Encouraging economic data, from sources public and private
Last week, a better-than-expected jobs report inspired scoffing among those to whom good economic news is bad political news, including suggestions that the government numbers had somehow been cooked as part of a political conspiracy.
That doesn’t seem to have been the case, as economic data continue to surprise on the upside, from government as well as private economic sources, and across economic sectors:
The economy is improving more than professional forecasters anticipated, particularly in data on employment and housing, according to the Bloomberg Economic Surprise Index, which compares 38 indicators with analysts’ predictions. The index, based on gauges compiled by private businesses and trade groups in addition to government, confirms U.S. growth is generating jobs in the face of a global slowdown and looming federal spending cuts and tax increases known as the fiscal cliff.
“The economy is improving, and the labor market is getting better,” said Robert Brusca, president of Fact & Opinion Economics and a former New York Fed economist. “These numbers are what they are, they’re not being slanted. On a scale of one to 10, the economy is at a fairly firm six and may be heading higher….”
From Reuters, on consumer sentiment:
The Thomson Reuters/University of Michigan’s preliminary October reading on the overall index on consumer sentiment came in at 83.1, up from 78.3 the month before, and the highest since September 2007, the survey showed on Friday.
The new buoyancy among consumers comes shortly after the U.S. unemployment rate tumbled to its lowest in nearly four years in September as more people returned to the workforce and found jobs than economists had predicted.
“We are getting some quite interesting signals from consumer sentiment and employment data – both (the) unemployment rate and initial claims – that there has been some quite significant improvement in the economy,” said David Sloan, an economist at 4Cast in New York.
From the Census Bureau on retail sales:
WASHINGTON — Retail sales rose a larger-than-expected 1.1% in September as consumers shook off fears of looming economic problems and continued to boost their spending after pulling back earlier this year.
The new data Monday came as the Commerce Department revised August’s increase in retail sales to 1.2% from the earlier estimate of 0.9%. That meant the rise in August was the largest monthly gain since October 2010.
Economists had expected a 0.8% increase in September, according to a survey by Bloomberg. Retail sales last month were up 5.4% from a year earlier. Sales for the three-month period ending in September were up 4.8% from the same quarter in 2011.
From Business Insider, on housing:
Despite some nagging doubts that have remained over the U.S. housing market, consensus is that housing has turned the corner and is recovering.
In his latest note titled The Housing Recovery Is For Real, Deutsche Bank’s Joseph LaVorgna writes that the “residential housing market is in the very early stages of a durable recovery.”
LaVorgna says this recovery in housing is important because housing is what led the U.S. economy into a recession, and is part of the reason the recovery has been so slow. Moreover, as “a leading indicator of underlying domestic demand,” any improvement in housing suggests that underlying domestic demand should improve as well. From Lavorgna:
‘…. At minimum, the strength in residential construction suggests it is unlikely that underlying domestic demand will weaken further. This provides us with some comfort that the recent sub-par performance in the economy is not long lasting and that over time, domestic demand will strengthen, perhaps as concern over Europe fades a bit and the “fiscal cliff” is adequately dealt with.’ “
From Fitch Ratings, on housing construction:
Fitch Ratings raised its projection for single-family starts and new-home sales this year, but warned housing growth could be somewhat less robust in 2013.
The ratings company expects single-family housing starts to improve about 19% in 2012, with new-home sales and existing-home sales increasing 19.5% and 8.5%, respectively.
Fitch, last month, forecast a 12% rise in single-family housing starts, 10.5% growth in new-home sales and a 5.6% bump in existing-home sales.
Fitch said the year-over-year gains for single-family starts and new-home sales earlier this year have sustained momentum. Meanwhile, seasonally adjusted statistics for single-family starts, new homes and existing-home sales have also been advancing most months.
From Ward’s Automotive Group, the auto industry newsletter, reporting a surge in fourth-quarter auto production in North America:
Hot on the heels of an estimated 20,300-unit September production shortfall, North American car and truck assembly plants are embarking on an even more robust fourth-quarter program than the one put in place a month ago.
Although Ford has not yet revealed what revisions it has in store for October-December, the rest of the industry already has boosted production plans by some 53,900 units for the period.
The bulk of the increase is set to occur this month with 61,700 units added to the October slate, some of which likely were deferred from September and some pulled forward from December’s plan, now 16,400 units lower than it was a month ago.
But, even assuming the entire September and December downward volume adjustments are included in this month’s higher schedule, that still means an additional 16,700 vehicles in the October boost, on top of which some 8,600 units have been added to the November plan.
The largest Q4 increase comes from General Motors, up 18,500 units, mostly cars, including gains of 26,000 in October and 3,000 in November, followed by a 10,500-unit cut in its December slate…
Incorporating the revised outlook, North American plants now are in line to build some 15,692,200 cars and trucks this year, up 16.5% from 2011’s 13,471,500 completions.
