What a shrinking middle class portends for our future
It’s easy to get fixated on the day-to-day give-and-take of politics and lose sight of the underlying realities that drive a campaign. So let’s take a step or two back and try to refocus on the big picture, shall we?
The dominant reality driving the campaign of 2012 — and probably 2016 and 2020 as well — is this, as laid out in a new Pew report on the American middle class:
As the 2012 presidential candidates prepare their closing arguments to America’s middle class, they are courting a group that has endured a lost decade for economic well-being. Since 2000, the middle class has shrunk in size, fallen backward in income and wealth, and shed some — but by no means all — of its characteristic faith in the future….
Fully 85% of self-described middle-class adults say it is more difficult now than it was a decade ago for middle-class people to maintain their standard of living. Of those who feel this way, 62% say “a lot” of the blame lies with Congress, while 54% say the same about banks and financial institutions, 47% about large corporations, 44% about the Bush administration, 39% about foreign competition and 34% about the Obama administration. Just 8% blame the middle class itself a lot.
The easy inclination is to blame the problems of the middle class on the economic crisis of 2008 and its continuing aftermath. And as one of the charts above documents, that calamity has indeed devastated the net worth of America’s middle class. Wealth that was tied up in the stock market has more than recovered what was lost in 2007 and 2008; wealth that was tied up largely in housing has not recovered and will not recover at any point in the foreseeable future. And many in the middle class had leveraged that now-vanished wealth to support themselves in a style which they will never enjoy again.
However, the other chart demonstrates the real problem. Income for the middle-class — defined by Pew as adults with an income of two-thirds to twice the national median income — had stagnated for a decade, long before the Wall Street crisis. In 1971, 61 percent of Americans fell into the middle class as it is defined by Pew. Today it has shrunk to 51 percent, and shows every sign of continuing to shrink.
As Pew puts it:
The hollowing of the middle has been accompanied by a dispersion of the population into the economic tiers both above and below. The upper-income tier rose to 20% of adults in 2011, up from 14% in 1971; the lower-income tier rose to 29%, up from 25%.
However, over the same period, only the upper-income tier increased its share in the nation’s household income pie. It now takes in 46%, up from 29% four decades ago. The middle tier now takes in 45%, down from 62% four decades ago. The lower tier takes in 9%, down from 10% four decades ago.
The 2012 campaign poses several important questions to American voters. Although cast as policy choices such as how to handle entitlements and how to change tax policy, they are really just symptoms of more fundamental questions:
Are these changes caused or merely exacerbated by government policy, which would suggest that a change of policy could reverse them? Or are they instead driven by larger tectonic shifts in which government plays a very small role?
Should government attempt in any way to compensate for these profound changes, such as the massive upward shift of income and the loss of economic security for those below? Or does government have no legitimate role to play?
How does the shrinking of the middle class and the ongoing shift of both wealth and power alter our understanding of America? For those who can attain it, the American dream is more rewarding than it has ever been. But the number of winning tickets is getting smaller and smaller.
In politics, questions are rarely if ever posed to the public in such as fashion. But these are the things that we’re really debating in this campaign, and the answers matter a great deal.
– Jay Bookman
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281 comments Add your comment
ty webb
August 24th, 2012
10:33 am
funny how people who condemn others for always speaking for Jesus, often try to speak for Jesus…perhaps they think their “wittyness”(”jebus”) masks their hypocrisy.
Madge From Accounting
August 24th, 2012
10:34 am
Yeah, get out of the way. Stop punishing success. Quit dreaming up job-killing regulations. End the war on our energy sector.
Stinkbeyootch – what a maroon you are….. seriously.
Donovan
August 24th, 2012
10:34 am
Ok, now that we have had our daily pablum of haves vs have-nots and our indoctrination of Marxist class warfare, this 2012 election boils down to who is more qualified in leading us out of this economic malaise.
Mitt Romney and Paul Ryan couldn’t be more qualified in their business approach to solving our economic troubles. In contrast, why would anyone in their right mind want two government loving hacks with 4 years of failure to have another 4 years of failure?
You liberal lunatics put these two inept buffoons in office with all their bad advisors and all their bad ideas. What you see is what you get. Garbage in and garbage out. Now you are trying to convince us that we should re-elect these two imbeciles again? Your support for this idea makes your initiative look like there are inmates running the insane asylum.
Once again, your campaign cannot be run on the record of your last 4 years. Since it has been an abysmal record of failure, you have to have cheerleaders like, Jay Bookman, blow sunshine up your skirts with distractions of blame and excuses.
So you all can forget about the “rich getting richer” and the “disparity of the classes” propaganda, based on your losing campaign battle. Let’s get right down to brass tacks. We have the perfect people in place to help this country. You Democrats, you liberals, you “progressives”, and you elitists have nothing in the way of qualified people to help this country out of its malaise other than nonsensical spin doctors.
Throw away the stupid charts, the stupid sociology textbooks, and the stupid class envy games. You’ve had your 4 years of social experiments and failed polices. It’s time to let some qualified experts try and right this sinking ship you all have run aground.
