Van Gundy: Hawks’ Hinrich deal better than Carmelo trade

Here's Kirk Hinrich knocking the ball away from Dwight Howard in game one Saturday.

Here's Kirk Hinrich knocking the ball away from Dwight Howard in game one Saturday.

ORLANDO — I think Stan Van Gundy just said Kirk Hinrich is better than Carmelo Anthony.

OK, not quite. But the Orlando Magic coach did declare the Hawks’ trade for Hinrich was the best deal any team made at the NBA trade deadline, including the New York Knicks’ acquisition of Anthony from Denver.

Whether you think Van Gundy is telling the truth or just trying to sweet talk the Magic’s opponent between games of their playoff series, here’s the quote on Hinrich: “He’s always been one of the best defensive guards in the league. Going back to when I was in Miami and he was in Chicago, I’ve always thought he was one of the best guys guarding [Dwyane] Wade. He can guard at both guard positions. He’s got good size. He’s extremely tough. He’s smart and a great competitor. Up until this year he had been a real up-and-down shooter. That was his main flaw. But he’s shot extremely well this year.”

And now, Van Gundy’s big finish: “Long before the playoffs got here, I thought of all the moves made at the trade deadline — and I know everybody got jacked up with the New York thing because of the names involved, and I’m not saying that was a bad move — I thought [the Hawks’ move was the best of all the moves. It was great. It was only one guy. They didn’t make the changes that New York did late in the year. What they did was take a smart tough guy and incorporate him.”

The Hinrich trade has been a matter of debate in Atlanta since it was a made. It was a five-player deal with Washington: Hinrich and Hilton Armstrong for Mike Bibby (who never played there), Jordan Crawford, Maurice Evans and a first-round pick.

There’s little question Hinrich improved the Hawks at point guard and gave them a better starting five. He did a good job defending Jameer Nelson early in the Hawks’ 103-93 win Saturday. (Nelson had 27 points but he was held to one point at halftime and didn’t start scoring until Hinrich went to the bench.)

The difficult part of the trade was the Hawks’ decision to part with rookie Jordan Crawford (who went on play in 26 games, start 18, average 16.3 points, 3.9 assists and had a 39-point game) and the draft pick.

Given Van Gundy’s comment, I thought it would be worth throwing it out there again. What are your thoughts on the Hinrich deal?

By Jeff Schultz

Last few Hawks blogs

Playoff win shows Hawks haven’t quit on Larry Drew

Hawks surprise us again — this time by stunning Magic

Like magic, Jameer Nelson suddenly not talking about Hawks

This would be good time for Hawks to knock somebody down

Follow me on Twitter @JeffSchultzAJC; friend me at Facebook.com/JeffSchultzAJC

81 comments Add your comment

Ben

April 18th, 2011
1:45 pm

I think the verdict on the hinrich deal is still out. We need to see how we finish these playoffs before fully evaluating the trade. I still think we should of been able to at least keep one of the other in the 1st rd pick or Jordan Crawford. I didn’t feel we needed to give them both in the deal.

Chris

April 18th, 2011
1:47 pm

It made them better at the point defensively. It seemed like Bibby was bothan offensive and defensive liability. by imporving on defense with Hinrich (even without offense) is an overall improvement. Is he the long term answer? Probably not. Giving up the draft pick hurt though. It hinders them from getting a PG or true Center in the forseeable future.

Najeh Davenpoop

April 18th, 2011
1:47 pm

The best deadline deal was OKC getting Perkins hands down. If Kirk continues to play like he did in Game 1, it is a good short term deal, but given what the Hawks gave up to get him and the fact that the trade was only necessitated by their refusal to develop Jeff Teague, it’s a stretch to rank it ahead of either the Perkins trade for OKC or the Melo trade for both teams.

Ben

April 18th, 2011
1:47 pm

verdict is still out on the Hinrich deal until we see how we fare in the rest of the playoffs. I just thought we didn’t have to give up both the 1st rd pick and Jordan Crawford in the deal. We should of only been able to give up 1 of the 2 but not both.

Jeff Schultz

April 18th, 2011
1:48 pm

Chris — Hawks had to do something. Bibby was dreadful at the end. Always was a defensive liability and offense got worse. Seemed like he stopped caring (in addition to getting older).

