Trades (Part II): Should Hawks deal Josh for point guard?
Josh Smith had two offensive fouls and missed three three-point shots in fourth at Milwaukee.
(It’s trade talk Thursday. For Part I on the Thrashers, click here.)
There were few secrets about the Hawks going into this season.
We knew they overpaid for Joe Johnson but management felt his scoring couldn’t be replaced. We knew Al Horford made the All-Star team as a center but he would be so much better at power forward. We knew Josh Smith could be either the most dominant player on the floor or a complete pill, depending on the week, or the game, or the moment.
Here’s what we didn’t know for certain: Could Jeff Teague be an adequate replacement at point guard, since it had become apparent that Mike Bibby’s 32-year-old legs turned to linguini last season? The answer right now is no.
New Hawks coach Larry Drew has done an admirable job this season, steering the team to a 29-17 record despite several injuries and bringing a new philosophy to the offense. But unless the Hawks have a floor leader up top running the offense, they’re probably not going very deep in the postseason again.
This is when we come back to the issue of whether it’s time to change the look of this team. It’s not going to be at center because there just aren’t many good ones. So that means trading Josh Smith for a point guard.
Forget trading Horford, who’s the Hawks only universally embraced player. Forget trading Johnson, who makes too much money. That leaves Smith, who on some nights looks like he finally has arrived and on other nights looks like he doesn’t get it and will never get it — like Wednesday in Milwaukee.
Chauncey Billups would take charge for the Hawks.
The Hawks blew an 11-point lead by allowing the NBA’s worst offensive team (the Bucks) to score 34 points in the fourth quarter. Smith was the biggest problem. He had two offensive fouls and was one for six from the floor. He missed three three-point shots. Why did he even take three three-point shots?
It would be great if general manager Rick Sund could somehow swing a deal for a take charge point guard who simply would look at Smith waving his arms in the corner, laugh and then look in the other direction and give the ball to someone else. But the Hawks don’t have that leader right now. The two best candidates who could help this team likely require dealing Smith in a trade: Denver’s Chauncey Billups — not the Nuggets’ Carmelo Anthony, as rumored, because he’s a scorer and doesn’t fit what the Hawks need – or Phoenix’s Steve Nash.
Billups is 36 and Nash is 34. They’re old. But either would far exceed the three-headed monster of Bibby, Teague and Jamal Crawford (a terrific scorer but not a true point). Billups or Nash also would give the Hawks a couple of years to either develop Teague (if they still believe he can be developed) or draft somebody else to develop.
When asked about Teague, Drew admitted, “I had hoped he would be further along. So we’ve had to go with what’s been good to us. Mike is up there in age but he’s still been pretty productive.”
Drew said he’s resting Bibby enough that he’s not overly concerned about the player wearing down in the second half and in the postseason. When asked about defenses breaking down the Hawks, he said, “It does start [at point guard], but most of our breakdowns on top will be off the pick and roll. … From a breakdown standpoint, it’s certainly the head of the snake for us. We have to have ball containment. But that’s true with everybody on the perimeter.”
The NBA trade deadline is Feb. 24. Will Sund act? He never publicly discusses his plans (or sometimes even general thoughts) on the roster. But he is, by nature, deliberate. He doesn’t do things quickly. He doesn’t have a reputation for being real proactive. So it’s debatable whether a Smith deal would be seriously explored.
Also key: Hawks ownership always has been a big Smith fan, and believes he carries marketing value.
If Sund can make a deal for a point guard without trading Smith, great. The expiring contracts of Crawford ($10 million) and Maurice Evans ($2.5 million) have some trade value. But this team needs more than a Band-Aid at point guard. It might be time for a makeover.
By Jeff Schultz
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EARLIER: Trade focus (Part I): Thrashers need help but will they get it?
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201 comments Add your comment
honest_abe
January 27th, 2011
8:32 pm
josh can’t shoot from the outside. look at his career numbers not some hot month he had earlier in the season. you don’t go from being a classic brick thrower to a good shooter in a span of an offseason. he’s quite the talent but he’s a head case the hawks can do without.
sure the hawks would lose a shot blocker and an intimidator in the paint but championship teams don’t have captains that choose when they want to play hard. my biggest problem with josh is that he quits on himself and the team when times get tough. also, he’s not young anymore so we can’t use that excuse anymore when he makes bad decisions like shooting a ridiculous jump shot early in the shot clock or leading the break like he’s the poor mans lebron james. the guy needs to go. get something good while he still has some value.
Jeff Schultz
January 27th, 2011
8:56 pm
Dawg A — Thanks.
