Hawks’ talent means nothing without heart, intelligence
When Carlos Delfino is celebrating, you know things aren't going well for Joe Johnson and the Hawks. (Milwaukee Journal Sentinel)
When a decidedly more talented team suddenly loses consecutive games to an opponent that has less size, less skill and it was assumed less hope for postseason survival, there really are only two possibilities:
– The better team is not playing as hard as it should.
– The better team is not playing as smart as it should.
Everything else is window dressing.
For most of their first two playoff games against Milwaukee, the Hawks had us wondering how high their ceiling was. For the next two games, they reminded us where the floor is. It’s one thing to lose game three. It’s another to trail, 31-13, 10 minutes into the game. It’s one thing not to sweep the undermanned and Munchkin-like Bucks in the first round. It’s another to keep suffering brain cramps, go weak at the knees every time they walk into an opponent’s arena and lose twice.
Despite 53 wins, the Hawks have not been universally embraced in Atlanta. This is why. If they want to be viewed as something special, this would be a good time to present a counter-argument to what so many are saying about them. They drift in and out of consciousness. They get outworked. They get outplayed. They get outcoached.
Brandon Jennings may be a rookie, but he can keep count. (Milwaukee Journal Sentinel)
Know what athletes hate hearing more than anything else? That they have no heart. Imagine how that accusation stings when it comes from another former athlete.
Chris Webber nailed it. He was in studio on TNT’s NBA wrap-up show Monday night. The panel was discussing the significance of the Hawks’ consecutive losses in Milwaukee. When somebody pointed out that their regular season record had improved every year, Webber chimed in.
“The size of your heart doesn’t show up on paper,” he said.
When the remark was relayed to Joe Johnson Tuesday, he didn’t dispute it. Fact is, he amplified on it.
“It’s true — it doesn’t show up on paper,” he said. “We haven’t played with that [heart]. We complain and whine too much and it gets you nowhere, instead of just going out and fighting through it. Whatever they do to us, do it back to them. Instead, we just complain to the refs. It’s not like they’re going to change the call. So you might as well just get back on D and keep playing.”
This isn’t the regular season. Fifty-three wins is so yesterday. The Hawks have evolved to the point that their season should be defined by playoffs, not a big win over the Celtics in January.
Look around the Eastern Conference. Orlando swept Charlotte. Cleveland and Boston won their respective series in five games.
The Hawks? They’re looking at this implausible string of words: must-win against the Bucks.
Lose game five at Philips Arena and they go back to Milwaukee facing possibly elimination Friday. Outside of Atlanta, they have been playoff road kill the last three years: 1-10. They can win. They should win. But what about the last two games gives you confidence?
Johnson again: “We don’t play with the same energy and the passion as we do at home. It kills us, man. I thought we had passed this step of immaturity on the road, but we haven’t.”
At 2-0, they thought they were the new Hawks. At 2-2, they realize they’re frighteningly close to the old Hawks.
“I’m surprised,” Johnson said. “I just think we got a little bit ahead of ourselves. We took care of business the first two games and we all thought we were going to go up there and do the same.”
Johnson said after game four, “It seems like we just don’t have the toughness.”
Josh Smith said Tuesday that if he were a fan watching the Hawks, he would think, “That we’re a team that’s still growing and we still have a lot to learn.”
They were supposed to be past this.
♦
Earlier posts
♦ Report: Mike Woodson could leave Hawks for Sixers
♦ Countdown: L.T.’s boozy draft, Ben’s brain, NHL ‘extraction’
♦
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128 comments Add your comment
"Chef" Tim Dix
April 27th, 2010
4:04 pm
first.
There, I said it.
Hawk n the Ham
April 27th, 2010
4:05 pm
Problem #1. Woody and his switching defense, and no adjustments.
Problem #2. No real vocal leader on this team to motivate the players.
Bat Masterson
April 27th, 2010
4:07 pm
Sad
Delbert D.
April 27th, 2010
4:08 pm
It’s just embarrassing.
Tech75
April 27th, 2010
4:18 pm
None of these players should be considered youngsters anymore. They’ve all been in the league several years.
No more excuses, no more of this “we’re young and still learning” crap.
They’re just lazy.
PMC
April 27th, 2010
4:19 pm
They just need to regroup realize they have home court for a reason and start playing harder for the WHOLE GAME. No need to beat themselves up. Just go win this series like they know they can. They just have to put it toegther the whole night. Whatever it takes to make Marvin play agressively do that.
Josh
April 27th, 2010
4:32 pm
I read the title and it summed up what my problem has been with this team the whole season. I would say good article, but I don’t need to read it.
Loc
April 27th, 2010
4:35 pm
Can any of you at the AJC ask Marvin how he feels about being considered such a bust by everybody in the country? Does it not drive him to at least be a serviceable NBA player? He is such a pathetic disgrace. No passion, no athleticism, no drive, nothing. Just a complete and utter bust. The Ghost of Billy Knight will haunt us even longer now that Sund has locked him up through 2014.
Dozer
April 27th, 2010
4:36 pm
Josh Smith is a tease. He runs his mouth on a non-issue (excitement in Milwaukee???) like a he’s a superstar, then goes out a plays small to back it up. He doesn’t take over games, he doesn’t dominate, especially on the road.
This team is a tease – they give you just enough to get excited, and then hit us with the cold reality that they don’t have what it takes to gain the kind of credibility and support they think they deserve.
They will probably beat the Bucks, but what’s the difference?? Is there anyone out there who really thinks they can beat Orlando 4 out of 7? Cleveland?? get real…..
WOODY'S EYBROW'S
April 27th, 2010
4:40 pm
we are done stick a fork in us
Rock Preston
April 27th, 2010
4:41 pm
Woody’s got to go!!! Go!!
Jeff D.
April 27th, 2010
4:41 pm
One guy who fired this team up was Flip Murray. He’s gone. Two more games like last night and we’re gone. It’s such a bad sign when the face of the franchise is saying pubicly “It seems like we just don’t have the toughness.” If you go back to last year’s playoffs, Joe made similar comments. I love this group of guys but they still have a long way to go.
