Bettman wants to make Thrashers’ sale hurt for Spirit
Hockey fans in Winnipeg aren't waiting for the official announcement: They were already celebrating the Thrashers' expected arrival on Thursday night. (AP photo)
Somebody who I trust — because he has been telling me that the Thrashers probably are going to wind up moving to Winnipeg for almost two years now — offered something else recently.
While it’s almost certainly too late to stop the train to Manitoba, Gary Bettman’s disdain for Bruce Levenson and the Atlanta Spirit is so great that wants to make it hurt financially for the Spirit.
I know. The last thing you really want to do right now is choose sides between Bettman and Levenson. Can they run into each other head first?
But if you’re looking for one microscopic scintilla of a possibility that the Thrashers’ move gets momentarily derailed, here it is: Bettman may be playing hardball. He not only wants the $60 million relocation fee that the NHL is mandating from True North Sports and Entertainment, he may want a share of the $110 million reportedly going to the Spirit for the purchase price.
Again, the possibility of this financial tug-of-wear stopping the Thrashers’ move to Winnipeg remains a long shot. (The Globe and Mail has reported it’s a done deal, although all parties are denying it.) But it’s worth noting that all franchise purchases — and certainly relocations — must be approved by NHL’s Board of Governors.
In short, Bettman has the hammer here.
Ken Campbell of The Hockey News has posted a blog outlining the exact thing I just addressed. But he takes it one step further, writing that not only is Bettman seeking a share of the Spirit’s possible $110 million, but Levenson is countering by seeking a share of the NHL’s would-be $60 million.
From Campbell’s blog:
What still has to be determined, according to a source, is how much of that purchase price goes to the Atlanta Spirit, a group that is hardly dealing from a position of strength when it comes to selling the team. …
Apparently, [Levenson] wants a bigger piece of the purchase price and is trying to get a portion of that $60 million from the NHL. It’s believed the league, meanwhile, not only wants the $60 million relocation fee, but a portion of the $110 million purchase price. In fact, there’s a possibility that the Atlanta Spirit might end up with only $80 million to $100 million of the purchase price. It should be noted that the relocation fee for the Thrashers seems to have come out of nowhere. There was no relocation fee when the Minnesota North Stars moved to Dallas in 1993, when the Quebec Nordiques moved to Colorado in 1995, when the Winnipeg Jets moved to Phoenix in 1996 and when the Hartford Whalers relocated to Raleigh, N.C., in 1997.
And the NHL is completely in the driver’s seat on this one. … In reality, Levenson is faced with the prospect of taking what the NHL lets the Atlanta Spirit have or absorbing crushing losses for at least one more season.
Thrashers fans: Your best hope is that neither side backs down and this goes on so long that it will be too late to move the team this year. But don’t count on it.
By Jeff Schultz
♦
Earlier: Will Muschamp comes back to Georgia — as a Gator
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249 comments Add your comment
JTH
May 20th, 2011
3:59 pm
Very petty of him.
Thanks Gary
May 20th, 2011
4:04 pm
The extra money Bettman will make from this tainted deal really helps the Thrashers! Thanks Gary !! You really are gonna stick it to them and again… it will REALLY help the Atlanta Thrashers! Way to go Gary ! You and the NHL get more millions and we are still without a team! thank you so much !!
Bluestreak
May 20th, 2011
4:12 pm
Barry,
Thank you for your civility. I am sure that you are a truer representation of the people of Winnipeg and Manitoba than many of the trolls incorrectly representing your area.
Barry
May 20th, 2011
4:13 pm
Bluestreak: Believe me, some folks just like seeing their name/handle in print for the sole purpose of stirring up poo. Winnipegers are great people, just like Georgians. Believe me when I say that we’d all have a blast at the same bbq!
This is news?
May 20th, 2011
4:14 pm
I thought every sensible person wanted ASG hurt.
Guffman
May 20th, 2011
4:22 pm
“Winnipeg celebrates the return at another teams loss because they aren’t a big enough market to pay and build an expansion team. It is cheaper to have a team in place and move than pay and build through expansion. Having a team move is Winnipegs only means of returning to the NHL. ”
You’re an idiot. Expansion fee 10 years ago was only $80M. TNSE is looking to pay $170M for the Thrashers. You’re quite silly in thinking the NHL could charge an expansion fee in excess of this amount. In fact, I think TNSE is overpaying given the market of multiple trainwreck sunbelt teams.
