Report says Hawks and Thrashers may both be for sale (UPDATE: Spirit responds with silence)
The Atlanta Spirit has always been one big happy team. OK, maybe notsomuch.
The Atlanta Spirit ownership group has been disputing reports that it is seeking to sell the Thrashers and that the NHL team might be on the move to another city. Now comes a report that the Hawks also might be on the market.
A New York Times story on sports ownership during the recession references both the Hawks and Thrashers as being among franchises that might be for sale. The paragraph in question reads:
Now that the economy seems to be on the mend, owners who held off selling during the downturn are seeking to unload their teams. According to sports bankers, the teams thought to be for sale include the Atlanta Hawks, the Memphis Grizzlies, the Golden State Warriors and the Detroit Pistons in the N.B.A; the [Dallas] Stars, the Atlanta Thrashers and potentially the Columbus Blue Jackets in the N.H.L.; and baseball’s Houston Astros.
E-mails this morning to various club officials seeking comment have not been immediately returned.
(UPDATE: Despite emails and phone requests, the Hawks/Thrashers/Spirit have yet to issue a statement, either confirming or denying the New York Times story. Draw what you will from their silence. For what it’s worth, the Thrashers have been quick to deny past stories of the franchise’s possible sale and/or move.)
There had been no indication in the past that the Spirit is looking to sell the Hawks. However, the potential exit of partner Steve Belkin is expected to prompt the group, led by Michael Gearon and Bruce Levenson, to seek a new partner. Belkin and the other owners have been in litigation for about five years. Both the Hawks and Thrashers are struggling in attendance. The Thrashers rank 28th out of 30 teams in the NHL, averaging 13,397 announced per game. The Hawks rank 21st in the 30-team NBA, averaging 16,092 announced, despite having the third-best record in the Eastern Conference.
NHL commissioner Gary Bettman recently told the Journal-Constitution that the squabbling among owners has affected the Thrashers’ operation and product: “Ultimately, the ownership situation has to be straightened out. It’s difficult to operate a franchise when owners aren’t getting along. It’s even more difficult in a recession climate. A team has to be at its very best. Issues have to be resolved and everybody has to be together so they can interact with fans. But that’s difficult when the owners aren’t together.”
The Times story addresses how devalued pro sports franchises are in today’s economy, and how new owners like Michael Jordan of the Charlotte Bobcats “are facing a future without the near-certainty of making up for any short-term losses by selling their teams for hefty profits later.”
“It used to be you got bailed out when you sold your team even if you lost money year after year,” said Marc Ganis, president of SportsCorp Ltd., a consulting firm. “Now, you’re no longer assured of cashing out to cover your capital costs and losses.”
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227 comments Add your comment
SOUTH GA DAWG FAN
March 17th, 2010
9:13 am
wonder what the hawks are worth
SOUTH GA DAWG FAN
March 17th, 2010
9:14 am
Oh my and FIRST!!! I might need to take another look at my bracket I am on a roll
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater
March 17th, 2010
9:15 am
please forward this email to Blank & Turner, they know what to do with struggling organizations.
SSI FAN
March 17th, 2010
9:24 am
If the Hawks, Thrashers, and the arena are not for sale, then the Atlanta Spirit group needs to tell Goldman-Sachs to get back all the portfolios that have been distrubeted soliciting a buyer for all their assets.
So, why not just sell...
March 17th, 2010
9:25 am
…them to the Belkin guy and end both his and their misery…how stupid are those guys??????
Gilley
March 17th, 2010
9:29 am
I wonder how Hawks fans would feel if we moved to another city due to poor attendance. I would be PISSED!!!!!!!!!!!!
Otto
March 17th, 2010
9:43 am
Hope the Thrashers can get new management and stay. Could really care less about the Hawks. Hockey is on their way to dead last and less than 3k in attendance below basketball?
Jeff Schultz
March 17th, 2010
9:45 am
South Ga Dawg — In order of worth, it goes 1) Arena; 2) Hawks; 3) Thrashers. Actual value of teams is difficult to say in this economy.
Nelson Skalbania
March 17th, 2010
9:45 am
Hey! I’m interested…….Again!
ThrasherFan
March 17th, 2010
9:45 am
Get these owners out of here as soon as possible. They have run the Thrashers into the ground and kept an incompetent GM in place who will see this team miss the playoffs again.
Also, move the teams to the burbs – nobody wants to be downtown in the stinkhole of Atlanta on a Tuesday night.
Jeff Schultz
March 17th, 2010
9:46 am
Dr. Kenneth — Even AMB isn’t looking to buy another team right now. Home Depot stock took a major hit with the rest of the market and getting new stadium for Falcons is a bigger priority.
Bryan G.
March 17th, 2010
9:48 am
It’s pretty sad the lack of attendance at Hawks games. However, I think ThrasherFan may be right…a lot of people are leery of going to downtown Atlanta on weeknights.
Leroy Powell
March 17th, 2010
9:48 am
I love it when these people proclaim they are the FIRST!!! one to post, only to find out they are not…
IRON CITY
March 17th, 2010
9:50 am
I live in Goergia, but about 4 hrs from ATL. I will never understand why the city doesnt support its teams any better than this. The Hawks have the 3RD best record in the east, but are 21st in attendance. That doesn’t make any sense?!? Falcons have had 2 straight winning seasons, but regularly dont sell-out?!?
ThrasherFan
March 17th, 2010
9:50 am
Jeff, the Falcons will get a new stadium once the World Cup is confirmed as coming to the United States and Atlanta is chosen as a city.
newkid
March 17th, 2010
9:53 am
Could this be JJ gamesmanship by the NY press? Plant the seed – with JJ and his agent – that the Hawks ownership situation is a rapidly sinking ship, and trust that JJ will quickly conclude that a safe and secure financial future awaits him in Manhattan with the Knickerbockers. I’d have thought this story would have shown up first in the Post (rather than the NY Times).
ThrasherFan
March 17th, 2010
9:53 am
Bryan G.,
It’s not just being leary of going downtown, it’s the heavy volume of traffic, getting home late, etc. It’s stressful getting down to a game to watch the Florida Panthers for the 4th time this year. Sports in this city aren’t well attended because nobody ever planned city wide for people to get there in a reasonable fashion.
PMC
March 17th, 2010
9:54 am
Urban Sprawl majorly effects attendence to most of the weekly sporting events in the city. Sure wish the Braves were on the market.
Also, I don’t think star power gravitas can be underestimated. Do these teams have guys that bring you to the arena to see in person?
PMC
March 17th, 2010
9:55 am
If there is one thing this city has proven time and time again it’s that they could care less about the name on the front of the jersey. It’s the name on the back they care about.
Otto
March 17th, 2010
9:59 am
Iron City, You have a few things in Georgia. 1st the natives are college fans. Look at how much money is spent on getting UGA football tix or for that matter just about any SEC team and their Football program. College is supported more than Pro in the south
Next many natives do not like going into downtown. Baseball is the exception to college rule in the south. The Braves have plenty of fans hours away from downtown but these fan can not make weekday games and do not like fighting to get downtown and then risk their car getting broken into a worse.
Finally Atlanta is largely a transient population with most remaining fans of their home team.
ThrasherFan
March 17th, 2010
10:00 am
PMC,
Well, since the Thrashers lost Dany Heatley, Marc Savard, Marian Hossa, Ilya Kovulchuk, Kari Lehts, etc, there is really nobody left with a name to care about on the Thrashers. Their marketing campaigns were built on these guys so the billboards are now defunct.
Oh, and they were swept in the first round of the only playoffs they made it to in 10 years. And Don Waddell still has a job why?
Otto
March 17th, 2010
10:02 am
Thrasher fan, I’ll be at the game Turs. night. Traffic is hardly a problem taking 400 or 75 South into the city.
ThrasherFan
March 17th, 2010
10:03 am
Otto,
I never get the college football fanbase arguments. There are what, 6-7 games a YEAR that they go to? The economy is down, Atlanta government is incompetent and our teams have been losing for a few years.
Your argument about transience hits a big nail on the head though. We don’t have local fans, we have Cubs fans, Mets fans etc. Just listen to the sportstalk radio locally, most of the talkers root for other teams.
Andre
March 17th, 2010
10:03 am
I’m tired of people saying this “leery of downtown.” Afraid for your life. When was the last time you heard a Hawks/Thrasher/Concert attendee was assaulted? Or is it that you’re scared of some homeless man asking you for money? Is that traumatizing? Where are you going to move these arena’s to? Didn’t you see the story in the AJC recently that stated that homelessness is reaching the suburbs? Any arena that is moved that far out, will definitely bring the “wrong” following. Let’s say the arena is where the Gwinnett Arena is for example. Could you imagine if fans from Douglas County, Fayette County, Henry County, Paulding County, wanting to drive all the way to that game. That would be horrible, the traffic is bad, attendance would be a staggering low. AT LEAST, the arena is centrally located. If you have a problem with that, there’s a state law that allows you to bring your arms out, so bring it!
Telfo
March 17th, 2010
10:04 am
the Thrashers getting sold to someone that actually cares to build a good team would be the best thing that can possibly happen!(assuming it is someone that will keep the team here, but i doubt Bettman would let the team move anyway)
ThrasherFan
March 17th, 2010
10:05 am
Otto again,
It depends on when you leave for the games. I usually leave work at 4 pm to miss the mess from Perimeter but then you’ve got 2.5 hours to burn. I’ve figured out every shortcut possible, believe me. But for fans who have kids in school and live in Gwinett County, it’s hard to get to the games, or find a babysitter, etc.. I may be mistaken, but those 3 and 5 pm Sunday family games are usually well attended.
Nick
March 17th, 2010
10:07 am
You want better attendance? Drop the prices. The Braves are offering season tix as low as $3 a game! You can not see a Hawks or Thrashers game for less that $10!
I would love to go watch the Hawks, but their sked is full of prime time games which they raise ticket prices for or crap teams which you are lucky to see 5,000 people attend. When you have to go to ebay to get decent prices for seats there is a problem.
I would love to go see the Hawks on a regular basis, but for the worst seats in the house it costs double what you can get at the Braves and for half the games. $250 for 83 games or $500 for 41? Does not sound too hard to me…
ThrasherFan
March 17th, 2010
10:09 am
Andre,
I’m not leary of downtown, but I would say that some people may be. Didn’t you hear all the news out of Georgia Tech regarding crime? GA Tech isn’t very far Phillips… My arguments revolve mostly around a bad product that isn’t cheap to attend and traffic sucking.
litz
March 17th, 2010
10:10 am
Can ASG even *sell*, with their current legal wranglings?
Or will they be forced to wait until all the Belkin legal mess is sorted first?
tony t
March 17th, 2010
10:11 am
are you people going to be hicks forever. don’t you have any pride.lets support these teams. i moved here because i thought this was a great city but i see you are just a bunch of country ass hicks. if we lose two teams we might as well change the name atlanta to hooterville. quit complaining about being leary to come downtown and the traffic, this is a city you know.
Dawggy Style
March 17th, 2010
10:13 am
Winning is still, and always will be, the best way to put people in the seats! The Thrashers have done woefully little of that in 10+ years, and the Hawks need a strong playoff run this season to finally shed their loser image. High costs (tickets/concessions/parking), lack of convenience getting downtown, horrible economy and pressure on household budgets, inconsistent and lackadaisical play by millionaires, etc. – Gee … really wish I could put my finger on the attendance problem!!
Jason
March 17th, 2010
10:15 am
There is no where in the suburbs you can move the teams. The density out there is too low. You’d pull in people from five miles around but for anyone else, it would be even worse than trying to get downtown. Try going from Woodstock to Suwanee sometime. Even without heavy traffic it takes forever. In metros that have a natural barrier that downtown sits against, such as the ocean, moving into the suburbs pretty much has to happen since connectivity is better out there (no ocean/lake/mountain/whatever blocking an avenue of approach). In Atlanta all of the major roads go through downtown. I tried going to the Gwinett Arena once and it took longer to get out of the parking lot after the concert than it ever has downtown. The roads out there can’t handle even that small arena, forget a much larger one.
Jeff, isn’t the value of the arena heavily dependent on the very large amount of money that Philips pays for the naming rights? Money that according to the contract that Philips would no longer have to pay if either the Hawks or the Thrashers move?
Since either team moving would create a large loss in the value of the arena, the price of the team would have to be much higher than the normal market value to compensate. There is lots of talk of a second hockey team for southern Ontario so maybe the Canadians would be willing to pay a huge premium over the market value of the Thrashers to get them to move, but I’m doubtful. More likely some other city without such a complicated arena agreement will lose their team while ours continues to limp by with poor attendance and a huge subsidy from Philips Electronics.
All I'm Saying...
March 17th, 2010
10:16 am
Per Forbes magazine,
Hawks are worth $306 million (purchased for $208 million) and
Thrashers are worth $143 million (purchased for $80 million).
The Memphis owner is looking to bail on his b-ball team and has been for years so that’s not a rumor but legit.
The Detroit Pistons owner Bill Davidson died in the past six months and his widow is open to selling so she can move on with her life.
I think Spirit simply wants to get rid of Belkin and bring in another minority partner. Those guys love hoops and realize the importance of having another tenant at Philips and will stick with the Thrashers as they can only get better at this point.
fes
March 17th, 2010
10:17 am
A sale is not going to happen anytime soon. It would have to be a package deal (Philips Arena, Hawks, and Thrashers) and no one is ponying up that kind of money in this economy. I can’t speak to the Hawks attendance woes, but for the Thrashers, it’s mostly a boycott of the product by some people that think not attending will get Waddell fired. Face it folks. He’s been at the helm for over a decade and attendance has been bleak many times over that period…he’s still here. There seems to be no accountability for him, especially in regards to attendance. I don’t think that the NY Times source could be more vague or speculative.
