It won’t be easy for Braves to turn fans back into believers
Fredi Gonzalez and Frank Wren have a lot of damage to overcome. (Curtis Compton/AJC)
This has been, as a general rule, a pro sports market of misery and hangovers, not celebrations and … well, hangovers.
The Falcons lost an NFL playoff game in 1980, and it evolved into some perceived mutant voodoo curse for the next two decades. The Hawks last won an NBA title in an era of canvas high tops (1957-58), and when they were based in St. Louis. The NHL – two teams, come and gone (the first winning a Stanley Cup after it moved to Calgary).
Even when the Braves’ lone World Series title in 1995 is referenced, it’s usually with some verbal slap about 13 other Octobers when the team fell flat, fell short or outright imploded (1996 vs. the Yankees)?
It’s for that reason that Fredi Gonzalez, Frank Wren, Terence McGuirk and the corporate weasel owner behind the curtain should be aware of something: This city-wide vitriol that they’re hearing, seeing and feeling in the aftermath of a late-season self-immolation is going to linger for a while.
Through the winter. Through the spring. Probably even through next September, because we’ve learned not to make assumptions with 8½-game leads.
Martin Prado's batting average dropped from .307 to .260 this season. (Curtis Compton)
In 22 years of living in Atlanta, I’ve witnessed the area’s sports fans being sad, distraught, shocked, confused, frustrated and numb. But I can’t ever remember this level of anger directed at a team, at least not outside of Athens, where it can be a weekly occurrence. (Eugene Robinson submarined the Falcons at the Super Bowl with a late-night mission of lust, but nobody could blame the team for that.)
By unraveling in the season’s final weeks, the Braves just firebombed much of their audience. It took five years to get people excited again in 2010, and that has been undone. Few will listen now to grand proclamations about this team contending for titles, until it actually does. Certainly, nobody will assume greatness of Fredi Gonzalez, at least until he can exorcise memories of a 9-18 September.
This is not an-easy-to-please sports town — not because fans have been spoiled, but because they’ve been conditioned to assume the worst.
In theory, the Braves should still be a strong playoff contender next season. But in theory, they had a playoff team this season (yes, even after injuries).
Fair or unfair, almost every assumption we made about this team now seem off. Dan Uggla, a career .263 hitter in Florida and .287 in his last season, came to Atlanta, signed a $61 million contract and needed every bit of it for therapy. He hit .233, and that, folks, was close to the high-water mark. So now we must wonder: Was he a great player on a bad team and in an invisible market who can’t take the pressure on a bigger stage?
Jason Heyward hit .227, 50 points lower than his rookie season, lost his swing after injuries and then lost his starting job. So we ask: Was 2010 an aberration, the scouting reports bunk?
Martin Prado’s average dropped from .307 to .260, he had the second-worst on-base percentage (.302) among regular position players on the roster, and he scored 34 fewer runs (66) than a year ago. Alex Gonzalez, the only player with a lower on-base percentage, hit .241, far below the shortstop he was acquired for, Yunel Escobar (.290), who also happens to be six years younger. Brian McCann, a perennial All-Star, faded late for the second consecutive season despite a new offseason workout plan.
Gonzalez? He was manager of the year with the Marlins three years ago. But is getting a cheap, young team to overachieve with 84 wins his strength?
All of this might seem unfair. But it’s not like most of this bunch has a long resume. The burden of proof is on them.
The Braves built up a lot of good will in 2010. They made the playoffs after a four-year absence and a season filled with an almost cartoon-like string of injuries. They were fun to watch, simply because they never stopped playing hard, even when X-rays, MRIs and logic told them the year was over. They lost in the playoffs, but it seemed acceptable because those box scores included the names Melky Cabrera, Troy Glaus, Rick Ankiel, Nate McLouth, Brooks Conrad, Diory Hernandez and Kyle Farnsworth.
There was momentum coming into 2011. There won’t be momentum going into 2012. Or assumptions. It’s going to take a while before people believe again.
By Jeff Schultz
•
Last 3 Braves blogs:
– Braves reverse field, make right call firing Larry Parrish
– Braves collapse, and the shine just came off of Fredi Gonzalez
– Poll time: Who should get most blame for Braves’ collapse?
