It’s time for GOP to accept reality of ObamaCare

TO ALL READERS:

Good Morning and Happy Thanksgiving Eve to all. Just a few words from me today.

Yesterday, was a very unpleasant one for me on the blog, especially after I posted a piece based on Paul Krugman’s assessment that Republicans had raised the deficit deliberately to have entitlements cut. I knew I would get some reaction because this is the heart of the South afterall (and the land of denial on many issues), but the reaction I received was inappropriately intense. I did not read some of the initial remarks to me until late last evening. So I will respond now.

Alex had posted that I needed to read more books in order to be able to post on this blog. What I want him, and all, to know is that I have been a reader all my life. My personal library contains thousands of books. I was educated at New York University and City College of New York, as an English major, and I hold a double major in Theatre. I hold a Masters Degree from Georgia State University as a Reading Specialist. I am constantly reading. Presently, I am reading two books, one about George Washington (excerpts of which I have shared on this blog) and the other about Thomas Jeffferson by Jon Meacham, which has just been released. Having read many of Alex’s posts, it is my opinion that he would broaden his thinking beyond the stereotypical, if he were to read more books outside of the narrow range that he prefers, and certainly books published before 1992, which might give him more of a historical perspective.

In terms of the topic on which I posted yesterday about the deficit, I have read extensively enough to know that what Paul Krugman states, in that regard, is truth. It is truth that I am after, not balance, as some others might prefer. And, I particularly want truth exposed in the land of the South, which often is content to live out a surface reality based on lies. I have known the South intimately for 70 years so I know this to be true. I have read and have studied extensively enough to know that in the mid to late 1970s, a group of libertarian conservatives formed ALEC, and that David and Charles Koch have been major contributors to this organization’s stealthy purposes, as well as to think tanks, such as the Cato Institute, which have perpetuated their ideas and power to turn our nation into a nation in which government is viewed as the enemy of its people and has little impact in citizen’s lives. Their out-of-balance agenda found defeat, fortunately, in this past presidential election in spite of billions spent to continue to perpetuate that ideology. The defeat of that agenda happened only because many people started exposing this Republican ideological plan that had been stealthily hidden for decades. Jane Mayer’s New Yorker magazine article of August 30, 2010, entitled, “Covert Operations: The billionaire brothers who are waging a war against Obama,” was a primary means of that exposure. Voices such as mine are another, even if our circles of influence are much, much smaller than of Ms. Mayer. It is citizens such as I, who refuse to be silent, throughout our nation, who will keep our democracy alive, in a real way, within our democratic republic.

I plan to keep posting and keep quoting Paul Krugman because, knowing Georgia as well as I do, this is precisely the place where my thoughts and my links are most needed to be communicated.
In many ways, Georgia remains the “Closed Society,” as it was named in my youth.

———————————————————————————————————–

• Link
• Report this comment

Freedom! Lucky Georgians will have the freedom to die without access to decent health care! Health care is a luxury you must earn, unless you work for Papa John’s …
Ha!

• Link
• Report this comment

It comes down to where Nathan Deal and his GOPers’ loyalties are–to their discredited, doomed ideology, or to the people of the state. If it’s the latter, they will see to it that Medicaid is expanded. If it is the former, then we the people have to boot them out of office at the next opportunity, and ignore the wailing of those who claim otherwise.

• Link
• Report this comment

Yes indeed. It is time to suck it, losers!

• Link
• Report this comment

The GOP will become obsolete if it continues its small-minded obstructionism — and America will never be great again if the GOP controls the gov’t with their small-minded policies!

• Link
• Report this comment

The majority of Americans did NOT vote for Barry Soetero.
.
And we will not stand-by and let a bunch of Chicago thugs/klepto/sociopathes screw up our medical care ..even more than Washington has already done.
.
There’s secesh fever in the air.
And it’s spreading.
.
Forward Freedom!

• Link
• Report this comment

sink

Check that:

When obamacare saves your life or someone in your families life, I expect a mea culpa…

• Link
• Report this comment

The majority of Americans did NOT vote for Barry Soetero.

I don’t know of any state that had a Barry Soetero on the ballot, so it’s pretty safe to say that NO Americans voted for Barry Soetero, Capt. Obvious. Seems like you picked the wrong day to quit sniffing glue…

• Link
• Report this comment

TH Jr … tell us more about how denying reality is the path to success.

• Link
• Report this comment

But seriously. Annoy Nathan Deal about expanding Medicaid. Call him a fiscal moron if he doesn’t. He might respond to that.

(Mrs. sfd and I have have already started, we will continue.)

• Link
• Report this comment

Do you actually believe the government can build and implement the infrastructure to get this off the ground in time for open enrollment THIS October? Really? Pure fantasy.

Well, given GOP intransigence over the whole healthcare issue, we don’t have any other option. If the GOP leaders had any common damned sense, they had more than enough time after the initial vote on the ACA to construct and implement their own “free market based” healthcare alternative to cut the ACA off at the knees. Instead, we had the GOP version of the Benny Hill chase scene trying to foil Obama and the Dems.

• Link
• Report this comment

Governor Deal had a choice. He could accept Obamacare and do everything in his power to help all Georgia citizens to have adequate health care. Or, he could pander to the worst of his Party, look at Democrats and say “he’s your president, not mine”, and ignore the pain and suffering of Georgia’s uninsured and under-insured.

Needless to say, very few in the State of Georgia, either Democrats or Republicans, are surprised at this base and banal behavior.

• Link
• Report this comment

Mary Elizabeth, I know you find the online incivility distasteful and I can get behind that, but I fear you’re like the guy with the pitchfork at the beach trying to keep the keep the crap at bay, after some cruise ship’s septic tank has sprung a massive leak. You might make an impressive show but I don’t think it’ll work.

• Link
• Report this comment

Jay, you miss two significant points.

Governors are refusing to setup state run exchanges to push Congress to address the entirety of Obamacare. The bill provided zero funding for the federal run exchange. There will be debate on funding the exchange and the entirety of Obamacare since it already is costing much more than promised.

And please do tell us all just from where those Federal dollars will come from? Will Obama print them in the basement of the White House or will he pull them from his rear? You write like the true Liberal you are ignoring the Federal Government produces nothing and can only give when it has taken from another.

• Link
• Report this comment

Do any of you have experience dealing with the federally run Medicare program? How about the state run Medicaid program? It is an absolute nightmare and it will only get worse. The government does such a good job of running these programs (dripping sarcasm).

Healthcare needs to be reformed. What we got instead is health insurance reform. They are much different subjects. I’m not against healthcare reform, but, the ACA misses the mark in so many ways.

• Link
• Report this comment

<i.Deal would be denying health insurance coverage to some 600,000 Georgia citizens just to make a partisan political point. It also means turning away billions of federal dollars — an estimated $14.5 billion over the first six years — that would flow into the state’s health-care delivery system. That’s a benefit of particular importance to rural Georgia, where the health-care infrastructure is skeletal at best because so many residents are uninsured and have few resources from which to pay medical bills

Perhaps if it include some money for landfills Deal might look out for Georgians?

• Link
• Report this comment

““Freedom,” Sinkwich?

Please explain, in concrete terms.”

Jay, once a state accepts the terms of expansion, it becomes a serf subject to the whim of federal nanny state bureaucrats.

Even though the majority of this country disagrees, free stuff ain’t free.

• Link
• Report this comment

GOP and reality in the same sentence.

What a concept.

There is a silver lining to this.

The more the GOP governors abdicate their responsibility in this to the federal government, the bigger the pool of insured will be, the more competitive the costs…..and the closer we get to a true public option.

Medicare for all!

Thanks Mr. Deal for bringing it closer.

• Link
• Report this comment

I really am starting to feel more and more like Paul Krugman every day. Really getting tired of this.

• Link
• Report this comment

” it becomes a serf subject to the whim of federal nanny state bureaucrats.”

Mr. Sinkwich, what does ^^^that^^^ mean, when it makes sense?

• Link
• Report this comment

Do any of you have experience dealing with the federally run Medicare program? How about the state run Medicaid program? It is an absolute nightmare and it will only get worse. The government does such a good job of running these programs (dripping sarcasm).

Ask the same about TriCare and see what responses you get. As to your statement on health insurance reform vs healthcare reform, I completely agree with you. I don’t like the ACA as I think it does nothing to help in the areas we really needed help. That said, the GOP would much better serve America by producing a viable alternative instead of simply doing their impression of a stubborn jackass. That impression helps America even less than the ACA does.

• Link
• Report this comment

accept reality?

LOL

Now, that’s funny!

• Link
• Report this comment

sfd … that’s hilarious! Science and reason kick ass!

• Link
• Report this comment

stands for decibels….you need to go back and retake econ 101.

• Link
• Report this comment

Memo To: White House

Subject: Obamacare

Dear Barry,

Eff U.

Sincerely,

Governors Who Love America

• Link
• Report this comment

It is time for Nathan Deal to be gone…This state should be smart enough not reelect him. Can anyone name 5 things things that he has done to make Georgia a better state?

Five things that he has gotten wrong
.
1. authorizing large revenue generating areas to form their own cities. (where will those new Charter Schools be built?)
2. changed the rules for the HOPE scholarship
3. cut deeply into the amount of funds for local governments education funding
4. created immigration laws that are one of the harsh in the U.S.
5. created an amendment (trick) for a state run Charter School Commission

• Link
• Report this comment

I see many here are sill basking in the artifical misunderstood glow of the Obama win. Here it is once again.

Obama won 26 states and DC (you don’t mean it) and gathered less than 51% of the popular vote.

That is not a mandate. It’s a big Electoral College win.

There is no huge overwhelming majority behind Obama. We are a country divided almost in half as to idiology.

The idea that Republican will just roll over and accept every kookie policy the Left puts forward is nothing short of la-la land.

• Link
• Report this comment

Will be there 2 lines at the gubmint doctors offices? One for Freeloaders and one for Producers?

