Mitt Romney, exit stage right. A little quicker, please …
Mitt Romney tried to explain his loss Wednesday to disappointed financial backers by telling them that he would have gotten away with it without that durned 47 percent:
“The Obama campaign was following the old playbook of giving a lot of stuff to groups that they hoped they could get to vote for them and be motivated to go out to the polls, specifically the African American community, the Hispanic community and young people. In each case they were very generous in what they gave to those groups.”
“With regards to African American voters, ‘Obamacare’ was a huge plus — and was highly motivational to African American voters. You can imagine for somebody making $25—, or $30—, or $35,000 a year, being told you’re now going to get free healthcare — particularly if you don’t have it, getting free healthcare worth, what, $10,000 a family, in perpetuity, I mean this is huge. Likewise with Hispanic voters, free healthcare was a big plus….”
“With regards to Hispanic voters, the amnesty for the children of illegals — the so-called Dream Act kids — was a huge plus for that voting group. On the negative side, of course, they always characterized us as being anti-immigrant, being tough on illegal immigration, and so forth, so that was very effective with that group.”
So let me get this straight: When Romney, in the first debate, promised a tax cut to the middle class, he wasn’t promising them a gift? When he wooed his backers on Wall Street by telling them that he would repeal Dodd Frank, abolish the Consumer Finance Protection Bureau and lower corporate taxes, that wasn’t promising a gift?
When he went to Viriginia to promise to build even more nuclear-powered submarines that just happened to be built right there in Virginia, that wasn’t a gift? When he went to coal country to promise to weaken environmental regulations that protect the air we breathe, that wasn’t a gift? When he traveled to Florida to promise to replace $716 billion in Medicare funding allegedly cut by the Obama administration, that wasn’t a gift?
Or is it only a “gift” when offered to poor African Americans or Hispanic Americans?
All in all, it is quite something to see complaints about pandering from a man who wafted in the political breeze with all the gravity of a dandelion seed.
It’s true that Romney’s political career has now ended, and that his sole remaining function is to sit on the stage during the inaugural ceremonies, his presence required as official recognition of his own defeat. But the mindset that he revealed in that infamous “47 percent” tape, the mindset that he confirms in his latest remarks, continues to be a serious problem for the party he represented.
And once again, Bobby Jindal of all people gets it. Asked about Romney’s remarks in a press conference, Jindal became “visibly agitated,” Politico reports.
“No, I think that’s absolutely wrong. Two points on that: One, we have got to stop dividing the American voters. We need to go after 100 percent of the votes, not 53 percent. We need to go after every single vote.
“And, secondly, we need to continue to show how our policies help every voter out there achieve the American Dream, which is to be in the middle class, which is to be able to give their children an opportunity to be able to get a great education. … So, I absolutely reject that notion, that description. I think that’s absolutely wrong.”
He reiterated the points for emphasis.
“I don’t think that represents where we are as a party and where we’re going as a party,” he said. “That has got to be one of the most fundamental takeaways from this election: If we’re going to continue to be a competitive party and win elections on the national stage and continue to fight for our conservative principles, we need two messages to get out loudly and clearly: One, we are fighting for 100 percent of the votes, and secondly, our policies benefit every American who wants to pursue the American dream. Period. No exceptions.”
– Jay Bookman
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382 comments Add your comment
alex
November 15th, 2012
10:46 am
Equating Schumer with ANYONE is a hideous example of human behavior and will NOT be tolerated on this blog,……
King Bee
November 15th, 2012
10:46 am
As a proud liberal/socialist I just want to give mitt a giant, “Thank you!”.
YOU were our secret weapon, Mitt! Your mouth…your deeds…they won us the election, they have given us the Supreme Court. You have pushed the United States to the left…hard! And maybe for a generation or more, gods willing!
Seriously…thank you, thank you, thank you!
PLEASE!!! Keep telling anyone who will listen your thoughts and philosophies.
But would you please not roof-rack the dog anymore???
Thanks!
Welcome to the Occupation
November 15th, 2012
10:47 am
AmericaShrugged: Obama gave, Romney just promised, big difference … ma spent almost his entire first term buying votes for his re-election. Great stregy, ti worked. But at what cost to America?”
I actually don’t disagree with that in its general thrust. But the question remains: How does your position claim when you recognize that MItt Romney will be just as cynical, just as mercenary, just as corrupt in seeking clients for to spread around favors to, as Obama could ever be?
(Hint: the disease is BI-PARTISAN.)
Mary Elizabeth
November 15th, 2012
10:47 am
Thomas Heyward, Jr., 10:35 am
You left out the essential paragraph of Krugman’s thought. Let me post it for you:
“And I don’t think the Republican party as currently constituted can change this: after 45 years of the Southern strategy, this stuff is what defines the party’s soul.”
Welcome to the Occupation
November 15th, 2012
10:47 am
AmericaShrugged: Obama gave, Romney just promised, big difference … ma spent almost his entire first term buying votes for his re-election. Great stregy, ti worked. But at what cost to America?”