Lloyd
April 27th, 2010
4:42 pm
Sadly this is a most accurate summation of the Hawks and their misgivings. Hopefully they’ll get it together, however, with the inconsistencies they’ve shown, they’ll get swept by Orlando without the Magic even realizing they were in a playoff series.
TMC
April 27th, 2010
4:43 pm
An embarrassment is an understatement. Anyone who follows the Hawks can see how they play down to lesser opponents, coward to the Elite teams and have zero passion on the road. No floor general to inspire the team and poor coaching leads to us being tied in a series with the Bucks. NO MORE EXCUSES!!
PlusSizeModel
April 27th, 2010
4:44 pm
It also means nothing without a coach who doesn’t appear to be a mouth breathing moron.
As an aside: Mike Woodson and Chris Dimino…separated at birth?
WOODY'S EYBROW'S
April 27th, 2010
4:44 pm
cav’s and who in the finals doesn’t matter Lebron gets his title and shaq passes Kobe in titles won don’t you think . I was hoping we would take orlando to 7 games but now i hope we take the bucks to 7 , you can understand 1 loss to an inferior team but two with at least three guaranteed come on !!!!!!!!
Ethan Benoff
April 27th, 2010
4:47 pm
I have always said it on this blog and I will say it again…Josh Smith has to go… yeah he can fill up a stat sheet but he can’t fill up a hand with championship rings. Tell me Joe Johnson was not calling him out… I dare you..JK. Were an emotionally inmature squad packed full of talent, but where is our K.G.? We don’t have one player that can pull the team aside and do a player only huddle on the court and talk some sense into our players. One on one pull up contested jump shooting ain’t going to get it done…it never has! Bye, bye Woody! Now I know why the team has not offered you a new contract… you can’t win on the road and you have clue how to maximize the talent of your ball club!
Clay
April 27th, 2010
4:47 pm
What’s embarrassing, Delbert, is hearing Woody in the huddle when he gets “miked.” He is just terrible in tight games. Scott Skiles is leaving Woody in the dust.
If the coaches could trade teams for one game, the Hawks would win by 20.
Jeff D.
April 27th, 2010
4:49 pm
Loc,
Let’s face it, everybody looks good at home. Calling Marvin a bust is easy to say based on where he was drafted. If we snagged him in the 2nd or 3rd round we’d call him a nice piece. A complete and utter bust? Come on! Marvin is a good fit for this team. He’s just one piece of the puzzle.
Loc
April 27th, 2010
4:53 pm
Marvin doesn’t even look good at home. If you know anything about basketball, you can watch him and realize he is no better than a 9th or 10th man on a good team. He cannot put the ball on the floor, can’t rebound efffectively, can’t defend anybody with quickness, can’t hit a shot unless he is completely set, etc. etc. etc. He cannot pass, he turns the ball over as soon as you ask him to dribble, he is clueless as to where to go with the ball when it is in his hands.
To make matters worse, he celebrates as if he is a beast any time he gets a wide open dunk. He is pathetic and will never be a piece to any NBA puzzle.
hawkfan
April 27th, 2010
5:02 pm
Joe Johnson:
““It’s true — it doesn’t show up on paper,” he said. “We haven’t played with that [heart]. We complain and whine too much and it gets you nowhere, instead of just going out and fighting through it. Whatever they do to us, do it back to them. Instead, we just complain to the refs. It’s not like they’re going to change the call. So you might as well just get back on D and keep playing.”
Translation:
“This team is soft and does not have what it takes to go all the way. I am not resigning with the Hawks as I am better off playing somewhere else after this season is over.”
Jeff D.
April 27th, 2010
5:21 pm
Loc, let’s agree to disagree but if Marvin wasn’t playing here he’d be in a rotation somewhere getting 20min plus a game. What did the man do to you? Jeez…
Mr. Turnip-Green Jeans
April 27th, 2010
5:26 pm
These Hawks showed many times during the season that they have no heart. Champions lay it on the line EVERY game, leaving nothing on the court. Hawks beat-up on a good team, then think it’s OK to NOT show-up for a bad one. This is not how championship-caliber teams behave.
This particular team will never win a championship, even if were together 100-years. It would NEVER happen. EVER.
jsch0602
April 27th, 2010
5:26 pm
Or, the better team is not really the better team.
F-105 Thunderchief
April 27th, 2010
5:32 pm
This is like watching the pre-Moses Sixers or the Fratello Hawks. Darn.
F-105 Thunderchief
April 27th, 2010
5:32 pm
Yes, I’m old. Shut up.
Jeff Schultz
April 27th, 2010
5:44 pm
Loc — Marvin was asked the “Chris Paul” question a million times in his first two seasons. No sense in keeping asking him since it’s not his fault he was drafted over CP.
Ethan Benoff
April 27th, 2010
5:45 pm
I can’t believe you guys are even wasting your time writing on Marvin Williams. He’s not even relevant to the conversation about our losing patterns. Woody’s got 2 go!
Jeff Schultz
April 27th, 2010
5:45 pm
Jeff D — I liked Flip a lot. At one time during Miami series last year I remember Dwyane Wade seeing he was their best player in series.
Ethan Benoff
April 27th, 2010
5:46 pm
Who deserves more playing time… Marvin Williams or Jason Collins??
FIRST
April 27th, 2010
5:52 pm
SHUT UP WITH THE “FIRST CRAP” ITS ANNOYING AS HELL. WHO CARES YOU POSTED FIRST?
Jeff D.
April 27th, 2010
5:56 pm
Flip was all business, gave 100% all the time.
Ethan Benoff, are you serious? Jason is an insurance policy. Break glass in case of total disaster only.
"Chef" Tim Dix
April 27th, 2010
5:56 pm
Heart has been replaced by process, intelligence replaced by going to the next level.
Whatver happened to, at any level, anything but the ultimate prize making you first loser?
What is this, saturday morning soccer mom stuff?
