College playoff may be moving toward using committee
Big Ten's Jim Delany slammed polls, computers as methods for picking title game teams.
I’m sorry, but did the Big Ten — the Betamax of college football conferences — just enter the digital age? And become pals with the SEC in the process?
Big Ten officials fell in line with the SEC and the Big 12 Monday, declaring that the impending college football playoff should be comprised of the nations four best teams, regardless of their conference affiliation. Commissioner Jim Delany also endorsed the possibility of junking polls and computer rankings and forming a selection committee to pick those four teams — an idea that has been pushed in my disturbed little corner of the universe.
Quoting Delany from a Monday news conference with Nebraska chancellor Harvey Perlman and Indiana president Michael McRobbie: “Everybody recognizes the present poll system is not a good proxy. … It should be the four best teams.”
Did that really happen?
The Big Ten and Pacific 10/12 conferences have long been obstacles in a playoff format, in part because of their respective allegiances to the Rose Bowl. So the fact that the Big Ten is not endorsing a model for change — albeit late — is significant.
A few weeks ago I proposed my plan for the four-team playoff. Here’s the link. But let me recap a few bullet points:
• The four teams can come from any conferences, with no automatic bids and no cap on how many per conference. I don’t care if the SEC gets zero or four. (Not surprisingly, SEC presidents favor this model, as you would expect from a conference that placed Alabama vs. LSU in the last BCS title game and has won six straight national championships.)
• The four teams should be picked by a selection committee, similar to the one used for the NCAA basketball tournament.
• The semifinals should be held at the campus stadiums for the Nos. 1 and 2 seeds, with the championship game bid out to cities, similar to the Super Bowl.
• The bowls, the BCS, polls, computers, etc., should have absolutely no input on the four-team playoff. They all can come into play for the non-playoff postseason games. And yes, that means the Rose Bowl can still have its Big Ten-Pacific 12 match-up, as long as neither school is in a semifinal. Similarly, the Sugar, Orange, Fiesta and Cotton Bowls also can create closed or partially closed bowls, fulfilling their own marketing needs.
Delany’s comments were significant Monday. I’m starting to believe many of the above criteria will be in place for a playoff.
By Jeff Schultz
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146 comments Add your comment
GTBob
June 4th, 2012
4:09 pm
So you think Clemson, acc champ, ranked # 15 by the polls at the end of the regular season….. (then had 70 put up on them in the bowl) deserved to be in a playoff just because the won their confrence championship over Alabama?
Clemson wouldn’t have been in the playoff under any format, including the conference champions format. SEC fans really need to quit using that argument. In the top 4 model Stanford would have made it over Oregon even though Oregon won the Pac 12 and beat Stanford by 23 points. Is that reasonable? Also, because of the BCS, the SEC championship game last year was completely meaningless. It will get even more meaningless if the top 4 teams are used in the new playoff.
gbal
June 4th, 2012
4:12 pm
They earned the right to play them again not HAD to…. based on how they played in the regular season, polls, strength of schedule, ….Not a Bama or LSU fan here but I do feel like they were the best two teams. One loss by 2 pts or was it 3 for bama. I can see why some fans in other areas would have rather seen someone else, but I do think they were the best and that it was a great regular season.
The demise of CFB is upon us
June 4th, 2012
4:12 pm
The desire to have a definitive national champion is rendering the regular season meaningless for a lot of teams. Right now the ACC or Big East teams have no shot at the championship. I would say only if FSU runs the table does the ACC have a remote chance (maybe Clemson and GT beating their in-state rivals would help the cause). Boise St will have no chance.
Raw Dawg
June 4th, 2012
4:13 pm
Question for those that say playoff participants have to be pulled from conference champs, or winning the conference will be meaningless… What does winning a conference mean in the current bowl system?
If an 8 team playoff were on the table, I would like to see all 6 conference champs +2 at large bids (but how to select the +2, hmmmm)
gbal
June 4th, 2012
4:15 pm
GT I was there… it was a packed house, great TV ratings, determined the SEC championship for 2011. Not meaningless at all.