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302 comments Add your comment
Keith
October 1st, 2011
9:35 am
I’m from Montana I have been a braves fan since the Dale Murphy days. So I have been through the bad the good and the great. It reminds me of the One and only time I was in Atlanta, I told a guy I’m a lifelong fan from Montana, he turned around and said so you are a masacist huh I said yes and that statement remains true today. See ya next spring Bravos, I need time to heal my wounds.
Jason (not the one that already posted)
October 1st, 2011
9:36 am
Jeff,
You just summarized how I’ve felt about the Braves since 2003. Around that time I was just getting out of college. When I went into college in 99, I had been keeping up with the Braves on a daily basis. Then, when I didn’t have my own tv in college and couldn’t keep up as easily, I started to recognize that the Braves really were just ok and not great. By the time I got out in 2003, I realized that the Braves were really nothing like they were in the 90s. They were the kind of team that were good enough to compete for a playoff spot, but they don’t really scare anyone. They are a team that is holding onto the past, and is too afraid to dump great players that are on their downside in order to push for the future. The Braves could have traded Chipper about 4 or 5 years ago and gotten something that would set them up well for the future. But what now? Chipper is on his way out, and the Braves have nothing to show for his presence in the last 5 years. Who is going to lead this team going forward? We’ve seen several rookies have great years only to disappear the next year (Francour and Heyward). Can we really trust that the Braves will be able to keep Freeman and Kimbrel on the right track? This is why I haven’t taken the Braves seriously in over 10 years. This isn’t about the collapse this year. This is about overcoming mediocrity that has persisted in the organization long term.
TomB
October 1st, 2011
9:42 am
The difference between the Braves and the Phillies is the starting pitching. They pitch complete games and this takes pressure off the relievers and the manager. If the Braves starters just pitched a complete game every now and then, it would make a big difference. It’s not like the Phillies are some great hitting team. The Braves have a decision to make; either match them with pitching or acquire more bats(preferable gamers) that would make the difference.
STRETCH
October 1st, 2011
9:44 am
I know we cant blame everything on Lowe, but Freddi gets lots of blame along with the players.
Lowe gave the Braves NO chance the last 10 times he went out there, clearly he was out of gas, but Freddi kept running him out there!
As Joe Madden said, the Braves dont have that prime time pitcher and they need one. The have 2 number 2’s a number 3 and 4 and some young guns that haven not had a chance to prove themselves yet.
Prado: in the famous words of Dennis, “Prado is who we thought he was.” Fix LF, SS and 3B.
They are gonna have to be bold this offseason and they should start in the outfeild. Hope Heyward bounces back, Get a full season of Bourn and pick up a BJ Upton and they are in business.
There is too much talent on this team to choke like that the past two seasons.
And the pitching coach gets fired, and wasnt the same people screaming for Terry Pendletons head last year? Point: Folks you can lead a horse to water, but you cant make him drink! Not advancing runners, DP’s w/RISP and striking out is on the guy standing in the box not the guy in the dugout!
Until management gets serious getting tough, grinding players, the Braves will always be an October 1 and done.
Gen Neyland
October 1st, 2011
9:46 am
Matt : Count the banners in the outfield prior to 1991. My children and our in-law kids were in elementary school when 1991 came along and they’ve known no different then, at the very least, making the playoffs pretty darn regularly. I’m in total agreement regarding the WSC’s during ‘The Run’…
Billy
October 1st, 2011
9:46 am
You right I’m out’er here..no more Braves after 40 years till Fredi and the Clowns are gone!
extremus
October 1st, 2011
9:48 am
I feel that the situation is beyond regaining the trust of fans for Freddi Gonzalez, by the way; he needs to be shown the door. Over the course of the season I saw him at least once sit in the dugout rather than take up for his players (VERY unlike his predecessor), utterly fail to address issues like half the team not hitting for months on end (Heyward should have been in Gwinnett in May, and running Derek Lowe out there time and again was a big part of the meltdown), mismanagement such as grossly overusing some of the bullpen and making seemingly random batting order changes throughout the last month or two that never allowed for any sort of consistency or common sense (if the Braves seemingly had it together right after both Bourn and Constanza were in the lineup then why all of a sudden did he bench Constanza?), and most glaringly, the Braves lost an 8 1/2 game wildcard lead in under a month on his watch. Perhaps what got under fans’ skin the most (going by the comments here) was Freddi’s seeming apathy toward losing (”Gotta tip your cap to…”); fans needed someone to speak to accountability and say “It was OUR (the Braves’ ) fault we didn’t get it done”. You could see it in their eyes and their body language, especially toward the end; the Braves lost hope and quit on their manager, who simply did not inspire confidence or passion.
