Obama tries to (cap and) trade on the oil spill
After eight weeks, President Obama has decided he needs to stop letting our crisis in the Gulf of Mexico go unexploited. In an Oval Office address tonight, he’ll explain why, as he recently told Politico’s Roger Simon, the spill should “shape how we think about the environment and energy for many years to come” — just as our perspective on foreign affairs was “profoundly … indelibly” changed by 9/11.
Oh, so within eight years our government will be studiously avoiding the word “oil” and referring to “pipeline-caused disasters”? Maybe a future president will make speeches about how oil barons helped pave the way for the European Renaissance.
Nah, probably not.
Obama reportedly hopes the spill will reinvigorate efforts in Congress to pass a cap-and-tax bill. The Gulf oil spill is a tragedy, but it doesn’t change the basic calculus about cap-and-tax — namely that, among other things, it:
1. reduces, not increases, employment by giving companies an incentive to move production to countries without caps on carbon dioxide emissions;
2. represents an enormous opportunity for politicians to game the system by favoring certain industries over others (and certain firms over their competitors — would Toyota really get the same terms as Government, er, General Motors?) in the allowances granted and the initial prices charged for those allowances; and
3. has worked poorly where it’s been tried (for carbon dioxide) so far, most notably in Europe.
Those things were true last summer, when the cap-and-tax bill passed by the House was considered dead on arrival in the Senate. They’re still true now.
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183 comments Add your comment
DawgDad
June 15th, 2010
1:54 pm
Call me a consipiracy nut if you wish. This crisis was far too convenient and the timing far too suspicious to not seriously investigate the likelihood this was no pure accident or tragedy, but an intentional event. Follow the money, and the benefits accruing to the tyrants. Seems pretty cut and dried.
CJ
June 15th, 2010
2:03 pm
Steve Benen:
“For the left, political goals relate to policy ends. We want to expand access to quality health care. We want to lower carbon emissions to combat global warming. We want to reform the lending process for student loans so more young people can afford to go to college. We want to help retailers who can’t afford unfair fees. There are competing ways to get to where progressives want to go, but the focus is on the policy achievement.
The liberal worldview is not necessarily about increasing the size of government or raising taxes; those mechanisms are only valuable insofar as they reach the desired end-point. Whether the government increases or shrinks in the process is largely irrelevant.
For the right, it’s backwards, since the ideological goal is the achievement. Corker’s comments are straightforward — the goal isn’t about helping retailers or consumers; the goal is to limit government. Why? Because limiting government is good.
As Jon Chait explained a few years ago, ‘[I]f you have no particular a priori preference about the size of government and care only about tangible outcomes, then liberalism’s aversion to dogma makes it superior as a practical governing philosophy.’”
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2010_06/024265.php
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
2:08 pm
CJ
That asinine article is from a left wing ding bat like Kieth Olberwoman. It answers none of the statements from you. The Washington Monthly is about as relevant as Media Matters and Larry King.
Try again.
Sick of Dems
June 15th, 2010
2:09 pm
MSNBC-thank you for setting the record straight. I am so tired of Democrats blaming Bush…18 months into his presidency at what point is it Obama’s fault? The Dems have controlled Congress since 2006. I mean you have to exploit a good disaster right? How many more lies can this man come up with before we can get him out of office in 2012
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
2:10 pm
CJ
Again, explain how left wing politics advance the middle class. So far, a left wing president has sent unemployment from 8.8% to over 10%. The stimulus bill failed. The health care bill will bankrupt the country and he’s yet to lead.
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
2:14 pm
Sick of Dems
Left wingers don’t argue facts. They sidetrack from the issues by either bringing up Haliburton, Rush Limbaugh and now calling people tea baggers.
You’ll notice that not one left winger has provided any documented evidence on how and what Obama has done that has helped America. Blaming Bush worked back in 2006 and 2008. The country is over that and they want leadership and transparency. None of which Obama offers.
Take HDB for example. HDB will get into a debate and then blame everything on white people. That kind of mentality is what keeps black people down.
Anyhoo, it’s pretty easy rebuking and slamming left wingers in an argument. All you have to do is post facts. If they call you names you know you’ve won the debate.
Sick of Dems
June 15th, 2010
2:15 pm
MSNBC-Maybe you should run for office. Hey just have a debate with Obama without a telpromter in front of him. We all need a little comic relief while the Dems are distroying our country
Kyle Wingfield
June 15th, 2010
2:19 pm
CJ @ 2:03: a liberal quoting a liberal quoting a liberal about the greatness of liberalism with its “aversion to dogma” and complete neutrality about “whether the government increases or shrinks in the process” of solving problems, except that — gosh darn it! — increasing government always happens to be the answer. Just a coincidence. Who’d a thunk it?!?