– Jay Bookman
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508 comments Add your comment
Doggone/GA
October 15th, 2012
5:36 pm
“I’m just trying to figure out why you blast one and accept the other”
Easy! IOKIYAR
JamVet
October 15th, 2012
5:37 pm
As the Bush Depression recedes and the Obama Recovery rolls into another year, there is some reason, albeit a smallish one, to be encouraged.
The motto for this election – ANYONE but another neocon.
And just for you White Power type Republicans…
https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/66301_2549996045262_1567890637_n.jpg
josef
October 15th, 2012
5:38 pm
getalife
That series of attacks on Dowd as being anti-Semitic was uncalled for, imeoiauo,
getalife
October 15th, 2012
5:39 pm
stevie,
If you know a collapse is coming cash out then wait for the market to hit bottom and buy.
getalife
October 15th, 2012
5:41 pm
josef,
neocons have thin skin.
They are dangerous and should not be in government because when you fail, get out.
They slithered back and Dowd had the guts to call them out.
josef
October 15th, 2012
5:41 pm
getalife
@ 5:39
Yep.
Jay
October 15th, 2012
5:42 pm
Josef, the third debate is scheduled to focus on foreign policy.
josef
October 15th, 2012
5:45 pm
JAY
@ 5:42
Thanks for that…tells you just how much attention I’ve been paying…
Paul
October 15th, 2012
5:45 pm
Doggone/GA
Thanks for the response. I was really hoping some of the conservatives would explain it, but evidently they were too embarrassed by the hypocrisy of it all -
Stevie Ray..Clowns to the left and Jokers to the right..here I am...
October 15th, 2012
5:46 pm
JAY,
Have you heard anything about when the latest unemployment figures will be restated as more data comes to fruitition? I know they generally adjust up or down…what about the California issue?
Wonder if they will be re-stated before election..
Smirkin' Joe
October 15th, 2012
5:46 pm
“The motto for this election – ANYONE but another neocon.”
These individuals didn’t express this sentiment quite as well as you, JV:
http://www.infowars.com/new-threats-to-riot-if-obama-loses-election/
But, hey, that’s democracy at work, right?
USMC
October 15th, 2012
5:47 pm
“Josef, the third debate is scheduled to focus on foreign policy.”
Not very good for “the President”…. The President’s record on foreign policy is WEAK.
“but…but…but…Obama Low-Crawled in with a Kaybar knife in his teeth and killed Osama all by himself…”
Doggone/GA
October 15th, 2012
5:49 pm
” but evidently they were too embarrassed by the hypocrisy of it all -”
It’s something of a joke answer…but not entirely, I don’t think. I truly do think that too many of them literally CANNOT SEE the hypocrisy.
getalife
October 15th, 2012
5:49 pm
Weak?
Ask aq and obl how weakhe is.
daffy and some terrorists in Libya, Yemen and Pakistan too.
mitt went crazy after the 3 am call in Libya and lost it.
mitt is not a leader.
deegee
October 15th, 2012
5:50 pm
After the good news of the unemployment rate dropping to 7.8%, the talking heads at CNBC screamed about people dropping out of the work force. They want you to think that they dropped out because they gave up looking for work. I think that some of the drop in the work force might be due to a number of baby boomers that had been laid off and looking for work because their retirement accounts were so decimated after the crash in 2008. My 401K is up 12% for the year and I still have about 30% in cash and bonds. So, yes there may be a number of retirement aged folks that have dropped out because they now have a retirement account again.
jconservative
October 15th, 2012
5:51 pm
As Biden keeps repeating:
“Osama bin Laden is dead and General Motors is alive!”
Like it or not, and I do not, that is one of the best “bumper sticker” comments in decades. The truth is the truth.
What is the latest from Ohio?
getalife
October 15th, 2012
5:52 pm
Ouir President will win Ohio and most swing States if not all of them.
josef
October 15th, 2012
5:52 pm
SMIRKIN JOE
Depends on how close it is…if it gets down to hanging chads…
Jay
October 15th, 2012
5:52 pm
Stevie Ray, the weekly jobless numbers I believe will be updated Thursday, and by then we’ll have a better idea on the California issue and on whether those lower jobless figures in general are a trend or a blip.
Stevie Ray..Clowns to the left and Jokers to the right..here I am...
October 15th, 2012
5:53 pm
GETALIFE
The NYT’s Editorial Editor Rosenthal stated that nothing in Dowds article suggested anything anti-semetic…I don’t read her column
Smirkin' Joe
October 15th, 2012
5:53 pm
“In percentage terms, how much did total federal spending increase between fiscal 2008 and fiscal 2012, after taking inflation into account? I’m not asking for the actual figure — I’m trying to get a feel for how much people THINK that spending has increased under Obama.”