The demise of CFB is upon us
June 4th, 2012
4:15 pm
How do we know that Okie St wouldn’t have been a better opponent? Bama was obviously a great team, but Okie St. also had one loss, in OT on the road.
Ahh, whatever. Like I said, it will never be a perfect system. Last years title game just was unappealing to me. Saw the first game, didn’t need to see it again.
GTBob
June 4th, 2012
4:16 pm
Not a Bama or LSU fan here but I do feel like they were the best two teams. One loss by 2 pts or was it 3 for bama.
Alabama only played one other ranked team besides LSU. They didn’t accomplish much of anything and pretty much got a free pass to the championship because they passed the “eye test”.
gbal
June 4th, 2012
4:18 pm
good question raw…. it does mean something to win your confrence, I agree.
On your 8 team with 6 champs… i agree, but think that the confrence winners must also be ranked in the top 10 end of season.
I like the BCS type formula,,, not perfect but averages a lot of factors and would do a good job of picking 8 team field. Better than a committee.
GTBob
June 4th, 2012
4:20 pm
GT I was there… it was a packed house, great TV ratings, determined the SEC championship for 2011. Not meaningless at all.
If UGA would have beaten LSU by 50 points then the national championship would have still been LSU vs Alabama. It had no influence on the National Championship at all. How many people do you think care that LSU won the SEC championship last year? No one.
Little Giants
June 4th, 2012
4:26 pm
It’s college football, a varsity sport. It was devised as a hobby to pit the best on one school against another. In the meantime us fans decided honor and tradition weren’t enough. Eventhough we have professional sports where money and influence is all part of the game, we still demand more for the students playing the college game. “Screw academics, we want to win!” we say. Then out of the other side of our mouths we decry how cheating has become rampant and hound these students because all they care about is going pro and chasing the cash. The root of all of the problems of modern college football is because of us fans. Personally, I think each college student who plays football doesn’t deserve to expect anything more than a great education and the enjoyment of playing the game, and maybe a ribbon for participation. Personally, I feel the whole thing has gotten out of hand. I can’t beleive that Texas and A&M are no longer going to play. Not Oklahoma and Nebraska. All for the mighty dollar and to placate us insatiable fans. I used to love everything about college football, now it just seems so commercial and professional to me. The tradition is going, going … almost gone.
Damon
June 4th, 2012
4:28 pm
They’ve really missed the point. College football fans have wanted a playoff mainly because the way the teams are chosen, ie. polls/bcs, are biased because of the human element. Humans are biased.You aren’t going to find anyone who knows and watches enough college football to do this job who isn’t biased. A selection committee will solve NOTHING and probably cause more problems. Why even bother to change the system if it’s still not going to be fair. If you do a committee, you still have the same issues, because it’s somebody’s “OPINION” on who is the best 2 or 4 or 8 teams.
Buckeye
June 4th, 2012
4:31 pm
No matter, dogs. You won’t be in a playoff anytime soon.
Scout
June 4th, 2012
4:33 pm
Jeff, you and Delaney are off your marker if you think you can put selection of a pool of only 4 teams that will compete for it all, in the hands of a few humans, referred to as a committee. As I said when your first proposed this, this is much different from 64 basketball teams. There are enough selctions in basketball that there can be no question that the best teams are in the mix. However, when the pool is only 4 teams, and you put it in the hands of humans, you’ll have a mutiny on your hands. People will go “koo koo” and the process will be screamed at with accusation of every form of corruption possible. Be real guys…….computer selection is the only way to go.