• Link
• Report this comment

“Oh, no strings attached to accepting all that “free” federal money, Jay? Is that what you’re saying?”

Like the half billion dollars in Race To The Top education funds?

• Link
• Report this comment

Brosephus™

November 21st, 2012
8:42 am

Ask the same about TriCare and see what responses you get. As to your statement on health insurance reform vs healthcare reform, I completely agree with you. I don’t like the ACA as I think it does nothing to help in the areas we really needed help. That said, the GOP would much better serve America by producing a viable alternative instead of simply doing their impression of a stubborn jackass. That impression helps America even less than the ACA does.

I have experience with Tricare as well. A very good example. The COST of healthcare is the issue, not the lack of insurance. People without insurance get treated every day. Yes, there are heart-breaking stories of people dying that were not offered life saving treatment because they were uninsured. But, the point is, when you need a cerified coder along with an administrative staff of 4 just to bill and collect for 5 providers, we’ve added a costly layer to the COST of healthcare. When hospital administrators are paid $+1 million a year…2 and 3 time more than physicians are paid. When you walk into a hospital lavished with italian marble and water fountains, you’ve added to the COST of healthcare. When needed drugs COST hundreds per month…

I could go on and on. The fact is the ACA does little if anything to address the COST of healthcare.

• Link
• Report this comment

explain to me how raising taxes on the RICH is going to create any more jobs?

the teeny tiny tax hike being proposed is a small corrective measure that will make a teeny tiny change to the ongoing upward distribution of wealth.

What will create more jobs is more federal spending.

got that? good.

• Link
• Report this comment

Jay:

However, the larger and by far more consequential question involves Georgia’s participation in an expanded Medicaid program offered through ObamaCare beginning in 2014. If Georgia ultimately decides to take part, Medicaid coverage would be extended to an additional 600,000 lower-income Georgians. (For a family of four, households with an income of roughly $32,000 and below would be eligible for coverage.) Those Georgians would get covered at very little cost to state taxpayers.

Under ObamaCare, from 2014 to 2016 the federal government will pay 100 percent of the costs for insuring those additional Georgians. In later years, the share covered by the federal government will drop slightly — Uncle Sam will cover 95 percent of the cost in 2017, 94 percent in 2018, 93 percent in 2019 and then 90 percent from 2020 on out. (For comparison’s sake, Georgia pays a little over a third of the cost for current Medicaid recipients.)”

Jay, your statement here is misleading. You say it won’t effect state taxpayers. Jay, whether or not it’s coming from my state income taxes or my federal income taxes, the bills still have to get paid. Talk about fuzzy math my liberal friend.

Anyone who thinks adding 600,000 low income people to Medicaid isn’t going to run up huge deficeits is living in la la land. And I thought liberals were supposed to be all into science and math.

“

• Link
• Report this comment

by the way, my family actually has experienced healthcare via a Medicaid provider. (It was an admittedly very short period of time, when we were foster parents.)

We didn’t get cooties or anything. Actually, the pediatric doc was great.

So, you don’t necessarily have to be all skeered of that.

• Link
• Report this comment

If only Obama and the Democrats had focused on jobs his first 2 years…..

• Link
• Report this comment

Deal says it’s not finanacially plausible, you say it is. Show us some cost numbers, projected 3-5 years.

I think a big challenge will be to find doctors to see this medicaid population, we will need plenty of NP’s and PA’s as this population will not be absorbed by physicians as the payment is too low and the patients are frequently non-compliant. Can’t disagree with Brosephus.Why would any rational person not prepare for both possibilities of the election.

If the federal govt. already has an exchange site, why duplicate their work, seems like a waste of time. Of course you COULD argue that Ga. could “refine ” it’s exchange..at what cost.. Jay, you slant and Deal talks about Ga. not “affording” the extra cost, NUMBERS please, not platitudes.

• Link
• Report this comment

The feds have done so well managing the postal service,medicare-medicaid,the deficit,prescription drug program,and it goes on and on. I’m sure obamacare will be run accordingly. Remember, the government is the answer for all our needs.One day this same government will take it all away!

• Link
• Report this comment

If only Obama and the Democrats had focused on jobs his first 2 years…

again with this?

The Recovery Act. Ring a bell? It wasn’t big enough, but it was the very first major piece of legislation Obama and the Dems passed. Without it, we’d have been in Great Depression II: Electric Boogaloo.

• Link
• Report this comment

Jay Bookman
“It’s time for GOP to accept reality of ObamaCare

No one yet knows the “reality” of ObamaCare, not the Democrats who passed it and certainly not you nor I. We shall accept the inevitability thereof but I fear the reality will indeed be much harder for all of us to accept.

• Link
• Report this comment

The cuckoo is strong today…

• Link
• Report this comment

stands for decibels

November 21st, 2012
8:54 am

Rome is burning.

No it is not. We are the richest, most powerful nation ever on earth.

Stop acting like you live in f-cking Somalia.
——————————————————-
.
There’s that latent racism again.
.
sheeeesh.

• Link
• Report this comment

“again with this?”

yes.

THBAEOSATSQ

• Link
• Report this comment

guy, on behalf of non-Republicans everywhere, keep up the great work!

Bashing Uncle Sam endlessly and denigrating this country and her people is working out fantastically for you and your party!

Stay extremist, my friends…

• Link
• Report this comment

The problem is that the ACA is not insurance, there is no underwriting, and without ’selection’ you don’t have insurance-but what do you expect when you are dealing with Maoists?

• Link
• Report this comment

I’m getting pretty fed up with Nathan Deal. Not that I ever thought he had any real desire to serve, but he needs to quit focusing so much on lining his friends’ pockets by putting them in cushy positions for which they are ill qualified (can anyone say “heckofajob”?) and start working on some things for the people.

• Link
• Report this comment

Who pays for all of the people without health insurance? You and I do in the form of higher costs for us. And we pay more for it when the uninsured go to the hospital than if they received proper preventive care. So Deal’s decision means that “we the people” will pay more for the health care of those 100s of thousands to whom he denied coverage. Is he working for the GOP or for us?

• Link
• Report this comment

decibels- how are we the richest nation on earth if we borrow 40% of what we spend with no plan get our budget (none passed in the last 4 years) in order. More govt is not the answer I can promise you that.
The fact that we have a very high per capita income is great but that’s in decline and eventually we will be like Greece or Spain with 20%+ unemployement and people like you rioting in the streets becasue some of your govt benefits have been taken away or reduced.

• Link
• Report this comment

How is it that liberals act like getting federal money is somehow “free?”

I hate to inform Jay, but all of this “free” money coming from the feds he mentions in this article still has to be paid for; its just being paid out of my federal income taxes, instead of state income taxes

• Link
• Report this comment

@ stands. great you found a medicaid doc, I can tell you from very personal experience it will not be easy for adults and when 600,000 are added to the rolls, the lines will be from here to Canada ( well mabye not that long..good donuts in Canada, though..) Seriously, many docs who take medicaid will shut it down or restrict entrance. As for Grady, for many years it was AWFUL, it has tried to improve. Yes if I had acute Trauma,that’s where I would go, but for NOTHING else and frankly I would know(can’t tell you why, but trust me, and I have a condo in Fla. , anyone interested?…

• Link
• Report this comment

Deal just wants to make sure he can pay for all the charter schools. Deny Medicaid, refuse the exchange, open charter schools to teach creationism and all things biblical, and BINGO you can almost forget we’re part of the United States….friggin’ bonehead!!!

• Link
• Report this comment

its just being paid out of my federal income taxes, instead of state income taxes

_____

where 47% pay more than the 1%

• Link
• Report this comment

Healthcare, like so many other things, requires a level of intellect and competence that simply cannot be found in a Republican-run faith-based system. We should be thankful that Deal recognizes his party’s shortcomings and thus relinquishes control of healthcare to the fed.

• Link
• Report this comment

Let’s see — it takes a strong Fed. government to get our national priorities in order, such as infrastructure of bridges, dams, power generators, transportation, communication and Internet capabilities, etc.
So Cons, which of your billionaire “job creators” will be stepping forward to take care of these American needs all on their own $$$, no assistance from the gov’t, etc.??? Who do YOU suggest gets America back to making BIG IDEAS happen again? Who was it that got Americans on the MOON back in ‘69, for instance — was that the Koch brothers with all their billion$$$??? You Cons are a joke to America!!!

• Link
• Report this comment

Politicians who gamble with the lives of children over money that
that they are not directly involved in, to gain political points, should
be denied medical care themselves.

• Link
• Report this comment

DownInAlbany @ 8:50

I agree with you on the cost issue. One of the hidden costs is the fact that people without insurance get treated anyway. Most times, they’re treated in emergency rooms which adds to the cost of those of us who carry insurance. I didn’t research much into single payer before, but whether the GOP wants it or not, their actions are pushing the US into single payer at full speed.

I would personally love to see the private sector formulate and implement overhauls that address costs, but unfortunately, they have had ample time to do so and have done nothing but complain about the ACA. Complaining ain’t gonna cut costs.

• Link
• Report this comment

real john: “I hate to inform Jay, but all of this “free” money coming from the feds he mentions in this article still has to be paid for”

Correction: it’s being paid for by ALL Americans’ payments into Federal income taxes. In other words, there is a transfer from larger wealthier states like New Jersey, California, etc. to the smaller and less affluent states, many of whom btw happen to be “red”.

• Link
• Report this comment

JamVet

November 21st, 2012
8:47 am

I’m not against healthcare reform, but, the ACA misses the mark in so many ways.

Agreed.

SINGLE PAYER NOW.

Oooh, single payer…makes me pucker up. Medical practices deal with many different payers. Blue Cross Blue Shield, Aetna, Medicare, Medicaid. All with different rules. Sometimes there are disputes with, for example, Blue Cross. When that happens and BC is not paying me because of the dispute, Medicaid, Aetna, etc still pay me and I can make payroll and keep the light bill paid. With a single-payer, if there is a dispute, the cash flow could come to a complete stop…

• Link
• Report this comment

real john You are wasting your time trying to explain what you are correct about to “libs” because “free” to them is using someone else’s money,not theirs.To them,that’s “FREE”.

