Why Ga. has so little to show for being so ‘business friendly’
In November, Georgia was ranked 4th in the nation for its pro-business environment by Site Selection magazine, which specializes in corporate relocations. The Georgia Department of Economic Development was understandably quick to seize on that happy news, giving it prominent play on the department’s website.
Such rankings appear to validate a concerted, decade-long effort by Georgia’s leadership to make the state as business-friendly as possible. Our state and local business tax burden, for example, ranks eighth lowest in the country, according to a 2012 analysis by Ernst & Young. And as Site Selection noted approvingly, the 2012 Legislature continued that effort by eliminating the sales tax on energy used in manufacturing, enhancing tax incentives and “strengthening” open records laws by delaying public release of economic development deals.
When the 2013 Georgia Legislature convenes Monday, it will no doubt attempt to continue that crusade. For example, while state legislators are likely to approve using tax money to help finance a new stadium for the Atlanta Falcons, they could balk at renewing a much-needed hospital tax that will help keep tens of thousands of poor Georgians covered by Medicaid.
You see, using tax money to help the Falcons and the NFL, the most profitable sports league on the planet, is “economic development”, while helping poor families get medical coverage is considered welfare.
The larger question, however, is whether the state’s strategy is achieving its goals. And that in turn depends on what you choose to measure. For example, here is how Site Selection has ranked Georgia’s business climate each year from 2002-2012:
2002: 4th
2003: 7th
2004: 4th
2005: 3rd
2006: 4th
2007: 2nd
2008: 10th
2009: 8th
2010: 6th
2011: 2nd
2012: 4th
For more than a decade, in other words, Georgia has never ranked out of the top 10 for business climate, and over that period it has averaged in the top five. That tells us that year after year, for an extended amount of time, our leaders have succeeded in crafting government policy to produce exactly the kind of regulatory and tax environment that business leaders say they need to produce growth and prosperity. So by that measure it has been a great success.
But what do we have to show for it?
— We have an unemployment rate of 8.5 percent, significantly higher than the 7.8 percent national average and the ninth highest rate in the country, tied with Mississippi. And it is not a short-term phenomenon. Our unemployment rate has exceeded the national average for each of the last 64 months.
— In 2001, Georgia had the 17th highest poverty rate in the country. By 2011 it had the nation’s sixth highest poverty rate. We are slipping and slipping fast.
— In 2001, the state ranked 25th in per capita income and was rising rapidly in that critically important category; today, it ranks 39th in per capita income. In fact, after adjusting for inflation, state per capita income has declined by 3.5 percent since 2001.
To make matters worse, while trying to create a diligently “pro-business” environment, state government has also attempted to shrink the social safety net substantially. In a piece headlined “Georgia’s Hunger Games,” Slate reported last month that thanks to aggressive government efforts to deny benefits, fewer than 7 percent of the 300,000 Georgia households in poverty collect benefits through Temporary Assistance to Needy Families, more commonly known as welfare. Nationally, the comparable number is 27 percent.
Is that punitive approach working? Not so you’d notice. We also have the nation’s fifth highest rate of those without health insurance, and the fourth highest differential between rich and poor.
In other words, there is no sign that pursuit of a narrowly defined “business-friendly” climate has resulted in a more people-friendly climate. And isn’t that the real goal?
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1,198 comments Add your comment
USinUK - not very ladylike (and former Girl Scout)
January 9th, 2013
10:44 am
“Damn. Now we’re up to 200 years of “it’s the Dems that done done us in.”
”
remember, Bush has been gone for 4 years, so we can’t blame him for anything.
The Dems have been gone for 10 years, but they can still be blamed.
Doggone/GA
January 9th, 2013
10:45 am
“If so, you need to spend less time here and more time on your homeschooling”
As I said, your reading comprehension fails you.
Thulsa Doom
January 9th, 2013
10:45 am
“Exactly, thank God good Republicans like Lincoln came in and burnt Atlanta to the ground. Where is Lincoln when you need him? We need northerners to march back in and take care of our problems.”
Danny X unintentionally humors Doomy. What we really need is some of them northerners from prospering states like Illinois to come in and show us how to grow the state.
MiltonMan
January 9th, 2013
10:45 am
“Yep! They’re quite well versed on such things as football and Bible verses. Bless their hearts. They just don’t do math or science.”
Ever heard of The Georgia Institute of Technology???
Oscar
January 9th, 2013
10:46 am
/The North Avenue Trade School
TaxPayer
January 9th, 2013
10:47 am
Cons proclaim themselves to be knowledgeable on the topic of climate science. Then they post something on the topic and contradict themselves, every time.
TaxPayer
January 9th, 2013
10:48 am
Ever heard of The Georgia Institute of Technology???
Yep. Except I’ve done more than just hear about it.
USinUK - not very ladylike (and former Girl Scout)
January 9th, 2013
10:48 am
“Ever heard of The Georgia Institute of Technology???”
a perfect illustration of “the two Georgias” – Atlanta and the rest of the state.
