Night of the living public option
At Reason, Peter Suderman asks a good question: Why won’t the public option die?
And don’t start by telling me that it’s oh-so-popular and yet somehow Republicans have just scared too many people –including a number of Senate Democrats — about it. If the public option is so darn popular, why is Nancy Pelosi trying to rebrand it so that people think they’re getting something other than what we’ve been discussing for months?
If it’s so popular, why has President Obama remained non-committal about it all this time? The fact is that the hypothetical public option in which millions of Americans magically receive new health coverage from the insurance fairy is popular, but a public option in which people are specifically asked to help pay for other people’s new coverage is not. Thus Speaker Pelosi’s attempt at trickeration.
The new “opt-out” idea from Harry Reid, in which states could decide not to participate in the new federal government insurance plan, is cut from the same cloth as Pelosi’s maneuvering. If the point were to give states a true choice in the matter, an “opt-in” plan would be far more intellectually honest since the easiest thing for state politicians to do is to not to deviate from the default option that Washington gives them. But Reid’s point, of course, is to set a public option in motion while giving the appearance of flexibility. Don’t fall for it.
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178 comments Add your comment
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
4:09 pm
Hatin’ on the stupid writes: Hey, don’t hate the messenger…
Who is hating, stupid? No one hating here. Just debunking your…………blogs.
BS Aplenty
October 27th, 2009
4:10 pm
“And feel free to keep on using it, Mr. Pugh”
Priceless.
Hatin' on the stupid
October 27th, 2009
4:13 pm
Fraud: “Stupid can get away with name calling and hateful rhetoric over there.”
Look in the mirror sometime bro, if you can stand it.
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
4:15 pm
Hatin’ on the stupid, what I find totally hypocritical with you is the fact that you come on this blog and Bookmans blog, act like a tool, and THEN get mad when someone else beats you at your own game.
Now, feel free to go cry to Jay Bookman because he is the ONLY person at the AJC that will look past your insults to defend you against right wing crazies like me! LOL.
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
4:17 pm
Hatin’ on the stupid, one more thing. The fact that you write, Look in the mirror sometime bro, leads me to believe that you never went to college. YET, you call yourself informed and Fox viewers, stupid and uneducated.
HYPOCRITE!!!!!
Hatin' on the stupid
October 27th, 2009
4:26 pm
Fraud: Hatin’ on the stupid, what I find totally hypocritical with you is the fact that you come on this blog and Bookmans blog, act like a tool, and THEN get mad when someone else beats you at your own game.
Dude, you have never made me mad. Only amused. I know you think it’s your patriotic duty to “hit back hard” at liberals, but your certainty that you are right is what I find amusing. That, and your play-ground name calling. You think you’re sooo bad, but you’re really just funny.
Hatin' on the stupid
October 27th, 2009
4:29 pm
Do you feel akin to Jesus when you yell, “HYPOCRITE!!!!!”
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
4:29 pm
Ms. Stupid, are you 15? What adult uses the word “dude” in a conversation with another adult?
My patriotic duty??????? Wow, did you even finish high school?
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
4:30 pm
Hatin’ on the stupid, look little girl, just go back over to Bookmans blog and brag how you argued with a right wing troll. Go on little girl, you can do it.
You wrote: Do you feel akin to Jesus when you yell, “HYPOCRITE!!!!!”
Nope, I feel like David Axelfraud who’s just called out a left wing nut job for what she really is.
Hatin' on the stupid
October 27th, 2009
4:31 pm
Fraud: “you call yourself informed and Fox viewers, stupid and uneducated. ”
Could you show me where I called anyone these things. Please. You are the one so free with the name calling.
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
4:34 pm
Ms. Stupid, here you go!
Hatin’ on the stupid
October 27th, 2009
3:23 pm
Fraud: “But then again, you also believe that the Daily Show is real”
I guess you missed the study showing Faux news viewers were among the least informed.
One: “least informed” in liberal speak means stupid.
Now, feel free to contradict yourself.
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
4:36 pm
Hatin’ on the stupid, your very name says it all. You claim to have never name called YET your very name Hatin’ on the stupid speaks volumes.
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
4:38 pm
Hatin’ on the stupid, if I am the least informed how come I know more about what’s in the health care bill?
You claim that FOX NEWS is not real news etc…., yet you have not read the health care bill.
Bottom line: You take your marching orders from the DNC and Moveon.org.
Kyle Wingfield
October 27th, 2009
4:39 pm
Hatin’ and Axelfraud: Stop the sniping. Axelfraud, this is your second personal spat today…that’s two too many.
