Wren’s problem: He hasn’t earned benefit of doubt
Here's Troy Glaus looking at a called third strike Wednesday night. He's hitting .203. So much for that experiment.
Frank Wren spent Wednesday at a high school game, coughing from pollen that triggers his allergies. That night, the Braves lost their eighth straight game in St. Louis, coughing from their apparent allergy — the other team.
They can’t hit long. They can’t hit short. Some nights they can’t field. Some nights they forget to tag up. Usually, they can pitch pretty well, although St. Louis hung 10 on them Thursday and there are some nights when Derek Lowe looks like he’s allergic to mounds.
When the Braves broke spring training, they looked like a possible playoff team. Now they have the second-worst record in baseball.
What is Wren doing about it? Nothing. Not trading. Not panicking. Not even twitching. Just waiting for the rain to wash away the pollen.
He will tell you the Braves have the advantage of time. But don’t even baseball time frames get shortened when a team has its longest losing steak since 2006 (the same year this non-playoff string began)?
“You can go from last place to first place pretty quickly this time of year,” he said. “I know everybody is jumping off the ship now. But this is like if the Falcons had played two games. We’ve only played one-eighth of the season.”
The math is accurate. But in the NFL, nobody asks, “When is the last time we lost two in a row?” When losing streaks are being researched, there’s a problem.
The Braves lost Thursday, 10-4. That makes nine straight. One more and marketing is going to have to start including lobster with the all-you-can-eat seats.
Their record is 8-14. They’ve been outscored 16-4 in the last two days. Total offense in the nine losses: 17 runs (including three shutouts).
Wren is preaching patience. If he is having a hard time finding support, it’s because that philosophy carries more weight when the preacher has a resume. The Braves have missed the playoffs four straight seasons. Wren is 0 for 3 since taking over. When the team hit a bump during John Schuerholz’ regime, it was easy to remain calm. Wren hasn’t earned the benefit of the doubt.
The leadoff spot figured to be a problem. It is. Chipper Jones’ health and production figured to be questions. They are. Troy Glaus figured to be a risk. Confirmation received. Nate McLouth, Melky Cabrera – it doesn’t end.
It was easy during the 10-game losing streak in 2006. You could look into the bullpen and say, “Their fault.”
Most of Bobby Cox's problems haven't been on the mound (Derek Lowe notwithstanding).
Now, the problems are everywhere. Every day is a new Bobby Cox lineup. Wednesday included six starters hitting .203 or less. Thursday’s lineup opened with Cabrera and Yunel Escobar, both hitting .197. (The blip is Martin Prado. He has no allergies.)
Wren said he is free to make a trade. He said, “We have some flexibility in our payroll,” though he didn’t quantify that.
“The other factor [in a trade] is how it affects us talent-wise. We have a farm system that we’re carefully stocking. We don’t want to do something that will lessen our ability to compete long term.”
It’s at this point that I mention the name: Mark Teixeira. In 2007, the Braves dealt a boatload of prospects to Texas for Teixeira. They hoped he would turn them into a World Series team. He didn’t. The thought occurs that memories of that deal would dissuade the Braves from making a significant prospects-for-All-Star trade again. (San Diego’s Adrian Gonzalez comes to mind.) But Wren said no.
“The Teixeira trade hasn’t impacted us at all,” he said. “If you look at the players we gave up, I’m not sure it’s had any effect on the major league club. We had Escobar ahead of [Elvis] Andrus at shortstop, we had [Brian] McCann ahead of [Jarrod] Saltalamacchia at catcher, the other guys wouldn’t have made our club. Neftali Feliz would be in our bullpen.”
So you wouldn’t be gun shy?
“No, not at all. We’ll make a trade if we feel it helps us.” But he added he won’t deal a prospect whom he feels can be part of the Braves’ future. That list presumably begins with Freddie Freeman.
It’s the end of April. General managers “tend to look at the quarter-poll,” Wren said. “Mid-May is when you start to get a sense where your club is. Really, June 1 is when you start making decisions.”