Adam
January 9th, 2013
10:49 am
http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/georgia-institute-of-technology-1569/reviews/20648
The Best Things
Friendly students, urban location, D1 sports
The Worst Things
Academics, people constantly complaining about their classes and lack of social life
Yup. All you have to do to “do science” is go to a college with “Technology” in the name!
Stevie Ray
January 9th, 2013
10:49 am
Adam
January 9th, 2013
10:44 am
I appreciate your passion and support of the conclusion you have drawn…..I simply don’t know (other than getting rid of use of fossil fuels is a good thing to aspire to) what the real situation is because I’m skeptical of such a new science that projects such calamity…
I used to think it was total bull but now profess I simply don’t know. In my science, numbers and mathmatical hypothesis seem to work but more time is spent trying to disprove new theory before it becomes part of the nomenclature. Sometimes what is professed to be accurate is later found to be flawed…
Brosephus™
January 9th, 2013
10:50 am
Doom: I doubt GB meant anything racist by just mentioning race.
Did I make such a claim? I simply stated he played the race card. I never said he made a racist statement.
USinUK - not very ladylike (and former Girl Scout)
January 9th, 2013
10:50 am
“Yep. Except I’ve done more than just hear about it.”
me, too … dated a grad from there, once
willie lynch
January 9th, 2013
10:50 am
As I read here I see everyone is the problem except the people who have been running the state for the last decade.
Oscar
January 9th, 2013
10:50 am
Continuing to use coal at out present rate will end civilization as we know it. 90 per cent agreement among scientists onthat. Hard to disagee wth 90 per cent.
Erwin's cat
January 9th, 2013
10:51 am
Yep. Except I’ve done more than just hear about it.
he’s driven past it too
GB
January 9th, 2013
10:51 am
“Do you know that, HISTORICALLY, Black unemployment has been twice the national average for almost as long as they’ve been recording it? That isn’t some new thing brought on by Democrats. That’s been the way things have been as long as we’ve been around. – Brocephus”
NOT TRUE !
During slavery times 100% of Blacks were employed, had housing, clothing and medical attention provided to them by their master.
Adam
January 9th, 2013
10:52 am
GB: NOT TRUE !
During slavery times 100% of Blacks were employed, had housing, clothing and medical attention provided to them by their master.
I am telling you….. malice aforethought here!
Oscar
January 9th, 2013
10:52 am
UK – You seem to have been around, I like that.
moonbat betty
January 9th, 2013
10:53 am
“Why Ga. has so little to show for being so ‘business friendly’?”
It’s GLOBAL WARMING’S fault I tell ya!
TaxPayer
January 9th, 2013
10:53 am
me, too … dated a grad from there, once
I’d have to see your photo because I’m terrible with names.
RB from Gwinnett
January 9th, 2013
10:53 am
Hey Jay, ““We hold corporations and government officials accountable for fiscal responsibility, and we must do the same for ourselves. This move will reduce controllable costs and help the company remain viable and focused on our core mission of journalism, while continuing to serve the community and provide advertising solutions.”
Just curious….How many more employees does the AJC have beyond what it really needs to run it’s business just because it’s a benevolent democrat run business? And how much higher than the going rate for each job task do they pay? Surely you have those stats available to you. Please share.
Adam
January 9th, 2013
10:53 am
Brosephus and Thulsa: GB’s last statement should leave no doubt in anyone’s mind that he’s just trying to egg us all on. And Thulsa, you should feel dumb for defending him.
Ignore him.
DannyX
January 9th, 2013
10:53 am
“What we really need is some of them northerners from prospering states like Illinois to come in and show us how to grow the state.”
You are exactly right Doom.
Per capita GDP rank
Illinois….15th
Georgia…35th
Brosephus™
January 9th, 2013
10:54 am
Doom
As to the educational aspect, we’re in agreement. That plays a big role in things, and it has nothing to do with race at all. It’s a matter of wealthy vs poor, and in the state of Georgia, the poor are getting their ass kicked quite handily.
http://www.ajc.com/news/news/georgia-schools-lay-unequal-foundations-for-colleg/nS9B8/
Dixie Edalgo and Allyson Reyer both graduated first in their class in Georgia public schools. Both now attend in-state public colleges.
But for these valedictorians, the road to college was dramatically different. Reyer, 18, graduated from Sprayberry High in Cobb County with a 4.578 grade point average and 39 hours of college credit through advanced placement courses. In her first year at The University of Georgia, she’s already a sophomore.
Edalgo, 19, graduated from Wilcox High in the South Georgia town of Rochelle, where budget cuts forced a four-day week, advanced placement courses are not offered and an estimated two-thirds of students don’t have Internet access at home. She graduated with a 4.0 but seldom had homework, and is now struggling with math as a freshman at Abraham Baldwin Agricultural College, where a 2.0 – a low C average – is required for entry.
stands for decibels
January 9th, 2013
10:54 am
Continuing to use coal at out present rate will end civilization as we know it.
