Poll: Who should get most blame for Braves’ collapse?
Here's two of your biggest targets: Derek Lowe and Fredi Gonzalez. (Curtis Compton/AJC)
I write this knowing that there’s still a very good chance the Braves (with Tim Hudson on the mound) will win tonight’s game against Philadelphia (which starts Joe Blanton) and at least force a one-game playoff for the wild card spot Thursday in St. Louis.
I write this knowing that if the Braves get into the playoffs, strange things have been known to happen in postseasons. And, seriously, it’s not like either potential divisional opponent, Milwaukee or Arizona, is some indestructible force.
Loading ...But as the Braves drag a four-game losing streak and 10-19 record over the past five weeks into the Phillies game, here’s the question: Who’s to blame for this collapse?
I’ve got my own feelings on this. But to be honest, I think I’m still in shock over the developments and, well, I’m still processing it all. A column will be forthcoming at some point. For now, I wanted to get your thoughts and post a poll on the topic.
I can’t list every player and team official. So I’ll just list a handful of candidates with a quick synopsis on each.
Here we go:
• Frank Wren: It’s his team. He built it. He made a solid move at the trade deadline for Michael Bourn, who has played well, but the Braves are only 26-26 with him in the lineup. So did Wren make the right move. Uggla looked like a good signing but results are mixed. There’s also the hangover over of the Derek Lowe and Kenshin Kawakami contracts, which has limited flexibility in moves.
• Fredi Gonzalez: He is the favorite whipping boy for a lot of folks. I’m not quite there yet. Gonzalez has made a ton of bold moves: taking Chipper Jones out of the No. 3 hole, benching Jason Heyward, changing lineups, shuffling batting orders. There’s only so much he can do. Starting Lowe on Tuesday obviously backfired in a major way. The flip side: You understand the concern of a manager starting his fourth rookie pitcher (Julio Teheran) in a pennant race. Then again, there’s this: It’s the manager’s job to get his team to play better. Obviously, that’s not happening right now.
• Larry Parrish: He is the new hitting coach. The Braves are not hitting. Many of you folks dumped on Terry Pendleton. So how do you feel about the job Parrish is doing?
• Derek Lowe: When Tommy Hanson and Jair Jurrjens went down with injuries, the Braves just needed Lowe to be halfway decent. Two more wins from Lowe and they’re not even in this position. But now he’s a mess.
• Dan Uggla: He’s back to his first-pitch, over-swinging, let-me-save-the-world-in-one-at-bat habits. Not good.
• Jason Heyward: He has been a major disappointment in year two, and the problems appear to go beyond him just having his swing messed up by injuries.
• Martin Prado: Personally, I think his season has hurt more than anything. Prado was Mr. Everything last season but this year has struggled, had some ailments and never got into rhythm.
• Brian McCann: He’s another guy who was counted on to be a major run producer. But clearly he is banged up. I debated even putting him on the list but he is this team’s potential cleanup hitter.
That’s it. You’ll notice I’m not listing Chipper Jones. If you want to discuss him below, that’s fine. But I’m not going to list him on the poll. I find it crazy that anybody would pin the team’s problems on him. He’s hitting .280 (No. 2 on the team) with 18 homers (No. 4) and 69 RBIs (No. 4). The man is 39 years old and being held together with duct tape. In terms of production, exactly what was it you expected?
OK, have at it. Who gets the most blame for what has been going on?
By Jeff Schultz
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699 comments Add your comment
bruce
September 28th, 2011
3:07 pm
hanson and JJ for getting injured same way last year we blamed prado and chipper for getting injured
Bluestreak
September 28th, 2011
3:07 pm
I blame Texas A&M, Gary Bettman and…
Sorry, had to join in the cavalcade of nonsense answers. Have to laugh to keep from crying.
You could blame everyone listed and more for the collapse. Who would have guessed that trading Prado instead of Infante (statistically) would have worked out better for us? Prado is a super-utility player forced to start. The team still needs a power hitting slugger to stick in left. Having one would have covered Uggla during his slump and would be helping now with McCann. Lowe is the million dollar house that now is worth $150,000. We couldn’t get rid of him and get any value out of him, short of an injury (and not wishing that on him). Hanson and JJ have been up and down this year, but them missing time has definitely hurt the team.