The math could work out. But if 8-14 turns into 16-28, just remember how early the cough started.
♦
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548 comments Add your comment
Jeff Schultz
April 29th, 2010
9:34 am
Windfall Profits– No. I think Frank uses John as a sounding board but that’s it. Personnel decisions are Frank’s call.
Intheknow
April 29th, 2010
9:35 am
No mention of the owners and the worst man in baseball… Terry McGuirk? The ATL’s sports writers are giving them a pass, and that in itself is wrong. NO ACCOUNTABILITY given to the this season’s disaster… Terry McGuirk and Liberty Media.
Clay
April 29th, 2010
9:36 am
Yeah Jeff, except for Cashman in NY (with the emphasis on “cash”).
Jeff Schultz
April 29th, 2010
9:36 am
Rough Estimate — I agree that obviously it wouldn’t be a step back, even if not sure how much either has left.
Rough Estimate
April 29th, 2010
9:37 am
Until the Braves add at least $10-15million per year in payroll, they will not be able to consistantly compete with the elite teams in the league and challenge for the post season on a regular basis. Thats it. Bottom Line.
meh
April 29th, 2010
9:38 am
If Wren’s the GM and Schuerholtz is the prez, what exactly does McGuirk do?
Clay
April 29th, 2010
9:40 am
Boys, boys, Wren didn’t trade for Tex, and surely didn’t trade Wainright for Drew.
Rough Estimate
April 29th, 2010
9:40 am
I believe the payroll is estimated at about $85million this year. (The Braves say it is $90+, but they use a different formula than most). That $85 million puts them I think at 15th in MLB. The highest spending team spends $200million and the lowest spending team spending about $40million. That means the Braves are A LOT closer to the bottom end of the payroll spectrum than they are the top.
meh
April 29th, 2010
9:44 am
I think the Tex for Kotchman trade was worse than the trade to get Tex. If Wren thinks thats a fair deal then he obviously has no idead what the heck he’s doing.
meh
April 29th, 2010
9:45 am
I think Wren makes trades to get rid of people he doesn’t want more so than to bring in people he does want.
jod
April 29th, 2010
9:47 am
We got to get rid of the Sink booby cox. He belows.
Halberstram
April 29th, 2010
9:48 am
Wren’s correct about Salty not being ahead of McCann, but everyone knew that back then. He was tried at first a bit, and I understand that didn’t seem like a good idea.
Andrus though would definitely be on the team. He’d be the lead-off hitter right now. Either Yunel or Elvis would have slid over to 2nd base and both could be on the team. That doesn’t even factor in having insurance against Chipper missing games.
Wren’s just trying to cover the trade, I understand though and the fact needs to be remembered that he didn’t make this trade. It was the homeboy upstairs. He wanted a last ditch chance for a WS during his last year. I don’t blame him, and he built up the goodwill for it but it hurt the team a lot.
time for a change
April 29th, 2010
9:49 am
time to fire Cox, come on people get the blinders off….Thank him for his contribution and move on
Richham
April 29th, 2010
9:49 am
The Braves problems go much deeper than just the players and gm. This team is lazy. Bobby Cox is a hall of fame manager, but the days of allowing your players to run the asylum are over. He gives them too much leeway in my opinion. I’m not asking him to bad mouth players in the media, but at some point you have to shake things up a bit.
We didn’t really fill any of our needs, and I’m not certain a major trade would improve things. I would much rather watch some of our young guys come up and get thrown into the fire. It’s funny how we always talk about rushing guys, but the Florida Marlins seem to have a pretty decent track record for running things young and cheap.
This team doesn’t do anything well, except pitch. I would clean house after the season with this entire staff, wren has already worn out his welcome. Focus on pitching and sign one great offensive player and put a bunch of young guys around him, instead of spreading it over the whole team if we have a budget.
PMC
April 29th, 2010
9:50 am
It was actually the “Lyre” Jeff sorry for my inaccuracy. Kind of appropriate though ironically.