Jay
August 24th, 2012
10:34 am
And all these shootings are occurring because we don’t have enough guns, right guys?
zeke
August 24th, 2012
10:34 am
anybody remember nardelli? ceos are dime a dozen just like their employees. i doubt i could have screwed up wall st any worse? but he who has the gold, rules.
Keep Up the Good Fight!
August 24th, 2012
10:34 am
JHM, if you missed it, great clip showing how Martin Bashir calls out a slimeball who casts demeaning aspersions against a senior military official…. some of our FTroop posters should watch and learn. Their lies and disrespect is shameful.
Welcome to the Occupation
August 24th, 2012
10:35 am
Meanwhile, we have a president who thinks more elite expertise and bushels of bipartisan aisle-crossing can solve the crisis. But not the other side.
Thomas Frank says it best:
What the public really wants is not someone who is going to reach out across the aisle and shake hands with the other side and say that “we aren’t red states and we aren’t the blue states, we’re the United States.” No. They wanted an answer to the problem at hand, and here’s the crazy thing: the Republicans came up with one. It’s a fanciful answer, the answer that we deregulate more, that we have to reach out and achieve that perfect capitalism that’s eluding us.
getalife
August 24th, 2012
10:36 am
The cons reasoning for self defeatism is silly.
Just look at them deflecting because they know they are wrong.
GeorgiaLatino
August 24th, 2012
10:36 am
I know it’s wayyyyy late, but I just need to respond to the very first comment on this article. @USinUK… it’s all well and good to tell the middle class to look in the mirror regarding trying to maintain a lifestyle far above their means, but if you look at the income graph, one can make a valid case that their income was flattening out or going down through no fault of their own.
In addition, other charts show an even more dramatic difference in the rates at which incomes have grown since the early 80’s between the middle class and the wealthy class. The bottom line is, regardless of the middle’s need to keep up with Joneses, the Joneses have been putting greater and greater distance between them and us, and are trying to make darned sure the laws keep favoring them.
Put it to you this way: Guys like Romney want to keep paying 13% on 22Million, and make sure you and I pay more to compensate. Sound fair to you???
ty webb
August 24th, 2012
10:37 am
“And all these shootings are occurring because we don’t have enough guns, right guys?”
no Jay, they’re happening because we haven’t banned murder…oh wait, nevermind.
Joe Hussein Mama
August 24th, 2012
10:39 am
T. Webb — “funny how people who condemn others for always speaking for Jesus, often try to speak for Jesus…”
I challenge you to find even *one* example of me condemning anyone for that.
“perhaps they think their “wittyness”(”jebus”) masks their hypocrisy.”
I can speak for myself just fine. And maybe *you* think that joking about chicken sandwiches somehow masks the fact that you were making light of public shootings.
Better get the stick out of your own eye before you criticize others for it, pal.
stands for decibels (SfBA)
August 24th, 2012
10:39 am
Ummm Romney was talking about big business, you know GE, Buffett’s group, Apple.
“la la la I can’t HEAR you, and besides, understanding the actual CONTEXT of a quote is for namby-pamby bed-wetting moral-equivocating LIBRULZ.”
Aquagirl
August 24th, 2012
10:39 am
go start a business, take on debt, hire folks, provide them benefits, and report back.
Sure, as soon as the gub’mint finishes building the billion dollar facility I deserve.
Sorry to irritate you Thomas, I didn’t know you were so touchy about the jocks.
Stevie Ray..Clowns to the Left of me Jokers to the Right, here I am...
August 24th, 2012
10:41 am
JAY,
Do you really think we are going to take guns away or otherwise limit use? To me unfortunately the jeannie is out of bottle since 1776 and no matter how ancient our constitution is in this area, no way gun ownership will decrease…sad state of affairs indeed. Guns scare me.
Jay
August 24th, 2012
10:41 am
I agree with you for the most part, Stevie Ray.
ty webb
August 24th, 2012
10:42 am
“Guns scare me”
knives do the same for me…and clowns.
Smoke&Mirrors
August 24th, 2012
10:42 am
Yep – guess to sum it up:
‘Third World Here We Come!’
…easily confirmed by following the money.
Adam
August 24th, 2012
10:43 am
Jay: No Adam, as the next poster demonstrates, you clearly underestimated their ingenuity and shamelessness.
Yes, this is a flaw on my part. I don’t think I am capable of removing that flaw so I think people will have to just deal with it as part of who I am.
Joe Hussein Mama
August 24th, 2012
10:43 am
KUTGF — “some of our FTroop posters should watch and learn. Their lies and disrespect is shameful.”
Agreed.
I don’t denigrate the service of anyone who served our country in uniform. But IMO some of our posters do a good job of sliming *themselves* by saying things like that.
Keep Up the Good Fight!
August 24th, 2012
10:43 am
Oy vey, the inane “well we can’t stop all killing, so we might as well not even try”….
We haven’t stopped all speeding either last I checked.
Adam
August 24th, 2012
10:44 am
Compromise:
What Romney said:
“I’m going to champion small business. We’ve got to make it easier for small businesses. Big business is doing fine in many places -– they get the loans they need, they can deal with all the regulation. They know how to find ways to get through the tax code, save money by putting various things in the places where there are low tax havens around the world for their businesses. But small business is getting crushed.”
