In upstate New York, gunman targets, kills firefighters

For families of at least two firefighters in upstate New York, Christmas 2012 took a dark, ugly turn this morning.

WEBSTER, N.Y. (AP) — The police chief in Webster, N.Y., says that four firefighters were shot while responding to a blaze in the town near Rochester and that two are dead.

Chief Gerald Pickering says “one or more shooters” fired at the firefighters Monday morning. Officials say they had arrived at the scene of the blaze near the Lake Ontario shore around 6 a.m.

It’s not the kind of story that you want to be posting on Christmas Eve. But this is the reality in which we live, and which — we are told by some — we are helpless to improve upon.

I do not accept that.

– Jay Bookman

186 comments Add your comment

Mr Right

December 24th, 2012
12:03 pm

I do not accept that

Your solution?

Georgia on my mind...

December 24th, 2012
12:05 pm

This is very disappointing news..We have come to a time that ALL first responders must be on alert…so sad…

Jay

December 24th, 2012
12:05 pm

barking frog

December 24th, 2012
12:14 pm

firefighters should have an armed guard at every firehouse
and an armed escort on every response and each firefighter
should have a weapon and extensive firearms training.

Mr Right

December 24th, 2012
12:19 pm

None of those steps violates the Constitution; none prevents honest citizens from obtaining firearms for personal defense, hunting and other legitimate purposes. But together, they have the potential to dramatically reduce the number of deaths caused by firearm misuse.

Some of the points you make may help reduce the overall number of deaths caused by firearms but I don’t see how it’s going to stop the crazy people from these crazy shootings!

RF

December 24th, 2012
12:23 pm

LaPierre will be trotted out about oh, say Thursday to talk about Israel’s armed guards and how first responders from both police and fire departments should be wearing SWAT gear and have armed escorts to “clear the scene” before they can actually put out a fire and maybe save some nut’s life.

Sadly, for the rational and responsible to exercise their God-given Constitutional rights, we have to put up with a whole buttload of nuts who shouldn’t even be allowed to play with Nerf guns. So we either get busy trying to change the culture that says “we just need MORE guns”, or we get busy arming every public servant out there.

Tom Middleton

December 24th, 2012
12:24 pm

More guns, more guns out there, right Wayne? Yep, you’re crazy!

indigo

December 24th, 2012
12:24 pm

For manhy years now the NRA and their Republican lackeys in Congress have done everything possible to turn America into a gun owner’s paradise.

They have sown the wind.

Now, unfortunately, we are all reaping the whirlwind.

Their solution?

Sell even more guns.

When will the sensible adults displace the profit crazed and political toadies in establishing a common sense gun policy?

Joe Hussein Mama

December 24th, 2012
12:25 pm

I’d like to see someone objectively define and quantify “crazy” in regards to ‘crazy people who shouldn’t have firearms’ and ’someone should have stopped that crazy person before he did that.’

There are plenty of mentally ill people in this country who never do ANYTHING violent whatsoever, but Wayne LaPierre seems to be intent on demonizing mental illness and the mentally ill as if stomping on the civil rights of others will somehow help him to keep his and his members’ firearms safely in their possession.

Mr Right

December 24th, 2012
12:27 pm

So RF, how would propose to change the culture?

Da Mick

December 24th, 2012
12:28 pm

barking frog, and others with a similiar vision of an armed society, has it ever occured to you that perhaps firefighters, teachers and other public service are not interested in extensive firearms training because they are not interested in shooting it out with every insane person who is easily able to get their hands on a weapon, in this weapons-crazed country? We should continue our path of turning the US into the wild west, just so folks like yourself can legally hang on to your precious guns, just in case of a government overthrow, racial riots, a nuclear emergency, or some other survialist wet dream?

