Did Falcons just take lead over Braves in title pursuit? (Update: Phillies get Pence)
Mike Smith and Thomas Dimitroff just moved closer to a title.
(UPDATED: 9:15 p.m. with news of Philadelphia trading for Houston outfielder Hunter Pence.)
Falcons general manager Thomas Dimitroff just worked his magic to sign defensive end Ray Edwards.
Frank Wren: You’re on the clock.
This is an important time for both the Falcons and Braves. The NFL is in free agency and major league baseball is bumping up against the trade deadline. This is when championship contenders often
Can Frank Wren get help for Fredi Gonzalez and Braves?
are determined.
The Falcons believed they needed to add at least one significant player on defense to compete for a Super Bowl. Edwards should provide that. He gives them a pass rusher from the left side as a complement to John Abraham.
The Braves need to add some offensive power, preferably a right-handed hitting outfielder who can drive in runs. Wren has had talks for several different players, but he hasn’t pushed the button on a deal yet. He balked at letting go of a valued pitching prospect (Mike Minor) for a rental player (Carlos Beltran).
The question now: Are the Braves willing to do what it would take to land a high-profile player like Houston’s Hunter Pence or the Chicago White Sox’ Carlos Quentin, or do they settle for somebody the next tier down (Ryan Ludwick or Josh Willingham) and hope the rest of the roster gets healthy enough for the stretch drive?
UPDATE: The Braves apparently pushed for Pence but Philadelphia pushed harder and acquired the outfielder from the Astros, according to multiple outlets. Fox Sports baseball reporter Ken Rosenthal first reported Houston will get four prospects in the deal, including two highly coveted ones: first baseman Jonathan Singleton and pitcher Jarred Cosart. So the Braves have now seen their biggest competition in the National League, the Phillies and Giants, both make major moves.
Dimitroff has worked this condensed free agency period brilliantly. Now it’s Wren’s turn.
For what it’s worth, in March I ranked Atlanta’s then-four pro sports general managers, and Dimitroff edged Wren for the top spot. We’ll re-evaluate after the Braves and Falcons complete their seasons.
There is still time before Sunday’s trade deadline for the Braves to make a move. San Francisco, coming off a World Series, already made its move by trading for Beltran. Philadelphia is pursuing several players and some believe may have the inside track on Pence.
We’ll find out soon enough how serious the Braves are about winning a World Series this year.
By Jeff Schultz
♦
Earlier: As Braves talk trade, Ross says ‘We need a piece’
Earlier: Braves would be taking a risk without major move
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231 comments Add your comment
Tomahawk
July 29th, 2011
3:48 pm
Sorry, but you need a CFer if you want to play with the big boys in October, and Bourn’s the only real difference-maker available.
GTT
July 29th, 2011
3:48 pm
He gives them a pass rusher from the left side to compliment John Abraham.
Complement.
Ridonkulous
July 29th, 2011
3:49 pm
Let’s cool the Ludwick talk. Ryan Ludwick is Jeff Francouer just six years older. Maddeningly inconsistent hitter. Compare their numbers for this year and Jeff has a better OPS, about the same HR & RBI. Again, Francouer is 28, Ludwick is 34.
DetroitBraves
July 29th, 2011
3:50 pm
Rob, I do get your point but I would take the chance myself. I realize there is some risk but the Braves have enough pitching depth I would take that chance. Otherwise, seems like they’ll just perpetually be a few runs short. We’ll see what Wren does. But I’m not saying you’re wrong. I would just go a different way.
Real American
July 29th, 2011
3:51 pm
don’t care too much for tat, but I do like………………
Falcons4Eva
July 29th, 2011
4:04 pm
Wide Receiver depth is a concern. Hopefully Falcons can bring Michael Jenkins back at less than his “outgoing” salary. It doesn’t take long to figure out a guys is a sure fire bust in the making. I for one knew Jamaal Anderson was a bust after season 2. Same will be for Piera Jerry and Harry Douglas. These WR on our rosters besides Roddy White and Julio Jones) are a bunch or nobody’s.
Tomahawk
July 29th, 2011
4:04 pm
I’d go all in and acquire Bourn and Quentin. Do whatever possible to keep the Big Arms, even it means unloading the great, but not “elite” prospects. All of them if necessary. Yes, all of them. I understand the “Texeira Syndrome” that’s spread through Braves Nation, but how often do you realistically have this great of a shot at a World Series? Even IF half our prospects pan out, there’s no guarantee that we’ll have a pitching staff this ideal, or a farm this stocked and ready to provide the big league club with a championship, because at the end of the day that’s why you have a farm: to provide the big league club. We have absolutely no idea who’s going to be healthy or what this team will look like in a couple years.
