The taxpayer, the Falcons and the question of priorities
As owner of the Atlanta Falcons, Arthur Blank runs a class operation that represents the city well. And as such arrangements go, the proposal to build a $1 billion Falcons stadium downtown with $300 million in taxpayer subsidies is reasonable and probably fiscally sound.
But still ….
The NFL is easily the most profitable sports league on the planet. All 32 of its teams are included in Forbes’ magazine’s list of the 50 most valuable sports franchises on the planet. (The Falcons are listed at 35th with a value of $831 million, up from $545 million when Blank bought the team in 2002.) And because live sports programming is becoming more and more valuable to advertisers, lucrative new contracts will bring more the league more than $6 billion a year in TV revenue beginning in 2014. That represents a 50 to 60 percent increase.
Now contrast that prosperity with the fiscal plight of state and local government. Thousands of workers have been laid off in Georgia, including police officers, firefighters and teachers. We tell ourselves that education is the key to prosperity, but in many cases we can’t afford to keep our kids in school for the once-standard 180 days a year. Our transportation infrastructure is inadequate to meet the demands placed upon it, yet any attempt to raise taxes to generate the necessary money is rejected.
Overall, we’re told, government can no longer do the things we want it to do; it must do only those things that we need it to do.
Given those realities, why should the Falcons demand that the public subsidize their new stadium, particularly when the publicly funded Georgia Dome continues to serve that purpose admirably?
The short answer is also the honest answer — because they can. They don’t really need the money, or even a new stadium for that matter, but in a sports-mad world they can get it. So why not? Everyone else is doing it. It’s a “bigger is better” league, from quarterbacks that go 6-5, 275 pounds to stadiums that charge fans a five-figure fee just for the right to later buy tickets. And in that hyper-competitive world, it is considered unacceptable for the Falcons to be condemned to play in the 20-year-old Georgia Dome, the 10th-oldest stadium in the league.
Under the proposed terms, the Georgia World Congress Center Authority would supply the land for a new stadium, plus contribute roughly a third of the construction cost. That public contribution would be raised through a 30-year extension of the hotel/motel tax. Proponents of the deal argue that because the hotel/motel tax is paid by visitors to Atlanta, rather than by residents of metro Atlanta, it is somehow less of a tax. However, it is also money that by a simple act of the Legislature could be diverted to purposes more crucial than subsidizing a quite profitable sports franchise.
Under the terms of the proposal, the Falcons “will retain revenue streams from the new stadium, including tickets, premium seating, food and beverage, sponsorships, naming rights and certain parking revenue.” That’s for all events at the stadium, not just Falcons games. In return, the Falcons will pay the state authority $2.5 million a year. For the sake of context, that’s about what the team pays an offensive lineman.
And again, in the universe of such deals, the Falcons could perhaps have demanded even better treatment.
Assessed from a purely practical point of view, such a deal is still hard to justify. But this is the world of sports, in which rationality and practicality are often bench players to irrationality and emotion. If any other line of work inflicted the concussions, the crippling injuries, the long-term brain damage and shortened lifespans of football, for example, it would have been legislated out of existence long ago.
Instead, we pack stadiums and find ourselves yelling at our TV sets, driven by the human thirst for pride, glory and rushes of adrenalin, even if they have to be experienced second-hand and subsidized with money that would be much better spent elsewhere.
– Jay Bookman
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702 comments Add your comment
Welcome to the Occupation
December 12th, 2012
10:15 am
New piece by Jonathan Chait confirming everything I’ve been saying about the BI-PARTISAN elite that is tyrannizing the people in this country.
Without realizing it, Politico reporters have hit on a brilliant depiction of Washington elite insularity:
The piece reads as if it were written by Upton Sinclair, if he were taken prisoner and trying to smuggle messages out to the world past a particularly literal-minded group of censors.
The subject of the piece is Allen and VandeHei’s report that broad agreement exists on the correct policy agenda, as revealed to them through “conversations we have had over the past three months with top lawmakers, officials, their senior aides and the CEOs who advise and lobby all of them.” The story proceeds to describe the obviously sensible agenda agreed upon by these sources: It is vital to reduce the deficit through tax reform and stingier entitlements, along with more free trade, resource extraction, and liberalized immigration. ….