I actually don’t disagree with that in its general thrust. But the question remains: How does your position claim when you recognize that MItt Romney will be just as cynical, just as mercenary, just as corrupt in seeking clients for to spread around favors to, as Obama could ever be?
(Hint: the disease is BI-PARTISAN.)
Keep Up the Good Fight!
November 15th, 2012
10:47 am
Why Mitt already told you that you had free healthcare by just going to the emergency room…. do you people never listen to those you nominate?
janet
November 15th, 2012
10:47 am
Wife Ann said she was worried about Mitt’s mental health if he was elected. I think she should be worried about his mental health period. He isn’t coping well with defeat so he blames it on everyone else. Sir, get thee to a clinic but first have a big glass of milk. You will feel better.
alex
November 15th, 2012
10:47 am
You are on I-285, there are no turns, Back to Atlanta Public Schools for you…
mase
November 15th, 2012
10:48 am
Its funny how everyone is saying the Republicans should listen to what the American people said in the election…what if the American people were wrong?
barking frog
November 15th, 2012
10:49 am
O.K. romneycons please reveal the romneyplan that offered jobs.
Erwin's cat
November 15th, 2012
10:50 am
O.K. romneycons please reveal the romneyplan that offered jobs.
it really doesn’t matter now does it?
DannyX
November 15th, 2012
10:51 am
“I heard from some late night comedian that the 25,000 votes for Texas to succeed were all from out of state..”
Thats pretty funny Stevie Ray, but I don’t want Texas to go.
Texas is very rapidly trending blue. Can you imagine the nightmare Republicans will face when looking at the electoral college map with Texas colored blue?
alex
November 15th, 2012
10:52 am
If California secedes will we still have to bail them out…..?Anyway, I hope that Waycross secedes…
DebbieDoRight - Math has a very strong anti-conservative bias
November 15th, 2012
10:52 am
That Mitt Romney — One Class Act!
stands for decibels
November 15th, 2012
10:53 am
SEE-sesshun SHEETZ! yee-hawww!
Butch Cassidy (I)
November 15th, 2012
10:53 am
On the bright side, with his election loss, Romney now qualifies as a Fox News spokesman. He’s free to appear on FNC anytime he wants and give his insights on how the guy that beat him really doesn’t know what he’s doing.
Redcoat
November 15th, 2012
10:55 am
Where are the rich Dem./Lib. job creators? are they creating jobs? where are these jobs? what kind of jobs are they? are they sitting on their money, and if so, why? What are they waiting on?
I know no one can directly answer these questions…..wish someone could
ahnald
November 15th, 2012
10:57 am
The 47% starts this country on a downward spiral, hands out, ready for big government to help them…Obozo wants you dependent on him, that is why he won….with ObozoCare looming, do you think companies are going to hire people and try and grow, NO WAY, Obozo is anti business, I want to grow my business and prosper but his policies and climate he has created scare me to death
Real Scootter
November 15th, 2012
10:58 am
Can anyone tell me where to go to signup for my free stuff? Please
DebbieDoRight - Math has a very strong anti-conservative bias
November 15th, 2012
10:59 am
He isn’t coping well with defeat so he blames it on everyone else.
Thats the “spoiled -given everything i’ve ever wanted-never had to do hard labor a day in my life- i DESERVE this- rich boy” attitude.
Cat: it really doesn’t matter now does it?
Obviously, to his voters, it NEVER mattered.
ahnald
November 15th, 2012
11:00 am
You do not use government spending to work your way out the financial ditch we are in, that is very basic….you create jobs, businesses do that, not the government
Krystal'sBalls
November 15th, 2012
11:01 am
Some of you people kill me with your stereotypes. You sit on your highhorses and look down at other people as leeches because they may be getting some government benefit. Meanwhile this SAME individual handed you your coffee through the Dunkin’ Donuts drivethrough this morning, or bagged your groceries at Publix or Kroger this morning, or even just walked into the restroom to clean up the piss that your trifling asses dump all over the floor around the urinals or scrub your feces from around the toilet because YOU were too damned nasty to clean up after YOURSELVES. You have ZERO perspective, yet you think you are the salt of the earth. To go along with that, many of you pretenders out here are really no further beyond those you ridicule and could find yourselves in the same situation in an instant. You’re just angry becaue SOMEONE ELSE tells you you should be. Pitiful.
King Bee
November 15th, 2012
11:02 am
“The 47% starts this country on a downward spiral, hands out, ready for big government to help them…”
If it’s for the 47%…The Grand Old Tea Partier’s say…It’s Bad, it’s Socialism!
If it’s a government handout/bailout/tax-break/welfare for them…it’s American as Apple Pie!