WOODY IS AWFUL
April 27th, 2010
6:11 pm
It’s clear that Woody has got to go at this point! He makes ZERO in-game adjustments and just keeps doing the same crap over and over. How many times are you going to use this switching defense where Jennings ends up going against one of our bigs like Horford or Zaza and then just drives to the lane for a layup or dish to an open man? I mean i must have seen this over and over in last night’s game. Woody is the worst coach in the Playoffs right now easily. He gets credit for improving the win total each year but it’s actually attributed to the talent on the team getting older and better each year not his coaching. We need a real coach in here to design an offensive gameplan and an actual defense. The Iso Joe’s and switching defense is awful and will never work. Get a clue you bald moron..
bowman
April 27th, 2010
6:23 pm
Hard for me to get excited about this subject. It’s not as if the playoff results are revealing something new about this team. Hopefully I won’t have to write this again in a few weeks: Tone at the top prepares the Hawks to play with heart, to start each game with intensity and to reach their individual and collective potential. Mike Woodson fails to establish a consistent, and certainly not a championship, tone at the top. Nothing changes until this position within the organization changes.
I remain undecided whether the Hawks will be better with or without Joe Johnson. That said, I think Johnson goes (looking for the chance of getting a champion ring) if Woodson stays. Johnson knows what Woodson brings in the leadership role, and it isn’t enough to honestly think a championship is possible.
bowman
–
“Art will always be Art.” – Goethe
Jeff D.
April 27th, 2010
6:44 pm
Quick poll:
1. Are you a Hawk fan win or lose?
OR
2. Are you a fan that will only support a successful Hawks product?
The Sarge
April 27th, 2010
6:49 pm
As they always said in the Marines, “Ability without effort ain’t gonna win any wars” . . . just saying.
Dawgs2010
April 27th, 2010
6:49 pm
Marvin Williams is the biggest draft bust since Adam Keefe.
Jeff D.
April 27th, 2010
6:50 pm
1.
Bad
April 27th, 2010
7:01 pm
If Mr. Soft himself, Chris Webber is saying it, you know it has to be bad.
moorman
April 27th, 2010
7:18 pm
the hawks were FINISHED waaaaaaay back when a GROUP of investors bought the team. FIRST MISTAKE. i knew it then. it may SOUND irrevelant to whats going on, but its THE ISSUE. the group of investors couldnt buy the team without each other, thus, the hawks have NEVER had a single voice making the critical decisions: who to hire as coach. team philosophy, general manager, who to draft, who to trade for. all that is run thru ownership, general manager notwithstanding. that was the start of the hawks problems. its reflected on the court. no team philosophy or direction. the hawks when because THEY COULDNT HELP but win with all their appearances in the lottery. the FIRST step in turning this mess around was rick sund signing jamal crawford. thats the ONLY move ive seen the hawks make under the spirit ownership that looked like a top team elite management move. until the hawks get NEW OWNERSHIP who isnt afraid to open up the purse (braves) and get let sund (keep him) get his players and coach, things will remain the same.
TheAntiMe
April 27th, 2010
7:27 pm
Okay, are or Atlanta Hawks once again making things much more interesting than they really should be? Of course they are. They are, after all, still the Hawks. However, this may not be such a bad thing in the long run.
I, for one, believe that it is just possible that once the Hawks get into the next round with Orlando, that they just may be able to take something from the way the undermanned Bucks scrapped against them in this series.
Maybe, the Hawks can embrace their roles as the under-classed underdogs against the Magic and use that to their advantage the way those deer heads have been able to do to them so far. As we all know, against the Magic they will need any advantage they can get, psychological, or otherwise.
After all, there are at least 4 NFL teams every year that motivate themselves by going on and on about how nobody respected them so they have something to prove. Get this series over and become Rocky of the 2010 NBA playoffs from that point forward.
TheAntiMe
April 27th, 2010
7:40 pm
Jason is an insurance policy. Break glass in case of total disaster only.
lol – Thanks, Jeff D., you just reminded me of a very funny joke by Chris Rock of which I can only say the puch line:
In case of emergency, break glass.
TheAntiMe
April 27th, 2010
7:43 pm
I can say the punch line, I just can’t spell the freaking word. Oh well, it still made me laugh.
Not Don Waddell
April 27th, 2010
7:56 pm
Could Joe be pointing those comments any more directly as Josh “Mush-mouth” Smith? I wish Joe would just come out and say Josh’s name directly. Smith’s childishness is what is holding this team back.
sansho1
April 27th, 2010
8:08 pm
“Bad” is right on the money. Not that Webber is wrong, but the “soft” accusation is a laugh coming from him.
That said, softness isn’t the only reason the Hawks are struggling — it’s not even the most important reason. We can’t defend the point. We switch because Bibby is a cadaver and Crawford is a matador. We also lack a ballhandler in the halfcourt offense. Yeah, Joe and Jamal can shake themselves free off the dribble, but that’s not the same as breaking down the defense via penetration.
Marvin isn’t much, but he’s largely irrelevant. We lack a point guard in a point guard league. That’s the problem.
shane
April 27th, 2010
8:10 pm
Joe Smith should have kept his mouth shut.
shane
April 27th, 2010
8:11 pm
I meant Josh
Jeff D.
April 27th, 2010
8:15 pm
Dawgs2010, Adam Keefe is really lowering the bar. He averaged 5ppg and 4rpg. You don’t think Marvin will finish his career with higher numbers? Please!
Jeff D.
April 27th, 2010
8:21 pm
TheAntiMe, Thanks. Hey, as Zaza said “Nothing easy.”
fratello
April 27th, 2010
8:25 pm
The Hawks Stink
JASon
April 27th, 2010
8:30 pm
Do me a favor and look at the stats from game 4. We lost the game at the free throw line. I saw the game and the hawks fought hard against a bunch of chumps with wonderful acting skills. The refs game them this game. Joe Johnson is also a chump; “complaining” about what?! Has he ever seen a celtics game or a lakers game? This team was screwed, and you’re criticizing your own guys for complaining? Don’t let the door hit you, Joe, you suck. Learn to be a leader you chump
Lenny Wilkins
April 27th, 2010
8:33 pm
I’m willing to come back if the price is right.