As for Gonzalez, he is culpable just as any manager is culpable for a failure by his team in the corporate world. Fair or not, it falls back on him ultimately. But to his credit, he didn’t keep putting people in slots on the lineup card because of their past (though he stuck with Uggla a lot longer than most would have). Bobby wouldn’t have moved Chipper down out of 3 for any reason.
This is payback for that stunt we pulled in 91 when we ran down and past the Dodgers. Thank yous to Boston for not making this the biggest collapse story right now.
gtne80
September 28th, 2011
3:07 pm
Could be long overdue payback from benefitting from the San Francisco collapse years ago.
I blame Ted Turner for becoming bored and selling the team to corporate money-grubbers.
I blame the architects for building a pitcher’s ballpark when the Braves have always thrived on the longball for offense. With a pitcher’s park, we needed to load up the lineup with speed and punch-and-judy hitters. That falls on Wren at the moment and Schuerholz before him.
With the current lineup being heavy on left-handed hitting, I blame Wren for not moving more quickly when it was obvious that Uggla was not going to live up to expectations. Once the deadline approached, the price for Beltran or Pence was too high and I’m glad he didn’t succumb to the pressure to empty the cupboard of young pitchers.
Virtually all of the hitters are undisciplined, overswinging and trying to pull everything (Uggla and Heyward being the chief offenders, but Prado and Freeman have fallen prey to it also). Is that the hitting coach or is it players that are unwilling or unable to adjust?
And I blame Bud Selig…don’t know why, but I just don’t like him.
Tom G
September 28th, 2011
3:07 pm
Detroit Brave – I will try to be civil in my dispute with you. So you think OBP is more significant than BA, HRS, RBI, SB, errors made, OF assists etc. Your corner OF guys have to be your power and productive guys(along with 3rd,1st base) in your line-up. Alot of us liked Constanza’s speed game, found it to be exciting and winning baseball! JasonH is just a likeable 21 yr old giant kid, maybe he finds himself but probably he doesn’t. The fact is he is not 1/2 the talent of Franceour and never will be. Frenchy is close, but not quite as productive as Pence(Phillies) or Stanton(Marlins) for a real example. JasonH should not even be mentioned with those players!
wayn-o
September 28th, 2011
3:09 pm
This team was winning up until the last month. That tells me it’s management not talent.
Pissed
September 28th, 2011
3:09 pm
Anyone remember that game against the Pirates where the Braves won on a VERY bad call at the plate in extra innings? Everyone at the time was saying stuff like “what if the Pirates miss the playoffs by 1 game?” (this was when they were in 1st place). Who knew that call would be the reason the Braves still stand a chance to make it in the playoffs and in a tie going to game 162???
WhereisConstanza
September 28th, 2011
3:10 pm
Tom G, I totally agree with you, and WHY that both the Phillies and Yankees were inquiring about trading for him prior to the Allstar Break.
Kmac
September 28th, 2011
3:11 pm
Bobo.
Bama Mike
September 28th, 2011
3:11 pm
Frank Wren. He built it. Brought in a manager with really no track record of success and here we are. Lowe and Kamakazi remind of his days in Baltimore. He didnt last long there.
WhereisConstanza
September 28th, 2011
3:12 pm
The Atlanta Journal Constitution is reporting that Kansas City Royals outfielder Jeff Francoeur might be heading to familiar territory in the NL East, albeit with a different team than the Atlanta Braves — the franchise that introduced Frenchy to the Major Leagues in the first place. With a major hole in their line-up against left-handed pitching, Francoeur could fit in well in the Phillies line-up.
There are other contenders to fill that slot, including San Diego Padres outfielder Ryan Ludwick. However, the Phillies already have a major budget and have been told to spend low, giving Francoeur a possible nod as a trade target. Francoeur is earning $2.5 million this season and has a team option for next season at $4 million. Francoeur has made overtures to stay in Kansas City, but the well-traveled outfielder is also aware of baseball’s business-first mentality, so he knows it’s a possibility.
