Is raiding the ACC still a possibility for the SEC?
I was talking conference expansion yesterday with a Georgia fan who posited that the ACC upping its exit fee to $20 million pretty much kills any chance of the SEC getting Virginia Tech or FSU or Clemson.
Looks like we’ll end up with West Virginia or Missouri, he said, noting that he didn’t view Texas A&M and Missouri/West Virginia as adding much luster to the SEC, though the conference did enter this expansion mess in a stronger position than any other league, in terms of football (which is what’s driving all this change).
A couple of thoughts about all that. First, the only ACC team that’s made any noise at all about studying possible realignment is FSU, and while their president obviously was among those voting unanimously to increase the exit fee, that doesn’t necessarily mean Florida State might not still find it worth its while to pay the $20 million in order to join the SEC. I can’t really see any of the other ACC schools, like Clemson, paying that fee, though.
Whether or not there was a rumored “gentlemen’s agreement” in the past for the SEC not to add teams in states where a conference member already resides — and there’ve been reports there never was any such agreement — FSU would certainly add to the SEC’s TV star power, even if it wouldn’t bring in a new television market. And it would counter the addition of Texas A&M geographically.
But while Missouri might not seem all that sexy a choice from a fan point of view, it would bring the St. Louis and Kansas City TV markets with it, and that would also be pretty attractive to the SEC. Auburn could move over to the SEC East to balance the divisons, thereby also assuring the Deep South’s Oldest Rivalry with Georgia continues to be an every-year affair.
West Virginia? Aside from being competitive on the football field, the SEC adding a program that the ACC didn’t want, and which brings very little in terms of TV reach, would justifiably seem like an also-ran choice.
Really, I think most of the SEC would have preferred to keep the status quo, but that has become impossible in the face of all the other changes going on.
So, best-case scenario, to me, is adding Texas A&M and FSU or Missouri.
Feel free to share your own views on SEC expansion.
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657 comments Add your comment
GeoffDawg
September 20th, 2011
4:48 pm
No official offer to Mizzou yet…
http://www.stltoday.com/sports/college/mizzou/tiger-tracker/article_6255fe5a-e3c4-11e0-8359-0019bb30f31a.html
SEC_Fan
September 20th, 2011
4:49 pm
@Delbert D.
AAU! AAU! AAU! AAU! AAU! AAU! AAU! AAU! AAU! AAU! AAU! AAU!
When you have no football, you just have to cling to whatever gives you comfort.
Chris
September 20th, 2011
4:49 pm
And them being in the ACC wouldn’t change that. I don’t know what’s so hard about that to understand.
Look at VT’s 2011 class – 21 players, 4 from Florida, one from Georgia. Three of the Florida players were from the same town. None were four stars.
GT GRAD
September 20th, 2011
4:49 pm
Sooooooo many of the SEC fans on these blogs are delusional.
None of the ACC schools are going to move to the SEC………the ACC is on the verge of a new TV deal (the deal will include football, basketball and baseball along with the other sports of course) which will result in a significant increase! No wonder why there are 10+ schools publically indicating they want to join the ACC {not to mention the numerous schools who are contacting the ACC behind closed doors}
The ACC is the hot conference that soooooo many schools want to join and the SEC fans simply cannot understand this logic (mark it down as sheer ignorance). The AJC writers and many of the SEC faithful bloggers are constantly trying to belittle the ACC. Truth be told ==> the ACC has a lot to be proud of regarding tradition, academics, football, basketball, baseball, golf, tennis, lacrosse and more. ACC has been ranked by Sagarin (computers remove bias and base rankings on actual results) as the second or third best football conference in the entire NCAA 3 of the past 6 seasons and we have been #1 or #2 in NFL recruits for 3 of the past 4 seasons! Most SEC fans will claim these stats are not true because these facts do not fall in line with their warped concept of reality.
GT Joe
September 20th, 2011
4:50 pm
Chris, you can’t compare ND recruiting to VT. Apples and oranges.
