For the man who killed bin Laden, what’s next?
Esquire magazine has a fascinating, lengthy interview with the unnamed member of Seal Team 6 credited with killing Osama bin Laden. “The Shooter,” as he’s called in the piece, recently left the service after 16 years, four short of the 20 years needed for a pension and health care.
Like many who leave the military, he doesn’t know what to do next in his life.
He does know he doesn’t want anything more to do with guns or killing people, so that line of work is out. His marriage is ending, although he and wife are separating on good terms. And lurking in the background is fear that they or their children may become targets for retribution.
As his wife puts it:
“He gave so much to his country, and now it seems he’s left in the dust. I feel there’s no support, not just for my family but for other families in the community. I honestly have nobody I can go to or talk to. Nor do I feel my husband has gotten much for what he’s accomplished in his career.”
Exactly what, if any, responsibility should the government have to her family?
The loss of income and insurance and no pension aside, she can no longer walk onto the local base if she feels a threat to her family. They’ve surrendered their military IDs. If something were to happen, the Shooter has instructed her to take the kids to the base gate anyway and demand to see the commanding officer, or someone from the SEAL team. “He said someone will come get us.”
Because of the mission, she says that “my family is always going to be at risk. It’s just a matter of finding coping strategies.”
The whole piece is definitely worth a read, particularly if you’ve seen the movie version, “Zero Dark Thirty,” which is absolutely absorbing. But here are a few excerpts to whet your appetite:
“We all wrote letters (before the bin Laden operation). I had my … little room and I’m sitting on my Pelican case with all my gear, a manila envelope on my bed, and I’m writing letters to my kids. They were to be delivered in case of my death, something for them to read when they’re 35. I have no idea what I said except I’m explaining everything, that it was a noble mission and I hope we got him. I’m saying I wish I could be there for them.
“And the tears are hitting the page, because we all knew that none of us were coming back alive. It was either death or a Pakistani prison, where we’d be raped for the rest of our lives.”
He gave the letters to an intel guy not on the mission, with instructions. He would shred them if he made it back.
“You write it, it’s horrible, you hand it off, and it’s like, Okay, that part’s over. And I’m back, ready to roll.”
Then they’re gathered by a fire pit (in Afghanistan), suiting up. Just before he got on the chopper to leave for Abbottabad, the Shooter called his dad. “I didn’t know where he was, but I found out later he was in a Walmart parking lot. I said, ‘Hey, it’s time to go to work,’ and I’m thinking, I’m calling for the last time. I thought there was a good chance of dying.
He knew something significant was up, though he didn’t know what.” The Shooter could hear him start to tear up. “He told me later that he sat in his pickup in that parking lot for an hour and couldn’t get out of the car.”
On preparations should things go awry:
“The group discussed what would happen if they were surrounded by Pakistani troops. We would surrender. The original plan was to have Vice-President Biden fly to Islamabad and negotiate our release with Pakistan’s president.
This is hearsay, but I understand Obama said, Hell no. My guys are not surrendering. What do we need to rain hell on the Pakistani military? That was the one time in my life I was thinking, I am f…ing voting for this guy. I had a picture of him lying in bed at night, thinking, ‘You’re not f…ing with my guys.’ Like, he’s thinking about us.”
On approaching the bin Ladin compound:
“I remember banking to the south, which meant we were getting ready to hit. We had about another fifteen minutes. Instead of counting, for some reason I said to myself the George Bush 9/11 quote: Freedom itself was attacked this morning by a faceless coward, and freedom will be defended. I could just hear his voice, and that was neat. I started saying it again and again to myself. Then I started to get pumped up. I’m like: This is so on.”
On the end of the long hunt, as they moved through the compound toward the target:
“We had to move, because bin Laden is now going to be grabbing some weapon because he’s getting shot at. I had my hand on the point man’s shoulder and squeezed, a signal to go. The two of us went up. On the third floor, he tackled the two women in the hallway right outside the first door on the right, moving them past it just enough. He thought he was going to absorb the blast of suicide vests; he was going to kill himself so I could get the shot. It was the most heroic thing I’ve ever seen.
I rolled past him into the room, just inside the doorway.
There was bin Laden standing there. He had his hands on a woman’s shoulders, pushing her ahead, not exactly toward me but by me, in the direction of the hallway commotion. It was his youngest wife, Amal.
He looked confused. And way taller than I was expecting. He had a cap on and didn’t appear to be hit. I can’t tell you 100 percent, but he was standing and moving. He was holding her in front of him. Maybe as a shield, I don’t know.
For me, it was a snapshot of a target ID, definitely him. Even in our kill houses where we train, there are targets with his face on them. This was repetition and muscle memory. That’s him, boom, done….
And I remember as I watched him breathe out the last part of air, I thought: Is this the best thing I’ve ever done, or the worst thing I’ve ever done?”
At the end of “Zero Dark Thirty,” the camera focuses on the CIA analyst whose dedication and even obsession with tracking bin Laden finally ended up putting him in a body bag. Her mission complete, she has no idea what comes next or where to turn. The Shooter clearly shares both her sense of great accomplishment and her sense of emptiness.
– Jay Bookman
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579 comments Add your comment
Common Sense isn't very Common
February 11th, 2013
1:36 pm
Jay
All I can say is DAMN
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
1:45 pm
On preparations should things go awry:
“The group discussed what would happen if they were surrounded by Pakistani troops. We would surrender. The original plan was to have Vice-President Biden fly to Islamabad and negotiate our release with Pakistan’s president.
This is hearsay, but I understand Obama said, Hell no. My guys are not surrendering. What do we need to rain hell on the Pakistani military? That was the one time in my life I was thinking, I am f…ing voting for this guy. I had a picture of him lying in bed at night, thinking, ‘You’re not f…ing with my guys.’ Like, he’s thinking about us.”
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
1:46 pm
Okay the comment that got omitted: This is likely much closer to reality than the idiot Benghazi absurdity from the ODS conned
Hoof Hearted
February 11th, 2013
1:46 pm
Wow…
getalife
February 11th, 2013
1:49 pm
We should honor him with the medal of honor like our President is doing now with Staff SGT Clint Romesha.
Jay
February 11th, 2013
1:51 pm
Getalife, as the man himself says in the interview, he didn’t do anything more than other Team Six members. He was just the one in the right place at the right time.
And giving him a medal — even THAT medal — would not change his situation.
F. Sinkwich
February 11th, 2013
1:53 pm
This indeed confusing.
The loonies here said O’bozo killed OBL…
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
February 11th, 2013
1:55 pm
The world is definitely a better place without Bin Laden, but I wish he had been eliminated much earlier.
Kitty
February 11th, 2013
1:56 pm
Wow, bless him and his family. Wonder why he didn’t stick it out until retirement. I am sure he could have gotten a different MOS. Perhaps some sort of training gig. I am sure he has a lot to teach younger soldiers.
barking frog
February 11th, 2013
1:57 pm
Good job. Now he should take care of his family.
Granny Godzilla
February 11th, 2013
1:59 pm
May god bless that young man and his family and keep them all safe.
Mick
February 11th, 2013
1:59 pm
This man should be recruited into the secret service and given a job where his skills might be needed.
Native Atlantan
February 11th, 2013
2:00 pm
Only Crapwich could take a unifying moment and turn it partisan…..
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
February 11th, 2013
2:00 pm
The loonies here said O’bozo killed OBL…
Loonies said Reagan tore down the Berlin Wall.
Loonies said Bush captured Saddam Hussein.
Road Scholar
February 11th, 2013
2:00 pm
Sinkwich: Get over it. It is too much for you to understand!
fedup
February 11th, 2013
2:00 pm
Some facts. It was riveting. Can somebody do something for the shooter and his family.
Now cons and NRA bums take a lesson from the shooter. He has nothing to do with guns.
getalife
February 11th, 2013
2:01 pm
Jay,
“He gave so much to his country, and now it seems he’s left in the dust. I feel there’s no support, not just for my family but for other families in the community. I honestly have nobody I can go to or talk to. Nor do I feel my husband has gotten much for what he’s accomplished in his career.”
I think honoring him on national television will get him hired immediately but he is concerned for the safety of his family.
Why did he leave the military and what do you suggest to help him and his family?
Erwin's cat
February 11th, 2013
2:02 pm
This was repetition and muscle memory. That’s him, boom, done….
hmm….how do you get to carnegie hall?
Road Scholar
February 11th, 2013
2:03 pm
Granny and Mick: Right on! I hope he will be able to deal with his life in the future.
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
February 11th, 2013
2:04 pm
hmm….how do you get to carnegie hall?
You shoulda turned left at Albuquerque.
Aquagirl
February 11th, 2013
2:05 pm
This man should be recruited into the secret service and given a job where his skills might be needed.
I think you’re missing the point–he doesn’t want to use those skills any more.
OBIWAN
February 11th, 2013
2:07 pm
Obozo will have a job summit for him…. oh wait the job czars have been disbanded….
комиссар (Occupation)
February 11th, 2013
2:07 pm
“This man should be recruited into the secret service and given a job where his skills might be needed.”
There’s a big opening there currently, I hear.
Just Saying..
February 11th, 2013
2:10 pm
And F. Sinkwich puts another yellow ribbon on his car.
Cause that’s as far as he goes…
Peadawg
February 11th, 2013
2:11 pm
Wow….
weetamoe
February 11th, 2013
2:13 pm
*This is hearsay* is an interesting way to include a comment that can not be sourced. From his interview with the Esquire writer, which is not *hearsay,* he instructed his wife that when vengeance showed its ugly face she was to put the kids in the bathtub in a recessed area and showed her how to brace her rifle against the bedroom wall so she could shoot through the door. He was offered a witness protection program new life driving a truck in a new town where he would never again be able to contact relatives or former friends. And he never got to do a victory strut in front of the whole USA and Charlie Sheen never said *call me.*
indigo
February 11th, 2013
2:15 pm
He should have re-upped for another four years. There are many military postions that have no real civilian counterpart and Navy Seal is certainly one of them.
We’ve seen so many of our combat troops come home from Iraq and Afganistan, get out of the Military, and then struggle to find employment.
Our Country should do more for those getting out of uniform. But, that would cost money and politicians, especially Republican, have made it clear that the old, retired and sick aren’t exactly a priority. Add to that retired Military and you get a truly sorry picture of politics in America.
rightwingextreme
February 11th, 2013
2:15 pm
fedup
February 11th, 2013
2:00 pm
Some facts. It was riveting. Can somebody do something for the shooter and his family.
Now cons and NRA bums take a lesson from the shooter. He has nothing to do with guns.
And that’s HIS choice….not some idiot government official.
Look before I leap...
February 11th, 2013
2:15 pm
I think congress should pass a special act for all the members of Seal Team Six granting them full retirement benefits for whatever time they actually served.
They went in and erased the most wanted man in the world from the face of the earth and sent his sorry, bony @ss to hell. That should count for something.
getalife
February 11th, 2013
2:16 pm
Oops.
“He does know he doesn’t want anything more to do with guns or killing people, so that line of work is out.”
Missed that. Sorry.
The current medal of honor winner is working in the oil fields of North Dakota.
комиссар (Occupation)
February 11th, 2013
2:17 pm
“We had about another fifteen minutes. Instead of counting, for some reason I said to myself the George Bush 9/11 quote: Freedom itself was attacked this morning by a faceless coward, and freedom will be defended. I could just hear his voice, and that was neat”
Don’t mean to sound insensitive, but maybe now he can do what he did before closing in for the kill and think of George W. Bush’s words about us having a health care system, namely primary care emergency rooms. Maybe now, faced with the challenges of life in the country he did hit jobs for, capital’s own backyard, where big moneyed interests allied with for-profit private health insurance companies have always seen to it that true universal health coverage never get off the ground, he can take pride in his service and take comfort in the former president’s words. That shouldn’t be too hard, should it? After all, I’m sure Bush wouldn’t have just said it for reasons of cynical political calculation and evasion, would he?
In the middle
February 11th, 2013
2:20 pm
What this team of seals accomplished is nothing less than spectacular. The double edged sword this man faces is knowing what he knows and not being able to do anything with it. No doubt if any of the sailors on this team were to be revealed to the public their fortunes would be made, at the same time they and all of their family would be instantly targeted for execution. Some our military give more than they will ever receive.
Thomas Heyward Jr
February 11th, 2013
2:20 pm
For the man who killed bin Laden, what’s next?
.
Statiscally speaking …….There is a good chance that this guy will …………..A)……..be murdered by the State via cops
B) kidnapped by the State and put into a mental institution
C) commit sucicide
or the worst
D) become a cop.
.
Welcome to Amerika.
Live by the sword……die by the sword.
Drudge
February 11th, 2013
2:21 pm
I’m a vet myself and it isn’t easy just going back to the office… I hope he stays tight with his teammates, there isn’t anyone who understands like the guy who was next to you, as hard as they try. SEALs are a different breed, so the local VFW is not going to have many resources. Good luck buddy, if I may offer a suggestion, go easy on the booze. It just makes it worse.
rightwingextreme
February 11th, 2013
2:21 pm
Look before I leap…
February 11th, 2013
2:15 pm
I think congress should pass a special act for all the members of Seal Team Six granting them full retirement benefits for whatever time they actually served.
They went in and erased the most wanted man in the world from the face of the earth and sent his sorry, bony @ss to hell. That should count for something.
Before I ask this question I want all to understand I have nothing but the highest regard for all of our military and think they should always have the best.
What if they never deployed on a mission? Full benefits? What about those Marines and Soldiers serving on the ground in Afghanistan who only serve one tour? Full benefits?
In the middle
February 11th, 2013
2:23 pm
To rightwingextreme, you got it. It was his choice, not yours, not mine, not the governments, but his. As it should be.
Native Atlantan
February 11th, 2013
2:23 pm
And….apparently, weeawhatever doesn’t understand what the ” thingies mean…..
DebbieDoRight - A Do Right Woman
February 11th, 2013
2:24 pm
This whole argument is ridiculous. Here are my reasons for saying this:
1) The “shooter’s” life and/or his families life would’ve NEVER been in any type of jeparody if he’d, and heres the tricky part, kept his damn mouth shut. Why was he in any type of Intel if he didn’t/couldn’t/wouldn’t keep secrets?
2) He, along with MILLIONS of other soldiers, who’ve sacrificed a lot more for their countries; do not get (as explained to them when they enlist); any type of compensation, unless otherwise noted, if they leave the military BEFORE their “pensions” kick in.
Hash but true. It happens all over the world, for instance — You work for Merck Laboratories as a biologists or whatever, and discovers a new drug that SAVES billions of lives. you don’t get SQUAT. You MAY get a bonus, but other than that, you don’t get one DIME. who gets all the money AND the patent from all your hard work and toil? THE COMPANY you work for.
3) Lets stop blaming someone else. You make a decision– good, bad, or indifferent; and you have to LIVE with it. Period. You may, if you’re lucky get a chance to change your course in life if you feel you’re going the wrong way; however, don’t blame the road for drive you’ve decided to take.
No one FORCES anyone to become a Navy Seal. No one. He CHOSE to become a Seal; exactly what did he think he was supposed to do as a Seal? Teach Kindergarten?
I’ve been hearing this, “poor, pitiful man, oh boo hooo, Obama/the government should do something for him”; stories all day. I’m sick of them.
the most he can get out of the government now, since he left before he could’ve gotten full pension, is free psychiatric help.
He’s not alone; and he’s not the only one. let’s stop PRETENDING that he is.
randy
February 11th, 2013
2:25 pm
I still think there needs to be an investigation into why we let bin Laden go at Tora Bora. Bush / Cheney / Rumsfeld all gave a blatantly false excuse of “we weren’t sure he was there”. But every book published by every guy who was actually there, from the Deltas to the CIA, say not only were they sure he was there, but that they plainly notified their chain of command. And that “orders from the very highest level of command” told them to provide a cease fire. This order allowed bin Laden to escape, and everyone knew it.
USA Patriot
February 11th, 2013
2:25 pm
Someone in congress could present a special bill for this team (and / or others with similar “high profile” targets) to provide financial relief for he & his family.
Congress made the famillies of 9/11 millionaires a couple of times over.
Just sayin’
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
2:25 pm
Statiscally speaking …….There is a good chance that this guy will …………..A)……..be murdered by the State via cops
B) kidnapped by the State and put into a mental institution
C) commit sucicide
or the worst
D) become a cop.
The words “statistically speaking” do not equate to “stupidly speaking”. May I suggest you consider investing more time reading a dictionary and less time telling us about drone attacks on WI weddings.
barking frog
February 11th, 2013
2:26 pm
‘For the man who killed bin Laden, what’s next ?”
…………………………………………………………………
retirement with pension, healthcare, an office with staff and Secret Service
protection for him and his family for as long as he wants.
stands for decibels
February 11th, 2013
2:26 pm
Anyone planning to read the whole thing (all 15,000 words) before commenting?
комиссар (Occupation)
February 11th, 2013
2:27 pm
DebbiDoRight: “Hash but true. It happens all over the world, for instance — You work for Merck Laboratories as a biologists or whatever, and discovers a new drug that SAVES billions of lives. you don’t get SQUAT. You MAY get a bonus, but other than that, you don’t get one DIME. who gets all the money AND the patent from all your hard work and toil? THE COMPANY you work for”
I think DebbieDoRight has the capitalist system of exploitation down pretty pat.
Mick
February 11th, 2013
2:28 pm
randy
Benghazi!
getalife
February 11th, 2013
2:29 pm
Perhaps a retiring wealthy Senator that can afford their own insurance can pass his or hers benefits to this man.
DebbieDoRight - A Do Right Woman
February 11th, 2013
2:29 pm
He should have re-upped for another four years. There are many military postions that have no real civilian counterpart and Navy Seal is certainly one of them.
Thank YOU. If he would’ve he would’ve gotten his FULL BENEFITS. If he didn’t want to be a SEAL anymore, he could’ve asked (and he’d probably would’ve received) an MOS change.
DownInAlbany
February 11th, 2013
2:32 pm
“No one who fights for this country overseas should ever have to fight for a job,” Barack Obama said last Veterans’ Day, “or a roof over their head, or the care that they have earned when they come home.”
But the Shooter will discover soon enough that when he leaves after sixteen years in the Navy, his body filled with scar tissue, arthritis, tendonitis, eye damage, and blown disks, here is what he gets from his employer and a grateful nation:
Nothing. No pension, no health care, and no protection for himself or his family.
Read more: Man Who Killed Osama Bin Laden – Treatment of Veteran Who Shot bin Laden – Esquire http://www.esquire.com/features/man-who-shot-osama-bin-laden-0313#ixzz2KcXN3t4R
Sad commentary…
Dunwoody Granny
February 11th, 2013
2:34 pm
There was a $25 million bounty on bin Laden. I really think the US should take that $25M and divide it among the soldiers on the mission, the helo pilots, and the couple of intel agents most respnsible. Bankers get HUGE bonuses for screwing us all. I think what these people did actually deserves a bonus.
the dog
February 11th, 2013
2:34 pm
Totally agree with DDR. Boo hoo, NOT.
DebbieDoRight - A Do Right Woman
February 11th, 2013
2:34 pm
Someone in congress could present a special bill for this team (and / or others with similar “high profile” targets) to provide financial relief for he & his family.
Why stop there?
Let’s do the same for the following soldiers:
The ones who piloted/flew in the Nola Gay
The Red Wings
The buffalo soldiers
Paul Reveere
etc. etc. etc.
Let’s parcel out dollars for bravery and service.
Let’s call it, “Mercenaries” instead of Soldiers.
the dog
February 11th, 2013
2:35 pm
How can you all be convinced this fellow isn’t jerking all your chains? How do you know he doesn’t have the $25M and living the good life. He could have just disappeared……………..
jhunt163
February 11th, 2013
2:36 pm
Wow, I can’t believe that I am in honest agreement with DDR. I guess NEMO must have worked its way down to hell.