Loc
April 27th, 2010
9:49 pm
Both Jeff’s, it’s not that Marvin doesn’t play like a number 2 pick that bothers me. We all know he will never live up to that. It’s the fact that he has not improved one bit since his rookie year and actually regressed this year.
He is not even worthy over the 2nd pick in the 2nd round playing like this. Yes it’s not his fault he was picked #2 by the moron Billy Knight, nor is it his fault that Sund made the idiotic move to sign him for 5 more seasons when nobody else offered anything close.
Still, he has been useless all season and so inconsistent it is disturbing. If I at least saw consistent heart and hustle, it’d be easier to handle, but he has been coasting all year and it’d be nice for the ATL media to call him out more consistently.
Weezin&Wuzin
April 27th, 2010
9:57 pm
Hawks need to use these next 2-3 games to really get their game together while Orlando rusts. Then bam, we steal one in Orl and on to the Conf Finals. boo yah!
LouFan
April 27th, 2010
10:23 pm
Heart? How can this team have heart? Lack of a captain, lack of a coach, and a PG who hates the NBA (Bibby). At the end of the day, we are fans and need to support them. Yet, we need to see the limitations and accept them. Nothing really… that we can do than hope the organization makes the right decisions. If not I will still enjoy watching this team…. And the wins will mean so much more. Even if we only get 30 next year.
IlliniDawg
April 27th, 2010
10:27 pm
I’m so sick of our pathetic excuses for basketball and hockey teams. I’d like both franchises shipped out of town. Maybe then we could get an MLS franchise. At least we would tap into a different fan base, and perhaps over time we could erase the painful memories of two very sorry, very embarrassing, very pathetic excuses for professional sports in our home town. And, maybe most importantly, we wouldn’t have to put up with all of the damn Yankees that come and cheer for their visiting team and make jokes about ours.
Jerome
April 27th, 2010
10:57 pm
Would you rather the Hawks lose to a inferior team the Bucks – or embarrass by the Magics? Think about it.
Not Drinking the Kool-Aid
April 27th, 2010
11:05 pm
I have been a Hawks fan since I moved here in 1999 and was a ‘Nique fan long before that. I really feel the real problem is Mike Bibby should not have been resigned in the summer. Everyone has to cover for his deficiencies on defense. Thus the switching defense that negates the solid team defense the Hawks play at times during the regular season. Anyone who knows basketball knows that basketball is a game of momentum, with no defensive stops teams lose confidence and thus you have Marvin who is stagnant on offense, you have Josh standing around looking like he is lost sometimes and getting in Joe’s way. The team is constantly trying to make up for Bibby’s defensive ineptitudes, he is slow and cannot defend. Woodson who has done a decent job with improving the team is to blame. Jeff Teague should have been developed this season for the playoffs. Bibby is an utter liability on the court, if not for his 3’s he should never touch the floor. The team works very hard on defense at times but Bibby’s man can score anyway. I think this disheartens the team and confuses them on offense at times. Joe likes to lead by playing hard letting his play speak to his team mates. I think Joe gets bogged down with his teammates standing around stagnant and defenses cheating to him. Look at other teams in the playoffs they have players who can take you off the dribble and score usually at the point guard spot. Teague has this ability, Woody never developed him this season thus all of the problems you see. Josh passing from the top of the key sometimes wildly and getting in Joe’s way, Marvin standing around and not being involved, overworking on defense stagnates the offense, not enough pick and roll, not enough post play, not enough steals that leads to not enough fast breaks – the life blood of these Hawks. This is Woodson’s fault, Teague should have been developed. I would hire Avery Johnson or Byron Scott both point guards and defensive coaches could easily take this team to the finals. The playoffs magnify whatever deficiences teams have, there are no bad coaches in the playoffs. Thanks Woody for the wins I hope you learned your lesson from your time with the Hawks. So long good luck on your next job!!!!!
@ReanuKeeves
April 27th, 2010
11:19 pm
Can you imagine what this team could do if it wasn’t hog-tied by Mike Woodson’s ineptitude?
I went to games 1 and 2 and have been to nearly every home playoff game since we started making the postseason again. But I won’t be attending another until they win a road playoff game. SHAMEFUL.
@ReanuKeeves
April 27th, 2010
11:26 pm
“Calling Marvin a bust is easy to say based on where he was drafted. If we snagged him in the 2nd or 3rd round we’d call him a nice piece.” – Joe D.
Saying Rosie O’Donnell is ugly is easy based on her level of attractiveness! If you compare her to Whoopie Goldberg and a rotting corpse, she’s a nice piece.
Who needs logic and reason, anyway?
Reid Adair
April 27th, 2010
11:31 pm
For as well as the Hawks played in the first two games against the Bucks, they’ve played about as poorly as possible in the last two. You summed it up perfectly, Jeff. It comes down to two simple things – heart and intelligence.
Orlando awaits the winner of this series, and there are at least two more games to be played. A lack of heart and intelligence against the Magic (assuming the Hawks advance) will result in a 4-0 sweep.
david
April 27th, 2010
11:37 pm
No defense, the most boring predictable offense and a coach that can’t adjust. The only time we win is when our team wins strictly off talent. Never motivated not even for the playoffs. WE WILL have a different coach next year. This team just doesn’t get it that if you play great defense it will kick in the offense. The O feeds off the D. That’s what great teams do. This team plays horrible D unless at home some of the time. Seems like the coach playing under Knight and coaching under Brown would get that. Watch them on D. Absolutely pitiful effort. And then on offense, so incredibly easy for a good coach to defend.
Youth
April 27th, 2010
11:42 pm
The team is still young—it will take a few years to play together and get an identity. Maybe atlanta can get dwayne next year and ramp it up.
Jeff D.
April 28th, 2010
12:14 am
LouFan, Bibby hates the NBA? What? I wasn’t aware of his desire to be part of the Rio Grande Valley Vipers in the D-League.
Mike
April 28th, 2010
12:19 am
Bucks Fan Here – love reading fans rip their team. With Bogut, Hawks would be down 3-1; without Bogut Hawks will lose in six. Bye Bye Atlanta.