Sheila
November 15th, 2012
11:06 am
Romney was so arrogant he kept saying “When I’m President”, since he seemed to claim moral superiority, perhaps he should have read the verse that says,”pride goeth before a fall”. As for gifts, he was protecting the rich from higher taxes. Even Buffet says it’s not fair that his secretary pays higher taxes than he does.
mase
November 15th, 2012
11:07 am
Krystals..that post is not stereotyping people at all.
Rich
November 15th, 2012
11:07 am
Wonder what would happen with Fortune 500 companies if they hired law professors instead of qualified MBA’s to run their operations. Only in government can the less qualified person be chosen for the job.
deegee
November 15th, 2012
11:08 am
And the most disturbing thing is that he was talking to a bunch of financial backers. He was trying to keep them on board so that they would feel confident about spending more of their money on republican causes. What a stupid SOB Mitt the Twit turned out to be.
DannyX
November 15th, 2012
11:08 am
“You do not use government spending to work your way out the financial ditch we are in, that is very basic….you create jobs, businesses do that, not the government”
ahnald is right. To create jobs you hand out massive tax cuts then start trillion dollar wars, and of course start socialist Medicare Part D drug programs. Spend and untax! Businesses do that, not governments. Or something like that.
All hail the job creators!!!!!!
frank burns
November 15th, 2012
11:09 am
Well Zeke, first of all there is no truth in him being a socialist. So you are barking up the wrong tree there.
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
November 15th, 2012
11:10 am
perhaps he should have read the verse that says,”pride goeth before a fall”.
Perhaps you should reread Proverbs 16:18
Pride goeth before destruction,
and a haughty spirit before a fall.
ahnald
November 15th, 2012
11:11 am
Krystal…I have worked those kind of jobs you mention…what is your point ?…earned me $ to go to college and beyond…and then on MY OWN, NO HELP from THE GOVT, started a business and have done well..The President has no idea or plan on how to move this economy forward, NONE….Obozocare is a joke
DannyX
November 15th, 2012
11:12 am
“Wonder what would happen with Fortune 500 companies if they hired law professors instead of qualified MBA’s to run their operations. Only in government can the less qualified person be chosen for the job.”
Exactly Rich, what this country needs is a businessman like George W Bush with his MBA from that Ivy League university to lead us to economic utopia!
southpaw
November 15th, 2012
11:13 am
Ronnie Raygun @8:38
After seeing some of the recent Nobel Prize winners, I’m less impressed with that distinction than I used to be. Compare Paul Krugman to Walt Williams? No, not necessarily. I just figure that Walt Williams can describe liberalism at least as well as Paul Krugman can describe conservatism.
“Worship” Ayn Rand? Believe it or not, you can get some ideas from other people without “worshipping” them. Williams “worships” Rand about as much as Krugman “worships” the government.
Regnad Kcin
November 15th, 2012
11:15 am
“You do not use government spending to work your way out the financial ditch we are in, that is very basic….you create jobs, businesses do that, not the government”
Then why are “job creators” continually whining about what the government does? Just create the dam jobs!
Oh, I see – you can’t do that without your government handouts…uh huh…
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
November 15th, 2012
11:16 am
…and then on MY OWN, NO HELP from THE GOVT, started a business and have done well..
You built your own roads, bridges and tunnels?
You built your own sewer system, water treatment facilities, and solid waste disposal system?
You have your own fire department and police force?
WOW! You are one bad stud.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TIZb8d87AI
catlady
November 15th, 2012
11:17 am
Jackie@8:04–But it is such a BIG family!
Well, he has plenty he can do. He can put several tens of thousands out of work, for example. He can offshore a whole boatload of money, for example. He can get his wife a new Caddy, for example.
He will NEVER be a senior statesman. Just an old, washed-up, political has-been who wasn’t liked by much of anybody.
Jason
November 15th, 2012
11:18 am
C’mon, Jay:
Allowing people to keep more of their income is not a gift. No tax cut of any kind could ever be called a gift. I didn’t take the time to scroll through all 325 comments, but I sure hope I am not the only one making this point.
Also, these are comments he made to the biggest donors in his campaign: do we really need to pick nits over how he characterizes his loss to them? Obviously he is going to try to cover his flank. Romney loss, and he probably deserved to, but he is an imminently decent, well-meaning human being who went into politics for pure reason. I keep telling my GOP friends and family who think the world is ending the same thing about Obama. Just because the other guy has an (R) or a (D) behind their name doesn’t mean they’re evil.
P.S. To all the right-leaning commentators and politicos: there is no connection between Patraeus and Bangahzi. Stop burning credibility and save it for the fights that matter. That is all.
Skip
November 15th, 2012
11:19 am
ahnaid, you got running water? Need I go on?
AmericaShrugged
November 15th, 2012
11:19 am
Welcome – I agree with you. What was Bush doing creating the almost worthless but expensive Medicare (D)? It was a handout to buy re-election votes.
I’m socially liberal and fiscally conservative and what bothers me most is the tax handouts they both made.