Little Giants
June 4th, 2012
4:37 pm
Oops, I got distracted. The playoffs are just another example of how us fans have turned a beautiful oddity into just another professional sport where we must have an absolute champion. I’m gonna miss the days when you could argue with a friend into the night that LSU was better than USC or vice versa and everyone was sure they were right. Now we’ll know for sure that one team beat another for the championship and all arguments against will be rendered null and void, right? Unlikely. Once we have our 4 team playoff we’ll decide it’s not enough, then what? I say just enjoy the games and remind your rivals that they’re inferior in everyway and be content with that, because it’s mighty fun already.
gbal
June 4th, 2012
4:41 pm
GT – COMMOM MAN —
A bunch of regular season games had no influence on the the NC game… in fact most did not. Again not picking on ACC but that confrence championship have no influence on the NC game.
Bowl games… on and on …. I know a lot of people didnt like seeing that again. not a fan of either, but I thought is was a great match up…after the close game in regular season. Being from the SE, I ws interested and did think it was the two best teams. Just my opinion..
GTBob
June 4th, 2012
4:55 pm
Again not picking on ACC but that confrence championship have no influence on the NC game.
True, it never will, but the SEC is different. If there is a top 4 model then there will frequently be 2 SEC teams already in the playoffs before the conference championship is even played. Pretty much all the ACC teams have to play for is a conference championship, so there is some motivation there. What real motivation is there to win an SEC championship? Pretty soon the top team in the SEC championship will start sitting their players so they don’t get hurt.
Jeff Schultz
June 4th, 2012
4:56 pm
Tokyo Tom — 4-team college playoff probably would start in 2014.
Jeff Schultz
June 4th, 2012
4:58 pm
UGASlobberknocker — So, hypothetically, you don’t think a Georgia home playoff game would sellout? Seriously? … And having all three playoff games in same city is awful idea. Then you’d REALLY have empty seats.
Jeff Schultz
June 4th, 2012
5:00 pm
Gbal — Yes, I like the idea of a committee. Obviously who sits on committee is an issue but full exposure helps process, in terms of dealing with potential biases and conflicts of interest.
Jeff Schultz
June 4th, 2012
5:02 pm
Zing — If you can put together a poll of “non-affiliated” people, you can do the same with a committee. As for the AP poll, those are writers. Funny, that for as often as writers are accused of been biased, that poll carries far more credibility than coaches’ poll. Coaches have more biases. Most writers I know don’t care who wins.
Jeff Schultz
June 4th, 2012
5:03 pm
Scout — I disagree.
gbal
June 4th, 2012
5:04 pm
You dont plan the system around the SEC which is in power now, it will change over time (and I am an SEC 1 ACC 2 fan) … You plan the selection based on the best chance of getting the best 4 teams in a playoff. That is difficult and nothing perfect with so may confrences and teams but do the best thing to get the top 4 there. If your admitting the SEC is so superior and suggesting that they always will be… thats no excuse to let a lesser confrence winner into the playoff. TOP 4 regardless. Wish it could be 8 and I would have a compromise.
gbal
June 4th, 2012
5:06 pm
Disargee Jeff – I think it will be so political and biased. Computers and masses of people can dilute the bias.
gbal
June 4th, 2012
5:07 pm
Any home playoff game at any college would be a sellout. absolutely
GTBob
June 4th, 2012
5:15 pm
You dont plan the system around the SEC which is in power now, it will change over time
I didn’t really mean it just in terms of the SEC. It will happen with other conferences too. Even if a conference only has one really good team, that team still doesn’t have all that much motivation to win the conference title when they know they will be in the national playoffs either way. The conference championship games will be a lot less exciting when you know the outcome doesn’t really affect anything, and at least one of the teams is already looking ahead.
Flounder
June 4th, 2012
5:28 pm
I Agree with everyone who raises this question: if Conf champions are not, at least in some way, part of a playoff selection, then why have Conf Champions? Why even have Conferences? If everyone (except ND) is locked into playing 8 or 9 of the SAME teams within their conference year after year, then WINNING that Conference should mean something and should be rewarded with a CHANCE to win a national title.