I know it’s wrong to dwell in the past, but savor, for a moment, the unbridled idiocy of the sentiment contained in this story’s headline.
http://articles.latimes.com/2012/oct/16/news/la-pn-presidential-debate-energy-policy-20121016
Good times.
TaxPayer
January 9th, 2013
10:55 am
he’s driven past it too
And you’re always there on the same corner. Would you mind puttin a little cleaner in that spray bottle so it don’t streak so bad.
(It’s those emoticons that make sayin just about anything palatable.)
williebkind
January 9th, 2013
10:56 am
“Why does Thulsa Doom write with an imaginary plantation owner accent?
Why does the cat just make up stupid shyte?”
Now that was funny!
Thulsa Doom
January 9th, 2013
10:56 am
“As the column points out, over the past 10 years our economic situation relative to the rest of the country has DECLINED significantly, after a couple of decades of strong growth.” – Jay
Jay,
And you seem to be ignoring the macro reasons why the Georgia economy got hit harder. The ajc had an article a couple of years back on Atlanta being disproportionately hit hard relative to many other cities because it was a technology center and we had lost a lot of technology jobs beginning with the dot.com bubble burst. The recession didn’t help either.
On top of that if I’m not mistaken I think Atlanta’s housing and construction boom was one of the biggest in the nation and a prime driver of our economy. And we all know that with the housing meltdown that virtually that entire industry went into the pooper.
But then I guess it was easier just to blame the Rs for the last 10 years than to look at some of the macro trends that are behind why Georgia lost so much ground so quickly. And your robots on here just ate it up that simpleton explanation they did.
Stevie Ray
January 9th, 2013
10:56 am
USinUK – not very ladylike (and former Girl Scout)
January 9th, 2013
10:44 am
I don’t see that DEMS have done anything terribly wrong that we know about yet..or will know for years. I do feel the healthcare bill will prove a financial disaster due to flawed partnerships and the projections regarding costs and outcome improvement are highly suspect.
If anything I highly criticize both parties for the small-ball crap they call progress. More importantly if the process is flawed we get flawed results…like everything coming out of DC..its broken and our interests are lowest on the totem poll…
Finally, our politician are afraid to come clean on the depths of our real economic problems…both are too spineless to do anything other than run with data most favorable..
Jay
January 9th, 2013
10:57 am
Would that be the Illinois with an annual per capita income some $7,300 higher than Georgia, with a much lower poverty rate than Georgia, with a rate of uninsured citizens roughly a third lower than in Georgia, with a high-school graduation rate of 84%, compared to 67% for Georgia?
You mean THAT Illinois?
Brosephus™
January 9th, 2013
10:57 am
GB: During slavery times 100% of Blacks were employed, had housing, clothing and medical attention provided to them by their master.
Care to post the BLS reports from 1850?
http://www.bls.gov/bls/infohome.htm
BLS History
The Bureau of Labor Statistics has provided essential economic information to support public and private decision-making since 1884. Learn about past BLS milestones, anniversaries, and commissioners.
JamVet
January 9th, 2013
10:57 am
Wow.
Maybe there is a tiny silver lining to the pollution kings and the anti-environmentalists trying to destroy the planet.
Thanks to global warming, my gas bill was down 43% last year! (Doing my taxers, ugh!)
Edward
January 9th, 2013
10:57 am
Maybe corporations ARE getting what they want here in Georgia. With unemployment high, education low, corporations can be very choosy on who they hire and wages/benefits they offer. Don’t like your job, get abused at work, get a lower-than-average salary? Tough, the company will just hire someone else who is willing. Seems like the perfect business environment for typical American corporations now. As long as management can rake in big bucks, who cares?
Stevie Ray
January 9th, 2013
10:58 am
Adam
January 9th, 2013
10:52 am
How on earth did we get to slavery? Who introduced that horrid issue into the various discussions here?
St Simons - aboriginal Bootakook 2014
January 9th, 2013
10:59 am
as for that climate change denier stuff, we have a bet down here.
There’s a piling where the water used to come to. And there’s a stump
where the water comes to now. The bet is – put your money/life where
your big mouth is – deniers handcuff themselves to the piling from 40
years ago, I’ll handcuff myself to the stump.
I’ll keep the key heheh
Now – we wait for high tide.
We haven’t had ONE bigmouth climate denier take that bet since
we’ve been here, which pretty much means they’re full of crap,
and they know they’re full of crap.
good news for cons is their credibility can’t go below zero.
DebbieDoRight - When morality comes up against profit, it is seldom that profit loses.
January 9th, 2013
10:59 am
Rafe @ 10:41 — You forgot to take your meds today.
Paul @ 10:41 — You.Are. SOOO. BAD!!!! but I like that about you!
Stevie: Which side will profit more? The companies having to pay insane amounts or those who profit from selling solutions that may not change things one way or another?