• Link
• Report this comment

And so the normal set up begins…….if Obamacare fails or problems develop, it’s because of………wait for it……..inaction and/or action of republicans?……..Flow of Federal dollars, that has to be payed for by…..taxpayers including Georgia taxpayers. Dems say Obamacare is modeled after Romneycare….maybe that’s why voters stayed at home, what’s the use. It’s here, so get on with it….and stop complaining and own it.

• Link
• Report this comment

@ Goldie: answer:hedge funds and private equity investors, probably not the answer you thought , but is the answer you should think. That being said, your answer:GOVT. does play a role, of course,not as an inivator, more of sustainability. The Govt has gotten out of the “moon” business, Obama told us so and has turned it over to private concerns–couldn’t afford it,: a little sad for america, if you ask me….

• Link
• Report this comment

Americans For Prosperity ‘Extremely Disappointed’ In Rick Scott After Obamacare Shift

Americans for Prosperity, a conservative organization backed by the billionaire Koch brothers, took aim at Florida Gov. Rick Scott (R) on Monday, accusing him of working against his state’s interests with his apparent change of heart on Obamacare.
In a statement, AFP said that Scott’s recent signal that he was willing to consider implementing key provisions of President Barack Obama’s health care reform law was a step in the wrong direction.
“AFP is extremely disappointed in leaders in Florida suggesting that the Sunshine State should create a health insurance exchange” said Slade O’Brien, AFP’s Florida State Director. “An exchange will increase insurance premiums on consumers and taxes on hardworking families. Florida’s best intentions will be masked by the federal government’s onerous requirements.”
Scott had stood as one of the most stubborn adversaries of Obamacare, even in the wake of the president’s reelection, which effectively secured the law’s existence. But after first vowing to reject moves to set up a state-run health insurance exchange and expand Medicaid rolls under the Affordable Care Act, Scott said last week that he was ready to “have a conversation.” Leaders in the state legislature have also signalled a willingness to take steps toward implementation.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/19/americans-for-prosperity-rick-scott_n_2160739.html?ref=topbar

• Link
• Report this comment

Mary Elizabeth,

Pleased to see you on these forums. Your input and reasoning are warmly received.

• Link
• Report this comment

Deal wants to be seen as having no part of collaboration with Obama as it plays well in Georgia. Besides he is very busy with his landfill and auto salvage business in gainesville and screwing the population in that county, and likely other county’s.

• Link
• Report this comment

When the hospitals are broke because Obamacare was not implemented
the Republicans will blame Obamacare for the destruction.

• Link
• Report this comment

Welcome to the Occupation

Are you saying only white people are conservative?

• Link
• Report this comment

Goldie- I like the roads, bridges, firefighters, police, and teachers argument that Obama and the libs make for raising taxes but there are many more people out here who work hard and pay taxes and it’s just not enough.Our govt has gotten way to big and no matter how much you take from the hard working american taxpayer it will never be enough. It’s not the billionairs who will be affected it’s the folks who have actually worked hard to get where they are and are trying to be self sufficient who will be hammered. It’s always easy to make the I want more and i think we ought to take more from someone else to get it; get off your lazy ass and take care of you and your family.

• Link
• Report this comment

“Yes indeed. It is time to suck it, losers!”

Well said #1 Foxylady!

Just like red states have to accept the fact that President Obama was elected to a second term and we all live with his leadership and direction of the country…
Residents of Georgia have to accept the fact that this is a GOP controlled state and they have to live with the leadership and direction of Governor Deal.

• Link
• Report this comment

williebkind: “Are you saying only white people are conservative?”

Basically, yes. In the sense of being a big talker about responsibility while in fact being a big taker and sponge off of their more affluent betters, usually located further North.

• Link
• Report this comment

Today the Cons are fully proving the reality that they can’t comprehend reality.

• Link
• Report this comment

Brosephus™

November 21st, 2012
9:09 am

DownInAlbany @ 8:50

I agree with you on the cost issue. One of the hidden costs is the fact that people without insurance get treated anyway. Most times, they’re treated in emergency rooms which adds to the cost of those of us who carry insurance.

.It’s a fact that the ER is the most expensive place to treat a patient and if you been to the ER lately, you see a lot snotty noses and ear infections that shouldn’t be there. The public hospitals are prohibited from turning patients away, but, I think they could do a better job of triaging the patients and saying, “…you have a runny nose, you go to door A” where a PA or NP treats and streets ‘em. Or “…you’re having a heart attach…you go to door B” where the cardiologist with a crash cart is there.

• Link
• Report this comment

“Okay, Kcin, let’s take it one step at a time.
1. Do you know what a serf is?
2. Are you familiar with the phrase “subject to?”
3. Do you know what a whim is?
4. Do you know what “federal” means?
5. Does the term “nanny state” make sense to you?
6. Do you know what a bureaucrat is?”

southpaw – in my experience, you’re usually not such a richard.

As an explanation of how the ACA impinges on sinkwich’s personal freedoms, you think this is a GOOD explanation? Sheesh…

• Link
• Report this comment

“Obamacare does not save lives….Doctors do”

tlt – The ACA provides ACCESS to doctors, allow the doctors to save lives that might otherwise no be saved.

Better?

• Link
• Report this comment

“Obamacare does not save lives….Doctors do.”

Lol! Fox News would love that one.

Btw, those doctors never received any training from government universities or government hospitals, right?

• Link
• Report this comment

Why should anyone accept bad legislation when there are still options to fight it….sorry Jay and other libbies No Sale

That said, of course it is good to insure uninsured people but the way this law was cobbled together there are way too many unintended consequesnces that ulitmately it will do more harm than good.

• Link
• Report this comment

The problem with health care in this country is plain: CAPITALISM & GREED. Insurance companies see only profits, and do not care. Until we take the profits from greedy insurance companies, and realize that health care is a right, then it is not a pretty picture. Okay, so Obama’s plan is not perfect, but he at least had the guts to make an effort to do something. Other countries have coverage for all, why can’t the USA? Again, the real problem is Capitalism, it is inherently evil.

• Link
• Report this comment

“Free” food, courtesy of O’bozo:

“More Americans will use food stamps to buy their Thanksgiving dinner this year than ever before, according to a new report from the nonprofit government watchdog group The Sunlight Foundation.”

• Link
• Report this comment

“Correction: it’s being paid for by ALL Americans’ payments into Federal income taxes. In other words, there is a transfer from larger wealthier states like New Jersey, California, etc. to the smaller and less affluent states, many of whom btw happen to be “red”.”

ALL Americans???? Really??? Somebody hasn’t been paying attention much lately…

• Link
• Report this comment

“it’s not a question of whether Georgia can afford it”

Jay, it’s *always* a question of whether we can afford it. Listen to Clark Howard or Dave Ramsey.

• Link
• Report this comment

Republicans always have their fallback position–Tom Price’s “I Object!”

• Link
• Report this comment

“More Americans will use food stamps to buy their Thanksgiving dinner this year than ever before, according to a new report from the nonprofit government watchdog group The Sunlight Foundation”

DUH- they’re still unemployed using the assistance. Those numbers go up during economic downturns and drop when the economy improves. I thought you guys were the economic experts…

• Link
• Report this comment

Jay, here’s reality, hospitals and doctors do not make money on medicaid, they loose money….OK,that is economics. Furthermore:docs do not want to be in small towns, so you’ve got to entice them, hospitals and health systems do that by paing them outsized salaries..Medicaid will not support those salaries:ECONOMICS.
As for the blogger who wrote that docs are trained by the govt..Better give up on that , if you knew how much docs make per hour in training , you might wonder why anyone would put up with it.

• Link
• Report this comment

Jay 9:33 – Nice theory, but I have been in healthcare for 15 years and there are very few providers, doctors or hospitals, that can survive on Medicaid reimbursement rates. If you think young men and women will invest ten years of their lives and hundreds of thousands of dollars to become a doctor in Lumber City and get $17.90 per office visit from Medicaid you must be smoking more than your turkey today!

• Link
• Report this comment

“unless they’re asking to secdee”

All that succession nonsense is chest-thumping, nothing more. It’s losers who are screaming, “I quit, I don’t want to play any more!,” but, after they’ve cried it out, will meekly assume their designated position in society, with quiet embarassment at their own outburst…

• Link
• Report this comment

Just as the Jews in Germany in the 1930s were forced to accept the reality of the Third Reich, Americans are now faced with the best healthcare system in the world being replaced with zerØcare. Many doctors will find other work as being a physician will be as lucrative as working for the post office. America will be split into the Haves and the Havenots. The really good physicians will go to a cash only business and will refuse government or private insurance. So you will be required to have insurance but you can only use it to see a government doctor and the waiting line will be longer than the Mississippi river. The quality of the healthcare for all but the very rich is going to nosedive and the cost is going to soar. To those of you who are responsible for me losing my healthcare I have a very personal message: I hate your guts. I don’t mean I have a philosophical difference of opinion about the role of government in our lives: I hate your guts. I hope you all die of Jungle Rot of the Crotch and the turkey you eat tomorrow has salmonella.Thanks to The Indonesian Imbecile the only thing I can afford is a Spam Sandwich.

• Link
• Report this comment

Just as the Jews in Germany in the 1930s were forced to accept the reality of the Third Reich…

Godwin’s Law, proven yet again.

• Link
• Report this comment

Showing my age here; what does “word” mean/imply?
I see this response on a few posts and do not get the implication.

Let’s just give thanks that we do not live in the Gaza strip…..

• Link
• Report this comment

AmericaShrugged
Guess those doctors will have to go to Thailand to practice.

• Link
• Report this comment

Mary Elizabeth

November 21st, 2012
8:17 am

TO ALL READERS:

ME, If you can’t take the heat then stay out of the kitchen, it’s Jay’s blog not YOURS.