I can foresee 2 things that may start to happen here if a 4-Team Playoff is started, with participants selected by private committee:
1) more teams will start to withdraw from their conferences and go independent, with the purpose of improving their regular season strength of schedule in pursuit of a better ranking. Setting aside the whole probability of “SuperConferences” … everyone will start clamboring to get into the SEC and their NOT gonna get in.
2) if the SEC dominates the 4-team selections year after year (and there is a GREAT probability that they will unless conf champions are part of the equation), the rest of the country outside of the SE will stop watching.
Bravesfan79
June 4th, 2012
5:30 pm
So when does this start? 2013 ,2014? FINALLY… college football takes a step towards joining the major sports of the world!
Bravesfan79
June 4th, 2012
5:36 pm
Flounder: ‘the rest of the country outside of the SE will stop watching”.
Yea right, so your telling me that fans who put up with the meaningless bowls for decades wouldnt be excited if there team somehow made it to the final 4 in a miracle season? (note… there was no such thing as a “miracle season” in the old system, just ask Boise state! ) Yes the SEC will dominate, but seeing teams like Penn State, Boise, Utah… etc get a chance.. will add more excitment than ever to college football!
Big Crimson 75
June 4th, 2012
5:57 pm
GTbob — Alabama only played one other ranked team besides LSU. They didn’t accomplish much of anything and pretty much got a free pass to the championship because they passed the “eye test”.
——————————————–
Bob — Go to bed, you’re stoned.
Big Crimson 75
June 4th, 2012
5:58 pm
Personally, I can’t wait for Bama-LSU III & IV.
NCAA Playoff Now
June 4th, 2012
6:22 pm
Again you sound like you have never been to a Conference Championship Game, they are grossly boring.
And 4 teams is twice as bad as the BCS 2.
Like some of the commentors, this too will fail, because Hancock and his bunch want to get back in control of the money. They are faking it, that is saying a playoff is coming, but they want it to fail so they can come up with some other lame form of BCS.
It will have to be 16 if you keep 120 or more teams.
But the weaker programs must be brought over to the strong Conferences and then through Conference revenue sharing their programs can be strengthened and therefore become competitive.
I have begged the media types to just look at the Perfect Playoff Plan with the 16 Team Playoff.
http://www.ncaa2012.com/theperfectplan.pdf
Ask every question and you will see they will be answered.
But the best team can only be ferreted out by playing a series of games with the teams that have won the most games in the regular season.
Your 4 may not include that one team.
12 Equal Conferences will give you The best teams with 4 at-large to pick up the unlucky team that just lost a game on an off afternoon.
Anyway tie the Conferences to Bowl Games and you will get better TV and more revenue,like $1 Billion.
Prove a Playoff by starting this year. we have the beginnings, the Conference Championships.
Look at the Interim 8 Team Playoff at http://www.ncaa2012.com
Delbert D.
June 4th, 2012
6:38 pm
After this is all hashed out, the SEC will move to a 3-1-1-1-1 scheduling system. I wonder what those permanent in-division matchups will be.
NCAA Playoff Now
June 4th, 2012
6:39 pm
I guess my first post is lost.
The Playoff is needed this Season, 8 Teams in 7 Bowl Games starting the 4th Saturday in December.
None of these as home games, because they are boring.
But 8 elimination games will get the number down to 8. The 4 AQ Conference Championships, an elimination game between the Big 12 & Big East Champions, the non-AQ Champion with the most wins and 2 elimination games with the 4 at-large teams with the most wins, just check this Interim 8 Team Playoff for 2012 & 2013 that will prove a large playoff will solve every problem.
http://www.ncaa2012.com
2014 will be the inaugural year for the 16 team playoff and realignment to 12 conferences with 10 teams.
Nativebird
June 4th, 2012
6:40 pm
If the major bowls are not part of the mix in the playoff, they will surely become irrelevant. Imagine USC or Michigan playing in and for thE national NCaA playoff championship, and a week before this winner take all clash among college football giants, the Rose Bowl is played between…uh..say…Illinois and UCLA. Wow, what a draw. Kind of like the Probowl a week befor thE superbowl. Yawn. Rose, Sugar, Orange and Fiesta will not (cannot) let that happen.