What Adam heard:
Big business is doing fine – Mitt Romney
What Obama said:
“Somebody invested in roads and bridges. If you’ve got a business — you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen.”
What the right wing heard:
If you’ve got a business — you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen.
CJ
August 24th, 2012
10:44 am
Getting back to the shrinking middle class discussion, I want to mention that its no wonder that the middle class is shrinking. An ideology has taken root that fights to protect income from investments and inheritances from taxation (primary income sources for the wealthy) while seeking to shift most of the burden to income from work (primary income source for the middle class).
Thomas
August 24th, 2012
10:45 am
Not touchy at all my good lady-
Adam
August 24th, 2012
10:46 am
Ok, now that we have had our daily pablum of haves vs have-nots and our indoctrination of Marxist class warfare,
MARXIST! DRINK!
Stevie Ray..Clowns to the Left of me Jokers to the Right, here I am...
August 24th, 2012
10:47 am
GA LATINO,
You realize that getting the 1%er’s to pay more only addresses 16% of the problem…the question is what is President Trillions (or Romney) for that matter proposing to do about it? I don’t see any plan that will anytime in the remote future reduce the annual deficit by 1 dollar…especially since that dog of a HC bill will cost taxpayers geometrically more than is being advertised..
Adam
August 24th, 2012
10:47 am
Jay: And all these shootings are occurring because we don’t have enough guns, right guys?
Yeah, I mean if someone had a gun in that crowd they would have been able to kill him dead before he fired off a single shot.
Aquagirl
August 24th, 2012
10:50 am
Not touchy at all my good lady-
Ah, thanks for the reassurance kind sir. It’s Friday after all, no one should be unhappy.
Adam
August 24th, 2012
10:50 am
ty: no Jay, they’re happening because we haven’t banned murder…oh wait, nevermind.
Clearly since people still murder, that law isn’t working so we need to make it legal. Just like the fact that criminals buy high powered weapons means we should make sure everyone can buy them too.
stands for decibels (SfBA)
August 24th, 2012
10:52 am
Adam @ 10.44
http://www.humanevents.com/2012/08/21/rnc-announces-we-built-this-night/
RNC announces “We Built This!” Night
By: John Hayward
8/21/2012 09:12 AM
The line that will, deservedly, haunt Barack Obama forever is getting center-stage treatment at the Republican National Convention, which has designated the Tuesday evening session “We Built This!” The session is meant as a rebuke to Obama’s “If you’ve got a business, you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen” speech.
Among the featured speakers will be Sher Valenzeula, candidate for lieutenant governor of Delaware, and a small businesswoman who, along with her husband, “started an upholstery business that makes padding for baseball umpires and military vests worn by members of the Israeli military,” according to a Fox News report.
Sher Valenzeula? hmm…
http://mediamatters.org/blog/2012/08/23/how-she-built-it-foxs-rnc-theme-undercut-by-key/189537
In fact, much as Obama suggested, Valenzuela appears to have succeeded through a combination of her own entrepreneurship and government assistance. She has in the past explained that government assistance was a vital factor in the success of her company. Earlier this year, Valenzuela gave a presentation on her small business success, crediting the use of “millions of dollars in secure government contracts.”
But, you know, we shouldn’t take Mittens’ stuff out of context. That would be wrong.
Stevie Ray..Clowns to the Left of me Jokers to the Right, here I am...
August 24th, 2012
10:52 am
ADAM,
The problem with that collossal gaff is that his speech writer didn’t apply the “taking out of context” exposure….that was a shot under the basket…also, if Bidens comment re chains was not off the cuff, that speech writer should be shot as well.
That being said, I don’t think any of these trivial word games will change any votes…those on government assistance and a large % of middle class were going to vote for Obama anyway…seems to me that the question is how many have the same enthusiasm and will actually vote…IMO
Matti
August 24th, 2012
10:53 am
Hey… There IS hope for the aging/shrinking middle class who will be broke before retirement! There IS a way to make it to the beach after all. Yay! An inspirational story:
http://abcnews.go.com/Health/woman-homeless-hungry-spiritual-life/story?id=17067174#.UDeUbqCurcx
Heh…
St Simons - he-ne-ha
August 24th, 2012
10:53 am
In Parade Magazine today –
His Lord High Hairgel Mittens of Romney explains that he wants to keep
his tithing between him and God,
and that’s why you can’t see his tax returns:
I swear, never have i seen the modern Republican summed
up so metaphorically & completely, as in those 3 lines.
TBone
August 24th, 2012
10:55 am
You might as well put teachers in the incredible shrinking middle class as our health care premiums sky rocket with the help of Obamacare. This country has been put on the fast track to third world status by the elected goons (both parties).
Stevie Ray..Clowns to the Left of me Jokers to the Right, here I am...
August 24th, 2012
10:55 am
STANDS,
Does it seem to you that both parties pitch is centered around why not to vote for the other guy as opposed to why vote for me? My conclusion is that Obama is afraid to make promises as in 2008 and wants the conversation to focus off economy and deficit. The GOP are now the ones making the ridiculous arguments about 12 million jobs…I predict regardless of who is in office, the deficit will sprial out of control in next four years well above 20 trillion and we will continue to lose on the global economy front..