Loc
April 28th, 2010
12:23 am
Also Jeff D, there is no such thing as a 3rd round in the NBA draft. That kind of shows the knowledge you possess.
Loc
April 28th, 2010
12:24 am
Marvin would still be pathetic, as an early second round pick. He provides next to nothing besides an inconsistent spot up jumper, and decent defense.
Kevin
April 28th, 2010
12:25 am
mike, u wont win in atlanta thats just the reality
LouFan
April 28th, 2010
12:26 am
@Jeff D.
Heh. After that travesty of the Lakers vs Sacramento bs in 2002. He has never been the same. All he cares is about money, I do not blame him.
Kevin
April 28th, 2010
12:27 am
To those that get on to us fans at bashing the hawks heart and effort and calling for heads just because the lakers struggled on the road. Well the lakers have won how many championships?? The lakers have to fight themselves to stay motivated. How many championships have the hawks won?? There should be no problem being motivated as an atlanta hawk player. It makes me sick to see… I was going to go watch the game tomorrow but I thought if they are not giving effort then why should I give effort to ride an hour and a half from columbus to watch them. They show me some effort and win this series and I will be at every home game in the orlando series.
LouFan
April 28th, 2010
12:32 am
@Kevin
You are wrong. A fan always supports their team. I will be there cheering there. Even though I have my discrepancies towards the leadership I will always be there. At least they are in the playoffs. Only 16 teams can say that.
Greg
April 28th, 2010
12:35 am
These Bucks fans crack me up. They are by far the worst team in the playoffs…that’s why Hawks fans are in such an uproar about losing two games to them. Yet they act like they have a good team….a good team in the D-league.
Jeff D.
April 28th, 2010
12:37 am
@ReanuKeeves, folks like to use the term “bust” for 1st round picks that don’t work out. A couple examples from football come to mind: Akili Smith and David Klingler. They didn’t pan out. After a few short stops for coffee, their professional careers came to an end. They didn’t have it, period. Marvin Williams on the other hand is not failing in this league. He is an NBA player and his contract was extended. If he wasn’t playing here he’d be playing somewhere else in the NBA. See the difference? Marvin is playing, the other two are not.
truthspitter
April 28th, 2010
12:48 am
Marvin is a bust without a doubt. Marvin Williams shows how stupid the Hawks management is the old saying goes, fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice shame on me, shame on the stupid ass Hawks for re-signing this “BUST”
Dr. Warren
April 28th, 2010
12:52 am
The OK Thunder are what the Hawks should be. OK’s growth in 2 years has exceeded the Hawks’ growth in 6 years.
Jeff D.
April 28th, 2010
12:53 am
Loc, good catch. My mistake. Look at this draft. http://www.thedraftreview.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=2344&Itemid=103 How many of these guys are not even in the league?
Big Ray
April 28th, 2010
1:04 am
The Hawks will be a different team at home, or they won’t.
The playoffs are a proving ground. Win this series in six games, or this cannot be counted as an improvement over last year. Getting to the second round presents a whole different situation. Whoever they play (assuming they beat the Bucks) will have homecourt advantage, which spells doom for the Hawks unless they learn to win on the road.
We can only hope that they continue to play UP to the higher competition. Winning a couple games in the second round is somewhat of an improvement over last year’s 2nd round debacle, but is it improvement overall?
At some point, you can stop blaming Joe Johnson’s teammates for everything, though that is part of the problem. There is a lack of leadership, clearly. There is a lack of offensive production from some starters on one end of the floor, and a lack of defensive production on the other end, and inconsistency overall.
Our point guard can’t defend his own position, so we switch all the time. That works until teams figure out how to beat it (assuming they have the necessary personnel with the necessary skill set) and then our man-to-man deficiencies are exposed.
On offense, we don’t have good team ball consistently. The team needs to have ball movement, along with personnel movement, as its base offense. Put the ball in the hands of our two high scoring guards and one post player when teams shut off the ball movement. Instead, we shut off the ball movement early, and resort to the ISOs, then wonder why the scoring droughts.
And I’m supposed to believe that coaching has nothing to do with this?
Look, either the coach isn’t getting the message out, or the players aren’t listening to it. What’s the GM gonna do, trade away those who aren’t listening, and acquire players who promise to listen?
Big Ray
April 28th, 2010
1:07 am
Proof that there really isn’t anything to do in Milwaukee….all the Bucks fans are blogging where? HERE. Too funny…
Ted Striker
April 28th, 2010
1:11 am
Forget Milwaukee making the Hawks look bad the last two games. What made them look bad was that the BUCKS MASCOT displayed more creativity and energy in one insane dunk than the entire Hawks team did during the games.
Snowman
April 28th, 2010
2:41 am
Jeff, you are a DOPE (and you know I know you are and you know I know you know you are)!!!!…You know blank well this team is limited and your boy Rick Sund has not done a blank thing to make the team better (I know, I know, I know…Jamal was a great acquisition…but now that it is the playoffs, what has he been lately?)!!!…SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME WHAT THE blank has the GM DONE?…ANYBODY???…What does he do all day, seriously, anybody?…The Hawks will win at home and win this series however if we lose the Orlando series then Woody will go to the 76ers because they don’t want to pay him here or give him the ‘love’ he deserves and I just don’t get it!!! They will bring in some clown and we will be back to being the Clippers of the South again. By the way, if you think Joe’s coming back if Wood does not, well I have a bridge in Brooklyn I would like to sell you. Why would Joe come back when he sees there is NO COMMITTMENT to winning!!! Because if there was then the Blog world and even Schultz could tell me or more importantly tell Joe what they plan is to bolster the bench (with a straight face is not good currently)and help Al Horford in the middle (by the way, where has Al been in this series?). The #1 problem Atlanta has is no bench. I have a friend who ran into Stackhouse this summer (Stack lives in Atlanta) and Stack told him and he wanted to play for the Hawks and begged them to sign him and it could not have been for more than a ham sandwich and we didn’t. SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME IF THAT IS A TRUE STORY OR NOT?…it sure sounds like it is true? “Show Joe and Woody the money” will be the theme of the off season!!!…Again Jeff you know all of this and refuse to acknowledge Sund’s role (by the way, why won’t you)?, why won’t you hold him accountable? The next 30-60-90 days are going to be crucial to this ball club and it’s future!!!…Go Hawks!!!