To me, such a question is a bit of a red herring. The central fact is that we have been operating a a serious deficit the past four years and, as a result, our debt is now over 16 trillion. I am not at all convinced that Obama understands what it means to operate in the red year after year. A business man surely does. Ironically, even Gore seems to have understood that back in 2000 when he ran for president (judging from his campaign promises).
USMC
October 15th, 2012
5:54 pm
Well, you have to give Hillary Clinton kudos… unfortunately she and Obama fall into that same category of not being able to LEAD!
Hillary Clinton Ad – 3 AM White House Ringing Phone–BENGHAZI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7yr7odFUARg
josef
October 15th, 2012
5:55 pm
USMC
Now that the gay issue is out of the picture as far as my vote, foreign policy is top on my list of factors in deciding…aside from his weak-kneed stand on human rights abroad, I’ve had no real objections to his foreign policy…
USMC
October 15th, 2012
5:55 pm
“Ouir President will win Ohio and most swing States if not all of them.”–getalife
Swing States poll: Women push Romney into lead…
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2012/10/15/swing-states-poll-women-voters-romney-obama/1634791/
Thulsa Doom
October 15th, 2012
5:55 pm
“Sure they do. When they see 3.8 million new private-sector jobs created in the last two years, sure they care”
Just lemme know when we get to 1 million jobs created in a month like we did under Reagan. Or hell for that matter lemme know when we can regularly average 250,000 a month. That number you cited comes out to only 158,000 jobs a month- barely enough to keep pace with the number of new entrants into the workplace. Ya’ll sure do have low expectations of this president.
Stevie Ray..Clowns to the left and Jokers to the right..here I am...
October 15th, 2012
5:56 pm
JAY,
Thanks…I’m getting to the point where i don’t trust anything anybody says about the economy…counting a trillion is one thing but Accounting for trillions is another…both sides interepret ANY data contrary to their position as false.. reminds me of Radioheads song Spinning Plates…
Smirkin' Joe
October 15th, 2012
5:58 pm
“Swing States poll: Women push Romney into lead…”
Polls are still meaningless this far out. I expect that this election may not be as close as some pundits think.
Stevie Ray..Clowns to the left and Jokers to the right..here I am...
October 15th, 2012
5:58 pm
jconservative,
I agree with bumper sticker but he will have a tall order defending the status of everything going on in ME at final debate…its a mess and his policies hurt more than helped..its a disaster..
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
October 15th, 2012
5:58 pm
Which brings us to the economic level. The deficits that Bush ran up in the years in which the country was teetering on the verge of a serious recession had the beneficial effect of righting the economy. In that sense, deficits not only didn’t matter, but were a force for economic good.
Deficits?
IOKIYAR
Thomas
October 15th, 2012
5:59 pm
Half Truths Half Lies
The great American taxpayer is a victim of politicians and media who are held to no standards. A broker lies- fines and prison a doctor screws up- massive law suit Journalist lie and tell half truths- crickets chirp because that is what is expected. Here a major person at the AJC cuts and paste to “prove” himself without any thought to demonstrate the good and the bad and use his two brain cells to then convince the reader. If it weren’t so sad it would be funny.
From Forbes
In the latest, much celebrated, unemployment report, the labor force participation rate had plummeted to 63.7%, the most rapid decline in U.S. history. That means that under President Obama nearly 5 million Americans have fled the workforce in hopeless despair
From Bloomberg
The Federal Reserve Bank of New York’s general economic index missed analysts’ expectations. It was minus 6.2 in October. The median forecast of 46 economists in a Bloombergsurvey called for a gain to minus 4. The figure was minus 10.4 in September, the lowest level since April 2009. The index covers New York, northern New Jersey and southern Connecticut.
“The economic outlook is worrying and that has hit the demand side of the equation,” said Phil Flynn, senior market analyst at the Price Futures Group in Chicago.
From Reuters
Investors are wondering just how high – and for how long -
the Fed may allow inflation to rise to encourage borrowing,
investment and hiring. In theory, more people working means
higher output, which should narrow the gap between what American
workers are currently producing and their potential.
“The Fed’s body language clearly says they think the output
gap is huge and that they’re willing to take risks on
inflation,” said Bluford Putnam, chief economist at futures
exchange operator CME Group
Stevie Ray..Clowns to the left and Jokers to the right..here I am...
October 15th, 2012
6:00 pm
SMIRKIN JOE
Agreed bout closeness of race..if obama supporters don’t come out as in 2008, it will not be close and we will have a new president to poke fun at…
Smirkin' Joe
October 15th, 2012
6:00 pm
“Depends on how close it is…if it gets down to hanging chads…”
If Romney wins and there are “race riots”, it will I think REALLY hurt the Democratic party for a long time.