Early on Bush was asked what happened to the surplus he inherited. He said we had a recession, we were attacked, and we’re at war. All true but he left out that in the face of all that he pushed through the largest tax cut in history, primarily for the rich.
Obama, faced with a big recession, gave a 2% reduction in SS, a vital system already facing financial problems. Has anyone noticed what the SS numbers were for 2011? As recently as 2008 SS was predicted to run a surplus through 2015. However, due to the recession, vastly increased numbers of unemployed and disability beneficiaries, and the 2% cut SS ran over $700B shortage in 2011!
Meanwhile the Reps won’t increase taxes on the rich and the Dems won’t cut entitlements.
Take whatever money you have left and buy weapons and canned goods because this isn’t going to work!
independent thinker
November 15th, 2012
11:27 am
Here’s how Mr. LOSER gets free stuff rom the government and makes millions on it without any disclosure in his presidential mandatory disclosures:
“”"”"”"”"”As Palast reported, a trust in Ann Romney’s name listed “more than $1 million” invested with Elliott Management, run by hedge fund guru and GOP mega-donor Paul Singer. (That’s the minimum amount of disclosure required by law, so it could have been much more than $1 million.) Singer subsequently snapped up large amounts of stock in Delphi at pennies on the dollar, and then, along with other hedge funds, demanded that the government assume pension responsibilities and bail the company out—or they would shut it down, thus crushing General Motors as well.
The government acceded, Delphi became lucrative again and then went public, and Elliott Management and its investors—including Romney—reaped enormous rewards.
Under any rational interpretation of the Ethics in Government Act of 1978, these are holdings that a presidential candidate would need to disclose, because they can be affected by government action. The Romney campaign doesn’t argue that they are not, but rather that, since Ann Romney’s trust is “blind,” there is no disclosure requirement.
Today’s letter points out, however, that Ann Romney’s trust is blind in name only. Romney himself has said that “the blind trust is an age-old ruse, if you will. Which is to say you can always tell a blind trust what it can and cannot do.” Moreover, this is not a federally recognized blind trust of the sort Romney would be forced to create if he won the White House. If it was, he would have never been able to reap his windfall from Delphi, the letter points out.”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”
http://www.thenation.com/blog/170967/did-mitt-romney-break-law-failing-disclose-delphi-investments#
LIAR, LOSER, CHEAT, HYPOCRITE, DRAFT DODGER, INCOMPETENT CAMPAIGN MANAGER-
I hope the those rich SOBs who got fleeced by Romney and Rove use those words and sue his behind for a refund. Even his father would hate this Loser.
Krystal'sBalls
November 15th, 2012
11:31 am
mase
November 15th, 2012
11:07 am
Please tell me where I am stereotyping anyone? Nobody stated that everyone working in any of those capacities is receiving public assistance, only that the SALARY RANGE commanded by each of those POSITIONS make someone more likely to have to rely on some sort of public assistance. But then again your mind is small which is why you have really nothing of substance to say in response, only some dumb little one liner to try and detract from the point. I give PEOPLE the dignity their work (whatever type as long as legitimate) deserves.
DownInAlbany
November 15th, 2012
11:36 am
I don’t think anyone has explained why anything to do with Mitt Romney is “news.” Why even mention his name? We get it…all things democratic = good; all things republican = BAD! Dang, is it going to be 4 years of “blame Romney?” Anything to deflect from Obama’s failed 1st presidency, I guess. O gets a pass from you people on everything. (and, I’m the one with my head up my ___! OoooKkkkk)
Jeb Bush 2012
November 15th, 2012
11:38 am
Many negro and hispanics voted for obummer because he gave them free stuff – just like Mitt said! Mitt would have worked with our Tea Party Patriots to DEMAND additonal tax cuts for the Job Creator class. Even most negroes and hispanics agree that they are part of the problem, the “entitled” 47 percent that pay NO TAXES!
In 2016, a Jeb Bush, Lez Cheney ticket will win. Then we can begin to end demorat socialist programs like Socialism Security, Mediscam, and so called unemployment “benefits”! In the meantime, we in the GOP need to educate voters better. Women need to understand that pregnancy from rape is a gift of life, as Rep Mourdock explained. That their so called rapist is blessing them with the seed of life! hispanics should leave (self deport) because America is for Americans (not kenyans either)! Our GOP ideas are great! Newt Gingrich’s Junior Janitor brigade for example was an excellent idea, lets get these little hoodlums of the streets where as he said ” they sell crack and pimp their sisters”, and get them to “clean our schools and houses”!
Go GOP!
Krystal'sBalls
November 15th, 2012
11:39 am
ahnald
November 15th, 2012
11:11 am
And guess WHAT there skip?? YOU were one of the very people held in CONTEMPT by the person you are TODAY. Of course your perspective is gone because you have obviously forgotten where you came from!! I too have worked “those” jobs. I however have NEVER and WILL never forget where I have come.
Hilarious how you sit TODAY and gloat on how YOU “worked hard” because you were able to ultimately accumulate a little “something”, yet the people currently in the situation YOU were in at one time don’t get the same consideration. Indicative of the type of person you are.