MitchC
April 28th, 2010
6:57 am
Jeff, the Hawks have been very Jekyll-Hyde in this series. They looked great in Atlanta, terrible on the road.
Maybe, being the still fairly young team that they are, they feed off the home crowd, and let the road just get to them.
My personal opinion is that the Hawks will take this series in seven games. They will probably win tonight, lose Game Six, and then win Game Seven.
I know this isn’t baseball, but, look at the Braves during the division title years. With the pitching staff they had, during the Maddux/Glavine Smoltz glory years, they should have won several world championships, not just one. How many times did they say sayanora in the NLCS. In the last four years of the division title run, they couldn’t even get out of the first round, in spite of winning more than 100 regular season games several times.
Pro sports games aren’t played on paper. Thats why you had things like the mediocre 1999 Knicks making the Finals, and the year the Rockets won the NBA title, 1995 I believe, when they won.. 45 or 47 games.
Hopefully, the superior Hawk team will show up tonight, and beat Milwaukee. I’m going with my prediction that the Hawks will pull this series out in seven games. Time will tell if I’m right
JSS
April 28th, 2010
6:58 am
I went to college in Michigan, Chris Webber CAN NEVER question anyone’s HEART! Who does he think he is, Juwann Howard? Oh yeah, maybe he does know what he talks about, he was an enigma that never lived up to his potential in hoops or life, kind of like IlliniDawg!
JSS
April 28th, 2010
7:07 am
@F-105
I’ve been saying it for YEARS! This franchise is the PRE-Moses Malone 76ers! When you depend on Daryl Dawkins and Claudell Jones like talent, and Lloyd “World B.” Free mentality; then you can count on being under-archivers of the first rank!
Dap01
April 28th, 2010
8:07 am
Some people might conclude that a more talented team losing to a less talented team was poorly coached. Could the Hawks be being outcoached?
That would be a shocking revelation.
No matter how much heart someone has, adjustments can be made by teams that would render your strategy useless.
Big Poppa
April 28th, 2010
8:10 am
It funny how quick everyone bashes the hawks. The lakers are defending champs and went to OKC and lost two straight to a team many deemed too young. A team that the lakers were supposed to sweep. Yet no one says Phil Jackson sucks or that he should be fired. Give Mike Woodson some credit the team has gotten better every year since he has been coach. If the Hawks lose tonight there will be cause for concern. The lakers bounced back last night and so can the hawks. Everyone just needs to stop hating on them. The Bucks have nothing to lose because no one expects them to do anything so they are playing freely. The hawks will make the needed adjustments and handle business.
JeJe
April 28th, 2010
8:31 am
“I have a friend who ran into Stackhouse this summer (Stack lives in Atlanta) and Stack told him and he wanted to play for the Hawks and begged them to sign him and it could not have been for more than a ham sandwich and we didn’t. SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME IF THAT IS A TRUE STORY OR NOT?…it sure sounds like it is true? ”
FIRE WOODY
FIRE SUND
FIRE ASG
JeJe
April 28th, 2010
8:31 am
I have a friend who ran into Stackhouse this summer (Stack lives in Atlanta) and Stack told him and he wanted to play for the Hawks and begged them to sign him and it could not have been for more than a ham sandwich and we didn’t. SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME IF THAT IS A TRUE STORY OR NOT?…it sure sounds like it is true? .
FIRE WOODY
FIRE SUND
FIRE ASG
Barkin'Dog
April 28th, 2010
8:41 am
My take is that the Hawks won their home games 2 years ago and took the champion Boston Celtics to 7 games. Some folks said that would wear out the aging Celtics, but they went on to win it all. Do I think the Hawks can win it all? No. But, I expect them to show they are contenders, whether they win on the road consistently or not. Either way, I am a fan forever. Like politics, I have little say in who is elected, but I have to support my country regardless… just like my teams! Go Hawks – get the win tonight!
JSS
April 28th, 2010
8:44 am
@JeJe…
That story was covered last summer during the post draft camps when UFA’s and rookies were fighting for spots on the team. The Hawks tried to save money by retaining then Hawk Othello Hunter. The signing of big man Jason Collins was supposedly more of a need (see Dwight Howard).
Paddy
April 28th, 2010
8:50 am
Bottom line. the Hawks are just an ok team that very few care about. There is much of that same feeling around all of the NBA with a few exceptions.
I'm Gumby, dammit!!
April 28th, 2010
8:56 am
Methinks Jeff D. must be a Tarheel. That’s the only rational explanation!!
heartofdarkness
April 28th, 2010
9:13 am
Everyone slams the coach, but some teams refuse to be coached. While teams like the Jazz and the Spurs seem to play within a structure year after year, they are very good at acquiring players who fit roles within the structure. The Celtics assembled a three headed offense that was successful and the Lakers have run a number of players through their organization trying to get back to where they were with Kobe and Shaq. These teams all demand help defense that anticipates the opponent will beat the first layer of defenders on penetration.
If you go through a list of offensive styles to find one that the Hawks personnel would have an advantage playing against most opponents, the answer is not so clear. Parts are missing and many of the players do not complement one another well enough. Consequently, the team has difficulty playing to strength during the playoffs.
JSS
April 28th, 2010
9:14 am
@Ted Striker
One word” “SWEET!”
For those of you who missed it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3umtw179KA
whiteout
April 28th, 2010
9:18 am
IS TONIGHTS GAME A WASHOUT OR A WHITEOUT.
J J J Joe Johnson
April 28th, 2010
9:50 am
Forward Marvin Williams said there were occasions when teammates were beaten one-on-one when he was supposed to provide help on defense, but did not.
“I just catch myself standing there,” he said. “Other guys have been doing the same thing, too.”