This is just getting ridiculous, and must be dealt with despite the outcries of powerful lobbying groups and the small percentage of radical fringe-dwellers who put their own selfish interests above the well-being of the general populace and the basic ability to be safe out in public, in this country.

barking frog

December 24th, 2012
12:29 pm

Jesus cured a crazy man by casting out his demons and putting
them into swine. More emphasis should be placed on this type
treatment.

barking frog

December 24th, 2012
12:32 pm

Da Mick 12:28
I support a total ban on firearms within the borders of the USA.
What about you ?

Jay

December 24th, 2012
12:35 pm

If our solution is to deny guns to crazy people, the place to start is with Wayne LaPierre.

RF

December 24th, 2012
12:37 pm

Mr. Right: it’s going to take time, but as Jay posted downstairs, it starts the way MADD did, with publicity and consistency of message. I don’t think the goal should be to remove guns as much as point out the need for a lot of safety in ownership and storage, training, and registering of weapons and ammo. Guns have to become less popular and be seen as the tool they are for defense, hunting, and sport, and proper safety and responsibility have to become a normal part of our thinking.

I posted down one thread about a neighbor who had a fire yesterday morning. Improperly stored ammo was going off and a buddy of mine down the street had to go inside after hearing the bullets zinging through the trees. Luckily nobody was hurt by that, but think what could have happened to the firefighters doing their job to put out the fire and save lives. We don’t have clear guidelines and laws about gun storage and safety, so think what would happen if a house had thousands of rounds stored in a closet on a shelf. And I know people who have that much.

resno2

December 24th, 2012
12:38 pm

The problem is that the fringe on both sides of this issue, legislators included, are the one’s that are going to be the cause for what ever changes are made, or not made. Knee-jerk legislation is not good for anyone.

Real Scootter

December 24th, 2012
12:39 pm

Dang,I guess none of you folks want to blame the criminals instead of the NRA. Whew!
I don’t have a link but would be willing to bet none of these tragedys were commited by NRA members.

RF

December 24th, 2012
12:39 pm

“Jesus cured a crazy man by casting out his demons and putting
them into swine”

Now we just put lipstick on the pig and try to run it Ms. America…

RF

December 24th, 2012
12:44 pm

“I don’t have a link but would be willing to bet none of these tragedys were commited by NRA members.”

Wouldn’t matter. Being an NRA member doesn’t guarantee that you are sane and safe in the use and storage of your weapons. I’d respect them a lot more if they’d get off the “more guns” shtick and start publicizing and promoting gun safety with the same energy and focus. It wouldn’t solve the problem, but it might help keep a few nuts from getting their hands on them. The NRA could elevate its reputation mightily right now by showing some willingness to put some of that precious lobbying money and power into promoting gun safety, training, and registration rather than fight every attempt to create gun owner registries and any ordinance requiring safe storage of them. Anyone with more than a hundred rounds and more than two handguns should have their arsenal stored in a fireproof safe to help prevent someone from stealing them or to protect firefighters in the event of a fire.

Tom Middleton

December 24th, 2012
12:45 pm

Jay: “If our solution is to deny guns to crazy people, the place to start is with Wayne LaPierre.”

As usual, Jay has the best comments by far!!!!

TaxPayer

December 24th, 2012
12:45 pm

Blaming the criminals and then turning around and making it ever easier for them to get guns is not working. Gunowners need to begin to accept a little responsibility instead of always trying to evade it.

getalife

December 24th, 2012
12:46 pm

Merry Christmas Jay and fellow bloggers.

I like your solution .

As usual, the right offers nothing but more guns.

td

December 24th, 2012
12:46 pm

indigo

December 24th, 2012
12:24 pm

For manhy years now the NRA and their Republican lackeys in Congress have done everything possible to turn America into a gun owner’s paradise.

I guess you are forgetting about all those gun loving Democrats in the Congress?

Stevie Ray..Clowns to the left and Jokers to the right..here I am...