You’re on a roll today, buddy. Keep ‘em coming!
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
2:20 pm
“Maybe you should run for office.”
Nah, if I wanted to make less money I’d go and work as a social worker.
HDB`
June 15th, 2010
2:21 pm
MSNBC=low ratings June 15th, 2010
12:49 pm
My point to you was that BP did not just contribute to Obama’s campaign….I wanted you to note the Republicans that are also under BP’s influence…and I will also include the entire Louisians Congressional delegation…both Mary Landrieu and David Vitter. Neither side can claim not to be under BP’s influence.
Since you were referring to my comments in Cynthia’s blog, I was stating that it was easier for a black person to find employment under Obama’s Administration due to the fact that he is a DEMOCRAT…not because Obama’s black. I was stating that I know of at least one black person who was able to progress further financially because of the change of administration……
The person does not have to be an idiot or a liar….but cognizant of his individual situation..personally and politically!!
BTW: Not all black areas are poor and crime-ladened; the question that you should ask is this: What economic areas in urbana have a high crime rate? Answer: Those with a lesser amount of economic opportunity and sub-par educational facilities…….Those who have taken advantage of the educational capabilities have progressed…….
Having lived in Chicago, Atlanta, Denver, Boston, NYC, Philly, DC, Misnnespolis/St. Paul, and Des Moines, that paradigm holds true for whatever area you can envision….and not just black areas either…..
HDB`
June 15th, 2010
2:26 pm
MSNBC=low ratings June 15th, 2010
2:14 pm
I have never blamed EVERY mishap on white people…but I HAVE blamed certain mishaps on the POLITICAL CLIMATE!! There have been white people who have both positively and negatively influenced me….but when I assess blame in the politcal sense, that blame has been determined by the experiences I have lived!! I also use facts to make an argument and attemot to debate from a logical point!! I like a good, spirited debate….but also know that my experiences will be different from many here!! Doesn’t make it wrong….just different!!
The only thing that can hold me down is a lack of desire…and that has yet to happen!!
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
2:26 pm
“Neither side can claim not to be under BP’s influence.”
You buy gas right? You’re also under BP influence. As well as Exxon etc….
“I was stating that it was easier for a black person to find employment under Obama’s Administration due to the fact that he is a DEMOCRAT”
Ever been to the south side of Chicago? That area has a 23% unemployment rate. Like I asked CJ, please provide facts that back up that claim.
“I was stating that I know of at least one black person who was able to progress further financially because of the change of administration……”
LOL!!!!!! First you write that it is easier for a black person and THEN you write that you only know of ONE black person………
“The person does not have to be an idiot or a liar”
Yes, they can also be lazy….
“What economic areas in urbana have a high crime rate? ”
Answer: black populated areas. See South Dekalb, Fulton Co……….
“Those with a lesser amount of economic opportunity and sub-par educational facilities”
Wouldn’t matter, they’d rather be out pretending to be 50 cent and Snoop Dog.
“and not just black areas either…”
Please post heavily white areas with high crime…………
kearns
June 15th, 2010
2:29 pm
DawgDad,
Absolutely. It smells incredibly fishy, no pun intended. I mean, a President sending down a S.W.A.T. team first thing? Hmm…..
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
2:29 pm
“I have never blamed EVERY mishap on white people”
You called Reagan, Bush, Limbaugh etc racists………. You once claimed that conservatives are racists….
Yet, you never remark on democrats who were KKK members. IE Robert Byrd
“I also use facts to make an argument and attemot to debate from a logical point!!”
No, you’ve only posted your opinion.
“The only thing that can hold me down is a lack of desire…and that has yet to happen!!”
That’s not what you wrote a few months ago.
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
2:29 pm
kearns
Don’t forget the lawyers…. He sent them to fix the oil leak……
Fox News is a joke!
June 15th, 2010
2:29 pm
I get a chuckle out of the Obama bashers. Mind you, many of these are the fools that voted for the Bush-Cheney regime. Reminder, W. and Cheney (Bush Co.) sold the country to their corporate buddies, gave more wealth to the top 1%, stifled the middle class, oversaw the destruction of a major U.S. city, witness nearly 2,000 people die during Katrina, came into office with a surplus that quickly turned into debt, began two never-ending wars, grew the nation’s military machine, and were on the clock on September 11, 2001.
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
2:31 pm
Fox News is a joke!…..and has higher ratings than every liberal outlet…..combined.