Still@theBAR
September 20th, 2011
4:50 pm
SEC_Fan and Clinton didn’t have sexual relations with that woman, there were WMDs, Hitler has no interest in Poland, the Russians are not putting Rockets in Cuba……………..Should I go on? You Believe the political Rhetoric is that helps you feel better about the SEC starting the POACHING.
GeoffDawg
September 20th, 2011
4:51 pm
It’d be nice to get a breakdown of the relative value of college sports in various markets. While breaking into the NY/NJ market would obviously be a benefit, what’s that really worth when the interest in sports up there is decidely pro? In pure marketing revenue potential, would that be any better than grabbing Charlotte where college is king?
Chris
September 20th, 2011
4:52 pm
Delbert – some of the educational requirements are valid. However there are some fantastic schools here. My old school was recently rated Top 100 nationally.
It’s more that these kids know that they’ll get more exposure, better training, better weather and a better chance at going pro at a school like Florida, Alabama, et al. Disagree?
SEC_Fan
September 20th, 2011
4:52 pm
Rutgers would be a great get for the ACC.
Good luck!
GT Joe
September 20th, 2011
4:52 pm
Rational: Rutgers doesn’t add much; Syracuse gets us into the NY/NJ market already. Sports-wise, nothing.
Rutgers HAS to be the last option for the ACC.
Chris
September 20th, 2011
4:52 pm
GT Joe – give a better comparison, or go back to dreamland.
Delbert D.
September 20th, 2011
4:53 pm
@SEC_Fan “When you have no football, you just have to cling to whatever gives you comfort.”
I am comforted by the fact that I have been an SEC fan since 1957.
Rojer
September 20th, 2011
4:53 pm
It doesnt matter so much where individual programs are now but more important the quality of the institution, its athletic program and its built in advantages.
The best thing the SEC has are its institutions commitment to football despite the negatives it brings to the school and community (crime and inflated budgets), the big state U nature of its schools and the fact that theyre in the boonies where there isnt anything else to do but HS football provides a big recruiting edge.
Conversely, the ACC has certain geographical advantages in major urban areas like Miami, Boston, DC, Atlanta that attracts athletes, particularly in hoops, and the quality of its educational institutions that attracts certain athletes (again hoops generally).
Which you prefer is what you like urban seaboard vs. southeastern rural.
GT Joe
September 20th, 2011
4:54 pm
ND recruiting in 2011: 23 recruits, 15 DIFFERENT STATES.
GeoffDawg
September 20th, 2011
4:55 pm
The only reason we know that 10 schools have approached the ACC about joining is because the ACC has told us so. What’s left out is the quality of the schools in question and how many other conferences they also contacted. My guess is that most of these schools are Big East / Big 12 just looking for a home and that they’ve probably all applied to the ACC, SEC and Big Ten and Pac 12. Only the ACC feels the need to prop itself up over this though.
Chris
September 20th, 2011
4:56 pm
Do you think, just by chance, that it’s because they play a NATIONAL schedule?
SEC_Fan
September 20th, 2011
4:56 pm
I’ll have you know that I most certainly did have sexual relations with that woman.
You really should consider talking up your left hand. I know that it might feel uncomfortable to begin with, but you’ll get the hang of it. You can’t stay lonely at the bar forever. Forget about your right hand. She never really loved you anyway. I heard a rumor that she was running around on you before you broke up.
GT Joe
September 20th, 2011
4:56 pm
You are right Rojer. And ND and PSU see themselves as east coast schools since their alumni are in all the major metropolises on the eastern seaboard. Not in the boonies.
GT Joe
September 20th, 2011
4:57 pm
Yes Chris, that’s why. And playing in the south will help them get more southern players FOR THE SAME REASON.