Tiger In the Back Woods
March 17th, 2010
10:17 am
They’re for sale…. They’re not for sale…. They’re for sale again……
BigBlue
March 17th, 2010
10:20 am
Georgia is simply put…a horrendous sports town! Top 10 media market with a bottom ten fan base for professional sports. Even UGA has problems. They sell out the games but tend to have 5 to 20,000 fans not show up on gameday. Tech has difficulties selling out its smaller stadium, etc. For whatever reason….Southernors overall just are not willing to attend games. Poverty? Culture? Who knows???
Najeh Davenpoop
March 17th, 2010
10:21 am
I would like to see the ASG choose one team or another and devote 100% of their resources to them. They have proven with the Hawks that they can, if they want, allocate enough resources to produce a winner. I don’t care anout the Thrashers, but I want the Hawks to be in the hands of an ownership group that can assure fans that they can commit the resources necessary to contend over a long period of time, and I’m sure Thrashers fans feel the same. That would be much more likely if they only owned one team.
Mr. Kiffin
March 17th, 2010
10:21 am
So the Hawks and Thrashers move, big deal. I don’t care. Neither wants fans, they only want money.
Mark
March 17th, 2010
10:22 am
Going to a game downtown is not a problem – when you drive down for a 7 PM game you are actually going against the flow. Parking is right across the street for $12 and Marta comes up right to the door. Find another excuse for not going – the teams are not kept together to build fan support and the ownership has insulted the fans time and again. ‘nuf said. The Hawks GM issue went on too long and the Thrashers GM issue is long overdue for a solution – that’s why fans aren’t going.
Mr. T
March 17th, 2010
10:25 am
Bright to think hockey would work a second time around. Wondder how long it will take for them to win a playoff game in their nes city. No doubt, less than 10 years!
BobbyH
March 17th, 2010
10:28 am
Andre,
You hit it dead on the nose. Let one of those arenas move to the suburbs and it will definitely be the beginning of the end for that franchise. Those arenas need to be centrally located acessible to everyone in the metro area
Najeh Davenpoop
March 17th, 2010
10:30 am
Co-sign Andre’s 10:03 post to the fullest. I’ve been to 10-15 Hawks games evey year for the last 6 years or so, not counting playoff games. I usually either take MARTA or park for free at Centennial Place Apartments (across Ivan Allen Boulevard from the aquarium) and walk. I have never once been in an unsafe situation. And considering that Gwinnett has pretty much become the epicenter of metro Atlanta drug smuggling, I don’t think you are any safer on Sugarloaf Parkway at 10 PM than you are near well-lit, well-policed Philips.
Mo Wanchuck
March 17th, 2010
10:30 am
Mr T…..You should have stayed in school….You spell like a 7 year old.
Hawks Fan
March 17th, 2010
10:32 am
ESPN live broadcast…”We’ve live at the “Atlanta” Hawks game tonight in downtown Kennesaw…
Gwinnett Mom
March 17th, 2010
10:33 am
No way is downtown Atlanta better than Gwinnett. For one, there are no queers here like there is downtown.
Greg
March 17th, 2010
10:39 am
I love sports, but I’m not the target demographic for either the NHL or the NBA. I just don’t have any interest in either. So don’t try to browbeat me into “supporting” these teams just so they’ll stay. If the people who like hockey and pro basketball can’t drum up enough money and attendees for these teams, I say let them go! Attendance figures suggest than only about 29,000 people in this city of 4 million will even care.
SimpleDawg
March 17th, 2010
10:41 am
Hey, put me down for the Thrashers. I’ve never owned a hockey team before….matter of fact, I’ve never coached or played hockey. I have seen a few hockey games…..
Hey, I’m as qualified as those who have owned the team, and I certainly can’t do any worse than those who have been managing and coaching the team.
By the way, how much are they asking for the team?
Ghost of O.J.!!!
March 17th, 2010
10:41 am
Gwinnett Mom
March 17th, 2010
10:33 am
You must be C R A Z Y !!!! I live and work here in Gwinnett, and there are tons of gay folks everywhere from Norcross to Buford!!! But what does the have to do with where the Hawks and Thrashers play????
SportsGuru
March 17th, 2010
10:42 am
Very few people will go downtown for anything. They keep putting attactions and sports teams down there, but the fans with the money to buy the tickets live north of town and don’t like the unsafe surroundings of downtown. One day they will get smart and put one of the teams in Gwinnett, North Fulton, or East Cobb and it will sellout.
Matt
March 17th, 2010
10:48 am
Big Blue, That was nonsensical. UGA NEVER has 5 to 20,000 not show up. Now there is always a few thousand who might not show up for the 1 game a year versus your NE Lousiana St.s of the world but that’s it.
Tim from EP
March 17th, 2010
10:48 am
Why is the location of where the Hawks and Falcons play an issue, but no one has a problem going to Turner Field to see the Braves…I’m just saying. One of the main problems with the Hawks is their ownership situation. If you have a good product and no one is buying it, then you have a marketing issue. Not just advertising…but marketing. I hate to put this out there, but going to the Hawks game is almost like going to a Hip-Hop concert. Not everyone is into that type of atmosphere. I mean..how do you go to a sports game and they don’t even play Phil Collins’ “In the air tonight:!
Chamwa
March 17th, 2010
10:49 am
Iron City….I’ve been to Steelers games & Pirates games when there was no sell out. So, it’s not just in the ATL. Also, the Falcons have sold out every game for years.
THRASHERS / HAWKS FAN FOR LIFE
March 17th, 2010
10:50 am
TED TURNER AND ARTHUR BLANK SHOULD MAKE A JOINT PURCHASE OF BOTH OF THE TEAMS!! They’re actually BASED HERE and LIVE HERE unlike the yankee Atlanta Spirit Group who only cares about themselves and their bickering. That group is harming the teams and they never show up to the games and support the team. It’s heartbreaking to see outsiders controling our local organizations. Let the Hawks and the Thrashers be in the hands of someone LOCAL and CARING. Someday it will happen, someday… For now, GO HAWKS!!!! GO THRASHERS!!!!
Realist
March 17th, 2010
10:51 am
Blank is going to buy the braves when Liberty Media’s tax writeoff expires at the end of this season. He knows better than to touch the Thrashers and Hawks. He’d probably buy Philips Arena if they sold it as a standalone.
Ghost of O.J.!!!
March 17th, 2010
10:51 am
SportsGuru
March 17th, 2010
10:42 am
Your assesment of this is off base…. Remember, they tried this with the Knights….The attendance at Gwinnett Area was weak at best! The Citizens of Gwinnett got ripped off by the Braves last year and the attendace at the new minor league park will suffer as well. You folks tickle me with the notion that putting a stadium on the North side means sellouts is wrong on so many levels!!!! Remember, Phillips Arena, and Turner Field were built in the last 15 years and I can say with a high degree of certainty that those that make these decision have billions of dollars and if just putting a stadium in one of the burbs would insure sellouts, then rest assured, They would!!!
Tim from EP
March 17th, 2010
10:53 am
The people who don’t want to go downtown are probably the same people who don’t believe in Marta. They feel they make a lot of money and everything they want should be a 5 minute drive from their home. Just be honest and say that… I mean I feel you.
corey
March 17th, 2010
10:53 am
Big Blue, you couldn’t be more wrong…
I’ve worked in sports for over 20 years in many different markets and Atlanta isn’t much different than any other city its size. Every market has an “it” sport. For Atlanta it’s college football with UGA being far-and-away the one with the highest interest. Do you have any IDEA how much money an SEC team makes? The Hawks and Thrashers are jealous of Vanderbilt’s TV contract, I can assure you…I’m not sure when you’ve been over to a UGA football game, but there are around 5-20,000 fans outside the stadium trying to get in on a gameday…there are no empty seats there or at hardly any other SEC stadium.
Atlanta has the same issues with fan support that LA, Phoenix, San Francisco, Miami, St. Louis–even New York and Philly have…it is not the worst by a longshot.
Most of Atlanta’s population is suburban and transient. The people who live in Atlanta didn’t grow up in a “city” like New York or Chicago…so they aren’t going to go downtown after work for a sport they consider secondary. For the same reason that people in Boston aren’t going to take the T down to see BC play Miami…even though half the TVs in the south would be tuned in if they were both in the top 10…The NFL left LA for that same reason–it’s an NBA town. Just like Atlanta is a college football town–and one that spends its money on college football.
I’d love to know if “big blue” stands for Michigan or Kentucky..because if its either, you don’t need to be lambasting Atlanta’s sports scene.
ThrasherATL99
March 17th, 2010
10:55 am
This is Schultz’s wet dream coming true!
David C
March 17th, 2010
10:55 am
“Now that the economy seems to be on the mend”? What world is this NYT writer living in.
The Real Fan
March 17th, 2010
10:58 am
The only queer is Gwinnett is the gwinnett mom.
Spud Webb
March 17th, 2010
11:00 am
Yahooooooooooooooo, please sell the thrashers.
Rajesh Koothrappali
March 17th, 2010
11:01 am
Who really gives a poo about either of these two teams? The Hawks are the Eastern version of Phoenix. Talented and fun to watch but will never win a championship. The Thrashers simply are reaping what they sow. Years of mismanagement from Waddell. Bad scouting leading to bad drafts. They are too cheap to pay the going rate for any stars they do get which leads to D-Wad dumping them for a bunch of barely warm bodies. Why should anyone feel the need to root for them if the team continually shoots itself in the foot by letting quality players leave town for nothing in return?
The Real Fan
March 17th, 2010
11:02 am
Tim from EP
Mark
March 17th, 2010
10:48 am
Man you hit the nail on the head. Falcons sell out, Braves sell out when winning and have for sometime. Maybe thoise stadiums aren’t really in downtown?
Go figure.
The Real Fan
March 17th, 2010
11:03 am
Rajesh Koothrappali
March 17th, 2010
11:01 am
I bet you root for Cricket!
SecondSage
March 17th, 2010
11:03 am
All this talk of moving the team to the burbs, LOOK, the world doesn’t revolve around you. No matter where you live in the burbs, answer this question. What makes your location better than others. Right now MARTA puts you at the DOOR. Are you willing to have MARTA RAIL come to your area? If not people would have to fight rush hour traffic to get to your venue. Cancel all week day games as far as attendance.
As far as fans goes, Atlanta is turning the corner as far as fan base. If I had the money I would buy both teams, even the Thrashers. I’m not a big fan of hockey but I don’t want to see the Thrashers move. They’re MY team!!! The Hawks are due a deep playoff run soon as we get a new coach. Rick Sund is taking the team in the right direction.
I’m a transplant and have my football and baseball loyalties. But I’m 100% Hawks and Thrashers. I go to the games, I’m in agreement with dropping the prices. This would definitely boost attendance. The end upper level seats should be $3,6,9. The Middle Upper level seats should be $12 and $16. Even the Nets would sell out at those prices.
Hatfield Geoff
March 17th, 2010
11:09 am
The Clusterf**k that is the Atlanta Sprit Group has got to be the biggest joke in professional sports. They kept Billy knight in charge of the Hawks as he screwed up the draft (Imagine this team with Chris Paul instead of Marvin William and a good player for the pick they wasted on the guy from Duke whose name I can’t remember). They leave Don Waddell in charge of the Thrashers for what 10 years now and have nothing to show for it but a 3-game sweep. If the Atlanta Sprit had been around in the 1920s and been the group that backed Lindberg he would have crashed off of Long Island. Sell the Thrashers (fire Waddell first and the price will go up 10%) and sell the Hawks to Belkin. One Moron running things has got to be better than 15.
Winkasdad29
March 17th, 2010
11:10 am
Atlanta fans don’t seem to care about pro sports that much. There doesn’t seem to be a lot of passion for its local teams. They love college football, though. I don’t understand that because college football doesn’t even have a definitive winner every year.
The Hawks are an up and coming team – they need more time to find out how far they will go. I don’t envision the Hawks going anywhere. Unfortunately, the Thrashers may end up in Winnipeg. If they go there, the franchise may still not survive because of the financial climate in Manitoba.
The Thrashers need to hire another GM. They also may want to look at the business model of the Carolina Hurricanes, who won a Stanley Cup in 2006, and 2 other appearances in the Eastern Conference Finals.
As fas as going to Philips Arena is concerned, I’m going to borrow from Chad Ochocinco – child, please! That area is not dangerous compared to some other areas of the city. On game nights, the police are all over. Besides, MARTA drops you off almost at the door. I don’t understand this “perception is reality” attitude of many that live in the metro area, especially in the suburbs.
Mike
March 17th, 2010
11:11 am
When will people learn that moving the teams to the burbs will never happen. It isn’t just the hometown sports teams that play in the arenas, but the sporting tournaments, conventions,etc that come to town. You have to have hotel and meeting space (Georgia World Congress Center) to attract those things. No city will build an arena for these teams because alone and without these additional events, the arenas aren’t worth the investment.
Not Blind
March 17th, 2010
11:12 am
I wouldn’t drive to the Arena on a week night and mess with parking even if someone paid me $100 and gave me a good ticket. I used to drive to Doraville station and take the train directly to the arena. It’s a no brainer.
What I actually do nowadays is spend my hockey money on NHL Center Ice. The Spirit Group have completely destroyed any desire I have to pay big money to see the Thrashers. I used to pull for TB but I don’t care for them much anymore in the Tochet [ sp ? ] era. Right now the team I like to watch is the Isles. Them guys compete and their coach is doing a great job with the team.
Ghost of O.J.!!!
March 17th, 2010
11:14 am
OK!!! For the record, as a business owner, you CAN NOT give away tickets for 3, 6 or 9 dollars and still afford the bring in top flight talent!!! You can’t afford to pay an Alex Ovechkin, or a Kobe Bryant ( or in our case Joe Johnson) by selling 10 dollar seats!
Mo Wanchuck
March 17th, 2010
11:15 am
When did the Knights play in Gwinnett?
Jon
March 17th, 2010
11:16 am
Stinkhole of Atlanta? HAHAHAHA. I’ll take Atlanta any day over the suburban ignorant cesspoools of Cobb, Gwinnett & Forsyth all day long. Sorry you can’t stand sitting next to a black person on the train who doesn’t dress like you or talk like you. And if any of you dimwits thinks the franchises would ever prosper outside city limits then please go take a few b-school classes.