Jay
February 11th, 2013
2:36 pm
I agree: The piece should have done a better job of explaining why The Shooter declined to re-up for another four years. And harsh as it sounds, Debbie does have a point.
Recon 0311 2533
February 11th, 2013
2:37 pm
Hopefully, we won’t lose too many more men from the military like the SEAL TEAM Six “shooter” and SGT. Ramasha.
DebbieDoRight - A Do Right Woman
February 11th, 2013
2:39 pm
There was a $25 million bounty on bin Laden. I really think the US should take that $25M and divide it among the soldiers on the mission, the helo pilots, and the couple of intel agents most respnsible.
It doesn’t work like that. It never has and it NEVER will.
If an FBI agent, discovers a child that was kidnapped , saves the child, and reunites the child with his/her parents, that FBI Agent doesn’t get ONE DIME of any reward money.
Fireman saves a guy from a burning building? He gets THANKS and that’s all.
This guy is no different from the MILLIONS of servicemembers around the world.
Why should he be treated differently for doing his job?
Oscar
February 11th, 2013
2:39 pm
I am surprised tht no pension and other benifits are vested until 20 yeares in the military. Should be vested at five years. Serving 16 years and leaving without any pension is really a disgrace.
Corbin Sharpe. I think, therefore I am...I think.
February 11th, 2013
2:41 pm
This is nothing new. The Shooter is not the only man or woman to leave the Service short of a career feeling betrayed, unwanted and left out. We have all read where the military suicide rate for 2012 was the highest ever. Those of you who never had been in combat can’t begin to understand the strain and trauma it takes on ones psyche. Sure, most of have “Support Our Troops magnetic ribbons on our cars and we talk of how heroic they are, but I’ll lay my bottom dollar most of us do nothing in the way of financial support. Have any of you seen a military family in a restaurant and bought them their meal?
Our country have been using our soldiers up physically and mentally from Johnson until now, but we refuse to do what it takes to help them out except to say “welcome home”. We are pathetic.
Look before I leap...
February 11th, 2013
2:41 pm
Nice attitude Debbie Do Wrong…
Eff ‘em and forget ‘em.
What a miserable, wretched outlook you have for those protect your right to sit on your fat @ss all day and type out stupidity hour in and hour out.
SEALS and Special Forces go through the most difficult training the military has to offer. They lead an uncommon life during service with rapid calls to some of the nastiest places on the globe, significantly more away time from their families, not able to tell them where they are or what they are doing or even when they are coming home (if ever).
Not to take anything away from the hundreds of thousands of other service members who bravely defend our country, but there is a HUGE difference between what a motor pool private endures vs. what a SEAL/Special Forces solider does.
Mick
February 11th, 2013
2:42 pm
In the end, it looks like a poor choice that was made by this man. Four more years to serve and get a pension as opposed to nothing? Whose fault is that? Yes, we all must take responsibility for our decisions, who else is there to blame???
Oscar
February 11th, 2013
2:42 pm
The Shooter should be given protecton because of the extreme danger his accts have left him in. This is no ordinary service and no ordinary amount of danger. We owe him.
Peadawg
February 11th, 2013
2:43 pm
“I agree: The piece should have done a better job of explaining why The Shooter declined to re-up for another four years. And harsh as it sounds, Debbie does have a point.”
Yup
Erwin's cat
February 11th, 2013
2:44 pm
Occupation – You work for Merck Laboratories as a biologists or whatever, and discovers a new drug that SAVES billions of lives, you don’t get SQUAT. You MAY get a bonus, but other than that, you don’t get one DIME. who gets all the money AND the patent from all your hard work and toil? THE COMPANY you work for”
so what?…Merk provide billions in facilities and support in order for you to make that discovery, You couldn’t have done it w/o them. In those facilities it is entirely likely that someone else could’ve done the same work, They put “you” on the patent and you are hailed a hero in professional circles all the while paying you well…you retire and make a modest living as a consultant….what’s the problem?
Oscar
February 11th, 2013
2:44 pm
Mick = That is speculation. We don’t know that it was his choice. There are many others possible reasons for his leavings.
Health problems are one possibility beyond his control.
комиссар (Occupation)
February 11th, 2013
2:44 pm
By the way, Jay, it would be interesting to hear your thoughts on the pro-torture propaganda film “Zero Dark Thirty”. What did you find so “absorbing” about it?
Oscar
February 11th, 2013
2:47 pm
At Merck, employee penions probably vest after five years.
USA Patriot
February 11th, 2013
2:47 pm
Look 2:41
Ditto!
DebbieDoRight - A Do Right Woman
February 11th, 2013
2:47 pm
EC: so what?…Merk provide billions in facilities and support in order for you to make that discovery, You couldn’t have done it w/o them.
Who cares? Have you ever heard of these words:
EXAMPLE
FOR INSTANCE
COMPARISON
PROTOTYPE
SAMPLE
ILLUSTRATION?
Grow up Cat.
комиссар (Occupation)
February 11th, 2013
2:48 pm
Let me guess, Jay. You thought “Zero Dark Thirty” was a brave, honest look at the things that, though we may not care to think about them, are nonetheless things that as good
Americansliberals have to steel ourselves to and be ready to carry out in the name of protecting ourfatherlandnation. Is that about right?Jay
February 11th, 2013
2:48 pm
Have you seen the film, Occupation?
JF McNamara
February 11th, 2013
2:49 pm
They couldn’t find this man a desk job in Hawaii?
Regnad Kcin
February 11th, 2013
2:50 pm
“This indeed confusing.”
I’m sorry, but not surprised, that you’re confusrd. Mr. Sinkwich.
Candor
February 11th, 2013
2:50 pm
Judging by the above posts, I must be the only member of the military to post. We may have been much further along if the team had adhered to LOAC. SEAL team 6 does no more than other members of the military; they do there job. They go where they’re told, they do what they’re told to do.I’ve met several SEALs in the field,’ most were very professional.
They know what they signed up for. For all you civilians; the military isnt “Zero Dark Thirty”, “Blackhawk Down” or “Apocalyps Now”. Those movies are loosly based on reality. They’re for the entertainment of the nieve. Most GI’s avoid them because they know what happened and how it came down; the good, the bad and the ugly.
Oscar
February 11th, 2013
2:51 pm
I have not seen Zero yet, but a movie can be good ntertainmement and absorbing, and thought provoking without being factually accurate. In fact very few, if any films that deal with history or anywhere near accurate.
Erwin's cat
February 11th, 2013
2:52 pm
DDRGrow up Cat
How about i just match your level of maturity instead?
RIckster
February 11th, 2013
2:52 pm
Reading the snippets from the story of “The Shooter” – I’m reminded of the last line from “The Bridges of Toko-Ri”
“Where do we get such men?
Heroic doesn’t even begin to come close.
Brosephus™
February 11th, 2013
2:53 pm
Jay
Thanks for the read. The entire piece is worth the read. I have no idea why he left after 16 years, but I appreciate all the sacrifices made by everyone involved including the families.
I have nothing positive or critical to say.
DebbieDoRight - A Do Right Woman
February 11th, 2013
2:54 pm
The Shooter should be given protecton because of the extreme danger his accts have left him in. This is no ordinary service and no ordinary amount of danger. We owe him.
Why just him and not his whole team? Why? How do we even know for a FACT that he is the shooter? Because he said so?
Are we really that freaking naive?
=========
What a miserable, wretched outlook you have for those protect your right to sit on your fat @ss all day and type out stupidity hour in and hour out.
Shut up Look — you know nothing about me. You spout off and have no idea of my background, what i believe in, or WHO my family is.
I’m telling you the truth. It hurts; but that doesn’t make it any less the truth. As a member of the armed forces, as explained to EVERY SOLDIER WHO ENLISTS, you don’t get anything special. You’re treated as equal as possible with all the other soldiers.
There are soldiers who have suffered from the effects of Agent Orange — soldiers who liberated the Concentration Camps in Europe, soldiers who have done all these things of bravery and sacrifice that we’ll probably never hear of or from — that’s the way it goes.
If he wanted more than what is being offered, then he should’ve NEVER joined the military. PERIOD.
East Lake Ira
February 11th, 2013
2:54 pm
Candor – Get thee to the GI Bill.
In the middle
February 11th, 2013
2:55 pm
I am amazed. I guess we should just give him an Obamaphone and tell him to scurry on his way. What a sad group….
Dunwoody Granny
February 11th, 2013
2:55 pm
DDR —
I understand what you’re saying. He knew the rules going in; he shouldn’t whine because the rules didn’t change. But I think these guys should be treated differently because I think what they did was different. Higher value than the ordinary military mission.
As someone commented earlier, the families of those killed in the Twin Towers got much more compensation than the families of those killed in ordinary plane crashes.
Oscar
February 11th, 2013
2:56 pm
JF – He can always apply for a desk job with the feds. Lot of vets work for the feds.
Erwin's cat
February 11th, 2013
2:59 pm
DDR – how is the biologist at Merck any different than the enlisted not getting anything special for just doing their job….i really don’t see a difference in the two, but you were offended by my example to Occupations post…what am I missin?
GT
February 11th, 2013
2:59 pm
This is real; it is not a photo op. It kills Obama’s opposition who in general go after him card blanch because they can’t match fact with their desire to have us all hate the president so they generalize and manufacture a president we will hate.
In the meanwhile in real life a president without this 40% of his country behind him, 40% actually trying to destroy Obama which in turn endangers these navy seals, by these anti American distractions are actually unexcited by this good news. They immediately presume that propaganda machine as to how it was not Obama’s administration that pulled this off and as clearly shown here the shooter considers O very much part of this.
The opposition continues their separation from our nation by turning any misfortune of this country into their vested interest by the same manufacturing of a man who does not exist. Like Clinton says, “who you going to believe them or you’re lying eyes?”
getalife
February 11th, 2013
2:59 pm
Lost his job, lost his wife and no future will leave him with a mind that is not right.
I am not sure of his mental status but it is probably pretty bad.
Dang empathy gene.
It is a bizarre ending to the story of killing obl.
I am cheering for him to keep going and a happier ending.
the dog
February 11th, 2013
3:00 pm
How is what he and the others did more worthy than a firefighter rescuing a family from a burning building?
fedup
February 11th, 2013
3:03 pm
“And that’s HIS choice….not some idiot government official”. That is correct but what you don’t get that he is not like the loonies thinking some official is coming after him and has to defend himself. There is a vast difference between his thinking and yours.
Oscar
February 11th, 2013
3:03 pm
The Dog – This is different because of the revenge factor. Both against him and his family. And fo the other members of the team.
комиссар (Occupation)
February 11th, 2013
3:05 pm
I have to plead guilty, Jay, I have not seen it yet. But I have read numerous accounts of the narrative and the depiction of torture, and I’ve heard people describe their reaction to it and how they were encouraged to “overcome” their squeamishness about the fact that torturing is involved in the name of the fact that we’re protecting ourselves, deafening the nation, fighting a ruthless enemy, etc. Things which, though all true and important, should not lead us to surrender our highest moral principles.
DebbieDoRight - A Do Right Woman
February 11th, 2013
3:07 pm
As someone commented earlier, the families of those killed in the Twin Towers got much more compensation than the families of those killed in ordinary plane crashes.
Granny you’re thinking with your heart.
The firemen/rescuers who died in the twin towers were a finite number of people. Let’s say their number was 300.
the people who risk their lives daily for the military all over the world is an infinite number. there would be no end to the number of recipients.
For instance — I saw a documentary on PBS about the air force pilot who spent 7(?) years in a Russian prison for spying during the Cold War. When he finally got out, do you think the government gave him any special bonuses?
The people in the CIA or who are on covert missions — if they’re caught, do you think they get anything special?
What about the soldiers in the field who were caught and held captive as a POW — some for years; do you think they got any special money for that?
When /If you open the door for THIS one individual to receive special treatment; where does the door close?
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
February 11th, 2013
3:08 pm
Not to take anything away from the hundreds of thousands of other service members who bravely defend our country, but there is a HUGE difference between what a motor pool private endures vs. what a SEAL/Special Forces solider does.
He did what he signed up for.
catlady
February 11th, 2013
3:09 pm
“Our Country should do more for those getting out of uniform. But, that would cost money and politicians, especially Republican, have made it clear that the old, retired and sick aren’t exactly a priority. Add to that retired Military and you get a truly sorry picture of politics in America.” Add to that poor, women, and minorities also.
But it is the white men who feel picked on! Go figure!
Recon 0311 2533
February 11th, 2013
3:11 pm
The self serving manner for political purposes in which the White House leaked information about this operation and in particular the specific identity of the special ops team has probably taken a toll on all the members of this unit. Needlessly endangering them and their families was the worst part. Because of this self serving ineptitude each member of the team should be provided special compensation and protection when they leave active service.
indigo
February 11th, 2013
3:11 pm
In the middle – 2:55
What is this Obamaphone you speak of?
Is this one of the gifts Ronald McRomney alluded to?
How do I get one?
DebbieDoRight - A Do Right Woman
February 11th, 2013
3:13 pm
DDR – how is the biologist at Merck any different than the enlisted not getting anything special for just doing their job….i really don’t see a difference in the two, but you were offended by my example to Occupations post…what am I missin?
EC you jumped all over Occupation for no reason. He didn’t originally post the comment. He was responding to the comment that I posted.
indigo
February 11th, 2013
3:13 pm
Debbie – 2:24
Its known as predatory Capitalism.
In at least this category, America definitely leads the world.
GT
February 11th, 2013
3:13 pm
The right is full of hogwash. If this had been their guy they would have had a ticker tape parade in Time Square for him with a black bag wrapped around his head to hide his identity. They wave the flag at their convenience like the fighter jet landing on the air craft carrier with Bush but turn their back on our boys if they think it doesn’t help their sick causes. Anybody remember anything at all said about military during the Republican Convention last summer? One more left handed compliment to Obama.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
3:15 pm
Its sad the obama administration is leaving this man behind after everything he’s done……
Jay
February 11th, 2013
3:15 pm
Just as a reminder, this is a consequence of war — every war — and another reason to be very careful about asking our men and women in uniform to put themselves through it on our behalf.
I’ve been reading an old family journal, and it relates this story about a Civil War veteran:
“He make his way back to where he done left his horse. There was this Yankee soldier aside it but he done fell asleep up with his back against this tree. He knowed that if he woke him up he would let the others know he was there. He say if he shoot him they hear the shot so he crawl in behind that tree. He takes his knife and retch round that tree and cuts that Yankee’s throat. Say he never had him no good look at that soldier ‘fore he done it cause he had him this coat up over his head.
When that Yankee soldier falls to the ground that coat come off. He looked him in the eye as he was passing and he say that soldier was maybe little more than fifteen years old and he done killed him dead a child. He say he was mouthing him some words but nothing come out and it like to put him in his own grave seeing him do it. He talked bout it a lot with granddaddy cause it was always gnawing at him.
Many a day I was thinking how he lived with knowing he done killed him that baby. Granddaddy say that war is war and such things be a part of it but I knows he never leave that thing behind him. Miss Bark say when she knowed him he had the happiest eyes on him and I done a lot of thinking bout that cause when I looked at them sometimes I sees me some sadness in them. I reckon war change a man no matter who he be.”
Same as it ever was.
Corbin Sharpe. I think, therefore I am...I think.
February 11th, 2013
3:17 pm
Debbie,
You are wrong on this one. Nobody I knew ever knew what he was getting into when they joined the service. Hell, I even got out for four years before I went back in to complete my time. I had a lot of positive backing in my decision. But it’s like I said, military service is no bed of roses, especially if you are Special Forces. I sent a good part of my Care in Special Boat Units, working with the SEAL teams. As one poster said, they were very professional, but they were wound up tight. They knew what they had to do, were trained for, and they did it, but it took a toll on all of them. God bless them. I personally think every Military man and woman should be able to go to the head of every line, be it education, employment, or just the lunch line. They have given years of their life to PROTECT us with their LIVES. That deserves more than just lip service.
Dunwoody Granny
February 11th, 2013
3:19 pm
DDR –
I think the door closes with this mission.
There was a $25M bounty on bin Laden because he was a true danger to our country, as well as a hugely symbolic opponent. I think the men and women who put an end to him should get that bounty.
I realize this is outside the rules. I still think the circumstances are outside the ordinary.
RIckster
February 11th, 2013
3:19 pm
but… but… Pres. Obama promised that “If you like your health care… you can keep it.”
Redneck Convert (R--and proud of it)
February 11th, 2013
3:19 pm
Well, I’m real sorry for this guy and his family but that’s the way it is when you’re in the military. They expect and take everything from you. When I got out of the army no one was falling all over hisself to hire me and the GI Bill wasn’t much use to a guy that never finished the 5th grade. As for what you do when you’re in there, that’s not your call except when you volunteer. Some people get lucky by getting a MOS that can prepare them for a civilian job. But there ain’t much call for a infantryman or a trained killer. And while you’re in there, the people that duck military service but scream about patriotism are getting a leg up on you in the civilian job market. In my opinion it was a little fairer when there was a draft and you had to go.
So this poor guy is finding out what I found out. Nobody gives a tinker’s damn about your military service, tho they pretend to be grateful for it. Your military service and 3 bucks will buy you a cup of coffee. You get out with nothing you didn’t have when you went in except for the pride of serving. And it’s even worse for the people that get their head messed up in combat, because there’s no help offered by the military.
I’ll get off of my soapbox now. Just want y’all to know there’s alot of resentment built up in this old redneck.
Erwin's cat
February 11th, 2013
3:20 pm
He was responding to the comment that I posted.
so…I was responding to the comment he posted.
Is the biologist any different than the enlisted man just doing a job?
emz
February 11th, 2013
3:20 pm
I agree with DebbieDoRight @ 2:24 pm and 2:29 pm and 2:39 pm — said all the things I’ve been thinking. He did shoot him but he just happened to be the SEAL in that place; it was his job — could have been another SEAL. Also I thought there was to be total secrecy about the identity of the SEALS. If he’s concerned about his family, he should be quiet.
Jay
February 11th, 2013
3:20 pm
Occupation, I’ve seen the movie, and because of its frankness, it strengthened rather than weakened my opposition to use of torture. I didn’t see it as an apologia for torture in any way.
stands for decibels
February 11th, 2013
3:20 pm
I have read numerous accounts of the narrative and the depiction of torture
Every account of that movie tells me that the viewer is led to believe that torture totally got us OBL.
I’ve no interest in enriching scammers so, I don’t plan to watch it anytime soon. Maybe if/when it’s a free streamer on Netflix. Maybe.
TBS
February 11th, 2013
3:23 pm
Corbin @ 3:17
Well said.
And as always I thank each of you on the blog who have served or are currently serving in a military or law enforcement capacity.
комиссар (Occupation)
February 11th, 2013
3:24 pm
Jay: “Occupation, I’ve seen the movie, and because of its frankness, it strengthened rather than weakened my opposition to use of torture. I didn’t see it as an apologia for torture in any way.”
Really? Well in that case, I really will have to wait until I have seen and can judge for myself.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
3:26 pm
Jay
Occupation, I’ve seen the movie, and because of its frankness, it strengthened rather than weakened my opposition to use of torture. I didn’t see it as an apologia for torture in any way.
So the use of drones by the current occupant of the White House to kill American citizens without substantial evidence is ok? The logic of libs is so confusing… Ok to kill but not make someone sweat or listen to loud music of be dunked under water… Whoa the missing logic….
Jay
February 11th, 2013
3:28 pm
Itchy, your phrase “without substantial evidence” makes that entire post a lie.
DebbieDoRight - A Do Right Woman
February 11th, 2013
3:29 pm
Corbin: Nobody I knew ever knew what he was getting into when they joined the service.
Maybe — however, if you’ve joined the service during WAR TIME; do you at least EXPECT to have to go to war?
If you’ve joined an elite group called the NAVY SEALS, and you know just as well as the most dense civilian knows just WHAT the Seals do, do you at least EXPECT to have to carry out a mission that is hazardous?