PAPOOH
April 29th, 2010
9:50 am
Atlanta sports SUCKS right now, I can’t wait til football season Gooooo FALCONS!!!!!!!
Phil
April 29th, 2010
9:53 am
Schultz,
Do you believe Wren acquired these players(Glaus, Melky) without consulting Cox or getting his approval? I can’t believe that would happen. Cox had to be in on the personnel decisions. If Wren is doing all of this on his own, we need to over throw that idiot and run him out of town.
bvillebaron
April 29th, 2010
9:53 am
As a 50 year Braves’ fan, I am as frustrated as anyone about this current slump. Unfortunately, I think Wren is right. Take a deep breath fans. The team is 21 games into the season. lost 8 in a row and is still only–get this–4 1/2 games out of first place. It is WAY WAY too early to do what many of you are advocating–PANIC. Veteran players such as McLouth, Escobar and even Cabrera and Glaus are not going to continue to hit 100 points under their career norms forever.
What does concern me is what I perceive to be a lack of leadership and focus on the part of the team. Lately, they look like zombies in the field and at the bat. I think Cox should have retired one year sooner. He gets applauded for being a “player’s manager”, but that only works when you have the right players who will respond to that style and play hard without being pushed. I found Cox’s comment after Escobar’s failure to tag up the other day that if that happened in his day a player who made that mistake would have been shipped out [to the minors]. What does he do? Put him in the lineup the next day. I don’t know if Escobar has any options left, but if he did, sending him to the minors for a couple weeks would have, in my opinion, sent a loud message to both him and the rest of the team. Sometimes when a manager has been around as long as Cox, the players stop listening and take things for granted. Unfortunately, that’s how it looks to me.
I also agree with some of you who feel that it’s time to get a new hitting coach. On balance, I don’t know that TP is doing a bad job. In fact, he proabably is giving the underachievers good advice which they aren’t heeding. It is disturbing, however, that Francoeur asked the then Texas and now Cubs hitting coach to help him in the offseason without letting TP know. You can be saying all of the right things, but if the message isn’t getting through, then maybe you need to find another messenger (i.e. communicator).
This team needs something to get it going and since as the old saying goes, you can’t fire all of the players, and they sure as heck aren’t going to fire Cox in his swan song season, perhaps firing TP would serve as both a wake up call and bring a different voice into the equation. Just my two cents folks.
Matt
April 29th, 2010
9:53 am
Right now this team is playing like most of us realistic fans figured they would. No leadoff hitter, no power bat, no speed, no true 3 hole hitter (sorry but look at the other 3 hole hitters in MLB, Chipper doesn’t fit that mold). This team is not built to win.
It’s a shame because this is a deep rotation that is being wasted.
asheville dawg
April 29th, 2010
9:56 am
The season started with a bunch of “ifs”:if Chipper doesn’t get hurt, if Glaus works out at first, if Melky hits ok, if Lowe returns to form, if Kawakami improves if McClouth plays like we think he can. Now that’s 6 strikes and we’re out. Another month of this and we say so long Bobby, wish you had some talant to work with. Damon looks like a trigger that should have been pulled.
paul
April 29th, 2010
9:56 am
This made my day –
“It was easy during the 10-game losing streak in 2006. You could look into the bullpen and say, “It’s that fat pig, Bob Wickman’s fault.”
Jason
April 29th, 2010
9:56 am
The Braves have some serious offensive development issues. How many good, fundamental hitters have the Braves developed and produced over the past 10 years? I believe the minor league hitting instruction must be poor, Terry Pendleton is not doing a very good job, and Bobby’s ‘play for the 3 run HR’ passive offensive mentality are all contributing factors. Gant, Justice, Galarragga, & Sheffield are all gone, as is the Launching Pad, yet Bobby has never adjusted. Wren’s biggest challenge will be to improve our offensive instruction and strategy if we’re ever going to contend for the postseason or World Series again, with our very restrictive payroll. He needs to clean house and bring in a fresh face as manager next year, with an aggressive offensive approach and good hitting coaches. The steroid era is over, sound fundamental hitting and utilizing speed is crucial now. It’s up to Wren to recognize this and to get our offensive system turned around, top to bottom.
