Why can’t you vote over the Internet? MIT explains
While we wait, MIT’s Technology Review raises and then answers an interesting question:
“A decade and a half into the Web revolution, we do much of our banking and shopping online. So why can’t we vote over the Internet?”
Imagine the advantages. No New Black Panthers hovering over your laptop, trying to intimidate you. No Florida governor to refuse to extend early voting. No standing in line in the rain. No offensive Obama mural in the background of your voting place, unless you happened to be the one who put it there.
It turns out the main disadvantage remains security, or the lack thereof. In fact, TR reports, the Department of Defense had planned to allow military personnel overseas to vote via the Internet this year, using a $22 million system developed by Accenture. But an audit found the system vulnerable to cyberattacks.
“The unsolved problems include the ability of malicious actors to intercept Internet communications, log in as someone else, and hack into servers to rewrite or corrupt code. While these are also big problems in e-commerce, if a hacker steals money, the theft can soon be discovered. A bank or store can decide whether any losses are an acceptable cost of doing business.
Voting is a different and harder problem. Lost votes aren’t acceptable. And a voting system is supposed to protect the anonymity of a person’s vote—quite unlike a banking or e-commerce transaction—while at the same time validating that it was cast accurately, in a manner that maintains records that a losing candidate will accept as valid and verified.
Given the well-understood vulnerabilities of networked computer systems, the problem is far from solved, says David Dill, a Stanford computer scientist. “Basically, it relies on the user’s computer being trustworthy. If a virus can intercept a vote at keyboard or screen, there is basically no defense,” Dill says. “There are really fundamental problems. Perhaps a system could be tightened so some particular hack won’t work. But overall, systems tend to be vulnerable.”
And lest you think that such concerns are overwrought or exaggerated:
“The problems of Internet voting were made clear in a trial two years ago, when the District of Columbia set up a system that let voters go online, enter an ID code they’d received in the mail, cast a vote, and get a record of the result. Election officials invited computer scientists to try to hack the system in a mock election.
Alex Halderman, a computer scientist at the University of Michigan, and two grad students accepted that offer—and soon found an error in the source code that “allowed us to completely steal the election,” Halderman said at the Princeton symposium. They were even able to change the choice of candidates that appeared on people’s screens.
Rivest put the matter in plain terms. “I think when we talk about voting over the Internet, my gut reaction says: Why vote over the Internet? Why? Why are you doing this? Why? Really, why? Why? I think you need to ask that question a lot, just like a two-year-old,” he said. “There are other approaches to getting information back and forth that are better, and have better security properties. Voting over the Internet is rarely going to be the best choice. It’s very complicated, and you are asking for trouble. Would you connect your toaster to a high-tension power line? Putting a voting system online is very much like that. Would you invest your pension in credit default swaps? You want to stay away [from] complexity. You want something simple. You are entering a world of attacks and risk that you don’t want to be in.”
– Jay Bookman
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141 comments Add your comment
ByteMe - Got ilk?
November 6th, 2012
5:02 pm
Again, that has NOT been because the developers presumed time would catch all bugs but because there wasn’t a large paid QA team to winnow out the bugs in a short period of time.
Large paid QA teams — having worked with them — are limited to what their people can find. Open source gives you the world’s largest QA team — especially when people would be motivated to breaking it, like with MySQL or voting software. And just because Oracle bought the company doesn’t mean the example is suddenly invalid. The software is STILL open source and they still go through a lot of iterations and user testing before they call a release “final”.
Thulsa Doom
November 6th, 2012
5:02 pm
The kkk does still exist and in frightening numbers especially in new York. At least that’s what tawana brawley and Al sharpton tell me.
Brosephus™
November 6th, 2012
5:02 pm
jm
Wrong on so many levels….
East Cobb RINO, Inc (LLC)
November 6th, 2012
5:03 pm
I’ve seen only one ex dem potus do a lot of good and that was carter.
http://www.clintonfoundation.org/
Towncrier
November 6th, 2012
5:04 pm
“Does it not baffle you, as a conservative, that conservative states such as Georgia do not have a fail safe voting system? It doesn’t seem like it’s just liberal faith in government, does it?”
Where, in my original statement, did I make a distinction between conservative and liberal government? In either case, government has shown itself time and again to be grossly wasteful, inefficient and downright stupid at times. Hence I have little of no faith in it. Government is not the answer to many of our problems, in my opinion. Induced altruism and ingenuity (through government incentives) seems to be a better path to take.
