Richt has impressive company among coaches with no national title
Can Mark Richt be called a great football coach if he never wins a national title? (Jason Getz / AJC)
USA Today’s Mike Lopresti had an interesting column this week discussing who is the best current college football coach without a national championship.
Naturally, Mark Richt’s name came up, with Lopresti noting that the coach “has survived the Southeastern Conference hothouse at Georgia for 11 years and won nearly 74 percent of his games.”
But Lopresti consigned Richt to the “resonable nominees” list along with Michigan State’s Mark Dantonio, Wisconsin’s Bret Bielema, Nevada’s Chris Ault (really!!??) and Notre Dame’s Brian Kelly (who has the best winning percentage among the top 10 active coaches in career victories).
His main candidates, though, included Kansas State’s Bill Snyder, Boise State’s Chris Petersen, Oregon’s Chip Kelly, TCU’s Gary Patterson and his ultimate choice of the best coach without a crystal football: Virginia Tech’s Frank Beamer, who has 251 career victories (the most of any active coach), has had 19 bowl teams and came closest to a national championship in 1999 with a certain dog-abusing quarterback.
Frank Beamer also doesn't have a national championship. (Associated Press)
Who the USA Today columnist picked as the best coach without a national title didn’t interest me as much as the fact that it’s a list of pretty impressive and successful coaching talent who are in the same boat as UGA’s Richt.
So, here’s my question: Just how important to a program is it to win a national championship? If Richt never gets one, will he forever rank behind the Nick Sabans and Urban Meyers, no matter how many successful seasons he coaches at Georgia? That’s been the major knock on Richt and it boggles my mind a little to realize that even if his Dawgs were to manage to win the SEC championship game this season and make it to the BCS game and didn’t win it … he’d still have that same millstone around his neck.
What do you think? Is it all about the national title? If so, does that really make Frank Beamer less of a coach than Urban Meyer?
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382 comments Add your comment
Mike S.
August 22nd, 2012
12:17 pm
@dawnfan – Saban’s 2009 squad is the only one of those that was undefeated. Saban didnt even win his division last year, but got the shot the polls wouldnt allow Richt in 2007. In 2007, Richt got voted down strictly because he didnt have a conference title. We all know its because UGA isnt a brand name in the polls.
His 2002 team was identical to Meyer’s 2006 team. Meyer got lucky and was a one loss team behind Ohio st. and Michigan who we all know play at the end of every season.
When you have a poll system picking 2 teams out of over 120, you need to be both lucky and good.
GTBob
August 22nd, 2012
12:18 pm
Rich on the other hand cares about guiding 18 year boys and creating productive young men in today’s society.
Im not sure you should try to argue that Richt produces fine young men with the amount of legal problems and dismissals he has.
ARdawg
August 22nd, 2012
12:18 pm
Mike S.
I would guess Bobo isn’t a good chess player, neither is Richt. My from the hip contention is that many of our losses in the last 10 years are from being out coached. Lack of preparation for the opponent and Xs and Os on gameday
Ace
August 22nd, 2012
12:20 pm
The BCS system is a popularity contest, Richt SHOULD have been invited 2x at UGA to the Natl Champ, but he wasn’t. Les Miles made it with 2 losses in 07′, was unfair. Who cares about winning some subjective popularity contest.
fact is, Richt has a better win % than Saban, Miles, or Spurrier.
Kirk Herbstreit can’t do anything too change that.
Ace
August 22nd, 2012
12:21 pm
Bama didn’t win the SEC in 2011, but got invited in. UGA didn’t in 07′, and got excluded.
GTBob
August 22nd, 2012
12:22 pm
The backhanded compliment in your statement is the fact that it takes a good coach to amass that kind of talent.
If you are a coach at a football factory/party school then it is not hard to amass that kind of talent. How much did Florida’s talent fall off after Meyer left? How much did USC’s talent fall after Carroll left? If Richt left today, whoever replaced him would recruit top 10 classes with ease.
ARdawg
August 22nd, 2012
12:27 pm
“If you are a coach at a football factory/party school then it is not hard to amass that kind of talent. How much did Florida’s talent fall off after Meyer left? How much did USC’s talent fall after Carroll left? If Richt left today, whoever replaced him would recruit top 10 classes with ease.”