You’re talking money right? How about health? Will the HEALTH of our children profit or loose by incorporating clean air and water standards? What does long instances of breathing in bad air do to young lungs?
Without children begating even more children, the US won’t last beyond another 50 years.
TBS
January 9th, 2013
11:00 am
Bro @ 10:54
I read that article a few weeks ago. Some telling information on the wide range in quality of our state’s education and of course the role that the tax bases plays.
julia
January 9th, 2013
11:02 am
To quote Fredrick Alan, if Atlanta could suck as well as it blows, it would be a seaport.
Stevie Ray
January 9th, 2013
11:02 am
Jay
January 9th, 2013
10:57 am
Regardless, we have vitually the same current unemployment rate as Illinois…8.5% versus 8.7% for IL…
The unknown is whether the situation would be better or worse if the current treatment in either state was not the case…
williebkind
January 9th, 2013
11:03 am
“I know it’s wrong to dwell in the past, but savor, for a moment, the unbridled idiocy of the sentiment contained in this story’s headline.”
Good grief who would ever believe what liberals write as a fair and balanced story.
Jay
January 9th, 2013
11:03 am
“And you seem to be ignoring the macro reasons why the Georgia economy got hit harder.”
No, I don’t, Thulsa. Had you bothered to actually look at the data, you would find that Georgia’s relative decline on measures such as poverty rate and per capita income actually pre-dated the recession.
For example, by 2006 — before the recession — per capita income in this state had already fallen to 37th in the nation, down from 25th just five years earlier.
Convenient and ideologically soothing as it might seem, blaming the recession just doesn’t cut it.
Jefferson
January 9th, 2013
11:05 am
So which businesses lowered their prices, or paid their employees (the workers,not the talkers) better as a result of the cost saving of the tax on utilities ?
Or did they just keep the cost savings, and a room of suit decide how to split it up among themselves ?
Adam
January 9th, 2013
11:06 am
Stevie Ray: How on earth did we get to slavery? Who introduced that horrid issue into the various discussions here?
The post is right before the one I made quoting it. But please do not respond to him or even talk about him. He’s just trying to egg people on.
Stevie Ray
January 9th, 2013
11:06 am
DebbieDoRight – When morality comes up against profit, it is seldom that profit loses.
January 9th, 2013
10:59 am
Seems to me that assuming water and air quality will deteriorate to levels that will adversely affect our kids is a stretch. Heck, that’s a good opportunity for a green tech manufacturer to come up with mechanism to minimize or eliminate any unwanted health affects if the water and air get too contaminated by the lot of us..
Who knows?
GT
January 9th, 2013
11:06 am
The Republican Party was a viable national party up to the evasion of the segregationist from the old southern Democratic Party. Once again the Republican short term gain was actually a long term loss and the Democratic long term gain. You woke up one morning with Strom Thurman as a bedmate. You also unleashed the baggage of the Democratic Party, these crazy selfish and idiotic red states that compromised the will of the middle of the Democratic Party. Now they are with the Republicans doing the same thing, eradicating a moderate position in the Republican Party and now are their cancer instead of the Democrats.
williebkind
January 9th, 2013
11:08 am
“Seems like the perfect business environment for typical American corporations now. As long as management can rake in big bucks, who cares?”
Is that not the results of the college education everyone keeps talking about? It does not matter if you are good or bad employee/employer as long as you have the basket weaving degree you are mandated to receive a huge salary. If you want to succeed on blogs, you must have two or more degrees.
MANGLER
January 9th, 2013
11:08 am
They way your Georgians bicker with each other and name call, is it any surprise that your legislature does the same thing? You don’t care enough about your neighbors and fellow Georgians to listen to them, show courtesy to them, let them merge, fund their schools or their mass transit, lend a hand when they’ve fallen down, or work with them to form anything resembling unity – but you’ll sure as Sugar Honey Iced Tea demand unemployment bennies, SS, and Medicaid disbursements from them, and that YOUR roads be widened all while lowering your tax rates.
Roy Barnes
January 9th, 2013
11:09 am
We need a stronger union presence in Georgia, and an old fashioned, tax and spend Democrat in the governor’s mansion, like in the good old days.
Brosephus™
January 9th, 2013
11:09 am
Stevie Ray @ 10:58
There’s a donkey fez posting here today. I can’t understand why any true conservative would not blast those who post like that under a “conservative” alias making them all look bad.
Stevie Ray
January 9th, 2013
11:09 am
Adam
January 9th, 2013
11:06 am
I always liked Churchill’s quote about an adversary:]
MacDonald has the gift of compressing the largest amount of words into the smallest amount of thoughts.
DebbieDoRight - When morality comes up against profit, it is seldom that profit loses.
January 9th, 2013
11:09 am
SoCoBro: As to the educational aspect, we’re in agreement. That plays a big role in things, and it has nothing to do with race at all. It’s a matter of wealthy vs poor, and in the state of Georgia, the poor are getting their ass kicked quite handily.