There is no timeline for regaining trust after a season like this; Freddi Gonzalez needs to go or most fans (including myself) simply won’t have any confidence to really care about this team’s misadventures until he is gone. Period. We need a new manager with a fresh approach and his own identity, this time from outside the Braves organization, so to speak (Gonzalez was a former Cox coach).
Sonny Clusters
October 1st, 2011
9:48 am
“Few will listen now to grand proclamations about this team contending for titles, until it actually does.” -Jeff Schultz
Yes! Those little signs that Fredi calls “pennants” need to come down. This organization needs to prove something. Those little signs are the signs of pretenders. An “epic” collapse may call for “epic” change. Do away with the inbred culture of BobbyBall and the continual disappointments, losses, failures, and the resulting campaign of telling us about the 14 consecutive division championships. Those weren’t championships, they were forums for defeat. How many teams have celebrated victory on the Braves home field? How many times do we have to watch the Braves skulk off the field in defeat? Champions? We think not. Chipper Jones, heroic Hall of Fame leader of the team? We think not. The numbers are good but he has nine fingers with no ring and he’s had a few chances, hasn’t he? Change this team, Mr Wren, or more familiarly, “Mr Schuerholz, tear down this wall!” There’d better be some changes because we are pretty huge fans and we are disgusted with this “epic collapse”. We also think Fredi is a gone goose and he may as well go now. He truly was stupid to tell this group of angry fans within hours of the collapse that all his coaches would return next year. We have to tip our cap to Fredi for assuring in those few words that Larry Parrish must go. Well, Fredi seems to have messed up our pitchers young and old and Heyward and Prado, too. We sure don’t want Bobby Cox back but neither do we want Fredi.
JB
October 1st, 2011
9:51 am
Hire Greg WALKER hitting Coach, he just resigned after 9 years with White Sox.
extremus
October 1st, 2011
9:53 am
Hmm, that was awfully eloquent and devoid of down-home humor for a Sonny Clusters post…
Sonny Clusters
October 1st, 2011
9:56 am
Who was the guy who from day one said Fredi was a “looser”? We was thinking he didn’t know what he was talking about and then . . . the epic collapse. Epic is a term used by the national media to describe what happened. Epic is pretty powerful. Epic flood, epic war, epic baseball collapse. Epic is big-time failure. Epic failure calls for epic change. No more BobbyBall. No more cap-tipping. No more not being able to put a bunt down or hit a cutoff man. No more free swings with runners on third and all we need is contact. Epic. Think about it. We was thinking Stinky Wintes could help this team.
Ken Shelton
October 1st, 2011
9:56 am
As much as we fans of the eternal-ever-after Tomahawking Braves are in shock, or better-yet, nightmarish shock over the September total collapse over what I am sure every fan would of bet their last dollar was destined for at the least the wild card when this ninth month of this yer began. Neverless, with a pro-active approach which Frank Wren has at least began to address by giving the ax to batting coach Larry Parrish. I have to believe 2012 will live up to a new level of expectations. As while I hate to see anyone lost their job, as case with LP, and while he can’t literally grab a bat and hit, the Braves are not a team of rag-tag players,or unproven commodities, management has put together an impressive squad of no-fewer than seven all-stars, and the best hitting rookie, so bring to the table a new hitting coach who can lead them to better hitting approaches, I have to think a new year, can only breed an October filled with baseball Atlanta way in 2012.
STRETCH
October 1st, 2011
9:58 am
Jeff, has anyone asked Freddi what happened with Constanza and why Lowe was allowed to pitch as much as he did?