I'll alert the Media
November 6th, 2012
5:04 pm
how about bringing in your tax return to vote……………whoops, sorry Dems……Would eliminate a good size block.
ByteMe - Got ilk?
November 6th, 2012
5:04 pm
If Romney wins, will the prez limo and air force 1 have doggie carriers on the roof?
My 5-year-old son came home yesterday from school and they had talked about the election. He said that Obama liked dogs and basketball and Romney liked horses. My son said he “voted” in class for Obama because Obama liked dogs. I thought that was as good a reason as any 5-year-old should have.
Morality?
November 6th, 2012
5:04 pm
Whoever the next Prez is – pray for him ’cause he is going to be in the middle of one GIANT economic mess. Pray for him to do get a clue and a backbone to solve this disastrous Fed debt abyss we are approaching. Pray for him to be loyal to the USA and what is best for our economic recovery rather than just being a party loyalist and being a yes man to party bosses. Pray for the Congress to put party loyalty aside and work together for a change.
ByteMe - Got ilk?
November 6th, 2012
5:06 pm
Pray for him to do get a clue and a backbone to solve this disastrous Fed debt abyss we are approaching.
We need a fainting couch on aisle two!! Aisle two!! Fainting couch!
Paul
November 6th, 2012
5:06 pm
how about bringing in your tax return to vote showing you paid at least the same effective rate as middle class taxpayers? ……………whoops, sorry Reps……Would eliminate a good size block.
Brosephus™
November 6th, 2012
5:06 pm
Does the KKK still exist – other than just a few boys putting on robes and dancing around a bonfire?
Lemme help you out a bit…
http://kkk.bz/?page_id=2896
Q. Is The Knights Party a part of the Ku Klux Klan?
A. Some people get confused because our name is The Knights Party, but we use some of the symbolism of the Ku Klux Klan, and volunteers for The Knights Party are called Klansman or Klanswoman etc. Let me explain using the term Christian. A Christian is a man or woman who believes in and follows the teachings of Jesus Christ. There are many opinions about what those beliefs are. There are religious systems that have been built up over the centuries which organize Christians into different groups (church denominations) all of whom may or may not believe quite the same. The central theme however is obedience to Jesus Christ and his Word. No church today can claim direct ties to Jesus Christ – Although the ancient church of Britain preceded Rome in the acceptance and national adoption of Christianity.
Today, there are no organizations, clubs, groups, etc. that have direct ties to the first Ku Klux Klan. The Ku Klux Klan could best be thought of as a concept or idea. The Ku Klux Klan was born in America. It pledged to stand for the U.S. Constitution. It demanded the protection and advancement of women and children. And it put Jesus Christ at the forefront of all beliefs. In fact, their beliefs were formed by what they felt to be good and holy and acceptable to God.
As a modern organization tackling the tough issues with boldness and sincerity, The Knights Party proudly stands for the principles of the Ku Klux Klan. To be a Klansman or Klanswoman is an honorable station in life.
We share many beliefs with the Home schooling movement, Border Protection groups, Right to Life groups, Traditional Marriage organizations, American Sovereignty groups, Small business and Agricultural groups, Second Amendment crusades, and those who oppose the international banking cartel. We also back strong law enforcement and individual rights. We want to see our people show compassion toward their racial family. When you put the word of God first in your private and public affairs healing will come to the nation.
The Ku Klux Klan as an idea, concept, or as the building blocks of a 21st century robust and thriving movement to renew the racial consciousness of the white race – is truly a Godsend.
RW-(the original)
November 6th, 2012
5:09 pm
Imagine the advantages. No New Black Panthers hovering over your laptop, trying to intimidate you
They would probably just switch to a Newer Than New Black Panther popup ad that would crawl out of the meebo bar and not go away until you voted “properly”
Joe Hussein Mama
November 6th, 2012
5:10 pm
Brosephus — “The Ku Klux Klan could best be thought of as a concept or idea.”
Uh huh. So it was an IDEA that strung all those people up and burned their houses down.
Not only are Klansmen nitwits, lately they don’t even seem to have the stones to stand up and admit they’re members of the Klan. They’re trying to make it sound like a Moose or Elks lodge or something.
Brosephus™
November 6th, 2012
5:10 pm
Where, in my original statement, did I make a distinction between conservative and liberal government?
You did not, nor did I question you in regards to liberal or conservative government. You stated that liberal faith in government baffled you, correct? I asked you about the apparent conservative faith in goverment in states such as Georgia as Georgia’s voter system is not fail safe and conservatives have not addressed it in the 10 plus years they’ve controlled the government.