What makes the consensus so astonishing, and even nauseating, is the degree to which those who share it show no awareness of their own insularity. Their shared sense of a smart economic growth strategy excludes any monetary or fiscal plan to bring down unemployment through higher consumer demand, a position that commands strong support among economists. Their list of ailments also excludes skyrocketing income inequality and out-of-control carbon emissions.
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2012/12/politico-accidentally-exposes-beltway-elite.html
Sounds like a ruling elite even ol’ Scout could get behind don’t it? Ooops, except lots of them have that pesky “Democrat” label by their names, which has Scout and other rubes shrieking socialism.
Doggone/GA
December 12th, 2012
10:16 am
“Benjamin Franklin defined democracy as two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch”
That’s not democracy, that’s anarchy
GT
December 12th, 2012
10:16 am
Depression babies kept it real because of their experiences of doing without. Doc in the box for minor medical would have never been dreamed of; these people went to doctors when they were really sick. The baby boomer generation kept the posters that pushed war bonds, kept the conservative lip service but lost in the translation conservative life style. Much of our problems today are produced by a generation of excess and not being truthful to ourselves of who we really are. We want to blame government or heathens or people “not like us” for our failures instead of our greed and personal spending habits that have among other things made us the fattest nation on earth. Our worship of celebrity plays right into this out of control private sector and the dangling of worthless pastimes which have no benefit to the recipe of our success, even diminishes it with very poor role models for the next generation is not where our forefathers were heading. This is our trip along to fools gold and values. Even our churches are on our journey as they become more like us than us. My father stopped to pull people out of burning buildings and wreaked cars today it is seen every day people turning their heads. But you put a semi celebrity into a crowd and the energy picks up as people are trying to be like Mike.
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
December 12th, 2012
10:17 am
UNCLE SAMANTHA @ 10:09
Thank you ……….. it’s funny how the libs. “tout” PURE democracy until the vote goes against them.
Then they really don’t like that system.
Our founding fathers didn’t either so they set up a system whereby the majority “will” of the people would always be tempered by representatives, a president and a Supreme Court.
Geez !
MANGLER
December 12th, 2012
10:17 am
The 4 proposed mega-developments around town (the Gulch/Underground, Doraville, Norcross, and Hapeville) would have been ideal locations to include a stadium, with highway and transit links already there or currently under construction). That would have been a better deal to say to Mr Blank and those developers that if they wan’t what they want, the respective cities/counties would allow it in conjunction with the stadium going in there, at their own expense of course. But then the people closet to the deal makers wouldn’t be making out like bandits.
Brosephus™
December 12th, 2012
10:17 am
DDR @ 9:51
Don’t forget about 12/21/2012…
————
Doggone
What has ever stopped people from making a public fool of themselves before on this blog? Reading a dictionary, won’t help when it’s already been demonstrated they don’t read posts here.
Seriously Folks
December 12th, 2012
10:17 am
@Morality? You DO realize that all the infrastructure you use “NORTH of downtown” was funded by the tax revenue OF downtown? Unless, of course, you live in a house that has the same value of any of the downtown buildings. SO, if by your logic, we should move everything “out of the ghetto” then prepare yourself for a HUGE tax increase to fund your suburban dream. Even Blank’s mansion is worth maybe the lobby of the Westin downtown….with that said, a new stadium is a JOKE. Just trying to show the importance of a strong, vibrant downtown!
Regnad Kcin
December 12th, 2012
10:18 am
“Benjamin Franklin defined democracy as two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch”
So, you’re saying that the purpose of a republic is to protect those who would otherwise be subjagated by those who are more powerful?
Doggone/GA
December 12th, 2012
10:19 am
“What has ever stopped people from making a public fool of themselves before on this blog? Reading a dictionary, won’t help when it’s already been demonstrated they don’t read posts here”
amen to that! but it’s lots of fun watching them try to defend their foolishness!
TaxPayer
December 12th, 2012
10:19 am
Has anyone broke the news to scout yet. Well allow me:
Obama Won,
GOP, Zero.
Now that’s what we call a winning score, a shutout.
Nero
December 12th, 2012
10:19 am
Just raise more taxes on the rich. They can afford it, and it’s only right to require more of their fair share. It’s the magic cure-all for everything according to you stooges. The rich won’t miss it and it gives the deserving middle class and poor some wonderful professional football to watch. Soak the rich some more. They owe us. They didn’t earn all that money they have. They’re unpatriotic and greedy.