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
4:40 pm
Hatin’ on the stupid, also, please provide REAL DATA that states whether FOX NEWS has lied about anything.
CBS made up fake national guard documents to kill the Bush presidency in 2004 so…….that makes them a fake news source.
What has FOX falsified as news?
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
4:41 pm
Kyle Wingfield, what have I done that’s so wrong? This is a public blog, right? I mean no one pays to be here.
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
4:43 pm
Kyle Wingfield, one more thing. You do realize that passivity gets you no where with liberals, right?
Linda
October 27th, 2009
4:48 pm
Dear Stupid, I apologize for referring to you as Mr. Stupid if you are really Ms. Stupid. It’st alright if someone else answers my questions I pose to you. I don’t mean to offend you, but sometimes Mr. Axelfraud makes a little more conservative sense.
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
4:52 pm
Linda, thanks. Conservatives are going to have to use the same tactics against liberals. It’s just the way it has to be. I don;t like it but hey, if it destroys liberalism so be it. Reagan never compromised his principals. Why should we.
Kyle Wingfield
October 27th, 2009
4:56 pm
It’s an AJC blog, Axelfraud, and it exists for our readers — all of them. I don’t want the conversation to devolve into two posters sniping at each other, leading everyone else to lose interest.
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
4:57 pm
Kyle Wingfield, uh, it was you who wanted a discussion on the public option. You wanted debate, right?
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
5:00 pm
Wingfield, not to be a jerk but you do need to garner a lot more bloggers. Bookman has many bloggers because of debates and arguments. I had to get vicious with Stupid because Stupid was posting nonsense about FOX NEWS etc… I have read the bill. Not many people can say that.
saywhat?
October 27th, 2009
5:06 pm
Linda
October 27th, 2009
3:45 pm
“Saywhat, are you saying that there’s a credible poll that indicates 70% of Americans who have & like their health care & insurance are willing to give it up for socialized medicine for illegal aliens, the poor uninsured, our healthy young folks & pregnant women who don’t want their babies?”
No, I’m not saying that. As a matter of fact, I doubt very much there is any poll like that anywhere, nor will there ever be, because no credible pollster would ever ask such a rambling nonsensical question.
What I am saying is that it is not hard to understand why most people would rather have the option available to buy their insurance from the government for a reasonable rate, and have benefits managed based on research proven best medical practices, rather than shell out exorbitant sums to a corporation and yet still be denied coverage based on technicalities or pure randomness for the sake of corporate profits. Do you have a poll that say people would prefer the second scenario?
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
5:06 pm
Dismantling America
By Thomas Sowell
Just one year ago, would you have believed that an unelected government official, not even a Cabinet member confirmed by the Senate but simply one of the many “czars” appointed by the President, could arbitrarily cut the pay of executives in private businesses by 50 percent or 90 percent?
Did you think that another “czar” would be talking about restricting talk radio? That there would be plans afloat to subsidize newspapers– that is, to create a situation where some newspapers’ survival would depend on the government liking what they publish?
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2009/10/27/dismantling_america_98883.html
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
5:07 pm
Did you imagine that anyone would even be talking about having a panel of so-called “experts” deciding who could and could not get life-saving medical treatments?
Scary as that is from a medical standpoint, it is also chilling from the standpoint of freedom. If you have a mother who needs a heart operation or a child with some dire medical condition, how free would you feel to speak out against an administration that has the power to make life and death decisions about your loved ones?
Does any of this sound like America?
How about a federal agency giving school children material to enlist them on the side of the president? Merely being assigned to sing his praises in class is apparently not enough.
How much of America would be left if the federal government continued on this path? President Obama has already floated the idea of a national police force, something we have done without for more than two centuries.
We already have local police forces all across the country and military forces for national defense, as well as the FBI for federal crimes and the National Guard for local emergencies. What would be the role of a national police force created by Barack Obama, with all its leaders appointed by him? It would seem more like the brown shirts of dictators than like anything American.
How far the President will go depends of course on how much resistance he meets. But the direction in which he is trying to go tells us more than all his rhetoric or media spin.
Hatin' on the stupid
October 27th, 2009
5:12 pm
Kyle, I was trying to discuss the topic at hand and immediately came under attack by Fraud.
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
5:14 pm
Ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, wrong Stupid. You’re not the innocent little victim here.
Linda
October 27th, 2009
5:15 pm
Mr. Axelfraud, I’m HATIN’ to tell you this but Forrest Gump pretty much summed it up with his famous quote: ” ….is as…does.”