On the year, Francoeur is hitting .322 against lefties and slugging at an incredible .655 rate. The Phillies have been disappointed by Dom Brown’s development in the outfield and Raul Ibanez has been hot and cold all season. While names like Ben Francisco can fill in from time to time, the reality is that the Phils lack an impact bat to help put them over the top. Frenchy could be that guy.
July 18, 2011
Hooter Girl
September 28th, 2011
3:14 pm
I find it very ironic that someone mandated that they stick with Heyward and Lowe to get them playoff ready, and therefore they fail to make the playoffs as a result.
Tucker
September 28th, 2011
3:14 pm
Freddie keeps saying all the Braves need is one broken bat single to get them going. Why doesn’t someone go up to the plate with a broken bat?
GO CARDS!!!
September 28th, 2011
3:16 pm
Pissed is right on. If they were running away with it, it’d be one thing…but if they back their way in again, they need to send that ump a nice fruit basket. I’m sure these Braves would be very good at picking one out at the Hallmark.
THE BRAVES ARE BUMS
20 out
September 28th, 2011
3:16 pm
This is just one of those posts to get us involved in whatever nonsense AJC has lined up. Obviously, you can’t pin the blame on one person. Blame is so second grade. Get over it. I think this team was never that good to begin with. If you really need to point the finger at someone, then it has to be Wren. He’s built this mess.
Remember those odd quotes from Chipper calling Lowe an “ace” when they signed Lowe to that god-awful contract? Yeah, that was real smart.
DetroitBraves
September 28th, 2011
3:17 pm
@Whereisconstanza, I don’t agree with your premise that more at-bats will necessarily lower rate stats. I do believe more at-bats will result in them seeking their true levels, a regression to the mean. For instance, Pujols may have a bad couple of weeks, or an extremely good couple of weeks, but over time he will be around .310/.400/600 because that’s who he is.
Francouer has 7 years worth of at-bats in the National League to find his level, and it wasn’t a good level, nor did anything in his minor league career suggest he could control the strikezone.
Heyward has always shown those particular skills with the exception of the period between mid-May and the end of August (he has bounced back in September). I’m not saying we know Heyward’s true level yet, or his ceiling necessarily, but there is a lot of data to suggest he is both now and going forward a superior player to Jeff Francouer.
Actually, the most disturbing part of Heyward at-bats is the lack of them. I have little concern about a healthy Heyward producing, but much concern about Heyward staying healthy.
Big Wally
September 28th, 2011
3:18 pm
Keys to success. Keep Gonzalez and just do the opposite of what he says. If he says start Lowe……..then you start someone else. If he benches a player, then you start that player. If he wants to bat Prado second, you bat him seventh, etc., etc.,
Tomahawk Broke
September 28th, 2011
3:18 pm
There are numerous reasons for the collapse. However, it’s the manager’s job to get his team back on the winning track.
Fredi seems to think the long ball is the answer to breaking out of slumps. How many times could he have hit and run or called for a squeeze(safety or straight up) to try to ignite some scoring? The team can get men into scoring position, it just can not plate them. Just attempting them, successful or not, will make the defense change their positioning. That would create more holes in the infield, where some balls might find eyes.
That’s managing, knowing to “create” runs.
Eric in NC
September 28th, 2011
3:19 pm
For the month of Sep.
Avg./OBP./Slug/OPS
McCann- .200/.326/.313/.639
Prado- .240/.262/.337/.598
Freeman- .227/.303/.364/.667
Bourn- .257/.299/.358/.657
I blame these guys. For those who want to blame Chipper- .294/.354/.518/.872. Nice numbers so forget it.
WhereisConstanza
September 28th, 2011
3:19 pm
20 out, Hate to tell you but Lowe was 15-10 and 16-12 his first two years here in 2009 and 2010. This year SUCKS
NO MORE PARRISH
September 28th, 2011
3:19 pm
There are two people to blame for position we are in. Frank Wren and Fredi Gonzalez!!