Doggone/GA
December 12th, 2012
10:19 am
“So, you’re saying that the purpose of a republic is to protect those who would otherwise be subjagated by those who are more powerful”
Nope
Old Farmer
December 12th, 2012
10:20 am
I don’t like it. Are they going to use a Hotel/Motel tax? Let’s be honest, Atlanta is not the hottest attraction in the USA. If we raise our hotel taxes too much, we may lose the visitors and conventioneers that we do have.
Let the Falcons and the NFL figure out a way to fund it, or learn to be happy with the stadium they already have.
Call It Like It Is
December 12th, 2012
10:20 am
But, but, but Mr. Blank says we need it to be more competitive. Intresting how the Packers have played on the same field since 1957 and have 4 rings, and the 49’s have been in candlestick since the 70’s and they have 5 rings. I wonder how they did that without a shiny new dome?
Regnad Kcin
December 12th, 2012
10:21 am
“Nope”
Didn’t really think so.
Could you elucidate?
Dirty Dawg
December 12th, 2012
10:21 am
The Falcons are acting like Republicans in Congress with the, so-called, ‘debt ceiling’…they’re holding the City and State hostage by threatening to build a new stadium someplace other than Downtown Atlanta where the State has invested so much in the Georgia World Congress Center, Centennial Park – along with the Georgia Aquarium, World of Coke and next, the College Football Hall of Fame – they can’t let Blank and the NFL pull out and thus losing the ‘key’ facility…kinda like not allowing the Country ‘default’ on our debt…rich people run a ‘rigged game’…that’s why they’re rich.
JamVet
December 12th, 2012
10:24 am
oops using the r word is more than a little ironic, huh?
Here is his family’s web page…
http://tinyurl.com/7d7t6jy
Erwin's cat
December 12th, 2012
10:25 am
Think of it as a corporate tax since the lions share of hotel rates are paid for by corporations (ie business trips)….Go Falcons
USinUK - not very ladylike (and former Girl Scout)
December 12th, 2012
10:25 am
“it’s funny how the libs. “tout” PURE democracy until the vote goes against them.”
wow.
your posts really are nothing more than a$$ gravy.
seriously – you never cease to amaze me with the crap that you spew.
southern hope
December 12th, 2012
10:27 am
I’m actually in favor of the new stadium but I admit that this column/argument is very well presented. and it does give me pause towards continuing my support.
Brosephus™
December 12th, 2012
10:27 am
Thank you ……….. it’s funny how the libs. “tout” PURE democracy until the vote goes against them.
Then they really don’t like that system.
Kinda like how those libs have been whining since the first Tuesday in November, right? Oh wait… nevermind
USinUK - not very ladylike (and former Girl Scout)
December 12th, 2012
10:28 am
Bro – “Kinda like how those libs have been whining since the first Tuesday in November, right?”
exactly like that.
UNCLE SAMANTHA
December 12th, 2012
10:29 am
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
your welcome!
ChillyMutt
December 12th, 2012
10:29 am
On first review, I don’t like it one bit.
Doggone/GA
December 12th, 2012
10:30 am
“Could you elucidate?”
I already did. I refer you to the dictionary definitions I posted, and pay CLOSE attention to where the words “representatives” and “elected agents”(aka: representatives) occurs
GT
December 12th, 2012
10:31 am
Nero the idea of the rich paying their fair share is to get their heads in the game not to even up the economy as such. The rich right now have about as much interest in our country as an Englishman, they don’t fight, don’t pay taxes; really have a very small wager on our success. We are in a system that promotes nepotism and in kind promotes advantages to the rich which has run over to our celebrity worship. If we are all part of the sinking ship you will see American ingenuity, as it is now the rich jump off and the middle and poor are locked below so the boat just sinks.
Woody
December 12th, 2012
10:32 am
Professional Football is warfare among autonomous city-states, pursued by other means. Unless you want to be mired in an actual shooting war with, say, New Orleans, and have our city bombed to the ground by jets sporting the fleur-de-lis, better cough up the bucks. It’s in our own defense,
UNCLE SAMANTHA
December 12th, 2012
10:32 am
Regnad Kcin
December 12th, 2012
10:18 am
“Benjamin Franklin defined democracy as two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch”
So, you’re saying that the purpose of a republic is to protect those who would otherwise be subjagated by those who are more powerful?