SecondSage
March 17th, 2010
11:17 am
I don’t know if KISS’s “Rock and Roll all night” is exactly Hip Hop. They play that at the Hawks games.
Money Losers
March 17th, 2010
11:17 am
Both of these teams are losing millions, due to poor management and atlanta fan indifference. They should be sold and moved to cities with real owners, who understand sports marketing, pricing, player evaluation… The current owners are morons.
?????
March 17th, 2010
11:19 am
so if the hawks get bought would they move?
Transplant NY Hockey Fan
March 17th, 2010
11:20 am
Instead of selling the Thrashers, need to get rid of their Management starting with the top and start fresh with new management that really cares about the team. Wendell and others have driven the team into the ground. How wonder attendance is low. Fans see what is happening to the team. This is all very sad because Atlanta had a good thing going. Why can’t someone turn the light bulb on and see all of this. Help – get the Thrashers new owers and managers then reorg the team ASAP!!! Thanks from a previous Regular attending FAN!
Kovy's Agent
March 17th, 2010
11:20 am
David C: 5.9% GDP growth in the 4th quarter, 3.2% GDP growth in the 3rd quarter, probably 3 to 4% growth this quarter. My stock portfolio is up 100+% since last March and I stand to bag a cool 10% off Kovy’s upcoming $100M contract this summer! Oh, times are good alright. Too bad you’re not seeing any of it.
mike
March 17th, 2010
11:23 am
Gwinnett Mom- I live in Larryland and I am a lesbian, albeit trapped in a male body.
As for going downtown to Phillips, it better be a damn good concert, or free tix to see a game, otherwise, I am not going. Parking is too high, MARTA is an inconvenience, I hate being pan handled or bothered by the scalpers, who blatantly break the law right in front of the worst police department in the country.
SecondSage
March 17th, 2010
11:23 am
I understand Ghost. But you would sell more tickets and the bottom line would improve. Bringing in talent like Ovee and Kobe would lead to TV revenue and Merchandise sales, therefore making the money back. Ticket Sales alone doesn’t pay for the players.
I wasn’t here back then but I understand Nique had all the games sold out. Plus all the NBA stations are here. TNT and NBA TV. I say we pull a Green Bay and all of us put in $100 each. Then we can vote on who we want as GM and we can only blame ourselves. Who’s with me??
Manny
March 17th, 2010
11:25 am
As far as the Thrashers are concerned, I don’t know. I like having hockey in Atlanta, but you gotta be consistent.
Hawks? The Hawks have low costs in personnel and salaries. They have a great record. They have consistently reached the playoffs in recent years. They are now known as one of the dominant players in the Eastern Conference. But their attendance is terrible.
Here’s the thing: I think that you have to find better ownership. And you need one guy where the buck will stop. You need an Arthur Blank or a Ted Turner to hold the strings. But I doubt that will happen.
But if the Hawks go anywhere, watch for a push from St. Louis. If I bought a perennial playoff basketball team, I would move the team to St. Louis. And I would sell out whatever arena they put me in.
Atlanta fans are too fickle. They wait until the playoffs to show up, and then… barely.
SecondSage
March 17th, 2010
11:27 am
Mike, that’s BS, the scalpers only bother you if you’re interested. They ask you once as your passing. say no and move on.
Seriously, all these preconceived notions must come to an end. It still feels like 1952 here. The region will not progress otherwise.
Khao$
March 17th, 2010
11:28 am
Atlanta is a big town with a small town mentality when it comes to pro teams. I’ll concede that we have a lot of people that have relocated from other places who have retained their allegience to their teams. I get that. However,even when the Braves were winning (’91 and ‘92 aside), the fanbase has been lukewarm. Crime in the city? Guys from Boston, New York, Chicago, and Detroit could make the same excuses. The fact of the matter is, Atlanta (speaking in general terms) seems to cater soley to collegiate football. That’s fine for towns like Clemson, Auburn, or Tuscalosa. However, we’re 5 million strong in the metro area.We’ve hosted the Olympics. We have winning basketball. We have a storied baseball team. We have a football team where the owner is willing to pay for players and has a bright future. At this point, the money and safety excuses are played. Other cities could have the same complaints. The economy is bad EVERYWHERE and crime is typically higher in ALL MAJOR CITIES to varying degrees. We haven’t lost a team since the Flames. I assure you, we’ll look bad if we lose any of the existing franchises. Lets just call it for what it is…this town love college, but isn’t ready to graduate to the pros…
P Rose
March 17th, 2010
11:31 am
Andre and Jason are right. I live downtown, a half-mile walk from Philips Arena, and I love it down here. My wife and I regularly walk down there to eat at one of the many fine restaurants. We’ve been doing so for nearly eight years, and never once have we been threatened. Occasionally some homeless guy will ask for a handout, but so what? The “crime” argument is so weak. Yes, a few people have been robbed near Tech. In a city of five million, when one downtown robbery is reported every few weeks, I’d say your odds of survival are pretty good. I see more crime in the suburbs. There seems to me to be more drunk driving, road rage, and juvenile delinquency in Gwinnett County than I see living downtown. And to “Gwinnett Mom” – many of my neighbors are “queers,” as you call them, but I’d rather live next door to them than to you any day. I have season tickets to the Braves every year, even though I have to drive three miles to get there, because I like the sport. Basketball and hockey bore me, personally. I could easily walk to those games, but I seldom do – maybe one or two games a year. Atlanta is indeed a transient town. People move here, or to San Diego, Phoenix, Tampa, etc., from the stink holes up north because our economy and climate are so much better. Cubs fans are more passionate than Braves fans because of their old ball park and 100-year tradition. College football rules down here for the same reason. Chicagoans’ baseball passion doesn’t make them better than Braves fans, just more passionate about that particular sport. Moving any of our downtown franchises to the suburbs wouldn’t make attendance any better; in fact, it would be a disaster. No one would drive from Douglasville to Suwannee. Talk about traffic? That would be traffic hell. Downtown is centrally located and all roads lead here. Please just admit the real reason you don’t support the teams downtown – either you don’t care about the sport, you’re from Chicago or some other stink hole up north, or you’re afraid of homeless black people. I’m just keeping it real.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 17th, 2010
11:33 am
” I hate to put this out there, but going to the Hawks game is almost like going to a Hip-Hop concert.”
Clearly you have never been to a hip-hop concert. For one, there is no weed at Hawks games. Secondly, there is barely any, you know, hip hop at Hawks games. Just wondering, do you also think Josh Smith is a “thug”?
PMC
March 17th, 2010
11:37 am
Yeah there is nothing wrong with the safety downtown. It’s fine. It’s at least as safe as it is anywhere else anyway. We could do a better job getting too and from the games. I wish there were express trains anyway. I like riding Marta to Phillips and the Dome because it’s right there. I wish they had one to Turner too oh well.
The ultimate problem though in general is that we live for College Football and aparently exclude everything else from the sports tree. Everything else is niche I guess.
I guess we will see if Heyward will get people off thier duff for weekday games..
ASHEVILLE DAWG
March 17th, 2010
11:41 am
Why are the “rich northside burbers” of Atlanta so presumtuous to think that a stadium needs to be closer to them. And won’t the “not in my neighborhood crowd” rear it’s ugly head. What about the folks from the southside of Atlanta (Henry, Fayette, Clayton county’s) or east (Rockdale/Newton) or west (Douglas county). That’s why the downtown stadium’s were built.
Now the Thrashers have been run by a bunch of clowns for a over a decade. If getting rid of star players in their prime is the indcation of how to run a team, you reap what you sow. Fire Waddell, maybe some will care.
The Hawks are a good collection of players, but no “superstar”. It’s plain and simple…….
Let’s now forget the ownership “clown” group. I’ll always remember the Steve Belkin/ Billy Knight handshake picture……….Nuff said
PMC
March 17th, 2010
11:41 am
For the record if you don’t live in Gwinnett it’s an arduous journey to get all the way up to Gwinnett Arena.
Jimgreen
March 17th, 2010
11:44 am
People who are “leary” of downtown Atlanta need to get out more, see the world for the sake of your own education, Atlanta has a high murder rate sure, but unless you are in a gang or are hanging out on gange territory you have nothing to worry about. And no, downtown is not prime gang land, there are homeless people, but any cosmopolitan city will have a dichotomy of wealth. I live inside the perimeter, originalyl from Douglas Co, and there is no way I would drive to Gwinnwett or even more so Alpharetta for a game, even on a weekend if I still lived in Douglas Co. Besides the proposed arena there is nothing else to do in the ‘burbs.
Greg
March 17th, 2010
11:46 am
I’m not afraid of downtown – I work there and I’ve also attended school there. But, if I actually enjoyed hanging out downtown, I would have moved there a long time ago. Same thing with all of you downtowners – if you enjoyed being OTP, you’d move there, wouldn’t you?
So stop being a hypocrite and telling us that we have to spend two hours roundtrip driving or riding to a game that we really don’t give a flip about in the first place. If you love downtown, or if you love pro basketball, or if you love hockey, then support it more and keep these teams in Atlanta so you can enjoy them.
But don’t sit there and tell the rest of us that we have to “support” the Hawks and Thrashers or we’re just a bunch of hillbillies. Asking us to pay money to support sports we don’t like, playing in an area we don’t enjoy, is like taxing us to pay for your healthcare!
martin
March 17th, 2010
11:50 am
The Thrashers are still here?
shawn
March 17th, 2010
11:51 am
Finally, we get a chance to get rid of Spirit. How Arthur Blank as a new owner? Or even Ted Turner? well, it is probably a wishful thinking.
Delbert D.
March 17th, 2010
11:51 am
Maybe somebody from Duluth will buy the Hawks. Move them to a new stadium that’s not in a high crime area.
Raider Fan
March 17th, 2010
11:53 am
This has probably been said 48 times already, but:
BRING BACK TED!
OZZFEST
March 17th, 2010
11:57 am
SELL THE TEAM, JEB…
GSUFan
March 17th, 2010
12:02 pm
I don’t think it’s so much that people that are scared of going downtown because they’ve heard that someone has gotten mugged right there. As someone that attends GSU, I can tell you that people are getting shot (like over at Walters, which is like what, ten blocks away) and mugged and kidnapped, and these are students, from parking decks and what not. I understand the fear. On top of that, traffic and parking are a total nightmare. But you know, I agree with Greg, I would totally live down there if I could. You just have to be careful, and there are a lot of people that are too stupid to realize how to be careful. And a lot of people would rather go to Gwinnett Arena. It’s a nice place, they have big names like Eric Clapton and Michael Buble and they have the Glads! It’s cheaper and closer to a lot of people’s homes, who live in Gwinnett Co. That’s a lot of people. AND PEOPLE ARE TRYING TO SAVE MONEY. Parking, Tickets, Food: It all cost money.
The thing is, if the team makes or will make the playoffs, people will come. Simple as that. I know the Hawks are doing well, but that’s just how it rolls in this city. I know that the Spirit Suck, but changing owners won’t change attendance, unless the teams are in first place, or in the playoffs. There would have to be a major incentive for people to come. In Atlanta, with all teams, that is being so good the chance the team will lose is about 5%.
Middle D
March 17th, 2010
12:02 pm
When the hawks wise up and move to a safe, suburban area with easy, inexpensive parking, I’ll attend the games.
Najeh Davenpoop
March 17th, 2010
12:05 pm
“For the record if you don’t live in Gwinnett it’s an arduous journey to get all the way up to Gwinnett Arena.”
You don’t have to be outside of Gwinnett for that to be an arduous journey. I live on the Gwinnett-DeKalb border and it takes me longer to get to Gwinnett Arena than it does to get to Philips.
E
March 17th, 2010
12:05 pm
I work off of Pleasant Hill Rd. in Gwinnett county. I would take being downtown on a Falcons/Tharashers/Hawks/Concert gamenight than stopping for gas at 10:00pm at the RaceTrack in P-Hill Rd. ANYDAY. Gwinnett is a scary, scary, dark place.
RenegadesRugby
March 17th, 2010
12:05 pm
I am embarrassed. I call myself an Atlanta fan. And I have a desire to go to more games. I haven’t been to a Hawks game in 15 years or more. I have been to one Thrashers game this year. I make a goal to attend at least 2 Thrashers games each year, and wanted to attend at least 2 Hawks games this year as well. I have failed on that front.
I like the games downtown because MARTA doesn’t run to the suburbs (Alpharetta/Roswell/Duluth/East Cobb/Lawrenceville etc etc.). It makes it easier to not deal with traffic and also to not worry about if I had one too many beers. I would like to see some changes in the Thrashers organization, but I hope they stay in Atlanta. I also think that the city of Atlanta NEEDS these teams to stay downtown. Atlanta better recognize how important it is for its budget that the Falcons/Hawks/Thrashers stay in-town.
I will also say that the area surrounding the GWCC, GA Dome and Philips Arena is vastly improving. I really want the Falcons to play in an open air stadium, or at least a stadium with a retractable roof, but I want them to stay downtown more than anything.
Joe Shmoe
March 17th, 2010
12:05 pm
I’m a big fan of the Thrashers. I watch the Hawks on TV more now than I have ever.
Why don’t I go to games? Ownership. Plain and simple. These teams suck, they don’t have what it takes to win and they aren’t marketed well. The ownership knows nothing about the sport, they’re just a bunch of rich whitey tighty nerds who thought they’d make a lot of money if they owned a team. Sorry you gotta win and give me a reason to spend my money. I’m not wasting money on an already expensive sport only to show up and see the garbage of a team they are trying to sell me.
When the Thrashers made the playoffs I was just introduced really to the team. I was at both home games and making lots of noise. I almost bought season tickets the next year, and then this team just implodes. You want Atlanta fans to waste their time and money on these sports? Bring in new owners (one for each team) and fire everyone in the building. Bring in respectable professionals who actually know how to build a team, not some cheap, learn on the job, no experience, loser of a GM. Build a team with heart and passion for the game and the city and maybe you’ll have me actually wanting to go to the games. Until then, I’d rather watch conveniently from my nice HDTV in my living room at no extra charge.