They both stuck with Parrish when all signs pointed to his offense plan was not working with Braves lineup. Rangers made a move early before it was too late so why did we stick by Parrish? I called it back in June saying our starters could not carry this team in September and we should make a move to fix this offense. They did not and here we are. I actually don’t blame Parrish. He is clueless and this is all new to him. It’s Frank and Freds fault for keeping him around so long.
With that said Parrish better not be brought back next year or this team is not serious about winning.
Tom G
September 28th, 2011
3:20 pm
Braves if they have any, should get Frenchy back in the off-season. A new start for Braves and Jeff. He might consider it(his parents still live here and he loves Parkview HS football)? A Gwinnett County Fan!!
BikerDudeBravesFan
September 28th, 2011
3:20 pm
You dumb-asses who voted for Fredi Gonzalez should be shot.. This is nowhere near his fault and he is not the one that should be blamed. Larry Parrish is the obvious one that should be blamed. Anytime an offense is struggling as a whole, it’s the hitting coach and also base-running errors. I’m just tired of liberty media holding back on spending.. Do you know what we could have done with an extra 60m in salary. Derek Lowe is a waste of space. I knew that last year even when he had that lucky September.. If this Braves team does make the playoffs, is it even possible to get to the 2nd round? Let’s go Braves.. get off your dumps and lets blow the Phils away.. no excuse.. Joe Blanton.. REALLY??
Fols
September 28th, 2011
3:21 pm
Can a collapse of this height really fall on one man’s shoulder? There are multiple pieces in place and i don’t believe it’s Frank Wren.
We asked for a right handed bat and he provided us Uggla. We needed speed and had a hole in CF, he provided us Bourn. I doubt anyone could have predicted Uggla’s struggles as a Brave and Bourn was pretty solid up until the entire team collapse.
Up and down the line-up, guys just aren’t getting it done. I put this on the players. They have failed, they are now getting all that wonderful publicity for doing so…and if they want to save complete embarassment they’ll wake up tonight.
Other than that, the blanket and lack of adjustment to succeed would fall on the coach. But that’s what happens when you hand pick your guy instead of going out there and picking the best option. Where they afraid to pick up a true known coach that might flip the clubhouse upside down?
Wren Should Bite The Weenie
September 28th, 2011
3:21 pm
Wren has got to be the dude. Technically, he hires Fredi, but that might be a little bit of a stretch. He gets Bourn, who hasn’t been the cure all. Constanza gets hurt then struggles for a couple of games when he comes back, and then he’s back on the bench and Heyward is back in the lineup without getting one ounce better! Fredi had raved about Constanza and then he stumps his toe and the struggling Heyward is back in. Now Heyward has improved a small bit, but the Braves were actually winning games with Georgie in the lineup, not so much with Heyward. I gotta believe Wren pushed that move by Fredi. Like I said, Fredi raved about Georgie.
This is Wren’s team. He put it together. He said he had enough. He made his choices and now he must take the rap. Sure the players haven’t performed but Wren signed, acquired or extended many of the players who haven’t performed!
Some will say he did a great job like trading Renteria to Detroit in a deal that brought JJ to Atlanta. Last time I checked JJ has an injury history and hasn’t been around for the end the last two seasons. Sure he shows flashes of greatness, but he and the other Boros client (Hanson) are unable to perform due to injuries that aren’t threatening structural damage to their arms and/or other members. Good ole’ Boros! I’m sure he’s urging his clients to take it easy so they don’t hurt their market value!
That’s ok Tommy and JJ! Part of the reason we’re having this conversation about who should take the fall is because you guys took a dive! Hope both of these guys are on a plane out of ATL sooner rather than later.
So did Wren have anything to do with hiring a guy who had never been a hitting instructor to help these guys with the bats?
Fredi may be the captain of the ship, but Wren is the admiral of the fleet. His fleet is sinking and he needs to be buried at sea with his fleet.
RW Gweed
September 28th, 2011
3:22 pm
Can Hudson pitch tonight and tomorrow night?
Bobby Cox
September 28th, 2011
3:22 pm
Whats the lineup for the Phillies tonight?