Tommy
May 20th, 2011
4:38 pm
Half the fans (myself included) bailed out when Bob Hartley was fired, and the other half packed it in when Kovalchuk was traded. The fact Waddell held onto his job for so long without being held accountable shows that ASG was never serious about winning. The fix has been in for a long time. They knew they would never find a local buyer, so the only way to unload the team was to ruin it so attendance would plummet. Obviously the alternative–building a winning team–was too much work. Guess it took all of their effort to watch the Hawks underachieve.
I loved this team, especially in the early years. But like thousands of fans, my wife and I quit going because we were tired of shelling out $200 a game to watch ASG and Waddell run the team into the ground. It stinks, but life goes on.
This team was born under a bad star, and in retrospect was doomed for years. We had Dany Heatley, Ilya Kovalchuk and Marian Hossa–arguably 3 of the top 15 players in the last decade–and have nothing to show for it. Zero playoff wins, and no players of value obtained in exchange for them.
Oh well. And let’s be honest–if the Braves or Falcons were rumored to be leaving, wouldn’t this blog have more than 160 comments?
Mike
May 20th, 2011
5:02 pm
So if Bettman does make sale for the Spirit, that means it could be fire sale for the Hawks/Phillips?
John Marshall
May 20th, 2011
5:09 pm
Great to see a post from Tom Lysiak. For you youngsters, the greatest Atlanta Flame of them all. And a great guy, too!!
Guffman
May 20th, 2011
5:15 pm
Manitoba premier was hinting today that next Tuesday should be an interesting day. Basically, he’s saying that the ink just needs to be dry. We’re at the 99% confidence level here.
NHL Sells Out Atlanta Fans
May 20th, 2011
5:22 pm
Angry……this will make you even more upset:
http://www.keepthethrashers.com//videokeepthrashersreally.html
GO
May 20th, 2011
5:25 pm
We can all focus on the fiasco of the ownership situation over the years, but the real problem was simply Don Waddell. While he didn’t always have the funding or ability to spend consistent with a championship team, there was plenty to work with and he failed miserably. As most truly knowledgable hockey fans know, the product placed on the ice was consistently horrible. Year after year of terrible drafting, terrible trades, and we can only assume terrible negotiations with players and potential players, made watching the games like torture. A good GM could have made that product reasonable…instead it was awful. And….there went the fans, the interest and ultimately quite likely the team. As fans…we didn’t fail the franchise….the franchise failed us. Thanks Don….
Adam
May 20th, 2011
5:25 pm
The NHL back in Winnipeg will sell out every game. The rivalry between the Jets and the other Canadian NHL teams will boost the already strong Canadian TV NHL ratings. The Canadian dollar is worth more than the US dollar, and the Canadian economy continues to boom, while the economy of the US is struggling along. Moving NHL teams to Canada, where support is strong and the dollars will flow in is a no brainer. The NHL had their little experiment with hockey in southern US markets and for the most part, the fans there are indifferent and the TV money is second-rate. Face it. And if the people in Atlanta would have supported this team, it wouldn’t be leaving. Don’t blame Winnipeg.
da'boomer
May 20th, 2011
5:28 pm
adam – you are one dumb bast–d. atlanta did support the team. do some reading.
LaRon
May 20th, 2011
5:41 pm
Adam you are a complete moron. You must work for Gary Bettman because only idiots with pea sized brains work for him and you sir are on of them. People in Atlanta did support this team and if you can remember that just 4 years ago this team was in the playoffs and fans supported the team. Fans got a taste of playoff hockey and wanted more, ownership didn’t care and let the team crumble. Fans got sick of spending money in a down economy to see a crappy team on the ice. The NHL is dying a slow death and I will be rooting for their demise even more because of the Thrashers leaving.
Paddy
May 20th, 2011
5:48 pm
It is hard to like Bettman but I sure like his style on this matter. If you got the hammer, use it. It would be a fitting goodby to the ASG from the Atl fans. “win if you can, lose if you must but always make it hurt!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
litz
May 20th, 2011
5:51 pm
Nah, the fitting end, is he uses the hammer to force this sale to fall through … and A$G ends up selling to a local owner for FAR LESS then they would have gotten from TSNE, and they take it up the rear as a result.