If you are a POLICE OFFICER, and you’re working in the streets, do you expect that one day, if you’re unlucky you may catch a bullet? maybe for something as innocuous as a domestic violence call or maybe during a routine traffic stop.
Why is it any different for a soldier/servicemember? Our servicemembers are NOT stupid and it is a all volunteer military; you can not seriously expect me to believe that SOME aspects of military life was not expected. That would be ludicrous.
Corbin: I sent a good part of my Care in Special Boat Units, working with the SEAL teams.
I spend a good deal of my time TALKING to old soldiers. Sometimes it helps them; sometimes it helps me to understand them.
Has anyone on this blog ever actually sit down and TALKED to them about their service? Especially if they served during a time of war? I have. Sometimes, they can’t talk to their families; so they talk to people liek me; (I volunteer at the VA), because they know I’ll listen.
I’ve never said, that what some of these soldiers go through and what they’ve LIVED through isn’t hell; but its part of the job. Period.
I’m not disrespecting their service, their sacrifice, their scars or their memories; but it is what it is. Period.
комиссар (Occupation)
February 11th, 2013
3:29 pm
stands for decibels: “Every account of that movie tells me that the viewer is led to believe that torture totally got us OBL.”
Absolutely, same for me. And even if the film is ‘agnostic’, the fact that some take it as an implicit invitation to embrace torture is enough, in a sense, for me. In other words, the fact that the film even leaves open the possibility to be entertained is almost tantamount to implicit endorsement.
For example, can you imagine a film that portrayed other tactics of genocide, such as gang rape and the abuse of women and children, etc., and did so in a “neutral” light so that the viewer was free to “judge for himself”? Naturally, we would find that repellant and morally obscene. The same should be true of waterboarding and any other torture.
Jefferson
February 11th, 2013
3:32 pm
itch is full.
Redcoat
February 11th, 2013
3:32 pm
I sure the Shooter could have any assignment he wanted to finish 20 years……..why didn’t he? Who “outed” our Seals to begin with?
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
3:32 pm
Jay
Itchy, your phrase “without substantial evidence” makes that entire post a lie.
obama is in charge of the military… This man is a veteran. I guess somehow its the GOP’s fault he’s being forgotten about???
Jay
February 11th, 2013
3:32 pm
Occupation, I took it as a relatively straightforward account of what happened, warts and all, rather than a movie making a political statement one way or the other.
Redcoat
February 11th, 2013
3:34 pm
* I’m
TaxPayer
February 11th, 2013
3:34 pm
itchy finger lives a lie.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
3:34 pm
Redcoat
I sure the Shooter could have any assignment he wanted to finish 20 years……..why didn’t he? Who “outed” our Seals to begin with?
The obama administration did… They went around the country patting themselves on the back and his followers let it slip…..
Jay
February 11th, 2013
3:35 pm
It certainly didn’t shy from the degrading psychological toll even on those who perpetrated the torture.
too little time
February 11th, 2013
3:37 pm
DebbiDoRight: “Hash but true. It happens all over the world, for instance — You work for Merck Laboratories as a biologists or whatever, and discovers a new drug that SAVES billions of lives. you don’t get SQUAT. You MAY get a bonus, but other than that, you don’t get one DIME. who gets all the money AND the patent from all your hard work and toil? THE COMPANY you work for”
I think DebbieDoRight has the capitalist system of exploitation down pretty pat.
Except you both are missing the part where, like the vast majority of times, you DONT come up with the next best drug since sliced bread, and Merck pays you a salary anyway… .for years and years. And you don’t mention where Merck spent millions of dollars developing that drug… and others that never made it. But you didn’t have any skin in the game, so when a drug goes bad, you don’t have to repay your salary do you? So WHO is taking the risk? MERCK! Thats right, the company that laid their millions/billions on the line took ALL of the risk. Therefore, they get ALL of the profit. THAT is what capitalism is about. THAT is NOT exploitation. And when someone dies from the drug that you created and Merck profited from, YOU don’t go to court… Merck does. And when a financial judgement comes out against Merck from a drug that you created, you don’t pay that penalty, Merck does.
DebbiDoRight and your example of exploitation is laughable, and shows just how little the both of you know about capitalism.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
3:37 pm
Its sad that obama is willing to cut veterans benefits but not touch unionized federal workers… He now wants to give them a raise!
http://www.humanevents.com/2012/02/28/obama-cuts-military-health-care-benefits-leaves-unionized-civilians-untouched/
barking frog
February 11th, 2013
3:37 pm
After reading the entire article I still say Good job, now take
care of your family. Veteran’s benefits may help.
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
3:37 pm
“I realize this is outside the rules. I still think the circumstances are outside the ordinary”
And I don’t think it is. The only thing “outside the ordinary” is that the media publicized the story because of who died. We don’t hear about all the other brave soldiers who did the job they signed up for.
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
February 11th, 2013
3:37 pm
Ok to kill but not make someone sweat or listen to loud music of be dunked under water… Whoa the missing logic….
Waterboarding is torture, sport.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
3:38 pm
The Bookman buffoons just can’t stay with it today… What’s up???
UNCLE SAMANTHA
February 11th, 2013
3:38 pm
DIRTY POLLUTING LIBERALS
you sold us a bill of goods you lying libs………….. SHAME ON YOU
http://www.rr.com/news/topic/article/rr/55255105/81350875/Solar_industry_grapples_with_hazardous_wastes
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
3:39 pm
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
Ok to kill but not make someone sweat or listen to loud music of be dunked under water… Whoa the missing logic….
Waterboarding is torture, sport.
That’s your opinion sport. No one has ever taken this court to determine if it was. Using drones to kill people without evidence is murder sport….
GT
February 11th, 2013
3:40 pm
It is the realness that escapes us. I think in the age of television and film we become disenfranchised with reality, it is the only way to explain dead babies on playgrounds, ugly hate.
I thoroughly think our forefathers had a better handle on the needs of each of us for each other. They had to live and know other human beings to survive. The enemy was a sea and language away, usually described by propaganda where the goal was hate, but domestically we were all Americans, which meant we were human.
We have these feelings of hate for our fellow countrymen because we don’t meet them, they are like that German in World War II, we are feed propaganda and we are too willing because most of us are social cowards to believe it and not realize it for what it is. A manipulation of good people to do the work of bad men and women is always the reward for hating our fellow man.
getalife
February 11th, 2013
3:41 pm
This would make a good tv movie and he could get paid.
His story is not over.
I hope he gets paid because the man that killed obl is a BFD.
Dunwoody Granny
February 11th, 2013
3:42 pm
Jay, meaning no disrespect, but from the books I’ve read (including “Manhunt” by Peter Bergen and Mark Bowden’s book), I think the film leaned a little more on the intel from torture than real life would have justified. I agree that it wasn’t to make a political statement; I think it was just because it’s a lot more dramatic to watch someone review tapes of torture sessions than to watch someone load search terms in order to comb through data files.
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
3:42 pm
Well if it’s just dunking under water, I wonder why Hannity chickened out after “bravely” promising to be waterboarded for charity.
DebbieDoRight - A Do Right Woman
February 11th, 2013
3:43 pm
Granny: I think the door closes with this mission.
Not that simple Granny…..once you’ve opened a door you’ve set a precedent. Once a precedent is set, it can’t be ignored or undone.
For example — The civil rights. You can’t say, “I’m going to let Black people drink from this fountain for 30 years”; then all of sudden take it away from them.
Life doesn’t work like that.
Corbin Sharpe. I think, therefore I am...I think.
February 11th, 2013
3:43 pm
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
3:38 pm
The Bookman buffoons just can’t stay with it today… What’s up???
That’s because we are all pointing our fingers at you and laughing.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
3:45 pm
Corbin Sharpe. I think, therefore I am…I think.
February 11th, 2013
3:43 pm
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
3:38 pm
The Bookman buffoons just can’t stay with it today… What’s up???
That’s because we are all pointing our fingers at you and laughing.
Yes when people look foolish and can’t string together a coherent message that’s about all they you fruits do is laugh…..
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
3:45 pm
“For example — The civil rights. You can’t say, “I’m going to let Black people drink from this fountain for 30 years”; then all of sudden take it away from them.
Life doesn’t work like that.”
You’re wrong on that. Life DOES work like that. The reason for laws like “Black people can’t drink from this fountain” is because they DID drink from that fountain and someone didn’t like it…so it was TAKEN AWAY from them.
Happens ALL the time.
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
3:45 pm
No one has ever taken this court to determine if it was
Japanese soldiers prosecuted by US for torture (waterboarding) say what?
Oscar
February 11th, 2013
3:45 pm
Most corporations are cutting out their pensions and going with 401K plans. Fderal government should do the sme Spot all future pensions. W don’t have the money to pay them. That is one problem with the post ofice. Can’t pay its pnsions.
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
February 11th, 2013
3:46 pm
That’s your opinion sport.
Actually it is the opinion of Malcolm Nance, former Master Instructor and Chief of Training at the US Navy Survival, Evasion, Resistance and Escape School (SERE) in San Diego, California and I’ll take his opinion over yours any day of the week and twice on Sunday, sport.
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
3:47 pm
“That is one problem with the post ofice. Can’t pay its pnsions.”
that isn’t correct. The problem is that the Post Office is REQUIRE BY LAW to “prefund” their pension for 75 years – which NO other government system is required to do.
http://blog.syracuse.com/opinion/2013/02/congress_created_this_mess_for.html
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
3:47 pm
If water boarding has been determined by you libs to be torture then why didn’t Bush get impeached?
Corbin Sharpe. I think, therefore I am...I think.
February 11th, 2013
3:48 pm
Well Itchy,
I do like having you around…you are good for my morale. No matter how bad things get for me, at least I can always say, “At least I’m not Itchy”…and I feel better…
getalife
February 11th, 2013
3:48 pm
They had the American sniper funeral at Cowboy stadium.
That story has a tragic ending.
War is hell.
UNCLE SAMANTHA
February 11th, 2013
3:49 pm
waterboarding top level terrorist by bush – bad
KILLING WOMEN AND CHILDREN WITH DRONES – GOOD
shame on you libs
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
3:49 pm
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
February 11th, 2013
3:46 pm
That’s your opinion sport.
Actually it is the opinion of Malcolm Nance, former Master Instructor and Chief of Training at the US Navy Survival, Evasion, Resistance and Escape School (SERE) in San Diego, California and I’ll take his opinion over yours any day of the week and twice on Sunday, sport.
Well dang sport! Bush should have been impeached then since this one guy thought it was torture…
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
3:51 pm
“If water boarding has been determined by you libs to be torture then why didn’t Bush get impeached?”
And who did Bush waterboard? And it isn’t “you libs” who determined that. We tried and convicted people after WW2 for using waterboarding as torture. You don’t agree? Take it up with the experts who agree it IS torture.
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
3:51 pm
If water boarding has been determined by you libs to be torture then why didn’t Bush get impeached?
A rather clownish retort that suffices to demonstrate that that particular poster has cluelessly confused legal determination with political issues regarding prosecution. A person may violate law and yet not be prosecuted for a number of reasons. That does not mean that the law was not violated. But considering the source and the ODS, not surprising.
barking frog
February 11th, 2013
3:51 pm
getalife
They had the American sniper funeral at Cowboy stadium.
That story has a tragic ending.
War is hell.
………………………………………………………………….
actually he did o.k. in war, it’s the firing ranges that are dangerous.
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
3:52 pm
“KILLING WOMEN AND CHILDREN WITH DRONES – GOOD”
But killing women and children in a country that never attacked us, and was no threat to us is just fine with you.
shame on you
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
3:52 pm
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes:
Jose Rodriguez Defends Enhanced Interrogation… And he was in charge of the operation sport….
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
3:53 pm
Doggone/GA:
He was the President. Remember back then the buck stopped with the President… Of course its different now….
Regnad Kcin
February 11th, 2013
3:55 pm
“Waterboarding is torture, sport.
That’s your opinion sport. No one has ever taken this court to determine if it was. Using drones to kill people without evidence is murder sport….
=============
If pigs had wings, they’s be pigeons, sport.
This has been another episode of non sequiter theater…
DebbieDoRight - A Do Right Woman
February 11th, 2013
3:56 pm
Except you both are missing the part where, like the vast majority of times, you DONT come up with the next best drug since sliced bread, and Merck pays you a salary anyway… .for years and years.
this is the last time I’m going to broach this subject; because frankly, it’s taking away from the subject on the blog …………….but…………………..
Please look up these words in your local dictionary:
EXAMPLE, COMPARISON, CONTRAST, SAMPLE, STEROTYPE, PROTOTYPE.
DebbiDoRight and your example of exploitation is laughable, and shows just how little the both of you know about capitalism.
DDR’s explanation of capitalism and how it works:
See pimps and h**es.
Pimp — Provides the ladies with a place to stay, food, drugs, and water to bathe.
The h##es provide the pimp with money, cars, and more women to exploit.
Capitalism 101.
getalife
February 11th, 2013
3:56 pm
frog,
True and he died doing what he loved.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
3:58 pm
Using drones to kill Americans with no evidence is murder… Why can’t you libs simply admit it???
barking frog
February 11th, 2013
4:00 pm
getalife
,True and he died doing what he loved.
…………………………………………………….
I understand he was trying to help a friend who shot him.
UNCLE SAMANTHA
February 11th, 2013
4:00 pm
SHAME ON LIBERALS
women/children killers
at least CONSERVATIVES only want children to drink dirty water and breath dirty air and only want women to use coat hangers………….
barking frog
February 11th, 2013
4:02 pm
Itchy Finger
Using drones to kill Americans with no evidence is murder… Why can’t you libs simply admit it???
…………………………………………………………………………………..
It is abundantly clear that you do understand evidence or murder.
Regnad Kcin
February 11th, 2013
4:02 pm
“Using drones to kill Americans with no evidence is murder… Why can’t you libs simply admit it???”
The key phrase being “no evidence.” Gotta link? To one of your “murders” with “no evidence?”
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
4:02 pm
This is a great example of how out of touch liberals are from reality….
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/02/11/pelosi-false-argument-to-say-washington-has-spending-problem/
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
4:03 pm
barking frog
Itchy Finger
Using drones to kill Americans with no evidence is murder… Why can’t you libs simply admit it???
…………………………………………………………………………………..
It is abundantly clear that you did not read the memo’s
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
4:05 pm
Regnad Kcin:
There’s plenty of links… Google is your friend….
http://www.newsmax.com/Headline/Obama-drones-terror-bush/2013/02/07/id/489365
DebbieDoRight - A Do Right Woman
February 11th, 2013
4:06 pm
You’re wrong on that. Life DOES work like that. The reason for laws like “Black people can’t drink from this fountain” is because they DID drink from that fountain and someone didn’t like it…so it was TAKEN AWAY from them. Happens ALL the time.
Let me rephrase what i said earlier — was typing fast and when I looked back, saw where the error was made.
Here goes:
ONCE you’ve past legislation that outlaws an unjust law, THEN try to rescind that law; it would be nearly impossible to do.
For instance — The Civil Rights Legislation, or whatever its called, which gave blacks/minorities in america equal rights; OR the 19th Ammend; that gave women the right to vote. Once you’ve set that precedent and given these rights, it wouldn’t be easy trying to TAKE THOSE RIGHTS AWAY.
There.
That should be a bit more clear.
Jefferson
February 11th, 2013
4:06 pm
full of crap
Oscar
February 11th, 2013
4:06 pm
Killing in self defense is not murder. All a question of proof. Proven after the fact.
barking frog
February 11th, 2013
4:06 pm
Itchy Finger
It is abundantly clear that you did not read the memo’s.
…………………………………………………………..
tell me what they said.
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
February 11th, 2013
4:07 pm
Jose Rodriguez Defends Enhanced Interrogation…
And I will be meeting Ilary Blasi at the Holiday Inn Express tonight at 8:00
pogo
February 11th, 2013
4:07 pm
getalife, if he tries to capitalize on this it will make him a target for Islamic extremists. He can really do nothing at all but live with it. Besides, are you for people capitalizing on killing? Should anyone be?
UNCLE SAMANTHA
February 11th, 2013
4:08 pm
regnad kcin
SHAME ON THE LIBERAL DENIERS
http://www.cnn.com/2012/09/25/world/asia/pakistan-us-drone-strikes
(CNN) — U.S. drone strikes in Pakistan have killed far more people than the United States has acknowledged, have traumatized innocent residents and largely been ineffective, according to a new study released Tuesday.
The study by Stanford Law School and New York University’s School of Law calls for a re-evaluation of the practice, saying the number of “high-level” targets killed as a percentage of total casualties is extremely low — about 2%.
Common Sense isn't very Common
February 11th, 2013
4:09 pm
DDR
3:56 pm
That’s one of the many reasons we love you
AmericaShrugged
February 11th, 2013
4:09 pm
Enhanced interogation is a good thing, it probably saves lives.
Shooter volunteered and in return received pay and benefits. It was an arms length transaction like any other job.
Some of you may have forgotten that the 9/11 victims families got compensated in return for an agreement not to sue the airlines. It wasn’t about the famly’s loss at the hands of terrorists; it was about the alternative being crippling or possibly bankrupting the airlines. It had more in commomn with the GM bailout than the shooter’s situation.
Oscar
February 11th, 2013
4:10 pm
The memo’s in effect said we could kill in defense of out country.
Aquagirl
February 11th, 2013
4:11 pm
Using drones to kill Americans with no evidence is murder… Why can’t you libs simply admit it???
Less than two pages on the busted-up SEAL and our cons are bored already…there’s the thanks of a grateful nation.
Common Sense isn't very Common
February 11th, 2013
4:12 pm
DDR
now you want to give women the right to VOTE, HELL NO
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
4:12 pm
Sorry jay but this wasn’t a good idea writing about this. Your die hard followers have no clue how to even argue a topic such as this….
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
4:13 pm
Oscar:
And it says with no evidence…..
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
February 11th, 2013
4:13 pm
Enhanced interogation[sic] is a good thing, it probably saves lives.
Not according to Malcolm Nance.
Enhanced interrogation?
Are you too squishy to say torture?
indigo
February 11th, 2013
4:14 pm
Itchy Finger, Uncle Samantha
These terrorists we’ve killed would not have hesitated for a second to smuggle nuclear weapons into America and kill you.
Since you must know this, its clear there is nothing at all in your protestings but pure political anti-Obama rantings.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
4:15 pm
Oscar:
The “white paper”, obtained by NBC News, states that Americans and others can be targeted if they are believed to be “senior operational leaders” of al-Qaida or “an associated force,” even if there is no evidence that they are engaged in an active plot to attack American interests.
Oscar
February 11th, 2013
4:15 pm
Finger – No, tht’s not what it says . Better read it again.
UNCLE SAMANTHA
February 11th, 2013
4:16 pm
LIBS HAVE NO PROOF OF ANY DEATHS BY WATERBOARDING
THEN STICK THEIR HEADS IN THE OIL-SPILL INFESTED SAND ABOUT DEATHS FROM DRONES
obama gets the nobel peace prize for KILLING CHILDREN
and carter gets the nobel peace prize for providing the arms for indonesia to committ genocide in EAST TIMOR
the shame aint the same… just deflect the blame…. thats the liberal game…..
DebbieDoRight - A Do Right Woman
February 11th, 2013
4:16 pm
now you want to give women the right to VOTE, HELL NO
Common — it’ll be easier, and probably safer, taking cake from a fat kid, than trying to mess with a woman’s rights.
ESPECIALLY american women. Some of carry guns. And we know how to use them!
=========
Kam – Are you too squishy to say torture?
Yep.
Paul
February 11th, 2013
4:17 pm
Pretty somber, Jay. That and your 3:15. Somber.