PewtieNewtie
November 15th, 2012
11:55 am
Mitt Douchebag…
FlaminioX
November 15th, 2012
11:55 am
Romney lost because he offered jobs to a country that doesn’t want to work and has become Obama-dependent!
Bob
November 15th, 2012
11:57 am
So let me get this straight: When Romney, in the first debate, promised a tax cut to the middle class, he wasn’t promising them a gift?
A TAX BREAK IS NOT A GIFT BECAUSE THE MONEY WAS NEVER THE GOVERNMENTS TO BEGIN WITH. GOVERNMENT CREATES NOTHING, IT ONLY TAKES AND DISTRIBUTES. YOU LIBS ARE SO F*****G DENSE.
Joe Hussein Mama
November 15th, 2012
12:00 pm
Paul — “Which is why I said based on what we knew at the time. I believe the CIA never verified her status and gave a record of their reasoning until after the special investigation was concluded.”
The CIA wouldn’t *do* that before the investigation was over anyway.
They’re not in the habit of divulging classified info — or the fact that something *is* classified — unless there’s a pretty strong reason to do so.
“But the larger issue is still the number of people on the Left who think it was Cheney or Libby who ‘outed’ Plame.”
FWIW, there’s circumstantial evidence that implicates Cheney, and I personally feel that Rove and Libby conspired to protect him. That said, I recognize that I have no hard evidence to support my supposition.
Joe Hussein Mama
November 15th, 2012
12:07 pm
Bob — “A TAX BREAK IS NOT A GIFT BECAUSE THE MONEY WAS NEVER THE GOVERNMENTS TO BEGIN WITH. GOVERNMENT CREATES NOTHING, IT ONLY TAKES AND DISTRIBUTES. YOU LIBS ARE SO F*****G DENSE.”
Bob, I just LOVE the early start you’re getting on the 2016 campaign.
You go with that line, k? I’m sure it’ll work wonders for y’all next go-round.
(giggling)
mase
November 15th, 2012
12:32 pm
Krystals…you stereotyped those folks who you accused were stereotyping people on public assistance, “as people who “were too damned nasty to clean up after YOURSELVES. You have ZERO perspective, yet you think you are the salt of the earth. To go along with that, many of you pretenders out here are really no further beyond those you ridicule and could find yourselves in the same situation in an instant. You’re just angry becaue SOMEONE ELSE tells you you should be. “
Jason
November 15th, 2012
12:54 pm
Joe Hussein Mama-
I raised the same point without profanity, and it’s a good one: tax cuts are not a gift. I usually think Jay is at least a thoughtful commentator, even though I disagree with most of his politics. But in this case when he equates entitlements to tax cuts he is trying to score cheap rhetorical points at the expense of intellectual honesty. And I’d ask all of you on this blog so anxious to castigate Romney to ask yourselves an honest question: do you pay income taxes or federal taxes of any kind? If the answer is no, then try to imagine that you do, and every month when you get get your paycheck – the one you split three or four or – as in my case – five ways to support a family. How would you feel about someone equating a tax cut with an entitlement? A tax cut is simply putting some of what those people earn back in their paychecks.
I’d go so far as to call the comparison offensive,
TiredOfIt
November 15th, 2012
1:00 pm
America wasn’t ready for a king and queen. Maybe Willard can put on a uniform and party with Jill and Scott Kelley. Better yet pay off their bills.
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
November 15th, 2012
1:08 pm
…do you pay income taxes or federal taxes of any kind?
Do yourself a favor and google federal excise tax.
clem
November 15th, 2012
1:20 pm
some moron cried about jobless claims….does sandy ring a bell?
deegee
November 15th, 2012
1:49 pm
This morning I was listening to a serious discussion on CNBC over how to resolve the impasse over the country’s finances. A number of serious recommendations were made concerning tax cuts and tax revenues. Then some CEO of some big corporation says that the best way to resolve the problem is to expand the economy. So they asked him point blank how that can be accomplished. His answer, “Instill some confidence within corporate America.” Isn’t that just grand? Send out the unicorns and shower gold dust among the land. Let’s face it, the days of blowing big economic bubbles are over. You can’t lower interest rates any lower than they are. We can’t export our way out of this. Asia is slowing down. What do they pay these big shot CEOs to do all day?
Jason
November 15th, 2012
1:51 pm
Kamchak – T from the Steppes:
I didn’t mean for that to sound condescending – I’m simply arguing that if you see a third of your paycheck go to the federal government every month, you should be offended at the suggestion that a tax cut is a “gift” on par with a federal entitlement.
And even though your condescension was entirely intended, I’ll tell you that I don’t need to do myself any favors by googling federal excise taxes. They aren’t relevant to the point I was making.
