The Big Lie exposed, in living color
The core belief that animates the modern conservative movement is that taxes are too damn high and getting higher all the time. They believe that rampaging government at every level — local, state and federal — takes more and more of their hard-earned money, leaving the private sector barely enough resources to sustain itself.
In fact, I’d love to ask delegates to the 2012 Republican Convention in Tampa this month one simple question: As a share of the economy, how much have total taxes increased over the last 50 years? Most would probably guess that it has doubled or tripled.
The real answer is that it has not changed at all. As a share of gross domestic product — and that’s the standard measure of tax burden accepted by most economists, both liberal and conservative — taxes at every level today amount to roughly 25 percent of the economy, just what they did back in the early ’60s.
In other words, the image of an ever-gluttonous government that serves as the basis of modern conservatism is false.
The chart above, compiled from decades of federal data by the Tax Policy Center, has a lot of smaller stories to tell as well:
– Local and state taxes account for the same share of the American economy today as they did back in the 1930s, which means it is unchanged for 80 years.
– As a share of GDP, taxes on corporations have fallen to less than half of what they were back in the 1950s.
– The only type of taxes to have grown as a share of the economy in the last 50 years have been federal payroll taxes, used to finance Social Security and Medicare and generally hitting the working and middle classes. For the last 30 years, revenue surpluses generated by Social Security have been diverted out of that program and used to run general government programs.
– To shrink then-rising deficits, President Clinton signed tax increases into law in 1993 at considerable political cost to himself and his party. The results are evident in the chart in the form of gradually rising revenue from the individual income tax. What the chart does not show is that despite GOP predictions of economic calamity after those tax increases, we went on to enjoy the longest period of economic expansion in our nation’s history.
Thanks to that rising revenue, we were also able to reclaim control of our nation’s fiscal destiny, slashing the annual deficit to zero. That proved temporary. Major tax cuts in 2001 and 2003 did not produce the economic boom that their backers had promised, but they did set off another cycle of rapidly increasing deficits.
A gradual return to the Clinton-era tax rates — not just for the wealthy, but for everybody — would allow us once again to reclaim control of our national finances. (And yes, at this point significant spending cuts will be required as well.) But in a political climate dominated by false notions about taxation, that option is simply not open to us.
– Jay Bookman
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299 comments Add your comment
Mama Says
August 20th, 2012
11:02 am
Hey Jay
give me your insider secret. Where do you come up with all the “facts” you qoute daily.
we should be on an even field.
by the way I love this trend you libs are starting to show.
Whats with this we are the patriots because we support the government taking your money stuff ?
some of you are actually trying to say the conservatives are anti American because we want less government.
Read your history folks–you cannot win that argument. No country ever revolted because its citizens felt their government wasnt taking enough in taxes.
Jackie
August 20th, 2012
11:04 am
Does anyone have a list of responsibilities they would remove from any level of government?
gadem
August 20th, 2012
11:04 am
I think Republicans need Sex Ed classes…
http://www.buzzfeed.com/annanorth/the-6-craziest-things-people-have-said-about-pregn
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
August 20th, 2012
11:07 am
Anyway, as you read Niall Ferguson, it’s worth noting that he has been wrong on economics ever since Obama took office.
Generation$crewed
August 20th, 2012
11:08 am
http://www.normanjohnsoncpa.com/fft/payingmore.htm
Seems this guy disagrees with you Jay!
Now he is only a CPA and you do write a blog, so maybe we should discount him.
Fair warning he did not use any colorful charts but he does say this……..
“Despite these differences we can make some general comparisons to give you a sense of how the tax burdens have changed over time. The U.S. Treasury Department provides inflation adjusted measures of “per capita tax burden.” The per capita tax burden indicates how much each person in the country would pay in taxes if everyone paid the same amount and how this amount differs today from earlier periods.”
And this….