December 24th, 2012
12:47 pm

JAY

I appreciate your DUI reference, but implementation of any proposed solution that is effective is not likely. Too many legitimate variables in the puzzle. In my work, occurrences that are measured in a fraction of a percentage are very difficult to pinpoint credibly. Same thing applies here. Legit gun owners have cogent arguement to continue as is….You can’t isolate “mentally ill” because you have no credible definition of the term and in a general sense, favorable outcomes are limited by desire of subject and current treatments. The idea of putting more guns in circulation to address exposure that can’t reasonably be qualified should be discounted as insane to begin with…

I say control with distribution of bullets and outlaw certain types….but the cash slinging gun lobby in DC will butter bread on a bi-partisan basis so we will not likely see anything that will prevent these extremely isolated actions…

Joe Hussein Mama

December 24th, 2012
12:47 pm

Jay — “If our solution is to deny guns to crazy people, the place to start is with Wayne LaPierre.”

I can get behind that.

moonbat betty

December 24th, 2012
12:48 pm

It was most likely the fault of the Meth and staying up for 3 weeks straight.

Thankfully, the only tools at his disposal weren’t a fork and knife.

He may have eaten their face off instead.

rightwingextreme

December 24th, 2012
12:48 pm

Jay…are you going to call for the arrest of David Gregory of NBC News? On yesterday’s Meet the Press show he held up what appeared to be a 30 round magazine. This is in clear violation of the law and he should be arrested immediately. Gregory easily broke DC’s gun laws.

DC High Capacity Ammunition Magazines – D.C. Official Code 7-2506.01

(b) No person in the District shall possess, sell, or transfer any large capacity ammunition feeding device regardless of whether the device is attached to a firearm. For the purposes of this subsection, the term large capacity ammunition feeding device means a magazine, belt, drum, feed strip, or similar device that has a capacity of, or that can be readily restored or converted to accept, more than 10 rounds of ammunition. The term large capacity ammunition feeding device shall not include an attached tubular device designed to accept, and capable of operating only with, .22 caliber rimfire ammunition.

barking frog

December 24th, 2012
12:48 pm

Why can we give out cellphones for poor people and not
give out guns, poor people need protection too.

Redneck Convert (R--and proud of it)

December 24th, 2012
12:49 pm

Well, chances are them good ‘ol boys thought the firefighters were the ones setting the fires. They probly never meant no harm.

Anyhow, I want to wish y’all a Merry Christmas. Don’t pick your teeth with your Glock and you’ll come thru the holiday just fine.

Stevie Ray..Clowns to the left and Jokers to the right..here I am...

December 24th, 2012
12:50 pm

barking frog

December 24th, 2012
12:29 pm

Metaphysics? How do we go about that?

Real Scootter

December 24th, 2012
12:50 pm

RF

December 24th, 2012
12:37 pm

Good day RF!!
I saw your post about the bullets zinging through the trees.What ever your friends heard was not bullets! Scientific experiments have been done on super heated ammo and the bullets rarely ever travel more 6ft.The shell casing will travel a little farther up to 12ft.Thus no bullets or casings flying into trees. And no,I won’t do the search and find a link to it! :smile:

getalife

December 24th, 2012
12:51 pm

I wonder if they were trying to cover up a murder in that house.

Juan on fox proposed no guns in the house if there are mental health issues is another idea.

barking frog

December 24th, 2012
12:51 pm

Stevie Ray 12:50
Pray for enlightenment.

Joe Hussein Mama

December 24th, 2012
12:53 pm

R. Scootter — “Dang,I guess none of you folks want to blame the criminals instead of the NRA. Whew!”

Nobody’s saying that the guilty parties in these sorts of things don’t deserve to be punished. I think everyone here would agree that anyone who goes shooting up public places deserves a long, long time behind bars, just like that Loughran fellow who shot Congresswoman Giffords is going to get.

But that’s not what LaPierre is talking about. He’s talking about affirmatively ABRIDGING the rights of Americans based on nothing more than his notion of who’s “crazy” and who isn’t.

Seriously, if anyone here honestly thought that someone they knew or worked with or went to church with was planning to shoot up a school or theater, I think any poster here would turn that person in. But the problem is that we’re not *getting* those sorts of heads-ups ahead of time, and so LaPierre has just preemptively decided that “crazy” shouldn’t get guns.