=====================================================================
if you want to really blow a liberal mind ask them HOW THE CIVIL RIGHTS ACT passed in this country…………………. and why it wasn’t a NATIONAL REFERENDUM to be voted by all voters in the U.S. in a country that was clearly biggoted!
it wasn’t democracy
Brosephus™
December 12th, 2012
10:33 am
your posts really are nothing more than a$$ gravy.
Thanks for that one. Now people in the service center here are looking at me like I am nuts for laughing out loud!!! I’m glad that I didn’t lose that mouthful of coffee.
Regnad Kcin
December 12th, 2012
10:33 am
“I already did. I refer you to the dictionary definitions I posted, and pay CLOSE attention to where the words “representatives” and “elected agents”(aka: representatives) occurs”
I got that, and I think we agree – I’ve been referring to the “Franklin” quote, about sheep and wolves, and wondering what meaning we are to take from it.
Welcome to the Occupation
December 12th, 2012
10:33 am
Nero: “Soak the rich some more. They owe us. They didn’t earn all that money they have. They’re unpatriotic and greedy”
You know sometimes the truth speaks even through the mouths of trolls.
Nero
December 12th, 2012
10:34 am
Just raise taxes and build the damn stadium! Else the masses may actually start paying attention to important things. Soak the rich. They can afford it. It’s for the good of the majority. The 2% are so greedy. If they won’t voluntarily give their fair share, then take it from the unpatriotic jerks!
DannyX
December 12th, 2012
10:35 am
“Oh wait… nevermind”
Never mind? Why? Oh that’s right, it’s the Republicans that are throwing the tantrum, like the 43% of “patriotic” Georgia Republicans who now want to secede because their guy lost.
USinUK - not very ladylike (and former Girl Scout)
December 12th, 2012
10:35 am
Brocephus – this and the whining baby (which begs the question … where IS Donovan?) … I’m on a roll this week!
Erwin's cat
December 12th, 2012
10:36 am
in 2006 Blank renovated the GA Dome to tune the of $300M out of HIS pocket to the benefit of a dome owned by the city…what a greedy rich b@astard…
Doggone/GA
December 12th, 2012
10:37 am
“I got that, and I think we agree – I’ve been referring to the “Franklin” quote, about sheep and wolves, and wondering what meaning we are to take from it.”
Franklin was talking about a “pure” democracy…where the ONLY thing that matters is what the majority wants. That’s why *I* called it anarchy. We don’t have a “pure” democracy, we have a regulated democracy where protection of the minority is enshrined in our founding documents.
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
December 12th, 2012
10:37 am
INCORRECT : “I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the DEMOCRACY for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.”
CORRECT: “I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the REPUBLIC for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.”
Brosephus™
December 12th, 2012
10:38 am
I’ve been referring to the “Franklin” quote, about sheep and wolves, and wondering what meaning we are to take from it.
The thing we should take from that is our founders were wise enough to know their stations in life. Webster focused on the dictionaries, and Franklin stuck with almanacs.
Regnad Kcin
December 12th, 2012
10:39 am
“When I use a word, it means exactly what I mean it to mean, no more and no less ” – H. Dumpty
Doggone/GA
December 12th, 2012
10:40 am
“to the REPUBLIC ”
Quite right. We have a Republic, a democratic republic…as opposed to, say, a communist republic or an Islamic republic…or a Budhist republic.
Nero
December 12th, 2012
10:40 am
Coming from dirty wannabe hippies who drop deuces on police cars and steal from churches who open their doors to you, I’ll take that as a compliment.
chuck
December 12th, 2012
10:42 am
So let me get this straight. the old stadium cost 210 to build. The new one 1 Billion..The Falcons make 233 million per year. Maybe they should move the planning out a few years and save the old “conservative” way. They also propose to keeping all revenue in the BUILDING! and we get back 2.5 million per year. We wouldn’t see our return in over 100 years!. They are smart they Them work it out. Build a few schools or something.
Brosephus™
December 12th, 2012
10:42 am
USinner
You do realize that you’re my #1 redhead, and that baby video is just another of the many ways that you ROCK!!!!!