Still@theBAR
September 20th, 2011
4:57 pm
Delbert D. funny some of your SEC brothers don’t even know you are one of them. You bring too much rational and intelligence to the argument for them to think you are an SEC fan. LOL again thanks for the ARTICLE very good read.
rational
September 20th, 2011
4:58 pm
@GeoffDawg, this is somewhat close to what you are thinking
http://thequad.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/09/19/the-geography-of-college-football-fans-and-realignment-chaos/
Chris
September 20th, 2011
5:00 pm
When you’re competing with the major SEC players for recruits, ND hasn’t won in awhile. Winning gets recruits, not losing to marginal programs no matter where they are played.
SEC_Fan
September 20th, 2011
5:01 pm
Delbert’s not an SEC fan, he’s just another sports blog contrarian.
SEC_Fan
September 20th, 2011
5:02 pm
Not that there’s anything wrong with that.
rational
September 20th, 2011
5:05 pm
Rutgers doesn’t add much; Syracuse gets us into the NY/NJ market already. Sports-wise, nothing.
Rutgers is a more popular team in the NYC market then Syracuse and adding them both solidifies one of the biggest TV markets in the country. Why do you think the ACC and the Big 10 are after Rutgers but teams are denying West Virginia? It’s not about football.
CuriousGeorge
September 20th, 2011
5:05 pm
There’s a lot of talk about new markets, but it’s more than just new markets. It’s as much about the high profile rivalry games (that draw viewers because they’re good games). How about inserting Southern Miss into the southeast and seeing a lot more people tune into those games? Would viewership skyrocket with Clemson, or FSU battling it out weekly with the SEC teams? I agree with punting Vanderbilt, but heck. Every team needs a “bye week”. Yes, Vandy gets their decent seasons once in a while, just as Duke does, or the teams on Tobacco Road.
Delbert D.
September 20th, 2011
5:06 pm
Chris – the weather? I’ve lived in Georgia for most of my decades, but I’ve also lived (not just visited) in Chicago, northern and southern New Jersey, western Mass and Boston (33 years apart), Knoxville (of all places), the SF Bay area, Napa, CA, Charleston, SC, eastern and central Maryland (30 years apart), Hawaii, and England. I’ve spent winters and summers in all of those places. The weather doesn’t mean a danged thing.
GeoffDawg
September 20th, 2011
5:06 pm
Interesting read rational. The point I was trying to make was that conferences should temper their expansion decisions with information beyond just potential tv markets and I think this bears it out. Interesting that Rutgers is in fact the most popular team in NY over ND by a 2 to 1 margin.
Still@theBAR
September 20th, 2011
5:07 pm
Geoff
The only team that asked about the ACC know they have to bring EDUCATION to the table not just Football. The SEC don’t care if a kid can read or write if he can tote da roc.
SEC_Fan
September 20th, 2011
5:09 pm
OTOH, ACC student-athletes must be prepared to complete their college education in 1 year.
SEC_Fan
September 20th, 2011
5:10 pm
Good luck with Rutgers. I really mean that.
Delbert D.
September 20th, 2011
5:11 pm
Still@theBAR – Yeah, some of these new posters don’t know anything about me. My 1st favorite team is in the ACC, but I seldom watch other ACC football; Clemson, sometimes. I watch SEC games instead. I used to usher at Georgia games, and when I didn’t, I paid $1 high school admission. . Plus Army-Navy, and some other interesting intersectional games. That’s the way I grew up, and that’s the way it is going to stay.
SEC_Fan
September 20th, 2011
5:12 pm
I heard a rumor that USC is not happy with Texas coming in to the conference and is currently considering an invitation from the ACC.
It’s just a rumor, but hey… this is just a blog, right?
GeoffDawg
September 20th, 2011
5:13 pm
Still@theBAR, do you truly believe that anybody gives a hoot what you have to say? Sometimes you do make a little sense but then you ruin it with your pointlessly inflammatory rhetoric. I’m not here for a flame war, I’m here to talk about the merits of conference expansion.
In any case, I’m out. Looking forward to seeing what the rest of the week has to bring.
Delbert D.
September 20th, 2011
5:13 pm
SEC_Fan – All you have to do is supply a source other than your imagination.