SR
September 28th, 2011
3:22 pm
” I write this knowing that there’s still a very good chance the Braves (with Tim Hudson on the mound) will win tonight’s game against Philadelphia (which starts Joe Blanton) and at least force a one-game playoff for the wild card spot Thursday in St. Louis”.
Did you really write that and worse still, do you really believe it?? A very good chance that the Braves win tonight’s game?? This moribund collection of losers?? I’ll take some of that action. Take the Phillies. Braves would find a way to lose tonight if they had Sandy Koufax throwing.
DetroitBraves
September 28th, 2011
3:22 pm
@Tom G, you are definitely baiting. There isn’t a scout, baseball exec, baseball writer, or sabermetrician alive that believes any of that. You have jumped the shark my friend and I will not be taking the bait (I shudder to think that you may be sincere).
Fols
September 28th, 2011
3:23 pm
Biker dude…….you over state the importance of a batting coach.
The players struggling don’t need coaching….they need to perform.
M10
September 28th, 2011
3:23 pm
I cant see why people are blaming a 2 year player Heyward for this its absurd.Heyward was just fine until pp on this team complained he needs to swing the bat more and calling him out for not playing through the injury.(Chipper and sm of you idiotic fans).It’s crazy for him to call out anyone when it comes to not playing.Also F.Gonzalez needs to be fired, they need someone like Ozzie to tell it like it is but to late.D.Lowe needs to go way overpaid.And if they don’t sign a prominant big bat I won’t spend a d*** dime on them next year.
Bobby C.
September 28th, 2011
3:24 pm
I am blaming Fredi, unless something is wrong with the guy who really gave us a spark earlier in the year. Where is Jose Constanza? If Constanza is still healthy why in the hell would Jason Heyward even see the field? For that matter Matt Diaz either.
Buck Nasty
September 28th, 2011
3:25 pm
Who’s to blame? Two words Braves fans…The Phillies (a/k/a the best team in baseball)…the Braves should petition MLB to move back to the NL West…the Braves just can’t hang with the big boys…So take your tomahawk chop and…well, you know…And if that punk Hudson hits any of our players tonight…the Braves are going to get beat in more ways than one…
smallmouth6
September 28th, 2011
3:26 pm
Either the coach for messing with the team’s mojo when they were rolling with Constanza, or Frank Wren if he made the call that changed the team’s direction. I do think Wren did a very good job putting together a team that should play well borrowing injuries and players meeting expectations based on their histories. I hope he isn’t interfering with field work.
Believer
September 28th, 2011
3:26 pm
At least when TP was hitting coach the Braves were getting on-base and hitting w/RISP, I think Larry Parish has screwed up a lot of hitter’s approaches (J-Hey and Prado). And the team OBP this season is awful.
DetroitBraves
September 28th, 2011
3:28 pm
@M10, I would love Ozzie Guillen here. The change in attitude would be refreshing and I’ve often read that he’s great at handling a pitching staff, which I believe is one of Fredi’s faults. Plus he would be worth it just for the interviews.
BartBuzz
September 28th, 2011
3:28 pm
You can’t blame just one person. It’s a myriad of things. Hanson and JJ going down was a start. The Braves as a team not hitting with RISP doesn’t help when the pitching was holding runs to 4 or less. Heyward having a sophomoric slump. Given all those reasons it also comes down to the manager putting the right combination of players on the field. But the bottom line is the Braves had so many chances to win key games these last 3 weeks and simply choked. That 2-run homer Kimbrel gave up to Florida was the telling blow. He looked in shock as he walked off the field.
smallmouth6
September 28th, 2011
3:28 pm
GTN80: Good point on Selig. All bad things in baseball are his fault.
Tom G
September 28th, 2011
3:29 pm
DetroitBrave – He has had almost 400AB’s this season. How can a 21 yr old player have constant nagging pains or injuries. He is at the peak of his healthly life. I can understand a 40 yr old 3rd base breaking down not some 21 yr old guy? Back to Franceour(since you seem to like to talk about him), didn’t he play in 162 games his 2nd and 3rd seasons with the Braves? Oh, 162 is the amount of every game in a season!!