Shadowman_no9

April 18th, 2011
1:54 pm

I think a good GM could have made the trade without giving up Jo. Crawford. Didn’t Atl give up a draft pick in this dead as well? Hinrich’s deal is up after next season too, right? Hawks gave away too much. Hinrich is a good pickup, but give up Crawford or the pick. Not both!

tremaine

April 18th, 2011
1:56 pm

The hawks should have started TEAGUE and put Bibby on the bench rather than giving up so much for one player.

“GIVE TEAGUE A CHANCE!”

Chris

April 18th, 2011
1:56 pm

I agree Jeff… Something had to be done. Now it could be just a simple situation of addition by subtraction, but Hinrich has defenitiely improved the team’s overall defensive numbers. The Hawks’ Opponent’s Point Per Game has dropped by about 4 since he has arrived if I’m not mistaken. I definitely feel like the move was made to improve the team. Unlike the move to bring Farnsworth and Ankiel to the Braves at the deadline last year. That was just a move for the sake of making a move.

MJC

April 18th, 2011
1:57 pm

For this year, I like our deal. Let’s see how it pans out in the future.

Also, Denver got the better part of the Carmelo trade.

Michael

April 18th, 2011
1:57 pm

A related question…What has Bibby done for Miami? I haven’t paid much attention to his stats since he arrived there. It would be interesting to see how his stats compare for this season here vs. in Miami.

hmmmm........

April 18th, 2011
1:57 pm

The Hawks gave up a good bit to get him and if he doesn’t resign here in the off season it was a terrible trade. Well unless they win it all. but i don’t see it happening

hmmmm........

April 18th, 2011
1:59 pm

Bibby has a been a nice 3 point threat for the heat but thats about it

Rut Nanny

April 18th, 2011
1:59 pm

Better deadline deals:

Battier to Memphis
Perkins to OKC
Package that Denver got for Melo
Landry to New Orleans

Just another case of Van Gundy running his stupid mouth.

Michael

April 18th, 2011
1:59 pm

And Bibby did play 2 games for the Wizards.

Shadowman_no9

April 18th, 2011
2:03 pm

Larry Drew, the GM, and all the hawks scouts should be fired anyway,

MJC

April 18th, 2011
2:03 pm

@hmmmm…..

Hinrich’s contract doesn’t expire until summer 2012

wxwax

April 18th, 2011
2:04 pm

How much playing time would Jordan Crawford have earned on this Hawks team?

By contrast, the Wizards threw him out there because they don’t have much else. He eventually turned into a productive player for them.

But with the current roster in Atlanta, I’m not sure he would have gotten the minutes to develop his game.

(ps I’m getting tired of this Teague talk. The guy has had the chance to prove his worth and what he’s demonstrated is supreme inconsistency.)

frelemur

April 18th, 2011
2:07 pm

Its a good move. I didnt like that they gave up crawford and a pick but a late first round pick in this draft isnt going to ammount to much. The 2012 draft is the one to focus on.

hmmmm........

April 18th, 2011
2:07 pm

The Hawks still need a true center for certain teams. Tyson Chandler is gonna be a free agent

hmmmm........

April 18th, 2011
2:08 pm

Rev in Tampa

April 18th, 2011
2:08 pm

Two Cliches:

1) The proof of the pudding is in the eating and 2) the regular season doesn’t matter in the NBA.

Given the truth of those two statements it is hard to argue with what Hinrich has given the Hawks against the Magic, but I think Teague could have given the Hawks the same defensive result.

Obviously Teague could not give the same leadership and experience that Hinrich gives, but he very well might in the near future. Maybe he could now if Drew had given him more minutes earlier in the season.

So my conclusion is that the Hawks gave up JC2 and a first round pick unnecessarily. I’m glad that Bibby and Mo are gone however.

Shadowman_no9

April 18th, 2011
2:09 pm

wxwax…Teague has not been given a chance, he’s made mistakes, but that’s going to happen with young pointguards. the only thing inconsistent has been his playing time.

Section 303

April 18th, 2011
2:13 pm

I think they had to make a deal of some kind. Had the trade deadline come-and-gone without a move, the organization would look like they weren’t even trying. At the time, I was thinking the Hawks would make more than one move. And, they almost did. There were a lot of people saying that the Hawks were shopping Josh Smith at the deadline, but asking for too much in return.