That’s horrible isn’t it? It’s like the 50’s all over again! There isn’t supposed to be any “Separate But Equal”; but we can see the disparity in educational funding daily.
That’s why my niece is going to Atlanta Girls School when she’s of age. I’ve already told her Moms this is how it’s going to be. And when she graduates from there, she’ll be going to Spelman. Then when she graduates from Spelman she can go to either Harvard or become a Rhodes Scholar. Those are her choices.
As for my nephews, I’m debating on what’s a good school for boys – preferably a BOYS ONLY school where they can concentrate on their schoolbooks and not schoolgirls. Hopefully by the time i have to worry about that, they’ll have something I’m interested in.
Brosephus™
January 9th, 2013
11:10 am
TBS
Things like that go completely ignored too. Damn shame.
USinUK - not very ladylike (and former Girl Scout)
January 9th, 2013
11:10 am
“UK – You seem to have been around, I like that.”
Oscar – don’t know about been around, but let’s just say that I didn’t marry when I was 22
Stevie Ray
January 9th, 2013
11:11 am
Brosephus™
January 9th, 2013
11:09 am
Hopefully, those conservatives are mostly just ignoring him…of course I don’t know for sure if the conservatives have a corner on the bigotry market or not….I do agree that silence can be interpreted into an answer….
USinUK - not very ladylike (and former Girl Scout)
January 9th, 2013
11:11 am
“We need a stronger union presence in Georgia, and an old fashioned, tax and spend Democrat in the governor’s mansion, like in the good old days.”
Bring back Tom Murphy, says I.
alex
January 9th, 2013
11:14 am
having an NFL team does not significantly impact the economics of the city, I’m completely against a new arena for Blank’s ego…Let Birmingham have the Falcons…Interesting data, empiricly this state attracts many newcomers looking for a job because they could not find a job in their home state (ex Michigan or Ohio), could the unemployment rate reflect these newcomers who already have poor job skills as reflected by their employment history? @ gt i MADE THAT POINT ON THIS BLOG MONTHS AGO…anyway agree with you and therefore with the recent electoral loss the repubs hope that they can reject the extremist (to borrow a Jay term) and move onto long term strategic goals of maintaining some element of personal responsibility as opposed to state responsibility of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness
USinUK - not very ladylike (and former Girl Scout)
January 9th, 2013
11:15 am
“Rednecks, White Trash and Crackers”
OHMY!
Thomas Heyward Jr
January 9th, 2013
11:16 am
Edward
January 9th, 2013
10:57 am
Maybe corporations ARE getting what they want here in Georgia. With unemployment high, education low, corporations can be very choosy on who they hire and wages/benefits they offer. Don’t like your job, get abused at work, get a lower-than-average salary? Tough, the company will just hire someone else who is willing. Seems like the perfect business environment for typical American corporations now. As long as management can rake in big bucks, who cares?
——————————————————————————-
Edward nails it.
.
The State Overseer doesn’t recognize Republicans or Democrats,black or white,……….only livestock.
But the State loves…….and needs…….those who do.
.
Forward Fiddle.
Brosephus™
January 9th, 2013
11:17 am
Stevie Ray
You have to remember that many of the conservatives here are constantly asking liberals to vocally denounce things, so I think that goes both ways. You can’t ask for something you’re not willing to do yourself.
Thulsa Doom
January 9th, 2013
11:18 am
“That plays a big role in things, and it has nothing to do with race at all.”
Brocephus,
Yep. We definitely agree on that. Except that like I was saying I think a poor education system and the gulf between rich, affluent systems and poorer systems might disproportionately hurt blacks more. Not sure but that’s what I would guess.
burntgrassroot
January 9th, 2013
11:20 am
Jay, thank you for this essay. If your goal was to educate, outrage and motivate us to reevaluate our goals as Georgians, and the process for reaching those goals, you have succeeded mightily. My coffee doesn’t even taste good this morning.
When Gov. Barnes was in office, to attract businesses to Georgia, I believe he instituted a moratorium on payroll taxes (unemployment contribution?) for employers. Is that correct? If so, has it been reinstated?
The southern strategy is still working because southerners are deluded into thinking that politics is about race (i.e. ethnicity) and redistribution of wealth, when it’s always been about economics, class and allocation of power. Although I don’t know the context of the following quote (aren’t intellectuals part of the bourgeoisie?), I think its sentiment is relevant. “Indignation about the powers that be and the bourgeois fools who did their bidding—that was all you needed … You were an intellectual.” —Tom Wolfe, Harper’s, June 2000
JamVet
January 9th, 2013
11:20 am
We need a stronger union presence in Georgia…
Oh heavens no! The Republinazis will never go for that!
Labor unions should all be banned so that we can double down on the 3.5 percent decline in Georgia incomes since 2001!
You honestly think that part of the solution is to have someone in a position of power who actually stands up FOR the little guy and AGAINST the trickle downers???!!!
Hell, that detestable Uncle Sam tries meekly to do that once in awhile and the godly conservatives have declared a jihad on him for doing so.