People dont want to here from Freddi that Lowe is a “Big Game” pitcher. Lowe was plain awful yet he still went out there and put the team in 3-0 and 4-0 holes repeatedly.
And KK was banished to the pen then to the Las Vegas desert but Lowe gets treated like CC Sabathia.
JB
October 1st, 2011
9:58 am
Dame Good reports by extremus and who? Sonny Clusters! Got to agree with both.
Dawg One
October 1st, 2011
9:59 am
You heard it here first: Grantham is out and Van Gorder is coming back to Athens!
hawesg
October 1st, 2011
10:00 am
You have to worry after a collapse like this that the Braves make the sort of shortsighted moves that are offered in internet comments threads. The ONLY reason we weren’t eliminated prior to the last game was the pitching depth Wren refused to trade. Yes, the end of the Lowe deal is bad. We all knew it would be. But he had to overpay for Lowe because the great Chuck James/Horacio Ramirez/Kyle Davies rotation didn’t pan out. Wren got Uggla. Wren got Bourn.
It was Fredi that failed to know how to get the most out of the talent the front office provided him. He yanked his starters too soon, putting stresses on the bullpen that killed it down the stretch. It was Frediot that didn’t understand that putting players with low OBP in the #2 spot will minimize the amount of runs you score.
Sonny Clusters
October 1st, 2011
10:01 am
We was very good in school, extremus. We was never so mad at a baseball organization as this. Consider not just that we enter next season with a 40-year old 3B but now our young players are struggling, too. The future of the team is pretty cloudy from where we sit. Do you realize how messed up things are? The young guys regressed. Pitchers, young and old, have arm troubles. Nobody hits .300. Trade for a hitter that hits .300 and watch his average drop 40 points. This organization needs to be changed. The fans should be outraged. WHERE IS THE OUTRAGE? We hope Frank Wren reads Jeff’s blog because he needs to go out and find himself a Stinky Wintes to make some epic changes.
hawesg
October 1st, 2011
10:03 am
Stretch, Constanza got hurt and returned to his ability level. There’s a reason why he is a 27 year old minor league journeyman. He played when he was hot. When he got hurt he cooled off. Constanza was playing over his head, there was no way that was going to continue.
Everyone hates on Heyward, but he had a .375 OBP in September even despite his swing problems that Parrish was unable to help him with.
P Rose
October 1st, 2011
10:04 am
Token changes (firing the hitting coach) won’t help. There have been 16 consecutive autumn failures since 1995. There is only one link to all those late season meltdowns. In 1995 he was The Sporting News Rookie Of The Year, and since then he has been a 7-time All-Star, a 2-time Silver Slugger Award winner, a league MVP, and a league Batting Champion. He gradually settled into the role of team “leader” by default. The trouble is, despite his personal achievements on the field, he makes a sorry leader. He leads the young players with his bad examples. Never mind that he fathered a child out of wedlock with a Hooters waitress, of all things. He incites opponents with his reckless, cocky public comments (”They can put their Yankees stuff on… We can beat the Phillies…” etc.). He publicly calls out his own players (Heyward) for not playing hurt, then declines to play hurt himself. He excuses himself from the team to attend his son’s minor elective surgery during a crucial stretch drive, leaving them without their “leader” and best hitter. He insults his own fans (telling a reporter last week they could “kiss his @$$ for criticizing him). He loses the final out in the lights in a must-win game. He goes 0 for 5 in an elimination game. He is arrogant, ignorant, and a hypocrite. This team melts down when the pressure is on because that’s what men of low character do. The young players are simply following his lead. They get downhearted because their leader does.
gtne80
October 1st, 2011
10:05 am
These things are cyclic. The collapse was hard to watch, but maybe it will be a blessing in the long run by teaching them that nothing is ever certain.
The real story for this season is that the Phils have the starting staff and lineup to dominate. Even had the Braves made the playoffs, they weren’t going anywhere.
Patience is the key right now. Continue to groom the young talent, especially the young arms. I think with Turner Field, we need to build a team that relies more on speed and hitting for average than for the long ball. TF is not the hitters’ park that the old launching pad was. There are a lot of “bandbox” stadiums out there, but Turner Field isn’t one of them. Besides, a lineup that is built on speed and hitting for average is less likely to go through an extended slump and is better suited for the post-season when you face “studs” as starting pitchers.