USinUK - not very ladylike (and former Girl Scout)
December 12th, 2012
10:43 am
Brocephus – right back at ya, babbee!!! (well, except for the red hair)
Regnad Kcin
December 12th, 2012
10:44 am
“The thing we should take from that is our founders were wise enough to know their stations in life. Webster focused on the dictionaries, and Franklin stuck with almanacs”
Thanks, Bro – that works.
Curtis Rivers
December 12th, 2012
10:44 am
Priorities reflect a society’s true values. While we cut services, diminish education, continue to scream that taxes are bad, we push a football stadium and $300 million in public debt. That makes our state and our society look petty, and it is. Mr. Blank should secure the funding elsewhere…after all, football is lucrative, and this additional debt could finance a lot of needed teachers, first responders, etc.
Erwin's cat
December 12th, 2012
10:45 am
chuck – We wouldn’t see our return in over 100 years!>/i>
BS…you’ll have no investment in it in the first place…thank a tourist
Mark in mid-town
December 12th, 2012
10:45 am
This is a good deal for Atlanta. 300 million dollars in tax revenue go to create a new state-of-the-art 1 billion dollar business generating asset. A one billion dollar asset that will create thousands of temporary jobs (and if done right) will attract lots of future investment as well. The potential payoff to taxpayers is far greater than the cost. As for why Blank should not pay the entire price — well, lots of other businesses benefit indirectly from the Falcons. The Georgia Dome, while a perfectly decent venue, does absolutely nothing for the aethetics of down-town. If the new facility is done right, it can be a magnet for more modern development in the area south of MLK (if that’s location chosen for venue). Let’s also remember that money doesn’t just get spent once. The same money cyles through the economy over and over again. The government ccontribution to the new Falcons venue does not necessarily mean that this money won’t be available for other needs. Once that same money gets cycled through again and again, plenty of it could end up funding these other needs.
DannyX
December 12th, 2012
10:47 am
I like the Cobb County stadium location idea! It may take two hours to park and three hours to get home but so what. The traffic jams would be worse than the Atlanta Speedway traffic but traffic jams are fun.
To fund the new stadium they can start a motel bed tax in Cobb. It will generate about $50,000 a year which will leave the public part of the cost of the new stadium about $299 million short. They will probably need a drive-thru window tax in Cobb County to supplement the motel tax, that should do it.
Can’t wait for the Cobb McRibs to start playing football in 2017!
JamVet
December 12th, 2012
10:47 am
I love Nero – he is the lib’s new secret weapon in decimating the GOP.
The boy is the Fox News AND Rush Limbaugh of AJC blogs.
Better luck in 2024, Nero…
Regnad Kcin
December 12th, 2012
10:48 am
“you’ll have no investment in it in the first place…thank a tourist”
I’d rather thank a tourist for educated young adults, paved roads, clean water, police protection, etc.
Finn de Siècle (The System isn't Broken; It's Fixed)
December 12th, 2012
10:49 am
off topic, sorry:
more on the Hostess debacle (debacle to the workers, not senior mgmt):
On August 12 of 2011, the employees got a letter that said that the company was going to “temporarily suspend payments” to its pension funds. That would be the $3 per hour that this worker had negotiated as part of his compensation – instead of paying it to him by putting it into his pension fund now, the company said they were going to put it in later.
As the letter said, “I want to be clear that this temporary suspension of payments to the pension fund will not affect your pension benefits.” Workers believed management, and kept on working.
But, it turned out, as we learned from that interview in today’s Wall Street Journal, that the senior management wasn’t just “borrowing” the pension funds – they were using them to fund ongoing operations. Including big paychecks to the fatcats.
http://www.alternet.org/corporate-accountability-and-workplace/twinkie-ceo-admits-company-took-employees-pensions-and-put-it
Brosephus™
December 12th, 2012
10:49 am
USinner
The beard skipped red. It’s going from black to white now. I’ve always had a thing for redheads though. I was near drooling when I met the actress that plays Phyllis on The Young and the Restless. I could be her bodyguard anytime.
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
December 12th, 2012
10:50 am
Doggone:
Finally you got it !
“Quite right. We have a Republic, a democratic republic ……….. ”
Yes ……. a Republic and even a democratic one ………. but not a pure democracy !