• Link
• Report this comment

Dang, Kamchak, I’ve gotta type faster!

• Link
• Report this comment

RB……Do consider this
http://taxprof.typepad.com/taxprof_blog/2004/09/red_states_feed.html

• Link
• Report this comment

Regnad

• Link
• Report this comment

Republicans do some things very well. Reality isn’t one of them

• Link
• Report this comment

stands- We are the richest, most powerful nation ever on earth.

I didn’t know you were Chinese…

• Link
• Report this comment

How ironic that the Thin Guy speaks for Jews when he would have made a perfect Nazi…

• Link
• Report this comment

From Jim Jubak:

Five years ago, I never imagined I’d type these words: By 2017, the United States will overtake Saudi Arabia as the world’s largest oil producer. In addition, according to the International Energy Agency, by 2015, the United States will overtake Russia to become the world’s largest producer of natural gas. The United States is now the fastest-growing oil and natural gas producer in the world. During the past five years, according to Citigroup, the United States has added 2.59 million barrels a day to total production.

http://money.msn.com/investment-advice/ready-for-the-us-energy-boom

• Link
• Report this comment

But instead of focusing on this monstrosity of a bill that’s anything but affordable they should have focus on jobs, getting people back to work, and paying down debt with the new taxes collected from people working.

you mean, he should have ignored what he and every other Democrat running for President promised to focus on, because… ?

He passed the Recovery Act, after a great deal of arm twisting and gnashing of teeth. We heard endless griping from Teapers about how we’d spent ZOMG 800 BILLION! (not really), they assaulted elected officials over the super scary SPENDING, and they rode that stupidity to mid-term victory in 2010.

How in the hell was Obama supposed to focus MORE on getting people back to work, when the solution–to spend more–was being blocked at every damn turn?

The PPACA was part of a long-term plan to address structural issues in America’s weird-ass health insurance system. Yes, I would vastly prefer single payer, and we may yet get that, but providing heavy regulation of private insurers + substantial Medicaid expansion was the best we could’ve managed.

So let’s do move on and work with what we have, shall we?

• Link
• Report this comment

Jay isn’t too bright. He is one of those in school that thought money grew on trees. He still does.
Yet he like all bed wetters, takes every tax deduction his CPA can find because he wants to spend YOUR money not HIS.
Typical bed wetter.

• Link
• Report this comment

I didn’t know you were Chinese…

Speaking of insane comments!

• Link
• Report this comment

Mary Elizabeth – 8:18

Jay’s blog is, unfortunately, filled with home schooled rich kids who love to play grownup here. Being a child in a rich family has caused them to have contempt for those less fortunate. It may be that, years from now, they will have attained enough maturity and education to show compassion for those less fortunate. Until then, give joseph, alex and others like them all the attention they truly deserve.

• Link
• Report this comment

DannyX……..you own it!………hahahaha!

• Link
• Report this comment

Dang, it’s gonna be a long 4 days with the relatives. Two liberals (me and my wife) and 7 whupped Republicans.

Sigh.

Break out the “Rub it in yo face, beeyatches” party favors!

• Link
• Report this comment

Thin Guy:

You apologize right now!!

You are going to make ME’s blood pressure go through the roof and cause a severe case of depression!

You already made me cry! (with laughter)

• Link
• Report this comment

oh, one other thing:

Then in his 2nd term focus on health care with a single payer once we could afford it.

Nothing says we can’t push for that, still, in Obama’s second term. We have people like Bernie *and* Elizabeth in the Senate now.

• Link
• Report this comment

Redcoat
We owned it anyway even with the half truths and outright lies and now we own you

• Link
• Report this comment

He is one of those in school that thought money grew on trees

Ok, mystery meat, please explain. Where does this “money” you speak of, come from?

and if your answer includes the words “job producers” I will have to smite you.

• Link
• Report this comment

@ RF, an investment? You are a typical liberal who refuses to admit that Americans don’t take care of themselves. You can spend all YOUR money on the clowns then come back and show me how it worked.
We spend more on education and we not only have a dumbarse population but we also have naive people like you.
So you see, healthcare will be just like just like education where we spend WAY TOO much and get WAY TO LITTLE. Why? Because the leeches don’t want to take care of themselves mentally or physically.

• Link
• Report this comment

Jay, acknowledge that point is frequently made, but if treating the patient actually looses you money(medicaid) even the economically-challenged doc, of which there are many, will not see the ,patient-ECONOMICS. that will not change the equation to get doc s to live in these communities. Previously, foreign-trained docs took these positions, not anymore,ask any recruiter. It is a real problem…The cost might be lower, but it is not low, overhead of 45-60%, ECONOMICS, the dismal science…

• Link
• Report this comment

health insurance went up just 4 percent this year, one of the lowest increases in recent history.

Don’t try using that math on them Jay. They don’t do that math stuff.

• Link
• Report this comment

The Divided States of America… ;(

• Link
• Report this comment

“Don’t try using that math on them Jay. They don’t do that math stuff.”

evidence: Romney will win 300 gajillion electoral college votes!

• Link
• Report this comment

Before Obamacare we spent $7700 per capita on healthcare and France spends $3800 for better results. Meanwhile the Red States get fatter and cost us more to maintain.

• Link
• Report this comment

Doctors have never been good businessmen. They are not good at setting up business models. Part of that is that in the past their costs were covered and did not have to worry about efficiency.

A doctor friend was talking about how he was not making much money, he took home what was left after all the other bills were paid. And he lost money on medicaid and medicare patients.

I suggested he rethink his business model, overhead, service and whether he should keep taking medicare and medicaid and he didn’t have a clue.

• Link
• Report this comment

“Oh great. $1,500 a month for health insurance, and now I have to pay for dead beats health insurance too?”

Who do you think pays now, Nunna? Serious question – do you think YOU don’t?

• Link
• Report this comment

if treating the patient actually looses you money

Don’t loose your money, dude! That kind of money goes to loose women?

• Link
• Report this comment

Kam, would you prefer Millard Fillmore or Taft references instead
__

If we are lucky, we will recover from the damage done by Fillmore in another coupld of decades.

• Link
• Report this comment

On the issue of freedom……

Democracy and socialism have nothing in common but one word, equality. But notice the difference: while democracy seeks equality in liberty, socialism seeks equality in restraint and servitude.

Alexis de Tocqueville

• Link
• Report this comment

Romney will win 300 gajillion electoral college votes!

see too:

http://www.cnbc.com/id/49698661

ha ha ha ha har.

• Link
• Report this comment

“That kind of money goes to loose women?”

speaking of loose women … did anyone catch this little piece of lunacy from Pat “hey, the muslims may be onto something with this whole burkha thing” Robertson??

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2232583/David-Petraeus-sex-scandal-Pat-Robertson-defends-ex-CIA-Directors-affair-Paula-Broadwell.html

• Link
• Report this comment

As long as the cons love getting bilked by the thousands of different players and layers of “free market” profiteers in our bungling bureaucracy of incompetence and needless death, little will change.

Long Live the Corporatoicracy!

• Link
• Report this comment

Looks like the South plans to continue fighting the Civil War for another 150 years, hoping for a different outcome. Good luck with that!

• Link
• Report this comment

Jerome Horwitz: “Know an Englishman who moved here recently and can’t believe how backward we really are”

True enough, but he better not gloat. The NHS is under attack as we speak by the Tories, very stealthily and insidiously, who are absolutely dying to gut it and gradually convert it into an American style system. This despite running on a promise to keep their filthy hands off of it of course, just more evidence of the utter contempt for the will of the people shown by elites in our time.

• Link
• Report this comment

barking frog – Either that or default on their student loans!!! Wonder if the CBO included that in their estimated cost of Obamacare?

• Link
• Report this comment

“he NHS is under attack as we speak by the Tories, very stealthily and insidiously, who are absolutely dying to gut it”

you got that right …

• Link
• Report this comment

Jerome Horwitz

November 21st, 2012
10:07 am

Comparison of our health care outcomes to that of other nations is a fallatious argument, same as comparing our education outcomes to other nations. We have a unique demographic to say the least relative to the countries that those who need to tell the voters they can make it better, are simply making us sick to make us better.

The outcomes under this approach will not reflect an improvement in outcomes compared to countries that don’t remotely share our demographic issues. We have thrown money at education for decades and the complaints keep getting louder..

• Link
• Report this comment

AmericaShrugged
If they practice in Thailand college loans will be a moot point except to
the US government.

• Link
• Report this comment

We are the richest nation. China owns us.

good God, the stupid is strong this morning.

JKL2, when have we ever defaulted on a payment?

• Link
• Report this comment

“You are a typical liberal who refuses to admit that Americans don’t take care of themselves

Jim Fixx died of a heart attack

• Link
• Report this comment

@USinUK 10:10- yeah, leave it to Pat to defend the guy. He’s one of those dinosaurs who believe we messed up when we let women wear pants and get educations. If he were king, you gals would never be let out of the kitchen and be wearing full length dresses. He musta watched a few too many reruns of Little House on The Prairie…

• Link
• Report this comment

“The point is that Obama said health insurance would go down.”

and, unless the federal government takes over the private insurance companies, you can look forward to corporate gouging unless people demand changes.

• Link
• Report this comment

Wow people……don’t like owning it?……..better start accepting instead of blaming…..”we’re in the money!, we’re in the money!” and free healthcare too..:)!

• Link
• Report this comment

“The point is that Obama said health insurance would go down. It’s hasn’t gone down 1 time since this bill was signed and parts started to be put in place”

What part of “not fully implemented yet” do you not understand? Plus, the lowered cost is on a “per person” basis…that doesn’t neccessarily mean that each an every one of us will see a reduction. You DO understand how “averaging across a population” works…don’t you?

• Link
• Report this comment

Obamacare will be unsustainable and, eventually, reversed, just like the plan that it was modeled after – Romneycare. Earlier this year the Massachusetts legislature all but repealed Romneycare by passing a 349 page bill because it was taking the state into bankruptcy. As with other attempts like it (TennCare), these liberal feel good, big ideas are unrealistic and eventually fail.