Jeff Schultz
January 27th, 2011
8:59 pm
Gimmeabreak — Seriously? You’re turning this into a race thing? Congrats, you get award for dumbest comment of the day. No, that’s not what “universally admired” means. Horford’s the only player on roster that everybody agrees is a keeper. Josh is loved by many, disliked by some. Same with Joe. Same with others.
Jeff Schultz
January 27th, 2011
8:59 pm
Triforce20 — Billups is older than Bibby but he’s also 10 times the point guard.
LAC
January 27th, 2011
9:07 pm
Nobody can believe these Atlanta STUPID Group, I have NEVER seen LIARS like this !!!
I hope they ALL GO TO HELL !
SleeplessinAtlanta
January 27th, 2011
9:13 pm
Apparently Deron Williams has stated that he wants to be traded from Utah. Can you confirm this? I would trade smith for Deron in a second.
Big Ray
January 27th, 2011
9:15 pm
Those of you who say the defense will collapse if Smith were to be traded….that’s exactly the problem.
Do you remember how stupid we kept saying it was to depend on Joe Johnson to BE THE OFFENSE?
Well it’s no less stupid to depend on Josh Smith to BE THE DEFENSE.
The Celtics don’t win because they have one or two guys who can really defend. They win because they have an entire rotation that believes in defending as a team.
The Hawks might actually have to trade Smith to help make this happen. If they don’t have to, then fine.
Yes, Smith has other-wordly talent. But he doesn’t bring it every night. Sometimes he doesn’t even bring it every week. This is not the characteristic of a true star. Sorry, but it’s just not. And this is coming from a guy who has been an unabashed Smith fan since we drafted him.
Mike
January 27th, 2011
9:16 pm
Why not Marvin and Bibby … 2 for 1.
Big Ray
January 27th, 2011
9:16 pm
sure the hawks would lose a shot blocker and an intimidator in the paint but championship teams don’t have captains that choose when they want to play hard. my biggest problem with josh is that he quits on himself and the team when times get tough. also, he’s not young anymore so we can’t use that excuse anymore when he makes bad decisions like shooting a ridiculous jump shot early in the shot clock or leading the break like he’s the poor mans lebron james.
So sad.
But so true.
Big Ray
January 27th, 2011
9:17 pm
Apparently Deron Williams has stated that he wants to be traded from Utah. Can you confirm this? I would trade smith for Deron in a second.
Me too…..
Najeh Davenpoop
January 27th, 2011
9:22 pm
“Najeh Davenpoop, have you even bothered to look at the Suns roster? They Carter/Hill/Dudley/Childress/Pietrus…All of which play the position that Jamal Crawford plays.”
First of all, Hill/Dudley/Childress are small forwards and Pietrus is a SG/SF. Jamal is a PG/SG. Jamal’s game is totally different from any of those players. Secondly, Jamal has an expiring contract, which if I’m not mistaken none of those players have.
There have been rumblings that the Suns may trade Nash all season, and if they were to do so, they would be doing it to begin a rebuilding process. Jamal’s expiring deal and a first round pick would give them cap space and an additional prospect going into next season, and if they like Teague that’s two prospects.
This is the way the NBA works. Teams never trade franchise players for other franchise players. When they trade them, they trade them for expiring contracts, draft picks, young players on rookie contracts, and cap space. Is that the best offer they could get for Nash? Maybe, maybe not. Do they even want to trade Nash? Who the hell knows — I certainly don’t, since I’m not some NBA insider. But if they were to choose to deal Nash before the deadline, that would be the kind of trade they would pursue.
Nola Slim
January 27th, 2011
9:35 pm
Dude, must be painful having to write about the Hawks – like somebody cares…
ATL FAN
January 27th, 2011
9:53 pm
YES!! Josh is not a SF, very inconsistent in that position, and he would be best used at PF to develop his post play. Problem is, Al is not a C, and he is also best used at PF. I’d take Al over Josh any day, and given Josh’s recent inconsistent play that has cost us games, we MUST trade him. Deal him for a PG that can run the offense and use Al Horford and swing the ball to an open Marvin…
SteveW
January 27th, 2011
10:03 pm
I like Nash and Billups, but I wouldn’t come close to trading Josh for either one of them.
Nire – Good point about Nash’s defense.
KevinM
January 27th, 2011
10:05 pm
1st LD mistake, making Smoove a captain..now how can you bench him if his game is struggling? And move he and Marvin…2 guys whose potential is going on right now.
Billups should be gettable with Marvin and a 1st rounder. We waste our draft picks anyway.
The easist position to replace in the NBA? Power forward….