USMC
October 15th, 2012
6:01 pm
“Now that the gay issue is out of the picture as far as my vote, foreign policy is top on my list of factors in deciding…aside from his weak-kneed stand on human rights abroad, I’ve had no real objections to his foreign policy…”–josef
Josef, there is NO way you vote for Mitt Romney…. and that’s okay, but I can’t believe you are insinuating that you are UNDECIDED… or did I misread??
What about Obama’s DISMAL record with RUSSIA… You remember the RESET button… Don’t you?
U.S. to End Pro-Democracy Broadcasts in Russia
http://freebeacon.com/u-s-to-end-pro-democracy-broadcasts-in-russia/
Also..
Russia Won’t Renew Pact on Weapons With U.S.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/11/world/europe/russia-wont-renew-pact-with-us-on-weapons.html?_r=0
JamVet
October 15th, 2012
6:02 pm
Sorry, meat, I don’t click on malware infected links.
You’ll have to summarize the White Power position for me!
You can cut and run from your legacy all you want – the facts remain, the Bush/Cheney years were the worst in my lifetime. Worse than Nixon by far.
A disgraceful, embarrassing, consummate failure of an administration.
But the real blame lies with those of you who voted for the PNAC stooges and that repulsive faux conservatism that they championed.
And why an otherwise middling president Obama coasts to victory twice…
So, better luck in 2016.
Or maybe 2020.
Or maybe 2024…
Or maybe…
Stevie Ray..Clowns to the left and Jokers to the right..here I am...
October 15th, 2012
6:02 pm
THOMAS
Wham POW!!
Who knows what is really true except we spend too much and have way too many folks in poverty and unemployed or underemployed than we should…not sure about prospects but we will see if unemployment numbers stick…U6 remains at 14.7%
josef
October 15th, 2012
6:03 pm
STEVIE
“…his policies hurt more than helped…”
Elaborate, please, and I’m not being snarky (or snide!
)
Stevie Ray..Clowns to the left and Jokers to the right..here I am...
October 15th, 2012
6:03 pm
JAMVET
Which link was infected?
Smirkin' Joe
October 15th, 2012
6:03 pm
“Agreed bout closeness of race..if Obama supporters don’t come out as in 2008, it will not be close and we will have a new president to poke fun at…”
I think so. Pollsters have been oversampling Democrats in many of their polls on the assumption that the Democratic turnout will be even greater than in 2008.
Jay
October 15th, 2012
6:05 pm
“Just lemme know when we get to 1 million jobs created in a month like we did under Reagan.”
Thulsa, contrary to your implication, that “a million jobs a month” happened just once, in September 1983, and it was a total freak occurrence. The prior month we had lost 308,000 jobs; the subsequent month we gained 271,000.
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
October 15th, 2012
6:06 pm
Pollsters have been oversampling…
Skewers.
JamVet
October 15th, 2012
6:07 pm
SR, just making fun of meat’s link to that conspiracy nutjob at infowars.
The moron who accused the US government of being involved in the Oklahoma City bombing and September 11 attacks.
Granny Godzilla
October 15th, 2012
6:08 pm
Koch bros threaten 45,000 employees of consequences of President Obama re-election.
Proof positive that even the wealthiest of homosapiens can be trailer trash.
I support their free speech, but will argue against their ideology until I die.
They BOTH suck
October 15th, 2012
6:09 pm
Thulsa
Why do you hark back to Reagan all the time in regards to jobs? More jobs were created under the Clinton Administration.
I’m of the belief that the President gets too much credit and too much blame for the job numbers, but if you want to play the job number game, Reagan isn’t the top guy………
just saying
josef
October 15th, 2012
6:10 pm
USMC
Of course I’d never vote for the Party of Diocletian of the Potomac. As for undecided, well, yes, I am. There’s always something besides the Dem/GOP to vote for so I at least show up as not FOR either one. I’m still not sure I could in clear conscience vote FOR Obama.
As for him and Russia…I know a lot of folks would disagree with me, but Russia is increasingly an insignificant factor, Syria notwithstanding…
Smirkin' Joe
October 15th, 2012
6:10 pm
“Or hell for that matter lemme know when we can regularly average 250,000 a month. That number you cited comes out to only 158,000 jobs a month- barely enough to keep pace with the number of new entrants into the workplace. Ya’ll sure do have low expectations of this president.”
Romney is right about the very great need for MUCH job creation. Without it, we are sunk. I’m sorry…I just get the distinct impression that Obama views dealing with our dire economic situation in the same way he viewed the first debate – as a kind of “drag”.
Stevie Ray..Clowns to the left and Jokers to the right..here I am...