After all it was NOT the 1% who have created all of these injustices in this country, it was the lazy stupid mooches in the 47%!
Fortunately the American fascists are in DEEP doo doo these days.
Speaking of which, I think Kyle is so fed up with his “conservative” malcontents and miscreants over there, he may never open up again!
Welcome to the Occupation
January 9th, 2013
11:24 am
“It’s also foolish to pretend that “Rs only took over the governorship here 10 years.” In many ways, the same people are in charge as were in charge when I came to Georgia in 1990”
Amusing to imagine transporting Thulsa Doom back about 20 years in time. He would be confused trying to speak on local politics in the South. Everything he would want to support would be dubbed “Republican” but he would be deprived of a clear cut party affiliation for his positions as some of the individuals advancing them would be under the “Democrat” aegis while others would be Republican. No such problem for him today.
Such is the role of partisanship in our politics today.
Intellectual short-hand for the less educated masses.
DebbieDoRight - When morality comes up against profit, it is seldom that profit loses.
January 9th, 2013
11:24 am
Seems to me that assuming water and air quality will deteriorate to levels that will adversely affect our kids is a stretch.
You’re kidding right? I mean, you can’t REALLY be serious!
Do you know WHY the EPA was started? Here’s a brief history:
For years, raw sewage, industrial and feedlot wastes had been discharged into rivers and lakes without regard for the cumulative effect that made our waters unfit for drinking, swimming, and boating. Smokestack omissions and automobile exhausts made air pollution so bad in certain communities that some people died and many were hospitalized. The land itself was being polluted by indiscriminate dumping of municipal and industrial wastes and some very toxic chemicals that would later come to the fore when their steel drum containers would rust and leak hazardous materials into soil and aquifers.
For decades Americans had assumed that air and water were free and plentiful and the industrial community gave little thought to pollution. Following World War II, however, several developments changed this picture. The U.S. experienced a vast increase in throw-away packaging: cans, bottles, plastics, and paper products–and the introduction into the marketplace of thousands of new synthetic organic chemicals. As a result of this deluge of waste land toxic materials, the earth’s automatic, self-cleansing, life support systems became increasingly threatened.
http://www.epa.gov/history/topics/epa/15b.html#bg
Also here’s a story about a river you might’ve heard of:
The Cuyahoga River at one time was one of the most polluted rivers in the United States. The reach from Akron to Cleveland was devoid of fish…….June 22, 1969, when a river fire captured the attention of Time magazine, which described the Cuyahoga as the river that “oozes rather than flows” and in which a person “does not drown but decays”.[14]
A view of the river from the Ohio and Erie Canal Tow-Path Trail
The 1969 Cuyahoga River fire helped spur an avalanche of water pollution control activities, resulting in the Clean Water Act, Great Lakes Water Quality Agreement, and the creation of the federal Environmental Protection Agency.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuyahoga_River
Stevie: Heck, that’s a good opportunity for a green tech manufacturer to come up with mechanism to minimize or eliminate any unwanted health affects if the water and air get too contaminated by the lot of us..
Yes, but what are we going to do in the meantime? Ignore the problem? History has told us that money, not necessity is the mother of all invention. But until someone deems that they an make a big enough profit to offset their expenses in coming up with a solution, then we still have to protect the environment.
Erwin's cat
January 9th, 2013
11:25 am
After all it was NOT the 1% who have created all of these injustices in this country, it was the lazy stupid mooches in the 47%!
are those the only 2 choices?
Brosephus™
January 9th, 2013
11:25 am
DDR @ 11:09
Nothing wrong with that plan there sister. I don’t know which way my lil one will go, but you’d better believe that mommy and daddy will ensure she gets her studies straight.
JohnnyReb
January 9th, 2013
11:27 am
More bleeding heart thoughts from Jay.
Jay fails to put forth a solution as to where the jobs, and therefore tax dollars to transfer to the so-called poor, will come from without incentives to draw business to the state. Of course, in the Liberal mind the ideal is one-world great society. Apparently, it is OK to take from workers of other states to support the poor here.
Welcome to the Occupation
January 9th, 2013
11:28 am
alex: “Let Birmingham have the Falcons…”
Heh. That’ll be the day.
If you had told me 20 years ago that the nation’s second largest city and media market would go not for a year or two, but possibly for decades without an NFL team, I would have dismissed it out of hand as impossible. And I suspect not a few NFL executives would have as well. And yet, that is exactly what is happening, with the NFL seeming to chug along undisturbed by this strange anomaly. It’s quite surprising really.
Paul
January 9th, 2013
11:28 am
DDR
One of the last times we went to MD Anderson for my wife’s annual check, the physician who attended did her undergraduate at Spelman. She was a most impressive individual. A few minutes’ speaking with her and you know she’d rise to the top of whatever field she chose to enter.
That college does good work. It’s good to see you doing that for your niece. That’s what families are for.