If the Hawks win this series with Orlando and show well the rest of the playoffs, then I think the deal was a good one (assuming Hinrich plays well, of course). The playoffs, as we learned last year, will be the ultimate judge of the entire season, as well as the Hinrich deal.

By the way, regardless of the end result of this postseason, I still think the team needs to be shaken up. Not just in a minor way, either. Betting Josh Smith names continues to surface in trade rumors up until the draft and then after the lockout.

Section 303

April 18th, 2011
2:15 pm

wxwax, you need to pay attention closer. Teague is a good player. I used to think like you, but I’ve changed. Teague has shown he can play.

I’m not saying he’s a savior. Just saying he can play and should be given a shot to contribute in the playoffs.

tremaine

April 18th, 2011
2:16 pm

“How much playing time would Jordan Crawford have earned on this Hawks team?”

He would have got plenty of playing time once the hawks got rid of the other Crawford but they will be forced to offer another bad contract.

(ps I’m getting tired of this Teague talk. The guy has had the chance to prove his worth and what he’s demonstrated is supreme inconsistency.)

Teague has out played every point guard on Atl roster this year when given the chance but unfortunately when he makes one mistake you never see him again.

Eric

April 18th, 2011
2:18 pm

He’s playing mind games the deal was OK. The deal Orlando made was horrible they sent four of their best players packing and have gotten nothing from the three guys they got. Plus none of the three play any kind of defense.

HarryHawkins

April 18th, 2011
2:22 pm

Hinrich has been a great addition and so far it has been a good trade. The first round draft pick may hurt us, and it’s a little tough giving up both Crawford and the pick….but one in the hand is worth two in the bush (especially now since all the chicks are shaved).

joe

April 18th, 2011
2:23 pm

no problem with part of the trade, Sund just gave too much. Crawford or a draft pick, not both! If the Hawks renew Sund’s contract I’ll be shocked(and mad). He has been as inept as some of the players….

ATL born and raised

April 18th, 2011
2:23 pm

We will see how good this trade is in the second round if the Hawks can defeat Orlando. The Magic are not the same team they were a year ago. Dwight is much improved, but they miss the offensive production of Carter and Lewis. The Hawks have won a 1st round series before. Let’s see how Kirk does against his former team, but nobody can guard D-Rose right now.

HarryHawkins

April 18th, 2011
2:23 pm

It was a good deal, maybe not a great one.

phil

April 18th, 2011
2:24 pm

I thought the Magic would sweep us easily for starters…first to admit, and glad, I’m wrong…As for the Bibby trade, good riddance. Heinrich has been ok but this “team” only wins when JJ and Smith decide to show up and play….i suspect we’ll soon be seeing them exit stage right….Smith is already whining about his elbow….setting up the excuse…

HarryHawkins

April 18th, 2011
2:24 pm

Hawks will win it in the ATL.

Shadowman_no9

April 18th, 2011
2:25 pm

Joe Johnson can’t be traded, Horford shouldn’t be traded, but otherwise, everyone (although I like Teague, and would keep Zaza) should be offered up for something. The front office, along with the coaching staff (I kinda like coach Bender) should be sacked. regardless if we beat the magic or not.

HarryHawkins

April 18th, 2011
2:25 pm

We can win if we show up with a Big Johnston. If the small one shows up we’re in trouble.

KOOL

April 18th, 2011
2:27 pm

Nice catch, Michael… Bibby did play @ Washington and wore #00

Samuel James

April 18th, 2011
2:28 pm

Loved the Hinrich deal hands down, and I said it before: the measure of KH is his playoff body of work in these playoffs. On paper, we gave “a little too much” in trading JC2 too, but it is my contention that the totality of pressure for Suund to make a PG change overlapped what we gave up in JC2. It also explains why he had trouble making deals on the deadline-we were desperate (Why else didn’t we get something decent for Crawford’s expiring contract?)

Shadowman_no9

April 18th, 2011
2:28 pm

Hubie Brown even said as much on TV during the broadcast, and everyone knows Hubie Brown is always right.