“As large as that increase was, the increase in the per capita tax burden throughout the 1980s and 1990s was close to what has become a normal rate of increase, not the exception for the century. But let’s look back to what should have been a time of huge burden to Americans. At the end of the Second World War, the per capita tax burden stood at $2,505, up from less than $1,000 at the start of the war. So, while the per capita tax burden has risen 40 percent in a generation, it has risen over seven-fold, that’s 700%, in three generations.
So, are you paying more than your parents? Probably so – by 40% or more.”
But again he is just a CPA and you do write a blog, so maybe we should just believe you.
I mean you’ve never been partisan about things before right, I mean you never spin anything right
Joe Hussein Mama
August 20th, 2012
11:10 am
Donovan — “His acceptance to the reality of Social Security being looted for other government programs is a subtle confession of Democrat malfeasance for the purposes of vote buying and citizen control.”
And yet when a Democrat — who was running for President — proposed securing those funds so that Congress *couldn’t* “loot” those funds, the GOP laughed its head off.
Granny Godzilla - Union Thugette
August 20th, 2012
11:10 am
Mama Says
“Read your history folks–you cannot win that argument. No country ever revolted because its citizens felt their government wasnt taking enough in taxes.”
No, but entire nations have been brought down by allowing a wealthy elite aristocracy to literally starve the people….
Hint:Let them eat cake
USinUK - pro-gay-marriage thug and former Girl Scout
August 20th, 2012
11:13 am
“That same George Washington was the ultimate 1%er of his time with an accumulated wealth, of get this, 525M dollars.”
which he got by working for the gummint and marrying Martha.
USinUK - pro-gay-marriage thug and former Girl Scout
August 20th, 2012
11:14 am
Mama – 11:02 –
is reading not your strong suit??
look at the bottom of the chart above – NBER
enoughsaid
August 20th, 2012
11:14 am
The only thing missing with this article is an editorial cartoon by Luckovich showing his one party can only do wrong mentality.
TaxPayer
August 20th, 2012
11:15 am
Hint:Let them eat cake
That argument does not work on the Republican constituency. They like cake.
Goody Three Shoes
August 20th, 2012
11:15 am
Augusta National adds first 2 female members
http://www.ajc.com/sports/golf/augusta-national-adds-first-1502648.html
Compromise
August 20th, 2012
11:15 am
Studies show that people who pay taxes feel more strongly about tax increases. I have no chart to support this.
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
August 20th, 2012
11:16 am
Williebkind :
1) If you are talking about Ruby Ridge ……… we are a nation of laws. If you are indicted, you have the right to hear your case heard in open court. You do not have the right to murder a U.S. Marshal.
2) If you are talking about taxes …………. work on the tremendous amount of waste, fraud and abuse first. Then we’ll discuss if there is a need to maintain or increase current levels.
Soothsayer
August 20th, 2012
11:16 am
Well, I see where Augusta National has done let in 2 clunky ol’ girls. Ewwwww! What is the World coming to? Is nothing sacred, anymore?
barking frog
August 20th, 2012
11:17 am
Forget the cake, I demand
Banana Pudding !
Soothsayer
August 20th, 2012
11:18 am
Oh, and by the way. I sure am glad to know I’m not a socialist anymore. Now, I’m just a regular ol’ garden variety communist. What a relief!
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
August 20th, 2012
11:18 am
Augusta National = He-man Woman Haters club.
USinUK - pro-gay-marriage thug and former Girl Scout
August 20th, 2012
11:19 am
“1) If you are talking about Ruby Ridge ……… we are a nation of laws. If you are indicted, you have the right to hear your case heard in open court. You do not have the right to murder a U.S. Marshal.”
it always scares the hell out of me when Scout and I are in agreement.
Welcome to the Occupation
August 20th, 2012
11:19 am
Niall Ferguson: proof of the endless capacity for Americans to swoon over bottomless hackery when it comes with the nice Oxbridge brogue.
getalife
August 20th, 2012
11:21 am
ferguson was a mccain adviser and gop hack.
Aquagirl
August 20th, 2012
11:21 am
If you are talking about Ruby Ridge ……… we are a nation of laws.