Keep blaming Bush! I’m sure it will get your party far come November! LOL
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
2:32 pm
“witness nearly 2,000 people die during Katrina”
Uh…………the death toll was nowhere near what you posted. Try again.
wex
June 15th, 2010
2:32 pm
HDB,
Your “facts” are nothing more than liberal propaganda. Hardly factual information. I am curious, you always speak of your “life experiences,” yet always in vague fashion. Why is that? Why no specifics?
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
2:33 pm
“oversaw the destruction of a major U.S. city, witness nearly 2,000 people die during Katrina”
So what was the LA government doing? Nagin ran, the LA governor ran and is now out of a job……..
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
2:34 pm
wex
HDB never posts facts. HDB posts his opinion and calls his opinions facts. Everything is whitey’s fault.
Democrat voters have low IQ's
June 15th, 2010
2:37 pm
Fact: Democrat voters are convicted felons, illegal aliens, dead people and welfare recipients.
Fact: Most liberals have degrees in liberal arts, art history, social work, pottery making and bong construction.
Fact: The average liberal lives off of their conservative parents money.
Fox News is a joke!
June 15th, 2010
2:40 pm
Fact: The most desired places to live in this nation, the U.S. cities with the most educated population, the most prestigious universities… all are in “liberal” areas.
Democrat voters have low IQ's
June 15th, 2010
2:43 pm
“The most desired places to live in this nation, the U.S. cities with the most educated population, the most prestigious universities… all are in “liberal” areas.”
Please post evidence to back up your opinion.
Fact: California, NY and Illinois are all going bankrupt.
Fact: Texas is the most stable state in the union….
HDB`
June 15th, 2010
2:46 pm
MSNBC=low ratings June 15th, 2010
2:26 pm
1) Yes, I’ve been to the South Side of Chicago….and the West…and the North! If you go past 82nd and Stony Isle, the South Side isn’t that bad of a place to live….and further south to Chicago Heights….
2) My point was pertaining to the change of administration….as I stated..I know of AT LEAST ONE (but I do know of more…but to prove a contrary point, one ONE example is needed)….
3) All urban areas have increased crime rates……downtown New York, the Loop in Chicago, Downtown Dallas/Ft. Worth………not just Fulton and DeKalb counties here…….even Des Moines and Minneapolis/St. Paul have high crime rates…….
4) Not everyone desires to be a rapper or a sports star; there are some in urban areas who desire to become teachers, doctors, firemen….and some go in the military. Many strive but have not been exposed to what can help them to progress. That exposure comes from multiple sources…but the schools are primary. If the educational system is failing, then the exposure to what creates the path towards progress is replaced by what is SEEN via the media. If the parental system is failing, then the exposure to what generates success is replaced by what can be expedited!!
Please post heavily white areas with high crime…………try Phoenix/Tuscon……..
“You called Reagan, Bush, Limbaugh etc racists………. You once claimed that conservatives are racists….” In the political sense….yes!! I stand by that!! If you look at MODERN political conservatism, from Barry Goldwater to present, it’s quite evident that it’s based on a racist paradigm!! We all know that both political parties have some racist characteristics…but the PRESENT DAY GOP continues wherein the Democrats attempt to ameliorate it………
“No, you’ve only posted your opinion”…I’ve posted my experiences…..and those ARE the facts of my life!! As I’ve said, it’s not wrong…just different!!
“The only thing that can hold me down is a lack of desire…and that has yet to happen!!” That’s not what you wrote a few months ago.” Please elaborate so that further expalanation can be given……
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
2:47 pm
Kyle
You know you’re doing something right when bloggers on Tuckers blog are blogging as “Kyle Wingfield SUX”
Kyle Wingfield SUXS
June 15th, 2010
2:47 pm
MSNBC=low ratings
http://economistsview. typepad.com/ economistsview /2008/04/what-have-you-d.html
Take out the space, if you type it in yahoo search the firsrt article is from the NY times.
Kyle Wingfield SUXS
June 15th, 2010
2:48 pm
Best Answer – Chosen by Asker
The middle class was much better under Clinton than Bush. The cuts are just one reason.
This from 2004: Since 2001, President Bush’s tax cuts have shifted federal tax payments from the richest Americans to a wide swath of middle-class families, the Congressional Budget Office has found, a conclusion likely to roil the presidential election campaign.
The CBO study, due to be released today, found that the wealthiest 20 percent, whose incomes averaged $182,700 in 2001, saw their share of federal taxes drop from 64.4 percent of total tax payments in 2001 to 63.5 percent this year. The top 1 percent, earning $1.1 million, saw their share fall to 20.1 percent of the total, from 22.2 percent
Over that same period, taxpayers with incomes from around $51,500 to around $75,600 saw their share of federal tax payments increase. Households earning around $75,600 saw their tax burden jump the most, from 18.7 percent of all taxes to 19.5 percent.
