Report: Marvin Williams wants out (OK, what’s the joke?)
There haven't been enough moments like this from Marvin Williams. (AP photo)
The Hawks have enough other issues now, with injuries to Al Horford, Jason Collins and Joe Johnson (who couldn’t finish Monday’s loss at Chicago because of a knee injury).
But here’s one more problem — or maybe it’s actually comic relief.
According to ESPN’s Chris Broussard — and I caution all to not treat this with Woodward-and-Bernstein reliability — Hawks forward Marvin Williams wants out. Quoting directly from Broussard’s “True Hoop” blog: “Frustration abounds in Atlanta right now, and sources say Marvin Williams wants out because he wants to play somewhere where he’ll have an increased role offensively. Williams is averaging just 9.6 points per game, his lowest since his rookie season.”
Let’s assume for a minute (or as long as it takes to finish this blog) that this true. Question: Seriously? I know Broussard covers the NBA but this items cries for some context.
This is Williams’ seventh NBA season. He has been a bust. Forget for a moment that the astrophysicist, former general manager Billy Knight, passed up Chris Paul to take Williams. There’s still an expectation that the second pick in the NBA draft will be a solid-to-great player, but Williams hasn’t been close to that.
It’s true that his scoring average of 9.6 points is the lowest of his career. But let’s not suggest that he has been an 18-to-20-scorer in the NBA. His annual averages: 8.5, 13.1, 14.8, 13.9, 10.1, 10.4, 9.6. Career average: 11.6.
Williams has been almost a full-time starter since year two. He has played 458 games. I think we all know by know what he can do.
In 2009, general manager Rick Sund gave Williams, then a free agent, a five-year, $37.5 million contract extension. I’m sure the thought at the time was that, after four years, maybe the small forward would turn all of that athletic ability into something good. But that hasn’t happened. So the Hawks are now stuck with an underwhelming player who makes $7.5 million this season, $8.2875 million next year and a $7.5 million player option in 2013-14.
In other words, Marvin, if you really want out, we hereby give you permission to pick up the phone and find a team that’s interested.
By Jeff Schultz
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245 comments Add your comment
JSS
February 21st, 2012
2:22 pm
Drive-by Hawks Blog! Toronto is beautiful this time of the year!
Delbert D.
February 21st, 2012
2:25 pm
Marvin, you’ll find that life is tough, living on the street.
SuperDuePer
February 21st, 2012
2:32 pm
BLOW THIS TEAM UP! Ownership couldnt look 1 fan in the eye & tell us that they believe this is a CHAMPIONSHIP TEAM! Its a problem that has always plagued every team in this city but more recently the Hawks…mediocrity. Yes MEDIOCRITY. every owner in this city outside of Blank has been trying to make a champion out of spare parts & tried to make it seem like the fans dont see how cheap they are. I respect Blank for going out spending the money & trying to put a CHAMPION on the field. Every other team ESPECIALLY the HAWKS are content with first round wins, millions of dollars, and rap video cameos. Nobody wants to be great on that Hawks team. Joe has yet to take the reigns of HIS team. Josh has made great strides but he is a complementary piece (the entire team is filled with Robins who are ok with being Robin) where is the Batman? Who wants to be Batman…Nobody & as a REAL FAN WHO HAS BEEN WITH THE TEAM DURING THE 13 win seasons Im sick of this feeling that nobody on my team wants CHAMPIONSHIPS. EVERYBODY is more concerned w/ All-Star Games,bonus money, stats, minutes, & NOBODY is mad enough about losing to give consistent effort night in & night out. I’ve never commented on this before but as a fan who really wants to see a WINNER, I wish the players on this team wanted one as bad as many of the fans do! Am I The Only One WHO FEELS LIKE THIS???