Jason
November 15th, 2012
1:58 pm
Kamchak -
One more point on excise taxes: so I assume you would be in favor of eliminating all payroll taxes in favor of a flat tax on all goods and services? You won’t find many people who voted for Romney who would oppose that idea. You do realize that most Republicans would prefer that ALL taxes be excise taxes.
Don’t kid yourself that people who buy gas and cigarettes and alcohol are paying taxes on par with people who fork over a third or more of their paycheck to Uncle Sam. Mainly because people who pay income taxes are also subject to excise taxes.
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
November 15th, 2012
2:07 pm
Don’t kid yourself that people who buy gas and cigarettes and alcohol are paying taxes on par with people who fork over a third or more of their paycheck to Uncle Sam.
Now you’re moving the goalposts.
I never asserted anything of the sort.
You said, “do you pay income taxes or federal taxes of any kind?”
Last time I checked federal excise taxes were a form of “federal taxes of any kind”.
I may have been born at night, but it wasn’t last night, sport.
pete
November 15th, 2012
2:18 pm
The media is getting closer to the truth about Benghazi. This administration can only play keep away for so long. This whole Paula Broadway story is a smoke screen to keep folks away from the REAL story here. Thank God we have a FEW REAL journalists out there covering it.
So, while the Obama media is out celebrating the re-election of the messiah, lets take a brief look at what is going on in the real world;
Thousands STILL homeless in New York and New Jersey.
More lay offs announced.
400,000+ jobless, which shot up after the election…I wonder why?
Rockets launched in Gaza while troops build up on border..
Recession imminent.
You MAY want to report on what is really going on instead of gloating the re-election of Obama.
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
November 15th, 2012
2:22 pm
This whole Paula Broadway story is a smoke screen to keep folks away from the REAL story here.
They say the neon lights shine bright on Broadway….
Jason
November 15th, 2012
2:29 pm
“I never asserted anything of the sort.”
You sure implied it. It should have been obvious that I was referring to federal payroll taxes. My point was that it is specious to compare payroll taxes – which are taken out of earnings – and entitlements. By responding to my argument by saying “excise taxes,” it would be reasonable to assume that you were arguing that by virtue of paying excise taxes, people who do not pay payroll taxes can relate to the experience of having a third of their paycheck go directly to Uncle Sam (in the immortal words of Chris Rock, “you don’t PAY taxes – they TAKE them; that’s a JACK”). Otherwise, why say it? And you didn’t just say it, you condescendingly told me to “do myself a favor and google excise taxes,” as if it completely invalidated my point.
Admittedly, I probably didn’t do myself any favors with the way I worded my question about whether any of the people on this blog paid taxes. I didn’t mean for that to sound so smug, but looking back at it it does come across that way.
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
November 15th, 2012
2:34 pm
It should have been obvious that I was referring to federal payroll taxes.
Again — “or federal taxes of any kind”
You can’t even own your words without caveats.
Geez….
Jason
November 15th, 2012
2:38 pm
Pete-
Dude. Benghazi was a terrible and unfortunate event, and probably could have been handled better, first by the State Department and, yes, the President. But there’s nothing there. There is much better fodder for criticism of the Obama Administration, and the GOP is wasting capital on Patraeus. If I hear one more person say “what did they know, and when did they know it?” my head will explode. The Patraeus story has nothing – NOTHING – to do with Benghazi. I can assure you that no one was more irritated with the timing of the Patraeus resignation than Obama, because now you’ve got the media hyperventilating over a scandal that now involves sex – hence the MSM’s participation.
Guess what? The Congress has subpoena power. GP is gonna testify whether he’s still the head of the CIA or not. He waited until after the election to resign out of loyalty to his Commander in Chief. To use an old Clinton expression, “there’s no THERE there.”
Tony Drake
November 15th, 2012
2:49 pm
Mr. Bookman,
you said, “So let me get this straight: When Romney, in the first debate, promised a tax cut to the middle class, he wasn’t promising them a gift? ”
No, it’s not a gift to give me back the money i earned.
Jason
November 15th, 2012
2:50 pm
Kamchak-
This conversation is starting to resemble arguments with my wife. I was making an argument. As most most people do when they make arguments, I used a series of sentences to make that argument, all of which supported it in one way or another. I used the words “federal taxes of any kind” (which I really only said to make clear I was including social security) when I should have said “federal payroll taxes.” But it did not effect my major premise at all. In response you said “excise taxes,” which was a response to a minor premise contained in the argument that had no effect on the point I was making. And you’re acting like you won the argument. I don’t even know if we disagree, frankly, because you have yet to respond to my ACTUAL point. I have no idea whether you agree with it or not.
This, in a nutshell, is why we’re all f*cked.
Which is more or less how things play out at home for me. To wit,
Me: I cleaned the house in thirty minutes, I got the kids dressed and to school, I picked them up, made them dinner and put them to bed. I think I have earned the right to watch the game with some friends.
Her: It took you 35 minutes to clean the house.