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
5:19 pm
RUSH LIMBAUGH IS RIGHT!!!!!! OBAMA IS A RACIST!
“I found solace in nursing a pervasive sense of grievance and animosity AGAINST my mother’s race.”
“I never emulate white men and brown men whose fates didn’t speak to my own. It was into my father’s image, THE BLACK MAN, son of Africa, that I’d packed all my attributes I sought in myself, the attributes of Martin and Malcolm, DuBois and Mandela.”
“I will stand with the Muslims should the political winds of shift in an ugly direction”
-Barrack Hussein Obama
Hatin' on the stupid
October 27th, 2009
5:21 pm
Blow, hot air, blow….
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
5:22 pm
Ms. Stupid, THIS IS THE VERY FIRST THING THAT I WROTE TO YOU.
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
3:07 pm
Hatin’ on the stupid, what lies are you talking about? NOT ONE congressman has read any of the socialist health care bills.
WHERE IN THAT COMMENT DID I ATTACK YOU???????????
COME ON STUPID, YOU CAN DO IT…NO WAIT, YOU CAN’T, BECAUSE I NEVER….ATTACKED….YOU……………
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
5:23 pm
Hatin’ on the stupid, I am tired of calling out your idiotic lies. You’ve lost. Done. Over with. Go back to the trailer park.
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
5:25 pm
Stupid, I hear Bookman calling you to come home. It’s bed time. Time to go night night in your cage. Go home little girl, go……..
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
5:27 pm
Stupid, do you know what a dictionary is? I wonder if they have one at your elementary school.
Attack: to set upon in a forceful, violent, hostile, or aggressive way, with or without a weapon; begin fighting with: He attacked him with his bare hands.
Now, with what weapon did I “attack” you with?
Hatin' on the stupid
October 27th, 2009
5:28 pm
Yeah, you’re right, fraud, you’ve totally demolished me in this most sophisticated of debates. You get the trophy. Health care for all!
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
5:28 pm
For any democrat voter. Name ONE state that is doing well under Democrat control. One.
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
5:30 pm
Hatin’ on the stupid, look, I pity people like you. You believe that fake news is real news. Still believe that Santa Clause is real and also think that Al Gore is a prophet.
Again, it doesn’t take a rocket biologist to figure out that you lost. Badly.
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
5:31 pm
Stupid, hey, since you’re offering to pay for my health care insurance GREAT!!!!!! Please make your payment payable to Blue Cross Blue Shield.
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
5:37 pm
Democrat controlled states:
Michigan: 14.8% unemployment, California: 12% unemployment, Massachusetts 9.3%, Illinois 10.2%
GOP controlled states:
Texas 8.3%, Georgia: 10.2%, Louisiana: 7.4%, Alabama: 10.6%
Now, one could conclude that Republican governors do a better job for their states. Just saying.
Hatin' on the stupid
October 27th, 2009
5:45 pm
If Fraud keeps talking to himself does anyone hear….
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
5:47 pm
Hatin’ on the stupid, you just answered your own question. Your stupidity is amazing.
Lost child
October 27th, 2009
5:50 pm
How bout a limit of say 50 blogs per day? Or have a couple of these folks exchange E-mails so we don’t have to read their every thought.
artatlarge
October 27th, 2009
6:09 pm
Mr. Wingfield:
I enjoy these little debates that occur here, but that David Axelfraud….
Sometimes I forgo commenting because I get tired of the kind of personal insults dished out by people like him.
My opinions have differed from yours every time but one. I agree that no public money should be used to build a new stadium for Arthur Blank.
But I refer to you as Mr. Wingfield rather than something mean-spirited because I know how little I like being insulted by people merely because our opinions are different. I’ll always call you Mr. Wingfield no matter how far apart our beliefs are (unless you tell me that I can call you Kyle), because that is how adults are supposed to behave.
But the unbridled hatred, name-calling, and insults are definitely having a chilling effect.
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
6:24 pm
artatlarge has selective amnesia. This is what artatlarge wrote this afternoon.
And hey, David Axelfraud…how many times do you righties have to be told something before you can accept it? IT’S NOT GOV’T HEALTHCARE, IT’S GOV’T HEALTH INSURANCE! Big difference.
Now, it was you who first addressed me.
Also, I just looooooooove the fact that you ignore the other two bloggers who argued with me today.
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
6:25 pm
artatlarge, do you enjoy lying?
Linda
October 27th, 2009
6:43 pm
Saywhat, There is a thrift store in my little hometown that sells everything dirt cheap. Books are 10 cents & clothes (even formal gowns) are 25 cents. Residents have to practically give their items away @ yd sales.