TonyCee
May 20th, 2011
6:09 pm
@blondie: That’s a great point about the Blackhawks (by the way, during the period you mentioned, the attendance numbers were padded; I was at the UC on many occasions where the announced crowd was 13K, but it sure as you-know-what looked like 9K). And the Minnesota North Stars went through the same thing in the ’70s. The team stunk, so empty seats outnumbered occupied ones, this in America’s hockey hotbed. Someone tell me how Winnipeg as opposed to one of the biggest markets in North America (Atlanta) helps broaden the NHL’s footprint.
jay
May 20th, 2011
6:14 pm
I feel bad for Big Buff. Now he’s stuck in whinypeg for 5 years.
Greg T
May 20th, 2011
6:16 pm
Does anyone still wonder why the Thrashes and the NHL are so completely irrelevant?
Disgruntled Flames Fan
May 20th, 2011
6:20 pm
When the Flames left because owner could make more money on concert seats than hockey, I was mad with him. Fast forward and now we lose the Thrashers. I’m done with the NHL. But we also need to look at leadership in ATL. At this time i will never support anything inside Fulton County. They are just as guilty. Don’t know how they will replace tax revenue lost and don’t care. But the lack of noise coming from city officials is deafening to me. As far as ownerships goes they still may own the rights to philips arena and i think a boycott of said real estate is in order. I miss my Flames, Thrashers, And after this i will miss NHL and ANYTHING inside of Fulton County they can make revenue off of.
Brendan
May 20th, 2011
6:29 pm
Jeff Schultz, I just wanted to thank you for your honest coverage of the Thrashers, since Day One. You were a voice that called for “accountability” and you even offered up free advice, that if taken, might have helped this club become more successful. Instead, they chose the path they did, with Waddell remaining in charge, and league minimum budgets.
Draft parties won’t be the same, without Atlanta housed inside the lottery draft. That’s for sure. As I look back over 11 seasons, I do have good memories of the team. I have an entire room filled with Thrashers memorabilia. Give-a-ways. Signed photos. Team posters. Parking plaques. License plates. You name it. That room will now have to be radically altered, as looking at it will only bring unpleasant memories of what could have been.
I am, truthfully, a bit surprised by the utter lack of effort by the Commissioner to keep hockey in Atlanta. Surely, he knew how ownership was running the team into the ground. Surely, he had to know that if a good ownership group were properly vetted, that hockey would thrive here, and be a revenue PRODUCER, rather than a revenue CONSUMER. Bygones, as we say.
Jeff, I always appreciated what you tried to do for the team. I know that the organization felt that you were hindering them, but I think that’s entirely untrue. They, alone, are responsible for their poor decision-making and lack of effort or intent to win. Truthfully, the NHL should have stepped in to run the Thrashers after 2007. That’s what a league that wanted to keep the Thrashers in place would have done. It is a sad, sad day for the good hockey fans of Atlanta. But, perhaps, an AHL team will come? Who knows? If the Coyotes cannot stay in Phoenix, and the new owners of the Hawks and operating rights to Philips Arena want 41 more guaranteed dates on their schedule, they could consider purchasing the Coyotes. Honestly, I think Atlanta, with an ownership that is trying to win, is a better market than Phoenix is. Your thoughts on that, Jeff?
Brendan
May 20th, 2011
6:31 pm
Disgruntled Thrasher Fan, I think the annual loss of Georgia State income tax revenue, from two NHL teams, for 41 events, is $30 million. I don’t know how the Governor or Atlanta City officials think they’re going to replace that revenue, but … ostensibly … they don’t care. They didn’t intercede to try to block this. And that, friends, is a curiosity. If I were an elected official, I think I would have been motivated to threaten some kind of legal action if the team endeavored to leave, prior to the lease being up in 2019.