• Link
• Report this comment

Oh happy days!…Oh happy days!……the Dems own it now! Accept, don’t blame……Be happy now!

• Link
• Report this comment

““I don’t think that word means what you think it means…” ”

ohsweetjeebus …

there isn’t enough screen cleaner on the planet right now …

• Link
• Report this comment

middle: actually, as I recall, Obama was against the individual mandate, but acquiesced to republicans, who were right about that. The individual mandate isn’t popular, but even Romney proved it could work in Mass.

• Link
• Report this comment

I would like to propose that Jay ban anyone who posts that dumbass ZOMG NUMBERZ IZ TEH SKEERY debt clock.

any co-sponsors out there?

• Link
• Report this comment

The right tried to leave a crime with us holding the bag, now they call that owning something. They spend more time plotting our failure than they do the success of this country. I not sure Bush’s whole eight years was not dedicated to development of a nuclear explosion set to go off in the Obama administration. We tuck and cut, cook the books and then leave the public eye before the reality replaces the allusion they had created. Somehow the fuse they light to set the explosion didn’t go off so now they form the modern day equivalent of the Tea Party Klan to destruct and obstruct any progress they may not get credit for and tell us we own it. A clumsy crew to say the least, I am so glad the Democrats didn’t decide to play this way, they are much better at accomplishing their goals.

• Link
• Report this comment

US/stands- um. no. the largest holder of US treasuries isn’t China … its the US.

Good to know we are monitizing our own debt. I feel much better knowing we are being run by the United States of Enron…

• Link
• Report this comment

Jay: “Remember “repeal and replace”? They never did accomplish the repeal, and never even tried to keep that “replace” pledge. ”

Actually, they kinda did, in the sense Rep. Alan Grayson referred to (Republican plan for health care: DIE QUICKLY).

• Link
• Report this comment

“Really? He did?

When?”

How cute. Jay plays dumb. Here’s a collage of Obama repeatedly saying in 2008 that insurance premiums will be reduced by $2500/yr.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=_o65vMUk5so#!

• Link
• Report this comment

It’s not a matter of whether GA can afford it, it’s already known that they can’t (state portion supposed be hundreds of millions per year eventually). Already can’t afford State health insurance programs as they are (or just barely as the budget does get balanced every year). Legalized gambling anyone? And opting in with “federal” money just means you and every other taxpayer in the country chip in, you pay for it one way or the other. No free lunches, sorry liberals.
The thing I don’t understand, how does it take a year or more to build an exchange to buy insurance? I can call 10 insurance companies or contact them on the internet and have quotes in a week with a few facts (age, gender, etc.). Why does it take the government so looooooonnnnnngggggggggggg? (time is money)

The

• Link
• Report this comment

Jim fixx had famial hyperlipidemia and lived 10 years longer than his father, who died of a heart attack and for many years had smoked 2 packs a day, my point-Fixx may have been a runner for 10 years, but he had a lot of cards stacked against him. Fianally, his runnig obsession may actually have been to his hearts detriment as ultra marathoner,etc. may actually have increased CV mortality,As GRANNY (not GODZILLA) would say:”sonny, everything in moderation”

• Link
• Report this comment

Terrence: it’s a nice dream, but most folks I know either lost a lot in the recession and can’t afford to think about it, or aren’t rich enough to have that option anyway. Those that are will retire when they wish regardless of healthcare costs. Your point is only relevant to those who may choose to retire early, and in this economy there aren’t many of those. A LOT of the babyboomers looking to retire in this decade are already rethinking that because they lost so much in the recession that won’t return for another ten years, if then.

• Link
• Report this comment

“The right tried to leave a crime with us holding the bag, now they call that owning something’

They played “starve the beast” for decades – the plan was always to leave the Democratic Party “holding the bag.”

• Link
• Report this comment

Jay
November 21st, 2012
10:01 am

“Oh great. $1,500 a month for health insurance, and now I have to pay for dead beats health insurance too? No pre-existing conditions? Price just went up again. Well, after the health insurance costs bankrupt me, maybe I’ll qualify for the free stuff.

Actually, Nunn, you were already paying for uncompensated medical care through your own private insurance. And contrary to your complaint about “price just went up again,” health insurance went up just 4 percent this year, one of the lowest increases in recent history.
++++
If you assume that Obama care is actually going to increase the number of people receiving health care unless the supply of doctors increases the cost will be higher with ObamaCare than without. This is basic economics. Demand increases without a increase in supply price goes up. Unless you believe their is excess capacity in the system the cost is going up. There is already a projected doctor shortage. If you remember the pictures of the Soviet Union with it’s empty shelves.

The left is always complaining about the right denying science in the case of global warming but the left seems to avoid the basic concept of supply and demand. There is no way Obama care does not increase the cost of medical care unless it is assume there excess capacity, it increases the number of doctors or magic.

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/doctor-shortage-health-care-crash/story?id=17708473#.UKzwn4dfCSo

• Link
• Report this comment

In FOUR years (or LESS), voters for ObUMa will be BEGGING to get OUT of ObUMacare!!!

• Link
• Report this comment

“So why have Republicans been blasting the individual mandate every chance they get, even to the point of wanting to repeal Obamacare just to get rid of the individual mandate”

playing to the numbers basically. They know its unpopular, so they’re hoping to swing votes with it. They pushed for its inclusion, both because it was necessary and because they knew they’d have a political point to criticize. Romneycare had the mandate too as I recall.

• Link
• Report this comment

“Good to know we are monitizing our own debt. I feel much better knowing we are being run by the United States of Enron…”

corporate entities, too, dear – insurance companies and so forth that HAVE to invest in Treasuries

• Link
• Report this comment

China owns us.

Just another example of the “low information voter” (which still cracks me up) that JHM wrote of this morning.

JKL2, George who??? (You still miss him doncha? LOL.)

• Link
• Report this comment

Wow Pea, you got ‘em. Candidate Obama proposed a health insurance plan to lower premiums, now since you are so smart, be honest and compare and contrast his proposeal vs what was passed, otay. You are comparing apples to apples, right?

• Link
• Report this comment

Mary Elizabeth, Paul Krugman was a trusted advisor to ENRON. Mary Elizabeth, if you have to cite the contents of your library, it smacks of defensiveness, which is unbecoming to one who wishes to be known for her scholarly pursuits. Mary Elizabeth, I too read Jane Mayer’s article in the New Yorker, but did not find it quite so mesmerizing as you apparently did. It might be prudent to check Ms Mayer’s sources for possible distortions and demonstrated omissions. Mary Elizabeth, you might want too sample a few more diverse opinions. I suggest the writings of Nat Hentoff, a writer with New York’s Village Voice for many years and now with Commentary. His articles are brief and clearly written. I was born in, lived in, and studied in New England for many years. I find the South delightful. There are no more fools here than anywhere else.

• Link
• Report this comment

To the wingnut Republicans, freedom means dying when your insurance is cancelled or you can’t afford COBRA after your job ends, or you get sick and have a pre-existing condition. It means having the freedom of losing your home, your belongings and your future if you get sick and your insurance company will not pay your bills because they say it is above the “usual and customary” fees, or because they decide you’re not covered for that. Republicans, take your “Freedom” and shove it. Americans have spoken. You now have the “freedom” to crawl back under your rocks and wait to slither out and hiss your lies into the ears of others (using public airwaves) closer to the next election.

• Link
• Report this comment

“Wow Pea, you got ‘em.”

Thanks

• Link
• Report this comment

You can’t spit-shine a turd.

Well actually on Mythbusters, they proved you can.

• Link
• Report this comment

Krugman may have advised Enron but he didn’t scam stockholders and employees. Kenny-Boy (dead), Pat Skilling (prison) and Andy Fastow (prison) did.

All GOP, by the way.

• Link
• Report this comment

Jay

November 21st, 2012
10:35 am

Another ignorant conclusion…the answer is that many doctors, nursing homes, ancillary providers, home health providers and the like will not survive the cuts that favor hospital systems who, along with insurers, paid off Pelosi et al to be favorably treated. Existing docs accepting medicaid/care, will stop accepting same because cuts will kill business model. Those who want to remain in the game are selling practices back to hosptials because that is the only way they can hope to participate in any means of making a profit.

Your assumption about influx of new docs filling new demand is another fallacious position..

• Link
• Report this comment

is it me or or are republicans greedy to the point of no humanity and to the point of hypertension?

• Link
• Report this comment

For healthcare cost to come down, medical expenses have to be lowered. There was nothing in the PPACA that addressed it. Tort reform was not allowed because the Democrats are in the pocket of the trial lawyers. There was not one Republican who voted for the bill and no amendments were allowed or any input. The bill has 21 new taxes built in it and everyone will feel them next year. One is a 2.4% tax on durable medical equipment, how is that going to lower medical cost? How about Obama getting in front of the camera and saying if you like your coverage then you can keep it, that is not true. If you go to an exchange you have to buy the plan design the exchange offers. IF you have a family income of less than 88,000.00 you can get subsidized by the Government, the money will be borrowed to give to people who can afford it. Brokers and agents are the first line of defense in getting Insurance companies to provide service and pay claims and they were thrown under the bus by Sen. Jay Rockefeller. Under the law Insurance companies are allowed to keep 20% of the premiums and the agents commissions are in that 20%. This has affected hundreds of thousands of people who served their communities. Another reason health insurance premiums are so high is because of Government regulations like COBRA and then HIPAA. They drove the cost so high that the Democrats saw a ripe time to take over the industry. Like Government ran Insurance programs? Ask people on medicare, doctors are pulling out in droves. Medicaid is poorly run and almost broke. Medicare has a nearly 42 trillion dollar deficit. The appeals process in the VA medical system takes over 800 days. A friend of mine had to wait 5 years to be treated for agent orange. Last of all the health insurance industry is a private industry and the government has no business being involved in it. Be careful what you wish for your industry will be the next one to be taken over by Obama if he has time!