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
February 11th, 2013
4:17 pm
LIBS HAVE NO PROOF OF ANY DEATHS BY WATERBOARDING
WATERBOARDING IS TORTURE REGARDLESS OF WHETHER OR NOT DEATH OCCURS, SPORT.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
4:17 pm
indigo:
I agree with you. Its all about politics and exposing the double standard. The left demonized Bush for dunking someone in water but remain silent about obama killing people with no evidence…
Erwin's cat
February 11th, 2013
4:18 pm
EXAMPLE, COMPARISON, CONTRAST, SAMPLE, STEROTYPE, PROTOTYPE.
VAGUE, UNRELATED, GERMANE, RELEVANT, MEANINGLESS, IMMATERIAL
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
4:18 pm
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes:
And where are those court documents where it was ruled torture. I can’t seem to find them sport….
UNCLE SAMANTHA
February 11th, 2013
4:18 pm
indigo
February 11th, 2013
4:14 pm
Itchy Finger, Uncle Samantha
These terrorists we’ve killed would not have hesitated for a second to smuggle nuclear weapons into America and kill you.
================================================================
liberalism at work
calling the women and children killed by drones TERRORISTS THAT WOULD SMUGGLE NUCLEAR WEAPONS is low
they were innocent ………. never had the chance to drink dirty water or breath dirty air
more shameful blamefule deflection
blame the vicitims
Moderate Line
February 11th, 2013
4:19 pm
Whether there is enough evidence or not is a matter of opinion which is why we have juries and judges in courts to determine such thing. The burden of proof is much less when all that is required is the opinion of high ranking intelligence official vs a judge and jury.
However, if you’re claiming he or she was a military attacks then you goal is not to prove “substantial evidence” which is what I thought the defenders of the drone attacks had been claiming. The goal is then to prove he or she was a military target according to international law.
Also, note it is not the libs with the double standard. Most liberals are calling for more transparency on this issue. It is merely the partisan apologist who are defending Obama.
One of the problems that people have with these attacks is the military has policy and procedures to ensure that international laws are being followed.
Dunwoody Granny
February 11th, 2013
4:19 pm
DDR –
Okay, fine, I’m willing to establish precedent.
In this case, and in every future case in which the US gov’t establishes a $25M bounty on someone, and that someone eventually winds up being picked off by the US military thanks to extraordinary work by a handful of CIA agents, the CIA agents and the military members on the mission get to divide the $25M. Just for doing their jobs. Because occasionally someone does a job that’s actually worth a bonus.
Football players get paid for showing up at the weekly game. They get extra for going to the Super Bowl. Even more if they win the Super Bowl.
Again I say: the circumstances of this case were extraordinary. The actions of these people were exemplary. That’s in no way meant to take away from the service of the ordinary soldier, the ordinary CIA analyst, the ordinary firefighter or police officer or working stiff. It’s just that this was the Super Bowl and these people stepped up.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
4:20 pm
Oscar:
Can you read?
Common Sense isn't very Common
February 11th, 2013
4:20 pm
DDR
Just for you. You don’t have the right equipment
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hz9AEJYCKrg
East Lake Ira
February 11th, 2013
4:21 pm
Somebody change Itchy already, it’s starting to really smell in here.
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
February 11th, 2013
4:22 pm
And where are those court documents where it was ruled torture. I can’t seem to find them sport….
Already answered at 3:45 p.m.
Maybe one of your class mates will lend you their notes since you aren’t paying attention in class.
UNCLE SAMANTHA
February 11th, 2013
4:22 pm
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
February 11th, 2013
4:17 pm
LIBS HAVE NO PROOF OF ANY DEATHS BY WATERBOARDING
WATERBOARDING IS TORTURE REGARDLESS OF WHETHER OR NOT DEATH OCCURS, SPORT.
===============================================================
is DEATH BY DRONE ATTACK then TORTURE?
or just MURDER?
or just liberal SPORT where everyone is a WINNER?
whiner
Brosephus™
February 11th, 2013
4:23 pm
Oscar @ 3:45
Google FERS and TSP. What you’re asking for was started in 1987 during the Reagan administration. The issues with the post office is due to the requirement that they prepay billions to their pension fund when nobody else has such a requirement.
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
4:24 pm
“He was the President. Remember back then the buck stopped with the President… Of course its different now”
Nope, it isn’t. An impeachment proceding still has to meet the Constitutional requirements and just because he was President does not meet that requirement. Now, if he personally approved the use of torture…that would be a different story, but even then, a case has to be brought. No case before Congress, no impeachment.
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
4:24 pm
“Using drones to kill Americans with no evidence is murder… Why can’t you libs simply admit it???”
Because you can’t admit a lie
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
February 11th, 2013
4:24 pm
is DEATH BY DRONE ATTACK then TORTURE?
NO
THIS HAS BEEN ANOTHER EPISODE OF ONE WORD ANSWERS TO A SIMPLE(TON’S) QUESTION.
Paul
February 11th, 2013
4:24 pm
Oscar
“I am surprised tht no pension and other benifits are vested until 20 yeares in the military. Should be vested at five years. Serving 16 years and leaving without any pension is really a disgrace”
A long time ago one of the justifications for the military retirement program was that it was a form of deferred compensation to make up for lower-than-civilan sector pay and living conditions. With the advent of pay parity and median compensation packages in the six figures, that rationale is weakened but the system survives. Vesting may seem fair, but it works against the idea of retaining personnel to the minimum 20-year point. But then again, so does a new GI Bill that provides nearly 50 grand a year to leave service.
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
4:26 pm
“Once you’ve set that precedent and given these rights, it wouldn’t be easy trying to TAKE THOSE RIGHTS AWAY”
And I still don’t agree. All it takes is enough people in Congress to pass the bill and a President willing to sign it. Whether it will pass constitution muster is another subject, but I refer you to the treatment of Japanese American citizens during WW2 for an example of how it can be done.
Paul
February 11th, 2013
4:27 pm
Three pages and none of the Obama-bashers have taken on ” I understand Obama said, Hell no. My guys are not surrendering. What do we need to rain hell on the Pakistani military? That was the one time in my life I was thinking, I am f…ing voting for this guy. I had a picture of him lying in bed at night, thinking, ‘You’re not f…ing with my guys.’
So they must accept it as plausible.
They sure do type pretty well with their heads spinning.
UNCLE SAMANTHA
February 11th, 2013
4:28 pm
Bro is correct…….. the upfront load of pension/healthcare is the reason for the USPS woes……….
however, the demographics was becoming such that there would be more retirees than active workers as the baby boomers retire………. then it would be a huge problem..
so typical DC solution….. solve one problem by making a worse problem
dbm
February 11th, 2013
4:28 pm
DebbieDoRight – A Do Right Woman
February 11th, 2013
3:56 pm
The reason pimps can get away with exploitation is that the government forces prostitution to stay outside the law, so prostitutes have no recourse when they are subjugated by a pimp. The proper function of government is to defend everyone, including prostitutes, from the initiation of direct or indirect physical force. Where government does not perform this function, capitalism can’t function. The prostitution industry in its current form is not an example of capitalism.
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
4:30 pm
Apparently Itchy does not have the ability to comprehend the google. Here Itchy, let me bing that for you so you can be educated and end your ignorance about Japanese soldiers who were hung for waterboarding American prisoners of war. http://tinyurl.com/b655thz
You may also want to become educated (I know we are reaching to ask you to do that before posting on a subject, but really, be one of the first conned to try something new) by at least using Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waterboarding
Common Sense isn't very Common
February 11th, 2013
4:30 pm
Bro
Glad you’re here.
I was just speaking with someone today about the OLD retirement plan for Federal employees and had to set them straight on the differences.
The workers of today aren’t treated near as well as the former military retirees or civil service employees.
I salute you for you service to our country
Stay safe my friend
UNCLE SAMANTHA
February 11th, 2013
4:32 pm
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
February 11th, 2013
4:24 pm
is DEATH BY DRONE ATTACK then TORTURE?
NO
===================================================================
and now we have it
LIBERAL LOGIC
torture is WORSE than MURDER
that LIBERAL LEFT WING RADIO HOST MICHAEL SAVAGE FROM SAN FRAN HAS IT RIGHT
liberalism is a mental disorder
http://www.amazon.com/Liberalism-Mental-Disorder-Savage-Solutions/dp/1595550437
alex
February 11th, 2013
4:32 pm
Jay, inrelation to your Civil war reading earlier; read Pat Barker’s “Regeneration Trilogy”- extremely powerful anti-war sentiment.
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
4:34 pm
Uncle Samatha does not comprehend the difference between a prisoner in custody and a terrorist who has eluded capture and meets other criteria. Oh the poutfest.
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
February 11th, 2013
4:36 pm
…LIBERAL LEFT WING RADIO HOST MICHAEL SAVAGE…
NOT INTENDED TO BE A FACTUAL STATEMENT.
AmericaShrugged
February 11th, 2013
4:37 pm
I’m not squishy, but you libs should figure out if you want to play PC or not. You play PC when it suits you but use words like “unconscionable” as Jay did earlier when it doesn’t.
Kam – We firebombed about 100,000 mostly women and children in Japan and followed that up with Nagasaki and Hiroshima, while under the direct orders of a Dem President. The Islamo facists killed over 3000. So no, I’m not squishy about a little water up the nose. I just wonder if blowtorches would be more effective?
UNCLE SAMANTHA
February 11th, 2013
4:39 pm
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
4:34 pm
Uncle Samatha does not comprehend the difference between a prisoner in custody and a terrorist who has eluded capture and meets other criteria. Oh the poutfest.
==================================================================
KEEP UP THE GOOD FIGHT DOES NOT UNDERSTAND THAT INNOCENT WOMEN AND CHILDREN ARE NOT TERRORISTS………….. SCARY
ACTUALLY THINKS ALL DEATHS BY DRONES ARE TERRORISTS……. NOT THE 2% THAT ARE ACTUALLY TERRORISTS………….. VERY SCARY
The study by Stanford Law School and New York University’s School of Law calls for a re-evaluation of the practice, saying the number of “high-level” targets killed as a percentage of total casualties is extremely low — about 2%.
http://www.cnn.com/2012/09/25/world/asia/pakistan-us-drone-strikes
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
February 11th, 2013
4:40 pm
Israel To Praying Ladies: You Can’t Have It Yahweh
All in all it’s just another chick at the wall
Uh Huh........Your beloved Bush & Bin Laden? George W. Bush Had Ties to Billionaire bin Laden Brood
February 11th, 2013
4:41 pm
WHAT DID YOUR BELOVED BUSH DO?
alex
February 11th, 2013
4:41 pm
@Kam, get over yourself, you are filled with one word answers, so nothing new, occassionally a pithy 3-4 words, nothing special same old rubbish, you and granny and her pthith (or whatever). If you are “literally”challenged,my bad…., but get over the self-enriching arrogance…”Wait for it “(3 words)
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
February 11th, 2013
4:42 pm
So no, I’m not squishy about a little water up the nose.
Not intended to be a factual statement.
Oh, and PC?
Bill Maher from the mid nineties called and said he wants his talking point back.
josef
February 11th, 2013
4:43 pm
An interesting read.
Granny Godzilla
February 11th, 2013
4:43 pm
alex
it’s piffle
as is your 4:41.
AmericaShrugged
February 11th, 2013
4:45 pm
Kam please….What does this man?
So no, I’m not squishy about a little water up the nose.
Not intended to be a factual statement.
You post that same line about 5 times a day when you have absolutely nothing to contribute but still feel compelled to post something. Did mommy dearest wean you from the teat too soon?
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
February 11th, 2013
4:47 pm
Kam please….What does this man[sic]?
Oh, the irony.
UNCLE SAMANTHA
February 11th, 2013
4:49 pm
AmericaShrugged
February 11th, 2013
4:45 pm
Kam please….What does this man?
Not intended to be a factual statement.
================================================
“Not intended to be a factual statement.” is actually a factual statement
appleseed
February 11th, 2013
4:49 pm
Sounds screwy to me.Why did he not finish out his 20 yrs?Could he not have transferred to another unit.Or at least applied ? He made the decision,so stop the self-pity.
Cheesy Grits is gone but not forgotten
February 11th, 2013
4:49 pm
So no, I’m not squishy about a little water up the nose. I just wonder if blowtorches would be more effective?
They wouldn’t that’s the problem
Torture me enough ill tell you I started the Great Chicago Fire and Killed Kennedy if that’s what you want to hear.
Intelligence gained by torture is notoriously unreliable.
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
4:50 pm
Sam, yes I do comprehend the distinctions. The collateral deaths from a drone attack are NOT the same as torture of a prisoner. If you wish to discuss drone policy and collateral damage (including the tragic loss of innocent civilians), lets start with WWII and firebombing a city. Congress authorized drone attacks by a President, see Patriot Act.
josef
February 11th, 2013
4:50 pm
alex
“the self-enriching arrogance…”
I like that turn of phrase. May I use it?
Oscar
February 11th, 2013
4:50 pm
At some point the drone attacks will have to stop being used in their present numbers. We may be losing more now in creating more harman danimosity than we are gaining by taking out the targets we are after.
But that is a political decision, not a legal question. Don’t think that a killing with documentation in the file showing it was reasonable aand justifiable is a violation of any law, US or International.
Common Sense isn't very Common
February 11th, 2013
4:53 pm
josef
the self-enriching arrogance
———————————————–
too late I Trademarked it
Uh Huh........Your beloved Bush & Bin Laden? George W. Bush Had Ties to Billionaire bin Laden Brood
February 11th, 2013
4:53 pm
CONS can say what they like about Obama.
What you WON’T get them to say is:
How the Bush family’s private connection to a dirty offshore bank is the only link between Osama bin Laden and Saddam Hussein.
The following chapter, “The BCCI Game: Banking on America, Banking on Jihad,” appears in investigative journalist Lucy Komisar’s new book “A Game as Old as Empire,” published by Berrett-Koehler (San Francisco).
Now that the U.S. Congress is investigating the truth of President George W. Bush’s statements about the Iraq war, they might look into one of his most startling assertions: that there was a link between Saddam Hussein and Osama bin Laden.
Critics dismissed that as an invention. They were wrong. There was a link, but not the one Bush was selling. The link between Hussein and Bin Laden was their banker, BCCI. But the link went beyond the dictator and the jihadist — it passed through Saudi Arabia and stretched all the way to George W. Bush and his father.
BCCI was the Bank of Credit and Commerce International, a dirty offshore bank that then-President Ronald Reagan’s Central Intelligence Agency used to run guns to Hussein, finance Osama bin Laden, move money in the illegal Iran-Contra operation and carry out other “agency” black ops. The Bushes also benefited privately; one of the bank’s largest Saudi investors helped bail out George W. Bush’s troubled oil investments.
UH HUH
TaxPayer
February 11th, 2013
4:55 pm
I see the Republicans posting here continue to ignore Jindal’s desire that the Republicans not be the stupid party.
josef
February 11th, 2013
4:56 pm
Common Sense….
Well, just d*mn…and I already had in mind just whom it fit…
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
February 11th, 2013
4:56 pm
Intelligence gained by torture is notoriously unreliable.
But…but…but… I saw the ticking time-bomb scenario on 24 so it MUST be true!
Butch Cassidy (I)
February 11th, 2013
4:56 pm
Please do not engage itchy. If you speak to him, he will never go away.
Uh Huh........Your beloved Bush & Bin Laden? George W. Bush Had Ties to Billionaire bin Laden Brood
February 11th, 2013
4:57 pm
@TaxPayer
February 11th, 2013
4:55 pm
I see the Republicans posting here continue to ignore Jindal’s desire that the Republicans not be the stupid party.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
CONS can have a FACELIFT…..
Eventually it FALLS back down.
Uh Huh
UNCLE SAMANTHA
February 11th, 2013
4:58 pm
COLLATERAL DEATHS ARE MURDER…….. LIBERALS WANT TO RUN AND HIDE FROM IT
SHAME
комиссар (Occupation)
February 11th, 2013
4:58 pm
Jay: “It certainly didn’t shy from the degrading psychological toll even on those who perpetrated the torture.”
I’m sure it did. But my point is that so is burning down a village or gang-raping women in wartime. But that doesn’t mean I want to get a chance to empathize with that psychological toll. Instead I’d like it to continue to be unthinkable that such things happen in the first place.
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
4:58 pm
“If you speak to him, he will never go away”
Do we WANT him to go away?
Oscar
February 11th, 2013
4:59 pm
Arrogance becomes Him – Sounds like a good movie title
Common Sense isn't very Common
February 11th, 2013
4:59 pm
josef
Send Jay the check when you use that phrase and all will be good,
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
4:59 pm
“COLLATERAL DEATHS ARE MURDER…….. LIBERALS WANT TO RUN AND HIDE FROM IT”
Unlike the cons, who didn’t even bother to COUNT them during that ill advised adventure in Iraq
Uh Huh........Your beloved Bush & Bin Laden? George W. Bush Had Ties to Billionaire bin Laden Brood
February 11th, 2013
5:00 pm
@UNCLE SAMANTHA
February 11th, 2013
4:58 pm
COLLATERAL DEATHS ARE MURDER…….. LIBERALS WANT TO RUN AND HIDE FROM IT
SHAME
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
JUST LIKE CONS WANT TO RUN AND HIDE FROM WEAPONS
OF MASS DESTRUCTION THAT CAUSED THOUSANDS TO
LOSE THEIR LIVES.
SHAME
UH HUH
josef
February 11th, 2013
5:01 pm
Common Sense
He takes a 10% fee, ya know…
Cosby
February 11th, 2013
5:01 pm
to the press and the white house and congress – Some things should remain secret and not made public like the Grammy’s…no Seal Team 6, no identification of those who belonged to Seal Team 6..but no..we have one of their own writing a book, we have the press lurching at each corner to get that “Excludive Interview”…..when all should have kept silent shame on those who cannot keep a secret. Now the dumb government should step in and hel he and his family..but they will not see government motors and green energy!!
UNCLE SAMANTHA
February 11th, 2013
5:01 pm
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
4:59 pm
“COLLATERAL DEATHS ARE MURDER…….. LIBERALS WANT TO RUN AND HIDE FROM IT”
Unlike the cons, who didn’t even bother to COUNT them during that ill advised adventure in Iraq
======================================================================
WELL SAID
UNCLE SAMANTHA
February 11th, 2013
5:02 pm
Uh Huh……..Your beloved Bush & Bin Laden? George W. Bush Had Ties to Billionaire bin Laden Brood
February 11th, 2013
5:00 pm
@UNCLE SAMANTHA
February 11th, 2013
4:58 pm
COLLATERAL DEATHS ARE MURDER…….. LIBERALS WANT TO RUN AND HIDE FROM IT
SHAME
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
JUST LIKE CONS WANT TO RUN AND HIDE FROM WEAPONS
OF MASS DESTRUCTION THAT CAUSED THOUSANDS TO
LOSE THEIR LIVES.
SHAME
UH HUH
======================================================================
AGREED
DebbieDoRight - A Do Right Woman
February 11th, 2013
5:03 pm
DG — DG please read the following words, (that i stated earlier):
it wouldn’t be easy trying to TAKE THOSE RIGHTS AWAY”
I said it wouldn’t be easy, i didn’t say it wouldn’ t be impossible.
================
dbm: The proper function of government is to defend everyone, including prostitutes, from the initiation of direct or indirect physical force. Where government does not perform this function, capitalism can’t function. The prostitution industry in its current form is not an example of capitalism.
Tomato / tomato it’s walking like a duck, talking like a duck, etc.; etc.
IMO prostitution is a GREAT example of capitalism.
Definition (as defined by Websters):
Capitalism – an economic system characterized by private or corporate ownership of capital goods, by investments that are determined by private decision, and by prices, production, and the distribution of goods that are determined mainly by competition in a free market.
an economic system characterized by private or corporate ownership of capital goods
the pimp OWNS the h@@es – the ho##es are the goods.
investments that are determined by private decision, and by prices, production, and the distribution of goods
the pimp determine the prices that the h##es will solicit from their customers.
determined mainly by competition in a free market
the pimp’s pricing will be in line with what the other pimp’s are getting from their ho##s; in order to compete for the customer’s dollars.