October 15th, 2012
6:10 pm
Josef,
Hows it hanging…
Syria is a mess, Egypt is a mess, Iran is a mess, Taliban will be back in power in Afghanistan soon, Al Queda growth is significant, Israeli relations a problem, Turkey is now shooting weapons into Syria, and Libya is soon to be controlled by al queda…it appears BO and his appointees bungled ambassador situation and prematurely postulated on reason of attack…oh and our guys are getting shot by those who we trained in Iraq.
Otherwise, things are fine:-)
Stevie Ray..Clowns to the left and Jokers to the right..here I am...
October 15th, 2012
6:12 pm
JAMVET,
Thats a good thing..one of my computers crashed as my kid allowed nasty stuff into our world…I don’t completely trust malware..
They BOTH suck
October 15th, 2012
6:12 pm
Thulsa
Numbers are from BLS eventhough it is a wiki link. Using your logic of jobs created under any given president, Reagan is the outlier and you should be a Democrat……..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jobs_created_during_U.S._presidential_terms
Now do your famous switch to who controlled Congress that you have done numerous times when these figures have been posted
Granny Godzilla
October 15th, 2012
6:12 pm
American spring
7 years
And we are exceptional
They BOTH suck
October 15th, 2012
6:13 pm
Stevie @ 6:10
Are you saying that those countries would be in great shape had McCain won or will be on in better shape if Romney wins?
Midori
October 15th, 2012
6:14 pm
too funny!!
http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/10/15/romney-is-attacked-by-his-fathers-longtime-aide/
Romney Is Attacked by His Father’s Longtime Aide
By MICHAEL BARBARO
A longtime aide to George W. Romney issued a harshly worded critique of Mitt Romney, accusing him of shifting political positions in “erratic and startling ways” and failing to live up to the distinguished record of his father, the former governor of Michigan.
Walter De Vries, who worked for the senior Mr. Romney throughout the 1960s, wrote that Mitt Romney’s bid for the White House was “a far cry from the kind of campaign and conduct, as a public servant, I saw during the seven years I worked in George Romney’s campaigns and served him as governor.”
“While it seems that Mitt would say and do anything to close a deal – or an election,” he wrote, “George Romney’s strength as a politician and public officeholder was his ability and determination to develop and hold consistent policy positions over his life.”
Mr. De Vries’s stinging assessment was contained in a nearly 700-word essay that he distributed to a small group of journalists with whom he has spoken over the past year. He said it was an outline for a book that may or may not be published. A spokeswoman for the Romney campaign declined to comment.
A registered independent, who said he voted for Barack Obama in 2008, Mr. De Vries has previously expressed reservations about Mr. Romney’s political postures in interviews, but never with such sweep.
Tom Middleton
October 15th, 2012
6:18 pm
And since we’ve finally recovered all the jobs Bush lost us with his failed supply-side economics, plus added more to boot, we should put Romney in to double-down on what Bush did and then keep our fingers crossed? To put it as nicely as I can: HELL NO!
JamVet
October 15th, 2012
6:21 pm
SR, my condolences. And I understand your concern.
The world wide web is like the wild, wild west.
And there ain’t no sheriff around!
Redneck Convert (R--and proud of it)
October 15th, 2012
6:26 pm
Pollsters have been oversampling…
Well, they better not do it on Nov. 6, is all I got to say.
Billybob
October 15th, 2012
6:26 pm
‘better than expected jobs report(114k jobs)’
jay,
two years ago was the summer of recovery and biden said we would have 500k jobs being created every month and this is your definition of good news……you really are a hack to spout this nonsense…..laughable and another eason why your ilk is in for a tough nov……i love it
‘economic data on the upside’…..again, really….500k jobs to 114k and going down over the last few months and that is how you classify the numbers……keep trying to convince yourself of that jay, b/c most people are tuning that nonsense out…..keep talking bookman, b/t you and obama’s own words, romney doesn’t have to even speak to win this debacle in the white house….fun stuff
Smirkin' Joe
October 15th, 2012
6:28 pm
“Well, they better not do it on Nov. 6, is all I got to say.”
Do you promise?
Billybob
October 15th, 2012
6:31 pm
we are back to even now libs?…really…..how about the fact that the universe of actual jobs right now is at least a couple million less that when obama took office and we also need to forget about all the people that no olonger get counted too…..just push those under the rug so nobody can see or remember those and then you get to your even number…..again manipulation is what the left does and all it has left at this point…..enjoy reaping what the radical leftist ideology has sown……republican independents and reagan republicans are multiplying as i write this…..that is all
paulo977
October 15th, 2012
6:33 pm
Mary E …”Citizens should consider what Obama inherited and what he has accomplished, without any Republican support, to turn our economy around before they cast their votes in November”_______________________________________________
“Citizens” are too easily swayed by blatant lying politicians and very quickly forget what has been done to help them without support from lying politicians BTW “citizens” ought to try and really figure out what Krugman has to offer in the way of analyzing for them the essence of Obama’s accomplishments . After all, he does have a Nobel Prize in Economics… !!!!!!