Will
September 28th, 2011
3:29 pm
I vote for Liberty Media. This team needs to be locally owned and operated. Ted Turner is a nut job but he was our nut job. Let’s ask him to buy our team back.
Ky Bravos' Fan
September 28th, 2011
3:30 pm
I am in total agreement with CT Falcons and Braves’ Fan. The injuries to Hanson and Jurrjens were crippling. I am just hoping that young pitchers(AAA) aren’t overused to get thru the postseason–if we get there. They are our future. I feel that D. Lowe still has a lot left. He’s 38, but has never had arm issues. Joe Simpson constantly talks about his lack of run support. This is true. After a while, a pitcher tries to be too fine. Even a veteran. Here’s hoping for the best for ALL the Braves!
Mello
September 28th, 2011
3:30 pm
What we need is pay by production. Every major leaguer that is a hitter should know how to hit. Too seldom these days do we see a .300 BA within a season. Another example of overpaid athletes who are too confortable financially and has loss that deep down desire to be a great baseball player.
gfc
September 28th, 2011
3:31 pm
Jeff left out the true reason for the collapse – us. The fans. Even when the team was riding high and doing well, how often was the stadium sold out? Even remotely full? How often was the energy from us palpable – either in the stadium or the city in general? No, instead the majority of you sit in front of your computer, ranting and raving like you have some clue how to manage or run a major league team.
Wren? Within the parameters he has to work with, he’s done the best he can. It’s real easy for you to say “he should’ve traded Kawakami!” or “he should have traded Lowe!” You know what? To make those trades requires a willing partner – and everyone in baseball knew exactly what position he was in and wanted to milk it for everything. Not many GM’s would willingly sit two $8m players in the minors.
F Gonzalez? It’s his first year. He’s taken a team to the brink of the playoffs. He’s having to manage around both poor performance and injuries. Like someone said, look back at the beginning of the season and say “you’ll have these obstacles” – would you still expect a playoff contender?
Chipper? At various times THIS YEAR he carried the team. It’s as simple as that. Yes, he’s slumped here and there – EVERYONE has. “Lost a grounder in the lights!” Really? A grounder? It chopped darn near as high as a shallow pop-up – RIGHT INTO THE LIGHTS!!!
Uggla? Yeah, HUGE slump beginning of the year but his power numbers were still there. And his defense? Darn near unbelievable – FAR more than any of us expected. And slump or not – EVERY SINGLE PLAY he played balls to the wall.
A Gonzalez? Yeah, another who got into a slump. And definitely had a lacksadaisacal attitude at times. His defense, though, saved MANY MANY runs.
McCann? Really? Guy is coming off the DL and, also, carried the team at times.
Prado? Life threatening infection . . . surgery to remove it (and a chunk of muscle . . . if I recall, he was starting to get on track right before that.
Heyward? Season long slump, for sure, that definitely didn’t help the cause at all. Not real sure, though, that I’d call it quits on him quite yet.
Lowe? Definitely hasn’t helped much lately, either.
As for the countless secondary arguments – why isn’t Costanza still playing? ‘Cause he’s been hitting worse than Heyward maybe? Overused bullpen? Yeah, an argument can be made for that. An argument can also be made that when Proctor or Linebrick aren’t cutting it, you HAVE to run out a proven pitcher.
I’m just as disappointed as anyone else at how the season is ending. But it’s not the end of the world. By and large this is a GOOD team, one that can definitely take it all when all cylinders are running. The problem, though, is that for far too long they haven’t been running at the same time. And that’s not a manager issue, it’s not a coach issue, it’s not really even a player issue. It’s simply fate or life or luck. We lose tonight and/or tomorrow and don’t make it, so be it. We look forward to next year and some great potential:
A true leadoff hitter
Some true studs pitching
A full season of Uggla hitting like he did this summer (and fielding like he has all year)
Heyward and Prado finding their swings
OVentrel rested
Several million freed by Kawakami and McLouth
Changes I’d make during the offseason?