The analysis, requested in May by congressional Democrats, echoes similar studies by think tanks and Democratic activist groups. But the conclusions have heightened significance because of their source, a nonpartisan government agency headed by a former senior economist from the Bush White House, Douglas Holtz-Eakin
Unfortunately, the middle class was convinced they were helped by the tax cuts as well. The president told them they were.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/art…
The following article has many links to other problems for the middle class, including a Wall Street Journal article about healthcare. The middle class is hurting because health insurance as a percentage of income obviously hurts the middle class more.
http://www.house.gov/georgemiller/middle…
Conservative and liberal economists note that these new jobs are of lower quality than the millions that were lost. USA Today said that “jobs in lower-wage industries and regions are growing at a faster pace than higher-wage jobs.” And although Vice President Cheney says that “incomes and wages have been rising,” the Bureau of Labor Statistics disagrees: employers are cutting back on hours, and wages are not keeping pace with inflation, meaning that paychecks are buying less than they used to. Real earnings fell in June by more than 1 percent, which The New York Times reports is “the steepest decline since the depths of recession in mid-1991.” Now, even Wall Street economists are worrying that weak job and wage growth could undermine the entire economic recovery.
The cost of health care is a top squeeze factor for middle class families. Health care costs are increasing five times faster than inflation, according to the National Coalition on Health Care, and by 2006 the average family will pay more than $14,000 for their health insurance premiums. Little wonder a quarter of all middle class Americans were uninsured over the past two years: High costs are pricing too many families out of the insurance market.
Americans are paying more for gas, milk, and other necessities. Since last August, the annual rate of increase for average hourly earnings increased by less than 2 percent, while the consumer-price index rose by more then 3 percent. Meanwhile, gas prices increased by closer to 20 percent in the last year, and tuition at four-year public colleges have increased by almost 30 percent since 2001.
Kyle Wingfield SUXS
June 15th, 2010
2:50 pm
IT was a play on someone on CT’s blog. personally, haven’t really formed an opinion on whether he sucks or not.
HDB`
June 15th, 2010
2:50 pm
wex June 15th, 2010
2:32 pm
HDB,
Your “facts” are nothing more than liberal propaganda. Hardly factual information. I am curious, you always speak of your “life experiences,” yet always in vague fashion. Why is that? Why no specifics?
Which area do you require specificity? I’m glad to elaborate further!! When I DO speak in specifics, many wish to marginalize my experiences and say that it’s not true. When questioned on specifics, I will ANSWER specifically!! Fair enough!!
Just ask for which point you desire specifics….I will answer!
MSNBC…..I have the capability of answering for myself……please do not attempt to answer for me…..
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
2:52 pm
“All urban areas have increased crime rates……downtown New York, the Loop in Chicago, Downtown Dallas/Ft. Worth………not just Fulton and DeKalb counties here…….even Des Moines and Minneapolis/St. Paul have high crime rates…”
Funny, these crimes are committed by black people.
“If the parental system is failing, then the exposure to what generates success is replaced by what can be expedited!!”
You answered your own question. The black family unit is overwhelmingly non-existent.
“Please post heavily white areas with high crime…………try Phoenix/Tuscon…….”
LOLOL!!!!!! You really shot yourself in the foot! That high crime rate is do to illegal mexicans!
“but the PRESENT DAY GOP continues wherein the Democrats attempt to ameliorate it……”
Not one modern day GOPer was/is a KKK member. A Democrat senator is……..
“and those ARE the facts of my life!!”
Yeah, again, you post your own opinion. Not documented fact. Thanks for playing!
“Please elaborate so that further expalanation can be given……”
It’s all whiteys fault-HDB
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
2:54 pm
“MSNBC…..I have the capability of answering for myself……please do not attempt to answer for me…..”
Make me stop.
Some People are stupid
June 15th, 2010
2:54 pm
MSNBC=low ratings
So all crime is caused by blacks and Mexicans…wow…didn’t know that, so I guess the increasing murder rate in Milton and Johns Creek must mean the blacks are coming.
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
2:57 pm
“So all crime is caused by blacks and Mexicans”
Illegal mexicans and blacks.
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
2:58 pm
“IT was a play on someone on CT’s blog. personally, haven’t really formed an opinion on whether he sucks or not.”
You must have a low IQ.
Some People are stupid
June 15th, 2010
2:59 pm
MSNBC=low ratings
Just so you know, phoneix crimes are actually more attributed to whites than hispanics.(please ask me to show the statistics)
You probably live a lonely life. Probably somewhere in a double wide, drinking PBR watchin the fox news channel. Waiting to start your shift at the local gas station…shame..