Hawksgoingbackward
February 21st, 2012
2:36 pm
Marvin Williams has played above average when given legitimate opportunity. Lets recall if you will:
6:00 PM ET, March 27, 2011
Marvin scores 31 pts, 7 rebs, 2 assts against cleveland while playing 43 minutes (Joe Johnson didnt play)
Coverage: TNT
8:00 PM ET, December 16, 2010
Marvin scores 26 pts, 5 rebs, 1 asts against the Boston Celtics while playing 36 mins (Joe Johnson didnt play)
Coverage: SportSouth
7:30 PM ET, December 3, 2010
Marvin scores 22 pts in 34 mins against the Philly Sixers (Joe Johnson didnt play)
February 07, 2009
Marvin scores 29 pts and goes 18-20 from the free throw line against Charlotte (Joe Johnson didnt play)
Marvin is a victim of horrible coaching, lack of opportunity, and a management structure that doesnt know what to do with talent.
You dont draft a guy 2nd overall to groom him to be a role player. Kevin Durant (not by comparison of talents sake) is a prime example of taking a player that high and allowing him the opportunity to grow into the role. When Seattle chose K.D. they traded Ray Allen to the Celtics and got back great value for Ray and opened up the spaces and opportunity for Kevin to become what he is today.
Marvin wouldnt have become Kevin Durant but without Joe Johnson the Hawks would have a better team. I hope they trade Marvin to another team in the east and he destroys the Hawks after resurrecting his career.
IMHO
February 21st, 2012
2:44 pm
Has anyone seen a fatter a$$ on a professional basketball player? One rich lazy mf.
IMHO
February 21st, 2012
2:45 pm
@Hawksgoingbackward
“Marvin Williams has played above average when given legitimate opportunity…”
Nearly 500 games and 3 coach’s say you are an idiot.
SWAT Native
February 21st, 2012
2:46 pm
Marvin didn’t draft himself. Virtually every draft “expert” rated the top two picks in his draft as Bogut and Marvin; the Bucks took Bogut so it wasn’t a stretch for the Hawks to take Marvin. Everyone knew he was raw and would take some time to develop, but he was considered to have the most upside potential. It’s not his fault that CP3 and DWill turned into top 15 players. Marvin was actually developing nicely until he hurt his back (and that was why the Hawks resigned him). He struggled with a back inury for a few years and it obviously affected him.
As several other posters have noted, the Hawks never used him effectively in their offense. He finally got his back fixed, looked like he was on his way and the Hawks still didn’t use him right. Now he wants to be traded to somewhere where he can be used effectively. Good kid, never complained before, and did everything the Hawks asked him to do. I don’t blame him, and wish him well.
Marvin's Mishaps
February 21st, 2012
2:48 pm
It is kinda telling that when Joe Johnson sits then Marvin shines. Joe Johnson isn’t that much better than Marvin really. He just gets paid 3 times what Marvin does but doesn’t put up 3 times the production…
3dub
February 21st, 2012
2:49 pm
SWAT Native – it was a stretch to draft Marvin – especially when they were stocked with small forwards at the time and were weak at the point guard position. Poor decision, anyway you cut it.
Hawksgoingbackward
February 21st, 2012
2:51 pm
@ IMHO
Im not gonna feed into your negativity, but just respond with stats that I have already posted above.
When given a legitimate opportunity to play while Joe Johnson has been out with injury Marvin has played above average basketball. The stats dont lie.
You are correct that isnt a huge sample size but thats because Joe Johnson is durable and reliable at coming up short. If Joe wasnt around and you inflate Marvins numbers based on averages of when Joe wasnt around you would have a borderline all-star player (which is what Joe is) at half the price and the ability to surround yourself with more legitimate pieces like a Chris Kaman.
Then there are people like you who dont do such a good just looking past the obvious which is why you should apply for a job with the ASG. Lol.
Joe J Gettin' Paid $$$
February 21st, 2012
2:51 pm
Does anybody other than me expect more out of Joe Johnson every night ? I mean while other teams super stars score 30 with 10 assists and 9 rebounds we get like 16 7 and 4 from JJ. Either JJ gotta step up or its over.