Moderate Line
August 24th, 2012
10:55 am
Jay
August 24th, 2012
10:41 am
I agree with you for the most part, Stevie Ray.
+++++
The United States has the highes gun ownership per capita than any other country. 88 per 100 people. The next country has 58 per 100 people. Our private citizens are the most armed in the world.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_gun_ownership
Stevie Ray..Clowns to the Left of me Jokers to the Right, here I am...
August 24th, 2012
10:55 am
TBONE,
I second..
Adam
August 24th, 2012
10:58 am
Stevie Ray: The problem with that collossal gaff is that his speech writer didn’t apply the “taking out of context” exposure…
My theory is that line wasn’t actually written into the speech. And yeah, it sucks, but we should demand our media stop taking things out of context like that, or that when ads do, they get called out.
RB from Gwinnett
August 24th, 2012
10:59 am
Hey Adam, how is that survey coming along? Mom not letting you use the car to get it done or what?
Granny Godzilla - Union Thugette
August 24th, 2012
11:00 am
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
August 24th, 2012
10:15 am
What’s going on here ? Both of these places are “GUN FREE ZONES” !
Pardon me Mr. Digits, but that’s flat out wrong
Hand gun ban “shot down” by SCOTUS by….5-4.
2 years ago.
Music for you, with all due respect
Adam
August 24th, 2012
11:00 am
Stevie Ray: That being said, I don’t think any of these trivial word games will change any votes…
Agreed, but THIS is not why:
those on government assistance and a large % of middle class were going to vote for Obama anyway…
It’ll be about turnout of the informed vs. the uninformed.
Brosephus™
August 24th, 2012
11:00 am
Jay, how much taxpayer money is spent on illegal aliens every year ? Many billions, every year, for how many decades ??? What if we had spent that money on infrastructure , pipelines, outer perimeters, mass transit ???
And how many billions in taxpayer money has been spent on fighting counterfeit goods coming out of China??? What if we had kept that manufacturing here instead of handing over the property rights and know-how to make our things instead??? Every economic problem we have in this country is not because of what the government has done.
I love how some people make the government look like Jason Voorhees, when they give a complete pass to the private sector which is bending them over a barrel and screwing them with no relief.
—————
on topic:
The middle class is screwing itself. One doesn’t have to venture beyond this blog for evidence. I’d imagine most everybody on this blog is middle class. There may be upper middle, middle, and lower middle, but I’m not holding my breath that anybody wasting time here is in the top income classes of this country. However, I could be wrong.
That said, instead of working together towards policies and practices that benefits the middle, we spend way too much damn time fighting each other. While we’re fighting each other, we’ve allowed the upper class to install their own puppet government, and they are ripping us all off. Every now and then, they’ll toss out garbage like abortion, tax returns, birth certificates, unions, gun restriction, and other sh*t to continue the distraction so they can continue to plunder without opposition. It’s almost too late for us to do something to stop it before this country is completely effed up, so continue to fight each other at your own peril. I’d invest in burlap for clothing for your grandkids. Hell, if they’re gonna live as a peasant, they may as well look the part.
——————
Why do you think almost 50% of American pay 0 in federal taxes?
Bush Tax Cuts of 2001 and 2003. Prior to that, I think the percenage was in the 33%-36% range under Clinton.
USinUK - pro-gay-marriage thug and former Girl Scout
August 24th, 2012
11:01 am
“@USinUK… it’s all well and good to tell the middle class to look in the mirror regarding trying to maintain a lifestyle far above their means, but if you look at the income graph, one can make a valid case that their income was flattening out or going down through no fault of their own. ”
I’m sorry, but using your house to pay for your kids’ college education is down to you not planning (I mean, it’s not like you didn’t know your kid was going to turn 18). And using your house to pay for your VACATION is just stupid.
The fact is that people maxed out their credit cards and used their houses like ATMs. Now, you could blame the banks for raising (and raising and raising) people’s credit limits while walloping them with loan-shark level interest – and that is part of the problem.
But, the bigger part of the problem is that people bought more house than they needed or could afford, they bought new cars every 3-5 years and they filled their houses with loads and loads of stuff (while leaving their liquid savings woefully dry).
I’m not saying it’s ENTIRELY their fault – but it would be completely erroneous to say that they didn’t play a role in their own problems.
ty webb
August 24th, 2012
11:01 am
Obama butchers one of Fauxcahontas’s infamous rallying cries and then screams “context”…it’s the context that is even worse. Using the one soundbite is actually doing obama a favor.
Adam
August 24th, 2012
11:02 am
RB: Hey Adam, how is that survey coming along? Mom not letting you use the car to get it done or what?
First of all, as I indicated on a previous post, I have my own car with a clean title. I even said what it was.
Second, it’s coming along slowly. I know patience isn’t your strong suit but if you want a social research survey from someone who doesn’t do it for a living, it’s gonna take a while. I have also had a huge jump in calls for my small business lately and that takes priority over every other project except those at my day job.
DawgDad
August 24th, 2012
11:02 am
America and the middle class rode the wave of the technology boom through the eighties and nineties, to the extent it enabled our economy (overall) to absorb the negative effects of globalization and outsourcing. Globalization was inevitable, but it remains the major factor pulling down the middle class.