Get Bourn. Get Quentin. Neither are rentals, and they would absolutely make this team a wrecking ball-sized hunk of C4. Oh, and don’t ask “but where will they play” because it’s really painfully obvious. Anyone with a brain would already know the answer to that question. Send Schafer to AAA when he gets healthy. Let Mclouth play left whenever Prado has to play third, and when Prado has to play left you bench Mclouth (or swap Mclouth and Schafer, doesn’t matter to me who our 4th OFer is). These are easy decisions, people. You play the guys that deserve it. When that happens, you win. I’m tired of the Braves just settling for “getting close” every yr.
I don’t want to just see my team compete, I want to see them STEAMROLL everything in their path. It’s time for this franchise to dominate again and they are very, very close to doing exactly that.
bvillebaron
July 29th, 2011
4:05 pm
Thadsdad:
I think you post is somewhat erroneous. It implies that the Braves could acquire Pence solely for Minor which by all accounts is simply not accurate. The Astros want several (at least two as I heard it) prime pitching prospects for Pence, not just one. Wren may be balking at including Minor as part of any package, but do you honestly think that Pence wouldn’t be playing in Atlanta tonight if the Braves could acquire him only for Minor? C’mon man.
FWI there are a number of guys who make a living covering minor league prospects who value Minor very highly, such as Keith Law at ESPN (former Blue Jays employee) who said he would not trade Minor straight up for Beltran (something I agree with).
For all of you who are clamoring that Wren needs “to do” something, please condider the following:
(1) The Phils are an aging team whose window to win a World Series is getting shorter whereas the Braves are a young team built predominantly on HOME GROWN TALENT AND PROSPECTS whose best days are in the future (particularly if they don’t panic and make another Texeira mistake);
(2) Pence, Quentin and Ludwick are all corner OFs when everyone knows the Braves primarly need a CF; and
(3) The acquisition of any of these guys doesn’t guarantee the Braves win the World Series (none of them are as good as Texeira and I think Jim Bowden is right: it would help if the Braves could get a bat, but as presently constituted, they will win th wild card and once in the playoffs, they have a chance to win because of their pitching).
Tomahawk
July 29th, 2011
4:07 pm
Meant to say: Quentin plays left whenever Prado plays third. If Chipper’s in there, play match-ups with Heyward/Quentin in Right. Sorry. Got a little excited.
FSUFalcon
July 29th, 2011
4:18 pm
The Falcons have passionate and serious ownership..the braves do not…
Ted M
July 29th, 2011
4:27 pm
Did the Falcon’s let Snelling go like a poster said earlier? I would care if they did.
Ludwick no thanks he’s another McLouth. Get HP or CQ or stand pat.
BR
July 29th, 2011
4:41 pm
Falcons have what the Braves need; local ownership dedicated to winning.
jbdrs
July 29th, 2011
4:42 pm
Good article Jeff. Is there any chance Liberty Media will sell the Braves anytime soon?
Brendan
July 29th, 2011
4:49 pm
I think the Braves must do what Jeff Schultz advocated a few weeks back, namely, use Derek Lowe as a bargaining chip for what the Braves need. That’s the move that makes the most sense to me.
JK
July 29th, 2011
4:59 pm
With all of this talk about needing a bat may I mention that there are 8, yes eight, players on our current roster that will end up hitting 15 or more homeruns this year. We just need to get healthier. Sure, an outfielder with pop would be great but we will be fine if we do not make any changes at the deadline.
Falcons4Eva
July 29th, 2011
5:06 pm
Its becoming more and more apparent that the Phillies (if they get Pence or Quentin) is becoming the Yankees of the National League. They don’t care about giving up their #1 and #2 prospects (as reported on ESPN) in order to get Pence / Quintin to win NOW.
They will simply BUY their next “proven” super star each and every year to keep a championship caliber team on the field. The fact of the matter is, the Phillies, just like the Yankees and the Red Sox can afford anybody they want. They sell out every game and money is not the issue for them as oppose the the Braves.
That’s the difference between Us (the Braves) and the Phillies, Yankees and Sox. I say Give up what ever it takes (except Tehran) to get us a proven bat. Period. The Braves will be sold in 2 years anyway. Hopefully, we can get back to the days when money wasn’t the issue here, and we had more Superstars & Sellout at the TED. Seems to work out for Philly and Yankees.
ChopChamps95
July 29th, 2011
5:10 pm
The last time the Braves ownership cared about winning was the last season Ted Turner still owned the ball club (and thats a debatable point at best depending on who you talk to). Liberty Media isn’t committed to winning and it shows by the payroll, therefore Frank Wren goes the cheap route everytime it matters in response to picking up a player (just like he will at the trade deadline this year).