Patience, Braves fans.
P Rose
October 1st, 2011
10:09 am
Token changes (firing the hitting coach) won’t help. There have been 16 consecutive autumn failures since 1995. There is only one link to all those late season meltdowns. In 1995 he was The Sporting News Rookie Of The Year, and since then he has been a 7-time All-Star, a 2-time Silver Slugger Award winner, a league MVP, and a league Batting Champion. He gradually settled into the role of team “leader” by default. The trouble is, despite his personal achievements on the field, he makes a sorry leader. He leads the young players with his bad examples. Never mind that he fathered a child out of wedlock with a Hooters waitress, of all things. He incites opponents with his reckless, cocky public comments (”They can put their Yankees stuff on… We can beat the Phillies…” etc.). He publicly calls out his own players (Heyward) for not playing hurt, then declines to play hurt himself. He excuses himself from the team to attend his son’s minor, elective surgery during a crucial stretch drive, leaving them without their “leader” and best hitter. He insults his own fans (telling a reporter last week they could “kiss his @$$ for criticizing him). He loses the final out in the lights in a must-win game. He goes 0 for 5 in an elimination game. He is arrogant, ignorant, and a hypocrite. This team melts down when the pressure is on because that’s what men of low character do. The young players are simply following his lead. They get downhearted because their leader does.
Robards
October 1st, 2011
10:10 am
I’ll be interested in seeing what the rotation looks like–so many options with all the young talent. Obviously, it’s important to select a hitting coach who emphasizes plate discipline and not someone who merely counsels to swing as hard as you can, with a slight upper-cut. Braves should contend for the division. The Phils’ everyday 8 are starting to age and the Nats aren’t quite ready. Marlins probably aren’t either, and the Mets are a mess. I’m not as pessimistic as Schultz.
Dirty Dawg
October 1st, 2011
10:11 am
Jeff. I don’t think you and Bradley and O’Brian and any of the sports scribes truly understand fans. We enjoy pulling for a winner…we go to games hopeful that we get to go home happy and when we do we come back ‘expecting’ to go home happy. If next year’s Braves play tough and smart and ‘winning’ baseball, we’ll be back…if they don’t then we won’t. We’ll find something else to do with our money and time…of course that won’t include hockey, and probably not basketball (pro, that is). Baseball has the added advantage of playing a lot of games, if you start poorly, you can make it up and turn ‘expectations’ around in a hurry. Of course if you lose then you dig the hole deeper and deeper.
The fans don’t want this team to do better any more than those that run it and play for it and if they don’t get their job done, then we’ll ‘move on’.
bruce
October 1st, 2011
10:13 am
Jeff, did your dog die?
Dr. Warren
October 1st, 2011
10:15 am
I think we have a fake Sonny Clusters on our hands. His syntax and style are completely different. Fake Sonny Clusters, please stand down. Choose a name and write entries good enough to make your own reputation!
P Rose
October 1st, 2011
10:16 am
Hmm.. two attempts to post this have failed. I’ll try to replace a couple of key words that probably offend our thin-skinned host.
Token changes (firing the hitting coach) won’t help. There have been 16 consecutive autumn failures since 1995. There is only one link to all those late season meltdowns. In 1995 he was The Sporting News Rookie Of The Year, and since then he has been a 7-time All-Star, a 2-time Silver Slugger Award winner, a league MVP, and a league Batting Champion. He gradually settled into the role of team “leader” by default. The trouble is, despite his personal achievements on the field, he makes a sorry leader. He leads the young players with his bad examples. Never mind that he fathered a child out of wedlock with a sports bar waitress, of all things. He incites opponents with his reckless, cocky public comments (”They can put their Yankees stuff on… We can beat the Phillies…” etc.). He publicly calls out his own players (Heyward) for not playing hurt, then declines to play hurt himself. He excuses himself from the team to attend his son’s minor elective surgery during a crucial stretch drive, leaving them without their “leader” and best hitter. He insults his own fans (telling a reporter last week they could “kiss his [expletive deleted] for criticizing him). He loses the final out in the lights in a must-win game. He goes 0 for 5 in an elimination game. He is arrogant, ignorant, and a hypocrite. This team melts down when the pressure is on because that’s what men of low character do. The young players are simply following his lead. They get downhearted because their leader does.
paul
October 1st, 2011
10:16 am
Your criticism of Uggla is way off base. He carried this team in the second half, including September. His HR numbers are near the top of the league, even aftger a horrible
first half. Hayward, Prado, and Left Field, along with the pitching injuries killed us.