Delbert D.
June 4th, 2012
6:42 pm
@ “in the hands of a few humans, referred to as a committee”
I think humans would be a better choice than sportswriters and coaches.
the committee
June 4th, 2012
6:52 pm
Mr. Jeff Schultz knows his stuff.
The demise of CFB is upon us
June 4th, 2012
6:59 pm
LIttle Giants, you hit it right on the head.
CBS
June 4th, 2012
7:01 pm
Alabama Lost to LSU at home,
Alabama lost the West Division,
Alabama lost the SEC Conference,
Alabama won 12 games
LSU won thirteen games
The conclusion of the matter is:
Alabama passed the ” eye Test “.
anotherdawg
June 4th, 2012
7:07 pm
The danger in a committee is I don’t know how it can not be biased. Any committee member will favor his conferance. In fact, if your conferance wasn’t represented on this committe, it would be like an independent being elected for president, instead of a democrat or republican. I’d just as soom see a computer system that factors in a teams record and it’s strength of schedule. If you base it on record only, teams will avoid a tough schedule. They will never come up with a system that will please everyone, but putting the top 4 teams against each other will definitely be an improvement
unbiased committee
June 4th, 2012
7:13 pm
NCAA FCS (Division I-AA) Football
came up with
a system that pleases everyone a long time ago.
GTBob
June 4th, 2012
7:13 pm
Bob — Go to bed, you’re stoned.
Ok, tell me about how great a season Alabama had. In the regular season they beat one team that ended up ranked and lost to another that ended up ranked. The rest of their schedule was pretty much garbage. You think 1-1 against ranked teams, and 2nd place in the division is an amazing resume?
Delbert D.
June 4th, 2012
7:17 pm
I don’t see how any selection system based on subjectivity is better than objectivity; i.e., having won your conference championship. With subjectivity you get favoritism, back room deals, outright graft, numbered offshore accounts, death threats (the “transparency” issue), mental incapacitation, and running off to Illinois to avoid having to vote.
Wet Willie...keep on smiling
June 4th, 2012
7:25 pm
Committe…yeah right that is what we need another collection of obnoxious and overbearing damn yankees selecting who is best! As a Bama fan I see 1966 and 1977 again all over. If the day comes when Notre Dame , Mitchegun, and Tattoo U has a decent football team then you can bet your sweet azz all three will be in the playoff. Hell you live under their rule today and now you wish to have them run football?
How is that obama thing working out for all of you. Committe my azz. Talk about something you know something about…whatever that might be.
Big Crimson 75
June 4th, 2012
7:59 pm
I never said amazing!!
It was as good if not better than okie st.
Ok st gets killed by Bama or LSU.
DetroitBraves
June 4th, 2012
8:23 pm
There are always arguments at the margins with the NCAA tournament but there’s little doubt that that deserving contenders are all included in the field. Plenty of error margin at 68 – plus every conference – and I mean every conference – gets representation. This football thing falls way short of that.
Hillbilly D
June 4th, 2012
8:39 pm
Just scrap the season and let every team into a double elimination tournament that last from September to January.
Cdpridg
June 4th, 2012
8:47 pm
As long as the best 4 teams play is all that matters…..the idea of conf champs is asinine and I am pleased to see that theory being shot down
Paul in NH
June 4th, 2012
9:03 pm
Oklahoma State went 3-0 in the regular season against teams that ended up in the final top 25 rankings.
Paul in NH
June 4th, 2012
9:05 pm
I wonder how many people would say you don’t have to win a conference if ND and BYU each go unbeaten?
BBQ MAN
June 4th, 2012
9:41 pm
8 teams with SEC, BIG10 PAC12, BIG12, ACC + 3 best of the rest with sos determining seeding