3dub
February 21st, 2012
2:52 pm
“When Joe Johnson sits then Marvin shines”.
Why can’t they both shine? Look at OKC – Durant scores 51 – Westbrook score 40 – in the same game! Marvin is just not assertive enough – he needs to get in positions on the court where he can demand the ball – not on the wings waiting for a spot-up 3 opportunity.
Joe J Gettin' Paid $$$
February 21st, 2012
2:53 pm
I’d trade Hinrich,Marvin,Zaza,and draft pick today for Chris Kaman.
Hawksgoingbackward
February 21st, 2012
2:54 pm
Marvin Williams has played above average when given legitimate opportunity. Lets recall if you will:
6:00 PM ET, March 27, 2011
Marvin scores 31 pts, 7 rebs, 2 assts against cleveland while playing 43 minutes (Joe Johnson didnt play)
Coverage: TNT
8:00 PM ET, December 16, 2010
Marvin scores 26 pts, 5 rebs, 1 asts against the Boston Celtics while playing 36 mins (Joe Johnson didnt play)
Coverage: SportSouth
7:30 PM ET, December 3, 2010
Marvin scores 22 pts in 34 mins against the Philly Sixers (Joe Johnson didnt play)
February 07, 2009
Marvin scores 29 pts and goes 18-20 from the free throw line against Charlotte (Joe Johnson didnt play)
Marvin is a victim of horrible coaching, lack of opportunity, and a management structure that doesnt know what to do with talent.
You dont draft a guy 2nd overall to groom him to be a role player. Kevin Durant (not by comparison of talents sake) is a prime example of taking a player that high and allowing him the opportunity to grow into the role. When Seattle chose K.D. they traded Ray Allen to the Celtics and got back great value for Ray and opened up the spaces and opportunity for Kevin to become what he is today.
Marvin wouldnt have become Kevin Durant but without Joe Johnson the Hawks would have a better team. I hope they trade Marvin to another team in the east and he destroys the Hawks after resurrecting his career.
Raw Dawg
February 21st, 2012
2:55 pm
The offense is run thru JJ. He’s option # 1. Marvin should be option # 2 since he plays like doo-doo.
Hawksgoingbackward
February 21st, 2012
2:55 pm
@3dub
Because they both play essentially the same position, K.D. and Westbrook work because they compliment eachother much better than Joe and Marvin ever would.
Raw Dawg
February 21st, 2012
2:58 pm
T-Mac needs to tell it like it is. Don’t muzzle dat Dawg ! Lets him shout da truth. Let’s see JJ’s been unhappy for 3 years. Now T-Mac unhappy,Marvin unhappy,and J.Smith unhappy. I guess only guy happy is goofball Zaza ?
Raw Dawg
February 21st, 2012
2:59 pm
Teague,Green,J.Smith,Horford,Kaman. Let’s roll.
3dub
February 21st, 2012
3:01 pm
@Hawksgoingbackward
You forgot to mention that Westbrook os much more assertive than Marvin – Durant takes more shots per game that Joe – but Westbrook always finds a way to get “his”.
IMHO
February 21st, 2012
3:01 pm
@Hawksgoingbackward
Clowns spend a #2 on 6′ 6″ potential. MW is lazy, plays no defense and is an average NBA player. You throw up 3 games, what about the other 450 games under 3 coach’s? The numbers don’t lie.
Marvin is a bust who can be replaced at 1/2 his salary.
Raw Dawg
February 21st, 2012
3:02 pm
Ain’t that T-Mac that Marvin’s missing a dunk over ?
Raw Dawg
February 21st, 2012
3:03 pm
In the picture ?
3dub
February 21st, 2012
3:05 pm
That’s not T-Mac
Raw Dawg
February 21st, 2012
3:05 pm
I know some dudes at the local school yard that are 6′6″ that can miss layups,not rebound,and score 9 points off 3 for 12 shooting that would play for $25,000 a year…
Sharp Shooter X
February 21st, 2012
3:07 pm
“Ain’t that T-Mac that Marvin’s missing a dunk over ?”