Me: (sigh)
Brandt Hardin
November 15th, 2012
2:51 pm
After the election, Romney should know better than anyone that money just can’t buy everything. Despite all odds, our President prevailed. He still has an uphill battle fighting a Red House which has blocked his every move in an attempt to squash his goals of bringing the Middle Class equal pay, women’s rights, gay rights and affordable healthcare. The Bush Administration drove our economy into a swift nose dive and Obama is still the patsy. Watch conservative hands paint him in Blackface with a visual commentary of how Barack has been bamboozled at http://dregstudiosart.blogspot.com/2012/10/bamboozling-obama.html
Jay
November 15th, 2012
2:52 pm
“No, it’s not a gift to give me back the money i earned.”
No, Tony, it’s not the money you earned. The money you earned has already been spent by your government. Any tax cut sending money back your way would be financed with money that is borrowed from the Chinese and others, money that your children and grandchildren and great-grandchildren will be forced to repay on your behalf.
Jason
November 15th, 2012
4:03 pm
“No, Tony, it’s not the money you earned. The money you earned has already been spent by your government. Any tax cut sending money back your way would be financed with money that is borrowed from the Chinese and others, money that your children and grandchildren and great-grandchildren will be forced to repay on your behalf.”
Jay- I usually think you’re pretty level-headed and rational, even when I disagree with you. But this statement is indefensible. It contradicts private legal principals of contract, public legal principals of government debt and taxation and private property ownership. The government can’t spend our money; it can only spend its own. The government’s revenue is derived from private property (in this case wages). The United States Government is a distinct legal entity, and it is a participant in the private market. It has it’s own legal obligations and debt, and they are separate and distinct from ours. The best way – the only way – to describe the government’s relationship to our wages is that the government has borrowed massive amounts of money to pay its obligations. Its collateral for that that loan is its accounts receivable – aka, tax revenues.
Taking your statement to its logical conclusion, there would be no private property ownership as long as there is a budget deficit. Hopefully this is a case of a late-afternoon blood-sugar crash.
Jay
November 15th, 2012
4:06 pm
“The United States Government is a distinct legal entity, and it is a participant in the private market. It has it’s own legal obligations and debt, and they are separate and distinct from ours.”
Jason, as a matter of law, as a matter of The U.S. Constitution, as a matter of financial reality, that is simply not true. Do the words “We the People …” ring a bell?
Jason
November 15th, 2012
4:32 pm
You’re making my point. “We the people…” is the opening line in the The Constitution. The Constitution is the legal contract between the United States government and its citizens. All of the government’s authority is derived from the Constitution, and that authority is limited by the Constitution. The United States government is a distinct legal entity that can borrow money, enter contracts, spend money. It cannot spend my money, and I cannot spend its money. I cannot be sued for the debt of the United States government.
I’m general counsel for a private defense contractor, so this is not just an academic exercise for me. I can assure you that I see contracts which are executed in the name of the United States federal government every day. In every single respect, the United States government is an entity distinct from its citizens. The best analogy – in a private context – might be that United States is corporation and the citizens are shareholders.
I’m not saying that the fact that the government is borrowing money from China to pay its bills cannot have an adverse effect on the citizenry. For example, the credit rating of the US Government affects how much it costs to borrow money privately. But it is inaccurate to say that the government has already spent our wages. It has a lien on our wages as they are earned, but just like a bank has to foreclose on a house to be able to possess it, the government has to take the step of taxing our wages before it can spend them. Not that that even slows it down…
rc
November 15th, 2012
5:14 pm
Yea don’t tell the truth or face facts. Just make it up and demonize Romney That plays to your base
ld
November 15th, 2012
6:42 pm
DAMN. I missed out. The only gifts I got from any political campaign this year have been an in-box full of irritating e-mails.
Tom in Atlanta
November 15th, 2012
7:00 pm
Hey it’s Judge Judy – but if you take the time to watch it – it is very revealing about the mentatility of some of those accepting entitlements – they just don’t get it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFke1xOaTEA
This is what is wrong with our country – Money for nothing – but instead of addressing the problem – all you’ll hear is howls of racism.
One of the Three Nephites
November 15th, 2012
7:06 pm
The great deceiver Mitt Romney has habitually lied to the American public. He also lied when he went to see Billy Graham just a few weeks before the election to get his endorsement of the Mormon Church.
Do you think he told Billy Graham about the secret Mormon Temple Ceremonies that involves secret temple oaths, laws of sacrifice and consecration involving Mormon theocracy, strict obedience and sworn secrecy of all the Temple rituals? And all this while dressed in white robes, white hats, green aprons and chanting with raised hands at temple altars.
Romney, the compulsive liar and deceiver told him nothing about this.
Do you think Billy Graham would have endorsed Romney and his Mormon church if he was aware of these clandestine Temple rituals?