Thulsa Doom
January 9th, 2013
11:28 am
“No, I don’t, Thulsa. Had you bothered to actually look at the data, you would find that Georgia’s relative decline on measures such as poverty rate and per capita income actually pre-dated the recession.”
“For example, by 2006 — before the recession — per capita income in this state had already fallen to 37th in the nation, down from 25th just five years earlier.”
And I think you might need some tutoring from Kyle next door who spoke yesterday on a very similar topic regarding incomes and demographics.
Trends such as the rise in single parent households which will affect the poverty rate and per capita income per household. And due to demographics those trends will be worse in Georgia. And no. Doomy is not blaming black folks for all of this. Plenty of single young white women out here in the sticks that are having kids and starting a cycle of poverty and govt dependence. The good thing for libs is that its another Dem voter looking for more social program spending.
JamVet
January 9th, 2013
11:28 am
So cat, tell me who you think is responsible for the vast amount of injustice in this country.
Presuming you even think there is any…
Brosephus™
January 9th, 2013
11:30 am
Doom
Why would you guess that? Check that AJC article I posted a link to earlier. I don’t think race makes as much of a difference as you think. Most Blacks in Georgia live in urban areas, and they generally have a higher tax base, even Clayton County, than most rural Georgia areas. I don’t know if you can even interject race in this one. It’s simply wealthy vs poor, and the poor are getting their asses handed to them on a silver platter.
The entire basis of conservative economic policy is to grow wealth. If you don’t have wealth to begin with, those policies don’t aid you much at all. Tax cuts, in the forms they are pushed, don’t help the poor or working poor. They are not designed nor passed to do such a thing. They are meant to help those with means to keep even more. They don’t increase job creation. Demand does that, and you can’t tax cut demand into an increase.
Towncrier
January 9th, 2013
11:30 am
I wonder how much Georgia being essentially a one city state has to do with all of this.
Tundra Dude
January 9th, 2013
11:31 am
Two years of Governor Kocher (Walker) attempting to be “business friendly” isn’t paying off in Wiscy, either.
We’ve dropped to 42nd in job creation. His 4-year goal of 250k jobs ain’t happenin’….not even close.
Regnad Kcin
January 9th, 2013
11:32 am
“Apparently, it is OK to take from workers of other states to support the poor here.”
You mean that hotel tax to help poor team owners?
n
January 9th, 2013
11:32 am
The most venal and corrupt among us populate the GA legislature. It was true during the era of Democratic control, and it is true now. The difference is that the Republicans are new to power and full of arrogance and hubris, and the conviction that we the people are nothing but sheep to be fleeced over and over again. For the past decade they have seemingly lacked the subtlety of the Democrats, who fleeced us with equal success, but had the circumspection required to successfully hide their tracks, and did occasionally make the effort to accomplish something beneficial to the people who elected them. Unfortunately for all of us, the current Republican leadership’s “lack of ethics” has not been not enough to attract the attention of seemingly otherwise-occupied law enforcement agencies, so Georgia’s reputation as a decent place to live & raise children has continued it’s down slide, while the legislators and the state leadership devote themselves to self-enrichment, while allowing education, environment, financial system, infrastructure and quality of life to plummet.
And the truly strange thing is that they are apparently proud of making GA into a bleak backwater state, where the populace is kept ignorant and poor.
Thulsa Doom
January 9th, 2013
11:32 am
“Amusing to imagine transporting Thulsa Doom back about 20 years in time.”- Welcome to the occupation
Naw. Real amusement is watching you try to make sense.
Erwin's cat
January 9th, 2013
11:32 am
Jam – depends on the particular “injustice”
whoever said life was “fair”?
will-o-the-wisp
January 9th, 2013
11:32 am
Yes, USinUK; more than 50% of the population in 70% of the land area in GA have high school or less education, so it should be no secret how voters are seduced into corporate bondage.
alex
January 9th, 2013
11:34 am
@ Debbie, the Cuyahoga is now clean, only there is nobody left in Cleveland to notice,……sad really, once a vibrant, creative city-destroyed by incompetent mayors and businesses ( and ,of course, the weather does not help)
Erwin's cat
January 9th, 2013
11:34 am
You mean that hotel tax to help poor team owners?
The city is pushing for that to keep the Falcons in the city and not lose them to the burbs
JamVet
January 9th, 2013
11:35 am
Doomy, and I blasted him for using “households” as the metric.
Note that the income decline of 3.5% in Georgia is per capita, not per household.
His flaccid response was funny, in that he actually bolstered MY argument.
IMUO, counting household income as the primary indicator is just deflecterbation…
Oscar
January 9th, 2013
11:35 am
JamVet – That would be greedy people.
GT
January 9th, 2013
11:35 am
We need a stronger union presence in Georgia, and an old fashioned, tax and spend Democrat in the governor’s mansion, like in the good old days
Local corruption doesn’t bother you? What they steal would pay 10 tax bills for each individual citizen, what they screw up would provide income for two Georgias. I have always said Lord let me make the income and I will gladly pay my taxes. Stolen money seldom has a tax just no boxes to check on the form, I guess.