Give me one of Houston’s…..Lowry or Brooks…both run circles around Bibby.
Kaman? Laughable…like everyone who pined for Camby…if the Clippers can’t win with both of these guys, what does that tell you about their value? Kaman is a lottery winner…with a salary to match.
Can you say DeAndre Jordan? Making less than 1M this year. I’m sure Sund explored that option already?….(eyes rolling).
Dr. Yale
January 27th, 2011
10:07 pm
Kevin if the Clippers had LeBron they couldn’t win…
bigeasy830
January 27th, 2011
10:13 pm
I would trade Marvin Williams for a good pimento cheese sandwich…..just saying
Air Zaza
January 27th, 2011
10:33 pm
None of these PG’s make us better long term. No point in trading Josh unless that’s address. I rather much rather trade Jamal.
Air Zaza
January 27th, 2011
10:36 pm
None of these PG’s make us better long term. No point in trading Josh unless that’s address. I much rather trade Jamal.
If we can’t get an All Star Center like Bogut or a superstar like Melo or Deron. We get worst and we are stuck in s***. We knew when we resigned Joe it became a need to get a superstar.
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roger
January 27th, 2011
11:15 pm
Jeff by far the best article you have ever written! Josh is a disease he leads the league in walking up and up and down the court! If he couldnt jump he would be in professional wrestling pouting and yelling at the official. Josh makes the team worse when he is playing If there was a one on one league he would finall be an all star. He is always open for the jump shot because they hope he will shoot! Please get a team player so we can be sucessful in the playoffs!
JSS
January 27th, 2011
11:22 pm
niremetal
January 27th, 2011
6:03 pm
@ niremetal…
SMDH…
bird
January 27th, 2011
11:26 pm
Im for trading Smith but we would have to find someone to defend the rim, Horford can’t do it. When Smith is not in the game, opposing players go to the hole whistling as they lay it up with ease. Not sure about Billups either, 40yr old PG? Really? well 36 but still, you get the picture.
bird
January 27th, 2011
11:31 pm
Trading Josh for a 36yr old point guard will not help the team defense. The Celtics have defensive minded bigs that thrive on playing defense.
bird
January 27th, 2011
11:35 pm
Please remind me why Woody got fired? Was it because he couldn’t get past the second round? Well I guess LD will get his walking papers this off-season.’
James
January 28th, 2011
12:24 am
Denver Gets:
Josh Smith
Marvin Williams
Mike Bibby
Hawks Get:
Chauncey Billups
J.R. Smith
Nene
James
January 28th, 2011
12:29 am
PG. Chauncey Billups
SG. Joe Johnson
SF. Josh Powell
PF. Al Horford
C. Nene
E43
January 28th, 2011
1:06 am
this trade can only happen if your satisfied with Jason Collins as center in the playoffs. he did do well when he was with jersey but this is a whole different scenario.
Timmy
January 28th, 2011
2:05 am
The Hawks only chance is to go in the tank in the next couple of years, hope and pray to get the #1 pick, and hope and pray that there is a star player available around whom they can build the team. Right now, the Hawks are a middling playoff team that has no shot at a title and is going nowhere fast. Bringing in Billups or Nash won’t put this team over the top. If I could get Carmelo, I would go for it and try to build a team around him. But I doubt he’d want to stay in Atlanta. I wouldn’t. In any event, at least he’d be a star, something Atlanta hasn’t had since Dominique. It’s really sad because Atlanta is a great basketball town and I think would really get behind the team if they had decent ownership that was serious about trying to build a championship team. But, then again, the NBA is really suffers in my opinion because there are only a few franchises that have a chance each year, and there are so many that have never really come close to a title (unlike the NFL).
JSS
January 28th, 2011
7:21 am
Timmy
January 28th, 2011
2:05 am
“The Hawks only chance is to go in the tank in the next couple of years, hope and pray to get the #1 pick, and hope and pray that there is a star player available around whom they can build the team.”
That is crazy talk! We did that already! You just need to make WISE MOVES! There’s only two teams who used the lottery to build a power house: San Antonio (who were constant 2nd rd losers) and Oklahoma City (Seattle)… It has not worked for Charlotte, Toronto, Golden State, New York, New Jersey, and Houston!
We’ve (the fans) have given him (Sund) a grace period given the mess that Billy Knight left him in Free agents, PG, SF, and 2nd unit. But, now is time to fish or cut bait! Rick Sund needs to earn his pay now…
VernC
January 28th, 2011
7:39 am
Enter your comments here
Walker, Texas Ranger
January 28th, 2011
7:59 am
answer, absotively
Geemack
January 28th, 2011
8:53 am
Jeff,
They should only trade Josh for and impact younger player, unfortunately Nash & Billups are to old.