It would also be nice to get ALL of our pitchers buntiing lessions.
P Rose
October 1st, 2011
10:16 am
Have I been banned? (If this shows up, I guess not.)
P Rose
October 1st, 2011
10:18 am
Okay, clearly I haven’t been banned. I guess the AJC filter simply doesn’t want you to read what I had to say. The truth hurts.
Curious George
October 1st, 2011
10:18 am
Does Terry Francona need a ride from the Atlanta Airport up to 755 Hank Aaron Drive?
Joe Maddon
October 1st, 2011
10:19 am
The Phillies aren’t a great hitting team, but they don’t strikeour much either. They are disciplined, especially when Utley has it going and batting second. That’s why you need a SERIOUS one-two punch to knock them out, like the Giants did last season. Hudson should have earned everyone’s respect by now, he’s a bulldog, but he’s not a true ace anymore (if he ever was). Hanson has ace potential, but until he throws 200+ innigs consistently, he’s just a very good pitcher. Jurrjens is a solid #3 or #4 guy but he can’t stay healthy. This is why you have to make a move. Keep Beachy because he has potential and work ethic to be an innings eater but he’s also a much better power pitcher than many expected him to be.
Just call me RAY-ZOR RAY-MONE!!!!
Curious George
October 1st, 2011
10:19 am
Why is it taking so long for the Braves to officially fire Roger McDowell and Fredi Gonzalez as well?
Corky Miller, Scott Thurman, and Oscar Villarreal
October 1st, 2011
10:20 am
This is where a real owner is needed. Think outside “the bottom line” for a year and raise payroll. Go after Reyes! Next years payroll will be high but Lowe and Jones will come off after 2012 to make up for it. Give the fans something to get excited about besides trying to piece together a lineup with rookies and utility men trying to play everyday. Pretty good lineup with just one addition…
1 Bourne
2 Reyes
3 Jones
4 Uggla
5 McCann
6 Prado
7 Freeman
8 Heyward
Sonny Clusters
October 1st, 2011
10:23 am
On the subject of Uggla, he did carry the team after the Break for a time before he again cooled off, but early in the season he killed us batting cleanup and hitting nothing. If Uggla had performed just a little bit earlier in the year the Braves would have a much better record. Uggla, Lowe, Proctor and Linebrink, McLouth, Heyward, Prado, Alex, pick your poison. We was thinking somebody told Fredi those little signs in the outfield are pennants. Hahahahahaha!!!
Joe Maddon
October 1st, 2011
10:27 am
Fire Roger McDowell?!?!?! LOL… Your Braves had a Top 5 pitching staff this season before the injuries. If there is one person who did his job and is secure, it’s McDowell.
Sonny Clusters
October 1st, 2011
10:29 am
Those little signs in the outfield are like participation awards they give the little leaguers when they are still playing in the dirt instead of watching the game. Anyone who calls those pennants is kidding himself and kidding you. Every one of those little signs that don’t actually stand for a NL pennant or a WS victory needs to come down. When the organization realizes that’s not winning maybe they can do something about it. Somebody explain it to Chipper, too.
Joe Maddon
October 1st, 2011
10:32 am
Corky Miller,
Now I agree with you on Reyes, but his history of leg injuries and will turn off a lot of teams since his game is all about speed, so unless he’s taking a discount and wants to come to Atlanta, chances are slim. I’d love to see it though! Bourn and Reyes would be the deadliest table setting combo in the majors. (I’d probably bat Heyward 5th, though)
Bill Stanfill
October 1st, 2011
10:35 am
I agree with you guys about Lowe. Why wasn’t he put in the bullpen in early August? There’s no excuse for continuing to use him every 5th day, none. (Right now, it’s a little hard to listen to Wren talk about what may happen NEXT year.)