Look for yourself. For the very first time in 170 years, the Mormon Temple Ceremonies have been filmed by secret undercover video, in the Salt Lake Temple Temple in Utah, this year.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6udew9axmdM&feature=plcp
One of the Three Nephites
November 15th, 2012
7:15 pm
Romney’s gift to America would have been a White House administration governed slowly but surely by his religious paymasters in Salt Lake City. You don’t believe this?
Take a good long look at this entire Mormon Temple Ceremony filmed, for the very first time, in secret by undercover video in a Mormon Temple in Utah, this year:
Yes, Romney and the Mormon crazies were getting ready to descend on Washington big time!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5VrsFEiTpsQ&feature=plcp
Vast Right Wing Conspiracy (aka "Knuckle-Dragger")
November 15th, 2012
7:44 pm
The Republicans have two ways to get the 47% – push to give away more than the supreme leader, or wait until the whole thing crashes and burns, and hope folks come to their senses.
Mr Common Sense
November 15th, 2012
7:58 pm
Sorry, pal, but tax cuts aren’t gifts. It’s your money to begin with. Obama did win with gifts and I find it refreshing that Romney is being forthright about the reasons he lost this election!
Mary Elizabeth
November 16th, 2012
12:00 am
Jason, you do not make your income in a vacuum. You make your income in a complex social interweaving that is America. You pay taxes to keep America viable so that you can continue to earn an income within America’s social structure.
George Washington, who was more prominent than any other American in founding our nation, first, as Commander-in-Chief of our military and, then, as America’s first President who laid the foundation for the survival of our nation, understood well the need for taxes to create a viable nation. It was not by happenstance that Washington was called ” The Father of Our Nation,” in his time.
From “Washington: A Life,” by Ron Chernow, p. 369
“The war continued to serve as Washington’s political schoolroom. Once again a harrowing winter forced him to think analytically about the nation’s ills. On both the civilian and military side of the conflict, he condemned slipshod, amateurish methods. America needed professional soldiers instead of men on short enlistments, just as it needed congressmen who stayed in office long enough to gain experience. Most of all Americans had to conquer their excessive attachment to state sovereignty. . . . Washington viewed the restoration of American credit as the country’s foremost political need, and he supported loans and heavy taxation to attain it. While fighting Great Britain, he pondered the source of its military power and found the answer in public credit, which gave the enemy inexhaustible resources. ‘In modern wars,’ he told Joseph Reed, ‘the longest purse must chiefly determine the event,’ and he feared that England, with a well-funded debt, would triumph over America with its chaotic finances and depleted coffers. . . .One virtue of a war that dragged on for so many years was that it gave the patriots a long gestation period in which to work out the rudiments of a federal government, financial mechanisms, diplomatic alliances, and other elements of a modern nation-state.”
And, from pages 424 – 425: “Washington also received a valuable education in finance from Robert Morris, who had raised money for the Continental cause on his own credit. Because the states had refused to collect their quota of taxes, Morris couldn’t service the sizable debt raised to finance the war. He warned that creditors ‘who trusted us in the hour of distress are defrauded’ and that it was pure ‘madness’ to ‘expect that foreigners will trust a government which has no credit with its own citizens.’ To end Congress’s servile reliance on the states for money, Morris proposed that it have the right to collect customs duties, and the fight for this ‘impost’ – the first form of federal taxation – became a rallying cry for proponents of an energetic central government.”
(It should be noted that the newly forming nation had so little money that it often could not pay the soldiers of the Revolutionary War who suffered great hardship including starvation, disease and death because of that fact, especially during the long, cold winters at Valley Forge. Washington, on several occasions, went to Robert Morris to ask for money to care for the needs of the soldiers of the Revolutionary War. Washington, who stayed with his men throughout their most dismal winters and rallied their resolve through his strength of will and who fought gallantly with his men in battle, often leading the way, lost money personally through his dedicated service to our nation and his efforts made our nation viable. You and I – and all of us today – are the beneficiaries of George Washington’s commitment and vision for this nation.)
Mary Elizabeth
November 16th, 2012
12:13 am
Mr. Common Sense, 7:58 pm
Gov. Romney has shown himself to be a poor loser who lacks both grace and insight.
Jason
November 16th, 2012
12:32 pm
Mary-
That was artful, rational, and even beautiful prose. But what’s it got to do with the price of tea in China?
I think President Washington would agree whole-heartedly that a tax cut is not the same as a hand-out. Which, as I have to keep repeating, is the ONLY point I was making by commenting on this column. And incidentally, Mr. Washington would spit out his wooden teeth if you told him the percentage of our paychecks that gets withheld for taxes. Then he would go sit on his back verandah and smoke some of the fashionable new cash-crop he – and many other founding fathers – grew in abundance. Not tobacco.
satch7
November 16th, 2012
5:17 pm
jason i’m tired of cats like you crying the goppers lost and going to keep losing until they realize rush,annn sean fox lies, are killing them.also the arrogance by the everyday working stiff con is old too. my vote was a vote against all of the above
Mitt Romney, exit stage right. A little quicker, please
November 19th, 2012
8:03 pm
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