The one problem I see in the way some Conservatives bash government is that situations, such as voting, should be high on the priority list for government functions. When you consistently bash something as useless, ineffective, or other derogatory terms, it’s hard to get those very people to actually govern and function effectively when they have control of things. If you govern effectively you can’t bash government as ineffective.
Towncrier
November 6th, 2012
5:11 pm
“My son said he “voted” in class for Obama because Obama liked dogs. I thought that was as good a reason as any 5-year-old should have.”
And it (sadly) may be a better reason than some actual voters may have!
Look before I leap...
November 6th, 2012
5:12 pm
@roswell mom
Per the Ga SOS website:
http://sos.georgia.gov/elections/voting_information.htm
Absentee Voting
A voter who requests an absentee ballot by mail is not required to provide a reason why he or she is voting absentee.
You may vote by absentee ballot in person if:
You will be absent from your precinct from 7:00 a.m. until 7:00 p.m. on election day.
You are 75 years of age or older.
You have a physical disability which prevents you from voting in person or you are a constant caregiver of a person with a disability.
You are an election official.
You are observing a religious holiday which prevents you from voting in person.
You are required to remain on duty in your precinct for the protection of life, health, or safety of the public.
An elector may cast an absentee ballot in person at the registrar’s office during the period of Monday through Friday of the week immediately preceding the date of the election without having to provide a reason.
I hope your actual knowledge of the issues and the candidates’ positions is more accurate than your knowledge of GA voting laws.
Paul
November 6th, 2012
5:12 pm
Morality? 5:04
Nice sentiment.
Would’ve been nice if certain elements had done the same four years ago. But as we read here last night, if that element thinks any compromise is off limits, then praying won’t do a darn bit of good.
Brosephus™
November 6th, 2012
5:15 pm
RW
That got me light headed from laughing so hard!!!!
—————
JHM
You would think that if someone truly took pride in something, they’d have no problem owning up to it.
I'll alert the Media
November 6th, 2012
5:15 pm
I pay the rates and take the deductions Charlie Rangal signed off on, just say’n
Towncrier
November 6th, 2012
5:18 pm
“I asked you about the apparent conservative faith in goverment in states such as Georgia as Georgia’s voter system is not fail safe and conservatives have not addressed it in the 10 plus years they’ve controlled the government.”
I don’t have any such faith. Indeed, I was very upset when the new electronic voting systems came online without a backup system in place. I got heated at the polling station and was almost yelling at the election officials for about 5 minutes. I tried to contact people in government after that but was largely ignored. I raised the issue again today. It REALLY bothers me.
“The one problem I see in the way some Conservatives bash government is that situations, such as voting, should be high on the priority list for government functions. When you consistently bash something as useless, ineffective, or other derogatory terms, it’s hard to get those very people to actually govern and function effectively when they have control of things. If you govern effectively you can’t bash government as ineffective.”
I agree that it should be high on the priority list for government functions. So I think you make my point for me – that is, if they can’t get that right, what can they get right? I agree that the focus on preventing voter fraud should be less upon voter ID and more upon registration and absentee voting.
Tundra Dude
November 6th, 2012
5:19 pm
If Romney wins, will the prez limo and air force 1 have doggie carriers on the roof?
LOL!! Good Wun!
Towncrier
November 6th, 2012
5:25 pm
“Uh huh. So it was an IDEA that strung all those people up and burned their houses down.”
In the Matrix, yes.
“Not only are Klansmen nitwits, lately they don’t even seem to have the stones to stand up and admit they’re members of the Klan. They’re trying to make it sound like a Moose or Elks lodge or something.”
On the contrary. There was a recent report on the Klan on 60 Minutes (I think). Those guys didn’t seem to have many qualms about being violent, racists and separatists. I always wondered why they burned crosses. Now I know – they hold the delusional belief that these represent the “light of Christ”. I am tempted to ROFL, but it really is not very funny.
RW-(the original)
November 6th, 2012
5:26 pm
Brosephus,
Seeing the conversation you were having around my NTNBP popup comment, maybe a KKK popup could sneak out on the other side of the screen. The two of them could just fight it out until you threw your laptop out the window and the election would be decided by the one guy that still took the time to find their polling station.
How come these kkker’s don’t get to be called New?
Brosephus™
November 6th, 2012
5:27 pm
Towncrier
Ok, gotcha. The way you specified liberal faith in government kinda perplexed me as it seems that conservatives, living in conservative states, share that same faith. I’ve heard some conservatives express fustration in the voting system as you say, but it doesn’t appear to be a concern of the majority.