All of this ^^ sounds like the perfect example of capitalism in its purest form.
Common Sense isn't very Common
February 11th, 2013
5:03 pm
josef
How else do you think he can pay for that cheap bourbon he drinks
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
February 11th, 2013
5:04 pm
to the press and the white house and congress – Some things should remain secret and not made public
Valerie Plame says, “What?”
DebbieDoRight - A Do Right Woman
February 11th, 2013
5:04 pm
DG — DG please read the following words, (that i stated earlier):
it wouldn’t be easy trying to TAKE THOSE RIGHTS AWAY”
I said it wouldn’t be easy, i didn’t say it wouldn’ t be impossible.
================
dbm: The proper function of government is to defend everyone, including prostitutes, from the initiation of direct or indirect physical force. Where government does not perform this function, capitalism can’t function. The prostitution industry in its current form is not an example of capitalism.
Tomato / tomato it’s walking like a duck, talking like a duck, etc.; etc.
IMO prostitution is a GREAT example of capitalism.
Definition (as defined by Websters):
Capitalism – an economic system characterized by private or corporate ownership of capital goods, by investments that are determined by private decision, and by prices, production, and the distribution of goods that are determined mainly by competition in a free market.
an economic system characterized by private or corporate ownership of capital goods
for intents and purposes, the pimp OWNS the h#@es – therefore the ho##es are the goods.
investments that are determined by private decision, and by prices, production, and the distribution of goods
the pimp determines the price that the h##es will solicit from their customers.
determined mainly by competition in a free market
the pimp’s pricing will be in line with what the other pimp’s are getting from their ho##s; in order to compete for the customer’s dollars.
IMO All of this ^^ sounds like the perfect example of capitalism in its purest form.
UNCLE SAMANTHA
February 11th, 2013
5:05 pm
SOME DUMMY LIBERALS ACTUALLY BELIEVE I AM CONSERVATIVE………..AND TRY TO COUNTER MY ARGUMENTS OF THE HYPICRACY OF THE LIBERALS BY DEFLECTING TO A CONSERVATIVE POINT OF EQUAL BUT OPPOSITE IDIOCY
SILLY LIBERAL RABBITS
TRIX IS FOR KIDS
Recon 0311 2533
February 11th, 2013
5:05 pm
Khalid Sheikh Mohammed appears to be in much better condition than Anwar al-Awlaki and his 16 year old son. KSM and two others underwent enhanced interrogation in the form of water boarding and Leon Pannetta recently dispelled White House misinformation by stating that water boarding did indeed play a significant role in obtaining the intelligence that led to OBL. I don’t particularly have a problem with how the Obama administration sends the likes of al-Awlaki off to Allah but when these guys get slammed with a Hell-Fire rocket there’s not much left of them to provide any intel. It does beg the question should one wish to debate the humane issue as to which is the most humane enhanced interrogation that produces actionable intelligence while leaving the interrogatee alive and well or a drone strike that produces a confirmed kill.
Common Sense isn't very Common
February 11th, 2013
5:09 pm
Del
Boots on the ground come with other risks as you know.
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
February 11th, 2013
5:09 pm
SOMEONE WHO USES THE WORD “HYPICRACY”, SHOULDN’T BE THROWING WORDS AROUND LIKE “DUMMY” AND “IDIOCY”.
JUST SUGGESTING
JamVet
February 11th, 2013
5:10 pm
I find it very encouraging that we now have a robust anti-war voice among Republicans and other right wingers.
UNCLE SAMANTHA, AmericaShrugged and Itchy are to be commended for standing up to and denouncing those who violate American and international law in the name of the “War on Terror”.
Hopefully their voices were heard loud and clear during the previous administration’s serial violations of law as well, but even if they are new to this concept, they have now joined in with the anti-war movement and are speaking out against this administration. And that is important.
And I welcome them to the fold. We need many more of them!
That Black Guy
February 11th, 2013
5:10 pm
If any of you guys know jay personally, please shake his hand for me.
Jay, thanks for bringing this to your attention.
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
5:10 pm
It does beg the question should one wish to debate the humane issue as to which is the most humane enhanced interrogation that produces actionable intelligence while leaving the interrogatee alive and well or a drone strike that produces a confirmed kill.
Oh prey tell, how do you interrogate a person not in custody. Or you just yelling at the clouds again?
That Black Guy
February 11th, 2013
5:11 pm
Jay, thanks for bringing this to your attention.
make that OUR attention.
That Black Guy
February 11th, 2013
5:14 pm
Native Atlantan
February 11th, 2013
2:00 pm
Only Crapwich could take a unifying moment and turn it partisan…..
*along with his twin*
fedup
February 11th, 2013
2:00 pm
Some facts. It was riveting. Can somebody do something for the shooter and his family.
Now cons and NRA bums take a lesson from the shooter. He has nothing to do with guns.
barking frog
February 11th, 2013
5:16 pm
josef
you may have self-effacing arrogance….
DebbieDoRight - A Do Right Woman
February 11th, 2013
5:17 pm
I’ve figured out how we can NOT use the drones and STILL get those terrorists!
We can teleport them!
Don’t laugh! They do it on Star Trek all the time!
Just the other day, I saw where Capt. Jean Luc Picard, told his Chief Engineer, to “beam” up an enemy combatant and send them directly to the brig!!
It was fascinating!
If we did that, we could save lives, millions of lives, property and food supplies!
this would work people! this would really work!
Who’s with me?
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
5:17 pm
josef, thought you might enjoy this one: Atop yet another typical Fox News article espousing the merits of heteronormativity sits a decidedly atypical sight: A photo of the same-sex couple who made headlines last year for being the first same-sex couple to get married at the Empire State Building.
DebbieDoRight - A Do Right Woman
February 11th, 2013
5:18 pm
Oh and thanks common for the dedication!!
You’re so sweet!
Recon 0311 2533
February 11th, 2013
5:18 pm
Oh prey tell, how do you interrogate a person not in custody. Or you just yelling at the clouds again?
The voice of incoherence utters yet another inane comment.
That Black Guy
February 11th, 2013
5:19 pm
Native Atlantan
February 11th, 2013
2:00 pm
Only Crapwich could take a unifying moment and turn it partisan…..
_____________________________________________
Reading 30 min after your post shows that it’s NOT “Only Crapwich could take a unifying moment and turn it partisan…..”
Both sides…
Brosephus™
February 11th, 2013
5:20 pm
NoCom
I laugh my ass off at people who think government workers have some kind of big assed retirement plan. Unless you were hired before 1987, your retirement plan could best be called, “market better save my ass ’cause that’s all I’ll have by the time I retire.” The people who retire in the next 10 years might be lucky, but I don’t expect to see a penny from Social Security or my defined pension, as small as it is.
Real Scootter
February 11th, 2013
5:21 pm
Oh prey tell, how do you interrogate a person not in custody. Or you just yelling at the clouds again?
Keep,
How would you answer the question he posed? (no snarc)
josef
February 11th, 2013
5:21 pm
Common Sense
A bourbon man can’t be all bad…
FROG
Not if you believe my detractor from last evening!
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
5:22 pm
In other words, Del fails again.
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
5:24 pm
Scooter, Del did not post a question that can be answered. You cannot interrogate a person not in custody. So “which is the “most humane enhanced interrogation technique” is plainly an idiotic question when discussing a drone attack on a person who is not in custody nor easily reached.
josef
February 11th, 2013
5:25 pm
GOOD FIGHT
Now that’s just TOOOO funny! Thanks for sharing…
BROSEPHUS
Got my first pre-retirement workshop coming up next Monday…furlough day…how apt is that?
indigo
February 11th, 2013
5:25 pm
Uncle – 4:18
How do you know women and children were killed?
Were you there?
And, even if you’re right, you know perfectly well I was NOT talking about them.
Common Sense isn't very Common
February 11th, 2013
5:25 pm
DDR
any time love
Keep
If a person who had a sex change operation in somewhere else and then moved to Ga. and then got married, what would be their standing?
I am curious as this might be a real problem nationwide.
getalife
February 11th, 2013
5:25 pm
cnn and rw media covered this one.
He is working some as a consultant.
Orange13
February 11th, 2013
5:27 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EUzMPlQb2G4
DebbieDoRight - A Do Right Woman
February 11th, 2013
5:27 pm
Oh prey tell, how do you interrogate a person not in custody. Or you just yelling at the clouds again?
Not keep, (he’s prettier — he looks like a girl, throws like one too); but I would ask the question is there just some people who are too dangerous to keep in custody?
Would we really want to endanger our people’s lives by keeping someone like OBL in custody? Imagine the rescue attempts that would take place trying to free him; not to mention the disruption that he may bring to the general population at the facility.
Imagine the SYMBOLISM too. He would become a martyr, a symbol of a man who is holding out against american imperialism. Good example (but not a PERFECT EXAMPLE) is Nelson Mandela. the South Africans would’ve had more peace if they would’ve just executed him. By keeping him imprisoned and alive all those years, they just strengthened the resistance.
IMO
Recon 0311 2533
February 11th, 2013
5:29 pm
Common Sense, you’re correct there. Like I said I personally don’t have a problem with drone strike hits on terrorists. We can’t, however, kill enough of them to really get ahead in this war. Over the last four years we’ve only captured one high ranking AQ member. It seems we’re losing sight of valuable intelligence opportunities with a kill only strategy verses a capture or kill.
Real Scootter
February 11th, 2013
5:30 pm
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
5:24 pm
Thanks Keep! No wonder I couldn’t come up with an answer.I was really hoping you had one!
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
5:30 pm
Common, not sure. I suspect it depends on the definition of woman and whether it requires “natural born” (whatever that means in an age of fertility implantation). But I have not researched that.
josef
February 11th, 2013
5:31 pm
DDR
Good point at 5:27
Soothsayer
February 11th, 2013
5:34 pm
As stated before, I think that the “real-life killing” of Osama bin Laden and now this movie are wonderful works of fiction designed to entertain an ignorant populace.
Gosh, we kill the head of Al Qaeda, and, rather than putting him in the cold locker aboard ship and returning his body to the U.S. for identification, we give him a full-fledged burial at sea presumably with honors.
Then, serendipitously, most of those involved in the “raid” are killed in a questionable helicopter accident.
I think this good soldier knows when to “get out while the getting’s good.”
I love a good fiction.
Common Sense isn't very Common
February 11th, 2013
5:34 pm
Del
Human Intel has been cut along with the budget over the years, what would you do to increase the amount of intel available?
Recon 0311 2533
February 11th, 2013
5:35 pm
Scooter, Del did not post a question that can be answered. You cannot interrogate a person not in custody. So “which is the “most humane enhanced interrogation technique” is plainly an idiotic question when discussing a drone attack on a person who is not in custody nor easily reached
Do you proof read your posts before clicking submit comment. No problem a rhetorical question.
josef
February 11th, 2013
5:36 pm
Common Sense
Why do you ask? Inquiring minds want to know….
Oscar
February 11th, 2013
5:36 pm
Bro at 5:20 – Good plan. If you don’t expect anything you won’t be disappointed.
I think s.s. will be here, but, you are right not to count on it. Or a pension.
Brosephus™
February 11th, 2013
5:36 pm
josef
In layman’s terms, I think you just got the finger.
That Black Guy
February 11th, 2013
5:37 pm
indigo
February 11th, 2013
3:11 pm
In the middle – 2:55
What is this Obamaphone you speak of?
Is this one of the gifts Ronald McRomney alluded to?
How do I get one?
__________________________________
http://obamaphone.net/
Oscar
February 11th, 2013
5:38 pm
Does the Pope have a pension?
Common Sense isn't very Common
February 11th, 2013
5:39 pm
josef
If you retire you will be here ALL DAY.
Gessh Jay will not have a freakin break. More Bourbon will be called for.
DebbieDoRight - A Do Right Woman
February 11th, 2013
5:40 pm
hiya josef! sorry it me so long to “write” you back. I hardly EVAH go through non-work related emails (unless they’re Evites!); so i missed the shout out.
Common Sense isn't very Common
February 11th, 2013
5:41 pm
josef
I have a friend who is trying to decide where to get married
josef
February 11th, 2013
5:41 pm
Why not stick to the tried and true…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sAn7baRbhx4
UNCLE SAMANTHA
February 11th, 2013
5:41 pm
indigo
February 11th, 2013
5:25 pm
Uncle – 4:18
How do you know women and children were killed?
Were you there?
And, even if you’re right, you know perfectly well I was NOT talking about them.
=====================================================================
AND HOW DO YOU KNOW ONLY TERRORISTS WERE KILLED…… WERE YOU THERE?
RB from Gwinnett
February 11th, 2013
5:42 pm
Can you liberals clear this up for me, please….
Was it this guy who killed Osama, or was it his gun? Seems if the gun was the blame for Newtown, it must also get the blame/credit for Osama, right?
Oscar
February 11th, 2013
5:44 pm
RB – It was the bullet that killed him
Real Scootter
February 11th, 2013
5:44 pm
Do you proof read your posts before clicking submit comment
Yes I do Recon and still manage to make stupid mistakes.I don’t understand your point in asking me that question though.Would you mind explaining?
barking frog
February 11th, 2013
5:45 pm
Oscar
the pope does not have a pension plan but he may create
one before he leaves office.
josef
February 11th, 2013
5:45 pm
DDR
You should have another one…
Brosephus
Curious
S/he’s marrying a sex change?
COMMON SENSE
He deserves it, I tell ya…
getalife
February 11th, 2013
5:45 pm
rb,
I would love to own the gun that killed obl.
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
5:45 pm
Doggone, that is a great law school question but it presumes a lot. If an American citizen, then constitutionally you could not kill once in custody (although we know that some law enforcement has acted as judge and executioner). But whether OBL would have been a “magnet” for more attacks alive or dead, or a martyr whether alive or dead presumes we can have a lot of “facts” that are really non-existence. Saddam was not much of a lightning rod once captured. And we have prisoners all the time who may encourage others to try to free.
Recon 0311 2533
February 11th, 2013
5:45 pm
Common Sense, just for an example we now know enough about the bin Ladin operation, (although we shouldn’t) to know it was a snuff operation and he could have been easily captured. Imagine OBL undergoing enhanced interrogation. He would have broke. Even though the CIA has done a great job of intercepting communication traffic and utilizing informent assets given the nature of this enemy we need to focus capturing and interrogating not just eliminatinghigh value targets IMO.
josef
February 11th, 2013
5:46 pm
SCOOTTER
Don’t let Wa-do Del get under your skin…he has issues…
Real Scootter
February 11th, 2013
5:47 pm
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
5:47 pm
Del claiming that he posts questions without reading them for coherency and then calling others incoherent for pointing out his failures. Oh the irony!
getalife
February 11th, 2013
5:49 pm
del is soft on obl.
Weak.
Recon 0311 2533
February 11th, 2013
5:49 pm
real scooter,
That was directed to keep up the good fight not you. Go back and read my comment completely
Soothsayer
February 11th, 2013
5:51 pm
Insurgents shot down a U.S. military helicopter during fighting in eastern Afghanistan, killing 30 Americans, most of them belonging to the same elite unit as the Navy SEALs who killed former Al Qaeda leader Usama bin Laden, U.S. officials said Saturday. It was the deadliest single loss for American forces in the decade-old war against the Taliban.
One current and one former U.S. official said that the dead included 25 Navy SEALs from SEAL Team Six, the unit that carried out the raid in Pakistan in May that killed bin Laden. They were being flown by a crew of the 160th Special Operations Aviation Regiment. Both officials spoke on condition of anonymity because families are still being notified.
Now that’s some real bad luck right there. There’s no doubt about it.
Now let’s see, hmmmm . . . 25, that would probably MOST of them, wouldn’t you say?
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
5:51 pm
to know it was a snuff operation and he could have been easily captured
Says the arm chair Ftroop captain who was not there.
getalife
February 11th, 2013
5:52 pm
I remember the American people hitting the streets to celebrate after learning obl was dead.
Very patriotic.
Recon 0311 2533
February 11th, 2013
5:52 pm
real scooter,
See keep up at 5:24.
detritusUSA
February 11th, 2013
5:52 pm
Enough! If you’ve never served, you’re nothing but an ignorant armchair warrior. Just shut your mouth about something which you have no experience with or knowledge of. This guy could have stayed for his 20, but he chose not to. He knew the consequences, he needs to just live with it. A soldier is a soldier, some heroes, some not; a soldier is a soldier.
DebbieDoRight - A Do Right Woman
February 11th, 2013
5:53 pm
Saddam was not much of a lightning rod once captured. And we have prisoners all the time who may encourage others to try to free.
Saddam was hate by his people — if anything they’d break in TO kill him.
OBL was much loved by his radical followers and his mere presence could’ve caused a dissent — not to break free, but to “pollute the waters” so to speak.
=================
Well folks, it’s Pilsner time. DDR out!
JamVet
February 11th, 2013
5:53 pm
I don’t think the bullet killed him either, Oscar.
It was almost certainly the damage to vital organs, etc and massive blood loss that killed him!
boots
February 11th, 2013
5:56 pm
Jay, really great article. This guy is a hero and should receive the benefits accorded a man who served our nation. I, for one, would rather he get my tax money than 99.9% of all the stupid things it goes towards. What needs to be done?
Recon 0311 2533
February 11th, 2013
5:56 pm
Says the arm chair Ftroop captain who was not there.
No dummy, all you have to do is read the reports that have been leaked and what Jay posted regarding the accounting from the SEAL Team ” shooter to make that determination. Geez
Real Scootter
February 11th, 2013
5:57 pm
Recon 0311 2533
February 11th, 2013
5:49 pm
Thanks Recon! I did finally figure it out.Sorry,I have a tendancy to be a bit slow.
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
5:58 pm
Jam, you are wrong. His heart stopped. That will kill you every time.
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
6:00 pm
No Recon, you are wrong. But you go ahead and arm chair all you want. Its more buffoonery. You don’t have any proof. and in fact the esquire article specifically says otherwise.
I’m just looking at him from right here [he moves his hand out from his face about ten inches]. He’s got a gun on a shelf right there, the short AK he’s famous for. And he’s moving forward. I don’t know if she’s got a vest and she’s being pushed to martyr them both. He’s got a gun within reach. He’s a threat. I need to get a head shot so he won’t have a chance to clack himself off [blow himself up].
Read more: Man Who Killed Osama Bin Laden – Treatment of Veteran Who Shot bin Laden – Esquire http://www.esquire.com/features/man-who-shot-osama-bin-laden-0313-5#ixzz2KdOMvjtL
josef
February 11th, 2013
6:01 pm
GOOD FIGHT
“His heart stopped. That will kill you every time. ”
Well, not EVERY time…there’s two or three of us still here and still blogging…
godless heathen - owner of many things he does not need
February 11th, 2013
6:06 pm
DDR: The firemen/rescuers who died in the twin towers were a finite number of people. Let’s say their number was 300.
The average compensation to the 9/11 victims’ families was $1.7 million. I assume this included those that were there as responders.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/September_11th_Victim_Compensation_Fund
Common Sense isn't very Common
February 11th, 2013
6:06 pm
josef@6:01
Can we improve on those odds?
j/k you leeching retiree to be
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
6:07 pm
josef, you’re right short term. Still I don’t know of a single person who died whose heart did not ultimately stop.
You can delay but ultimately it gets us all.
Real Scootter
February 11th, 2013
6:08 pm
Well, not EVERY time…there’s two or three of us still here and still blogging…
And some of us here are glad you made it!!
Recon 0311 2533
February 11th, 2013
6:08 pm
There was bin Laden standing there. He had his hands on a woman’s shoulders, pushing her ahead, not exactly toward me but by me, in the direction of the hallway commotion. It was his youngest wife, Amal.