• Link
• Report this comment

weetamoe: “Paul Krugman was a trusted advisor to ENRON”

I assume you’re saying that to discredit him because you find his views too “liberal” (even though he is quite the mainstream economist if every there was one).

But if you are going to dismiss an economist for being affiliated with an entity like Enron, you will find yourself without any economists left in your conservative economic stable. (Cough cough, can you say “G-r-e-e-n-s-p-a-n”?)

• Link
• Report this comment

“To the wingnut Republicans, freedom means dying when your insurance is cancelled or you can’t afford COBRA after your job ends, or you get sick and have a pre-existing condition”

The trailer parks are full of folks who once had a good life-style, but acquired what is now a “pre-existing condition.” Some folks think that’s as it should be; others, not so much.

• Link
• Report this comment

Pea, since you are not honest and apparently ignorant of context. Here’s a clue for you. In 2008, Candidate Obama was proposing Universal Healthcare. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_care_reform_in_the_United_States_presidential_election,_2008

Hopefully you will apologize for your distorted claims. But I doubt it.

• Link
• Report this comment

As if ‘explaining’ the whole of The Affordable Care Act to most folks here would matter, it’s important to realize that the reason it was named that was its design was to be a ‘balanced’ approach to healthcare that would, over time, help bring the costs down for everybody. For Georgia to deny a Grady, and every other hospital that treats patients that can’t pay – which is all of em – means that those costs are gonna be disproportionately laid on Georgians, rather than shared with the rest of the country. By the way, we’ll be paying into, with our tax dollars, the system that funds this, regardless of whether we use it or not…but don’t worry, Georgia, despite how we already treat our Medicare-eligible citizens, gets more from the Feds than we put it…guess that means we’re a ‘taker’ rather than a ‘maker’…AKA ‘moucher’. So it goes, Deal and the rest of our Republican ‘leaders’ will continue to ‘cut off OUR noses just to spite Obama’…I wish they’d cut off their hands so they couldn’t play with themselves…the jerks.

• Link
• Report this comment

Enter your comments here
USinUK – not very ladylike (and former Girl Scout)

November 21st, 2012
8:54 am

“explain to me how raising taxes on the RICH is going to create any more jobs?”

explain to me how keeping it as it is or cutting it will – it hasn’t in 40 years, so why will it suddenly work now???

I actually thought things weren’t to bad under Clinton, just sayin!

• Link
• Report this comment

doggone- Yeah, I have MY plans in place too. Except right after Bush got elected the economy tanked and I lost almost half my retirement savings. Then the economy tanked again at the end of his reign and I lost almost half of what was left. So much for plans

obama says the economy is booming and wall street is at record levels. Didn’t you get the memo?

• Link
• Report this comment

Mr Bookman and all your liberal friends, enjoy OBAMACARE and the new taxes, corruption and lack of healthcare you’ll now receive. May the next four years go by quickly and maybe just maybe we can survive the Socialist agenda Mr Obama craves!!!

• Link
• Report this comment

Wany, tort reform is being done. 29 states have capped liability.

Its funny how “states rights” GOPers become all Central Gov when it comes to screwing consumers.

• Link
• Report this comment

JAY

Look into Jonathan Grubers new position on ACA..he was main consultant for Romney and BO..offered a complex methodology to tell congress what they wanted to hear…unfortnuately, his original model didn’t factor in the cost of pre-existing conditions, the new high utility insureds, and other major factors..

He orignally told Congress that premiums would be reduced by 14-30%…he was subsequently hired by MN and WS…now his tune has changed with more credible revised model…his new position is that premiums will increase by 13-33%..

Imagine that, the FEDS jamming a program a material majority didn’t want based on data that didn’t consider the main cost drivers of the bill…this is not atypical…and one of the reasons we spend 30% more than we take in…

I guess like any current problem, it’s all Bush’s fault eh? Those evil GOP trying to stop Hope and Change..perhaps you will find others to blame as well..

• Link
• Report this comment

weetamoe

WELL SAID…

• Link
• Report this comment

“Under ObamaCare, from 2014 to 2016 the federal government will pay 100 percent of the costs for insuring those additional Georgians. In later years, the share covered by the federal government will drop slightly — Uncle Sam will cover 95 percent of the cost in 2017, 94 percent in 2018, 93 percent in 2019 and then 90 percent from 2020 on out. (For comparison’s sake, Georgia pays a little over a third of the cost for current Medicaid recipients.)”

Now put these stats into real numbers? What would be the actual cost to the taxpayers of Georgia? We currently spend about $3 to $4 billion a year to cover Medicaid now and I have heard that the expansion would cost the state an additional $1 to $2 billion to start with.

How is the state going to afford this additional cost? Right now Education is about 50% of the states budget and Medicaid is an additional 20%. Do we want to take away money from Education? Police? Archives?

• Link
• Report this comment

how does connecting Greenspan to the GOP give Krugman anymore more creditability?

• Link
• Report this comment

“obama says the economy is booming”

When you have to lie to make your point, you have no point.

• Link
• Report this comment

I am so happy that Obama won the election…I can keep my five free cell phones.

• Link
• Report this comment

The speaker of the house, JB, said he thought the GOP would propose some amendments to the Affordable HCA. He didn’t say what they would be.
When we go over the cliff on Jan 1, there will probably be a lot of changes coming. Mainly cuts and more cuts. In medicare, medicaid and defense.

Nobody that studied the AHCA before it was passed really thought it would lower health care premiums. If they thought that, they were not paying attention.

The aim was to provide health care for more people, not to lower costs for everyone.

• Link
• Report this comment

welcome- If the Chinese hold a significance percentage of US debt, then who holds that power exactly?

Ummm, China. The borrower is slave to the lender.

obama: Bringing slavery back to the people!

• Link
• Report this comment

Apathy is a for sorry excuses for Americans.

• Link
• Report this comment

Much of the debt is owed to the SSI fund, Americans.

• Link
• Report this comment

“Wany, tort reform is being done. 29 states have capped liability.

Its funny how “states rights” GOPers become all Central Gov when it comes to screwing consumers.”

It ain’t screwing consumers – it is screwing lawyers. If people were really upset about that Emory doctor amputating the wrong finger, they would push for having his license suspended or revoked so he could not do it again. Instead, all they want is the money from EVERY doctors malpractice insurance. YES, when you go to the doctor next, you will help pay for that wrong amputation.

• Link
• Report this comment

“if the insurance companies decide that overweight people should pay significantly higher premiums, I am on-board with that”

and I am NOT. Being overweight is not proof, in and of itself, of being unhealthy. I am at least 100 lbs overweight. I have normal blood pressure and normal cholesterol In the last 20 years I’ve been to a doctor MAYBE 25 times. And in the last 5 years I’ve been once a year, and that’s only because I have to do to get my stomach prescription refilled. And THAT has nothing to do with my weight. It’s just what’s available NOW to control a problem I was diagnosed with at 16…when I weighed 110 lbs.

• Link
• Report this comment

“Peadawg, each of those truncated quotes is taken out of context. The administration has been clear that that’s an expected reduction below what the cost of health insurance WOULD have been without these reforms.”

That makes absolutely no sense. So it’s going to keep going up…just not as much as it would have?

• Link
• Report this comment

Pea, yes sweetie, run away from your original claim and move the goal posts. Remember they have to back in place for the games this weekend. You might want to get some help since you are clearly experience a weakness in the mind.

• Link
• Report this comment

“Ummm, China. The borrower is slave to the lender”

Don’t bet on it. “When you owe the bank $100, the bank owns you. When you owe the bank $100,000,000, you own the bank”

• Link
• Report this comment

“if the insurance companies decide that overweight people should pay significantly higher premiums, I am on-board with that”

Depends on the situation imo. Someone people that are “overweight” are actually perfectly healthy.

• Link
• Report this comment

2. I have to admit it, you are awesome.

Your inestimable help in ruining the GOP deserves great thanks as we start this holiday!

Keep Hopelessness Alive!

• Link
• Report this comment

“I think the gop guvs opting out will give us single payer. We will join the rest of the civilized world thanks to the gop.”

Ah yes, socialized medicine. “You have strep throat. We will spray your throat with Cepacol. Go home and do not come to us again about this issue.”

• Link
• Report this comment

@ jay, Look at funding for residencies and residency slots, they are not increasing anywhere near enough to keep up with the aging population,Jay you make some good points, we all do, but in this you are responding to good questions with poorly informed thoughts. There is a real problem here of doc shortage which cannot increase overnight which is in essecnce what will happen if 600,000 people get medicaid. Can’t happen. there will be an increase in mid level providers..Now I drive an Accord with over 100,000 miles and I am happy with a mid-level car;my dentist is superb and so is my doc. People with have to compromise with their health care, and that is ok,but NOT for me…I hope everyone out there understands that. This is what happened in england.. See you at Aldis, but NOT at Grady….

• Link
• Report this comment

” Being overweight is not proof, in and of itself, of being unhealthy.”

I am not sure that doctors would agree with that.

I am sure that smokers probably claim the same thing about their bodies – “yes, I smoke, but I am not any more unhealthy than anyone else.”

• Link
• Report this comment

doggone- got proof?

After an exhaustive 2 second google search, here you go. http://articles.nydailynews.com/2012-06-18/news/32303200_1_obese-adults-global-population-researchers

• Link
• Report this comment

I guess this latest crushing defeat for the Bush-led neocons was inevitable.

When the two giants of right wing intellectual thought, and the very stalwarts of their entire ideology, are Joseph McCarthy and Jim Crow, things were bound to get REAL ugly for them.

And here is to more ugly!

Speaking of which, anyone seen rags lately?

And whatever happened to “Obama is over”?

VERY tough times for right wing sock puppets, huh?

• Link
• Report this comment

“doggone- got proof?”

Yep. Me.