David E.
March 17th, 2010
12:06 pm
In regards to whether attendance might be better if the teams moved out of downtown, there is actually historical proof that supports the idea that attendance would go up if a team moved closer to where the bulk of their fan bases live. Many of you won’t remember this, but in 1979, the Atlanta Chiefs, a stuggling soccer team in the old North American Soccer League (NASL) played at Atlanta-Fulton County Stadium and drew an average of 3,000 per game. Amidst claims by suburbanites that they would attend Chiefs games if they were closer, the Chiefs tested the market once and played a game in what was then a suburban location – Adams Stadium in DeKalb County, I think, although I’m not positive – and 14,000 people showed up. Political pressure ensued, and another suburban game was never scheduled or mentioned and the Chiefs folded a year or so later. As for me, the location downtown does not deter me, and I’ll go no matter where they play. Also, admittedly, 1979 was a long time ago (Atlanta had just over a milion people then and MARTA was not yet viable). However, the fact is it happened, and it leads me to believe that the Thrashers and/or Hawks might draw better at Gwinnett or if a new arena was built in Cobb.
Pop
March 17th, 2010
12:09 pm
The Falcons are next……….
Reasons for Lack of Support
March 17th, 2010
12:19 pm
I’ll give you a few reasons why ATL doesn’t support the Hawks (Thrashers are simple- NHL simply doesn’t work- particularly in the South)
1. Hawks fans have endured 10+ years of total mismanagement starting with Pete Babcock and leading to greater incompetence with the Spirit. A series of bad drafts, free agent signings, and Billy Knight will not be easily forgotten.
2. NBA is way too expensive to attend – particularly when we’re all cutting back. Add up parking, food, drinks, and tickets for one game and you could buy a nice TV. With HDTV, it makes the decision to stay home even more compelling.
3. Traffic. ATL commuters spend way too much time in their cars as it is. Who wants to sit in traffic heading to a 7:00pm Hawks game after you’ve already logged 2 hours in the car that day?
edward
March 17th, 2010
12:19 pm
I don’t think the traffic is really the big problem. I live in Pittsburgh and believe me, it is a joy to drive into and out of Atlanta. 4 lane highways(2in/2out) here in Pittsburgh. The whole city is being changed by construction and it sits on a small island between three rivers. Don’t cry about traffic!!
I think it was David Justice who said it best…”The fans here are awful they don’t come out to support the team”. Or something to that effect. It’s true. I go to The Ted whenever I go home and it’s not really full. Same for the Hawks. These are not bad teams by any stretch of the imagination. The Thrashers are horrible but that’s because the owners have no clue about hockey. I think they thought it would be neat to say they own a hockey team.
It is the fans. It’s embarrassing to hear that we have the worst fans in baseball and basketball. The Pirates are horrible and are making new records of horribleness and yet they still sell seats. All you have to do in Atlanta is just have a plan on getting in and getting out. It’s pretty simple. The longest it has ever taken us driving time to go in and leave afterward is maybe 20-30minutes. As to it being a high-crime area, yes but aren’t all big cities? I always see at least 10 policemen within a mile walking distance. We park at the Tabernacle and walk down to Philips.
It’s a poor excuse to complain of the drive to the city. Just admit y’all are just lazy armchair fans!!
Peter
March 17th, 2010
12:20 pm
I have done business with the Atlanta Spirit Group……. And they do bad business, will take advantage of you, and won’t keep their word.
Gee no wonder they are going broke, and have a bad reputation !
MR164164
March 17th, 2010
12:20 pm
Co-sign Andre’s 10:03 post.
Otto
March 17th, 2010
12:21 pm
Thrasher Fan, The College Football argument goes to show that Southerners/Georgians do support local sports. Pro Sports just is not on the radar and on top of that many Georgians have never liked venturing into Atlanta at all. Decades of mismanagement (Falcons take those honors) further put Pro Sports in the backseat in Georgia. On the flip side up north college sports take a back seat to the Pro teams in many areas (NY/NJ, Boston, Pittsburgh, Philly).
High School is also fairly well supported but has decreased some especially in the metro area again due to transient population and the natives having split loyalties thanks to new schools and district changes. HS football and baseball is big in the more rural areas.
Gwinnett is a bit more of a pain thanks to 85. You will never make everyone happy but for the 75/400 commutes it really is not that big of deal. I was there before Olympic break shortly after the trades and was pleasantly surprised on the week night crowd. The Knights always had decent attendance. If a decent team is put on the Ice the crowds will grow (easily passing the Hawks) but getting there is another blog.
Richham
March 17th, 2010
12:22 pm
Let’s see the economy sucks, gas is fairly cheap at going on $3.00 a gallon, traffic, price of tickets to sit anywhere within 100 yards of the floor is way over priced, food, parking, traffic again which sucks big time on a weekday night.
No one has the extra money to support these teams. My family comes first over this type of entertainment and yes its an overall hassle/pain just to get downtown, park, etc. to watch a game. Not to mention that basketball and hockey are second tier sports, in popularity, here in the South.
Move to Boston or L.A. and you can get all wild and crazy over your basketball teams with everyone else.
Oh and I agree with the last poster Greg, if I actually enjoyed hanging out downtown I would have moved there. Different strokes for different folks. There is plenty to do here in the burbs, it just depends on what you enjoy doing. I live in Flowery Branch, so it is at least a two hour round trip for me to downtown and quite possibly three depending on traffic. I wouldn’t support the hawks if they were located in Gwinnett, Cobb, etc. If you love living inside the perimeter, that’s awesome, live it up. I could care less. The safety downtown is just fine, it all boils down to the fact that no one cares.
Do we even have to go into the mess that is the Atlanta Spirit??? I’m shocked people actually pay money to watch the Thrashers anymore. It is pretty evident that ownership could care less about hockey.
I simply have much better ways to spend my money and my time.
MR164164
March 17th, 2010
12:23 pm
Also- As long as these suburbs reject MARTA, no team will be there. There is nothing better than taking a train straight to the GAMES.
Otto
March 17th, 2010
12:26 pm
David Gwinnett would kill the Cobb audience and hurt the Alpharetta/Cumming viewers. Nobody wants to cross 285 to make a week night game. Further many in those areas do not see Gwinnett as an upgrade in terms of safety/crime.
Is crime that bad compared to other cities? maybe..maybe not but many did not like going into the city 20-30 years.
FAN4LIFE
March 17th, 2010
12:26 pm
THE ATLANTA SPIRIT IS ABSURD! PLEASE DO SELL THE HAWKS AND THRASHERS TO SOMEONE WHO IS ACTUALLY A FAN….WHAT A NOVEL IDEA. I GO TO NEARLY EVERY HAWKS GAME AND SIT BEHIND THE “OWNERS” AND THE ONLY ONE I SEE THERE IS GEARON JR. I ALSO HAVE A SUITE FOR THRASHERS GAMES AND HAVE ONLY SEEN SEYDELL THERE ONCE. BOTTOM LINE IS THIS GUYS, DO ATLANTA A FAVOR AND SELL THE TEAMS TO SOMEONE WHO HAS A VESTED INTEREST IN THE CITY AND IT’S FAN BASE. HALF OF YOU CLOWNS LIVE IN ANOTHER STATE! MR. BLANK PLEASE, PLEASE BUY THE THRASHERS AND HAWKS….THEN WORK ON THE BRAVES. ONE LAST POINT, IF YOU CLOWNS WHO CALL YOURSELF ATLANTA SPIRIT, DO LOSE THE THRASHERS, YOU WILL HAVE FOREVER DENIED THIS CITY OF AN NHL FRANCHISE. DO YOU REALLY THINK THEY WILL GIVE US ANOTHER SHOT IF WE HAD TWO CHANCES. OH, THAT’S RIGHT, MOST OF YOU PRICKS LIVE ELSEWHERE. YOU GUYS SUCKS!
Otto
March 17th, 2010
12:32 pm
Atleast 2 hours from Flowery Branch to Downtown? I made the Varsity leaving Road Atlanta (6:00?) in an hour and 15 on a weekday afternoon last fall. Kennesaw/Woodstock to Road Atlanta is about an hour and half on the weekend.
Richham
March 17th, 2010
12:34 pm
Edward
Check your facts bro. You say we are the worst fans in baseball/basketball yet we ranked 15th out of 30 teams in baseball attendance. We outdrew Pittsburgh by almost 1 million fans, you guys were second to last in attendance and your talking trash about Atlanta?
We also outdrew pittsburgh in football, any you guys have a ton of super bowl rings and a strong loyalty base to depend on for ticket sales.
Atlanta has only 1 title between all 4 major sports and Pittsburgh has like 20 and the penguins only draw 4,000 more fans a game than the pitiful thrashers.
Get a clue!!!
Richham
March 17th, 2010
12:36 pm
I said roundtrip. Try rereading my post. It is easily an hour to Atlanta during rush hour traffic one way.
Not Surprised...
March 17th, 2010
12:41 pm
Unfortunately, Atlanta is not a sports city. We have rarely supported our sports teams even when we were winning on a regular basis.The closest time we have was when Mike Vick was part of the Falcons. And that was sporatic at times. The Braves seem to have somewhat of a following but that looks as if it is getting smaller each season. The location of these arenas may be the reason behind low attendance but I don’t think that if “They build a new arena or move they will come”….(Field of Dreams)…
The Monkey
March 17th, 2010
12:42 pm
Go back to the suburbs and stay there. What a sad, pathetic bunch we have here. I’m really surprised some folks have the ability to use the internet to post here.
The Atlanta Spirit sucks, no doubt. DW is questionable, but I think the real problem is the people who cut off Schultz from the free journalist buffet. Please feed this grumpy codger.
Jason
March 17th, 2010
12:48 pm
David E, the NHL outdoor game attracts more fans each year than any other game, including the playoffs or championship. Should all NHL games be played outdoors? Of course not! A big crowd will show up for a novelty. A single soccer game is a novelty. What size crowds did the Silverback pull in out their spaghetti junction stadium for regular season games? Not very large crowds and that was with the added advantage of being near the soccer obsessed Hispanic population.
tired of em anyway
March 17th, 2010
12:52 pm
To hell with atlanta’s collection of losing sports teams and their owners. It says a lot when the number one interest is the GA bulldogs. This city has more me-first mentality than anywhere in the U.S. I want out of this dump, just like the owners.
The Real Fan
March 17th, 2010
12:53 pm
“Greg Asking us to pay money to support sports we don’t like, playing in an area we don’t enjoy, is like taxing us to pay for your healthcare!”
Your’re already paying taxes for health care, or aren’t you bright enough to know that. That’s okay is was a rhetorical question. But don’t let the truth get in the way of a good arguement.
The Real Fan
March 17th, 2010
12:56 pm
“tired of em anyway
March 17th, 2010
12:52 pm”
I-75 goes north as well as south!
The Duck of Death
March 17th, 2010
12:58 pm
The IHL Atlanta Knights had solid attendance, a good fan base, and a much higher quality game presentation. Plus the prices were cheap and the product was good. The Thrashers games are dull and vanilla. The product is inconsistent and the prices are absurd. Lower the prices make it more enjoyable and the fans will show up.
Dickie Dunn
March 17th, 2010
1:04 pm
I told you so….see you in Winnipeg or Hamilton next year!!!
Worst Sports City Ever
March 17th, 2010
1:07 pm
ESPN routinely gives that title to Atlanta so we have no one to blame but ourselves. Surprisingly, they found the most consistent sports base – meaning stable support despite cyclical performance – was Dallas.
My personal opinion is the NHL should contract and take the Thrashers and a few other teams out. The Hawks and the Falcons are about what anyone can expect. Mediocre teams with mediocre histories displaying mediocrity.
Manny
March 17th, 2010
1:26 pm
You people don’t know what you are talking about. If the location of Philips Arena is the problem, then why does Philips get all of the good concerts and Gwinnett barely gets anything. It’s because Philips is a superior venue, is a more central location, and has access to public transit. If the stadiums were located in the northern suburbs it would be MORE inconvenient for many more people to attend the games. I, for example, would never go up there.
Tiger Time
March 17th, 2010
1:31 pm
My contact who knows the Toronto owners told me the Thrashers are moving to Winnipeg. It is a done deal.
Manny
March 17th, 2010
1:32 pm
Lets also not forget that the Hawks (and Falcons) have a pretty heavy African American fan base that generally lives south of town. So it would really make a lot of sense to move the team to Cobb or Gwinnett. With the Thrashers, though, you may have a point.
Brayne Varner
March 17th, 2010
1:32 pm
these comments are full of people making excuses as to why they won’t make it out to support Atlanta sports teams that desperately need it. Stop making excuses! If you are a real fan then you will make it out to the arena.
Also, anyone who is “leery” of coming to Philips because of crime lives in a silly suburban bubble where they are told that shady figures lurk around every corner. I ride Marta to most games and have never been hassled. Parking lots are patrolled by security and everyone I know who drives has never had a break in.
I remember when Gwinnett voted to not let Marta run through their county. People thought that Marta would bring crime (Black People). If your that afraid of “Crime” then just stay in Hickville. We don’t want you at Philips Arena.
smith30
March 17th, 2010
1:47 pm
Where do you people find the time to write a statement that is as long as the article?
dirty bird
March 17th, 2010
1:49 pm
What a minute here, let’s not brand all of Atlanta’s pro sports teams into this debate. I have been a Falcons season ticket holder for 10 years, and as I recall every game since #7 was drafted has been a sell out, now I’m sure Mr. Blank might have bought a few thousand tickets to a few of those games, but that’s what a good owner does, so the game isn’t blacked out and all the fans can watch on TV who didn’t go to the game. I have also noticed that the Falcons seem to be allot more involved with the community, and are out there for people to see. Now I don’t follow the hawks as much but I don’t see the same community involvement with them or the Thrashers. We all know the Thrashers suck, and mangment is more of a BB fan, not to mention the GM is incompedent.