“A republic and a democracy are identical in every aspect except one. In a republic the sovereignty is in each individual person. In a democracy the sovereignty is in the group.”
And thus the major philosophical difference between conservaitves and liberals !
Mr Right
December 12th, 2012
10:50 am
Given those realities, why should the Falcons demand that the public subsidize their new stadium, particularly when the publicly funded Georgia Dome continues to serve that purpose admirably?
They shouldn’t!
ATL Born and Raised
December 12th, 2012
10:50 am
@Erwin
The taxes on that room were about $100. Now imagine you’re a company booking a whole block of rooms at a hotel for a convention. Those taxes sure as hell add up.
Erwin's cat
December 12th, 2012
10:51 am
Mark in Midtown
It’s not if it makes sense or whether it will be an economic engine and will fuel jobs
It’s just that a rich guy is involved…and we all know he didn’t earn any of that money in the first place and is just a greedy rich CEO type
Thomas Heyward Jr
December 12th, 2012
10:51 am
Hark!!!!!
When the Polis State hires multitudes of worms that worship Ocnus, sent out to harrass ye and hold up peaceful progress.
When the State-paid chatterers bow down to Pythonus.
And the State-paid exterior wars 70 hectars away compete with the State-paid Colesium wars ……..are conducted upon the weary backs of Decent working people,
then ye shall surely know…………….that Moros is upon ye ‘re society.
One day …………the culled ,fleeced animals of the state will stare at the ruins of this colisium and wander what went wrong.The crack of the whip of the State will answer.
.
Alexium Jonesiruim 400 A.D.
Erwin's cat
December 12th, 2012
10:53 am
Those taxes sure as hell add up.
and yet people still pay them…of that 100 how much of it was for the dome?
Morality?
December 12th, 2012
10:53 am
Bird Bird Bird is the Word Bird Bird Bird Bird is the Word……. there was a time when the Falcons were a disgrace and humiliation to birds every where and the bird community was highly offended that this team was named the Falcons.
Joe Hussein Mama
December 12th, 2012
10:54 am
E. Cat — “It’s not if it makes sense or whether it will be an economic engine and will fuel jobs”
So if the new stadium isn’t built, then none of those putative future jobs will happen? Is that what you’re saying?
Huh. Guess they *didn’t* build that by themselves. Looks like you and Mark are admitting that they’ll *need* government funding to build the stadium so that ‘entrepreneurs’ can come in, build businesses and then slap themselves on the back for having done it all on their own.
ZOMG SOSHULIZUM
JamVet
December 12th, 2012
10:54 am
In a republic the sovereignty is in each individual person.
In a democracy the sovereignty is in the group.
In the GOP the sovereignty is in corporations.
USinUK - not very ladylike (and former Girl Scout)
December 12th, 2012
10:56 am
“more on the Hostess debacle (debacle to the workers, not senior mgmt):”
but you’ll still get a chorus of “the unions killed Twinkie”
oy to the stupid.
Morality?
December 12th, 2012
10:59 am
Just keep raising the motel/hotel taxes….. they are absurdly high NOW. Tourists can go somewhere else you know. Never been to an NFL game but love to watch on T V where they don’t charge a motel tax. Of course the NFL channel is an experiment with the idea to eliminate the NFL on the basic channels and force you to pay extra to see them – like HBO/Showtime.
larry
December 12th, 2012
11:00 am
Let’s ask Los Angeles about not having a football team and all of this stadium fuss…..
They’ll probably ask, whats football………….. oh yeah, that sport they play in college.
Funny, Georgia has been in Sanford Stadium since 1929 and GT has been in Grant Field since……….
I dont know
They seem to be doing well.
SPC
December 12th, 2012
11:02 am
If the stadium is a good idea, it doesn’t need to be subsidized.
stands for decibels
December 12th, 2012
11:02 am
Just keep raising the motel/hotel taxes….. they are absurdly high NOW.
Just in case anyone is foolish enough to EVER trust something that gets posted here by “Morality?”–
The ATL room tax is 13%. That’s pretty run-of-the-mill, apparently:
[from 2008]
http://www.hospitalitynet.org/news/4036511.html
Room taxes average 12.62 percent, about $12.39 per night nationwide, in addition to the average room rate of about $94.69 for 2008. The national average of these combined bed taxes is up from an average of 12.4 percent in 2003
Morality?