If we could get CP3, D-Will, or Melo for Josh and Jamal I would pull the trigger in a heart beat.
coachx
January 28th, 2011
8:54 am
“Any time you sacrifice principle for talent you lose.”
Fran Tarkenton
That is what the Hawks are doing with Smoove. He is mental midgit with the worst shot selection in the NBA.
Anthony Lee
January 28th, 2011
9:03 am
R u out of your mind u telling me u going to deal a young Josh Smith for 2 old players because of one bad game . The hawks were going for a record for road wins they never did that with the great Mike Woodson and u gone get the same thing u gettin out of Mike Bibby old and slow !!!!
Stephen
January 28th, 2011
9:23 am
Jeff, with Dwight Howard possibly becoming a FA after next season, has there been any chatter about him wanting to come back home to play for the Hawks? and if so, does keeping guys like Josh Smith and Josh Powell around enhance that possibility?
Anthony Lee
January 28th, 2011
9:38 am
Here is the trade everybody should be pushing for Marvin and Jeff Teague for Ty Lawson !!!!!
rm
January 28th, 2011
9:52 am
So you are saying that Bibby is too old at 32 but the Hawks should trade for either a 34 year old or a 36 year old PG? Huh?
WcHaWkSwC
January 28th, 2011
9:55 am
JS i have been seeing alot about the Hawks getting Nash or Billups as pg, well i say for get about it, they do not need some old legs with a year or two left in the tank. Why not go get Chris Paul? I went to espn trade machine and traded MB, MW, Jamal C, and a first round pick for him.
JMS
January 28th, 2011
10:01 am
I could not agree more with this article! Personally josh smith is my favorite player on the hawks, but he is to hot and cold. At times he is throwing down monster dunks and blocking shots five rows into the stands. However at other times he is walking up the court and jacking up threes that he knows he can’t hit at a high %. The hawks need a true point that is a playmaker who can run the offense. Mike Bibby is way past his prime and teague looks like a bigger bust than marvin williams. Nash would bring a ton of attention to the hawks, he would make Joe and Horford even better, and could hopefully help develop Teauge!
Casey
January 28th, 2011
10:22 am
Not going to happen… we might as well be saying “Josh and Marvin for Bosh an Wade”.
VernC
January 28th, 2011
10:22 am
ForReal: While I would personally pick Bynum, Blake and Granger up from the airport, why would Indiana give away those players to get a 40 year point guard and a bench player? If they do, I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell them.
Why Not..?
January 28th, 2011
11:00 am
Josh Smith
Marvin
Jamal Crawford
to New Jersey
Devin Harris
Troy Murphy
Travis Outlaw
Damion James
to the Hawks
lazydawg
January 28th, 2011
11:01 am
YES!
jack bauer
January 28th, 2011
11:10 am
Smith and this year’s first round pick for Lawson and Nene. Billups isn’t goig anywhere. He’s from Denver and says he’d on accept a trade to LA.
bob
January 28th, 2011
11:46 am
I think we should trade:
Jeff Teague and Pape Sy and a 2nd round pick for Steve Nash and Grant Hill then trade
Marvin Willams and a second round pick for Elton Brand to play center
C-Elton Brand
PF-Al Horford
SF-Josh Smith
SG- Joe Johnson
G-Steve Nash
BENCH
C-Zaza Pachulia or Jason Collins
PW-Grant Hill
SF-Maurice Evans
SG-Jamal Crawford
G-Mike Bibby
thats a tem that chould make it to the all the way
Joe
January 28th, 2011
12:02 pm
2005 NBA Draft
1. Andrew Bogut, MIL
2. Marvin Williams, ATL
3. Deron Williams, UTA
4. Chris Paul, NO
5. Raymond Felton, CHA
The funny things about this draft are that Deron Williams is never mentioned as being overlooked by the Hawks and Felton would have been better than any PG the Hawks have had since.
Tremaine
January 28th, 2011
12:25 pm
Josh Smith for Chancey Billups? Are you crazy. We should be able to get a lot more than Billups. We might be able to get Carmelo and Billups if we give up Josh/Marvin/Bibby.
JustAThought
January 28th, 2011
12:48 pm
How about Josh and Marvin/Teague to the Clippers for Kaman and Curry…..
JeJe
January 28th, 2011
12:57 pm
LOL LD is resting Bibby enough?
BS.
Bibby has had tons of 30+ minute games this year. Dude played 40 at NEW ORLEANS LOL