FSU to Big 12? School has inflated idea of self-worth
Jimbo Fisher and Florida State might think brand is worth more than it really is. (AP photo)
There is only one thing that throws me about this Florida State-to-the-Big-12 rumor that has been growing and mutating over the past several days: Do school officials consider themselves some kind of super power? Because I believe time machines are not applicable here.
In the last six years, Florida State has played in the Emerald Bowl, the Music City Bowl, the Champs Sports Bowl, the Gator Bowl, the Chick-fil-A Bowl and the Champs Sports Bowl again.
They have played in one BCS bowl (Orange) in the last eight seasons (and lost). They haven’t won any BCS bowl game since the national title 12 years ago.
They haven’t won the ACC since 2005. They have played in only one ACC championship game in the last six seasons.
Before a school starts making financial demands and threatening to change conferences, shouldn’t it at least have to win the ACC Atlantic Division more frequently than Boston College?
This, of course, is all about money. The problem is that Florida State is living in its super power past. It’s frustrated that the ACC is not the SEC. Every conference is frustrated that it’s not the SEC. But, sorry, when a conference wins six straight national championships, the result is not going to be a level playing field, least of all when it comes to television revenue.
The ACC and ESPN recently announced a 15-year, $3.6 billion contract. That averages out to $17.1 million per school per year, which certainly seems good. But the fact that the deal is back-loaded — it will take nine years before schools see a $17.1 million take – has some members grumbling, particularly Florida State, whose athletic department is facing a $2.4 million shortfall.
Andy Haggard, an FSU trustee, mouthed off to Warchant.com. He complained that the ACC surrendered its third-their television rights to ESPN for football but not basketball, seeming evidence that the conference was favoring the North Carolina-based schools for basketball reasons.
There was a problem with that statement: It wasn’t true. The school had to issue an apology Saturday night. This goes back to my theory that many members of a school’s Board of Trustees are little more than more than big-money boosters who get to go to meetings and, it follows, talk too much.
Seminoles coach Jimbo Fisher also said, “…I think you always have to look out there to see what’s best for Florida State. If that [jumping to the Big 12] is what’s best for Florida State, then that’s what we need to do.”
This from a coach who last season finished behind Clemson and Wake Forest. I’m not sure what Fisher believes the Florida State brand is worth right now, but I doubt the school can do better than what it has right now. Leverage comes with winning something.
By Jeff Schultz
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454 comments Add your comment
George Stein
May 14th, 2012
8:23 pm
I wish you were right, Tod. I just think the voters are mostly idiots, and they’ll see 12-0 and presume that means more than 11-1.
Beast from the East
May 14th, 2012
8:24 pm
Vandy is on the rise. Ole Miss…not so much. BC doesn’t take football any more serious than Duke does. Neither one will ever be able to retain a quality coach because they won’t pay them to stay. In this day and age, you have to pay through the nose to lure/retain a top notch coach.
Besides, what exactly has Matt Ryan accomplished in the NFL? Success in college doesn’t translate to success in the NFL for the vast majority of QB’s. Ask Charile Ward if you don’t believe me.
KG
May 14th, 2012
8:27 pm
Delbert – yes. To hell with the ACC. To be clear, we have seen our best days in the ACC. Again – we are a football school first. I would love to be in the SEC but that won’t happen. The next best thing is the Big 12, especially with Texas, Oklahoma and Okie State. BTW – if/when we leave, we won’t go alone. Count on at least 2 other teams to bolt from the ACC – trust me on this one. The ACC will counter with adding freaking Rutgers and UCONN. If these new additions don’t tell the story, I don’t know what will….
Tod
May 14th, 2012
8:28 pm
Charlie never tried to play in the NFL
Beast from the East
May 14th, 2012
8:31 pm
Tod,
That’s because he knew where he could earn a paycheck. You missed the whole point. Try Vince Young, Danny Wuerffel, etc.
George Stein
May 14th, 2012
8:33 pm
Wrong attitude, KG. Go where you get the best deal. That probably will be the ACC.
If you think you’re gonna see Texas and Oklahoma very often, I think you’ll find yourself pretty disappointed.
George Stein
May 14th, 2012
8:34 pm
That’s because he knew where he could earn a paycheck.
Isn’t this where a Florida fan would say FSU paid him very generously while he was in Tallahassee?
docsbro
May 14th, 2012
8:38 pm
I say let ‘em go. They really haven’t added anything. Not exactly what we signed up for.
Tdawg
May 14th, 2012
8:38 pm
Funny thing you Nole fans bashing Dawg fans. When was the last time FSU won the AlmostCluelessConference? I see that you Nole’s are still living on the glory of teams over 10 years ago. I will not brag on my dawgs until they at least win the SEC, both sides of the SEC. The Bama fans are under the delusion that the Tide will win the SEC again. Can’t wait to see the looks on their faces when they drop 3 or 4 games.
Brian
May 14th, 2012
8:41 pm
Yeah Mizzou can get away with it but FSU can’t. Dumbass.
Delbert D.
May 14th, 2012
8:42 pm
Beast – In fact, BC fired a head coach simply for interviewing for another job.