GTBobby, your pannies are showing again and you should stop playing the jester. “football factory/party school” That is only your very biased opinion. Are you capable of an intelligent football conversation or shall I move on? Florida’s talent level was seriously on the down swing BEFORE Meyer left, players and coaches. Why would you bring a cheating USC and Carroll into this conversation? Where is the relevance?
Ace
August 22nd, 2012
12:27 pm
BCS is politics, Richt can’t control that. They are anti-UGA, that’s obvious by now.
How in the world is UGA not pre-season #1 when they have the top 5 units at QB, RB’s, WR’s, DLine, LB’s and DB’s and only play 1 top 10 ranked team, when LSU, Bama, UF, SC, all play at least 3 top 10 teams, and the coach is ranked #4 in win % vs. coaches w/ 10 years epxerience?
Look at the “Herbie” awards, UGA has 1 guy there? No Rambo? No Jenkins? No Ogletree? No Murray? Give me a break.
All Richt can control is keep winning a higher percentage of games than Saban, Miles or Spurrier, which he has done.
DawginLex
August 22nd, 2012
12:32 pm
Georgia could have defeated florida in 2002 and still would have been left out because of Miami and Ohio state being the ESPN poster boy favorites.
Just like Auburn in 2004
GTBob
August 22nd, 2012
12:32 pm
Why would you bring a cheating USC and Carroll into this conversation? Where is the relevance?
The point is that those guys recruited very well and then the coach who replaced them recruited very well. Can you name a big name team who recruited very well, then changed coaches and recruiting fell off the map? How has FSU recruited since Bobby Bowden left? How about Clemson after Terry Bowden? Are all of these schools just really fortunate to always hire world class recruiters?
BMOC
August 22nd, 2012
12:32 pm
The difference here is Richt is in the SEC at a high-profile school like UGA with loads of talent close by. GA should be able to recruit the top athletes & compete for a national title 3 out of every 5 yrs, or at least be in the hunt for one. Yes, he came close in 2002, 2004 & 2007, and was just on the outside looking in. That’s the bad thing about the BCS, but hopefully that will be a thing of the past here pretty soon. But the main thing that has kept Right and UGA out of the national title competition is they’ve been outcoached too often. He held on to Martinez about 4 years too long & almost cost him his job, and I think that’s obvious to everyone now. But Richt is hard-headed & that’s what has cost him (and UGA) national title opportunities in the past – not being able to adjust his offence, defense or recruiting style to keep up front.
GTBob
August 22nd, 2012
12:34 pm
Guys, don’t waste your time trying to talk to GTBob or argue with him.
He is an idiot of the highest order and his hatred for UGA and absolutely insane, comical comments make him someone to be pitied.
I’m starting to think you don’t like me Lex.
hws
August 22nd, 2012
12:35 pm
Richt is a good coach and a better man from what i can tell. If he stays we will win a NC in the near future. I’m not sure that this is the year but the schedule does set up nicely. The biggest hurdle is the SECCG. The west is very tough at the moment and will be tough to beat. It wasn’t to long ago that the east was on top.
The NC would be great but I would much rather have an SEC Crown because that is won on the field. The NC is and always has been nothing more than a beauty contest decided largely by the media. While I agree that Alabama was the best last year and I do not think anyone could have beaten them, we will never know because they weren’t given the chance. I.m a huge SEC fan, Bulldawg first, and I am glad that the SEC has won 6 NC in a row, but it is a joke how some teams are denied an opportunity to even challenge for the NC.
Major college football is the only sport that the champion is decided on paper and not on the field. The main reason is the money I know. I think if every one would give it a chance a playoff would yield much more money for all involved. The new 4 team format will demonstrate this I am sure. That however should be extended to at least 8 teams from 8 regions across the U.S.
Just sayin………
Ace
August 22nd, 2012
12:35 pm
Alabam could have defeated LSU in 2011 in the regular season, they didn’t, so they should have been locked out of the BCS.
Ace
August 22nd, 2012
12:36 pm
lsu could have won the SEC in 2007, and won all their games instead of losing 2, they didn’t, they shouldn’t have been able to leapfrog SEC Champ UGA.
ARdawg
August 22nd, 2012
12:38 pm
GTBobby
Boy you stepped right in that one. How about Chan Gailey? Programs? Miami, Louisville, Pitt, Texas, Ohio ST. How many more do you need?