December 12th, 2012
11:03 am
There are plenty of corporations that vote and support Obama. Bill Gates and many others. Corporations aren’t Repub or Dems and support whoever supports them – it’s that simple.
larry
December 12th, 2012
11:03 am
We need to concentrate on education and transportation ………. those issues that bring jobs to this state………
The Georgia Dome is just fine.
Besides, Nathan said the state’s expenses are in a dire straits right now. So we can’t afford it.
Nero
December 12th, 2012
11:04 am
I love JamVet. She’s a hoot!! Keep celebrating. You Dems always overreach. It’s in your DNA. Decimating the GOP…BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!! Kinda like the Dems in ‘94 huh? Pride goeth before the fall Jammie. You keep crowing. The pendulum always swings back.
Joe Hussein Mama
December 12th, 2012
11:04 am
“Morality” — “There are plenty of corporations that vote”
Do tell.
Peter
December 12th, 2012
11:05 am
Well why is the New Orleans Super Dome not out dated ?
Why is education not as big a priority ?
larry
December 12th, 2012
11:06 am
I said back in ‘97 that they should keep Fulton County Stadium up, because they will be wanting an open air stadium in the future. Plus , it was a historic building.
They could have put a retractable roof on it and waaaaaaala, we have our stadium.
JamVet
December 12th, 2012
11:06 am
There are plenty of corporations that vote and support Obama.
Really?! I never knew that!
Newsflash! The sun will set in the west this evening!
Welcome to the Occupation
December 12th, 2012
11:07 am
Curtis Rivers: ” Mr. Blank should secure the funding elsewhere…after all, football is lucrative”
Ah but that’s not the way a kleptocratic oligarchy works. In such a system, which has now consolidated its hold on virtually every aspect of our society, the more privilege and wealth an entity or individual enjoys the more wealth and privilege he can demand, and get, in the future.
larry
December 12th, 2012
11:08 am
Why is education not as big a priority ?
Lets ask Nathan.
Nathan, ole Nathan………………………NATHAN!!!
Dang it he wont answer.
Welcome to the Occupation
December 12th, 2012
11:09 am
Erwin’s cat: “a rich guy is involved…and we all know he didn’t earn any of that money in the first place and is just a greedy rich CEO type..”
Yep, you’ve just about got it.
So, what of it?
rivercard
December 12th, 2012
11:11 am
Mark- Any tangible numbers on how this is a good deal for Atlanta? It is not just the 300 million for the stadium , but another 200 million for surrounding infrastructure and potential unnamed costs for land purchases. We have had Super Bowls, Final Fours, etc. and downtown is basically the same place it always was. Is this new stadium really going to attract any game changing business that we aren’t already getting?
Lots of other benefits do benefit from Falcons and I am sure they pay non subsidized rent , mortgages, etc.
The Georgia Dome is way down the list of aesthetic issues in downtown Atlanta.
The new dome is not physically that far from the old dome. Bigger pipe dream than the putt putt by Turner field, to believe this will create any significant new development.
Some of the money may stay in the local economy and some won’t but if it was spent on something more useful to the general population this would still be the case and that tax is potential money that could have gone into the pockets of local businesses.
Seems like priorities out of whack to me. No reason an entity with the financial strength of NFL shouldn’t be funding their own workplaces. Freeloading – plain and simple.
Shine
December 12th, 2012
11:12 am
Horsepoop…there is no justification for helping “helpless deadbeats” build a new stadium.
Erwin's cat
December 12th, 2012
11:12 am
So if the new stadium isn’t built, then none of those putative future jobs will happen? Is that what you’re saying?
No
Huh. Guess they *didn’t* build that by themselves. Looks like you and Mark are admitting that they’ll *need* government funding to build the stadium so that ‘entrepreneurs’ can come in, build businesses and then slap themselves on the back for having done it all on their own.
and No
Brosephus™
December 12th, 2012
11:13 am
Let’s also remember that money doesn’t just get spent once. The same money cyles through the economy over and over again.
Interesting argument. Funny how that same line of thinking is rejected whenever it’s applied to other forms of subsidized government spending.