There’s no way private health care co’s can compete with gov-run health care. Businesses can’t compete with govt., non-profits & charities.
The goal of the DC bunch is to put private insurance companies out of business & to socialize our health care, just like did with our financial system, 2 of our 3 auto makers, the largest insurance company in the world (AIG), Fannie Mae & Freddie Mac, etc.
We had the best real estate financial system in the world & a great real estate market, but the govt. decided that home ownership was a right, not a privilege, & required the banks, savings & loans, Fannie Mae & Freddie Mac (who bought loans from mortgage companies) to make loans to anyone who breathed. Our fed. gov’s philosophy of Affordable Housing caused a world-wide economic collapse.
Health care is already a right. Now, they’ve decided that health care insurance is a right, not a privilege.
The health care reform bill has nothing to do with health, care or reform. Medicare is ripe with fraud & will be bankrupt in 7 yrs. Americans don’t want to give up the best health care insurance system in the world for socialized health care, which is neither healthy or caring. The govt. will never reform tort as long as lawyers are in charge in DC. If this was really about insuring the uninsured, all they have to do is contract with insurance co’s for group rates for everyone, regardless of citizenship or pre-existing conditions. Just a few phone calls would do it. It would be cheaper for the govt. to buy all the uninsured insurance policies than to create these 53 new agencies & try to run it like the post office or the IRS.
Unfortunately, there’s no money to do either. Check debtclock.com. Our deficit already this year has quadrupled. We not only owe almost $12 T that we’ve borrowed but there’s another $106 T we owe but don’t have the money for, including $14 T in social security & $73.5 T in medicare that the govt. took from our paychecks but spent. We’ve indebted our great, great, great, great grandchildren & Cap & Trade/Tax has already passed the House. What money they haven’t borrowed, they’re just printing which will cause massive inflation. Our triple A credit rating will go down. In 3 yrs., our debt service will be equal to the income from taxes! We are close to bankruptcy. Our national security is at risk. We’re borrowing money from China who in turn sends us lead based toys & toxic baby formula & refuses to reign in N. Korea, & from countries that jack up the price of oil for you & me while ships are dumping it out in the ocean. They have us over a barrel, so to speak.
While I’m at it, the economic stimulus bill had nothing to do with the economy or stimulus. It made the economy worse. DC raised the minimum wage during the worse economic crisis in decades. Remember Econ 101? The people who are suffering the most from lack of health care is the middle class, average American taxpayers with pre-existing conditions. Rich people can buy health insurance. Poor people & illegals can go to emergency rooms & be hospitalized for free.
If the govt would just STOP, we would be better off. Stop the spending, stop the borrowing, stop printing, stop passing bills, stop the pork. Just go home for a few months & let the economy recover.
Allow companies to start hiring again so more people will have health care.
Linda
October 27th, 2009
6:57 pm
Kyle, I don’t mean to be disprectful, but Mr. Axelfraud’s writings are almost as good as yours. Don’t censor him. I just had my husband come down here to read some of this stuff & he was rolling in the floor, & since it’s my husband’s birthday, let’s allow Mr. Axelfraud to continue. Also, I think Mr. Axelfraud is kin to Neal Borsch. Doesn’t he sound like at least his third cousin? Neal gets paid for this kind of fun. Mr. Axelfraud has 2 college degrees. I don’t know if they were 2 different colleges or which one or ones they were, but he sounds smart enough to be a Conservative, maybe even a 3 o-clock one, you know, on a clock, that’s as far right as you can get. (I’m about 2 o’clock.) Thanks for your consideration for my request (& birthday boy).
Linda
October 27th, 2009
7:01 pm
Mr. Axelfraud, you hurt my feelings. I addressed you at 5:15 & you didn’t respond. It doesn’t take a rocket mind to understand my post.
Peace Lover
October 27th, 2009
7:09 pm
Educating the masses is feared by those in power! If I’m educated and I am enlighten then no politician or leader can make me do what I don’t want to do.
We are an enlighten people. We have institutions of higher learning on every corner but yet when it comes to politics, we lose all sensibility.
We would never believe a lying, cheating, swindling person if they came to our door selling snake oil, but put a necktie on a person, call him a Harvard grad and we will believe anything he dishes out. That goes for Republican and\or Democrats.
People, stop your arguing, stop acting like you live in a third world nation and unite to take back the government. “We the people” Remember those word?
Knowledge is power!!!
David Axelfraud
October 27th, 2009
7:24 pm
Linda, thanks. It’s always funny to play games with liberals.