Why do you subnarine your own argument?Terry Bowden wasn’t a good recruiter, Dabo Swinney is. You must not be watching the recruiting and much as you proclaim. FSU has had great recruiting under Fischer
Ace
August 22nd, 2012
12:38 pm
UGA is held to higher standard than LSU or Bama.
UGA has to win the SEC AND go 13-0 to get invited to the BCS Championship.
PerroGrande
August 22nd, 2012
12:38 pm
What happened to Richt’s championship? I think he just started out trying to win, but it turns out his best chances came early on. The SEC has gotten much tougher in recent years. The BCS championship winners prove the point. So, I think CMR was getting comfortable and in the groove when the other programs got a lot stronger, and he has been reacting since. I think he finally has UGA back to SEC top quality. 12 will be his best shot since ‘07. (If the O line is decent).
Ace
August 22nd, 2012
12:40 pm
I count 2002 & 2007 as UGA National Championships.
I don’t care if Kirk Herbstreit agrees with me.
ARdawg
August 22nd, 2012
12:43 pm
@ACE
“UGA has to win the SEC AND go 13-0 to get invited to the BCS Championship.”
I honestly do believe this to be the case. Furthermore, if there is a 12-0 OSU, Michigan, USC ect, we still probably get looked over
Big Albany Dawg
August 22nd, 2012
12:43 pm
Bill, unfortunately, Yes. Along the same lines as your article; Dan Marino and Jim Kelly are great QB’s and nice guys, but they never won the SB. CMR needs some hardware, fast!
Bill Condon
August 22nd, 2012
12:46 pm
I despise the notion that the only winners are the ones who win it all and that all the rest are just losers. Richt’s teams, over 11 years, have won 74% of their games and have been SEC Champs as well as SEC East champs. Richt’s sustained level of excellence is remarkable, and he’s done it against competition that far outstrips what Chip Kelly or Frank Beamer or Chris Petersen have faced. Granted, Richt is probably too loyal to underperforming staff members (Martinez, Bobo), so if there’s one place where he is clearly outdone by Saban, Chizik, Meyer, etc, it’s in his staffing decisions. But the man is a winner, a great coach who has thrived in a very tough league.
Old Dog Class of 80
August 22nd, 2012
12:48 pm
“I believe that if Mark Richt were coaching at Alabama, he most likely would have won just as many national titles as Nick Saban.”
What have you been smoking?? I am a loyal Dawg fan, but there is no way Mark Richt is a better coach than Nick Saban. Does Nick Saban say “We don’t need no special teams coach” after his special teams cost him several games? Does Nick Saban keep a QB in a game even after the QB makes several costly turnovers, just because of “loyalty”. Does Nick Saban put up with prdictable play calling from his OC? Does Nick Saban ease up off the gas when he gets a comfortable lead?
A bitter pill to swallow, but it's the harsh reality that dawgs must live with
August 22nd, 2012
12:51 pm
A few comments about UGA:
1. Four different SEC teams have won the last six BCS championships.
2. UGA was not one of those teams.
3. During that period, UGA did not win the SEC championship.
4. Red panties.
In other words, UGA has sunk into total irrelevancy both regionally and nationally.
So why is UGA paying Mark Richt millions of dollars a year?
GTBob
August 22nd, 2012
12:51 pm
Boy you stepped right in that one. How about Chan Gailey? Programs? Miami, Louisville, Pitt, Texas, Ohio ST. How many more do you need?
Chan Gailey was a worse recruiter then CPJ and im not sure I would argue GT is a major program. Mack Brown has been at Texas for 14 years now and Ohio State just changed coaches for the first time in over 10 years and recruiting hasn’t dropped at all. Miami? Nope. Recruiting stayed solid with the transition to Shannon and the transition to Golden. Im not going to bother looking up Louisville and Pitt. Is that really the best you can do?
chazzo
August 22nd, 2012
12:53 pm
This argument is tired. Bring on the haters and the defenders. We’ve heard it all from each other before.
I will say this, though. The playoff system and potentially expanded playoff system changes that equation a little bit.