Problem is, LaPierre ain’t qualified to decide who’s crazy and who isn’t.

barking frog

December 24th, 2012
12:53 pm

getalife
Juan on fox proposed no guns in the house if there are mental health issues is another idea.
…………………………………………………………………………………
No gun juan will be the result.

barking frog

December 24th, 2012
12:56 pm

JoeHusseinMama
Problem is, LaPierre ain’t qualified to decide who’s crazy and who isn’t.
………………………………………………………………
But he does provide an example…

Stevie Ray..Clowns to the left and Jokers to the right..here I am...

December 24th, 2012
12:57 pm

barking frog

December 24th, 2012
12:51 pm

Prayer? No evidence exists that particular tactic has relevance in the physical world.

Joe Hussein Mama

December 24th, 2012
12:58 pm

R. W. Extreme — “Gregory easily broke DC’s gun laws.”

Then I encourage you to contact District police ASAP and let them handle the matter.

http://mpdc.dc.gov/service/hotlines-tip-lines-and-important-numbers

barking frog

December 24th, 2012
12:58 pm

Stevie Ray 12:57
I would refer you to former governor Perdue and the current
availability of water in the state of Georgia..

getalife

December 24th, 2012
12:58 pm

frog,

Juan and Shep are the only sane ones on fox.

MANGLER

December 24th, 2012
12:59 pm

Fire fighters and Paramedics are neutral positions and need to stay that way. They do not carry arrest authority and should not. Their chosen job is to help and be first responders into situations that most everyone else runs from or can’t handle – but unlike Police and the military, they are not armed and not seen as a potential threat.
You don’t arm firemen, paramedics, doctors, or teachers. These positions in society are too important to risk being perceived as taking sides.

Find Muck

December 24th, 2012
1:00 pm

Real Scootter, I thought RF’s “bullets zinging through the trees” story sounded “off” as well. Without the barrel to concentrate and direct the force from the exploding powder in the casing, the bullet would not travel far. The energy would initially push the bullet out of the casing, but then rapidly dissipate since it would not be confined in a barrel.

RF, as they say on this blog, “if you have to lie to make your point, then you have NO point.”

Mr Right

December 24th, 2012
1:01 pm

Jay

December 24th, 2012
12:35 pm

If our solution is to deny guns to crazy people, the place to start is with Wayne LaPierre

Ok, so if you don’t agree with Jay that makes you crazy!

Real Scootter

December 24th, 2012
1:02 pm

Problem is, LaPierre ain’t qualified to decide who’s crazy and who isn’t.

Agreed JHM!!

Not to sound snarky here but I don’t think Wayne is going to do that cause he ain’t a shrink.

barking frog

December 24th, 2012
1:02 pm

getalife
Juan and Shep are the only sane ones on fox.
………………………………………………………
by what standard are you measuring sanity?

getalife

December 24th, 2012
1:02 pm

Well, they could label conservatism a mental defect and disarm them.

Stevie Ray..Clowns to the left and Jokers to the right..here I am...

December 24th, 2012
1:04 pm

barking frog

December 24th, 2012
12:58 pm

I’m sorry..I respect your beliefs and those of others. I simply didn’t grow up in that environment and as a result, have no interest in metaphysics…physics, science and the like definitely…

getalife

December 24th, 2012
1:05 pm

“by what standard are you measuring sanity?”

That is the job of professionals and it would stop folks from saying crazy things.

Mr Right

December 24th, 2012
1:05 pm

All you people that are so against guns go ahead and post a sign in your yard stating that your house is gun free!

barking frog

December 24th, 2012
1:05 pm

getalife
Well, they could label conservatism a mental defect and disarm them
……………………………………………………………………..
or just call it foxmania…

Stephenson Billings

December 24th, 2012
1:06 pm

Gotta love the “do as I say, not as I do” liberal elites:

Gregory Mocks LaPierre for Proposing Armed Guards, but Sends Kids to High-Security School

“David Gregory mocked the NRA’s Wayne LaPierre for proposing that armed guards be at every school in America. But the NBC host seems to have no problem with armed guards protecting his kids everyday where they attend school in Washington, D.C.