Welcome to the Occupation
January 9th, 2013
11:35 am
JohnnyReb: “Jay fails to put forth a solution as to where the jobs, and therefore tax dollars to transfer to the so-called poor”
You say that as though there are not tax dollars being transferred in the trillions to the so-called “rich”, which continues right as we speak.
Why is that ok with you, JohnnyReb? Haven’t the rich gotten enough tax handouts and wealth transferred to them? Or are you confused? Do I need to explain the basics of our political-economic system to you?
Thulsa Doom
January 9th, 2013
11:36 am
“how voters are seduced into corporate bondage.”
“corporate bondage”??? Libs do like they hyperbole they do.
Quick! Someone help. We got another liberal fainting goat.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_3Utmj4RPU
DebbieDoRight - When morality comes up against profit, it is seldom that profit loses.
January 9th, 2013
11:36 am
Paul: That college does good work. It’s good to see you doing that for your niece. That’s what families are for.
My favorite aunt went to Spelman — she left provisions in her will for ME to go to Spelman too. She left me her house, some funds and some property, (most of the money I couldn’t get to until I either turned 25 OR graduated from Spelman, with honors — so I still had to get a job to help with tuition and stuff).
I plan to follow in her footsteps and do the same thing for my honey bunny — since I’m much younger when my niece was born than my aunt was when I was born, hopefully I’ll be around to see her graduate too. With honors!
Regnad Kcin
January 9th, 2013
11:37 am
“The city is pushing for that to keep the Falcons in the city and not lose them to the burbs”
The Lawrenceville Falcons…hmm…
JohnnyReb
January 9th, 2013
11:38 am
“You mean that hotel tax to help poor team owners?”
No, that’s another related subject. I was in reference to the federal extortion of taxpayers that is being funneled back to the so-called poor. BTW – the Left uses the word “poor,” but what they really mean and believe in their bleeding heart is “not economically equal.”
As to the new Falcons stadium, I have posted opposition here at every opportunity. With the ATL public school system recording almost 100% of families qualifying and receiving the free school meals, there is a lot greater need than giving the Falcons a convertible.
Erwin's cat
January 9th, 2013
11:39 am
The Lawrenceville Falcons…hmm…
They don’t call it Road Braselton do they?
Regnad Kcin
January 9th, 2013
11:40 am
“They don’t call it Road Braselton do they?”
Touche!
alex
January 9th, 2013
11:40 am
“seduced into corporate bondage”……OHHHHHH!, Mother Jones is calling…..
Thulsa Doom
January 9th, 2013
11:40 am
JamVet,
Deflecterbation? Is that a JamVet invention. I usually don’t read your posts much anymore since we don’t blog battle but sometimes I got to read them just to see what new funnys you come up with. Saw one the other night that had me rolling but I can’t remember what it was. BTW you must be slipping cause I haven’t seen you call anyone mystery meat in a while.
GB
January 9th, 2013
11:40 am
Somebody else is posting comments with my initials. Pay no attention to the false one.
JohnnyReb
January 9th, 2013
11:41 am
Occupation – try to grasp the total economic picture. Laws/tax incentivies were not put in place to screw the poor people. Instead, if the rich have more money they make jobs for others available. Yes, it’s the dreaded trickle-down you guys hate, but it sure as hell beats trickle up poverty.
Regnad Kcin
January 9th, 2013
11:41 am
” the Left uses the word “poor,” but what they really mean and believe in their bleeding heart is “not economically equal.”
Got a link to the (medical?) source of THAT whopper (I’m guessing Rushie)?
JamVet
January 9th, 2013
11:42 am
cat, you need a dictionary.
jus·tice -noun
1. the quality of being just; righteousness, equitableness, or moral rightness: to uphold the justice of a cause.
2. rightfulness or lawfulness, as of a claim or title; justness of ground or reason: to complain with justice.
3. the moral principle determining just conduct.
4. conformity to this principle, as manifested in conduct; just conduct, dealing, or treatment.
5. the administering of deserved punishment or reward.
Maybe you can find it, but I don’t see the word *fair* in there anywhere, do you?
Again, just answer the question, instead of just deflecterbating and showing your inability to make an intelligent argument outside of your endless simplistic sloganeering.
Ir won’t kill you to take a stand, righteous or otherwise, now and then.
Regnad Kcin
January 9th, 2013
11:42 am
““seduced into corporate bondage”……”
50 shade of SOMETHING…
Oscar
January 9th, 2013
11:42 am
GB – Howdo we know which posts are by the false one?
Welcome to the Occupation
January 9th, 2013
11:43 am
JamVet: “After all it was NOT the 1% who have created all of these injustices in this country, it was the lazy stupid mooches in the 47%! ”
About as close to dead wrong as it’s possible for a statement to be. The diametrical opposite is the truth.
The 1% are responsible for EVERYTHING that is unjust about our current economic situation.