JamVet
October 15th, 2012
6:33 pm
Bob sounds p*ssed off that the employment numbers aren’t worse.
Your guys allowed the economy, and millions of people along with it, to be damn near destroyed.
This sucker could go down. ~George W. Bush, September 2008
I’m surprised it has come back this much…
josef
October 15th, 2012
6:35 pm
STEVIE
“Syria is a mess”
And the best we can do is to stay the hell out of it as much as possible…what could Obama do? Other than be prepared for perhaps millions of refugees. He has drawn his red line if the Assad regime uses WMDs on its own people…
“Egypt is a mess”
It’s a mess of their own making and, again, non-intervention seems the most pragmatic. What should /could he have done?
“Iran is a mess”
And has been for some time. He let Netanyahu literally draw the red line. Meanwhile, he’s stepped up the sanctions which, it appears, are having an effect on the domestic front inside Iran…
“Taliban will be back in power in Afghanistan soon, Al Queda growth is significant”
My jury is out with Obama on Afghanistan…
” Israeli relations a problem,”
Barack and Bibi are as thick as thieves on this one…same page, same line…
“Turkey is now shooting weapons into Syria”
The Obama foreign policy, more or less it seems, was to pass the ball to Turkey and follow their lead…what else could/should he have done?
“..and Libya is soon to be controlled by al queda…”
The President of Libya as a pro American moderate. The new Prime Minister now forming the government is a pro-French secular liberal. The Libyans turned out in the tens of thousands to make the point that they were grateful to the West for what it had done for them and that this was NOT the direction they were willing to let their revolution go. The fundamentalists have been unsuccessful at the polls and the Libyan people outspoken in their rejection of the theocrats “telling us how to be ‘good Muslims.’
“..it appears BO and his appointees bungled ambassador situation and prematurely postulated on reason of attack…”
I;m not so sure of that…but that is a bungle of the state department CAREER diplomats, not the administration’s policies…this one has been politicized for our own domestic campaigning…
“…oh and our guys are getting shot by those who we trained in Iraq.”
And what has Obama’s foreign policy got to do with that? He pulled out as per the plan already in place. What should/could he have done differently?
Stevie Ray..Clowns to the left and Jokers to the right..here I am...
October 15th, 2012
6:37 pm
THEBOTHSUCK
I don’t have a clue what McClain would have accomplished or Romney…no body of work…it is what it is on the surface, by no means can BO argue that his policies in the ME are anything but a disaster…except of course to deflect blame…heck, we left 10,000 rounds, 14 air to surface missles and 17 RPG’s in libya some of which were recently stolen by Egyptians…if we think fast and furious is a problem…
Jay
October 15th, 2012
6:39 pm
how about the fact that the universe of actual jobs right now is at least a couple million less that when obama took office
We have 500,000 plus more private sector jobs today than when Obama took office.
Marty Huggins'
October 15th, 2012
6:39 pm
Paul
October 15th, 2012
5:45 pm
Just got in and saw your question.
It’s the mentality of you’re too drunk to drive I will I’ve only had 7 drinks not 12 like you.
I giggle daily at both.
Odd to me though that you would only pose that to the conservatives as only to those calling out Obama.
Have you missed the posters here who blast Romney for changing positions or saying something to get elected, but fail to mention anything in regards to Obama doin the same?
Could your absence of a question to the liberal side be indicative that you are also falling into the drunk driver catagory?
TM
October 15th, 2012
6:39 pm
If you believe these report you must also believe Libya was about a movie.
Jack
October 15th, 2012
6:41 pm
By any liberal’s judgement, the economy will really boom for the next week or so. It wasn’t booming when the liberals felt Obama had a comfortable lead. I suppose the logic is that since Obama and Biden bombed so miserably in their debates, liberals had to find comfort in capiltalism.
USMC
October 15th, 2012
6:44 pm
“As for him and Russia…I know a lot of folks would disagree with me, but Russia is increasingly an insignificant factor, Syria notwithstanding…”–josef
Unfortunately, the quite the opposite is true. Russia, Vladimir Putin to be more specific, has their hands in EVERYTHING.
Just read the articles that I linked above for you. Russia/Putin is trying to flex their muscles in a big way and it isn’t very good for “World Peace”.
Who do you think built the Nuclear reactors in Iran??? The Russians. The Russians are the Masters at causing conflict between Third Party Countries and the U.S.
paulo977
October 15th, 2012
6:45 pm
josef
October 15th, 2012
6:35 pm
_____________________________________
Oh well, very well answered !!!
Stevie Ray..Clowns to the left and Jokers to the right..here I am...