Ownership has a ton to do with the success of the Franchise, and I for one am hoping the Falcons don’t build a new statium in the Suburbs. For one I don’t want to deal with the Traffic, with it being in downtown on a Sunday there are 20 different ways to go. Another reason is I don’t want to pay more than double what I pay now for my seats, plus a seat license fee. No way….
Transport
March 17th, 2010
1:53 pm
One day, scientists will uncover a deep mystery, the reason that when they built the braves stadium, it was not near a marta station, or why marta didn’t build a stop by the braves stadium. I guess geniuses in the fantastic city of atlanta marta board know this answer, but they are way above the intelligence of regular people, so everyone will just have to make do!
Tiger Time
March 17th, 2010
1:57 pm
Transport:
Don’t question authority.
StateBird
March 17th, 2010
1:59 pm
Transport – MARTA did not plan a stop at Atlanta Stadium/Turner Field to protect the interests of parking lot concessionaires and the taxi lobby. For similar reasons transit service was not orignally built to the airports in New York.
David McDavid
March 17th, 2010
2:04 pm
Shoot pardner. Don’t look at me. Dang, I already tried to buy them Hawks once before.
homeless
March 17th, 2010
2:06 pm
I’m a homeless person. Please let the Thrashers move out of my part of town. They are bringing down the value of my shopping cart and cardboard box.
Greg
March 17th, 2010
2:14 pm
Do we say that Boston is not a sports town because they don’t routinely attract 90,000 people to Boston College football games? Of course not.
And just because Edmonton sells out their hockey games, does that mean they are such a sports town that we should move an NFL franchise there? (or an NBA franchise, for that matter?) Yeah, good luck with that.
Now, do you really think that all of the people at UGA games are from Athens? Try driving on 316 on a football Saturday.
As someone else said earlier, different cities (and areas of the country) are into different sports. You can’t say Atlanta isn’t a sports town, it’s just not an NBA and certainly not a hockey town.
Kevin
March 17th, 2010
2:22 pm
I come up to games and events from Columbus, Ga I never have trouble getting to the games and nobody has ever bothered me. People need to stop making excuses and start supporting these teams. The Hawks are the most exciting team to watch in basketball and I think the Braves may finally get it right this year.
TD
March 17th, 2010
2:26 pm
What was the actual attendance of the hockey game last night?
Dr. Warren
March 17th, 2010
2:30 pm
I’ve followed the Hawks, Braves, and Falcons for 40 years. Suffered is the more appropriate word. After all that, If these buffoons (The Spirit) end up sending the Hawks to Vegas or Seattle or wherever, without us ever even reaching the semifinals in 42 years, I won’t know whether to laugh, cry, or just give up on pro sports in Atlanta altogether.
Otto
March 17th, 2010
2:41 pm
Greg,
I agree with you until you get to Atlanta is not a hockey town. Have you been to a KSU hockey game? Very solid attendance given their short history. The Hawks are 3rd in their division and draw ~2,500 more than a hockey everyone knows does not stand a chance. Knights attendance was strong enough to get the attention of the NHL.
Atlanta can be a solid hockey town, of course at a Canadian support level but put the Thrashers 3rd in their division after a few decent season as the Hawks had and attendance will pass the Hawks.
Brayne, Crime did go up with Marta. Bridge Mill in Canton is filled with former Stone Mountain/Gwinnett residents. Please expand MARTA in other areas of Metro Atlanta, my property value will thank you.
In Conclusion.....
March 17th, 2010
2:52 pm
Well, Several People on here have taken the words/thoughts that I had planned to type on here and stated them already….I am a “REAL” Atlanta Pro Sports Fan (Been in Atlanta all of my life) and I will simply state some facts, issues, and remedies regarding our “Fan Base”
1) Get a F*ckin owner who actually cares about the the fans and the team
2) Marta needs an expansion/ Gwinnett County…. Especially YOU!!!
3) Speaking of Marta….Wasn’t some of the same people who are complaining about the Metropolitan’s traffic nightmare the same individuals who didn’t want Public Transportation in their communities a few years back?
4) Yes, Unfortunately; Atlanta.. (Georgia) as whole is full of transients who go to games to see their home teams…
5) The Question may come up to why don’t the true fans just hurry and buy out the tickets before the transients??? Because many of these Companies BUY OUT several of the seats for games and several of the home team fans are left with sorry, overpriced seats….No, not all of the great seats are brought out, but a HUGE Section(s) of seats are…For instance, sometimes Falcons games are proclaimed to be “sold out” but when a person watches the game on television, there are several ‘empty seats’
6) For the people scared to go downtown, look at it this way, the city of Atlanta is more safer than it has ever been, if you were here during the 80’s and 90’s, you will agree… Atlanta use to a section 8, drug infested, dirty city and in some spots it still is… however, during a period in the 80’s and 90’s, it was listed as the NUMBER 1 ranked city in HOMICIDES, or at least in the top 3, if you were from here, you may have knew that…. Now, Atlanta is full of Businesses, Condos, and all types of fancy bar/clubs. The Olympics was the changing point for my city….
7) We, as residents need to speak up and design alternative ways in which traffic can be avoided, the former/probably the present Management of Marta has screwed this city from the inside out…Back in the 70’s, Marta should already been in some of the high traffic volume areas…and when the Olympics were announced in the early 90’s, sidewalks, public transportation, etc. should have been put in place yet again….
Once the Thrashers get better management and stop throwing away GREAT Talent, fans will come….
9) Questions????
26belly
March 17th, 2010
2:52 pm
In the words of the late Lewis Grizzard from Moreland, GA (southside, Coweta Co.) to all of those who complain about downtown and the ATL, “Delta is ready when you are!” You can get the H- – - on back where you come from!
Barry
March 17th, 2010
2:53 pm
Hey Y’all:
If you want fans to come to the game, it all starts with MARKETING. The Hawks and all the other teams in Atlanta do not have a great marketing plan. The do their social marketing stuff on the computers and advertise in the papers, but that is not going to reach the people. They have to conduct a “GORILLA MARKETING CAMPAIGN:. They have to market to the small businnesses and non-profit organizations in the metro area. They have to reach out to the state,counnty and city governments for attendance packages. They have to reach the school systems and specials for atheltic programs at the high schools. They have to get the youth in the community who play basketball more than interested in coming to professional games ( basketball, football, hockey, etc.) in the city. They need to invest in mailing directly to residents adresses of their teams and sales packages throughout the metro areaa. It will be an investment well spent. They need to be “CONSISTANTLY AGGRESSIVE” in this marketing area. This need not be a 1 year thing, but an “ALWAYS” thing. They need to do this all the time. THEY NEED TO REACH OUT TO ALL THEIR CONSUMERS MORE AGRESSIVELY. Once the consumer is at the games, the team will take care of itself due to they stadiums will be packed with happy, excited fans who were courted, through GORILLA MARKETING, on a “DAILY” basis. We have to be agrresive. ANd if I know this, and not getting paid, what the hell are those people on these teams marketing department doing while they are getting paid. THEY ALL NEED TO CHANGE OR GET FIRED!!!!!!! Make us want to come to the games. COME AND GET US. WE ARE THERE!!!!!!
GO ATLANTA PROFESSIONAL SPORTS TEAMS!! GET A BETTER MARKETING APPROACH!
SSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This is a SECRET from an ATLANTA SPORTS FAN. TELL EVERYBODY!!!!
…………………”GO GORILLA MARKETING”…………
Steve
March 17th, 2010
2:54 pm
tony t,
You put that quite bluntly lol but I couldn’t agree with you more. There’s not a single major city in the country that isn’t full of crime. If Atlanta sports fans worry about that more than they care about supporting their pro teams, does this city really deserve these teams?
Really?
March 17th, 2010
2:54 pm
KSU has a hockey team?! Who do they play? I could imagine that they have to do a lot of traveling.
Greg
March 17th, 2010
2:56 pm
26belly,
I SERIOUSLY doubt that Lewis Grizzard was a big fan of downtown Atlanta!
Theels23
March 17th, 2010
2:58 pm
Anyone who thinks Hawks games are like “Hip-Hop” concerts clearly has not been to a Hawks game this year.
As for moving into the suburbs, that logistically makes no sense and leaves no chance of ever selling out. It may be nice for the Gwinettians and the 400-N folks but not anyone else.
giving all my money to the altanta spirit
March 17th, 2010
3:02 pm
i don’t know if the atlanta spirit is trying to sell the hawks or not, but they definitely don’t want to if the price increase on my tickets is any indication. my season tickets have nearly doubled from $12,000 last year to $22,000 this year. (i like the good seats). what they are “giving” me to offset this price increase is 2 extra tickets behind the goal for me to give to someone else. these seats can not even access where my seats are, so if i give them to friends, we wouldn’t even really hang out. also, why am i being forced to, basically, buy extra seats i don’t want? they are making me fill the seats for them because they can’t do it themselves. they won’t even let me refuse the extra tickets to lessen the price. they say there is a great demand for where my seats are, yet they have an average attendence that is ranked 21st (?). these guys are idiots. i have so many other complaints, i can’t even list them all.
however, in 11 years of having hawks tickets, i have never once had anyone harrass me or felt as if i were in danger at a single game. the police presence is very obvious and they do a good job.
i haven’t decided if i am going to renew for next season or not.
Brian
March 17th, 2010
3:12 pm
The problem with those two Atlanta franchises is that most of the people in Atlanta are not from Atlanta, so their loyalty lies with teams from their home areas. When you go to a Hawks game, there are just as many fans for the opposing team as their are for the home team. The same with the hockey team, the Thrashers will never have the history that the Bruins, Red Wings, Rangers, etc…have. Are there any die hard Hawks or Thrasher fans out there that will sell out the arena, I doubt it.
26belly
March 17th, 2010
3:12 pm
Greg:
Of course he WAS NOT a big fan of downtown, but all Atlantan’s learned that phrase from him when expressing our displeasure of “damn Yankees”!
niremetal
March 17th, 2010
3:17 pm
You know it’s getting bad when Schultz can’t even print his own speculation anymore…now he’s using the New York Times’ speculation.
Mr. Turnip-Green Jeans
March 17th, 2010
3:21 pm
I agree that the hip-hop atmosphere at Hawks games is a HUGE turn-off to many. I used to attend around half their games, but not a single one in the past 5-years. They’re courting a crowd I’m alien to.
The Thrashers? Their plight is simple. Nobody gives a damn.
Otto
March 17th, 2010
3:23 pm
http://www.ksuicehockey.com/history.php
Kennesaw State would bring home the ultimate title as the 2006-2007 ACHA D3 National Champions. No other team from the South division has ever claimed a National Championship, and in five years, the Owls were able to build a program of such tremendous success.
…and Atlanta is not a Hockey town?
DHD
March 17th, 2010
3:24 pm
Atlanta attendance: It’s not about being “leery” of going downtown, it’s the fact that Atlanta only has 450,000 people inside the city limits and 5 million outside the limits. People are NOT going to leave work, drive an hour to Alpharetta, get the kids and drive back to Atlanta another hour for a game, especially when it is on TV. When school is in, the kids aren’t getting to bed until midnight. You can’t compare other cities to Atlanta because no city has this population makeup. That’s why moving the sports venues to the north would increase the attendance. It’s all about convenience.
Dr. Warren
March 17th, 2010
3:34 pm
The fault is NOT with the fans. Customer needs come first. The Spirit has not filled those needs adequately. So naturally, the laws of business are interceding, and the ship is finally sinking. 2 years of winning basketball don’t cancel out 9 years of horrible losing. If the Hawks had a bankable major star–read: draft incompetency; If the Hawks had had a big name coach–read: cheapness; if the Hawks gotten rid of those boring red uniforms and dated logo much earlier–read: lack of imagination; if the Hawks had overhauled the fan experience a la Arthur Blank–read: putting the customer first. If they had done these and more, they wouldn’t be in trouble. Let’s not blame Atlanta’s customer base, transients or natives. It’s a business–and it’s been poorly run.
ELVISINTHEHOUSE.
March 17th, 2010
3:35 pm
Greg everyone who works and get a check will pay for health care if there black white purple or gold.Its simple,this blog is for people’s opinion if you don’t like downtown then don’t go downtown.And for everyone who don’t like coming to the games because of there location,last i checked the teams have been and are thus far are doing a great job without your funding.Your choice of living is just that your choice.
Lee
March 17th, 2010
3:54 pm
Oh please no! Love the Thrashers and the Hawks!
George G.
March 17th, 2010
3:59 pm
The NY Times article says that the economy is “on the mend.” What economy are they talking about?
Anthony
March 17th, 2010
4:16 pm
Time for the Atlanta (and other) sport franchises to come back to reality. Paying top dollar to watch over-paid millionaires play a game has a ever shrinking base of paying customers. The supply and demand curve is reflecting lower ticket prices is required to increase fans in the seats. However, the greed factor does not follow the logic and is exactly why I stopped buying tickets years ago.
tmerge
March 17th, 2010
4:19 pm
God, I am so tired of these clueless owners, the Atlanta Spirit. Look, I don’t have any problem with anyone spending their hard-earned money (though inthe case of the Spirit, there are at least a few spending daddy’s or daddy-in-law’s money) any way they want to. But these guys have absolutely no clue what is going on or how to run a team. There’s only one or two of them that really even ran a business for any period of time.
Just look at the pic that comes with this blog – a bunch of guys who should NEVER be allowed to dress up like this and try to recapture their youths. They spent their money for front-row seats and all the jerseys/sweaters they wanted, but they have wasted our time, money and patience.
They have made NO smart decisions on the Thrashers’ side of the ledger, and on the Hawks’ side, well even a blind squirrel finds a nut every once in a while. The tough decisions with the Hawks (JJ, Smoove, etc.) are just around the corner, and they’ll find some way to screw these up, too.
These guys are the laughingstock of the leagues and I hope that their foolishness and (dare I repeat myself) cluelessness doesn’t cost us the franchises themselves.