LMAO. “Missing”….
Sharp Shooter X
February 21st, 2012
3:09 pm
What about JJ,Zaza,Marvin for Gasol ?
SWAT Native
February 21st, 2012
3:12 pm
@ 3dub – Again, Marvin didn’t draft himself. You can’t blame him for that. You’ll laugh at this too, but at that time the Hawks thought that Joe Johnson would play point guard for them.
Sharp Shooter X
February 21st, 2012
3:12 pm
okay Larry Drew, just run the offense thru Marvin tonight and tell him to show us that he can be “THE MAN”. Put up or shut up.
Sharp Shooter X
February 21st, 2012
3:13 pm
well SWAT, no matter what team drafted Marvin or what team he plays for today he is not a star or even nearly a star while CP3 & Deron are.
Sharp Shooter X
February 21st, 2012
3:15 pm
I’d trade ‘em all (JJ,J.Smith,Zaza,Teague,Marvin,Hinrich,Pargo,T-Mac,Ivan,etc.) for Kobe then call up D-league scrubs. They’d stand the same chance at winning as they do now…
3dub
February 21st, 2012
3:18 pm
@SWAT Native
I remember that plan for Joe to play the point – just stupid. And I’m not blaming Marvin for getting drafted # 2 – good for him. He also managed to play “well” enough to get a new contract.
Hawksgoingbackward
February 21st, 2012
3:19 pm
@ Sharp Shooter X
Nobody is saying that Marvin would be the star that CP3 or Deron is. That train has left the station, its admitted that a mistake was made there.
The question is how to get the most out of Marvin. The reality is that Marvin has produced give the opportunity. If Joe wasnt here its more than possible that Marvin could produce number around 17 pts per game with 7 rebs and 2 or 3 asts, Which is exactly what we are getting from Joe (sans the rebs) but for 3.5 times as much money.
Its crazy!
@ IMHO
I didnt go back and find every game that Marvin played well. Your foolish for thinking that in 450 games Marvin hasnt had any other good games than the ones I referenced. And even with that being the case compared to Joe Johnson’s falling averages would the Hawks be worse with Marvin getting more shots at a third the price.
Hawksgoingbackward
February 21st, 2012
3:20 pm
How about Marvin for D.J. Augustin straight up???
The Hawks get another guard to destroy and Marvin goes to play for a N.C. alum who will give him a true shot on a team that needs help.
3dub
February 21st, 2012
3:21 pm
@ Sharp Shooter X
I don’t think theJJ,Zaza,Marvin for Gasol trade would match up salary wise – not to mention that JJ and Kobe play the same position.
3dub
February 21st, 2012
3:23 pm
@ Hawksgoingbackward
There are countless games where Joe has struggled (facing double teams, etc) and the Hawks needed someone to “step up”. Where is Marvin during these times? Mr. Invisible.
Andrew Lipham
February 21st, 2012
3:24 pm
Horford, Hinrich, Marvin, Zaza, picks for Dwight and Turk
That is THE trade that needs to made soon.
Hawksgoingbackward
February 21st, 2012
3:29 pm
@ 3 dub
Marvin has fallen out of favor in recent years with coaching. Not his fault. Coupled with the fact that he is playing on a shoot happy jump squad with no leadership. No one who should be getting shots is getting them. Hence T-Mac’s comments about playing time, Hence Josh shooting 3’s (still), Hence Teague still not being developed at critical points in the game.
There is alot wrong with this team that has nothing to do with what Marvin can provide when given a true opportunity.