Clay
April 29th, 2010
9:56 am
Yeah, Rough Estimate, but the Braves attendance in ‘09 was also 15th. So the spending seems to correlate with income.
Paddy
April 29th, 2010
9:57 am
The Braves have always had great scouts and information on opposing players. This years team tells me they are not listening to them or not following their suggestions. Couple that with a mid-range budget and what you see is what you get in 2010. Patience will not fix poor hitters!
The Future
April 29th, 2010
9:58 am
This is frightening: The Braves have almost $30million/year commited to Chipper & D. Lowe for 2011 & 2012. That is 1/3 of their total payroll! Those two salaries for declining, past-their-prime, aging, former stars will handcuff the Braves until 2013. Who gave out those contracts? – FRANK WREN.
Phil
April 29th, 2010
9:59 am
Like someone else said, pretty soon Turner Field will look like the Marlins stadium, nothing but empty seats. Maybe that’s the best way to send a message.
Tech Suck
April 29th, 2010
9:59 am
Same old Braves.
1) Don’t go after any good hitters every year because you don’t want to pay them.
2) Bring in retreads on the cheap whose best days are many years behind them and hope they resemble their former selves (this has never worked).
3) Let your best players go for nothing. Letting Vasquez go was just idiotic.
Signing Lowe, idiotic.
Rough Estimate
April 29th, 2010
10:00 am
Clay – I think you have to spend and show that you are serious about winning before you will see attendance increase. Bring in some big name free agents and the people will come. Nobody wants to come to Turner Field to see Troy Glaus!
Brave Fan
April 29th, 2010
10:01 am
Put the pitcher in the lead off spot. He couldn’t do any worse and then you get him ot of the way.
lazydawg
April 29th, 2010
10:02 am
Not Frank’s fault now but if we keep Terry around much longer it will be. First of all I don’t believe TP should be the hitting coach ,I have never seen improvement with any player has been turned over to him.
Ralph Garr
April 29th, 2010
10:02 am
Wow look what Kelly Johnson’s doing for the D-Backs. Freed from the burden of of playing for the Braves he’s killing it. I’m afraid to see what LaRoach is doing. Wainwright tonight… It’s a curse. even when we had SmoltzGlavineMaddox we didn’t support them, with the bats, with the fans in the stands. Gotta wonder how deflated the team was when they had that big early-season series at home against the Phillies and more people showed up for a Hawks game.
EW
April 29th, 2010
10:02 am
Why save our “flexibility” in the payroll for AFTER we stink it up. Then when you make a move and it doesn’t lead to a turnaround Wren looks dumb again??? No Frank, the truth is you tried to make this team competitive on the cheap because you are a businessman at heart and the powers that be won’t let us spend to win. If we have flexibility as he claims we would have used it to build the best roster for 162 games. This is a resounding problem with the Hawks, Braves, and Thrashers. The Falcons are the exception, Blank CARES about winning, takes losing personally, and is willing to put his a$$ (that’s his rear end and dollars) on the line to make it happen. There’s a reason that we see Blank on the sidelines but can’t even name the owner’s of the Atlanta [lack of] Spirit Group.
Rough Estimate
April 29th, 2010
10:02 am
Tech Suck – you are pretty much right on the money. They Braves have never spent big on hitters, or even traded for any that they kept more than 1/2 a season. The lone exceptions – Fred McGriff & Gary Sheffield.
Jeff Schultz
April 29th, 2010
10:02 am
Phil — I’m sure there was consultation between Wren and Cox.
But that’s a fuzzy area.
Cox could’ve responded anything from, “I love Troy Glaus!” to, “Are you sure that’s the best we can do Frank? Really? Well, OK.”