McCann wasn’t the same after returning from the injury. Ross should have been starting 1 of every 3 games.
Why was Linebrink used in any game that mattered down the stretch? The guy throws hard but it’s batting practice stuff.
I’m pulling for RAYS or and Detroit. . . pulling against Phils and Yankees. Gotta give credit to the Cardinals–they never let up down the stretch.
TomB
October 1st, 2011
10:35 am
I think F. Wren heard from the Clusters and he finally said enough. Clusters was on all the blogs yesterday shouting “Where is the outrage?”, and Mr. Wren knew just how powerful the Clusters are. All the calling for Stinky Wintes at all was enough for Wren to act. Keep it up Sonny Clusters. Yea, and please bring back Francouer.
POLAD
October 1st, 2011
10:40 am
I share Robards’ curiosity about what next year’s rotation will look like. Maybe it’s time to give Teheran and Delgado a chance.
Larry
October 1st, 2011
10:41 am
Just read the 2nd comment from “59bulldawg” and the 4th comment by “FJ10.”
It is comments like this that make me want to absolutely puke!
You two perfectly exemplify the gooberish, polyannaish, and downright dimwitted dolts that tolerate–and, in turn, perpetuate–the attitudes that plague this organization. Well, let me tell you something, this is not the little league, the American Legion, or your local church softball team. This is a business where the players and owners are making unfathomed riches by the common man and thus we, as the customers who pay for this, have every right to expect the very best from ownership, management, and players.
Enough of my time with Pollyanna Goobers…
Jeff,
Superb work! I for one truly appreciate your courage to put in print what everyone (well, everyone but the goobers, anyway) is thinking.
We as fans (paying customers) can only make our displeasure known by withholding our financial support for this business called the Atlanta Braves or blog and write letters. You, however, have the broad reaching power of the media and I for one greatly appreciate your willingness to exorcise this power and privilege in an honest and diplomatic manner.
But for me, I’ll not be so diplomatic. Fruity Gonzalez is so over his head I feel pity fir the guy. I want to urge all Braves fans to withhold their financial support until the Braves take their customers seriously and hire a proven manager and leader. And I put my money where my mouth is by not renewing my 21 year season tickets when they hired him. Well, guess what, I didn’t buy one single ticket this past season and I’m feeling a he’ll if lot better than those that did!
One of the two or three best managers in the game is sitting out there for the taking. His name is Terry Francona and he is a perfect 8-0 in two world series sweeps. We can get him for a heck if a lot less than the $15 million a year we’ve wasted in Lowe.
Francona will fill the seats and I’d renew in a second…do it Wren!
blazerdawg
October 1st, 2011
10:41 am
I believe the Braves are at the same crossroads as the Mets were in the late 90s.
The Braves of the 90s were built by Cox to feature “lockdown” starting pitching and good defense; at the time it was a strategy meant to improve upon the Mets’ strategy. It was successful. The Mets, on the other hand, went through a series of management changes and strategies, mostly built on signing big names, but without a good plan. They have mostly failed. I do not want the Braves to overreact (with the exception of letting MFG go), and do not expect that they will.
I do not want the Braves to change much at all.
Upgrade at shortstop.
Right field must be able to hit.
Keep developing the younguns on the farm.
Emphasize great starting pitching.
Bourne was a GREAT acquisition – keep him or develop some more speed.
$86 Million is a fine payroll. 2.4M – 2.6M is fine attendance. (although if they hired Francona attendance would certainly go to 3M+ in year one)
I think they are really close. Upgrade the left side of the infield, with an average hitting right fielder, and they are WS bound.
Robert
October 1st, 2011
10:43 am
Joe Maddox:
The entire starting eight (minus pitchers) … are overpaid. If you don’t make the playoffs, I say you are overpaid and need to take a pay cut. I pull harder and enjoy more watching a 40 million dollar team win it all with young hungry kids than watch overpaid “stars” fail time and again.
blazerdawg
October 1st, 2011
10:44 am
Dang Larry, we made the same point at the same time.