Well he is honest…
Justin
April 28th, 2010
10:15 am
Sounds a lot like ga tech basketball
Darrin "The Vent King"
April 28th, 2010
10:17 am
The difference between the Hawks-Bucks and LAL-OKC series is two fold. One OKC Thunder have all their players very healthy and their BEST player happens to be the #1 scorer in the league and the Bucks are missing their BEST player. Two, Kobe and Co. have been there and won that ring so they are just suffering from what I call the “fat cat” syndrome that only champions can suffer from. They have to find something different to motivate them since they’ve made it to the top of that mountain that other teams like the Hawks have not. You can not compare the Bucks to the Thunder at all. Matter of fact if given the homecourt advantage I believe with the heart that OKC plays with vs the heart the Hawks seem to lack on the road, OKC would win a seven game series over both them. How do you explain this team inconsistent focus on the road for the past 5 years? I tell you how- MIKE WOODSON. He is our Doug Collins. Yes, he has gotten them this far (or they got HIM this far depending who you ask), but he CAN NOT take them to the next level period. Replace him and couple of stiffs on this roster stealing money and we’d be headed in the right direction, until then it’ll be the Highlight Factory at home, but America’s Not SO Funny Away from Home Videos on the road…
justahawkfan
April 28th, 2010
10:37 am
FIRE THE HAWK FAN ON THIS BLOG, IF INDEED THEY ARE REALLY HAWK FANS. DOES N’T FANS HAVE TO ACTUALLY BE FOR THIER TEAM. THE SERIES IS TIED, RIGHT?
Valdostan surrounded by nothingness
April 28th, 2010
10:37 am
Hey Jeff
According to Relocate America, top 100 places to live in 2010,
guess what? based on leadership, employmnet opportunities,
thriving community commitment, recreation options, overall
high quality of life, Valdosta (Winnersville) was only three
cities in the state of Georgia named.
JeJe
April 28th, 2010
10:37 am
FIRE WOODY
Just Being Real
April 28th, 2010
10:42 am
ok here goes…Dear HAWKS, I can see the “were too young thing” being a excuse the first time round but that ain’t working on me this time, why hasn’t any low “big” on our team learn to post up people yet? Why do we keep the same line up ALL the time? Why when the team HAS to play on the road everybody wants to be a jump shooter? DRIVE THE F-ING BALL, MOVE WHEN THE BALL IS NOT IN YOUR HANDS, CRASH THE BOARDS, POINTS CAN NEVER BE CONSISTANT BUT HUSTLE SURE CAN, YA”LL play like this church team I was forced to watch, it was awful, like a team of LeBron’s vs. a team of Kwame Browns!!! That how bad it feels to be an Atlanta sports fan all my life!!!!
ELVISINTHEHOUSE.
April 28th, 2010
10:52 am
JUSTAHAWKFAN,just tired of the same old story year after year after year since this team(hawks)was birthed.lose year after year after year then think someone suppose to keep supporting them,we’re tired.Get some players and a coach in here that will change that same old song,then we will stop our complaining.
Sunshine time: Dancin' Falcon; Wren's move; D-Wade's exit? | Jeff Schultz
April 28th, 2010
11:10 am
[...] ♦ Hawks’ talent means nothing without heart, intelligence [...]
Just Being Real
April 28th, 2010
11:15 am
ELVISINTHEHOUSE
Thats why I’m so mad right now I tired of always being the joke of sports, I been here all my life, about to turn thirty and have witnessed ONE, (1) , 3-2=1, Championship, out of four pro teams, The town of GREEN BAY has one pro team and many trophys, how the F*#K does that happen, I never get to climb a street light or high five strangers after a championship, and you can take ALL of Atlanta’s pro teams and include them in this title
“ATLANTA PRO TEAMS’ talent means nothing without heart, intelligence” sigh
JSS
April 28th, 2010
11:35 am
Let’s see one word: LOMBARDI!
Hmmmm… Hawks: Fratello, Loughery, Weiss, Stotts, Kruger, Fitzsimmons (when he had no clue), and countless interim others…
Atlanta has had three coaches worth a dime: Guerin, Brown and Wilkins…
Woody, maybe is worth a nickel…
Westie
April 28th, 2010
12:43 pm
someone please kick Brandon Jennings in his Rookie FACE!
Dancing clown!
Michael
April 28th, 2010
12:47 pm
They lack the heart and determination, they may win this series and that’s it. They may get swept the next like last year verses Cavs.
BirdDawg
April 28th, 2010
12:56 pm
2 things need to happen:
1) Woodson needs to get a clue or get fired. You can’t continue to let your team make the same mistakes over and over again and do nothing. Make adjustments when the game plan goes to $#!T. If it’s not working, try something else…you can’t get any freaking worse.
2) Joe needs to speak up. You’re the teams best player and leader by example which apparently isn’t enough. Venting to the media after the game has much less effect than exploding on your teammates during the game. Get fired up, you’re Joe Johnson, it’s ok.
JC
April 28th, 2010
1:02 pm
Woody is a player’s coach on a team desperate for an authoritative figure. When Josh Smith bitches to the refs and plays soft on the road, who is he accountable to? Certainly not Woody. Josh Smith has never had to answer to anyone, from all the ill-advised three pointers to all the errant “I hate City X” comments. Who has been his coach since he started in the league? Woody. Get someone who can teach him discipline and he could be a franchise player and perennial All-Star.
Jeff Schultz
April 28th, 2010
3:26 pm
Thanks Reid.
Jeff Schultz
April 28th, 2010
3:26 pm
Mike — Would’ve been interesting to see the Bucks in this series w/Bogut.
Jeff Schultz
April 28th, 2010
3:27 pm
Big Ray — I agree. I’d be STUNNED if they don’t play well tonight.
Jeff Schultz
April 28th, 2010
3:30 pm
Snowman — I don’t normally respond to comments that begin, “Jeff, you re a dope,” because it sort of closes the door to sensible debate. But I don’t think you can put anything bad that has happened in this series on Rick Sund. Could team be better in the middle? Yes, absolutely. That’s not a revelation. A real center would allow Al to move to the 4. But this is Milwaukee, not Orlando. The center position is not the reason Hawks have lost the last two games.