Looking ahead, what does America have to offer the world? Not much at this point. All of the major economic influences are negative: deeper globalization, stifling personal and national debt, massive government expansion, expensive wars, aging population and infrastructure. Is America positioned to capitalize on the next revolutionary breakthrough in providing goods and service that will be in demand by the rest of the world? Are we even positioned to spawn or create it? Our leaders are working AGAINST us. Bailing out failed institutions, investing in unviable energy schemes, paying off non-productive groups to buy votes, seizing control of the health care apparatus (a likely source of the next boom), sustaining costly foreign engagements, and threatening tax increases on the primary investors are not policies that will position our Nation or ANY class (except the narrow ruling class) for future economic growth. Expansion of government will not solve our economic problems, it will make them worse.
Welcome to the Occupation
August 24th, 2012
11:02 am
..that we have to reach out and achieve that perfect capitalism that’s eluding us
USinUK - pro-gay-marriage thug and former Girl Scout
August 24th, 2012
11:02 am
“MARXIST! DRINK!”
man, it’s going to be a long day.
Brosephus™
August 24th, 2012
11:03 am
Adam @ 10:44
Well played sir.
Adam
August 24th, 2012
11:03 am
Brosephus: Bush Tax Cuts of 2001 and 2003. Prior to that, I think the percenage was in the 33%-36% range under Clinton.
EXACTLY
Brosephus™
August 24th, 2012
11:05 am
dB @ 10:52
Nah, taking Mitt out of context is considered blasphemy. I’d add that if Ryan is anywhere near that session, I’d love to hear somebody question him about those government road building contracts that daddy got while building his business too.
Aquagirl
August 24th, 2012
11:07 am
Looking ahead, what does America have to offer the world?
The McRib.
Brosephus™
August 24th, 2012
11:08 am
My conclusion is that Obama is afraid to make promises as in 2008 and wants the conversation to focus off economy and deficit.
Stevie Ray
If you were in Obama’s shoes what would you do? You have an opposition party who’s sole purpose is to tank any damn thing you try to do. Your fellow party members don’t have the spine of a dead octopus in backing you up. You tell me what would you do?
stands for decibels (SfBA)
August 24th, 2012
11:12 am
Does it seem to you that both parties pitch is centered around why not to vote for the other guy as opposed to why vote for me?
I know you’re probably trying your best to play this down the middle and that’s fine–I’m just not going to be swayed by the implicit notion that I should be ashamed of picking a side. I think the Dems are preferable to the Reps in 2012.
And unlike you, the mere fact that we are going deeper in debt is not troubling to me. It’s how we’re doing it, and how we’re proposing to eventually correct that course, that troubles me. Deeply, lie-awake-nights troubles me, sometimes.
Headin’ upstairs for Huckabee SHEETZ.
Brosephus™
August 24th, 2012
11:12 am
Adam @ 11:03
You will never hear a damn peep about that from the 50% crowd. I don’t recall a single one of them championing the ending of said rate cuts in their entirety either.
Stevie Ray..Clowns to the Left of me Jokers to the Right, here I am...
August 24th, 2012
11:14 am
ADAM,
Turnout is key for sure but I’m not so sure the vast majority of the population understand all this talk about deficits blah blah blah….I think all they hear is either more free stuff or lower taxes for the more fortunate….
Three touchpoints that terminally affected my view on things..First and drug companies getting to advertise, second the media becoming the news, and finally, the corporations being in obvious position to control DC agenda while we get shafted.
Stevie Ray..Clowns to the Left of me Jokers to the Right, here I am...
August 24th, 2012
11:19 am
BROCEPHUS,
Both sides can be criticized for what you suggest goes only with GOP. What I would do is run soley on the commitment to amend the constitution to remove all the private money out of politics..that, to me is the most important issue which neuters and courage any of our DC’ers can muster…they should be spending 100% of their time focused on working for us as opposed to 65-70%…with the balance campaigning or simply enjoying the limelight….
I can dream can’t I…
Adam
August 24th, 2012
11:20 am
Stevie Ray: Most people don’t understand the deficit talks, that is true. They think that a growing deficit is a calamity, when it isn’t.
The “free stuff” line somehow becoming a rallying cry still makes me laugh. I mean, tell me that people wouldn’t voluntarily become poor in REALITY if they knew they could all have Escalades and iPhones and steaks. Even THEY don’t believe in their own BS on that.
Three touchpoints that terminally affected my view on things..First and drug companies getting to advertise, second the media becoming the news, and finally, the corporations being in obvious position to control DC agenda while we get shafted.
I definitely consider those things but I have other things that have more affected my view. They mostly come from acknowledging that there is no balance in crazy between the right and the left – the right has more crazy, hands down. I can cite several examples, but since the right wing doesn’t believe anything evidence related and likely thinks even the term “crazy” is entirely subjective, I doubt I could “prove” my case.
Stevie Ray..Clowns to the Left of me Jokers to the Right, here I am...