Artie B's not Walking Through That Door, People
May 20th, 2011
6:41 pm
Jeff,
2 angles you need to go on from here on:
1. Look at what the San Antonio Spurs have and the Cleveland Cavs have. NBA team, owning the facility and having a (gasp) AHL franchise in the same building as well. This makes sense for the ASG. Manitoba will have to jettison its AHL franchise, Spirit will have 44 more open nights now to fill the building as well as a full staff who can sell, service and work the franchise. The overhead will be far less than what it is for an NHL franchise and they can set ticket prices more in line with what the market has tolerated in Atlanta so far (Chick fil A nights, 50% off, BOGO offers).
2. If the Thrashers leave, the blood of many great ASG employees will be on their hands. There’s no way they keep the same staff numbers losing a hockey team and going into a lockout in the NBA. Bruce and company may get off as close to breaking even as possible (when you factor in the under valuation of the arena and Hawks in the Turner deal and whatever they get out of King & Spalding) but it would be at the expense of scores of innocent people who gave it their all for that franchise that Bruce and the Gearons could care less about. Don’t let the ownership group get off from that.
Darren
May 20th, 2011
6:54 pm
“Scott believes that Winnipeg will be a break-even proposition at best for the owners given the lack of corporate support in this city. What Chipman/Thompson are doing is a huge risk for them and should be viewed as philanthropy.”
Note that Thompson is the 17th richest man in the WORLD (according to Forbes.) He could lose $50m a year on the Jets in Winnipeg from now until the end of time, and not even notice.
jerry
May 20th, 2011
7:03 pm
Ford, Chevy, Fischer Body, and a Nascar race gone. And now the Thrashers. Atlanta is the new Detroit.
jerry
May 20th, 2011
7:13 pm
Coca Cola is worth over a trillion dollars and sells 1.6 billion drinks per day. They could do something for Atlanta.
Tripp
May 20th, 2011
7:18 pm
I don’t care how long it takes, every effort must be made to keep the Thrashers in Atlanta. If they need to be sold, then a buyer who will keep them here must be chosen. This is the 2nd time we have lost a NHL team, this must stop. Canada has enough hockey teams!!!!
Ox Baker
May 20th, 2011
7:23 pm
Winnipeg, may you be blessed with owners who care.
ASG, you should leave Georgia NOW. Don’t let the door hit you, where the good lord split you.
NEVER, EVER, come back to Georgia. You are a disgrace to the city and state.Bernie and Bob knew what kind of folks you were and are and they still tried to make things work.
Don’t go out to the bars.Don’t go out to the restaurants. Sell your abodes and git!!!
ScottKG
May 20th, 2011
7:26 pm
Hey Jeff,
Where is the Atlanta mayor and any other leadership in keeping the team? Aren’t they concerned about losing $40million in tax dollars in ticket, food and merchandaising sales?
colga87
May 20th, 2011
7:34 pm
I feel for the Atlanta hockey fans. I’ve lived in cities that lost teams and it sucks. If the move does happen, the true hockey fan can look no further than Gwinnett for their live hockey fix.
Rob
May 20th, 2011
7:59 pm
Only reason Atlanta is going instead of Phoenix is that Glendale built an arena just for the NHL, and Bettman does not want to alienate cities that build arenas for the league. Stupid giving up a key US market for a Canadian market. Only way that is approved is that NBC / Comcast were advised of the move prior to the new contract
Paddy
May 20th, 2011
8:24 pm
jerry…Coke owning any sports franchise is so far from what their mission statement is that Mars and Neptune seem like neighbors to Buford. Coke owes nothing to Atlanta. Atlanta owes everything to Coke!
Columbus
May 20th, 2011
8:30 pm
Winnepeg mayor says it is a DONE deal and expect an announcement Tuesday…..
Columbus
May 20th, 2011
8:31 pm
When Atlanta gets a team again one day, let it be with Top-Notch Ownership who are committed to I dont know….WINNING!
Columbus
May 20th, 2011
8:42 pm
Shall we boycott the Hawks games in person and on TV and every event at Philips? Lets get ASG out of this town once and for all. I will watch the Hawks ONLY in the playoffs next year and only on TV. I will NOT go to a game EVER again as long as ASG has ANYTHING to do with the Hawks. Atlanta Spirit…what a JOKE of a name! What kind of spirit? Cheapest management and coaches money can buy spirit?
Rangers forward Boogaard dead at 28
May 20th, 2011
8:50 pm
[...] [...]