Jeff Schultz
April 28th, 2010
3:32 pm
MitchC — The “they’re young” excuse doesn’t work for me. Who’s young? Not Joe, Josh, Bibby, Marvin, Jamal. Al’s in his third year. I agree the Hawks will still win the series, though.
Jeff Schultz
April 28th, 2010
3:33 pm
JSS – You knocking, D.Dawkins? “Chocolate Thunder!” I loved that guy.
Jeff Schultz
April 28th, 2010
3:35 pm
I’m Gumby dammit — Just wanted to say that was one of the all time great SNL skits.
Jeff Schultz
April 28th, 2010
3:36 pm
Valdosta surrounded by nothingness — You the mayor or just the president of the chamber of commerce? Valdosta does have a chamber of commerce, doesn’t it? …. Hey just kiddin’. Fact is, my daughter probably is going to school there next year.
Jeff Schultz
April 28th, 2010
3:37 pm
Westie — that’s not nice.
JSS
April 28th, 2010
6:31 pm
@Jeff Schultz…
Is your daughter going to be a teacher or a nurse?
Beam “Chocolate Thunder” back to “Lovetron!”
Jeff Schultz
April 28th, 2010
8:00 pm
JSS: As of the moment, her career goal is FBI agent. I’m not making that up.
IM Hawk
April 28th, 2010
9:34 pm
The hawks will wrap up this series in the next 2 games and take orlando to 6 games–bank on it. With woodson, the hawks will never win anything big. He’s an average coach with a team with better than average talent.
Eric C.
April 28th, 2010
11:10 pm
Hmmm…not sure the players stood up for their coach in this game, huh?
King of Pop
April 29th, 2010
8:37 am
To: Joe Johnson
From: Michael Jackson
Reference: Talking about “The size of your heart doesn’t show up on paper,”
“Man In The Mirror”
Sincerely,
Michael Jackson
heelsfan
April 29th, 2010
12:42 pm
Lol. I got to keep defending Marv. So he is a bust. He has probably played in the same amount of playoff games as the number 1 and number 3 pick in the draft. He wasnt brought here to be the savior. he was brought here as a complement. No he won’t wow you with his athletic ability or scoring prowess but he is a pretty solid defender. He is the fifth option and although his scoring and minutesd are down. He has improved in other areas such as rebounded and defense. If you knew the game you would understand that.
corrina252
April 29th, 2010
1:07 pm
FEAR THE DEER.
Snowman
April 29th, 2010
9:40 pm
Jeff, we FINALLY agree on something. So let me start out by saying you are right (ouch)!!! I should not have called you a “dope”. So for that I apologize. Now to your point, how can you NOT put any of this on Rick? The Bucks GM was exec of the year because he added pieces to the Buck team (Stackhouse and Salmons to name a couple), who are contributing. Look, we did not have a draft pick in 2008 and in 2009, Jeff Teague has not worked out. Except for Jamal (and he has been great in the regular season however he has never played in the playoffs and how about the layup he and Josh both had inside 4 minutes last night and missed them both), and please don’t say Joe Smith. We have not tried to improve this team (why should Joe stay if the organization is not committed to winning?) If we had added a couple of pieces (just for example and I have not figured out salary cap ramifications or anything like that) Camby, Brendan Heyward, Caron Butler, Ben Wallace or a Tayshaun Prince, even a Heinrich to name a few and I am sure you could come up with one or two others. How much better would this team be? Mo Evans, ZaZa, Josh Smith, Teague, Marvin (although he had a great game last night)…these are not “smart” players. I mean Charlie Bell and Royal Ivey (he started for us not to long ago….smile) don’t even get off the bench and Bell would play quality minutes for us. We need more, better and “smarter” players…period!!!
It is the GM’s JOB to get the coach a piece or two, c’mon!!!? For whatever reason you NEVER criticize him, why? I have listed below the fact that coach Woodson was picked 9th “best” coach of the year and Rick was not even mentioned in the GM balloting. He did NOT GET A VOTE…NOTE ONE!!!!
In closing the Hawks this season were 53-29, swept the Celtics 4-0, beat every team in the NBA including Lakers, Cavs, and Magic, were a 3 seed in the East, has improved their record (not team) every season for 5 consecutive seasons and had no contributions from any draft picks in two years and had one free agent that helped (Jamal). Oh, and if coach has had so many great “prospects” on the bench over the years, when they left Atlanta, have they ever been heard from again? (just name one, I could ONLY think of Boris Diaw and that’s a reach). As Chad Ocho Cinco would say, “Child Please”…Hawks and coach Woodson deserve an “A+” if you handed out grades. Now would Rick? I want you and the bloggers to hand out grades on coach and the GM. I would like to see what folks think after really thinking about it.
The Hawks will win in Milwaukee Friday and close out the series on Sunday…GO Hawks!!!!
NBA Executive of the Year Voting
4/24/2010, 2:29 p.m. EDT
The Associated Press
The Associated Press
John Hammond, Milwaukee 12
Sam Presti, Oklahoma City 9
Danny Ferry, Cleveland 2
Rod Higgins, Charlotte 1
Mark Cuban, Dallas 1
Chris Wallace, Memphis 1
Jeff Bower, New Orleans 1
Kevin Pritchard, Portland 1
Geoff Petrie, Sacramento 1
Kevin O’Connor, Utah 1
Coach, Team 1st 2nd 3rd Pts
Scott Brooks, Oklahoma City 71 39 8 480
Scott Skiles, Milwaukee 26 54 21 313
Nate McMillan, Portland 9 9 35 107
Jerry Sloan, Utah 10 9 21 98
Alvin Gentry, Phoenix 4 5 11 46
Larry Brown, Charlotte 1 2 12 23
George Karl, Denver 1 1 3 11
Rick Adelman, Houston – 2 1 7
Mike Woodson, Atlanta – 2 1 7
Lionel Hollins, Memphis – - 6 6
Stan Van Gundy, Orlando 1 – - 5
Mike Brown, Cleveland – - 2 2
Rick Carlisle, Dallas – - 1 1
Erik Spoelstra, Miami – - 1 1
limewire
April 30th, 2010
6:03 pm
lol amazing stuff man.