Arthur Blank on the other hand does care about the team if its a winning one. He opens up his wallet to get good players and Dimitroff goes out and gets the best available. As long as Liberty owns the Braves and Blank owns the Falcons, the advantage will go to Blank and the Falcs every time.
Stinger2
July 29th, 2011
5:18 pm
schultz: I admit as a fan, I don`t know anything about the Braves or Falcons unless I get it from some form of the media. Opinions? Yes I like everyone else can have one. Problem is most fans opinions are worse than yours.
The point I want to make from the above is: You and every other media person need to ask yourself before you release an article or make a verbal statement: Why am I writing this? Does it help the fans understand more about the player(s) or team in question. To the best of my knowledge is what I am writing the truth and not
‘posion pen” because I don`t like someone? I am not saying you personally are guilty of misrepresenting anything or even unethical reporting. The problem I have is that in this case, you are encouraging Braves management to do something (trade a player or players)that you, nor I, or any fan has a clue if its the right thing to do. Let management make their own decisions. Then you can report the facts.
Delbert D.
July 29th, 2011
5:18 pm
Ludwick or Willingham would be “ok” pickups if it doesn’t take much to get one (or both) of them. They have nearly identical 162-game projection career averages of 25 HR and .262 and .263 BA. Problem is, Ludwick has top seasons of 152, 139 and 136 games (but 99 so far this year), and Willingham has top seasons of 144, 142 and 133 (with 80 so far this year).
rally
July 29th, 2011
5:28 pm
Apple’s to Orange’s Jeff. Football vs Baseball…..Alot of different variables and factors. In football one man doesn’t make a team….in baseball one man can make a team in either pitching or hitting. Just my two cents.
david
July 29th, 2011
5:33 pm
I think our priority is to win the AAA title. Go Gwinnett!!!!
Mike R.
July 29th, 2011
6:20 pm
Did the Braves have the lead over the Falcons prior to this deal?
I considered the Falcons more legitimate contenders for the Super Bowl last year than I do the Braves currently for the World Series.
extremus
July 29th, 2011
6:22 pm
The Edwards signing is HUGE for the Falcons and immediately makes them an even more serious contender to win the Superbowl this season. A DE was a glaring need for a pass rush that had been repeatedly exploited all of last season at key moments, most notably when it was picked apart methodically by Aaron Rodgers in the playoffs.
The Braves could make a similar splash by getting a significant new offensive piece, and for what it’s worth going by the numbers I like Quentin as a possibility more than Pence, though either one could provide a boost. Until that happens and the Braves’ offense shows a consistent pulse, my money would have to be on the Falcons having the first parade down Peachtree.
Bill
July 29th, 2011
6:31 pm
No! The Braves are not close. When the going gets tough they fade.
DetroitBraves
July 29th, 2011
6:38 pm
@bvillebaron, I saw that Law wouldn’t have traded Minor for Beltran in his chat a couple of days ago. I think that says something about Minor, and a lot about having no club control beyond this year for Beltran, no Type A compensation when he walks, Beltran’s ability to play center, and the limited probability that he will make a meaningful difference over so few games. That’s just my guess.
That’s not to say Minor isn’t a prospect. He’s just not at the same level as some of their other guys.
Which brings me to the next point, which is that Minor for Pence is kind of a no brainer. I would be absolutely shocked if Keith Law didn’t agree.
But you are almost certainly correct – there is no way the Astros are looking at just Minor. They want some package that probably includes Teheran, Vizcaino or Delgado too. If Minor were enough by himself they would have taken the Cosart/Singleton deal (if such a deal was actually ever offered). So the people clamoring for Wren to pull the trigger on dealing Minor really need to ask themselves how they feel about trading Minor AND Delgado.
Hillbilly D
July 29th, 2011
6:40 pm
My guess is that it’ll take 3 to 4 players to get Pence.
DetroitBraves
July 29th, 2011
6:45 pm
@Hillbilly D, you’re probably right. And then it starts to look more like the Teixeira deal and the Braves have already been burned once recently in a deal like that (which isn’t necessarily in and of itself to not try again) and Pence isn’t as good as Teixeira (which is a very good reason not to try it again).
If Minor is without question the best player in the deal going to Houston then let’s get Pence. If he’s not, Wren’s got to think seriously about cheaper options.
lobo
July 29th, 2011
7:10 pm
Latest rumor:
Pence going to Phillis
Bourn going to Reds
BJ Upton and Ludwick to Braves
From MLB
Najeh Davenpoop
July 29th, 2011
7:13 pm
Nnamdi Asomugha is an Eagle. The Braves are still closer than the Falcons.
Omar
July 29th, 2011
7:26 pm
It most be nice to be a Philadelphia fan right now. As a Brave and Falcon fan I have to admit they play for championships up there.