HDB`
June 15th, 2010
2:59 pm
MSNBC=low ratings June 15th, 2010
2:52 pm
Not all crime is attributed to black people as many here persist in noting; you fail to mention the meth labs that are predominately in white communities; I mentioned Phoenix as a counter to an area that is innodated by BLACK crime!!
You persistently bring up Robert Byrd and the KKK….but what about the present John Birch Society? You don’t want to bring them into the mix? How about the Mormons….who discriminated against black people joining the Boy Scouts in Utah?? Look…it happens on both sides….but only PRESENT DAY POLITICAL CONSERVATISM continues a racist bent; you have yet to disprove that!!
BTW: How you have lived is a fact, correct?? WHat you have experienced is FACT, correct?? Same here — how I’ve lived and what I’ve experienced ARE facts….can not be changed….will not be marginalized……Granted, different from yours…but factual just the same……..
Kyle Wingfield SUXS
June 15th, 2010
3:00 pm
MSNBC=low ratings-
Yep, low iq here…
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
3:01 pm
“Just so you know, phoneix crimes are actually more attributed to whites than hispanics.”
LOL! Whatever you say.
“You probably live a lonely life.”
No, I’m actually married and live a happy life!
“Probably somewhere in a double wide, drinking PBR watchin the fox news channel.”
Love PBR and Fox. As for the double wide, no I actually have a very nice house in the Highlands.
“Waiting to start your shift at the local gas station…shame..”
You sure do know a lot about working at gas stations.
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
3:06 pm
“you fail to mention the meth labs that are predominately in white communities; I mentioned Phoenix as a counter to an area that is innodated by BLACK crime!!”
You can’t spell.
“You persistently bring up Robert Byrd and the KKK
I brought him up today.Not exactly persistent. And yes, that comment was to make you look hypocritical for supporting a party that employs a guy who hung black people.
“How about the Mormons….who discriminated against black people joining the Boy Scouts in Utah??”
I’m not Mormon. I don’t care what they do. Just like I don’t care if black churches don’t like white people coming in. IE: Obamas church in Chicago.
“but only PRESENT DAY POLITICAL CONSERVATISM continues a racist bent; you have yet to disprove that!!”
Oh yeah I can. I can because you’ve yet to post proof of any racist activities by conservatives.
“How you have lived is a fact, correct??”
Nope
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
3:06 pm
“Yep, low iq here…”
Well at least you admit you’re dumb.
HDB`
June 15th, 2010
3:06 pm
Gotta run, all……have a good day!
Some People are stupid
June 15th, 2010
3:07 pm
Like you said
LOL…whatever you say
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
3:08 pm
“Like you said
LOL…whatever you say”
Nice comeback, Carrot Top.
HDB`
June 15th, 2010
3:10 pm
Oh yeah I can. I can because you’ve yet to post proof of any racist activities by conservatives.
OK — Ronald Reagan stating that he was for segregation in Pliladelphia, MS
Jesse Helm’s racist campaign against Harvey Gantt in North Carolina
John McCain and Ronald Reagan being against the MLK Holiday
Ronald Reagan’s failure to enforce Affirmative Action law and stripping the Civil Rights Division of the Justice Department
Trent Lott’s statement to Sttrom Thurmomd on his birthday……
Rand Paul’s statements on his non-support for the Civil Rights Act of 1964…..
There’s always more…..
Gotta make a run….have a good day all…….
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
3:13 pm
HDB`
None of those people hung black people. Your own party has a guy who did.
See you later, don’t let the door hit you on the way out.
Some People are stupid
June 15th, 2010
3:14 pm
To the guy that said California was bankrupt, isn’t California Republican.
And also, don’t convicted felons lose the right to vote
A CONSERVATIVE
June 15th, 2010
3:14 pm
OBAMA———–” I AM THE ONE-” JAY BOOKMAN—”OBAMA WILL LEAD US TO THE PROMISE LAND—–0F FREE..FREE….FREE….MILK & HONEY for everyone-” ALL OUR WORRIES WILL BE OVER.”—JAY BOOKMAN
A CONSERVATIVE
June 15th, 2010
3:15 pm
JAY——-STILL DRINKING THAT OBAMA KoolAID—–YES
Some People are stupid
June 15th, 2010
3:16 pm
MSNBC=low ratings
“None of those people hung black people. Your own party has a guy who did.”
Then shouldn’t you vote democratic then since you think that all crime is attributed to blacks. You should support someone who hangs black people wouldn’t ya?