Use some of the money saved by Kawakami and McLouth to sign Bourne long term
Use some of the money to bring in a corner outfielder
Dump Parish and have Chipper be a player/manager
Dump AGonzalez and use Wilson until Tyler is ready
Seriously consider moving Lowe to the bullpen
Rotate Medlen and Minor between bullpen and starting until one settles into the role
Not sure what else yet . . .
NO MORE PARRISH
September 28th, 2011
3:31 pm
Tom G – Not happening. Frenchy signed a contract extension with KC and is happy playing with no pressure of winning.
Lamar
September 28th, 2011
3:32 pm
You have to blame Derek Lowe. He has been awful and should be released tomorrow. You have to blame Larry Parish as well because of the hitting being non-existent. Plus Dan Uggla and Jason Heyward have not been what you expected them to be. Next you need to blame Roger McDowell or the training staff for the pitchers not going deep into ballgames and wearing out the bullpen. If we lose by one game then everyone gets a finger pointed at them. Chipper for losing a ball in the light, Johnny Venters for blowing a lead, Kimbrel for his June struggles and on and on.
ChillyMutt
September 28th, 2011
3:32 pm
“That’s it. You’ll notice I’m not listing Chipper Jones … The man is 39 years old and being held together with duct tape. In terms of production, exactly what was it you expected?”
I think that is just it. He is being held together with duct tape – he’s spent significant time on the DL and/or so injured that he was a shell of himself. by not retiring, he ties up $15,000,000 and forces us to basically platoon at 3rd. He is unwilling to bat #2 for any extended period – a nice fit for him and where the Braves Team needs him.
With that said, I would not vote for him. I voted for Frediot and not for the reasons you stated but for a season long list of head scratching decisions. He very well be the worse game manager I have ever seen and that includes my high school and college playing days.
NO MORE PARRISH
September 28th, 2011
3:32 pm
gfc – The fans? Really? Tampa has the worst attendance in MLB and is that stopping them? Come on dude! Gotta come better than blaming the fans.
WhereisConstanza
September 28th, 2011
3:34 pm
Detroit, My point exactly. I really feel Heyward didn’t want to play at one point this year, even with Chipper commenting that at times you play when you don’t feel like it. I believe Heyward is scared of striking out, not getting a hit, etc.. and being the way JF was treated after 4 years. Regardless I do NOT believe Heyward will ever get close to the productive player JF is. Franceour’s stirke out for this yearly average 111 per year while his is getting an average of 605 ab’s per year. Heyward averages in 2 years are 110 so’s while only getting 457 ab’s. This is where RBI’s come into play, Franceour has averaged in 6 full seasons (I am not even counting his call up year of 2005 in any of these stats) 85 rbi’s per year.
By comparison everyone dogs JF but praises Brian McCann. They were called up and have played the same period of time and by comparison:
Franceour Career .270 121 hr 552 rbi’s .313 obp
McCann Career .286 136 hr 537 rbi’s .352 obp
And God knows I didn’t mean to get into all of this, but looking back Franceour wasn’t bad. As a matter of fact he was and is pretty good and is an RBI machine along with one of the best right fielders in the MLB.
M10
September 28th, 2011
3:34 pm
DetroitBraves
I coud’nt agree more.
DetroitBraves
September 28th, 2011
3:35 pm
@Tom G, I’ll grant you concerns about Heyward’s health, particularly at a young age. There is definite value in, you know, actually playing. Francoeur’s durability is not in question. He gives you plenty of at-bats. Unfortunately for whatever team is foolish enough to extend him (cough* KC *cough) they aren’t likely to be quality at-bats. But no, I don’t particularly enjoy talking about players that so often trudge along below replacement level so I think I’ll stop.
St. Louis Dick
September 28th, 2011
3:35 pm
Just a quick hello to Atlanta…it looks like it might be a little hot down there today…steamy perhaps. St. Louis is enjoying some really nice cool temps, sun shining brightly and a light wind that seems to be lifting everyone’s spirits. We try not to count on the weather…as we’ve learned that can be fruitless and emotionally draining. We’ve also learned not to blame each other for the weather…heck even the weatherman is just doing his best. Sometimes the right play is to just quiet down a bit, realize that ‘it is what it is’ and play the game.