NickGranite
July 29th, 2011
7:34 pm
We haven’t “sniffed a WS in years”? The major leagues is the most difficult of all major sports to make the playoffs with only 2 slots open to you as an individual team…either division winner or wild card. The other 2 slots in your league are the other division winners. if you make the tournament as we did LAST YEAR, you are sniffing the series.
M10
July 29th, 2011
7:39 pm
First the Braves are no where close there ownership is pathetic so thats going to hold them back.It starts up top.
TNScott
July 29th, 2011
7:50 pm
Sergeant Schultz, you and Milton Bradley need to remember one very important fact when it comes to Frank Wren competing Thomas Dimitroff. Arthur Blank ain’t Liberty Media. It wouldn’t surprise me one bit if we sat out the trade deadline because LM is more concerned about the shareholders and their bottom line especially in the economic climate this country is facing. It’s always been that way from Time Warner to Liberty Media. They talk a good game but that’s all it is.
TNScott
July 29th, 2011
7:55 pm
Omar- Even more so in baseball. Bottom line is bottom line for the Braves owners.
dawg4u
July 29th, 2011
8:00 pm
It is a fact that our starting pitchers are wearing down as the season goes on. They were giving up 2-3 runs average and now 3-4 runs. It is just a fact of life that the season wears down these pitchers and their arms into giving up more runs later in the season. I still hope that Frank Wren isn’t pinning our hopes for the post season into getting our injured regulars back and producing. I know people say that one bat won’t correct our deficiencies. I get that but one bat and a good bat will send a message to the players and fans that we are serious about getting to the playoffs and beyond. Anyone who watches this team knows that we desparately need a bat in this lineup. Go get it FW before the deadline!
1eyedJack
July 29th, 2011
8:32 pm
The Braves need a new owner, with deep pockets and a singular purpose in mind.
Delbert D.
July 29th, 2011
8:44 pm
Jack – The Braves don’t really have an owner, they have an “entity.”
For Real
July 29th, 2011
9:02 pm
We really don’t need a trade…. We just need these guys to play better. Bottom line. A solid banger in center would be nice but all that thinking would change if these guys would turn it on. Most are playing just avg baseball. Don’t trade the future for some guy to come in here and slum it up like that 1st baseman we got from the Cubs a few years ago…..
Bill
July 29th, 2011
9:19 pm
MLB-TV just said Pence to Phillies all details after the game between Phillis and Pirates….Whats Braves next move?
Hillbilly D
July 29th, 2011
9:30 pm
I just heard a report during the Cubs broadcast that Hunter Pence has been pulled from the game.
Bill
July 29th, 2011
9:35 pm
Done deal Pence to the rich Phillies…..
Matt "CHOKE" Ryan
July 29th, 2011
9:36 pm
2011 MVP………..Mike Vick
2011 Superbowl MVP……………Mike Vick
2011 Superbowl Champs…………….. Eagles
Why is it that the Eagles put weapons around Mike Vick?
Because they are football smart
Julio Jones is a BIG waste of money, especially when they play the Eagles. Roddy and Julio are going to be on lockdown, and we all know how CHOKE loves to float those butterflies 10 yards deep
Time
July 29th, 2011
9:36 pm
Pence to Phils is good. Now the market for Upton empties back out, the price goes down, and the Braves will pounce for the guy they really needed anyways.
milller
July 29th, 2011
9:40 pm
It’s easier for Thomas to make a deal with the backing of Blank.
Wren has no backing, no MONEY. Get real people. This is not the Ted Turner Braves.
Matt
July 29th, 2011
9:47 pm
I am so tired of the Braves attitude that they’re going to get a pennant for the best AAA pitching staff. Who gives a damn about that when the big league club doesn’t have the sack to go for it when they have a team that is close.
Hunter Pence
July 29th, 2011
9:58 pm
I am so excited to be going to the 2011 World Series champs. I heard I might be traded to Atlanta, but I would have retired before I accepted that deal.
See you soon.
unbelievable
July 29th, 2011
10:04 pm
Awww, its ok guys! I told you people a few days ago to cool out on Pence, because he’s not coming here. But its alllllllright, cause we’ve still got Mike “Wainwright” Minor on our team and the future is SOOOO bright! Good thing we didn’t give him away for that broken down rbi machine Beltran, who’d be gone at the end of the year, which is actually ideal because the winter market will have many more good players available! Now lets go get McLudwick and call it a year! Yall are brilliant.
unbelievable
July 29th, 2011
10:05 pm
Enter your comments here
Bill
July 29th, 2011
10:09 pm
Contaza had his first hit, rbi, and run scored after waiting 7 years to get to majors.. Congrad u earned it.
Sambo McPoots
July 29th, 2011
10:11 pm
Wren you suck, way too cheap, Falcons are now Atlanta team, if you don’t do something there may not be 5,000 in the seats by seasons end