But when it comes to Gregory’s own kids, however, they are secured every school day by armed guards.

The Gregory children go to school with the children of President Barack Obama, according to the Washington Post. That school is the co-ed Quaker school Sidwell Friends.

According to a scan of the school’s online faculty-staff directory, Sidwell has a security department made up of at least 11 people. Many of those are police officers, who are presumably armed.

Moreover, with the Obama kids in attendance, there is a secret service presence at the institution, as well. ”

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/gregory-mocks-lapierre-proposing-armed-guards-sends-kids-high-security-school_691057.html

AngryRedMarsWoman

December 24th, 2012
1:06 pm

Just want to point out to everyone that these firefighters are/were volunteers. Those of us in metro-Atlanta are accustomed to paid departments, but I am originally from the WNY area and can assure you that outside of the “big cities” like Buffalo and Rochester the communities are served by all-volunteer forces….my father served in one department “forever” (even being Chief for a number of years – YAY Daddy). Anyway, the situation is horrible no matter what….but I thought I should point out that this POS shot and killed people who were helping their community in an unpaid capacity. Seriously….this makes me hope that there is in fact a Hell.

moonbat betty

December 24th, 2012
1:07 pm

“Well, they could label conservatism a mental defect and disarm them.”

Yeah, that will most likely be obama’s solution. Maybe re-open up his flag@whitehouse.gov so the libs can report anyone with whom they disagree.

barking frog

December 24th, 2012
1:08 pm

Mr Right
All you people that are so against guns go ahead and post a sign in your yard stating that your house is gun free!
………………………………………………………………………..
at the same time you post a list of valuables in your house
protected by guns

Joe Hussein Mama

December 24th, 2012
1:08 pm

Scootter — “Agreed JHM!!”

See? More common ground. :)

“Not to sound snarky here but I don’t think Wayne is going to do that cause he ain’t a shrink.”

Well, not to be disagreeable, but I think he’s *already* doing that by bringing it up in this way. I think that if he and the NRA *really thought* that the mentally ill were to blame for most public shootings, he’d have come to Meet The Press armed with surveys and statistics, and I think he’d already have a PR firm and a boatload of professional psychiatrists lined up to back his claims.

Frankly, I think the Newtown shooting caught LaPierre and the NRA leadership flat-footed, they don’t really know how to respond, and so they’re desperately casting around for something they can use to defend themselves.

I know! Let’s use crazy people! Who’s going to speak up for crazy people? After all, they’re crazy, right?

Maybe you can see where I’m going with this. :)

rightwingextreme

December 24th, 2012
1:08 pm

Joe Hussein Mama

December 24th, 2012
12:58 pm
R. W. Extreme — “Gregory easily broke DC’s gun laws.”

You miss the point…..the ban didn’t stop an otherwise, at least as far as we know, law abiding citizen from obtaining a banned item.

Do you really think the criminal element gives a rat’s rear end about gun laws?

Once you take guns away from law-abiding citizens only the criminals will have them.

On a side note, Gregory sends his kids to the same school Obama does. The school’s website notes there are 11 security guards present. Betcha they’re armed. And those are the ones we’re told about. With bammy’s kids being there you know Secret Service is there and they are armed.

Seems the liberal elite like having their little ones in schools with armed security.

Why can’t us working folks have the same level of protection for our kids, who are just as precious to us, as the liberal elite?

Real Scootter

December 24th, 2012
1:08 pm

Find Muck

December 24th, 2012
1:00 pm

I don’t think RF is lying.I just think his friends are mistaken about what was zinging through the trees.

getalife

December 24th, 2012
1:09 pm

moonbat,

Sounds good to me.

See something say something,

RF

December 24th, 2012
1:10 pm

“What ever your friends heard was not bullets!”