See what I mean?
But Wren is not going to acquire players without talking to his manager ahead of time.
Mark McGwire
April 29th, 2010
10:02 am
Hire me as manager. I’ll get those boys hitting in no time, one way or another . . .
Scrotie McBoogerballs
April 29th, 2010
10:03 am
Crappy Braves fans should jump on Tampa Bay’s, oops I mean St. Pete’s bandwagon and pretend to be Rays fans.
EW
April 29th, 2010
10:03 am
If Pendelton is the new manager next year I’m officially a Devil Rays fan.
Jeff Schultz
April 29th, 2010
10:03 am
Thanks Paul. It had been too long since a Bob Wickman joke. … A Dan Kolb joke could be just around the corner.
Realist
April 29th, 2010
10:05 am
Couldn’t agree more with this headline. When Frank Wren dumped all over John Smoltz last year, my first thought was, “You may be right, but John Smoltz has won 14 division titles in Atlanta, and you haven’t won any. So maybe you oughtta think twice about the way you handle this.”
Rough Estimate
April 29th, 2010
10:05 am
Is Greg Norton available? Even he would be an improvement at this point
GM
April 29th, 2010
10:05 am
everyone is blaming wren, BUT…
if melky was in other team he would have 3 HRS, 265 ave
kawakami would have record 2-2
glaus would be hitting in the 3 spot and had 5 hrs
nate would be the old nate like when he was in pirates uniform
lowe would be better that what he is now.
heyward would be hitting 7th or 8th more relaxed.
if we had neftali as our closer we would have saved 7 mill in wagner and probably kept laroche.
EVERY ONE PLAYS BETTER OUT OF ATLANTA…
EW
April 29th, 2010
10:07 am
GM, nobody’s complaining about Wagner, I actually think he was a good addition..he’s a veteran lefty throwing 95 and has looked good…if he had any games to save we’d be singing his praises.
Skeezix
April 29th, 2010
10:07 am
Jeff: The quickest way for the Braves to restore confidence and boost the moral of us long term fans would be to fire Wren and for JS to step back in and start cleaning this mess up.
Phil
April 29th, 2010
10:08 am
Thanks Schultz,
That was my thinking also. A lot of people on here blame Wren for everything. Although I agree he is a clown, I think it was a group decision and Cox was in on it.
This is where I believe the next manager can help. He can perhaps give the opposing point of view and help guide Wren to some better alternatives.
Roto Rooter
April 29th, 2010
10:09 am
Jeff, great article. The most important and truthful thing you said was, Frank Wren has not EARNED the benefit of the doubt. Until he earns that trust he has to understand he NEEDS to do something soon to shake this team up because the reverse of “If it ain’t broke why fix it” is the Atlanta Braves.
Roy Hobbs
April 29th, 2010
10:09 am
Kelly Johnson: .286, 8 HR; Adam LaRoche: .270, 2 HR; Jeff Francoeur, .278, 3 HR.
Maybe we need a hitting coach and a GM.
escobar
April 29th, 2010
10:10 am
escobar, nate, melky, chipper, brian, heyward, they all going to hit against houston and gain confidence, and there we gon on the road again, for 10 brutal games, i know whasington was going to be a far better team than last year.
Clay
April 29th, 2010
10:10 am
The Future, that is disheartning, but if Wren hadn’t extended Chipper’s contract, he woulda been strung up in ATL, especially with Chipper batting about .400 at the time.
One other thing about Glaus. I don’t think Wren tells Bobby to keep putting him in the 5 spot every game (or Chipper in the 3) while we’re all waiting for them to start hitting. Or even to start him everyday. These are Bobby’s lineups.
jod
April 29th, 2010
10:12 am
What about Kolb and not being able to hit the broad side of a barn?
Skeezix
April 29th, 2010
10:13 am
The analogy to Bagdhad Bob–the former Iraqi press secretary for Saddam–is very close to the truth. Had me laughing at a sad situation….Thanks!