He looked confused. And way taller than I was expecting. He had a cap on and didn’t appear to be hit. I can’t tell you 100 percent, but he was standing and moving. He was holding her in front of him. Maybe as a shield, I don’t know.
For me, it was a snapshot of a target ID, definitely him. Even in our kill houses where we train, there are targets with his face on them. This was repetition and muscle memory. That’s him, boom, done….
Keep up the poor fight, reading comprehension and assimilation just isn’t your thing now is it. Carry on
Soothsayer
February 11th, 2013
6:08 pm
Innovative jazz trumpeter Donald Byrd dies at 80
azz musician Donald Byrd, a leading hard-bop trumpeter of the 1950s who collaborated on dozens of albums with top artists of his time and later enjoyed commercial success with hit jazz-funk fusion records such as “Black Byrd,” has died. He was 80.
He died Feb. 4 in Delaware, according to Haley Funeral Directors in the Detroit suburb of Southfield, Mich., which is handling arrangements. It didn’t have details on his death.
Byrd, who was also a pioneer in jazz education, attended Cass Technical High School in Detroit, played in military bands in the Air Force and moved to New York in 1955. The trumpeter, whose given name was Donaldson Toussaint L’Ouverture Byrd II, rose to national prominence when he joined Art Blakey’s Jazz Messengers later that year, filling the seat in the bebop group held by his idol Clifford Brown.
Here’s my favorite song of his:
Although a high-quality original of this song by Donald Byrd is almost non-existent, this cover by Joe McBride is a great version of “Walking in Rhythm.”
Bob
February 11th, 2013
6:11 pm
randy , 2:25 pm,
I still think there needs to be an investigation into why we let bin Laden go at Tora Bora. Bush / Cheney / Rumsfeld all gave a blatantly false excuse of “we weren’t sure he was there”.
randy, why not ask why Clinton didn’t take him out before 9/11 ? Just think, if Clinton would have taken him out when he had the chance we would not have had 9/11 most likely, but you want to investigate Bush !
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
6:11 pm
Recon, using your brain aint your thing now. You made a claim and yet trained Seals (and you are not a trained Seal) knew that capture would not be easy or safe. Once again, you cowardly run away instead of proving your claim. You’re dismissed as a child, again.
josef
February 11th, 2013
6:11 pm
GOOD FIGHT
Was it the heart stopped, or the blood stopped flowing…
SCOOTTER
And some aren’t!
TBS
February 11th, 2013
6:12 pm
Sooth
Do you think the Esquire story is fake and being used to solidify OBL’s death in American’s minds?
If not, what purpose do you think this story serves? I’m asking from the perspective that it seems based on your post that this gentlemen and his SEAL team didn’t kill OBL.
Apologize if I have misinterpreted any of your previous posts regarding this issue.
That Black Guy
February 11th, 2013
6:15 pm
Brosephus™
February 11th, 2013
5:20 pm
NoCom
I laugh my ass off at people who think government workers have some kind of big assed retirement plan. Unless you were hired before 1987, your retirement plan could best be called, “market better save my ass ’cause that’s all I’ll have by the time I retire.” The people who retire in the next 10 years might be lucky, but I don’t expect to see a penny from Social Security or my defined pension, as small as it is.
____________________________________
Stop yer b**chin’.
You should have took that gov’t job while you were still in middle school, and you would have been set.
josef
February 11th, 2013
6:16 pm
COMMON SENSE
Not sure when that day is coming, but it sure is nice to know it can be whenever I choose now…
Rightwing troll
February 11th, 2013
6:16 pm
“F. Sinkwich
February 11th, 2013
1:53 pm
This indeed confusing.
The loonies here said O’bozo killed OBL…”
One thing’s for damn sure…George W Bush didn’t kill him…
F. Sinkwich
February 11th, 2013
6:18 pm
Maybe he can get a gig at Blackwater.
Oh yeah, lib ilks hate that company, so they would rather he take a government handout.
Got it.
godless heathen - owner of many things he does not need
February 11th, 2013
6:20 pm
If not, what purpose do you think this story serves? I’m asking from the perspective that it seems based on your post that this gentlemen and his SEAL team didn’t kill OBL.
I was always curious about the DNA ID they did on the body in a manner of hours on a ship.
Soothsayer
February 11th, 2013
6:20 pm
TBS: numerous reports have Osama bin Laden living on dialysis and on borrowed time as early as 2000. Even Fox News reports that he died sometime in 2000.
I find it implausible — if not laughable — that, after having killed the most-wanted “terrist” in the whole wide world, we would dump him overboard rather than returning his body to the U.S. for identification.
I also find it extremely suspicious that many of those SEAL Team 6 members who presumably “got” bin Laden were themselves killed shortly after the “raid.”
As far as “purpose?” I mean, come on. Here’s Obama a hero for killing bin Laden. He’s got “bona fides” that no one can question as a Commander in Chief.
It’s just all too tidy for me. But, then again, anyone on this blog will tell you that I’m a conspiracy nut. I freely admit it. I don’t trust our government.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
6:22 pm
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes:
So an opinion from someone is actually concrete.. Wow.. I know you people are crazy but delusional to…. That’s almost like taking Al Gore’s movie seriously. Oh wait. ya’ll did….
And it was actually at 3:46… But since its no count it don’t matter… No court has ever decided whether water boarding is torture. Its simply the opinion of the left….
Brosephus™
February 11th, 2013
6:22 pm
TBG
Dammitt!!!!! I hate it when you’re right. I should have gotten up off my sorry ass and got a job like real people. I could have gone back to finish school later on like the pro athletes do.
godless heathen - owner of many things he does not need
February 11th, 2013
6:23 pm
WalMart says they will hire any veteran that applies.
Thogwummpy
February 11th, 2013
6:29 pm
Sadly, we’re a nation that pays worthless social workers more than a soldier. We give a free living to the laziest; and yet those who serve can barely scrape by or provide for their families. We rely on charities to aid the disabled veteran…and yet pour taxpayer funded services upon trespassers who jump our borders illegally. Our priorities are “progressive”…which means totally out of whack; and pathetically UNETHICAL.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
6:30 pm
Keep Up the Good Fight!
Apparently Keep you don’t live in the US. I could care less what happened in Japan. Japan can do what they want…. We here in America live by our own rules and water boarding was legal when we did it. I realize you libs don’t understand reality once again and that’s to bad… Hopefully when you gain the intelligence and inform your \self you’ll understand more about where you live… In no court in this country has water boarding been deemed illegal. get over… Check Mate!!
Real Scootter
February 11th, 2013
6:31 pm
I freely admit it. I don’t trust our government.
Then you should be a NRA member.
indigo
February 11th, 2013
6:32 pm
Uncle – 5:41
That is not what I asked.
josef
February 11th, 2013
6:33 pm
SCOOTTER
Sooth has issues, too…
Brosephus™
February 11th, 2013
6:35 pm
Sadly, we’re a nation that pays worthless social workers more than a soldier.
Besides the fact that you’re comparing state workers to feds, there’s no help for someone who sees social workers as worthless.
F. Sinkwich
February 11th, 2013
6:37 pm
There’s more to this story somehow.
No named sources. No substantiation. No evidence anywhere. Just hearsay and crap.
But this story is certainly enough to suck in Jay and his weep-easy minions, as evidenced by the posts here.
But lib ilks like to believe sob stories so they can lobby for more government spending to end such “injustices.”
Pathetic.
godless heathen - owner of many things he does not need
February 11th, 2013
6:38 pm
On 1/20/09 Dims lost their healthy skepticism of government.
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
6:39 pm
No named sources. No substantiation. No evidence anywhere. Just hearsay and crap.
Someone is confused. We are not talking about Benghazi.
That Black Guy
February 11th, 2013
6:41 pm
Brosephus™
February 11th, 2013
6:22 pm
TBG
Dammitt!!!!! I hate it when you’re right. I should have gotten up off my sorry ass and got a job like real people. I could have gone back to finish school later on like the pro athletes do.
___________________________________________________
Now you got it.
Who needs recess when there’s work to do.
Real Scootter
February 11th, 2013
6:43 pm
Sooth has issues, too…
So do I Josef,I guess that’s why I read his posts.
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
6:43 pm
“On 1/20/09 Dims lost their healthy skepticism of government”
I got MINE on May 4, 1970. Haven’t lost it yet.
комиссар (Occupation)
February 11th, 2013
6:44 pm
Sinkwich : “But lib ilks like to believe sob stories so they can lobby for more government spending to end such “injustices.”
getalife
February 11th, 2013
6:44 pm
“In her parting shot on leaving the State Department, Hillary Clinton said of her Republican critics, “They just will not live in an evidence-based world.” She was referring specifically to the Benghazi controversy, but her point applies much more generally. And for all the talk of reforming and reinventing the G.O.P., the ignorance caucus retains a firm grip on the party’s heart and mind.” Krugman.
Reality is just too much for them.
F. Sinkwich
February 11th, 2013
6:45 pm
“We are not talking about Benghazi.”
Nope.
At least with the Benghazi thing we have some facts. Real facts, not some loonie illusion.
getalife
February 11th, 2013
6:47 pm
filky,
You got nothing to get our President.
Stop trying con.
Paul
February 11th, 2013
6:48 pm
Okay, I’m confused. Again.
I’m back to reading the same people saying Pres Obama did not kill Osama bin Laden, it was a SEAL (team).
AND I’m reading Pres Obama kills Americans with drones and Hellfire missiles. It’s not the drone pilot pulling the trigger and killing the people, it’s Pres Obama.
Can someone PLEASE clarify this for me?
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
6:49 pm
“At least with the Benghazi thing we have some facts. Real facts, not some loonie illusion”
Sure, after we filter out the loonie illusions put there by the conned
F. Sinkwich
February 11th, 2013
6:50 pm
“You got nothing to get our President.”
Off topic.
I’m calling BULLCRAP on this story. BULLCRAP.
Prove me wrong.
комиссар (Occupation)
February 11th, 2013
6:51 pm
There goes your rube yawp.
getalife
February 11th, 2013
6:51 pm
“Can someone PLEASE clarify this for me?”
They are still focused on getting our President .
Stay the course, if you will.
комиссар (Occupation)
February 11th, 2013
6:52 pm
“I’m calling BULLCRAP on this story. BULLCRAP”
You tell ‘em, Sinkie.
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
6:52 pm
“Can someone PLEASE clarify this for me”
I refer you to Alice in Wonderland and the White Queen
getalife
February 11th, 2013
6:52 pm
“Prove me wrong.”
Nah, you do a pretty good job of doing that.
Brosephus™
February 11th, 2013
6:53 pm
TBG
——————
Paul
Unlike butter, that argument can’t be clarified.
F. Sinkwich
February 11th, 2013
6:53 pm
“An Army veteran who was today awarded the Medal of Honor for his courageous leadership during a daylong firefight in Afghanistan wept as President Obama named his fallen comrades.”
An American hero.
Compare and contrast with the story above….
That Black Guy
February 11th, 2013
6:55 pm
Paul
February 11th, 2013
6:48 pm
Okay, I’m confused. Again.
I’m back to reading the same people saying Pres Obama did not kill Osama bin Laden, it was a SEAL (team).
AND I’m reading Pres Obama kills Americans with drones and Hellfire missiles. It’s not the drone pilot pulling the trigger and killing the people, it’s Pres Obama.
____________________________________________
Sure.
It’s kinda like “Bush spent this and Bush spent that”
BUT when it’s Obama it’s “CONGRESS does the spending…”
And not, neither makes sense.
Jack ®
February 11th, 2013
6:55 pm
Hollywood is making money on the movie that Bookman had time to watch. Maybe the show-business folks ought to give the soldier part of the profits.
F. Sinkwich
February 11th, 2013
6:56 pm
I’ve read autobiographies by SEALS. They don’t whine.
And they don’t wear mom-jeans and throw baseballs like a girl.
getalife
February 11th, 2013
6:58 pm
Um, w had a rubber stamp congress that marched lock step on spending and now the same gop say they are fiscal cons.
Just the facts.
Vast Right Wing Conspiracy (aka "Knuckle-Dragger")
February 11th, 2013
6:58 pm
This story has got to be stunningly odd for you liberals.
Here is a guy performing his duty for country, because of love for his country, that wants nothing in return. He has not claimed “victim” status; does not think somebody owes him something.
How do y’all reconcile that with your worldview, where almost everybody is a “victim” of something? Talk about cognitive dissonance.
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
6:59 pm
“BUT when it’s Obama it’s “CONGRESS does the spending…””
Nope. It’s Congress who approves the allocation, but it’s not SPENT by Congress. Or, in the case of Obama, they DON’T allocate unless they’re forced into it. The President, no matter who he is, can’t spend money that isn’t allocated by Congress
комиссар (Occupation)
February 11th, 2013
7:00 pm
“And they don’t wear mom-jeans and throw baseballs like a girl.”
He looked kind of good in ‘em, didn’t he?
getalife
February 11th, 2013
7:01 pm
vast,
He applied for disability.
josef
February 11th, 2013
7:01 pm
SCOOTTER
A hint, though, it’s all the Jews’ fault…they’re behind every conspiracy, doncha know?
PAUL
Howdy, troublemaker…
Jay
February 11th, 2013
7:03 pm
“Here is a guy performing his duty for country, because of love for his country, that wants nothing in return. He has not claimed “victim” status; does not think somebody owes him something.
yeah, and the rest of you “patriots” have a conniption when asked to do something for the country as simple as pay taxes. Ohhhh, the humanity!
F. Sinkwich
February 11th, 2013
7:04 pm
“The President, no matter who he is, can’t spend money that isn’t allocated by Congress.”
Soooooo, once again nothing, ever, in perpertuity is O’Bozo’s fault. Not the economy, not spending, not taxes, not nothing.
Got it.
That Black Guy
February 11th, 2013
7:04 pm
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
6:59 pm
“BUT when it’s Obama it’s “CONGRESS does the spending…””
Nope. It’s Congress who approves the allocation, but it’s not SPENT by Congress. Or, in the case of Obama, they DON’T allocate unless they’re forced into it. The President, no matter who he is, can’t spend money that isn’t allocated by Congress
_____________________________________
Kinda what I was trying to say. The President can’t spend anything not approved by Congress.
BTW, The pups are doing great. Healthy and happy.
josef
February 11th, 2013
7:06 pm
TBG
“BTW, The pups are doing great. Healthy and happy.”
It’s all that gubmint cheese…
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
7:07 pm
“Soooooo, once again nothing, ever, in perpertuity is O’Bozo’s fault. Not the economy, not spending, not taxes, not nothing”
If you say so. I wouldn’t agree, but you’re entitled to your opinion.
That Black Guy
February 11th, 2013
7:07 pm
F. Sinkwich
February 11th, 2013
7:04 pm
“The President, no matter who he is, can’t spend money that isn’t allocated by Congress.”
Soooooo, once again nothing, ever, in perpertuity is O’Bozo’s fault. Not the economy, – The President does NOT control the economy.
not spending, – Congress approves spending
not taxes, – Congress levies federal taxes.
not nothing. – well, he did choose to wear those mom jeans
That Black Guy
February 11th, 2013
7:08 pm
josef
February 11th, 2013
7:06 pm
TBG
“BTW, The pups are doing great. Healthy and happy.”
It’s all that gubmint cheese…
_______________________
FWIW I miss that cheese. Great in mac and cheese and grilled cheese.
TaxPayer
February 11th, 2013
7:08 pm
Poor Sinkwich. He just can’t comprehend the fact that Republicans lost.
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
7:09 pm
For those that do not seem to understand how difficult it is being in a military situation where you shoot and are shot at, this is a stark reminder.
We must remind ourselves that many speak about keeping the country safe by using the finest military force in the world, yet, the so-called conservatives are constantly barking about we spend too much money in our government. They have said repeatedly that we spend too much on our government without thinking, knowing that it is people like NAVY Seal that are talking about.
The so-called conservatives have even proposed legislation that would lower the pay of the service member, lower the benefits promised them and their families and cut back on jobs for contractors that usually employe this service member and often his spouse.
How duplicitous can people be?
In the middle
February 11th, 2013
7:09 pm
Jay, his service was not wasted, cannot say the same about all of the tax revenues
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
7:10 pm
“BTW, The pups are doing great. Healthy and happy”
I’m so glad to hear that!
That Black Guy
February 11th, 2013
7:10 pm
Time to UATAO.
TBS
February 11th, 2013
7:13 pm
TBG
Didn’t know you had a litter? You back to work already?
j/k- glad they are doing well
F. Sinkwich
February 11th, 2013
7:14 pm
Jay, this story is CRAP. No substantiation. No independent review. Just CRAP.
In the middle
February 11th, 2013
7:15 pm
“The so-called conservatives have even proposed legislation that would lower the pay of the service member, lower the benefits promised them and their families and cut back on jobs for contractors that usually employe this service member and often his spouse.”
Who?
F. Sinkwich
February 11th, 2013
7:18 pm
“The so-called conservatives have even proposed legislation that would lower the pay of the service member…”
Not intended to be a factual statement. **
** KammieSpam. All rights reserved.
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
7:18 pm
@In the Middle
Here is a link for the benefits. Will find one that quotes specifically the House members that proposed the cuts.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/19/us/retiree-benefits-for-the-military-could-face-cuts.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0
josef
February 11th, 2013
7:18 pm
TBG
There’s nothing like it! Best Mac and Cheese in the world…!
I’ve told this story here before, but just in case…
A few years back there was a big flood out in Texas and there were commodity cheese handouts. A buddy of mine’s sister got a’hold of some and UPS’d some of it to him. He brought me some and told me he was on his way to the Piedmont Driving Club to share in the largesse with some of his friends there…
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
7:21 pm
@In the Middle
Do you recall what will happen when the so-called conservatives in Congress allow the sequestration to happen?
http://www.armedforcesjournal.com/2012/05/10122477/
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
February 11th, 2013
7:21 pm
99.9% of Americans kept by better men than themselves ……….. and most are too stupid, gullible, uniformed, politically screwed up or even jealous to appreciate it.
Just my feelings.
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
7:23 pm
@Sinkwich
You may try reading something that doesn’t have too many big words; you may be surprised at what you will find to be true as opposed to listening to rumors and innuendo.
indigo
February 11th, 2013
7:23 pm
Thogwummpy – 6:20 “worthless social workers”
Are those the same “worthless” people who rescue children from abusive homes?
F. Sinkwich
February 11th, 2013
7:25 pm
“Will find one that quotes specifically the House members that proposed the cuts.”
Bwaahahahahahahaha
houndmother
February 11th, 2013
7:25 pm
Amazing. There aren’t enough words to say “thanks” for everything he and his family sacrificed. He deserves a nice, quiet life after all he’s given.
josef
February 11th, 2013
7:26 pm
indigo
He wouldn’t last a day as a social worker…
YouLibs
February 11th, 2013
7:26 pm
Boy, that itchy finger guy is a real piece of work, huh?
I wonder what name he was using when he was guaranteeing that Obama would go down in a landslide.
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
7:26 pm
@Sinkwich
Often it is best for one to keep their mouth shut and be thought of as an idiot than to open their mouth and remove all doubt!!!!
Did you read the link? It does not have too many big words.
indigo
February 11th, 2013
7:27 pm
Scout – “99.9% of Americans kept by better men than themselves”
Who are the other .1%?
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
7:28 pm
@Sinkwich
It does not take that long to read those short pieces.
Sinkwich, where you at?????????????
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
7:29 pm
Boy Senior Digits is going to be upset when he figures out he is being “kept” by women, gay men and gay women too.
josef
February 11th, 2013
7:30 pm
JACKIE
Why would Sink read those,,,he doesn’t even read his own meanderings…if he did, somebody might think he had taken some liberal arts courses…
josef
February 11th, 2013
7:32 pm
GOOD FIGHT
Well, we do know about a certain pink flamingo in a camouflage tutu tattoo!
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
7:32 pm
@Sinkwich
Did you withdraw from the battlefield, with your bloomers trailing behind you, or, is that a white flag?