August 24th, 2012
11:21 am
STANDS,
I’m more of a micro thinker and the middle is where the actual truth lies….all this other stuff is hand-jive until we somehow improve performance of out spineless permanent political class…
Did you see the EXELON article on front page of times yet? Obama is not different from those before him…
Brosephus™
August 24th, 2012
11:22 am
SR
We can both dream. The reason I asked that is because Obama’s currently in the captain’s chair. I’d ask the same question if the roles were reversed. I don’t really pay attention to promises as I learned it’s more important to see who’s running Congress. The president can’t write legislation, he’s basically a hand, fingers, and a pen when it comes to that. The true focus should be on Congress.
In this current time, we’re more likely to find Jimmy Hoffa than get any semblance of common sense from those houses of jackasses.
Stevie Ray..Clowns to the Left of me Jokers to the Right, here I am...
August 24th, 2012
11:24 am
ADAM,
I forgot one of the touchpoints…it should have read lawyers and drug companies…
I can’t disagree on you comment about the right…the religious zealots and gun freaks speak volumes and I agree with gridlock but it won’t go away due to the major contributors to both sides call the shots…
The right has its share but i do think Obamacare falls into the free stuff category for 30 million or so…
Michael
August 24th, 2012
11:25 am
We establish priorities, and the economy responds to those priorities. For example each time we deregulate it gives investment bankers access to more insured deposits. As a result investment bankers look for more exotic products to apply to their investors. Thus, was born the credit default swap. We also give investment bankers preferential treatment on their taxes, i.e. their carried interests (bonuses) are treated as capital gains and taxed at 15%.
In contrasts scientists (like the Mars rover team) pay taxes at ordinary income tax rates. Also, doctors, teachers, members of the armed forces and veterans pay taxes at ordinary income tax rates.
Accordigly, it appears that our goal for the future is to increase the number of investment bankers and reduce the number of scientists, doctors, teachers, and members of the armed forces. This is not the way we grew the economy in a more balanced way in the 20th century.
Stevie Ray..Clowns to the Left of me Jokers to the Right, here I am...
August 24th, 2012
11:25 am
BRO,
Well played. It seems the more time goes by, the Presidency is becoming more and more a ceremonious position….congress does suck….bunch of kindergarters..
godless heathen
August 24th, 2012
11:29 am
Byte Productivity is a measure of what’s being produced vs. the labor being used to produce it. It’s not stagnant and tends to grow strongly during the latter part of recessions and early part of recoveries (when fewer people get used to create more products). You don’t measure it on a person-by-person basis, it’s an aggregate of results vs. labor input to create the results.
Take one of the many many glass office towers in a large city such as Atlanta. No “products” that can be counted roll out the back door although there are thousands of workers in the building. How is the productivity of all that labor determined?
Adam
August 24th, 2012
11:40 am
Stevie Ray: The right has its share but i do think Obamacare falls into the free stuff category for 30 million or so…
Perhaps in overall desire, not in action. Assuming by “free stuff” you also include welfare, which has a work requirement and a lifetime time limit.
Brosephus™
August 24th, 2012
11:43 am
SR
I wised up a few years ago. The president is nothing but a ceremonious position. Look at the number of advisors they have. They don’t have to think anymore because taxpayers pay people to think for them.
In a presidential election, the things I look at when deciding who to vote for boils down to two things.
First thing I look at is who’s controlling or will control congress. That will determine whether this country has a chance to veer hard right, hard left, run the center, or stagnate as it has done the past four years.
The other thing I look at is who the advisors are for the candidate. I’m not sold on Obama’s people, but one thing that made him look good in ‘08 is that he brought in some sensible people from Clinton’s administration. The Chicago people didn’t sit well with me. McCain’s advisors were not very good in instilling confidence in me. Once he picked Palin, that cemented my vote against him, even though I’ve been a McCain supporter since 2000. Romney going with Bush recasts don’t make me feel comfortable, but I still have until November to make my choice.
beam me up
August 24th, 2012
11:49 am
The very rich (say those with incomes over $1 million per year and net worth over $10 million just to put a face on it), have been getting richer, a lot richer, while everyone else has been getting poorer. That’s a fact. This will probably continue to be the case no matter the outcome of the November election. More and more people will continue to fall into poverty, real poverty, as in having difficulty surviving. This will be a systematic problem, not one of their own making for most. If you don’t know someone who once was doing well , but lost their job and probably has no hope of ever finding a good replacement, then you must not know many people. So, as a society, what are we going to do with these people? Let them starve in the streets? This is the fundamental question of our time. There are very few people who could make it more than a few months if this happened to them. How long could you make it? What if you got sick? Do you want to be heartless? And make no mistake, the Ryan plan is just that. Just ask yourself these questions, and be honest about it. If the answer is that you are plenty well off and don’t care what happens to everyone else, then by all means run out and put a check by Romney’s name. If you are young and vibrant and think you can make it through without any problems, and don’t care about the rest of society, by all means do the same. If however, you are not wealthy (as in truly don’t have to worry wealthy) , or are not young, or maybe not the vision of perfect health, you might want to do some serious soul searching and hard thinking on your own before you do that. Take a break from Fox News and talk radio. If you still feel the same way, by all means. This is an important election. We are at a pivotal point, and this is what it’s about. Everything else is just window dressing and mudslinging.
St Simons - he-ne-ha
August 24th, 2012
11:52 am
(preface: i have 5 little indians in Ga’s educ system, from K – UGAVS)
Do you see the correlation between an achievement of
‘middle class-ness’ and the comprehensive education of our children?