Dilusional SEC
September 20th, 2011
5:14 pm
What I find intriguing is that people are “fans of the SEC” but not of their respective teams? That is fantastic that your team may be a part of a powerhouse conference, but unless you are Bama, LSU, Florida, or I guess Auburn now after last year, your team still sucks. Claiming your SEC bragging rights is living through someone elses team. A 6-7 team is still 6-7, even if an SEC team wins the NC. You should focus more on your team improving, then living through other SEC teams, particularly your own rivals (such as uga fans and Florida and Auburn).
thwg
September 20th, 2011
5:14 pm
why in the world would any ACC team want to leave for the SEC. ACC is far superior in academics as well as broad sports programs. Besides Football, what else does the SEC have. Road trips to places like Athens, Tuscaloosa, Knoxville, Gainseville, Auburn, Starkville, Oxford – hell, the best one is Nashville, Baton Rouge is a cesspool. Or road trips for fans to Atlanta, Boston, New York, Pittsburgh, Miami, RTP, Tallahasse – are you joking? The SEC is a bunch of farm towns. In 5 years, it’ll be between the ACC and Pac-16 to see who is the best. The SEC will remain a small town, redneck conference. And basketball?? If not for KY, TN Women, and a brief flash with FL, it’s a 3rd teir b’ball conference. Let’s see: Syracuse, Pitt, Carolina, Duke – once we add Kansas and Uconn it’ll be lights out!
Delbert D.
September 20th, 2011
5:14 pm
GeoffDawg – Take care, catch you later.
Still@theBAR
September 20th, 2011
5:14 pm
Rumor has it SEC-Fan can chew gum and type at the same time, but it is just a rumor.
Chris
September 20th, 2011
5:14 pm
Delbert – understandable, but you aren’t an 18 year old male. Sun dresses on coeds in Tuscaloosa in late October is a fantastic recruiting tool.
SEC_Fan
September 20th, 2011
5:15 pm
Since we’re confessing… (must be the whole Notre Dame thing?)
I’m secretly a Georgia Tech fan. You can’t really blame me for keeping that in the closet, can you?
Delbert D.
September 20th, 2011
5:16 pm
Chris – You got me there. Man, that reminds me of the beach at Wild Dunes with my lovely wife.
Proof
September 20th, 2011
5:17 pm
If the ACC is such a great conference, why have a $20Mil exit fee? Why the need to hold your member schools hostage?
Wanna know what the exit fee for the SEC is? Betcha can guess…
SEC_Fan
September 20th, 2011
5:17 pm
It’s true Still@theBAR.
The secret is in keeping both hands free.
thwg
September 20th, 2011
5:17 pm
Texas to the SEC – are you high? Again, let me see – road trips to Los Angeles, San Francisco, Boulder versus two horse farm towns? SEC is gonna get stuck wtih A&M, Missouri and a WV the ACC didn’t want. No way FSU leaves the ACC for an inferior SEC at this point. Swoffard is a genius.
thwg
September 20th, 2011
5:19 pm
SEC raiding the ACC – my guess is ACC goes after Vanderbilt to combine with either Kansas or Uconn. Then the SEC can backfill with Cincinnatii or Georgia State.
SEC_Fan
September 20th, 2011
5:20 pm
@Proof
You mean the SEC doesn’t have to force their members to remain in the conference? Wonder how they make that work?
PhDawg
September 20th, 2011
5:20 pm
Good job on spelling delusional right.
Delbert D.
September 20th, 2011
5:20 pm
SEC_Fan – What heck is wrong with you? I’m a Georgia Tech fan. I watch every danged Georgia game, too since my brother, brother-in-law, daughter-in-law, uncle, niece and miscellaneous friends graduated from Georgia. I have no clue as to what you are, other than someone who likes to annoy people.
SEC_Fan
September 20th, 2011
5:21 pm
I’m a Georgia Tech fan too!
Imagine that!