GT
December 12th, 2012
11:13 am
UNCLE SAMANTHA so you don’t support civil rights? What are you afraid of, like integrated baseball players, if given a level playing field you can’t compete? Probably not but no one gave you anything all you have you earned, you just won the medal playing your own rules, justice is not an entitlement to anyone but you.
GT
December 12th, 2012
11:18 am
My bad you do support civil rights, good for you. The country is better off playing a full deck even if it put some of us back in the bush leagues where we belong, it makes the team better.
Alex
December 12th, 2012
11:19 am
Stupid sport, stupid fans, free society…”you can’t fix stupid”
USinUK - not very ladylike (and former Girl Scout)
December 12th, 2012
11:22 am
““Morality” — “There are plenty of corporations that vote””
did they show their drivers license??
JamVet
December 12th, 2012
11:26 am
The pendulum always swings back.
Riiiiight!
As Flip Romney, Alan West, Joe Walsh, Todd Akin, Richard Mourdoch and George Allen all say hi from the unemployment line.
You boobs actually think there is some immutable “pendulum” law. It belongs in the pantheon of great Republican intellectual thinking along side global cooling and intelligent design.
If you had stayed awake during high school, you would know that you Republicans once went FORTY YEARS as the minority party in the US Congress. You boys can put up losing streaks that would make Northwestern’s football teams envious.
You neocons are going the way of the dodo bird.
I’m just doing my part to help…
Erwin's cat
December 12th, 2012
11:31 am
Welcome – So, what of it?
He was able to, and did donate $300M of HIS money to renovate a city facility in 2006…the greedy rich thug
Nero
December 12th, 2012
11:31 am
Pantheon…HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! Good thing JellyVet has his Roget’s handy. Oh God!! Thank man! I haven’t laughed that hard in a while. Hilarious!!
JamVet
December 12th, 2012
11:33 am
Morality is a people, my friends.
One of the recent great lines about the latest GOP loser…
Essentially, Mitt Romney is a corporation running for president masquerading as an individual. ~Ralph Nader
Nero
December 12th, 2012
11:34 am
Ralph Nader…BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!
Alex
December 12th, 2012
11:34 am
@ Jamvet, yes you’re doing your part to push the pendulum back and that will occur faster IF the Dems overreach like the Gingrich repubs did
godless heathen - fiscal cliff dweller
December 12th, 2012
11:36 am
I don’t care where the Falcons play or how much it costs, as long as they mop the floor of the place with the New Orleans Saints once a year.
stands for decibels
December 12th, 2012
11:36 am
did they show their drivers license??
Shouldn’t we pass some legislation to prevent corporate voter fraud? Just in case? You can’t prove it doesn’t happen, after all.
Doggone/GA
December 12th, 2012
11:36 am
““A republic and a democracy are identical in every aspect except one. In a republic the sovereignty is in each individual person. In a democracy the sovereignty is in the group.”
And thus the major philosophical difference between conservaitves and liberals !”
Except that first paragraph is wrong. In a democracy the sovereignty is in the individual. It doesn’t matter what type of government is used, it’s still a democracy
Wilbur
December 12th, 2012
11:37 am
This train is being driven by the city of Atlanta not by the state. If we say no( which would be great with me) the city will whine about not being supported by the state. Maybe we can be treated to another dishonest diatribe about racism in Georgia. I don’t care anymore. I will make it clear to my representatives that I would want want one cent of my money going to fund a new stadium for the Falcons or any other such venture.
There are two questions.
First is this kind of guarantee a wise and legitimate function of government. I say no!
Second, can we afford it? Obviously not!
Bonus round:
Do you trust the people who are crafting this deal? O dang no!
Patricia
December 12th, 2012
11:37 am
Typo in the second paragraph.
Erwin's cat
December 12th, 2012
11:38 am
larry – Funny, Georgia has been in Sanford Stadium since 1929 and GT has been in Grant Field since……….
I dont know
They seem to be doing well.
and how many Super bowls, final fours, and other events did they host for the financial benefit of Atlanta?
getalife
December 12th, 2012
11:39 am
Saints 1
Falcons 1.
Nero
December 12th, 2012
11:39 am
@Patricia…LOL!!!!
Joe Hussein Mama
December 12th, 2012
11:40 am
E. Cat — “No”
In which case, let them build it on their own, if those putative future jobs won’t be affected.
“and No”
Once again, then let them build it on their own.