Especially in a, let’s say ‘challenged’ state like Jawja?
Well – here are some of the actual thangs yew can larn in
actual fer-profit charter skool textbooks, in actual use TODAY –
-the Earth is 6,000 yrs old
-swear to god, “the Flintstones is basically historically accurate”
-“[The Ku Klux] Klan in some areas of the country tried to be a means of reform, fighting the decline in morality and using the symbol of the cross. Klan targets were bootleggers, wife-beaters, and immoral movies. In some communities it achieved a certain respectability as it worked with politicians.”
-”the best known work of propaganda to come from the Depression was John Steinbeck’s The Grapes of Wrath…Other forms of propaganda included rumors of mortgage foreclosures, mass evictions, and hunger riots and exaggerated statistics in the so-called Great Depression”
-“Unlike the ‘modern math’ theorists, who believe that mathematics is a creation of man and thus arbitrary and relative, A Beka Book teaches that the laws of mathematics are a creation of God and thus absolute…A Beka Book provides attractive, legible, and workable traditional mathematics texts that are not burdened with modern theories such as set theory.”
-“Mark Twain’s outlook was both self-centered and ultimately hopeless … Twain’s skepticism was clearly not the honest questioning of a seeker of truth but the deliberate defiance of a confessed rebel.”
-”Emily Dickinson viewed salvation as a gamble, not a certainty. Although she did view the Bible as a source of poetic inspiration, she never accepted it as an inerrant guide to life.”
-Girls, you should be mommies, and maybe you could write poems, too.
-”for the best examples of literary excellence, “there is no writing in English that equals the King James Version of the Bible”
-”literary analysis can promote unbelief”
-”aesthetic judgements are possible avenues for sin.”
-”Good fiction likewise does not, directly or by implication, leave moral questions unanswered. Its moral viewpoint is that of the Scriptures.”
and on and on….
with your tax dollars……
lifetimes & generations of work down the drain of ignorance.
thanks a LOT, cons. no really. Congratulations.
Newby
August 24th, 2012
11:55 am
heathen – a measure of productivity might be something like Total Revenue/Total man-hours – adjust as appropriate for youe business.
td
August 24th, 2012
12:04 pm
This survey is comparing household information over a period of time when the household has changed dramatically. This is like comparing apples to oranges and at least on measuring income is bogus.
DawgDad
August 24th, 2012
12:25 pm
“If you were in Obama’s shoes what would you do? You have an opposition party who’s sole purpose is to tank any damn thing you try to do. Your fellow party members don’t have the spine of a dead octopus in backing you up. You tell me what would you do?”
Ha ha ha. Whine, whine, whine. He made his bed, at the expense of the taxpayers.
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
August 24th, 2012
12:52 pm
From Jay:
“And all these shootings are occurring because we don’t have enough guns, right guys?”
No …………. it’s because our culture has changed for the worse and there are myriad reasons for that.
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
August 24th, 2012
12:54 pm
“Granny Godzilla – Union Thugette”
“What’s going on here ? Both of these places are “GUN FREE ZONES” !
Pardon me Mr. Digits, but that’s flat out wrong
Hand gun ban “shot down” by SCOTUS by….5-4.
2 years ago.”
Sorry Granny …………… go back and read Heller v. D.C.
That ruling established “in the home” as an individual right. Illinois/Chicago and New York City do not allow carry on the streets (except for the criminals).
DawgDad
August 24th, 2012
12:56 pm
beam me up:
I’ve been sick and I’ve been laid off. I took care of myself and my family, and I’m not rich. I’ve re-invented my career several times over four-plus decades. The issues you cite are not new problems. America needs to be what it traditionally has been, a Nation where opportunity provides the inspiration for people to work, create, invest, and adapt to advance themselves and future generations. Opportunity is not a trip to the mailbox to pick up somebody else’s handout, it’s a vibrant, expanding, and productive private sector.
It’s not heartless to say this. It’s heartless to cast the safety net backstop solutions as “opportunity”. It’s heartless to make decisions and limit choices and freedoms for other people when they should be making those decisions and choices themselves. It’s heartless to tell someone they “need” government, unless they truly do need government. Government should facilitate, not provide.
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
August 24th, 2012
12:57 pm
And while we’re on the shooting incident, early reports are stating that some of the wounded are due to the police “accidentally shooting people” in an attempt to stop the madman.
Based on what some of you people have opined, the police should not have shot at all since they “might” have wounded/killed someone ………….. you know, the same as a civilian with a concealed permit.
Bottom line …………. you do what you have to do to stop the carnage and in the long run you save lives.
Eugene Patrick Devany
August 24th, 2012
1:06 pm
The data presented focuses on the “middle class” but the real data is much worse for half the country.
According to a report from the Congressional Research Service, in 1995 the top 10% of the country had 67.8% of the country’s wealth while the bottom 50% shared only 3.6% ($1,912 billion [in 2010 dollars]). The bottom share eroded to 2.5% a couple of years before the Great Recession of 2007 and by 2010 it had tumbled to 1.1% ($584 billion). The loss of wealth to the bottom half the country was offset by a 6.7% gain ($3,558 billion) for the top 10%. The data makes it clear that there was prosperity but it not shared. Half of America lost $1,333 billion over 15 years.