October 15th, 2012
6:45 pm
Josef,
If you were BO, how difficult would it be to dispute these optics? Your comment about Israel is suspect, Libya beddhi&ing whoever you want to point to is his adminstration, he was supposed to meet and develop relations with Iran per 2008 promise, he supported anti-semetic-muslim brotherhood in Syria and Egypt…..who know whats happening in pakistan..Russia another story..they think BO is a joke.
Interesting link..http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505263_162-57523314/taliban-and-al-qaeda-working-together-in-afghanistan/
USMC
October 15th, 2012
6:48 pm
Russia thinks Obama is a JOKE!
Obama Handshake Snub in Russia
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AHEposwhovk
Stevie Ray..Clowns to the left and Jokers to the right..here I am...
October 15th, 2012
6:49 pm
JAY,
How does the 500k net new jobs compare to the 125k suggested in attached?
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/27/data-job-growth-obama_n_1919533.html
JamVet
October 15th, 2012
6:50 pm
USMC is out and out cheering on the Russians now?
Wow.
How far can the neocons sink…
getalife
October 15th, 2012
6:51 pm
mitt is a rookie and a failure.
He failed the foreign test after the attack on Libya.
End of story.
pogo
October 15th, 2012
6:51 pm
It appears that some on the Left are now willing to “riot” if Obama loses. In saying such a thing they are basically stating that they are willing to throw democracy to the wayside in their persuit of whatever it is they want. It’s kind of like Greece isn’t it? Most blacks want Obama to win and they will vote for him no matter what. Even when faced with evidence to the contrary they are still willing to support one of the most destructive and divisive leaders this country has ever known because he is black, not because he has done anything in particular to help them as a group (other than giving them free taxpayer funded entitlement programs). The entitlement crowd (which consists of both large numbers of white and black people) want their free money to continue to come in no matter the damage it does to our country and they are ready to riot also. Yep. It is a fine state we find ourselves in now and liberal politics is the reason for it. Jay, do you support anarchy if Obama loses? Are you willing to “take it to the streets” as it where and submit to full Marxism?
USMC
October 15th, 2012
6:51 pm
“Encouraging economic data, from sources public and private”–Jay
Michelle Obama: ‘We Are in the Midst of a Huge Recovery’
http://cnsnews.com/news/article/michelle-obama-we-are-midst-huge-recovery
Yeah, just ask Michelle, she knows…
TM
October 15th, 2012
6:52 pm
Obama lied people died
Midori
October 15th, 2012
6:52 pm
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/election-2012/wp/2012/10/15/charity-president-unhappy-about-paul-ryan-soup-kitchen-photo-op/
getalife
October 15th, 2012
6:52 pm
She told the truth.
You lose usmc.
josef
October 15th, 2012
6:53 pm
STEVIE
I understand what you’re saying about “on the surface.” Here’s my take on the Obama non-interventionist policy in the ME, for what it’s worth. By stepping back and staying out of their internal squabbles while they held free, yes, free, elections, we now have a much clearer view of what their people think about where they want to go. Now we have a clearer picture of where to put our support, who, how many and how strong are those who share our values. There’s a great deal of hope in Libya, Tunisia can still be “courted.” Egypt may well be a lost cause. Turkey and Israel are in our corner. Afghanistan is Afghanistan. Iraq? Kurdistan has been a success story. Iran? It looks like it’s about to lose its surrogate in Syria. it has its own internal pot boiling….not the best of times to go nuclear on THEM…
All in all, considering the Byzantine nature of that whole regional mess, his policies have been pretty sensible…
Jay
October 15th, 2012
6:56 pm
USMC, that is a total load of Bolshoi.
Those people aren’t shaking Obama’s hand because they’re HIS OWN STAFF, whom he is introducing to Medvedev in that video. Medvedev is shaking their hands because he is meeting THEM.
Seriously, the eagerness of the right to invent utter nonsense, and of you guys to believe utter nonsense, is extraordinary. How many times do you have to be played for fools?
USMC
October 15th, 2012
6:57 pm
She told the truth. You lose usmc.”–Getalife
No Getalife, We ALL lose.
Just ask the MILLIONS of Americans who can’t find a job and simply quit looking…
Those numbers are in the DOUBLE DIGITS.. Make 7.8%look great!
Stevie Ray..Clowns to the left and Jokers to the right..here I am...
October 15th, 2012
6:57 pm
josef,
If I had my way we’d get all of our folks out of the entire region…we got no payback on either Iraq or Afghan investments except more debt, body bags and worse rap…
But the optics are gonna be very easy for…well even Romney to master…
Check you later
moonbat betty
October 15th, 2012
6:58 pm
McCarthy alert @ 6:50!!
Smirkin' Joe
October 15th, 2012
6:58 pm
“Have you missed the posters here who blast Romney for changing positions or saying something to get elected, but fail to mention anything in regards to Obama doin the same?”
Yes, he has.