• Link
• Report this comment

The article in the AJC on Grady is a good example of Obummercare. Why duplicate expenses on the taxpayer when the Feds said they would do it if the State didn’t. If good journalist all over the Nation had reported about Obummercare adequately just maybe ? ? ? Ya see, we have to pass bills before we know what’s in them. The fiscal cliff is upon us.

• Link
• Report this comment

If good journalist all over the Nation had reported about Obummercare adequately just maybe ? ? ?

Is that English ? Can anyone translate this ?

• Link
• Report this comment

Having the Feds setup and run the exchange here in Georgia may be the best way to go. If Deal were to get involved would surely result in a less than efficient system, if only because of his crony appointment policy. For you Luddites out there I hope the cost of your insurance policies continue to rise at 10% per year. How long will you put up with that?

• Link
• Report this comment

“Ya see, we have to pass bills before we know what’s in them”

When you have to lie to make your point, you have no point.

• Link
• Report this comment

@Stevei10:53, It’s called the dismal science, as I have said(tongue in cheek), I follow the school of Schumpeter and his troup of viennese “tarts”

@ jay, who was the senator who said”a billion here and a billion there and soon you’ve got real money” or aomehting like that…Wait, I just found TWO BILLION in my pocket,” I got it”…

• Link
• Report this comment

doggone- Don’t bet on it. “When you owe the bank $100, the bank owns you. When you owe the bank $100,000,000, you own the bank

Which bank do you use? I luvs me some free money…

• Link
• Report this comment

John Forbes – we have no choice but to put up with it unless we want to gamble that we will not experience some ultra-expensive treatment for illness or injury.

• Link
• Report this comment

Electronic medical records=regression to the mean,you should be scared, bad medicine (except at Mayo)

• Link
• Report this comment

“Which bank do you use? I luvs me some free money…”

How hard do you have to work to misunderstand when people say?

• Link
• Report this comment

“…Wait, I just found TWO BILLION in my pocket,” I got it”…”

Well quick, go and spend it on a useless war! Healthcare for poor Americans is an abomination!

• Link
• Report this comment

“Premiums for employer-provided family coverage rose $3,065 — 24% — from 2008 to 2012, the Kaiser survey found. Even if you start counting in 2009, premiums have climbed $2,370.

What’s more, premiums climbed faster in Obama’s four years than they did in the previous four under President Bush, the survey data show.”

Peadawg – I researched your numbers and you are right about the first but your second claim is cherry-picking. Here are the calculations:

2000- $6438
2004 – $9950
2008 – $12680
2012 – $15745

So the increase from 2000-2004 (Bush) was $3512 which was a 55% increase, from 2004-2008 was $2730, a 27% increase, and from 2008-2012 was $3065, a 24% increase.

So there was LESS increase in the past for years than with either Bush terms.

• Link
• Report this comment

saywhat? – I never blamed Obama, I just gave the opinion that there is no end in sight for rising health care costs. Also, in case you weren’t aware, jobs are hard to come by these days.

Liberals chiding others about personal responsibility. Too funny. Don’t you know, “it takes a village.”

• Link
• Report this comment

Stevie Ray: “Nobody on this blog (i hope i’m mistaken) has a clue as to which is correct…economics has become so politicized”

Economics has ALWAYS been politicized, perhaps as no other field is. It’s just that we’re now once again waking up to just how much the case that is.

• Link
• Report this comment

You guys who keep going on about “free money”?

You … DO realize that we haven’t been on a gold standard since 1971.

Yes?

And that money is worth, basically, what we collectively determine it is worth?

Just wondering.

• Link
• Report this comment

Obamacare will hurt our country by hurting many small businesses… We will see less jobs created and it will actually hurt the quality of healthcare for many.

Here is how:
The bill outlaws what are called carve-out programs, so a company that could provide insurance to one group of employees but not another will no longer be able to do that so they will have to send all of their employees to the govt exchange. The penalty will be $2000 per year per employee, most small businesses will not be able to afford this new tax. Therefore, they will have to cut expenses to cover this, which means less employees. Since, about 55% of Americans work for small businesses, this won’t be good (and small businesses have been responsible for 65% of all new jobs created over the last 17 years). If a company falls on hard times and does provide health insurance and need to cut expenses they will have a choice….provide health insurance at an average costs of $8000 per employee per year or pay the $2000 fine. They will choose the fine, so more and more people end up on the govt plan. Clearly this will become a complete govt system and they will dictate what doctors and hospitals can charge. Good…except if you are a bright young student who can pick any field you want and the govt just lowered how much you can make as a doctor you will choose something else. You will also lower what companies make who supply goods and services to hospitals, lowering the amount of money available for R&D. Plus, when healthcare is free, everyone will run to the doctor every time they have the sniffles, so more people with less doctors…not a good formula.
Now, the country is already bankrupt, so how do you pay for this? The notion that you will cover half the costs from cutting wasteful spending in Medicaid/medicare is crazy. Find one govt agency that has successfully done that (hint- you can’t). So the short fall will fall on the federal budget. It will drive us further in debt at a time when we must be getting out of debt.

Please tell me how this is a good plan?

• Link
• Report this comment

so a small increase compared to large increase…is now a “decrease”…or is it a decreased increase??

• Link
• Report this comment

“FYI: Total state funds for Medicaid are $2.71 billion.”

Are you sure you a right about that, td? After all, you are wrong… A lot.

• Link
• Report this comment

Please tell me how this is a good plan?
______

The tax is less than the cost of maintaining health insurance for employees. That means more companies will drop health insurance and pay the tax.

That saves money for the company, and gets employers out of the health insurance business.

And that’s a good thing.

• Link
• Report this comment

A 2700-page law that nobody fully read before they voted for it, that was rammed in with questionable tactics with not a single vote from the other side, yep, that’s something you should be proud of, Jay. Doctors will be leaving in droves in the next few years, and there is projected to be a huge doctor shortage in years to come. But, hey, it’s what you liberals wanted, so you own it.
And Mary Elizabeth, you come on these blogs not to engage in discussion but to pontificate. You cite hyper-partisans like Krugman and Alter, but when challenged about reading articles from other more conservative writers, you clearly stated you “didn’t have the time.” Right. You have time to write for your own blog, which you frequently link to, you have time to write paragraph after paragraph on these blogs, but you don’t have time to read differing points of view. That’s why I and others have no respect for your opinions.

• Link
• Report this comment

Jay
November 21st, 2012
11:04 am

Moderate, the most recent stats I can find say that Massachusetts has the highest number of physicians per capita in the country.
++++
Perhaps the best known example of this approach has been Massachusetts, which since 2006 has mandated that every resident obtain health insurance and those that are below the federal poverty level gain free access to health care. But although the state has the second-highest ratio of primary care physicians to population of any state, they are struggling with access to primary care physicians.

“It would take 10 nurse practitioners to equal one primary care graduate, based on volume,” Wexler said.

I cited this article before which stated that Massachusetts has the second highest number of physicians so I am not sure whether what difference whether they have the second or first matters. However, as ABCNews article explains there is still a shortage of primary care doctors in Massachusetts.

Magically, med schools are going start producing more doctors. Magically, students more people will become smart enough to become doctors and magically more people will decide to become primary care doctors instead of practicing other forms of medicine and magically they will pick to be doctors instead of other professions.

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/doctor-shortage-health-care-crash/story?id=17708473#.UKz8todfCSo

I am actually for universal health care but I can not deny the basics of economics.

• Link
• Report this comment

A 2700-page law that nobody fully read before they voted for it
___

People read it. I read it. Those pages were mostly triple space with large type and very short lines.

Not all that hard to read.

• Link
• Report this comment

nunna yobinnnes- I was just channeling my inner conservative/libertarian. It surprisingly fun to be a self-righteous douche. I can see why so many are attracted to these otherwise useless philosophies.

Now about jobs being hard to come by- only lazy people can’t find work. If you had made good life choices like I did, you would already HAVE a job that provided insurance, like I do. So stop whining about costs and find those boot straps.

• Link
• Report this comment

there is still a shortage of primary care doctors in Massachusetts.

While I’m all for heading off future problems at the pass when such things are merited, Moderate, I have to ask–how much of this projected shortage is a direct result of the means by which the profession rations the number of individuals admitted to med school and licensed?

How do we differ from other nations on that score?

I honestly don’t know, but I suspect the answer to this particular problem might lie in the answers to those questions. (For what it’s worth, I did read the article you linked, and there was nothing in amongst the proposed solutions that address the issue of how we bring docs into the system in the first place.)

• Link
• Report this comment

Since the 600K new beneficiaries of Medicaid will be supported by Federal largesse, I don’t suppose we have anything to worry about. How silly of us that thought we’d be paying for it as taxpayers. How silly of us that didn’t know that Obama could wave a magic wand and produce manna.

• Link
• Report this comment

Saywhat —- Half the people are below average in IQ. Everyone can’t finish first like you.
If the jobs are not there. the top tier gets work, and the rest don’t.

• Link
• Report this comment

“The majority of Americans did NOT vote for Barry Soetero.”

Obama won a majority of the popular vote, silly goose.

• Link
• Report this comment

Lastly NO one has ever been denied emergency health coverage in the United States as all hospitals were mandated to not turn away patients.
_____

That rule only applys to hospitals that have emergency rooms. That’s why a lot of hospitals are dropping their emergency rooms.

Emergency rooms lose money and are a drain on overhead.

• Link
• Report this comment

” I never blamed Obama, I just gave the opinion that there is no end in sight for rising health care costs. Also, in case you weren’t aware, jobs are hard to come by these days”

You sure sounded like you were blaming Obamacare – you said your insurance said they were going up 19% because of the no-previous-condition clause.

You will be glad of that clause if you go to change insurance companies to get a cheaper policy and you have a previous condition.

You will also be glad of other Obamacare provisions if you got real sick and you insurance decided to “recission” you, leaving you without ANY insurance after you paid them those premiums all those years.

Previously, most people could not decide to retire early because they could not afford the insurance to bridge them between leaving their job and Medicare – perhaps with the new rules, they will be able to retire.