A wealth distribution of this extreme has not been seen in the U.S. since the Great Depression of 1929 (when unemployment was also as bad). Top income tax rates were increased from 24% to: 63%, 79%, 81%, 88% and finally to 94% in 1944 in order to correct the economic imbalance. Today job killing payroll taxes actually make conditions worse than in 1929 because they add 7 ½% to the cost of each job (business share) and further reduce consumer spending power by 7 ½% (employee share).
Many economists and politicians know that each year $1.3 trillion in tax expenditures redistribute income mostly to people who don’t need it, but how many economists and politicians know that each year the amount redistributed is twice the amount of wealth owned by half the country? Few economists and politicians know that half of America has only $3 for every $10 they had before.
Do you have a solution?
The 2-4-8 Tax Blend is the only answer. It fixes the tax code by replacing the job killing payroll taxes with a net wealth tax of 2% and reducing the income tax rate to 8% (and is optionally revenue neutral). Read more at http://www.TaxNetWealth.com.
Tom Middleton
August 24th, 2012
1:07 pm
Jay, if a capitalist economy is based on spending first (demand), with investment (supply) stepping up in response, then the middle class can also be called the consumer class and the great demand engine of any capitalist economy.
I mean, investors do consume, but nothing like the middle class. And with the middle class shrinking, like you say, and Republicans doing all in their power to keep government from taking up the slack, especially during troubled times like these, then who will keep it going like was done so well in the past, like during the Clinton years?
I have never accepted the logic of supply-side economics, since investors aren’t going to create one job more than is necessary to meet demand for profit. And I think the Bush years of no-growth should have proved to us all by now that the logic simply isn’t there, in spite of all the claims these days by the fanatical right-wing.
And if Romney is somehow able to win and enact his $5 trillion more in tax cuts for the wealthy by making the middle class pay more, plus make the Bush tax cuts permanent, forever taking us away from the dynamic years of President Clinton, then we are all screwed – poor and middle class alike!
Jay, you say we’ll still be talking about this is 2016 and 2020, but that’s assuming we’ll still have a functional democracy left to make our voices heard. I mean, you see what they’re doing now with their voter-suppression efforts designed to put and keep them in power. Can you imagine what they will be like when they realize we’ve all figured them out!
Mary Elizabeth
August 24th, 2012
2:30 pm
The larger question to pose, Brospheus, is who controls Congress?
The simple answer to that question is that the people control Congress, through their votes. But, the real answer lies deeper. The same people of great wealth and influence who are controlling, especially, the ultraconservative voice in the present day Congress have, also, built a shrewd state-of-the-art propaganda machine to sway the unseeing populace to vote against their own best interests.
Just look at the number of people on this blog who are not aware that they will be voting against their on best interests in November. The current day ultraconservatives are looking out for the interests of the top 1% in this nation.
What a shrinking middle class portends for our future | Jay Bookman | Income Tax Guide
August 24th, 2012
6:31 pm
[...] federal policies. …. Lower taxes and the jobs will return. … Follow this link: What a shrinking middle class portends for our future | Jay Bookman ← THE WANDERING TAX PRO: WHAT ABOUT the MORTGAGE [...]
Adam
August 24th, 2012
9:55 pm
Scout: Bottom line: A trained and psychologically evaluated person is much better with a gun than your standard criminal crazy shooter.
truedat
August 25th, 2012
7:29 pm
There is a real disturbing trend going on in America today that neither party seems to be doing much about,
Prosperous companies demanding major givebacks of their workers and outsourcing American jobs.This is going to end with with all of our children working for Walmart (min wage and no benefits) if working people don’t wise up and start supporting each other..
22,000 AT&T workers were just on strike because they don’t want their pensions robbed and their healthcare gutted. The company makes billions in profit and the CEO’s salary is 25 million dollars a year.
Caterpillar is a prosperous company, The stock was surging — but that does not seem to stop the corporate suits from demanding major givebacks of the employees. Pay freezes, pension freezes, it’s all fair game. The Caterpillar employees went on strike rather than sell future generations down the river.
There was just a one month lockout at Con Edison, another prosperous company, where the 11 million dollar a year CEO locked out 8500 employees and immediately canceled their health insurance! Their stock was at an all time high but the executives still wanted givebacks related to pensions, healthcare, and other things.. Governor Cuomo had to step into the negotiations to get them back to work.
Verizon may lock out 45,000 employees soon. The company is a money making machine. The top 5 executives have been paid 350 million dollars over the past 5 years yet they are demanding everything under the sun back from the employees. Pensions, healthcare, sicktime, overtime etc…. And they are sending lots of American jobs to India and the Philippines.
Seems to me profitable corporations are doing their best to kill the American middle class even as they enjoy tax breaks and get favorable legislation from the politicians that are supposed to be representing “the people”. These politicians may find themselves on the wrong end of a pitchfork weilding mob soon if they don’t stop siding with greedy SOB interests over working middle class Americans interests. A disgrace.
Teaching People to Hate Their Own Govt. Is at the Core of the Project to Destroy the Middle Class | Alternet « Ye Olde Soapbox
August 26th, 2012
4:39 pm
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