Tdawg
May 14th, 2012
8:45 pm
KG why is FSU and the SEC a no go? I don’t think the SEC is through expanding just yet. May have to wait a year or two, but if FSU were to apply one would have to think they would be first in line when expansion happens again.
Delbert D.
May 14th, 2012
8:48 pm
KG – “Again – we are a football school first.”
The various parties at Florida State have been in confused disagreement with each other on that for the past few days. The board of regents, AD, the coach and the president. I think that it is going to turn out that Florida State is a university first, and the ACC has it all over the Big 12(10) in that regard.
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Delbert D.
May 14th, 2012
8:54 pm
Tdawg – Don’t be to sure about that. Of the aspirers/applicants last year, including WVU, Louisville, East Carolina and Memphis the SEC selected two prestigious academic schools who are members of the AAU. That resulted in *doubling* the number of SEC AAU members.
Warnell Dawg
May 14th, 2012
8:54 pm
As a south GA Dawg fan that grew up 40 minutes from Tallahassee, I can tell you from personal experience that FSU fans are THE DEFINITION of “over-inflated self-worth.” They rag on UGA all the time about “living in the past,” yet not a single one of them can accept the fact that FSU’s “glory days” of dominating the pathetic ACC and having an easy road the BCS/NC games year after year are over. And if you ever wanna see an FSU fan’s head explode, bring up SEC football dominance and/or the fact that FSU punked out over joining the SEC when they had the chance back in the day. They have a LIST of conspiracy theories for both of those topics.
NolesRulesTheNest
May 14th, 2012
8:57 pm
If many of you feel that FSU is so overrated, it shouldn’t be a problem when we leave.
KG
May 14th, 2012
8:58 pm
Delbert – it’s not confusion. Its strategic manuevering – trust me. Do you really think that the Chairman of the Board of Trustees came out with this “dis-satisfaction” without it being calculated? No – that didn’t happen. These events were planned in advance.
KG
May 14th, 2012
9:01 pm
TD – the SEC is off limits based on Slive’s comments about only wanting to tap into new markets for expansion purposes. I can see them tapping on Va Tech’s shoulder once we bolt.
George Stein
May 14th, 2012
9:06 pm
And I can see VT ignoring that tap.
Pink Pony
May 14th, 2012
9:07 pm
FSU is afraid to join the SEC always has been.
Delbert D.
May 14th, 2012
9:09 pm
KG – He was dissatisfied then and now, and he probably will remain dissatisfied. I makes no sense to me for Florida State to move into the Big 12(10) for football, money and certainly not national prestige, considering who the remnants of that conference are.
Delbert D.
May 14th, 2012
9:14 pm
VT is not going anywhere, I don’t think. They are competitive in the ACC almost every year in football. Frank Beamer is that program. He’s going to be 66 this Fall.
John Greene
May 14th, 2012
9:15 pm
Come on down FSU! I would like nothing better to see than the ACC fall apart.
KG
May 14th, 2012
9:15 pm
Delbert – it’s all about the greeny green($$$$) brother. The ACC doesnt have it and the Big 12 appears to have plenty of it. It is quite simple. If we dont have $$$, we can no longer compete with the big boys. We have been down in football but if we dont bolt soon, we will stay down for the duration – years to come.
George Stein
May 14th, 2012
9:17 pm
VT isn’t going anywhere unless UVA goes with them, Delbert.
KG
May 14th, 2012
9:23 pm
VT will bolt for the SEC – as any smart institution would. C’mon Delbert, who are we fooling here. If they receive an invite, this will not be about Beamer, nor should it be. The decision to join the SEC is much bigger than Beamer. FSU fired Bowden and he won 2 national championships – 2 more than Beamer. Penn State fired Paterno and he was TRULY Penn State. In the grand scheme of things as it involves millions of dollars, Beamer means nothing to Va Tech. If they leave, his feelings shouldn’t be considered nor should they be as it would be a business decision.
Delbert D.
May 14th, 2012
9:26 pm
KG – I’ve been around long enough to know that it is not all about the bucks from football, and it will be less so in the future. People are increasingly PO’d about the operation of a semi-professional sporting enterprise under the auspices of a university.
George Stein
May 14th, 2012
9:28 pm
This should be obvious, but you have no clue what you’re talking about, KG.
sports
May 14th, 2012
9:28 pm
FSU should leave as soon as possible, and take Miami and Virginia Tech went you. The ACC is weak and stupid conference, wanting to give all the money contracts to the Carolina schools. The ACC belongs in Division 2 ball anyway…everyone knows that!!!
Beast from the East
May 14th, 2012
9:29 pm
“Isn’t this where a Florida fan would say FSU paid him very generously while he was in Tallahassee?”
Not this Florida fan. I’ve never seen any evidence of FSU paying players. Besides, Charlie Ward was always a good guy. Hated him one day a year. He and Warrick Dunn had our number one forgetful Saturday in November. Both were solid students, players and people. I-10 isn’t the only good thing to come out of Tallahassee despite what most Gators will tell you.
KG
May 14th, 2012
9:30 pm
Be more specific George. No clue about what specifically? Please share.