• Link
• Report this comment

dannyX- see note to oscar.

• Link
• Report this comment

““Ah yes, socialized medicine. “You have strep throat. We will spray your throat with Cepacol. Go home and do not come to us again about this issue.””

not intended to be a factual statement.*

• Link
• Report this comment

We will not know the full effects of the new healthcare bill for 2 or more years. I just can’t understand why one cannot look at the past history of ANY government program that is not over spent and BROKE. JAY knowing you are well read and informed on such matters, as I asked before (and got no reply) will you please tell me what if any govt. program has not gone BROKE?

• Link
• Report this comment

Oscar- You actually believe the government will do a better job?

Keep this in mind, the exchange will basically become a govt run insurance program with private insurers having to compete with govt’s exchange which is expected to be the state funded Medicaid portion. (which is what the supreme court ruled is unconstitutional…forcing the states to fund this). No private insurer will be able to compete with the govt and it limits the amount any insurer can profit at 20%. Sounds good in theory but if they can only make 20% this year then next year when they have losses of 50%, they cannot recoup that money. You will have less and less private insurers in this market…thus more people on the govt program.
Then the gov’t exchange will start dictating what they charge (it will happen). The govt program will negotiate with hospitals just like private insurers do now for what can be charged for every procedure. Medicaid and Medicare do this now. That is how Obama is claiming to have cut $716 Billion in Medicare/Medicaid….he simply lowered what they would pay hospitals and in return several facilities stopped accepting it. What do you think will happen when Medicare/Medicaid is the behemoth it will become with most Americans on it, it will have compete negotiating power. I didn’t pull that out of thin air, it is simply business and the Obama administration did it this year. I just don’t see how this is a good thing. It will hurt job creation and hurt the overall quality of healthcare. Sad but true.

• Link
• Report this comment

“Lastly NO one has ever been denied emergency health coverage in the United States as all hospitals were mandated to not turn away patients. So defacto everyone already had some type of health coverage.”

JJ – and who PAYS for that coverage (very EXPENSIVE ER medicine) – YOU AND I DO THROUGH OUR CURRENT INSURANCE PLANS. I would RATHER see them FORCED to obtain their own coverage.

• Link
• Report this comment

“Lastly NO one has ever been denied emergency health coverage in the United States as all hospitals were mandated to not turn away patients. So defacto everyone already had some type of health coverage”

ohfercryingoutloud … and if you have MS and can’t afford to purchase beta seron or one of the other meds to treat it, you’re supposed to go to the Emergency Room every other day??? If you have kidney problems, you can rock up to get dialysis whenever you need it???

sheesh THINK people … healthcare is more about emergency services.

• Link
• Report this comment

““Obama won a majority of the popular vote, silly goose.”

TWICE”

Only b/c the GOP couldn’t provide a competent option imo. I reluctantly voted for Obama a few weeks ago. It was a case of voting for the devil you know or the devil you don’t know.

• Link
• Report this comment

“will you please tell me what if any govt. program has not gone BROKE?”

None. ALL government programs go “broke” – because government is not a business and does not generate a profit. Forever, and always, WE the taxpayers have to pay the bills of the government.

• Link
• Report this comment

And for all the good Christians out there, who would Jesus insure?
…………………………………………………..
Jesus is the Republican healthcare plan for the poor.

• Link
• Report this comment

“I just can’t understand why one cannot look at the past history of ANY government program that is not over spent and BROKE”

The Republicans socialist Medicare Part D drug program has come in way under initial projections.

The socialist Georgia Bulldog football program makes a ton of money.

• Link
• Report this comment

“JJ – and who PAYS for that coverage (very EXPENSIVE ER medicine) – YOU AND I DO THROUGH OUR CURRENT INSURANCE PLANS. I would RATHER see them FORCED to obtain their own coverage”

Conservatives HATE personal responsibility – they want to make sure those ER visits are paid for by the TAXPAYER, dang it!

• Link
• Report this comment

Saywhat – “Now about jobs being hard to come by- only lazy people can’t find work. If you had made good life choices like I did, you would already HAVE a job that provided insurance, like I do. So stop whining about costs and find those boot straps.”

If only lazy people don’t have jobs with health coverage, then why are you so gung ho on providing heatlhcare coverage for lazy people? Seems to me you just shot yourself in the foot.

• Link
• Report this comment

WHY DO POOR WHITE PEOPLE VOTE AGAINST THEMSELVES..THE RICH WHITE PEOPLE WILL NOT SHARE ANY OF THEIR WEALTH WITH YOU BUT YOU CONTINUE TO VOTE FOR THEM..IF YOU ARE SOUTH OF HENRY, NORTH OF MARIETTA HEALTH INSURANCE IS SCARCE..BUT I AM SURE YOU VOTE AGAIN FOR NATHAN DEAL TO TELL YOU HE WILL NOT BE TAKING ADDITIONAL FUNDING OR PROGRAMS FOR THE DISADVANTAGED IN GA …JUST PLAIN STUPID IF YOU ASK ME

• Link
• Report this comment

the problem of doctors choosing something other than primary care.

It would seem to me that managing the fees paid for particular types of care needs to be massaged so that people have more of an incentive to go into primary care, if in fact those are the docs we need. Of course that’s what is a big part of the planned for Medicare savings, the infamous 700 billion “cuts” we heard about during the general election, if memory serves.

• Link
• Report this comment

“The GOP handed the 2012 election to Obama on a silver platter by selecting Romney.”

and again … the GOP didn’t pick him … the PEOPLE voted for him in the primary season. They had a whole field of people to choose from and they picked him.

• Link
• Report this comment

“The GOP handed the 2012 election to Obama on a silver platter by selecting Romney.”

Pity Elmer Fudd didn’t run for the nomination. We have it on good word that he would have won hands down.

• Link
• Report this comment

“Jesus is the Republican healthcare plan for the poor.”

Not anymore. Have you seen the Republican plan to privatize Jesus when he returns? There are big bucks to be earned. Here is a price list.

Giving sight to the blind…$1,000,000.00
Curing a cripple…$1,000,000.00
Raising the dead…$1,000,000,000.00

Jesus Inc will accept payment from major insurance companies only. No Medicare/Medicaid/Peachcare for Kids.

• Link
• Report this comment

Are all you libs ready to accept the hammering this bill is going to put on your beloved “less fortunate”? Between the price icreases to cover added expenses, the outright job cuts, the hours reduced to 30 to get under the “full time” rules, and the lack of a pay increase to hold expenses, they’re going to get HAMMERED by this thing.

The truly sad thing is, when it happens and they fall further behind, you’re never going to own up to being responsible for it. It’s gonna be ugly, libs, but it’s what you demanded. And every day you whine about it, I’m going to remind you it’s EXACTLY what I told you was going to happen.

• Link
• Report this comment

“And for all the good Christians out there, who would Jesus insure?”

Jesus wouldn’t let a doctor do it…Jesus would just do it himself.

• Link
• Report this comment

Why should they accept this disaster of a bill? Why? Just imagine if the shoe were on the other foot the Dems would never ever give up! Obamacare is only for us serfs: Congress has exempted themselves from this most historic bill they held so high. But not meant for Fancy Nancy & Company – no no no! Federal employees can shop nationwide, have excellent coverage including long term care & those of us forced to drop our plans pay for their gilded coverage. So ultimately after all consumer driven plans ie HSA’s and FSA’s are gone, after employers dump their employees into the rationed & pricey DMV-styled exchanges, we have only the Obama& the Dems to blame since they are incompetent ideological leftists with their iron boots strapped on tight. Obamaland: I’ve Seen You Future& It Doesn’t Work. Read the book by a British citizen. We are doomed. But the Masterminds on the Left have it all under control.

• Link
• Report this comment

“YOU AND I DO THROUGH OUR CURRENT INSURANCE PLANS. I would RATHER see them FORCED to obtain their own coverage.”

That’s what I’ve been saying all along. The naysayers just don’t get it that they pay more now because of the law their gawd, the great emperor Reagan, enacted that says ERs have to take any patient regardless of ability to pay. Somebody pays for it, and it’s the insured. Bring that cost down, and we all benefit, IMO.

• Link
• Report this comment

If you really want to get an idea of how Christians would handle this, there is a great book by Steve Corbett and Brian Fikkert titled ‘When Helping Hurts – How to alleviate poverty without hurting the poor… and yourself’.

It is a well written book about how to help the poor without creating dependency.

• Link
• Report this comment

No one knows the reality of Obamacare. It’s going to be a fun ride…

• Link
• Report this comment

The only sensible comment I’ve read is that we’ll learn as we go along. Not a very smart way to go about the business of governing, but the way it is now being done.

Well put. I may get agitated here when dealing with what seem to me to be deliberately silly people, but I do think there are, generally, enough springs and shock absorbers, so to speak, built into our nation’s weird patchwork that we manage to muddle through somehow.

I happened upon this excellent interview with Bill McBride, the guy behind the must-read Calculated Risk blog, who was asked about the “fiscal cliff.” and it kinda reminded me of what you’d posted, so I will share.

JW: I’ve noticed you’ve been fairly sanguine about the fiscal cliff, both in terms of the effects if we go a little into January without a deal, and also the prospect of getting a deal, you don’t seem too concerned. Could you frame your thinking around that and why you’re not too worried if we go into January and taxes jump and spending goes down?

BM: Well, I think the hardest thing to do is predict what politicians are going to do. It’s hard to imagine, but of course we saw the debt ceiling debate a year ago, that people are really that crazy. Obviously, tax rates are going to go up in some way on the high income earners, that’s why I originally thought they’d let it slide past January and then vote, so that Republicans could say “Oh we’re just cutting taxes we’re not raising any”. They could do that now and say they’re going to expire and there’s nothing you can do about it. You can’t predict, really. You kind of have to say, “well are they going to do something dumb or are they going to come to some sort of compromise?” I think they’ll come to some sort of compromise that seems like the most logical thing to me. I could be wrong about that.

• Link
• Report this comment