Columbus
May 20th, 2011
8:51 pm
I agree totally with Tommy @4:38 and there would be more comments on here if, exactly as Tommy said, the team was not ran straight into the ground. It was methodical. They bailed out on the Thrashers almost immediately and crashed this plane into the ground and now are about to burn the city and it’s fans in 4 days. They make the city look like it is the problem but the real problem is that ASG NEVER cared enough about the Thrashers. How were they EVER approved by the NHL?
Columbus
May 20th, 2011
8:54 pm
Yes Winnepeg will sell ot the first few years and maybe longer due to the SMALL arena. Duh. But just like last time what will happen if the Canadian dollar falls?
Ralph McCormack
May 20th, 2011
8:56 pm
It appears that Atlanta Hockey can be scuttled forever by inept ownership and management and Bettman. Where did this relocation fee come from? You can get paid for a franchise multiple times? For $60 million divided 29 ways you can’t even get a first class defenceman for one year.
I believe that the NHL is about to make a very bad mistake that in the end will have major ramifications. However it will be karma for Bettman. Why are things so quiet from the previous owner of the Coyotes who was forced to sell to the NHL (at their price) because the NHL rejected a very attractive offer to relocate the team to Hamilton. Further, Mr. Balsillie of Blackberry fame, the prospective owner has been unusally quiet as well.
While I am not a lawyer and Bettman is, it would seem to me that the NHL is open for a lawsuit from the previous Coyote owner for killing the deal. This is especially true with this new addition of a relocation fee. Unfortunately, for Atlanta this opportunity gets better after a deal with Winnipeg is agreed to. Then a good injunction stopping the deal would be interesting. It is amazing how a threatened lawsuit in Arizona stopped a sale of the Coyotes.
Then, why is Mr. Balsillie being so quiet. Well his Mark Cuban approach backfired with Bettman & his NHL owners cohorts. He is better off to keep quiet. This new relocation fee allows any team who cannot find a local owner the ability to sell to anyone? who will pay it. What a deal for Balsillie – he can have his choice of any other team in ownership trouble – Florida, St. Louis, Dallas, Islanders and even Coyotes again. Bettman is about to open a can of worms and in the future a whole line of carpetbaggers can acquire troubled NHL teams.
Another question. Why would a local owner want to have ASG as their landlord, as Phillips Arena likely needs two tenants to be viable. ASG is in the process of lowering value of the whole package and the Hawks are likely next.
ASG? What a class act? Going thru a Select Your Seat charade when they plan to sell the team to Winnipeg next week. Are they selecting seats in the Winnipeg arena?
cable guy
May 20th, 2011
9:10 pm
Not that it matters to any of you, but the weirdest thing about this is, I worked at Bettman’s house before moving to georgia in ‘96. In ‘06 i met and worked on DW’s cable in Gwinnett. I wound up being the Thrasher’s personal cable guy at the practice rink in Duluth for a couple of years. So having talked hockey with both of them, & this being the end of it. I’m astounded.
thrasherdawg
May 20th, 2011
9:28 pm
“Where is the Atlanta mayor and any other leadership in keeping the team? Aren’t they concerned about losing $40million in tax dollars in ticket, food and merchandaising sales?”
They are politicians, they do not understand “cash flow”, business, nor do they know how to add and subtract.
I wish the Braves, Falcons, and Hawks would all leave town. The Mayor and Governor stand by and put zero effort into arguing the case to keep the team here. What a bunch of losers.
Maybe they can explain to all the people who will lose their jobs why they sat around and did nothing. What a bunch of Lazy Losers.
slobberknocker
May 20th, 2011
10:05 pm
Screw the Spirit Group and screw Gary Bettman. For years the Spirit Group gave us Thrasher fans an inferior product and ask us to bond with it. They traded away the few Superstars we had for inferior players to satisfy self-imposed budgetary restraints. And now Betteman is going to let the SPIRIT Group move the Thrashers to Winnipeg. A city that HAD an NHL Team that is now playing in Phoenix. Winnipeg, a city with a metropolitan population of approimately 700,000. Great move for the NHL, Betteman. Your a real visionary. Leave Atlanta, a city with a metroploitan population of over 5 million and great natural rivalries in Carolina and Florida, and Tennessee. Metro Atlanta is the eighth- or seventh-largest media market in the United States. And I haven’t even mentioned the thousands of transplanted hockey loving Northerners living in the Atlanta area. Instead of the Thrashers moving to Winnipeg, move the Spirit Group to Winnipeg. And they can take that empty suit moron Betteman with them.