David McDavid, are you still out there? How about you, Jim Kennedy? Arthur, can you spare any money now that the Dome is paid for?
JSS
March 17th, 2010
4:37 pm
Co-sign Niremetal!!!
Najeh Davenpoop
March 17th, 2010
4:39 pm
“NBA is way too expensive to attend – particularly when we’re all cutting back. Add up parking, food, drinks, and tickets for one game and you could buy a nice TV.”
Nice TVs go for $30 now?
chas
March 17th, 2010
4:40 pm
Got to drop the prices for the Thrashers and Hawks games. I went to a Thrashers game a week ago and we dropped $30 for upper level seats and then another $30 on beer to kill the pain of the game. Thrashers went down 3-0 in the first 15 minutes. Very simple formula…fill the seats with lower priced tickets and make your money on concessions. I love hockey, but there has never been an NHL team in Atlanta that got out of the first round of the playoffs so aren’t I a fool to keep watching? I think the attendance at the Thrashers game is actually very good relative to what the team has been doing. Hockey will work in Atlanta if you give the people a good product and lower the prices..real simple. Hawks attendance probably is off for the same reasons. LOWER THE PRICE!!!!!!
go thrash!
March 17th, 2010
4:47 pm
Jeff
why do you hate the spirit?
Also the only reason the thrashers have not had big crowd is because Bruce will not make a change with gm. I looked at Boston, Chicago , and Washington attendance when they had issues and there attendance was horrible. You harp (it is the 17th) on hockey not making it here. This town more than enough hockey support. The issue bruce’s unwillingness to make a wholesale change in the front office. The anti hockey/ thrasher crowd on this do not reflect the thousands in atlanta who love hockey. You need to go to the root of the issue and analyze why Bruce won’t make a change. We have core talent but it needs tone nurtured properly and the 18000 will be back.
Intereting that the thrash have on some nights outdrwan hawks.
So speaking of the Hawks, who I apprciate, their constituency is totally different.
Basketball people generally speaking are not hockey and vice versa. You of all people should not that. Please stop writting negative articles against hockey that do not have substance.
chas
March 17th, 2010
4:52 pm
By the way, NBA can work well in Atlanta, so don’t pin the blame on fan apathy. Look at the Hawks in the mid to late 1980’s…they had great attendance and a great product and a great record, but never advanced past the second round of the playoffs. So, it has been proven that we can draw large crowds for the Hawks so there is certainly a solution. And, the city had alot fewer people back then. Maybe we need to bring back the OMNI.
The Smart Move
March 17th, 2010
4:53 pm
The Atlanta Spirit should sell the thrashers and some of that money can be used to sign some free agents for the hawks so that the team can get over the top and maybe win a championship.
Atl Resident
March 17th, 2010
4:57 pm
This damn group of “owners” should have never bought both franchises in the first damn place. They been catfighting ever since they got here. I hope Blank is listening cause these franchises just need one owner but it’s took around 10 years for public to finally see that.
go thrash
March 17th, 2010
4:58 pm
chas
you’re right….but its all about winnung consistently. Not going to playoffs and losing 4 straight. Same for Thrashers who have done nothing but consistenly lose. However when they had a glimmer of hope they were packing them in.
The Hawks fans will reurn but they still are not believers.
We have one of the best buildings for both but we need to believe
Andrew G
March 17th, 2010
4:59 pm
I live in Colorado and bought the NHL center ice package for $150. I can watch every game for what it would cost for 2 single game tickets at Philips. Lower the ticket prices and build a fan base…..ASG has got to go…….Oh and I bought $5 seats when the Thrash came to Denver. Ted….Arthur….please help an Atlanta Fan out!
Thug Town
March 17th, 2010
5:00 pm
The hawks / philips arena area is just a big thug / hip hop fest on game nights and that’s how they market the team. I’d rather stay in the suburbs and watch a movie at a metroplex than deal with that atmosphere. The city never learns—it’s always the same downtown.
chas
March 17th, 2010
5:02 pm
I agree with some of the other comments. Can you imagine any sane/profitable business blaming the customers for not buying their product? That is a recipe for disaster if you don’t look in the mirror first and don’t understand your target market. People are motivated by pain and pleasure and if you give them more pain than pleasure they ain’t gonna fill the seats.
go thrash
March 17th, 2010
5:05 pm
unlike Bruce, Art has fired people who do not get the job done. But I have been to many Falcon games during the down days when it has been have empty but does Shultz write a negative article about Art? Does he suggest they are moving on absolutely no basis?
No, why? because he has a personal issue with Bruce. But Bruce should forget about Jeff and make the right decision about the management of thrahsers.
WeSupportHockeyInAtlanta
March 17th, 2010
5:06 pm
Cue the Canadian media rumors about the Thrashers moving to Winnipeg, Hamilton, or Quebec City (That’s where the Atlanta Knights ended up moving to after the Omni was imploded.).
I think that the most likely local bidder if the teams are on the market or ASG is looking for new partners would be the Dickey family. They were one of the groups that made a play for the Braves prior to the deal with Liberty Media. Maybe Jerry Reinsdorf would be interested in the Thrashers (He couldn’t own the Hawks since he owns the Chicago Bulls.) as well as the Phillips Arena rights?
When you consider that there are rumors that the NHL may be owning the Phoenix Coyotes a little bit longer than expected (There are rumors that the Ice Edge Group, who is supposed to be buying the team, may be forced to pull out.), it may be a bit tougher to sell an NHL team unless the league is cool with the team possibly relocating (Which as long as Count Bettman is running things, there will not be any relocation of any NHL team.).
Hawks fan
March 17th, 2010
5:08 pm
Gwinnett Mom,
People need to avoid the suburbs to stay away from people like you!
As for the Hawks and Thrashers they both deserve a better following, especially the Hawks. With all of their talent, the games should be sold out every weekend. Come support your home teams if you want them to last.
Thrash
March 17th, 2010
5:37 pm
I’ll be GLAD to hand over my money for Thrasher and/or Hawks tickets when I actually get value for my money… until then… Even the Braves have become a money losing adventure for the fan but overall, much more economical bang for the buck than the Philips Arena tenants.
heartofdarkness
March 17th, 2010
5:41 pm
Nothing attracts and illustrates biodiversity like a moldering corpse or a Jeff Schultz blog.
Unless the US economy generates better returns than currently forecast, sports teams are likely to retain attractive shelter from taxes for US owners and inflation hedges against loose monetary discipline if the political system fails to self correct from the age of excess over the last quarter century. Likely, these assets will attract foreign owners as well in the manner of the European soccer leagues.
Pressure will build on professional sports team’s operating budgets due to unemployment and tighter controls over corporate expenses. That may result in lower player salaries and smaller professional sports budgets. [Worry not, UGA fans, you have significant public subsidies of your sports infrastructure and your labor costs remain of the pre-industrial age.] Redirecting expenditures to areas that may have more long lasting social benefits might be a good thing for future generations.
I try to imagine a moneyed individual or entity, however, who would be willing to join the ASG without acquiring at least 51% of the ownership. Theoretically, the markets should have removed the assets of anyone that dense.
KnightInATL
March 17th, 2010
5:44 pm
Don’t look for the Braves to bring in any high attendance numbers this year either. Guess how many Fri/Sat/Sun home games we have this year against the Mets and Phils.
A nice round ZERO. That’s right, no weekend series’ against the top division rivals this year.
MrHughes
March 17th, 2010
5:46 pm
This article is rubbish. The Hawks and Thrashers aren’t going anywhere. They are a package deal! As long as they are tied to the arena, neither league is going to sign off on leaving one of the most attractive tv markets in the country. I was at the Thrashers vs Sabers game last night. The attendance was 12,540 (67.6% full). That’s not bad for a game in the middle of the week. Also, the Sabers and Thrashers sold out a game at aproximately the same time at Philips last season.
The reason the Thrashers are not pulling in fans isn’t about traffic, cost, marketing or stars. Wins equal higher attendance numbers. I think folks are just waiting to see about the Hawks. The fans will come once the playoffs get here. I think it’s funny to see people complain about DW and spell his name wrong though. It is what it is.
Building a stadium/arena in the suburbs is dumb and has been rehashed on here countless ways. I’ve ventured to Gwinnett Arena once and it took me twice as long to get to the highway as it ever has leaving Philips or the GaDome. Moreover, GWA right next to the I-85 and is half the size of Philips! The Force at Gwinnett was a joke. After a lot of fanfare and cries of “we [GW] have our own team and we will support them” they and the AFL died with a wimper in the burbs despite basically being subsized by the NFL.
The Braves deal can only be described as thievery; that process reaked shadyness and that team should still be in Richmond. Keep complaining about politics in Atlanta folks. There’s egg all over your faces…
Then the Glads. The only reason they exist at GWA is because they are an affiliate of the Thrashers. FYI:The Glads played in front of only 6400 people the other night. It’s all relative folks.
As for the crime “arguement” I regularly walk around downtown at night, have never have been bothered, and don’t get scared when people look at and/or speak to me. But, that’s what happens when some folks become BIG boys and BIG girls behind computer screens. Anyway, some of y’all must have “Welcome to the big city” looks on your faces that encourage all these thieving criminals to steal your dowries.
Yea right…
UGASlobberknocker
March 17th, 2010
5:52 pm
The Hawks arent going anywhere so any new ownership would be welcome. As for the Thrashers, the present ownership has pi$$ed on the fan base for so long that if the Thrashers moved out of town, not many people would care.Many would not even notice. I love hockey and go back to the Flames, but enough is enough..I refuse to spend another dime on the Thrashers.Hopefully new ownership would spend some $ and get the fans back. The stands now look like a high school wrestling match.
UGASlobberknocker
March 17th, 2010
5:54 pm
If there were 12k fans at the Thrashers game last night, about half of them came disguised as empty seats. They may have sold that many but no way there were that many people there not even close.
ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
March 17th, 2010
5:58 pm
Somebody wake me up when Mr. Hughes quits rambling. Mr H pls, pretend your are twittering and keep it to 140 characters..then someone may read it.
mario scandrett
March 17th, 2010
6:04 pm
I will buy the HAWKS if Arthur Blank doesnt…..
emptyseats
March 17th, 2010
6:08 pm
My question is who told this guy from the NY times that the economy is on the mend? Is he living in the same country that I am?
Title Town
March 17th, 2010
6:56 pm
Hockey down in atlanta is a joke! Up in New York, the fans support the team win or lose. We have a loyal fan base that always shows up. I miss living in the Bronx—hopefully, I can move back soon when the economy picks up. Too many rednecks down here.
Native Georgian 1988
March 17th, 2010
7:18 pm
I wish we could just be honest. We all know why attendance is suffering. First of all, it’s the economy. With a good amount of people who have left the city, or have remained but are unemployed, you diminish the pool of potential attendees.
Second, racism and classism is an issue. It is an issue in every big city. White people left the city in droves decades ago because they didn’t want to live in the now segregated city. They passed on those fears to their children, and in some cases, sadly, their grandchildren.
The reason MARTA is having problems is because it hasn’t been expanded sufficiently so that it’s ridership is large enough to support the service it should be offering. May of those folks who fled the city thought that those black and poor folks would get on MARTA, come out to their neighborhoods, and commit crimes and then wait at the bus stop to be taken back to the city. Don’t laugh, if you have lived in the city for a bit, you know I’m right. This euphemism is known as the “I don’t want my property value to decrease”.
Lastly, we have team management. Or Mismanagement if you’d like. For whatever the reason, ownership does not inspire fans. This includes the Braves now too. This city responds to aggressive and successful ownership. Fans want to know that the owners burn to win a championship, year after year. Perhaps Ted Turner spoiled us, but we all know that if these teams start to win and are compelling, the fans come. The decision not to connect Turner stadium with MARTA was one of the worst planning decisions in the city’s history. The Ted needs to be a connect point in every direction much like 5 points , directly out to the suburbs and later to commuter rail that will take advantage of the fan base that lives around the state and region.
The Braves once were among the tops in attendance, but they spent more aggressively and didn’t talk about self-imposed budgets. Fans will pay for a consistent winner, even if they don’t sellout during the Fall. The Hawks were once the toast of the town, they had no problems filling the Omni during the days Fratello was coaching and at the start of the Wilkens era. The Flames and Thrashers have had their moments, if they win and are compelling.
The teams aren’t going to move to the suburbs because the infrastructure is not there and the tax payers aren’t going to want to pony up. Better to stay in a central location with infrastructure already in place.
Sorry to go so long, put I’m tired of reading crap euphemisms such as, “leery to go downtown”. I grew up in the ‘burbs, and can tell you, there are far more drugs and drug users out there than in the city. Everything from glue sniffing kids in elementary school, on through the availability of every hard and soft drug you could want, is available, in the ‘burbs. Oh, and don’t forget plenty of prescription drugs availability too. The only difference is that it’s behind doors, or they come to the city sometimes and party. If you aren’t stupid, then you tend to remain safe in the city. Those that look as if they are among aliens tend to arouse others to violence due to sheer stupidity and disrespect.
Star of the Zanarkand Abes!
March 17th, 2010
7:36 pm
Atlanta needs more GM’s, sports team owners, and citizens like Khao$ and P Rose.
I haven’t seen anyone on AJC.com make so much sense since…….EVER!!!
no round ball, please
March 17th, 2010
7:36 pm
Sell the Hawks, spend the money on the Thrashers.
Coach D
March 17th, 2010
8:25 pm
Steve Smith, Kevin Willis, David McDavid : )… Where are you????
Scare Dee Cat
March 17th, 2010
8:28 pm
I am the biggest wuss and the the most fearful person on the planet. I hate big cities. I’m a thrashers STH and Even the most sparsely attended weekday game doesn’t cause me anxiety. traffic and parking is a peice of cake for anyone on the southside. This team was routinely selling out before the basketball bafoons took over. It’s a shame. this town could be Hockey Town Two! Two in O’Ten! Too bad..
RCH BCH
March 17th, 2010
8:39 pm
Questions for Native Georgian 1988
What were the demographics of clayton county prior to ctran(the supposed model for how marta can slither into the burbs without it being marta), and what are they now? And what have property values done?