CHDawg
August 22nd, 2012
12:55 pm
This is like many things in life–success doesn’t always happen overnight. It took Dooley 16 years at the helm before he finished first, and Richt has had more top ten finishes. One of my favorite quotes is when Babe Ruth moved from pitcher to position player and one of the great players of his day pointed out that the move was a mistake–Ruth would never make it as a hitter. He was an expert and he was totally wrong. All it would take is a couple of NCs over the next 15 years and suddenly CMR will be the greatest coach ever. Maybe this is the year???? Also, judging him on wins alone is like saying the only way to evaluate a man is by how much money he makes. Not was he a good dad, husband, employee, & Christian. Richt has a lot of great qualities as a coach and a man. Glad we have him!
Joey
August 22nd, 2012
12:55 pm
Richt was very good in years ‘02 – ‘07. Since then, he has barely been average.
Fan-boys will blame injuries, conspiracies, whatever. He gets beat by good teams, and he never, ever beats a better team anymore.
The truth is, no coach could have done LESS with the worlds of talent of the ‘07 and ‘08 teams. And even the ‘02 and ‘04 and ‘05 teams all lost to inferior teams.
I hope Mark Richt wins it all this season, and collects those bonuses – I will shed some tears for him.
But, based on Richt’s past results, I ain’t holding my breath . . .
Pitbull
August 22nd, 2012
12:57 pm
I don’t care about any national championship.
As long as we beat Tech, Auburn, Florida,Tennesse and South Carolina I am a happy man.
The rest of the wins are just gravy.
Sunny Cloisters
August 22nd, 2012
12:57 pm
“BCS is politics, Richt can’t control that. They are anti-UGA, that’s obvious by now.”
—————————————–
If that baloney makes you feel better, keep on eating it. UGA doesn’t win for one reason – Mark Richt.
GTBob
August 22nd, 2012
12:58 pm
One more nugget of wisdom for you guys. Here are the top 5 teams in recruiting rankings for 10 years (2002-2011). Which one seems like the odd one out?
1. USC – 2 National titles.
2. UGA – No national titles or title game appearances.
3. Florida – 2 National Titles.
4. LSU – 2 National Titles.
5. Texas – 1 National title. 2 title game appearances.
The Factor
August 22nd, 2012
1:01 pm
@GTBob,
Bob, com’on. If you were rational towards UGA. which we both know you are not…. If Richt was in the ACC, PAC 10, or the Big Ten, his with current recond of 10 wins a year (on average) this would make him a dynasty “coach”. Second, as history proved with both LSU and Bama (LSU with 3 loses, UT’s blocked field goal against Bama) it does take a bit of luck to win a NC. A favorable schedule also helps- ie. SCal, Notre Dame, Fla St
Tide Rising
August 22nd, 2012
1:01 pm
We measure coaches by national titles. Sorry but that’s just our mentality- a championship mentality. As for comparing Richt with coaches at places like TCU, Nevada, and Boise that don’t have the same talent base, facilities, or fan support its just laughable.
The Factor
August 22nd, 2012
1:05 pm
@a bitter pill…
No, you are a Pinhead. We just happen to be in the only relevant conference.
Preseason NC
August 22nd, 2012
1:06 pm
I predict that my Dawgs win the NC this year!!!!
dawgster
August 22nd, 2012
1:06 pm
Look at the record of tech and Paul Johnson…the ACCESS has gotten much better with Dabo
Bill Condon hit nail on the head
August 22nd, 2012
1:08 pm
“despise the notion that the only winners are the ones who win it all and that all the rest are losers.” Amen to that.
Here is my challenge to those on this board: Outside of the NC in football and men’s basketball, what greater accomplishment can one achieve in college athletics than to win an SEC football championshi
I submit that winning an SEC football championship is a tremendous accomplishment, and sometimes it is easier to win a NC than an SEC title.
CHDawg
August 22nd, 2012
1:08 pm
Come on folks! We finished (AP) 2nd, 3rd, 7th (twice), 10th, along with several top 20 finishes under Richt. It is just a matter of time till he wins the crown. He recruits very well; he is a great mentor to the young men and staff, and he is a great X/Os mind, along with being a fine head coach. Get your heads out of the sand. Some of these whiners would have fired Patton and Eisenhower 1945!
Tide Rising
August 22nd, 2012
1:08 pm
(LSU with 3 loses, UT’s blocked field goal against Bama) it does take a bit of luck to win a NC.