Hire Francona!
Wish someone down on Aaron/Capitol Avenue is paying attention to the paying customer.
Why Chipper Why
October 1st, 2011
10:45 am
First of all Fredi has to go. Get Francona, get anyone.
But Chipper Jones is the reason we are in this position. He did it to us last year and he did it this year. We constantly had to shuffle players around to fill in for him when we wasnt feeling good, or his knee had to be probed, or his back was hurting. Whose to say poor Prado’s season wasnt attributed to moving between third and left?
How can a person be a team leader when he’s not contributing? These Braves are human. I would imagine some players becoming a little irritated. Our Braves looked like a team only a month ago. What I saw in the dugout those last 3 games were a defeated team that did want to be there.
After the game 2 Freeman was quoted as saying he didnt want to be anywhere near a ballpark.
That says it all.
blazerdawg
October 1st, 2011
10:48 am
Meant to refer to the Mets of the 80’s, not 90’s in my earlier post.
jmor
October 1st, 2011
10:55 am
The Braves need a left fielder, a right fielder, a third baseman and a shortstop. Prado is not good at 3rd or left field and does not hit for enough power to play either. He is really a second baseman.Hudson is going to be 37 and could start to drop off quickly like Lowe did. McCann is below average as a defensive catcher(throwing and blocking the ball in the dirt) and I question his signal calling as does Hudson who prefers to pitch to Ross. Thestarting pitchers are a collection of 5 and 6 inning guys with no chance to ever pitch a complete game. The bullpen is solid, but the manager is weak and was exposed as such during the September collapse. Frank Wren has lots of issues to consider in the off season.
MitchC
October 1st, 2011
10:55 am
Very good article, Jeff. Atlanta was an apethetic sports town even during the latter stages of the 14 division title run, when first round playoff games wouldnt sell out.
On paper, the Braves are still decent, abit long in the tooth, with older players like Chipper, Lowe, etc.
As we know, the Mets were contenders the season afrer they blew the infamous 7 game East lead in 2007, and since 2009, havent been heard from.
Even if we have a wild card lead late in the season next year, no one will believe until we actually clinch.
I still think that Fredi G will be under a microscope next season. If we dont contend, or contend and dont win the wild card, I think there’s a good chance he will be gone after next season.
Ridonkulous
October 1st, 2011
10:56 am
Braves have to make changes and with “faceless ownership,” we cannot count on the wherewithal to pull them off. Who’s running the show? Don’t give me Terry McGuirk — the guy has managed to turn being Ted Turner’s gopher into a lifetime goldmine. The Braves need:
Power in the corner outfield spots. Not another season with Prado & Diaz please.
Chipper? Figure it out. He’s the new Hinske.
McCann? Can he play 3rd? Probably not, he has no foot speed. He should be traded (sold) to an AL team as DH. This will never happen but it should.
A Gon B gon.
Heyward? He better tear it up in Orlando or he starts in Gwinnett or gone.
Pitching – Pretty good shape. Questionmarks: can Hanson last with that delivery? Who can we dump Lowe on? Finding some good arms who can pitch the 6-7-8 so we can lighten the load on Venters/Kimbrel (after first figuring out whether these guys will ever recover from their scandalous overuse in 2011).
Freddy — he gets 40 games. His magic number is 20.
P Rose
October 1st, 2011
10:56 am
There have been 16 consecutive autumn failures since 1995. There is only one link to all those late season meltdowns, and despite his personal achievements on the field, he makes a sorry leader. He incites opponents with his reckless, cocky public comments (”They can put their Yankees stuff on… We can beat the Phillies…” etc.). He publicly calls out his own players (Heyward) for not playing hurt, then declines to play because of “flu-like symptoms.” He excuses himself from the team to attend his son’s minor elective surgery during a crucial stretch drive, leaving them without their best hitter. He insults his own fans (telling a reporter last week they could “kiss his [expletive deleted] for criticizing him). He loses the final out in the lights in a must-win game. He goes 0 for 5 with 3 strikeouts in the final elimination game. This team melts down when the pressure is on because that’s what men of low character do. The young players are simply following his lead. They get downhearted because their leader does.