Answer key:..white, black, fallen thru the damn floor..
BRock
March 17th, 2010
8:46 pm
They should sell tickets cheaper since they are raping us with concessions. If you want people to come to games make it affordable or at least doable. If you bought $15 Thrasher seats in the 400 level an individual would on average spend $50 on beer and food while at the game. That is outrageous. Government should step in and not allow the monopoly that is arena concessions. $6.50 for a beer? That mark up is in excess of 500%. It probably cost them $1.00 tops for that beer. A hot dog for $5.50? Probably cost them $.75. That is the scam. If they charged less for the concessions they could reasonably charge more for the seats. People can understand that. When one person is going to shell out upwards of $100 on themselves for a sporting event and 15% is for the ticket then people will not go.
If the ASG cut concession prices in half they would probably sell 15,000 on average to a game. Also the parking is a scam too. $12 to park in Centennial Garage? Get real.
Tightey Whitey
March 17th, 2010
9:02 pm
Why would anyone want to go down to Philips for any reason period, and have to deal with the following:$
(1)FOUL SMELLING HOMELESS LOWLIFES ASKING FOR MONEY.
(2)SIT NEXT TO OR NEAR CLUELESS UNEDUCATED, FOWL SMELLING GHETTO THUGS WITH A BASEBALL CAP TURNED SIDEWAYS FLASHING BLING AND ACTING LIKE THE LOWLIFES THEY TRULY ARE.
(3)PAY TOP DOLLAR TO BASICALLY SEE A ZOO FULL OF GRILLED AZZHOLES THAT HAVE NO BUSINESS ATTENDING A PRO SPORTING EVENT
(4) WASTE MY MONEY FOR SUBPAR CONCESSIONS
(5) PAY FOR INFLATED PARKING RUN BY (FOWL SMELLING GHETTO THUGS)
(6) FIGHT THE CONGESTION OF DOWNTOWN TRAFFIC
(7) WITNESS A TEAM COACHED BY A TOTAL MORON WHO IS A DRUNK AND DOES NOT HAVE A CLUE
I once was a Hawks season ticket holder during the Hubie Brown era and never missed a game but Ill be dammned if I am going to subsidize anything that is black oriented. As far as the Thrashers who gives a rats azz if they win lose or leave town. Do mme a favor and do just like the FLAMES and go NORTH. Inferior product, inferior GM, inferior coaching, inferior talent and inferior marketing.
As far as Iam concerned the whole city of Atlanta ir run by IGNORANT UNEDUCATED GHETTO THUGS. That is why whites stay away from downtown period. Let the blacks continue to screw up everything for all of us and we will stay home and watch the product on TV for nothing. In case you havent noticed, whites have the spending power to make a franchise succesful, blacks cant afford chit and thus the franchises will lose money and leave town.
Cater the product to attract professional educated clean smelling patrons and the product will be supported.
It is the same old story with underground, buckhead nightlife and so on. When ever and where ever there are lowlifes, the whites will stay away and things will go in chitter.
Hockeyfan
March 17th, 2010
9:06 pm
I wonder why the Spirit didnt respond to you. Maybe they read the NYT article and saw where it only says “thought to be for sale”.
Or maybe they just dont read your columns. Who could blame them?
gcs
March 17th, 2010
9:10 pm
Atlanta Spirit: Don’t let the door hit you on the way out.
….
Star of the Zanarkand Abes!
March 17th, 2010
9:18 pm
Native Georgian 1988: I’ve been here since 1980, and you’re exactly right.
If one of these teams catches fire and wins a title, thanks to SMART management, this city will go insane. (And the parade will be down Peachtree, not any street in the burbs.)
B. Thenet
March 17th, 2010
9:33 pm
Hockeyfan: Exactly. What exactly is ASG going to dispute, that someone at a business think tank thinks they are for sale.
Sometimes Jeff just likes hucking bricks at beehives to see what happens.
Atlanta Hawks - Page 30 - iSTORYA.NET
March 17th, 2010
9:50 pm
[...] outscored 31-18 and attempted stupid shots. Hasola na ani ilang style oi. Haha! SELL THE TEAM!!! HAWKS/THRASHERS FOR SALE? Now that the economy seems to be on the mend, owners who held off selling during the downturn are [...]
Matt the Brave
March 17th, 2010
10:09 pm
Pretty sure that the NBA would block the Hawks from moving, but I don’t see the NHL moving to block the Thrashers from getting out of town. It’s a shame, too, because they seem to have a lot of potential. Frankly, there doesn’t seem to be a lot going on at Philips Arena for the fans other than the game. Not saying that this shouldn’t be the main focus, but at least have something…
Sean Grace
March 17th, 2010
10:28 pm
Jeff,
Are you sure you haven’t willed this to happen? Have your evil powers finally peaked?
There are many reasons for the Thrashers lack of success. It starts with sub-piss poor Ownership with an assist by upper management. Reason 117 or so is the AJC or more specifically, you. What did this organization do to you to merit the obvious hatred you have not been even attempted to conceal? You have all but call Don Waddell a moron over and over again. For years you’ve had it out for the Thrashers. Now, whether Don is or isn’t a dullard is not the question. The question is should a hometown Reporter somewhat support a struggling organization by occasionally writing something positive?
I am a devout hockey and Thrasher fan and never miss a home game. I know I am an anomaly but there are a few thousand like me. My contention is that there would be many more thousand if the AJC had eased up on the constant Thrasher bashing years ago. But let’s forget about placing blame for a moment. Obviously the negative articles in the AJC have not caused the habitual losing of games, stars, and fan base hope.
More than a few of us are curious. What happened between you and the Thrashers? Please share Jeff! I assume you and Waddell have exchanged heated words more than once. How did it begin?
Sean
Report says Hawks and Thrashers may both be for sale | Atlanta Hawks Fan Store
March 17th, 2010
10:50 pm
[...] Atlanta Journal Constitution (blog) [...]
Quick hits: Spirit mute; Thomas climbs; Obama goes red | Jeff Schultz
March 17th, 2010
10:57 pm
[...] POSTSCRIPT: So I posted this blog Wednesday morning on the Times story. Sent emails to two owners (Mike Gearon, Bruce Levenson), two general managers [...]
Brendan
March 17th, 2010
11:01 pm
It took a long time to read all these comments. Lots of interesting points. So, here’s mine. I’ve been waiting, and waiting … and waiting for this team (Thrashers) to be sold. It can’t be sold soon enough! Please, for the love of Pete, let an owner arrive on the scene who cares for hockey. And if the Hawks get sold, too, same deal. Let a true basketball aficianado emerge.
I can only hope this story is true. I really want the Thrashers to be sold. I have something close to zero confidence in this group. The fundamental lack of respect they show to their very own consumers … is remarkable. Bruce Levenson should never … speak … to the public. He pushes the bile to the tip of our throats.
Jeff Schultz
March 17th, 2010
11:13 pm
Sean — I don’t hate Don Waddell, or the franchise, or certainly the sport. I’ve followed hockey since my youth. And if you blame me or anybody at the AJC or anybody in the media for the Atlanta Thrashers’ failures, you’re being short-sighted. Teams win, the media reports positive stories. Teams lose, the media reports negative stories. Did the Braves lose before 1991 because of negative stories or because the franchise was poorly constructed? It’s really that simple. You need to take a step back, Sean. No hidden agendas, no conspiracies.
Tired of Being TEASED!!
March 17th, 2010
11:24 pm
The PROBLEM with Atlanta Pro Sports is NOT the Fans…..It’s the poor performance of the teams!
The 2 COLLEGE teams (GT & UGA) have MORE championships in football since 1980 than all of the Atlanta professional teams combined!! How bizarrely PATHETIC is that? And you want us to pay 60 bucks a seat to sit in the 300s in Philips for a 2-1/2 hour game?
Atlanta Fans should take a bow!
The Thrashers are out of the playoffs again yet 16,000 fans still show up for the weekend games. Swept in 4 games after their only playoff appearance….PATHETIC!!
Last year the Hawks had their first WINNING season since the 98-99 season! They GAVE UP and quit playing against LeBron & Crew and got swept. Joe Johnson turned down $60 Mill basically saying he WON’T BE BACK next year. WOW! I really want to go see that PATHETIC team play….
The Braves teased us with 14 consecutive Division titles and 5 trips to the World Series only to lay egg after egg when it counted and winning only ONE World Series. How do you take the FIRST TWO at the Bronx and then fold like an old suitcase….PATHETIC!!
And “let Blank buy the teams” like he’s performed some miracle with the Falcons. How about drafting Mike Vick and putting the UGLIEST FREAKIN BLACK EYE ON THIS CITY in the history of professional sports. That’s what the Falcons are known for – “They had that Mike Vick fella didn’t they? The one who was electrocuting and hanging dogs on his days off?” Thanks Vick…You’re gone but sadly you’ll NEVER be forgotten! The Falcons, by the slimmest of margins produced back to back winning seasons the past 2 years for the FIRST TIME in the history of the franchise! PATHETIC!!
YOU WANT FANS??? HOW ABOUT GIVING FANS A WINNING FRIGGIN PROFESSIONAL TEAM? YOU KNOW – A CHAMPIONSHIP!!
Dave Justice can lick himself….I stood in the lines for playoff tickets that wrapped all the way around the old Atl Fulco Stadium!! We showed up while it was the BRAVES who didn’t!
Tired of Being TEASED!!
March 17th, 2010
11:33 pm
CORRECTION: Vick was drafted in April 2001, Blank bought the ‘Cons in Dec 2001. Vick was named starting QB for 2002 season after Blank bought them (The Amazing Chris Chandler was starting QB in 2001 season).
go thrash/Hawks
March 18th, 2010
12:11 am
it is personal Jeff….we are not stupid..but nice try
Brendan
March 18th, 2010
12:30 am
Jeff, on the hockey blogs, we’ve been discussing “Can you pinpoint the defining moment of failure of the Thrashers franchise, since inception?” Here are, so far, the choices discussed. Then I’ll reveal my choice. And then ask you for yours.
1. The hiring of Don Waddell in 1998
2. The selection of Dan Marr as Chief of Scouting
3. The 2002 Draft, with the selection of Lehtonen, a goalie who would take 5 years to develop
4. The Heatley Crash/Dan Snyder death
5. The 4 trade deadline moves of 2007
6. Standing pat, after the 2007 playoff sweep
7. Firing Bob Hartley in 2008
8. Failure to re-sign Hossa during the 2007 offseason, leading to the 2008 trade deadline move
9. Failure to retain Kovalchuk this year. (Re-sign him in July, or September, forcing the trade deadline move in 2010.)
10. The re-signing of Don Waddell as GM for two more seasons after an 11-4-1 performance behind the bench in 2008, in immediate relief of Hartley.
Jeff, my choice is #6. I just don’t see HOW … after mortgaging the future with 4 trade deadline moves that resulted in zero playoff wins, that an organization’s response could possibly be … to DO ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. No one was fired. Not Dan Marr. Not Bob Hartley. Not Don Waddell. The result? The 2007 free agent signings included Eric Perrin and Todd White. And perhaps causally, the failure of Marian Hossa to even negotiate with Atlanta, along with the re-signing of GM Waddell for another two seasons. It really is quite staggering. Please weigh in with your choice.
Stone Cold Schultz
March 18th, 2010
1:59 am
Jeff Schultz
March 17th, 2010
11:13 pm
Sean — I don’t hate Don Waddell, or the franchise, or certainly the sport. I’ve followed hockey since my youth. And if you blame me or anybody at the AJC or anybody in the media for the Atlanta Thrashers’ failures, you’re being short-sighted. Teams win, the media reports positive stories.
OK Schultz – I’m calling you out! You’ve written much about the Thrashers lately. Kindly point me to the most recent POSITIVE piece you’ve penned about the Thrashers. (Sorry, but the thing earlier today about them possibly being sold and leaving town doesn’t count.)
Perhaps it was during the unlikely 6-game point streak after Kovalchuk was fired that began Feb 6th when the team collected 10 out of a possible 12 pts? Nah, didn’t think so.
Maybe it was when the team had to bus out of the blizzard in DC to VA, taking about 4 hrs and including an accident on the icy highway to fly into Hartsfield and literally race to Philips Arena, change into their uni’s and BEAT the Panthers 4-2 before a raucous crowd of nearly 17,000 rabid Thrasher fans. Nah, didn’t think so.
Maybe it was about how the ASG owners should be commended for making Kovalchuk the highest $$$ offer in the history of the NHL to try and keep him here for the rest of his career, since he frequently stated to the press (you guys) that he wanted to end his career as a Thrasher. Nah, didn’t think so.
Perhaps it was knowing when to cut bait with Kovalchuk and Waddell/Dudley picking New Jersey’s young talent dry for just a 20-something game RENTAL of a player that was practically unmoveable because he just turned down more money to play ice hockey than half the countries in the world’s GDPs! Nah, didn’t think so.
Maybe it was when they played a very good Phoenix team Sun into a shootout, then followed that up with a full 60-min (winning) effort against the #3 team in the East – Buffalo – Tues nt, chasing the Olympic MVP Goalie in just the first 5 min of the game with 3 goals in 5 shots? Nah, that’s when you reported that the team is possibly up for sale and may leave town.
Really Mr. Schultz…..Please point us to the last article/blog you wrote about the Thrashers that was POSITIVE. I’d like to see how you felt about them then and what in the world happened to turn you against them. I’ll go out on a limb and say there are a few of us who read your stuff who would like the answer……I honestly can’t remember when you wrote something good about the Thrashers.
sam'l
March 18th, 2010
4:49 am
The Hawks have broken their fans hearts for 50 years now. Look at tonight’s game with the Raptors. Impossible to lose, but the Hawks did it. (sigh) I said two weeks ago on another blog that Woodson has to go NOW, because Joe gonna go, the team gonna go if they don’t bring in a tactician to move these guys where they should be, a couple of games behind Cleveland……and deep intot the playoffs. Really, Sund’s logical move, to let Woody run out his contract will lead to the departure of this team.