“Could your absence of a question to the liberal side be indicative that you are also falling into the drunk driver catagory?”
No. Liberals are allowed to have a double standard. How else would they make any sense?
Dharma Bum
October 15th, 2012
6:58 pm
So much hatred and vitriol coming from the left and the right… am I the only one who sees this?
Mitt Romney and Barack Obama are both decent men… make your choice, shut up, and go cast your vote on Nov. 6th. There aren’t any undecided voters to convince and no one on this board is going to be swayed from their positions… that has been made abundantly clear.
Obama came in with a less-than-stellar economy and has turned it around far slower than people predicted. That doesn’t necessarily make him Satan incarnate.
Mitt Romney is not some evil rich guy that wants to give you cancer and provide tax breaks to himself. The man took no salary as the governor of Mass. or as the President of the 2002 Winter Olympics.
Both of these men demonstrate integrity on a daily basis and personal attacks or questions of their caring/patriotism/etc. are simply facile arguments that betray an underlying lack of substance on the part of the attacker.
They BOTH suck
October 15th, 2012
6:59 pm
USMC
Have to hand to you. The one about the handshake is even better than your article about the “real reasons” Hillary didn’t go to the convention……..
Smirkin' Joe
October 15th, 2012
7:00 pm
“Michelle Obama: ‘We Are in the Midst of a Huge Recovery’”
Yes. We only need 8-12 more years of Democratic “leadership” to get back to where we were in 2007. Then we can address the deficit (which might be as great as 30T by then).
josef
October 15th, 2012
7:00 pm
USMC
The point is that Russia’s clientele is dwindling…that’s why I said INCREASINGLY insignificant…
STEVIE
How did he “support” the Muslim Brotherhood in Syria and Egypt?
And as for Israel…his foreign policy vis a vis Israel is the same one that’s been in place since 1947.
They BOTH suck
October 15th, 2012
7:01 pm
Stevie
When you state, what “we left” in Libya, did you want Obama to put boots on the ground?
USMC
October 15th, 2012
7:01 pm
The Truth About Obama’s Handshake with Hugo Chavez
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nh96i-yS6lE
You guys will like this one; it favors Obama and shows your friend George W. Bush. It’s pretty funny!
Jay
October 15th, 2012
7:04 pm
That’s it, USMC? Just continue blithely spreading BS?
You’re like a fish in some fish pond, taking the same bait over and over again and never learning. Don’t your lips hurt from all those hooks?
The GOV
October 15th, 2012
7:04 pm
“I didn’t get a haruumph out of that guy!”
josef
October 15th, 2012
7:04 pm
IMAM
“USMC, that is a total load of Bolshoi.”
Okay, Maureen, that’s GOOD and SNIDE …tip of the shapka!
The GOV
October 15th, 2012
7:06 pm
Usually it’s hard to catch a fish you just caught.
Jay
October 15th, 2012
7:06 pm
Yeah, given the Russian context, I thought it appropriate ….
Smirkin' Joe
October 15th, 2012
7:07 pm
“Seriously, the eagerness of the right to invent utter nonsense, and of you guys to believe utter nonsense, is extraordinary. How many times do you have to be played for fools?”
Funny…I was thinking the same thing of the left – you know, like Romney killing a woman, abusing his dog, paying no income taxes (YOUR Senate majority leader), scavenging companies purely for profit while at Bain Capital, lying in his debates and speeches and note merely “fudging” a little (YOUR favorite Harvard economist, Klugman) and so on.
getalife
October 15th, 2012
7:09 pm
The cons prove Biden right.
They are full of it.
“Israeli parliament dissolves for early election” AP
We could use that choice.
Jay
October 15th, 2012
7:09 pm
“Usually it’s hard to catch a fish you just caught.”
yeah, but that’s because usually, the fish isnt’ TRYING to get caught.
Here’s USMC:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x3Bf0WhvsNk
YouLibs
October 15th, 2012
7:12 pm
Dharma Bum
I have some friends who live in the country. They have five dogs, Aussies and Border Collies, and their next-door neighbors have Daschunds and Chihuahuas. Every morning those dogs get together at the fence line and run up and down as fast as they can, barking at the top of their lungs, over and over and over.
I guess you would deny them that pleasure, too.
Smirkin' Joe
October 15th, 2012
7:13 pm
“By stepping back and staying out of their internal squabbles while they held free, yes, free, elections, we now have a much clearer view of what their people think about where they want to go.”
I am afraid that was NOT consistently the Obama administration’s modus operandi. Indeed, it now appears that the Syrian rebels are intensely resentful of the lack of support from western nations (who might have expected more after Gaddafi was targeted). And Libya, where we intervened, is a mess (if the attack on the consulate is any indication)
moonbat betty
October 15th, 2012
7:14 pm
Y’all need to go noodlin. That’s real fishin.