AJ

April 18th, 2011
2:29 pm

Don’t forget about the very athletic Hilton Armstrong. I hope to see more out of this young man if he can get more PT. If I were LD I’d take Armstrong over Powell or Etan Thomas.

James on Pharr Rd

April 18th, 2011
2:29 pm

Loved the Hinrich deal hands down, and I said it before: the measure of KH is his playoff body of work in these playoffs. On paper, we gave “a little too much” in trading JC2 too, but it is my contention that the totality of pressure for Suund to make a PG change overlapped what we gave up in JC2. It also explains why he had trouble making deals on the deadline-we were desperate (Why else didn’t we get something decent for Crawford’s expiring contract?)

JSS

April 18th, 2011
2:34 pm

Everyone knows that the Hawks tried to move 3 players at the deadline (Bibby, Marvin, and Zaza). The Bibby /Hinrich deal is only questioned because of the cost (JC2 and the upcoming 1st round pick). I was happy to see Evans go. I hated that he had an option year in the first place. The question of just how good Jordan Crawford will be is a big if. He would only get that kind of shot volume as he is getting in Washington after Jamal leaves. The Hawks were in a panic to do something about that perimeter d… And we know they don’t trust Teague to run the team…

Reid Adair

April 18th, 2011
2:36 pm

Stan Van Gundy has been drinking the proverbial Kool-Aid at the ASG offices, apparently.

The Hawks gave away too much for Kirk Hinrich (forget the other guy who has been a non-factor).

SWAT Native

April 18th, 2011
2:36 pm

I like the trade, but of course I would have liked it better if the Hawks had gotten Jevale McGee rather than Armstrong.

tremaine

April 18th, 2011
2:37 pm

It’s amazing how when the hawks have one good win everything is right with the world. Get real people. They are still the team that lost like 5 games by 30 points or more. If Dwight Howard get any kind of help the hawks are done.

KevinM

April 18th, 2011
2:38 pm

Teague isn’t going to be given a chance….we can all pine for it, but he will play mop up minutes. lD has no faith in him. A DNP in Game 1 and the win will seal Teague’s fate this series.

On the Hindrich deal, we were desperate and Sund showed no experience in his negotiations with a team going nowhere. We could have done better with Houston and maybe Portland. I gve Sund a D for this trade. What’s ignorant is how he and LD continued to try to convince fans that Bibby was in his prime and kept giving him minutes even if it meant little or no production.

Now that he is gone, I will be more than receptive to see how thisnpans out with Hindrich. He hasn’t been here long enough to feel comfortable.

I still think though that Teague is getting a raw deal and I fault LD 100%.

We’ll try to move forward

KevinM

April 18th, 2011
2:39 pm

ID=LD in previous post.

clay

April 18th, 2011
2:40 pm

I think its a great deal. Ill take defense all day over a little offense. As long as he can score 10 dish out a couple of dimes and grab a couple of boards. Ill take it all day if thats the case and the hawks would win more that way than not.

James on Pharr Rd

April 18th, 2011
2:41 pm

Outside of the elite point guards-Williams,Paul, Rose,Westbrook,Kidd,Rondo,Parker, Billups and Miller-Hinrich is considerably better or as good as the other guards. Since we couldn’t get any one of the above, I dont mind settling for top 13 out of 30 choices for a position that is very important in our conference. (I purposely left out Harris,Nash, Curry or Martin because KH is significantly better on the D side)

Gene Rayburn

April 18th, 2011
2:43 pm

I like Hinrich as well . But the dude is getting long in the tooth & we gave up multiple players & a one pick . Even with getting Hilton Armstrong we gave up to much . That being said he is a gamer & was wanted by other teams .

KevinM

April 18th, 2011
2:48 pm

KH doesn’t help us long term and we will continue to flounder at PG.

The 13th best PG isn’t going to be good enough to be a serious contender going forward.
Only a LA or Miami will be the exception to that rule.

It is not possible IMO for Sund to move this team forward, But I will be there Friday and show m support for a team who is inconsistent at best.

KevinM

April 18th, 2011
2:51 pm

You know why other teams want KH? As a short term fix to get them some depth, not to start him and givenhim major minutes.
LD’s task is to use him in a role best suited for the remainder of his ability. I will say KH will always have JJ Redick worried about breaking another ankle going forward!