Actually, a friend in law enforcement said that’s not entirely true. He’s been to fire scenes where a few traveled further. Depends on the storage. Loose they’re not much more than noise. Metal box is dangerous because of shrapnel if the box comes apart as ammo goes off. If they’re in a loaded gun, then it’s a problem. Evidently the guy whose house burned (nice guy but a bit of gun freak) had some loaded weapons going off, according to one of the firefighters, but I did get that info. secondhand…

Again, since there aren’t rigid standards about gun storage, it’s not uncommon for loaded weapons to be stored by folks who don’t have kids in the house to worry about.

Stephenson Billings

December 24th, 2012
1:10 pm

“All you people that are so against guns go ahead and post a sign in your yard stating that your house is gun free!”

The Journal News in NYC is already doing that with residents in Westchester and Rockland Counties. At least now criminals know where to go to avoid the guns:

NY newspaper runs interactive map with names, addresses of handgun-permit holders

http://www.lohud.com/interactive/article/20121223/NEWS01/121221011/Map-Where-gun-permits-your-neighborhood-?nclick_check=1

moonbat betty

December 24th, 2012
1:11 pm

“Sounds good to me.”

Until YOU get reported. :)

Tom Middleton

December 24th, 2012
1:12 pm

<– Gun Free! :)

barking frog

December 24th, 2012
1:12 pm

when assault weapons are banned only outlaws will have
assault weapons unless they are grandfathered in to current
owners…

getalife

December 24th, 2012
1:12 pm

Moonbat,

Did you snitch me out?

Mr Right

December 24th, 2012
1:13 pm

RF

December 24th, 2012
12:37 pm

Like I told Jay, it may help reduce some deaths which is good but will not stop the crazy shootings by crazy people! Now respond as jay did and call LaPierre crazy which solves nothing. Nobody believes he would shoot up school!

RF

December 24th, 2012
1:14 pm

“RF, as they say on this blog, “if you have to lie to make your point, then you have NO point.””

Just reporting what I was told. Actually the guy did have numerous weapons and apparently a few were loaded (no kids, single guy, gun enthusiast). He was dumb enough to keep loaded weapons in the house. I do recall an episode of Mythbusters where they showed that a gun can shoot on its own in a fire.

It still points out to me the need for better understanding of how to store guns and ammo and the need for gun safes in homes that have a high number of guns.

moonbat betty

December 24th, 2012
1:15 pm

“Did you snitch me out?”

Nah, getalife, I know you are harmless.

I’m sure there are some others from the far left here that wouldn’t think twice though.

Joe Hussein Mama

December 24th, 2012
1:16 pm

R. W. Extreme — “You miss the point…..the ban didn’t stop an otherwise, at least as far as we know, law abiding citizen from obtaining a banned item.”

I didn’t miss your point, because your point hasn’t been *proven.* We don’t know, for example, that NBC News didn’t contact the District Police and *ask to borrow* that 30-round clip. You’re presuming that Gregory or someone else went out and bought (or otherwise obtained) that clip, but right now, we don’t really know the story behind that.

See, this is why Breitbart sucks. They leap to conclusions like that without actually doing any investigation.

“Do you really think the criminal element gives a rat’s rear end about gun laws?”

Not my point.

“Once you take guns away from law-abiding citizens only the criminals will have them.”

Not my point.

“On a side note, Gregory sends his kids to the same school Obama does. The school’s website notes there are 11 security guards present. Betcha they’re armed. And those are the ones we’re told about. With bammy’s kids being there you know Secret Service is there and they are armed.”

And this has what to do with LaPierre’s appearance on MTP yesterday?

“Seems the liberal elite like having their little ones in schools with armed security.”

Again, this has what to do with LaPierre’s appearance on MTP?

“Why can’t us working folks have the same level of protection for our kids, who are just as precious to us, as the liberal elite?”

I’d like to thank you for introducing a ludicrously high level of mud into the waters of the discussion.