Marvin isnt in the game in the fourth quarter, and you can make the argument that is partly his fault, but how can you really pass blame to Marvin with a management and coaching structure that tears apart everything that comes its way.
atlanta spirit are dumbies
February 21st, 2012
3:29 pm
by giving joe johnson all that money, they have created a mindset in the organization that we will pay you alot of money for under acheiving because you feel you are a great player in your head. marvin you will never make this type of money again!!!! get in the gym and do 6 hours instead of 1 or 2. & stop drinking joe’s cool aid and looking at his paycheck and feeling like you need to make more. your stats in relationship to your paycheck say who you are. GET OVER YOURSELF!!!!
DHD
February 21st, 2012
3:29 pm
The NBA started?
Josh W
February 21st, 2012
3:30 pm
Dwight does not want to come here. He will.be in the same position he was in in Orlando. He wants a Kobe or a Derron to play with. Not a Teague or Johnson. And at the time of the draft werent we set with decent PG’s at the time? So its easy to make hindsight judgments but Marvin def should not have been #2 overall.
SWAT Native
February 21st, 2012
3:31 pm
@ 3dub – actually, in those situations, Marvin is usually sitting. See why he wants to be traded?
3dub
February 21st, 2012
3:35 pm
@ Hawksgoingbackward
I’m not blaming Marvin for all the Hawks faults – but, if he has fallen out of favor, why would you invest in him and re-sign him as they did? Also, he knew his role when he re-signed – don’t start crying now.
tyger
February 21st, 2012
3:37 pm
STOP BASHING MARVIN MORONS…
You are going to scare the other teams away…
I am Marvin’s biggest fan and value his game…
Points alone, do not tell Marvin’s story…
Marvin cannot exert himself stuck in the corner deferring to Big Pass Joe…
I hate to see him leave, every championship team needs a Marvin…
However, the cost is too high…#2 Overall Pick/ $7.5M extension…
The expectation is greatness, upper echelon, Allstar…
And we all can honestly say, that has not occurred…
The 6′9, 230, versatile F can defend, play multiple positions and shoot the 3…
That has value…he is smart, coachable and fundamentally sound…
Has a champions pedigree but was never given the green light here…
It’s worth mentioning that when JJ is out, Marvin’s avg. increases exponentially…
But to be fair, JJ is not the reason Marvin has not blossomed…
Marvin is not the Nique-esque player we envisioned…
Yes, the metrics are similar, but Marvin doesnt have the agility, explosiveness…
Nique was the complete package – long, athletic, explosive, agile, fast, quick, inside-out…
Marvin is long, somewhat athletic, can shoot the 3…
But cannot create for himself off the dribble…which is his biggest limiting factor…
Marvin is more apt to fall down rather than throw it down…
But in the right system Marvin can be extremely valuable…
He can defend the best athlete on the floor…James, Kobe, Pierce…
Stretch the defense with the 3, hit FT, and provide nice 2/3 options…
Celtics, Wizards, Cavs, Bobcats, Hornets, Spurs, Nuggets, Pistons
3dub
February 21st, 2012
3:37 pm
@ SWAT Native
He’s sitting in those situations now because he hasn’t stepped up in those situations previously. I really think Marvin finally realizes he needs to move on and get a fresh start somewhere.
Josh W
February 21st, 2012
3:40 pm
Omg I appologize, we desperately needed a PG
3dub
February 21st, 2012
3:53 pm
STOP BASHING MARVIN MORONS…
You are going to scare the other teams away…
@ tyger
They are already scared!!
The Prez, and a member
February 21st, 2012
3:56 pm
MW to the Lynx for Maya Moore and Candace Wiggins…Oops wrong league…
Sharp Shooter X
February 21st, 2012
4:00 pm
“Marvin is more apt to fall down rather than throw it down…”
And herin lies the problem…
Sharp Shooter X
February 21st, 2012
4:01 pm
If they were picking teams (like school yard) out of every NBA player in the league Marvin would be picked last.
Sharp Shooter X
February 21st, 2012
4:02 pm
(: Marvin Williams as a Hawk
Marvin Williams not a Hawk