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
February 11th, 2013
7:33 pm
Who are the other .1%?
Sheep, wolves and sheepdogs.
The sheepdogs !
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
February 11th, 2013
7:33 pm
Bumper Sticker:
“Fare well vs. Welfare”
indigo
February 11th, 2013
7:34 pm
joseph – 7:26
True. And, in honesty, I probably wouldn’t either.
indigo
February 11th, 2013
7:36 pm
Scout – 7:33 “Sheep, wolves and sheepdogs.
OoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooK.
(I think)
josef
February 11th, 2013
7:38 pm
indigo
And neither would I…those people have my undying respect…
Recon 0311 2533
February 11th, 2013
7:40 pm
” Once again, you cowardly run away instead of proving your claim. You’re dismissed as a child, again.”
Oh I’m very much here jackass. If you have military credentials put them up. I’ve got them or maybe you’re the coward.
josef
February 11th, 2013
7:42 pm
And here comes the Wa-do Warrior Del with his nightly butch attack! Looks like happy hour at Closet Capers wasn’t very…
JamVet
February 11th, 2013
7:43 pm
Bush/Cheney were really not friends at all to the men and women on active duty. Everybody remembers how they cut corners to keep from armoring those vehicles to protect Americans from IEDs. Also they wouldn’t even fund the resources to get everyone the right type of helmets and bullet proof vests in combat zones.
In addition the Bush Administration cut $1.5 billion for military family housing, despite Department of Defense statistics showing that in 83,000 barracks and 128,860 family housing units across the country were below standard. (”Nothing But Lip Service,” Army Times, June 30, 2003)
The Bush Administration’s 2004 budget underfunded veterans’ health care by nearly $2 billion. (”Vets Health Low on Bush’s Priority List,” The Hill, September 17, 2003; “Support for Troops Questioned,” Washington Post, June 17, 2003; U.S. Department of Veterans’ Affairs, September 2002)
Bush Administration budget cuts force more than 200,000 veterans to wait for health care. Over 200,000 United States veterans have to wait more than six months for a medical visit because of health care shortages. (”VA Health Care Funding Alert,” Veterans of Foreign Wars of the United States Press Release, January 31, 2003)
Bush Administration proposal would end health care benefits for 173,000 veterans. More than 173,000 veterans across the country would be cut off from health care because of Bush Administration proposed budget cuts and its plan requiring enrollment fees and higher out-of-pocket costs. (”Support for Troops Questioned,” Washington Post, June 17, 2003)
Bush Administration cuts $172 million allotted for educating the children of military personnel. The Bush Administration’s 2004 budget cut $172 million of impact aid funding. Impact aid funding assists school districts by making up for lost local tax revenue from tax-exempt property, such as military bases. These education cuts will especially affect school-age children of troops serving in Iraq who reside on military bases. (”Support for Troops Questioned,” Washington Post, June 17, 2003)
Bush Administration tax cut denies military families increase in child tax credit. The families of 262,000 children of military personnel do not receive the child tax credit increase because the plan fails to cover taxpaying families with incomes between $10,500 and $26,625. According to The Washington Post, the House version of the Bush Administration plan “wouldn’t help many of those serving in Iraq.” One solider who will not benefit is Army Specialist Shoshana Johnson, the soldier and single mother who was wounded twice in the same convoy as Jessica Lynch. (”Ex-POW’s Family Accuses Army of Double Standard on Benefit,” Washington Post, October 24, 2003; “The New Senate Child Credit Legislation – What It Does and Does Not Do,” Center on Budget and Policy Priorities, June 25, 2003; “Whose Child Is Left Behind,” Children’s Defense Fund, July 23, 2003
Bush Administration opposed plan to give National Guard and Reserve Members access to health insurance. Despite the war efforts of America’s National Guard and Reserve Members, the Bush Administration announced in October 2003 its formal opposition to give the 1.2 million Guard and Reserve members the right to buy health care coverage through the Pentagon’s health plan. One out of every five Guard members lacks health insurance. (”Bush Opposes Health Plan for National Guard,” Gannett News Service, October 23, 2003)
The list is even longer but you get the idea.
Support the troops.
Recon 0311 2533
February 11th, 2013
7:46 pm
Boy Senior Digits is going to be upset when he figures out he is being “kept” by women, gay men and gay women too.
More incoherence from a pathetic little man with no history of accomplishment because if he did have accomplishment in his life he would only post his opinions rather than attack in a childish fashion the opinions of others. Carry on pathetic little man.
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
7:47 pm
@JamVet
SALUTE!!!
It looks like our non-reading, non-believers have gone home to put some ice on that burn and you show up with more fire!
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
7:48 pm
Jackie:
You may want to do a little research. Obama has proposed cutting military benefits…
http://www.newsmax.com/US/obama-cuts-military-benefits/2012/02/27/id/430757
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
7:49 pm
Oh no… the child is back. Cant prove his claims so he runs a weak attack. Clucking away.
josef
February 11th, 2013
7:49 pm
GOOD FIGHT
Don’t you just quivver when Wa-do Warrior goes to talking rough…?
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
February 11th, 2013
7:52 pm
indigo:
For you ……………
http://www.gleamingedge.com/mirrors/onsheepwolvesandsheepdogs.html
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
7:52 pm
JamVet:
obama is the one who cut veterans benefits… You may want to fact check yourself there jammy…
http://www.newsmax.com/US/obama-cuts-military-benefits/2012/02/27/id/430757
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
February 11th, 2013
7:53 pm
“Halfway around the world tonight
In a strange and foreign land
A soldier unpacks memories
That he saved from Vietnam
Back home they didn’t know too much
There was just no way to tell
I guess you had to be there
For to know that war was hell
And there wasn’t any big parades
For those that made it back
They flew them in at midnight
And unloaded all the sacks
And the living were left walking down
A long and lonely road
Because nobody seemed to care back then
When a soldier made it home”
Arlo Guthrie – “When a Soldier Makes it Home”
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
7:53 pm
@Itchy
Saw that proposal and the blow-back offered by the DoD and Pentagon.
It has not come up again from the Administration.
And, like any other vet, did not and will not support any move by the President that reduces those benefits.
Recon 0311 2533
February 11th, 2013
7:54 pm
josef,
I’ve turned 70 years old and in my time I’ve found everyone has an issue of one form or another but I thank the good Lord mine aren’t yours. Seek help you may even find at your age there’s is indeed help for you. I’ll pray that you find it if there is.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
7:54 pm
Veterans benefits under Bush in the first 3 years continue to climb but dems somehow think its a cut…
http://www.factcheck.org/print_funding_for_veterans_up_27_but_democrats.html
TaxPayer
February 11th, 2013
7:57 pm
I see twitchy finger continues to live the lie.
josef
February 11th, 2013
7:57 pm
Wa-Do Del
Just for the record and before the Imam puts it in probably deserved moderation, after what you said about MY military boy, you can ESAD and I’ll dance on your grave. Respect for the troops? You’re just a big, blowhard hypocrite…
And, no, I won’t waste my time talking to my G-d asking for your redemption…it’s not worth it…
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
7:58 pm
josef, the chest thumpin reminds me of a King Kong movie….. but he’s Magilia gorilla.
I am sure he’s hoping you’re a bowl of jelly for all his advances. 
The flirting reminds me of Cheers. 
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
7:58 pm
@Itchy
I think you may want to read the entire piece before you make your claim about what President Bush did for the vets.
And, your post stated, in the first 3 years of his Administration, benefits rose at a slower pace than most had wanted. Now, look at his last 5 year performance.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
7:59 pm
Jackie:
But Bush never reduced benefits as you stated…
http://www.usgovernmentspending.com/spending_chart_2002_2012USb_13s1li111mcn_30t
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:00 pm
Jackie:
You look at it. Its continuing to rise…..
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
February 11th, 2013
8:00 pm
Itchy Finger:
I guess you’ve figured out by now if they can’t debate you they will just call you a liar.
It’s just their way.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:01 pm
When Bush left office his military spending was $800 trillion and now its almost $900 trillion… There’s waste there somewhere folks….
Recon 0311 2533
February 11th, 2013
8:02 pm
josef,
I had no idea that keep up the fight was your military, well “boy”.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:03 pm
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801:
That’s all they got… Most libs just aren’t very knowledgeable especially about foreign policy.
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
8:04 pm
@Itchy
I have never stated that Bush reduced benefits.
If you read your post, it says clearly that Bush reduced vets benefits, increased the copay for families medical insurance and vets are required to pay for a portion of their medication.
Check out your post.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:04 pm
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801:
What amazes me is that I presented a gubmint chart showing Bush increased military spending every single year he was in office but they still say he cut benefits. Go figure….
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
8:06 pm
@Scout
Don’t mind the debate with you or Itchy.
Have no reason to call him or you a liar because what he presented is from sources other than hearsay.
So, if it is a debate you want, bring it.
josef
February 11th, 2013
8:06 pm
Wad-Warrior
You know very well what I’m talking about even if you were sloppy sloshed when you said it. If you had any honor about you at all you would never have said that. But, then, it don’t take a great genius to figure out why you would have done that. You have no honor. You’re just a silly, old, tired, worn-out b*tch queen trying to pretend you’re something else…
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:07 pm
Jackie:
obama and the dems increased co-pays….
http://www.armytimes.com/news/2011/09/military-tricare-benefits-cuts-obama-091911w/
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
February 11th, 2013
8:07 pm
“The basic difference between an ordinary man and a warrior is
that a warrior takes everything as a challenge, while an ordinary
man takes everything as a blessing or as a curse.”
Matus
Republicans Push Back as Rove Aims to Appoint Himself Kingmaker
February 11th, 2013
8:08 pm
Since 2010 the Republican Party has lost five Senate races that it believes it should have won.
In his latest attempt to save the party from itself, Republican strategist and pundit Karl Rove last week announced the formation of the Conservative Victory Project, a super PAC intended to fuel and direct the nomination of electable Republican Senate candidates. Not surprisingly, Rove has met with denunciation by the Tea Party, and this intraparty conflict stems from what the Republican Party is and who Rove is not. One thing is certain: he is not Chuck Schumer, and that is a problem for both Rove and his party.
Rove, who helped guide George W. Bush to capture the Texas governorship and then the White House, continues to play an outsized role within the party, even as his former boss has left the stage. The past year, Rove’s super PAC, American Crossroads, raised and spent millions of dollars but came up short on Election Day at the same time that Rove was making the Republicans’ case as a Wall Street Journal columnist and a Fox News pundit. It is a complicated fusion of roles (perhaps made necessary by his lack of official standing within the GOP) that is further complicated by the challenge of working on behalf of a party that channels the values of white Americans at prayer in an ever more secular and diverse nation.
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2013/02/10/republicans-push-back-as-rove-aims-to-appoint-himself-kingmaker.html
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:08 pm
obama destroyed military healthcare the same as he’s doing for all of us…
TaxPayer
February 11th, 2013
8:08 pm
Now twitchy finger is living the lie alongside scout in one of scout’s potholes.
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
8:08 pm
@Itchy
You presented the chart and you are only reading the numbers from the chart that clearly shows an increase.
You still do not seem to acknowledge the fact that after his first 3 years in office, he raised copay for families and reduced the benefits the vets had, increasing the cash outlay of vets.
You may want to check that out.
F. Sinkwich
February 11th, 2013
8:09 pm
Jammie did the the ol’ C&P two-step, just like Granny does lots.
Thought he was above that…
Bummer.
JamVet
February 11th, 2013
8:09 pm
Jackie, right back at ya!
Apparently those dollar amounts and easily confirmed facts do not matter to the Bush faithful.
Which is OK by me.
As long as they keep getting beaten like a red headed step child like they did in the last election, and three out of the last four, it is better than OK by me!
As Mr. Rundgren noted,
Some men’s world is only hate and money
Afraid of everything and they laugh at nothing
And they only live to criticize
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HavIYhoAiUE
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:10 pm
I guess he’s being fair….
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
8:12 pm
@Itchy
Read this from a prominent veteran organization.
It doesn’t have all the “gubmint” charts as your post does, but it clearly spells out what the VFW national organization says about their research.
http://thinkprogress.org/security/2007/03/06/10845/morin-bush-va/
Soothsayer
February 11th, 2013
8:12 pm
Things is gettin’ ugly ’round here!
Recon 0311 2533
February 11th, 2013
8:12 pm
josef,
Maybe your tribal master can help you to calm down. I sincerely hope so as you need to reflect on life beyond yourself.
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
8:12 pm
@Sinkwich
You made it back!
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:13 pm
Jackie:
I had co-pays raised on me and my family… He certainly didn’t raise as much as obama and the dems are proposing… I know many people in the military right now. Every single on would tell you that their benefits were much better under Bush than they are under obama.. obama simply has no use for the military.. He’s like most libs who think its unnecessary….
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
February 11th, 2013
8:13 pm
Jackie:
Oh I will when the time and subject matter meets my fancy !
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
8:13 pm
@Itchy
I can only pass along the information that is reported by more than one source. If you want to call that unfair, oh well!
F. Sinkwich
February 11th, 2013
8:14 pm
Bush!!!!
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:14 pm
Jackie:
Sorry Jackie but there’s no way I would waste my time reading tripe from think progress. A far-left bunch of fruits….
kayaker 71
February 11th, 2013
8:14 pm
Seems a bit melodramatic to me. If the guy wanted a secure future, he could have signed on for another 4 years, This OBL Op is no different from many other OPs that these guys train for and accomplish on a regular basis. That’s why they are SEALS. Bookman’s concern is most touching.
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
8:15 pm
@Itchy
You are talking about proposals of the Obama Administration while I am speaking about facts that occurred during the Bush Administration. Big difference!
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:16 pm
This is why military personnel always vote Republican…. Dems would rather protect their union fed workers than our soldiers…
http://www.humanevents.com/2012/02/28/obama-cuts-military-health-care-benefits-leaves-unionized-civilians-untouched/
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
8:16 pm
@Recon
At your pleasure.
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
8:17 pm
@Itchy
But, you read information from other sources. Wouldn’t you want to validate what you read as being true by using more than one source?
F. Sinkwich
February 11th, 2013
8:17 pm
“@Sinkwich
You made it back!”
My fans call.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:18 pm
Jackie:
they are facts.. obama is in charge and he has the purse… Its already happened and will even worse when obama’s sequestration takes place.
josef
February 11th, 2013
8:18 pm
Wa-do Warrior
Why would I REFLECT on my life BEFORE me? When I do reflect, that is look back, I’m satisfied with what I see…I’ve pretty much had it all of everything I could have ever wanted or dreamed of. And for that, I am grateful to the Cr-ator…we get along pretty well…
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
8:19 pm
It seems that other organizations have different information concerning who votes for whom.
https://www.ladiesauxvfw.org/news/auxiliary/323-military-times-the-critical-military-vote.html
Recon 0311 2533
February 11th, 2013
8:20 pm
K-71,
Thanks to the White House who leaked the identity of this special ops unit or specifically SEAL Team Six they should all make tons of money writing books and giving interviews. God Bless them and shame on the Obama administration.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:20 pm
obama has a military budget. He can direct money to be spent in his budget however he wants.
F. Sinkwich
February 11th, 2013
8:21 pm
I have called CRAP BS on this story. SEALs don’t whine. Never ever.
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
8:21 pm
“obama is in charge”
Somebody doesn’t understand how our political system works
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
8:21 pm
@Itchy
You seem to be missing the point as to how our government is actually structured.
The President can only sign/veto legislation that comes from the House who controls the purse strings.
President Obama has nothing to do with the sequestration, as you well know.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:21 pm
Jackie:
I think any informed person would agree the military overwhelmingly votes Republican..
Recon 0311 2533
February 11th, 2013
8:22 pm
Jackie, my SALUTE…enjoy the evening.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:22 pm
Doggone/GA:
Please explain….
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
8:24 pm
“obama has a military budget. He can direct money to be spent in his budget however he wants”
Somebody doesn’t understand how our political system works
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:25 pm
Jackie:
The house has passed a budget the last 2 years. The Senate has not. obama has presented a budget even his own party won’t vote for so he is still operating on the last budget passed by a dem congress… Of course Repubs continue to go along with raising the debt ceiling which is unfortunate. So actually obama controls the purse strings….
Jerome Horwitz
February 11th, 2013
8:26 pm
Well Itchy – The colonel referenced in your link still pays far less for his health insurance tham the unionized civilian worker. I’d really like my premiums to be less than 200 per month,
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:26 pm
Doggone/GA:
i think perhaps MessNBC don’t explain it to you….
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:27 pm
Jerome Horwitz:
thanks to obamacare we’ll all be paying more… Much much more…
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:28 pm
Doggone/GA
“obama is in charge”
Somebody doesn’t understand how our political system works
So obama is not in charge. Who is?
F. Sinkwich
February 11th, 2013
8:28 pm
“President Obama has nothing to do with the sequestration, as you well know.”
Except is was his proposal, which was passed…
Jackie = Ignorant, but I mean that in a good way.
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
8:29 pm
@Itchy
Please explain your logic.
How does the President control the purse strings when he can not vote on or allocate money?
The Constitution strictly forbids it.
As for your reading material and your saying that “anyone informed person” knows the military votes Republican is highly suspect. Please show a link indicating what you say is true.
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
8:30 pm
@Recon
SALUTE!!!
JamVet
February 11th, 2013
8:31 pm
Somebody doesn’t understand how our political system works.
That is putting it mildly.
Itchy, so why did you change your name after the election?
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
8:31 pm
“Please explain….”
Sorry, I don’t have any idea how to explain why you don’t understand how our political system works. Did you fail Social Studies, maybe?
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
8:32 pm
@Sinkwich
You should pull your shoe strings out of your teeth because it shows that have something stuck that impairs your speech and probably your thought process.
How was sequestration his proposal? When does the Congress follow the dictates of the President on Legislative matters?
Did you take your little blue pills today?
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
8:34 pm
“The Senate has not. obama has presented a budget even his own party won’t vote for so he is still operating on the last budget passed by a dem congress”
Here’s your chance to investigate and learn just how important a “budget” really is.
Gimme Gimme Gimme
February 11th, 2013
8:34 pm
What’s the problem? According to our Liberal friends here the economy is doing just great so he should have no problem finding a job.
TBS
February 11th, 2013
8:35 pm
Jam
He and several others just so happen to come across the blog after the election
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
8:36 pm
“think perhaps MessNBC don’t explain it to you”
and I have no idea what you are talking about
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
8:37 pm
“So obama is not in charge. Who is?”
Thank you for confirming my suspicion.
F. Sinkwich
February 11th, 2013
8:37 pm
“Did you take your little blue pills today?”
Well, truth be known, Long Dong Silver wept at his inadequacy when he saw mine.
But thanks for asking.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:38 pm
Jackie:
The logic is simple. He has money for a military budget. obama and his cabinet can direct that money to go wherever he see’s fit.. You really don’t know how Washington works do you???? Money is allocated to each department. that department directs the spending. And who’s in charge of those departments. Its certainly no Congress…..
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
8:39 pm
“According to our Liberal friends here the economy is doing just great”
got proof?
This one is easy....
February 11th, 2013
8:39 pm
Take a public speaking course and get on the lecture circuit. If he has the stones to pull off a mission like the raid on Bin Laden then being able to give a speech to a large audience should be a piece of cake. I would get in line early at whatever event he was speaking at to get a front row seat to hear him tell his story in person.
Ol' Timer
February 11th, 2013
8:39 pm
I think Lindsey Graham should stand in the corner and hold his breath until there’s a full disclosure of why George Bush, Dick Cheney and Rumsfeldt let bin Laden get away at Tora Bora. John McCain and Liebermann should stand by in support of Graham’s efforts. The Three Stooges ride again!
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
8:39 pm
@Itchy
Where does President Obama get this “magic pile of money?”