RF

December 24th, 2012
1:17 pm

“Like I told Jay, it may help reduce some deaths which is good but will not stop the crazy shootings by crazy people!”

No, but if it save lives at all, it’s worth considering. Nobody thought tougher drunk driving laws or better safety in cars would help, but it has. I remember lots of flak about airbags, but they have been proven to work. Crazy people will be crazy, but if it’s harder for them to get a gun, then maybe we can keep a few of them from creating a massacre like this. What’s your solution? More guns and kevlar vests for every citizen venturing out in public?

Joe Hussein Mama

December 24th, 2012
1:18 pm

I’ve turned my staff loose, and now I’m out, too.

Everyone, drive safely and come back to see us after the holidays are over.

And don’t drink and drive. Find a sober person who can keep the shiny side up and the greasy side down, okay? :)

Peace out.

Real Scootter

December 24th, 2012
1:19 pm

they don’t really know how to respond, and so they’re desperately casting around for something they can use to defend themselves.

Agreed again JHM!!! But here is the deal JHM.His real message is “The NRA will not stand down and allow gun control legislation”.Can you imagine the flak he would take from that.Whew!!

Lynnie Gal

December 24th, 2012
1:19 pm

Military grade assault weapons and high capacity magazine clips should be banned for public sale. However, they were a hot sellers at the gun show in Cobb County this weekend, demanded by hoards of angry white conservative men who are paranoid that the guns might not be available for mass shootings very soon.

RF

December 24th, 2012
1:24 pm

Mr. Right: I think LaPierre’s an idiot, but not crazy. He’s a friggin’ CEO, so his bottom line is his paycheck. He’ll say anything he has to for his job and try his best to convince us to believe him. My opinion of him has nothing whatsoever to do with my belief that we need better training for gun owners and better standards for safety, sale, registering, and storage of guns. I don’t support bans except for large capacity clips and some of the higher powered rifles, but even that wouldn’t do much to stop the use of the millions out there already. Just trust that I will be doing my part to move the conversation about safety and responsibility forward. I don’t want your guns, but I do want to be safe from them by making sure they don’t get into the wrong hands. We can’t stop crazy people from being crazy, but we might be able to make it a LOT harder for them to be equipped with the arsenal they’re taking with them into the carnage.

BlahBlahBlah

December 24th, 2012
1:24 pm

I’d like to see the circumstances behind this tragedy before I automatically assume any government law would have stopped it.

moonbat betty

December 24th, 2012
1:29 pm

“I’d like to see the circumstances behind this tragedy before I automatically assume any government law would have stopped it.”

No kidding, it could have very well been a loaded .22 rifle inside the blaze.

But, lets go ahead and blame it on crazy white conservative males with their “machine guns” before anything is known…

Real Scootter

December 24th, 2012
1:30 pm

I swear I can’t see how y’all can blame these shootings on the NRA.

It’s like blaming the UAW for car wrecks! Whew!

Real Scootter

December 24th, 2012
1:33 pm

RF

December 24th, 2012
1:24 pm

Great post RF! And I agree.

marko

December 24th, 2012
1:33 pm

Wayne, I wouldn’t call you crazy, Stupid as hell perhaps. Using your logic we can’t control cancer because we don’t have enough cigarettes.

Fire fighters already have to carry sixty to a hundred pounds of gear into a fire. I’m sure they won’t mind adding guns and ammo.

I was just thinking of the little girl scouts out there selling cookies. What kind of heat should they be packing Mr. La Pierre?

getalife

December 24th, 2012
1:34 pm

The nra are just gun lobbyists.

I am not a fan of lobbyists bribing pols to get what they want but that is today’s American politics.

Don’t hate the players, hate the game.

Change the game.

BenDaho

December 24th, 2012
1:35 pm

This angry white male bought a nice 223 at the Cobb Gun Show. I’d like to go hunting with David Gregory….