As to the voter fraud, Thulsa Doom and you are the only two conservatives posting here that have stated they are more concerned about the registration process as opposed to the voter ID issue. For that, I tip my hat to the two of you because I personally think you eliminate most avenues for fraud when you can control the registration process effectively.
pogo
November 6th, 2012
5:27 pm
I don’t know who will win tonight, but I do know one thing; starting in January of 2013 all of you old Obama supporters (and everybody else) are going to start to feel the real impact of Obamacare on medicare. A bunch of spoiled leftwing baby-boomers are about to learn a real lesson about mindlessly following a leftwing ideologue. Unless of course Romney wins and Obamacare is dramatically altered.
RB from Gwinnett
November 6th, 2012
5:28 pm
How is collecting votes electronically and sending them electronically to a central location any safer?
pogo
November 6th, 2012
5:29 pm
Even the UN observers are amazed that the US doesn’t require absolute ivoter dentification for a voter. That is truly astounding.
RW-(the original)
November 6th, 2012
5:30 pm
Put me firmly in the “fix the registration” camp. You can’t buy dog food without ending up registered in some places it seems.
roswell mom
November 6th, 2012
5:31 pm
Look before – I see your info on the ga.gov website. I was looking at this form
http://sos.georgia.gov/elections/elections/voter_information/absentee_ballot_app_2012.pdf
and it didn’t list merely being absent on election day. I think your info is probably correct, but I don’t quite understand why this form doesn’t have matching criteria. I’ve never voted absentee.
Brosephus™
November 6th, 2012
5:35 pm
RW
Suddenly, I have the urge to go ensure my Norton is up to date. In regards to the “New” label for the KKK, that’s an interesting question that I may have to go research when I get done cooking dinner.
Dixie Chicks
November 6th, 2012
5:35 pm
Lest we forget George W. Bush…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pojL_35QlSI
Towncrier
November 6th, 2012
5:37 pm
I’m out…goodnight all. It will be an interesting one, to be sure.
Peter
November 6th, 2012
5:39 pm
Hard to believe people put down all the good work churches do, especially overseas work by many of the larger churches.
Does that include the Catholic Church who stops birth control……. but hides the fact the priests are perverts, and also has been caught laundering Mafia money through the Vatican bank ?
Why can’t you vote over the Internet?
November 6th, 2012
5:44 pm
Because Obama is slow in providing free computers as yet another entitlement (or is it a ‘right’?) to the generational government dependents (aka his voter base)…
independent thinker
November 6th, 2012
5:46 pm
I am more concerned about the Romney cartel controlling a significant number of voting machines in Ohio and the past history in 2004 of questionable vote results that put Bush over the top. Karl Rove is still alive and breathing.
Georgia on my mind...
November 6th, 2012
5:47 pm
President Obama will win Georgia by 1 percentage point!
Brosephus™
November 6th, 2012
5:48 pm
Quick question for the board. Did anybody’s House district change? I went from Westmoreland’s to Scott’s district. The interesting thing is that they were both on primary ballots that my wife and I voted on earlier this year.
josef
November 6th, 2012
6:16 pm
Georgia on my mind…
“President Obama will win Georgia by 1 percentage point!”
I don’t see that happening, but it’d tickle me pink if he did!
PETE
Oh, for Pete’s sake…was your Mama scared by a penguin when she was carrying you? Next thing you know, you’ll be coming in here badmouthing college football…
josef
November 6th, 2012
6:20 pm
Talk about more fun than a barrel of monkeys….
“Newsmax TV tonight.
In addition to Dick Morris, our online TV coverage will feature:
Donald Trump
Newt Gingrich
John Zogby
Pat Caddell
John Fund
Mike Reagan
Doug Schoen
Herman Cain
Reince Priebus
Ralph Reed”
Steven S
November 6th, 2012
6:59 pm
I still don’t get it. People file taxes over the net. We buy stuff with credit cards. There are pass codes and safeguards! There must be some way to set up security and then people can check to see that their vote was recorded correctly. Right now, I have no idea if my vote was cast correctly!
mathilda
November 7th, 2012
9:46 am
I have just discovered this site and love it! Thoughtful and intelligent. It is refreshing also to know that Jay is affiliated with the AJC, a newspaper I had originally thought too biased to air these views. I am happy to know your publication is more even handed than I originally thought, or, is changing with the times.
My husband and I were just discussing why we disagreed with online voting. This article edifies and gives concrete evidence to support what people intuitively know already. Thanks.