Ryan
May 20th, 2011
10:34 pm
I don’t want to generalize, because most of the Atlanta fans did not do this. But notice some of the comments from “typical” Amercans about Canada. This is the reason why the rest of the world thinks negatively about the US. I live in Spain and have spoken to numerous south americans, Europeans, Asians, etc, and the general consensus is that Americans are ignorant and egotisical. (ie. invented democracy, are the greatest nation on earth, win all the wars).
Don’t send aggression to the Fans of Winnipeg. They are not celebrating you losing a team, they are celebrating getting a team back that was taken from them. If you want to point blame, try Bettman or the Atlanta ownership group.
As well, forget the size of Atlanta versus the size of Winnipeg. Yes, Atlanta is much, much bigger. However, how many kids in Atlanta grow up playing hockey as their go-to sport? How many of them grow up trying to play for the Braves or Hawks or Falcons. Winnipeg has no other major sports team and are Hockey Mad. Thus, even though the population is smaller, I would bet that on average a Winnipeg resident is 3 times more likely to buy a ticket/season tickets than an Atlanta fan.
In short, Americans, be humble. The rest of the globes opinion/negativity towards you will not change until you can accept other viewpoints. Don’t send aggresion towards Winnipeg. They are not the reason this team may relocate. Finally, understand that sometimes social-cultural factors play into sports decisions. Atlanta may be a huge market, but how many of your kids are playing hockey in their free time? I like the Thrashers where they are, but cleary something is not working the way it should be and maybe Atlanta is not an NHL market.
Yum Yums
May 20th, 2011
10:36 pm
The only thing I would like to do is hang the ASG and Waddell by there toes from the tallest pine tree in the state. Maybe we could use them as a piñata?
illputitoncspan
May 20th, 2011
10:57 pm
Hands down the worst run league in sports!!! It’s not even close.
illputitoncspan
May 20th, 2011
11:04 pm
I commented several days ago how quiet city and county officials have been along with those from the ACVB and the Chamber of Commerce. Yet it was these same people, or their predecessors, who were crying that the arena could not be built outside the city. They said it would kill downtown. Now nothing… Thanks guys. Absolutely useless.
katherine
May 20th, 2011
11:05 pm
Ryan
May 20th, 2011
10:34 pm
I don’t want to generalize, because most of the Atlanta fans did not do this. But notice some of the comments from “typical” Amercans about Canada. This is the reason why the rest of the world thinks negatively about the US. I live in Spain and have spoken to numerous south americans, Europeans, Asians, etc, and the general consensus is that Americans are ignorant and egotisical. (ie. invented democracy, are the greatest nation on earth, win all the wars).
you just did generalize….you cannot possibly think that a “typical” american is spewing negativity on a blog. the south americans, europeans, asians…etc can think what they want…if america is so bad then why do they still come here to live? I, for one, am sick of that attitude…….if you really think a typical american is like that then you don’t know much about the great people of our nation.
katherine
May 20th, 2011
11:07 pm
oh and ryan…did you see the attendance numbers? atlanta is right there with a lot of other teams…so the whole “maybe Atlanta isn’t a hockey market” bs is just that…bs
Ryan
May 20th, 2011
11:30 pm
Once again, I am not generalizing Katherine, because I know a lot of Americans do not feel this way, but your comment of “then why do they still come her to live? you don’t know much about the great people of our nation” is the epitomy of an egotistical American comment. I am Canadian. And I wouldn’t be caught dead saying something like “the great people of our nation”. I am a proud Canadian, but what make me think that people from my country are better than any others? They are not, and I can find fault in all aspects of my country and people. You have a facist attitude that cannot accept other viewpoints. What attitude are you sick of? An opinion. It’s called democracy. Listen to other opinions and stop with the “Us versus them” mentality. It gets you nowhere. And yes, I looked at the attendance. The Thrashers attendance has been going down over the last 4 years and is right there with a number of other teams that are being considered for relocation.