George Stein
May 14th, 2012
9:32 pm
Eh, it was a joke, Beast.
You apparently have no idea what had to happen for VT to be invited to the ACC. They aren’t leaving without UVA.
Beast from the East
May 14th, 2012
9:35 pm
George,
I agree that VT is going anywhere. I think the ACC has accomplished what they wanted to with a few well-respected football schools and a monster line-up in hoops.
Delbert D.
May 14th, 2012
9:36 pm
KG – You misunderstood that. VT is not the same without Beamer (lower valuation of the product, as you likely view it). George Stein is correct in that VT is restricted by UVA. There is not enough upside for VT to move to the SEC to become another Kentucky in football, and VT is a better university than the majority of the SEC schools.
Delbert D.
May 14th, 2012
9:38 pm
“The ACC is weak and stupid conference”
That one takes the cake.
Tod
May 14th, 2012
9:53 pm
“Isn’t this where a Florida fan would say FSU paid him very generously while he was in Tallahassee?”
Not this Florida fan. I’ve never seen any evidence of FSU paying players. Besides, Charlie Ward was always a good guy. Hated him one day a year. He and Warrick Dunn had our number one forgetful Saturday in November. Both were solid students, players and people. I-10 isn’t the only good thing to come out of Tallahassee despite what most Gators will tell you.———————Well said beast as any good seminole fan would not bash Danny Wuerful or Fred Taylor both class acts
Tod
May 14th, 2012
9:56 pm
Ten times more good has come from UF and FSU players than bad but only the bad gets media attention. Danny with his mission in New Orleans, Warrick Dunn habitat for humanity Derrick Brooks takes kids to Africa every year etc………………………..
BLT
May 14th, 2012
10:02 pm
sports
May 14th, 2012
9:28 pm
“FSU should leave as soon as possible, and take Miami and Virginia Tech went you. The ACC is weak and stupid conference, wanting to give all the money contracts to the Carolina schools. The ACC belongs in Division 2 ball anyway…everyone knows that!!!”
Hilarious! Please continue…
Explain “stupid conference”, should be a doozy…Laughter!
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May 14th, 2012
10:15 pm
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Delbert D.
May 14th, 2012
10:38 pm
The Big 12(10) is then Strong and Smart? Here is how Florida State would rank in the BIG 12(10) academically:
45 Texas
75 Baylor
97 Iowa St.
*97 TCU
101 Oklahoma
101 Kansas
**101 FSU
132 Oklahoma St.
143 Texas Tech
*160 West Virginia
*Not actually there yet
**Hypothetical
US News and World Report rankings
Tod
May 14th, 2012
10:48 pm
Academic rankings are subjective. Those that do the rankings decide what subjects to rank the schools on. So if the school has an established medical and/or law school and those are subjects that are chosen for the rankings then they do well. FSU started off as a liberal arts college and has one of the best in the country. Try again Delbert
Delbert D.
May 14th, 2012
10:53 pm
Would being tied for 5th academically in the Big 12(10) be better than tied for 13th (last) in the expanded 14-school ACC? Would the fans and students feel better about that? Would that be a better “fit”?
The Big 12(10) is rumored to be considering Louisville again (#164 ranking) and BYU.
TigerT
May 14th, 2012
10:56 pm
fsu needs to keep quiet and stay in the ACc—they haven’t been relevant for years and choke every year in big games. The big 12 doesn’t want that minor league program sucking away millions in their conference. fsu will be lucky to win 9 games in 2012, even in the weak acc.
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May 14th, 2012
10:57 pm
[...] – Kirk Bohls of the Austin-American Statesman says the Big 12 should add Florida State. Jeff Schultz of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution thinks FSU has an inflated sense of self-worth. [...]
Delbert D.
May 14th, 2012
10:58 pm
Tod – No, the USN&WR ranking is a combination of objectivity (data) and subjectivity (example:peer evaluations). Florida State is in the category of National Universities. Furthermore, Florida State charges 40% more tuition (along with Florida) as a 1st tier research university per the state legislature.
naplesnole
May 14th, 2012
11:08 pm
central dog…I don’t know what rock you crawled out from, but one only has to look to about a year ago, when the FSU SEMINOLES WON the sec east with relative ease…..Go check how the gates and cocks did. Also FSU REPEATEDLY asked the to join the sec only to get snubbed for years. Only after they accepted an invitation to the ACC did the sec step up to save face. The biggest story that has circulated among the cheating conference for years.. Research it.. Try Google Please continue with your dis- information. Only sec homers believe it.
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May 14th, 2012
11:13 pm
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Tod
May 14th, 2012
11:24 pm
That’s funny Delbert because FSU was just ranked as one of then top schools that is economically viable for students on loans and grants. I know my son will be a Sr there in the fall. You are going to have to start posting some legit links as proof to back up your claims because they are false. My son applied to UF was accepted didn’t like the program he chose as compared to the one FSU offered and it is almost half the cost as UF.
Tod
May 14th, 2012
11:26 pm
As a follow up what subjects are included in the “National University” category? Even the word National suggests that every school included in National better conform to what they are being graded on to get a good ranking.