.
sam lee
March 18th, 2010
5:05 am
if u taking atlanta hawks out take all sports out braves thrashers falcons and all college football or basketball garbage take atlanta out of the sports games lets depend on home depot coca cola aquarium or worlds busiest airport thank you
Jeff Schultz
March 18th, 2010
8:46 am
Stone Cold Schultz — Yeah, it’s been a while since I’ve written a positive piece. But seriously, a column on a team having a brief point/winning streak after the Kovalchuk trade is no more relevant than doing a column on the six-game losing streak that followed. Like I said, take a step back. Big picture never changed. If team’s point/winning streak had continued for an extended period, positive things would’ve been written. Otherwise, it’s an aberration. Hey look, you and Sean and anybody can believe anything you want. That’s fine. You’re fans. But don’t assume I have some agenda just because we disagree.
RenegadesRugby
March 18th, 2010
10:05 am
This is in reference to an earlier post about the implications of the US possibly hosting the 2018 World Cup Soccer Tournament. I don’t believe that this would enable the Falcons to get a new stadium. The GA Dome successfully hosted two major soccer matches this past summer and I believe that was done as a trial to determine if it could host a World Cup match.
Furthermore, the president of FIFA has said that it would be preferable if the US did not bid for 2018, and instead bid for 2022. The Falcons lease is up in 2020, I think. And a decision will probably be made around 2016 whether they are staying or leaving.
Back to the original question. It is good that we can watch the Thrashers on SportsSouth, but the NHL as a whole needs to work on a deal with CBS, Fox, ABC or NBC instead of playing on VS. I personally think that the economy is affecting the Hawks revenue. People would spend more to see a team in the top 4 of the conference, even if the East is weak. It may not sell out, but there would be more butts in seats.
RenegadesRugby
March 18th, 2010
10:07 am
to clarify, I meant whether the Falcons are staying in the Dome or moving to a new stadium. I did not mean for anyone to think that I am speculating that the Falcons might leave Atlanta.
Hopeless
March 18th, 2010
11:28 am
Have arthur blank buy the hawks or thrashers? funny stuff!! What has he done with the falcons? Nothing, except waste money on overrated talent and produce mediocrity.
Stone Cold Schultz
March 18th, 2010
11:49 am
The point is, when you take a step back, things HAVE changed with the Thrashers because the “franchise player” is gone. So if your big picture is to pen things about the team post-Kovalchuk – which is what us “fans” buy tickets to go see – then there have been several instances where something positive could’ve been written…Even if it would’ve been an “OK, so the Thrashers have moved into the #8 playoff spot but will it last?” story.
In contrast, here’s what we see you’ve written recently about the UGA BB Team:
♦ No miracles for Georgia, but direction is established
♦ We’re LIVE and Thompkins says, ‘We want to win it all’
♦ These Dogs are tired of talking about 2008 Dogs
♦ Georgia drills Arkansas — and could it happen again?
♦ We’re live from Nashville: Is it miracle time for Georgia?
Clearly a POSITIVE tone, even in defeat. The “big picture” never changed. They were the SAME TEAM that finished at the bottom of the SEC East with a .313 Conf winning % and an 0-8 Conf road record. See how you found OPTIMISM in that “big picture”?
You were clearly GAGA over the Braves in FLA. You sounded like their new PR Guy.
You’re giving GT BB the benefit of the doubt “if Shumpert gets the point”. This is in the face of an embattled, underachieving coach who has grown roots at the school and after having an entire season of working with possibly the most talented players in the ACC, they ended the reg season with another losing Conf record, a 1-7 Conf road record and their two biggest challenges remain 1) the inbounds pass and 2) trying to keep unforced turnovers at under 20 per game. This “big picture” hasn’t changed in 5 years. Same coach, talented recruits, underachieving performance….But you’re “cautiously optimistic” entering the Big Dance.
Now here are your recent Thrashers headlines:
Trade deadline passes, no help on the way for Thrashers
Lehtonen trade is another blemish on Thrashers’ draft history
Bettman wants Thrashers’ owners to get their act together
Kovalchuk dealt to New Jersey in sad, expected ending
Thrashers blow it with Kovalchuk, as with everything else
You looked at UGA BB and pulled out optimism. You looked at GT BB and pulled out optimism. You looked at the Braves and could find no wrong. You even looked at Tiger Woods and found praise for him.
With the Thrashers, you went to Commish Bettman (publicly) before the Olympic break to stir things up and add pressure to a situation that could obviously USE a little optimism. Now you call it “unprofessional” when they won’t respond to your latest inquiries. See how things don’t quite add up? See how your readers can easily believe you have some agenda, even if you don’t?
Obviously you can continue to deny it and if there actually is something going on behind the scenes – which you still deny – then it probably isn’t fit to print anyway. But Thrashers Fans suffer enough already and it would be nice if you could dig deep, suck it up and find a silver lining every once in awhile when writing about what is still “our” team at this time. Your loyal readers deserve it.
CrazyDiamond
March 18th, 2010
3:07 pm
Hey Stone Cold – Maybe yopu should cut the pills in half before you post again.
If you don’t like what the AJC prints about the sorry state of the Thrashers try reading about them somewhere else. If the AJC wrote glowing praise about this poorly run franchise you would be happy but nobody else would believe it. This team would still stink if Schultzie never wrote another blog.
Brendan – I love your “Top Ten Reasons the Thrashers Have Gone Nowhere” list above. My pick: All of the above. I would add just one that captures the sad state of the clueless ownership mess.
Stone Cold Schultz
March 18th, 2010
3:52 pm
CrazyDiamond, nobody asked you.
Brendan
March 18th, 2010
4:19 pm
Thanks Crazy Diamond. I was hoping to get a response from Schultz. Oh well. At this point, too much time has passed, and he’s inked 2-3 more blogs already.
Jeff Schultz
March 18th, 2010
5:45 pm
Brendan — That’s a very difficult call. Obviously DW has failed to build a winning franchise, develop players, grow the sport or cultivate a large fan base in Atlanta. So I guess it starts with him. … From there you could go with early personnel decisions (Damian Rhodes as your stabilizing influence in goal behind an expansion roster) or philosophy (trying to have an open attacking style right away with slow, less-talented players.) The Minnesota route (better coach, better system) would’ve created more early success. …
I never thought Hossa was going to re-sign here. If they had foreseen that, they might’ve gotten more in a trade if they moved him earlier.
2) As for Dan Marr (a great guy, by the way), Don ultimately makes the decisions so I don’t put it on Dan.
3) Kari Lehtonen — definitely a problem because he was expected to be first franchise goalie;
4) Heatley/Snyder — obviously a huge setback but remember they got a good player in return (Hossa) and made the playoffs, so issues thereafter weren’t really because of the accident;
5) Obviously the Coburn trade was a crusher. I didn’t criticize Don much for that because he believed (and I believed) they HAD to make trades to get into the playoffs, and they did. The bigger problem was that because of poor previous decisions, he had to make desperate trades.
6) Significant. Very significant. Part of a long-term problem of believing every young player on the roster was going to be better the following year and every older player would be just as good. This gets back to building.
7) I’ve said it enough times: Bob got jobbed. Do I think he had lost the locker room? Yes, absolutely. But that’s more a statement on the players in the room than Bob.
9) Kovalchuk — Obviously a step back. Once again, failed to read the tea leaves. Ended up getting too little for him.
10) I think you know my stand on that one.
If I had to pick one thing, you have to go back to the beginning. No. 1. DW is the only one who’s been here from the outset. Not everything is his fault, obviously. Hands are somewhat tied now by ownership. But if his blueprint worked from the outset, the franchise would’ve been more successful and the current owners would not have put limitations on him. Remember, when the Atlanta Spirit first took over, they allowed Don to spend money.
Brendan
March 18th, 2010
6:19 pm
Thank you, Jeff. There were a lot of votes at Rawhide’s site for choice #1, “the hiring of Don Waddell.” I guess I can’t really argue it. Much of the blame has to fall on him. Though, clearly, not ALL of it. But somehow, I guess the ‘wishful thinker’ in me, kept believing that if the organization had just fired Wadell and everyone he hired, back in 2007, that the roster could essentially be redone over the next 2-3 years. Who knows, maybe a “home” for Bobby Holik could have been found, too.
I can’t really argue anything you wrote, Jeff. I sit here agreeing with you on your points. If I could split hairs on something, it would be this: In 2007, I think Waddell should have been FORCED to coach this team into the playoffs, and not make HALF of those moves. Get Dupuis for Alex Bourret and the Rangers 3rd round pick. Yes, I’d still do that. I’d even still do Belanger for Vitaly Vishnevski. And if Alexei Zhitnik had to be had, try to offer Atlanta’s 2nd and 3rd round picks in lieu of Coburn. And if not, don’t do the trade. Make Waddell, the architect of the team, coach the team HE, ALONE, assembled into the playoffs. If it doesn’t work, you fire everyone. And, in the process, you still have Coburn. You still have your 1st round pick in 2007. (But you’re out the 2nd round pick in 2007, and the 3rd round pick in 2007 for Zhitnik, the hypothetical trade.)
I totally agree that Hossa was never re-signing here. Barring a Cup win, that is. Kovy, I don’t think, wanted to stay so long as Waddell and the Spirit, LLC were in charge. Different ownership, different GM, maybe yes, he would stay. I think Bob Hartley did a good job here. But he had lost the room, I believe.
Jeff, if you’re still reading this blog, chime-in on this one. I think Waddell’s “player friendly” style of management … hurt the team. Do you agree or disagree? Bobby Cox may be able to “get away with it” and still be somewhat successful. But Don Waddell can’t. He can’t be their buddy and confidant, while also running the team, making hard and necessary decisions about said players. I think the inmates started to run the asylum. And that’s never good. While I don’t really want a situation where players report, and are scared to death they’ll be traded at a moment’s notice, the “entitlement mentality” is something that has to go, in Atlanta. Kari Lehtonen felt “annointed.” Kovy was in charge, at the end, influencing the roster decisions. Bobby Holik was a loose cannon. That’s how I saw it, anyway.
Jeff Schultz
March 18th, 2010
6:28 pm
Brendan– You may be on to something with the player friendly thing. But I’ve seen Don also be pretty cold in some personnel decisions too. More likely to think it’s just bad judgment. But your observations are pretty spot on.
Stone Cold Schultz
March 18th, 2010
10:24 pm
If you guys would simply stop sitting around and patting each other on the back for reliving things that have gone wrong with this franchise over the past 10 years, you’d find there’s some really GREAT HOCKEY being played at Philips these days.
WHO CARES about the past when the team is STILL IN THE PLAYOFF HUNT? You call yourselves hockey fans? Doesn’t anything the Thrashers are doing even EXCITE YOU?
Yeah Schultz….You’ve “followed hockey since your youth”. I smell a poser…..
Brendan
March 18th, 2010
10:41 pm
Want something exciting? Here, there’s a boxscore for tonight’s win big, 6-3, over Ottawa. http://www.nhl.com/ice/boxscore.htm?id=2009021045
Brendan
March 18th, 2010
10:44 pm
Jeff, I found, through the years, that Waddell rarely calls a player out in the media. It does happen. But it’s rare. I guess, maybe, I perceive that as being “player friendly.” After the 2007 playoff loss, I would have called out Hossa. Waddell went after Belanger and Kozlov. I was surprised, after hearing it, that he’d then re-ink Kozlov to a 3-year deal that offseason.
MrHughes
March 19th, 2010
1:10 pm
I agree with Stone Cold Schultz. Some tremendous hockey is being played at Philips these days. It’s a shame folks are missing out on it because of conjecture from some random analyst who happened to pick up the phone in a “news” article. The Thrashers rumors have been flying since the RIM dude attempted to relocate any NHL team to Canada.
Bettman has gone on record several times saying that he is committed to keeping a team in Atlanta. The Southeast Division is important to the future health of the NHL. Carolina and Tampa have won cups in the last 10 years, so it’s only a matter of time before the Thrashers go deep into what is argubly the most exciting postseason in professional sports. Add that to the Philips Arena naming rights deal and it’s clear that the Thrashers are not going anywhere.
If the Thrashers make the playoffs, then they will sellout Philips for those games. And, they will finally win their first playoff game. That’s good news for me. Glad they got rid of Kovy. I used to love him, but there’s no room for folks that don’t want to wear the colors of Blueland.
If the Thrashers and Hawks make noise in the playoffs this year there is something positive to be said for Spirit management. I have no qualms about how the Hawks have been managed. I’d rather a loss like the Hawks had in Toronto, than a meltdown in the playoffs. All teams need moments like that to wake them up from time to time. Add all that to the impending removal of Belkin from the ownership group and I don’t think their tenure has been all bad.
I think they do care about hockey and basketball and I find Michael Gearon Jr to be a very respectful and thoughtful voice for the other owners.
FYI: For those calling for David McDavid. He’s Steve Belkin in wool. There’s a reason he’s been unsucessful at securing a franchise this many times.
J
March 25th, 2010
7:58 am
Nick,
Braves also have 85 odd home games to sell, so they need that $3 price to get a body in the seat. Also, a seat at Philips Arena for $10 is much, much, much closer than a seat for $3 per game for the Braves. Of course, what do i know, i only attend games. Another lame excuse, if you ask me.
Lehnerd
March 28th, 2010
3:11 am
Well we all hope Home depot buys thrashers n arena keep and i wonder if arthur blank can own 2 teams….i sure want own hawks so who left to buy them…..Like i said if not don waddell can kiss his job gone if thrashers Moved to winnipeg.But Hawks 21st shows are crowd base…they make a great play n the crowd is still like at a church meetin.they make noise n jump if cleveland (who will choke again) and that James fellows come a callin he be a knick anyway. Maybe hawks can sign Labron James for here bet crowds be bigger!
Hawks and Thrashers for Sale? « NBA in the eyes of a high school bench player
May 17th, 2010
2:00 pm
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