комиссар (Occupation)
February 11th, 2013
8:40 pm
Itchy finger: “thanks to obamacare we’ll all be paying more… Much much more…”
Because paying taxes is. The. Most. Important. Thing. In. The. World.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:40 pm
Does the buck not stop with the President?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/barackobama/9777275/Barack-Obama-signs-sweeping-US-defence-spending-bill.html
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
8:41 pm
“He has money for a military budget. obama and his cabinet can direct that money to go wherever he see’s fit”
Got proof?
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
8:41 pm
@Sinkwich
You are hilarious!
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:41 pm
Jackie
Where does President Obama get this “magic pile of money?”
he simply keeps printing it… LOL….
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:42 pm
Doggone/GA:
Google is your friend sport…
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:44 pm
http://www.stripes.com/news/special-reports/election-2012/what-obama-s-re-election-means-for-the-military-veterans-1.196225
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
8:44 pm
Google is your friend sport…
Oh the irony from the poster who can’t research waterboarding when shown US cases.
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
8:45 pm
@Itchy
Stop reading bumper stickers and try to get a good handle on how our democratic republic works.
Our government is commonly referred to as a three-legged stool; the Legislative (House and Senate); the Administrative (President); the Judicial(Supreme Court).
The Legislative writes laws and allocates money; the President can veto that legislation or be overridden by the Legislative branch; the Supreme Court reviews laws passed and determines if they meet Constitutional muster.
In a nutshell, that is all there is to our government.
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
8:46 pm
“Oh the irony from the poster who can’t research waterboarding when shown US cases”
And who doesn’t appear to know even the most basic facts of our political system!
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
8:46 pm
@Itchy
You are working on your comedic routine, right?
TaxPayer
February 11th, 2013
8:46 pm
Poor Republicans. Seriously. They’re poor. Except for the 1 percent that the remainder of them serve. So sad.
independent thinker
February 11th, 2013
8:46 pm
Just remeber which party dissed veterans in their convention and campaign by letting a man born into a family of draft dodgers run as the presidential candidate. Just look at he difference a week later at the Democratic convention. To the shooter- Thanks and the President will never consider you part of any group that is mooching off the rest of us.
Gimme Gimme Gimme
February 11th, 2013
8:46 pm
Doggone – “got proof?”
Yes – try the archives to your right.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:47 pm
Keep Up the Good Fight!:
Oh the irony when no proof has been given that either legislatively or through the courts has water boarding been deemed torture….
TaxPayer
February 11th, 2013
8:47 pm
You are working on your comedic routine, right?
If so he shouldn’t quit his day job.
Keep Up the Good Fight!
February 11th, 2013
8:50 pm
Oh the irony when given the proof and a poster choses intentional ignorance.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:50 pm
Jackie:
Just throwing facts out.. I guess in your obama supporting mind you can’t handle them….. I’ve provided real links to legitimate websites. You’ve provided nothing but talk….
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:51 pm
Jackie:
it’s bedtime for me… Until you can inform yourself and understand the failures of the man we now have in the White House arguing with you is like arguing with a stop sign…. Its repetitious and irrelevant…..
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
8:52 pm
@Keep
You are working too hard!
moonbat betty
February 11th, 2013
8:53 pm
I haven’t read the magazine write up yet, but this article seems vague and written by Oprah.
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
8:54 pm
@Itchy
The professionals says that sleep deprivation tends to confuse us. I am glad that you are going to get LOTS of sleep!!!!!
Read a book on government; it will help you to sleep soundly.
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
8:54 pm
“Just throwing facts out”
Hate to break it to you, but just because you say it…doesn’t mean it’s actually a FACT. The Humpty Dumpty philosophy doesn’t work so well in the real world.
Itchy Finger
February 11th, 2013
8:54 pm
Jackie:
Stop reading bumper stickers and try to get a good handle on how our democratic republic works.
Our government is commonly referred to as a three-legged stool; the Legislative (House and Senate); the Administrative (President); the Judicial(Supreme Court).
The Legislative writes laws and allocates money; the President can veto that legislation or be overridden by the Legislative branch; the Supreme Court reviews laws passed and determines if they meet Constitutional muster.
In a nutshell, that is all there is to our government.
But one more thing. You fail to understand that the last two years its hasn’t worked like that.. Again. Inform yourself before trying to tackle a debate on an issue such as this. This President has racked up enormous debt that our children and Grandchildren will have to repay… It’s sad.. but at least we have a Republican house trying to stop him from running us completely into the ground…..
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
8:56 pm
@Itchy
The President has not racked up a penny in debt; he does not have the authority.
Secondly, if the Congress did not allocate money to help feed the economy, you would have to go to be so early and get sleep for your work tomorrow because you would have no job.
Doggone/GA
February 11th, 2013
8:57 pm
“This President has racked up enormous debt that our children and Grandchildren will have to repay”
got proof?
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
February 11th, 2013
8:59 pm
The Legislative writes laws and allocates money…
Followed by:
This President has racked up enormous debt…
Oh, the irony.
moonbat betty
February 11th, 2013
8:59 pm
I say give them a good job and the security that is required.
Shouldn’t even be an issue.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBcMKwbMEcQ
TaxPayer
February 11th, 2013
9:01 pm
Jindal definitely had twitchy finger in mind when he said that the GOP should stop being the stupid party.
JamVet
February 11th, 2013
9:06 pm
betty, was reading about the new TR album coming out in April and someone linked this band, which I’d never heard before.
Like the Ting Tings, they are an English boy/girl duet, but with a much more sophisticated sound.
Have you ever heard them?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r3Cg1wxgX6M
Jackie
February 11th, 2013
9:06 pm
Good night all.
I have to do studying for my Corporate Taxes Class.
dbm
February 11th, 2013
9:09 pm
DebbieDoRight – A Do Right Woman
February 11th, 2013
5:03 pm
In a free market, government protects individual rights so that force does not determine outcomes. In the prostitution industry in its current form, government protection is absent because prostitution is forced outside the law. This leaves pimps able to use force on the prostitutes, the opposite of a free market. That market is not free.
To put it another way, the prostitutes are not free. In fact, they are enslaved. You acknowledged as much when you said the pimps own the prostitutes. Slavery is incompatible with a free market.
moonbat betty
February 11th, 2013
9:18 pm
No, have not, Jam.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iT8RnVm1k_8
stands for decibels
February 11th, 2013
9:19 pm
I read the Esquire piece (all 26 pages). Recommend everyone who hasn’t, do so as well.
moonbat betty
February 11th, 2013
9:21 pm
This thread is F’d up.
Itchy, can you please change your name?
stands for decibels
February 11th, 2013
9:22 pm
…and I can confirm what Jay said about the article–The Shooter doesn’t say anything about whether he was interested in seeking some other kind of assignment within the service in order to qualify for a pension and lifetime medical benefits. It was obvious, though, that he was done with carrying a gun on the job, and couldn’t bear to be away from home 300+ days/year any more.
It would be interesting to know what kind of work would be available within the service for such a man.
moonbat betty
February 11th, 2013
9:22 pm
stands,
why do you think Esquire got the interview?
not a set up, just curious…
stands for decibels
February 11th, 2013
9:25 pm
mb, not Esquire so much, but this writer, got it the old fashioned way–hard work, lots of time getting to know the subject and establishing trust with him.
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
February 11th, 2013
9:26 pm
Itchy, can you please change your name?
I recommend the name, Vagisil
Brosephus™
February 11th, 2013
9:27 pm
dB
I burned through the pages that Jay linked. Didn’t know there was more.
Old timer
February 11th, 2013
9:30 pm
Just Damn
moonbat betty
February 11th, 2013
9:32 pm
I don’t know…
Itchy finger just makes me want to hit it with a hammer.
Brosephus™
February 11th, 2013
9:44 pm
betty
Just tune that crap out. It’s much easier and won’t lead to possible assault charges.
moonbat betty
February 11th, 2013
9:44 pm
Kam, you are a slob.
appleseed
February 11th, 2013
9:46 pm
Lamisil unless he has been soaking that finger in cider.
Losers Like You
February 11th, 2013
9:46 pm
Idgits you are; idgits you’ll be; today, tomorrow, and forever you’ll be.
stands for decibels
February 11th, 2013
9:47 pm
Bros, I may have mislead–the “26 pages” I referred to were a printout I had (I don’t generally do that, but I knew I’d be spending a bit of time in a place without ‘net access). The 7 online pages you read were the entire article.
moonbat betty
February 11th, 2013
9:47 pm
Bro,
Congrats on your beautiful baby thats coming!
You are a blessed man.
roswelldickie
February 11th, 2013
9:49 pm
a few comment for jay and others;
1. its a tough call to put folks in harms way. but, this is an all volunteer force and the SEALs are volunteer elite among the volunteers.
2. too many folks on this board have zippo direct military experience. if you did, or if you spent time with spec ops folks you would know that these men operate on a different plane relative to patriotism. their sense of duty, honor and country is unassailable. its just that simple.
3. our government has for years done a miserable job of getting folks like this acclimated back to civilian life. funding these programs and the VA is the last we should be doing but for some reason we dont.
May God bless them all and forever. and if this guy needs a job tell him to come see me.
Brosephus™
February 11th, 2013
9:55 pm
dB
Ok. I read it completely before I posted my first comment. After contact with people from that community (I don’t ask specific job info), I found the article quite interesting to say the least. I’ve learned what questions to avoid when talking to them.
—————–
betty
Thanks. I feel better than the wealthiest man in the world.
Z
February 11th, 2013
10:35 pm
Isn’t this the guy that wrote a book on killing Osama Ben Laden. Maybe he thought he would make plenty of money off the book he wrote and could afford to retire. He took a chance by coming out with his real name.
moonbat betty
February 11th, 2013
11:21 pm
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hLQl3WQQoQ0
nite all
Zoro
February 11th, 2013
11:24 pm
This guy gets out the service and writes a book he knows he was not authorized to do. He put himself and his team in jeopardy. That was a top secret mission. He could have been tried and punished for braking his secrecy. Now he is crying Mama, and wants a silver spoon in his mouth account ‘he thinks’, he single handily took out a piece of crap. He was only a PART of the team. Nothing more. He was boy in mens clothing and needs to grow up.
Jm
February 11th, 2013
11:50 pm
Blog blog bloggy
Morality?
February 12th, 2013
12:36 am
Hollywood makes up HISTORY all the time. Obama being part of the dreaded 1% should privately and quietly contribute to this families future as he has benefited politically and financially from The Seal’s actions.
Esquire Navy SEAL Article Wrongly Claims Health Care Was Denied: Stars And … – Huffington Post | Medical Laser Training Schools | Enroll Today
February 12th, 2013
1:09 am
[...] Betrayed by US Government, Steps into the Limelight …TIMEThe Guardian -MSNBC -Atlanta Journal Constitution (blog)all 157 news articles » Share and [...]
Z
February 12th, 2013
1:35 am
oooops correction from above..wrong guy. Another guy who was there wrote a book about that night.
Oscar
February 12th, 2013
1:54 am
Some of the facts in the book don’t match the facts stated in the Esquire story. Fog of war, I suppose.
fred ™
February 12th, 2013
5:43 am
USinUK: Are you lurking? If so, check out what’s for breakfast:
http://www.poorgirleatswell.com/2010/08/recipe-fresh-blueberry-crepes-birthday.html
Hey Libs, how is your paychecks looking now
February 12th, 2013
6:36 am
This is SO funny!
Obama in his address tonight will discuss ideas that he repackaged from his first term! How stupid! He wants to increase more taxes while 15 million plus are out if work! How is that working, Mr Job creator? He has to travel to Asheville, NC to find a company that has added manufacturing jobs! I know of three of my buddies that have companies employing 53 people each. Guess what, they are laying 4 each to get under 50 so not to be forced in carrying government driven insurance! Does Washington have a clue? Repubs and Dems aka Progressives both take the responsibility of incompetence!
Fred ™
February 12th, 2013
7:00 am
Hey libs is a moron and his buddies are traitors bent on killing America. They want to get richer while screwing their employees, it’s the Republican way.
Corbin Sharpe. I think, therefore I am...I think.
February 12th, 2013
7:04 am
Fred,
I might have said it a little gentler, but I applaud the sentiment…
Corbin Sharpe. I think, therefore I am...I think.
February 12th, 2013
7:05 am
…and BTW, Happy Tuesday to all y’all!
TaxPayer
February 12th, 2013
7:16 am
The face of the GOP.
Seems apropos to me. I mean, he’s definitely got the look of stupid mastered now all we need is to hear him confirm it. Again.
stands for decibels
February 12th, 2013
7:19 am
mornin’.
He could have been tried and punished for braking his secrecy. Now he is crying Mama
[...]
oooops correction from above..wrong guy. Another guy who was there wrote a book about that night.
Stuff like that give me some hope for humanity. It’s nice to see someone enlightening himself and–above and beyond that–acknowledge an error.
[polite golf clap]
Also:
Some of the facts in the book don’t match the facts stated in the Esquire story. Fog of war, I suppose.
Or, someone’s making stuff up. Or, someone allowed a ghostwriter to make stuff up and signed off on it, which is essentially the same thing.
Or, maybe “fog of war” really does describe it–when something as complex and fast-paced as the OBL mission is executed, the participants are describing honest, sincere recollections–which happen to contradict one another.
Granny Godzilla
February 12th, 2013
7:28 am
Taxpayer
Wrong end altogether.
stands for decibels
February 12th, 2013
7:30 am
The face of the GOP.
TP, I’m genuinely of two minds, straddling that proverbial fence, about how to handle this.
One one hand it is totally understand that anyone even mildly left of center is crowing about this self-identifying flaming a-hole being the invited guest of a Congressman. Why not, right? We can take lots of cheap shots at the mindset that allows such a thing to happen; we can (as Rachel Maddow did last night) re-play video of Ted Nugent saying revolting things about BHO that are about 1000x more offensive than anything the Dixie Chicks ever said about GWB.
On the other hand, this flaming hole-o’-ass is undoubtedly enriching himself in a manner he’s not seen since people actually purchased his recordings.and listened to his music in large quantities. He’s probably got gigs lined up into 2014 thanks to all the publicity. So, maybe we’re part of the problem, at this point, and it’d help to remind ourselves that the opposite of love is not hate, but indifference…
Rowy REptile
February 12th, 2013
7:30 am
What do you expect from a muslim-loving socialist?? Obama was told by Panetta that CIA had tracked bin laden to that house…they had 100% positive I.D. on him there…..as part of the standing SOP for that OP (which was put ino place in 8 months after 911)…Special OPS teams went into alert mode and stood-by to deploy for assault…..obama could not decline the operation knowing full well at the time his polls and re-election were at stake—it could not “get out” that he had bin laden “in the bag” and let him go—Clinton paid that PR price for a similar mistake…..obama had to give the “GO” order….it was an emergecy convened “situation room” that you saw photos of staff “dumbfounded” by watching the SEAL Team “operate.” Obama lost a lot of “clout” and respect with his muslim brothers over that raid….ad now he throws the SEALS to the wind in retribution….what a pathetic piece of WORK that useless suit is for a military leader—utter disgrace…… Sorry SEALS, you served AMERICA well, but “cesar-in-the-white-house” disapproves….What’s new??
stands for decibels
February 12th, 2013
7:31 am
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phil_Bronstein
The author of the amazing Esquire piece has led a rather storied life, himself, by the way.
stands for decibels
February 12th, 2013
7:34 am
what a pathetic piece of WORK that useless suit is for a military leader—utter disgrace…… Sorry SEALS, you served AMERICA well, but “cesar-in-the-white-house” disapproves
I really kind of pity your sort, so blinded by hatred at this point that you can’t see straight, and the sobering thing is, you haven’t yet hit bottom.
You might want to try doing something that actually helps America, rather than just bitching about losing another election, all these weeks/months later.
(which is, if you are honest, really what you’re doing here. I don’t think for a moment that you really think Obama is any more of a “cesar-in-the-white-house” than the last guy we had there.)
Paul
February 12th, 2013
7:42 am
Morning, all –
Rowy REptile
“What do you expect from a muslim-loving socialist?? Obama was told by Panetta that CIA had tracked bin laden to that house…they had 100% positive I.D. on him there….”
The proper order on this blog is: drink heavily, finish hangover, post.
NOT drink heavily, post, drink heavily, post, drink heavily, post.
Fred ™
February 12th, 2013
7:54 am
Rowy REptile
February 12th, 2013
7:30 am
What do you expect from a muslim-loving socialist?? Obama was told by Panetta that CIA had tracked bin laden to that house…they had 100% positive I.D. on him there…..as part of the standing SOP for that OP (which was put ino place in 8 months after 911)…Special OPS teams went into alert mode and stood-by to deploy for assault…..obama could not decline the operation knowing full well at the time his polls and re-election were at stake—it could not “get out” that he had bin laden “in the bag” and let him go—Clinton paid that PR price for a similar mistake…..obama had to give the “GO” order….it was an emergecy convened “situation room” that you saw photos of staff “dumbfounded” by watching the SEAL Team “operate.” Obama lost a lot of “clout” and respect with his muslim brothers over that raid….ad now he throws the SEALS to the wind in retribution….what a pathetic piece of WORK that useless suit is for a military leader—utter disgrace…… Sorry SEALS, you served AMERICA well, but “cesar-in-the-white-house” disapproves….What’s new??
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Wow. The stupid. It burns. You know not even that idiot Bill Maher could make up a “character” this stupid. If he were to say some FOXBOT nutcase said this no one would believe him.
You just can’t beat real life folks…………….
stands for decibels
February 12th, 2013
7:55 am
Off topic, but really good NYT piece on how much of a pain in the ass North Korea is to China right now, and what the new General Secretary might choose to do to relieve the irritation.
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/13/world/asia/north-korea-nuclear-test-poses-challenge-to-chinas-xi-jinping.html?_r=0
Thomas
February 12th, 2013
7:57 am
Relevant, interesting, inspiring, on and on. The vast majority of us are incredibly bored and seek 1% of the relevance.
stands for decibels
February 12th, 2013
7:57 am
Fred, Paul, I don’t want to pile on, but for me, the craziest group of words (I hesitate to call it a “sentence”) was this:
Clinton paid that PR price for a similar mistake
It’s just stunning in its willful ignorance of actual political history, as opposed to that alternative version he’s been provided by his right wing echo chamber.
Fred ™
February 12th, 2013
8:00 am
dB; And yet they will toss out phrases like “you don’t want to debate” after tossing out a turd bomb like that. What’s to debate? There isn’t a factual shred in anything these yahoos post.
Are we supposed to be “debating” the gremlins in their closets or the voices in their heads?
Doggone/GA
February 12th, 2013
8:03 am
“What’s to debate”
You just have to understand what they mean. “Debate” is like “compromise”…you agree with them and that’s “debate”. If you don’t agree, that’s either intolerance or anger.
stands for decibels
February 12th, 2013
8:07 am
DGA, Fred–Actually, I take issue with the whole notion that exchanging online posts in a forum like this constitutes a “debate” beyond the very, very most–dare I say it?–liberal interpretation of the word.
You won’t hear me using that word, ever, in this context, and hence you’ll never hear me crying about someone refusing to “debate” me online.
stands for decibels
February 12th, 2013
8:08 am
Well, we gots Nork SHEETZ.
Fred ™
February 12th, 2013
8:09 am
Later. If someone would be so kind, could you direct Kamchek to the following article when he comes on? I’m sure a new thread will come first so he wont come here.
http://www.ajc.com/ap/ap/crime/soccer-faces-epic-fight-against-match-fixing/nWMP6/
Jay
February 12th, 2013
8:09 am
“The author of the amazing Esquire piece has led a rather storied life, himself, by the way.”
True enough, and even in the Esquire piece somehow managed to make it all about him at times.
Sheets.
Itchy Finger
February 12th, 2013
9:00 am
It’s amazing just how stupid the left is and reading through these posts prove it…..
Joel Edge
February 12th, 2013
9:06 am
http://goo.gl/EzL8o