A couple corrections to make. No. 1 LSU had 2 losses that year- not 3. And those 2 losses were in triple OT on the road against teams that went bowling. As for Bama’s near loss to UT in 09 even if we had lost that game we still would have been no. 2 in the bcs after winning the sec and we would have played Texas for the national title anyway.
Tide Rising
August 22nd, 2012
1:12 pm
“and sometimes it is easier to win a NC than an SEC title.”
Nope. That’s become a fairly chic thing to say since the national champion Alabama did not win the sec. But that was only because the best teams in college football happened to reside in one division. And you can also make the argument that it was harder to win the national title than an sec title. Why??? Because its a helluva lot harder to beat LSU in New Orleans with a majority LSU crowd than it is to beat a average team like Georgia in the seccg.
The Factor
August 22nd, 2012
1:12 pm
For Frank Beamer to have not won a NC playing in that conference is the real eye opener. Well maybe not. I like the guy though…
Recruiting rankings
August 22nd, 2012
1:13 pm
While Richt usually has a top ten class, he has yet to put together consecutive top three, top five classes that those on the list above have. Nick Saban is Mr. February, having had like 4 #1 recruiting classes. Under Meyer, Florida had a number of top five classes, as has Les Miles.
Georgia’s 2011 class was followed by a smaller, less talented 2012 class (though a few outstanding players), and 2013 is shaping up to be very good. Things look bright for the future.
The Factor
August 22nd, 2012
1:17 pm
@Tide Rising
“LSU had 2 loses” – I stand corrected. It doesn’t matter if they were in OT. That helps make my point: It takes a little luck. With 2 loses in this conference, you normally don’t have a chance to make it to the SEC tiltle game, much less NC
GTBob
August 22nd, 2012
1:18 pm
For Frank Beamer to have not won a NC playing in that conference is the real eye opener. Well maybe not. I like the guy though…
He has maybe the 4th most talented team in the ACC year in and year out. Its a pretty good accomplishment that he has done as well as he has.
Tide Rising
August 22nd, 2012
1:22 pm
The Factor,
Yeah I like Beamer also. I just don’t think VT has the recruiting base or national appeal to consistently compete with sec programs. When we played them a few years ago the physical difference was enormous. We just ploughed right through them. As for LSU winning it in 07 I don’t really chalk it up as luck. Everyone had 2 losses except for the no. 1 team and to me it was clear that out of all the 2 loss teams that LSU was easily the most deserving team. Now I would agree that sometimes it really does take a little luck but I think most of the time they get it right in that the best 2 teams play for the title and it usually but not always because of luck. It certainly does take luck though often in terms of a favorable schedule and avoiding key injuries.
chiefdawg
August 22nd, 2012
1:26 pm
UGA will never win a MNC, because they are not anESPN darliong.
Joey
August 22nd, 2012
1:27 pm
“It is just a matter of time till he wins the crown.”
************************************
Come on, CHDawg, if this were 2003, I would agree with you. Richt can’t get through a season without losing to an underdog. Think back: Since ‘05, Richt’s Dawgs have lost to Vandy, KY, SC, Colorado, Miss St, Central Florida, and gotten blown out by Bama, UF (twice), Boise St, and LSU.
Does that sound like “a matter of time” til he wins the Big Game?
Class of '98
August 22nd, 2012
1:29 pm
Bo Schembechler never won a national title, and some people consider him one of the all-time greats.
Richt’s, and UGA’s, chance to hold of the crystal football is coming. It will be sweet when it arrives.
kingdaddy
August 22nd, 2012
1:32 pm
Anybody who doesn’t like Mark Richt is free to pull for a coach you like better. Most real Doggies support him and would not, I repeat, would not trade him for any of the above mentioned coaches. I am proud of Coach Richt and I’m not alone. He hasn’t won the big one yet, but CMR is a winner and a diamond in the rough. Only 16 coaches in the country have the continuity of an intact staff. It will make a difference in recruiting and play on the field. All you haters can whine and cry all you want, let’s just take it to the field. You got your coach, (congratulations) we’ve got ours…
Reality Dawg
August 22nd, 2012
1:33 pm
I think Frank Beamer, Petersen, and a few of those other guys would win a NC if they coached at an SEC school and were pulling in SEC level talent.
Richt hasn’t been able to do it and I don’t think he ever will…at least, not without a better OC.