Victor Midtown

December 24th, 2012
1:36 pm

By all means, ban assault weapons. But I want the anti-gun liberals to show as much interest in dealing with the gun wielding street culture in America. Four kids shoot dead a kid on the streets of downtown Wilimington. It isn’t only about the gun … It is also about a failed family structure and culture of violence. Our prisons are bulging hell holes but we have to lock these punks away forever.

Rafe Hollister

December 24th, 2012
1:37 pm

Well, maybe we should wait for some facts to come out, before rewriting the Constitution.

More than likely by Thursday, the facts will be in. After all, the process goes much much faster, when the facts fit the media’s liking, not like Benghazi, where we are about 100 days later and have no idea what happened and what decisions were made by whom. All we know is that mistakes were made, but no one in a position of responsibility made them.

DannyX

December 24th, 2012
1:38 pm

Merry Christmas.

Speaking of Jesus…

Would would Jesus pack?

CB

December 24th, 2012
1:39 pm

Simple solution here folks. There should be a assault weapon on every fire truck. I am sure my NRA buddies will agree with me.

getalife

December 24th, 2012
1:40 pm

rafe,

Your party would promote them.

Heads rolled because they were held accountable for their failures.

You should do the same with your party con.

Real Scootter

December 24th, 2012
1:41 pm

I was just thinking of the little girl scouts out there selling cookies. What kind of heat should they be packing Mr. La Pierre?

:roll:

DannyX

December 24th, 2012
1:43 pm

I think fire hoses should be able to shoot bullets. Fire trucks should have cannons.

Real Scootter

December 24th, 2012
1:44 pm

I am sure my NRA buddies will agree with me

No,we wouldn’t!

Real Scootter

December 24th, 2012
1:46 pm

Fire trucks should have cannons.

They do! Any other brilliant solutions?

moonbat betty

December 24th, 2012
1:54 pm

“They do! Any other brilliant solutions?”

Yeah, make everyone register their guns, and when they have a fire, don’t dispatch anyone to help them.

BenDaho

December 24th, 2012
1:56 pm

getalife

December 24th, 2012
1:34 pm
The nra are just gun lobbyists.

I am not a fan of lobbyists bribing pols to get what they want but that is today’s American politics.

Kinda like green energy companies getting government money from the Obama administration then going out of business?

getalife

December 24th, 2012
1:57 pm

The shooter is dead and it was a trap.

marko

December 24th, 2012
1:57 pm

http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/24/us/new-york-firefighters-shooting/index.html

Looks like the fire was set as a trap for the fire fighters. It seems the killer has been killed by the police, or perhaps he killed himself. it’s not clear at this point.

Jackie

December 24th, 2012
1:58 pm

Many still do not understand that there are no absolutes, even in nature.

Given this small fact, the 2nd Amendment of the US Constitution has no absolutes either.

Real Scootter

December 24th, 2012
1:59 pm

I said brilliant solutions moonbat! :lol:

nelson

December 24th, 2012
2:00 pm

These are times that try the integrty of humanity. As the most celebrated event is being heralded[Christmas] the unabated violence aganst the people continues. It is incredible that there are more and more of the populace that consider an armed citizenry, a safe citzenry. No country ever became more peaceful by becoming better armed. No individual becomes more peaceful by becomng more armed.

barking frog

December 24th, 2012
2:03 pm

There were no guns when Jesus was crucified or he might have
been shot.

Real Scootter

December 24th, 2012
2:03 pm

Given this small fact, the 2nd Amendment of the US Constitution has no absolutes either.

I agree Jackie and think Jay has come up with a reasonable suggestion.

CB

December 24th, 2012
2:07 pm

Yes Real Scootter every fireman should be trained and armed with a fire arm. How about a Police Officer riding shotgun with them if my first suggestion is not possible. I am sure Mr La Pierre would agree with me. After all they can”t fire back with their water hoses. That is a brilliant solution for you.

moonbat betty

December 24th, 2012
2:15 pm

CB, they should only allow squirt guns.

Squirt guns wouldn’t have a chance against those hoses…