Unless you’re a wingnut, in which case we’re a nation of laws, except for you personally. Then you get to decide what laws apply to you, and shooting anyone who disagrees makes you the object of much fruitcake devotion.
larry
August 20th, 2012
11:22 am
I still say the House is up for grabs. This guy co-sponsored a bill with Rep. Ryan to redefine the definition of rape. Idiotic Ignorance is going to cost the Repubs.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/20/joe-scarborough-todd-akin-rape-morning-joe_n_1810077.html?ir=Politics&ncid=edlinkusaolp00000009
Mama Says
August 20th, 2012
11:23 am
Ok Granny now the republicans are akin to French Aristocracy.
The richest country in the world now has peasents. you guys are getting funnier
Hey gay boy scout or whoever. I was asking generally as you should know since I asked for his DAILY source..duh
larry
August 20th, 2012
11:24 am
Augusta National adds first 2 female members
I never thought i’d see that in my lifetime. I said he!! would freeze over before they admit women.
I guess he!! has a winter storm warning as we speak.
Moderate Line
August 20th, 2012
11:25 am
What is left out is the growth of non-defense spending? In 1962 49.2% of the budget was for National Defense. In 2011 non-defense 19.4%. In 1962 Social Security was 13.2% and 2011 20.1%.
The Big Lie is that Non-Defense is rising and will continue to eat of the budget.
Also, the revenues in terms of GDP is misleading because with unemployment over 8% revenues would be down because people don’t have jobs. In this way it is misleading.
In 2007 receipts were 18.5% of GDP in 1962 they were 17.8%.
Soothsayer
August 20th, 2012
11:25 am
mama = low information much
kawasaki kid
August 20th, 2012
11:26 am
Don’t know if anyone reads the posts this far down the list, but since the 60’s, Big Money has armed itself to the teeth with conservative talk radio stations and bullsh– artists spewing hate and misinformation to millions of blue-collar rednecks, who avidly eat the crap up during the day while on the job driving or working. This is ground-zero for our political polarization.
stands for decibels (SfBA)
August 20th, 2012
11:26 am
UnU, Scout thinks Romney ought to release more of his tax records, and he thinks it shouldn’t be so easy to get a concealed-carry permit.
He’s all right, sometimes.
Soothsayer
August 20th, 2012
11:28 am
kawasaki: it’s called mass indoctrination.
I call it training to be fascist.
Granny Godzilla - Union Thugette
August 20th, 2012
11:29 am
Mama says….
Not all….Mrs. Silly Pants.
Unless you are admitting to all of us here that you are unaware
of the number of people in this nation that live in poverty?
But yes….the 1…2% are akin to the French Aristocracy.
And frankly it’s sick of you to think that it’s funny.
getalife
August 20th, 2012
11:30 am
willie will release he 2010 taxes in October
That is all you people will get.
So the gop will vote for a tax cheat with zero foreign policy experience but does know how to fire Americans. Her will raise taxes and try to steal SS and Medicare.
What could go wrong?
cc
August 20th, 2012
11:30 am
Bookman:
I do not understand why you waste your time and talent writing for a liberal rag. You should be in charge of the nation’s economy!
Corporations, companies and businesses do NOT pay taxes. Their tax obligation is added to the price of their goods or services and the consumer pays the taxes.
How brilliant to support an increase in taxes! That will take more money out of the economy and prevent any beginning of a recovery. Please not that I did not say, “slow the recovery”. There hasn’t been any recovery. An increase in taxes might permit obama to fund more “green energy” businesses founded by his campaign contributors. They manufacture products that consumers don’t want and will not buy, but it helps Obama with his fundraising.
Yes, Bookman, I believe you’ve nailed it!
. . . over $6 trillion and moving FORWARD . . .
larry
August 20th, 2012
11:32 am
Now i know its a freezing day in he!!.
I’m agreeing with Bill Kristol. It is “weird” that Mitt Romney paid only 13.9% on income of 42 million. Kristol says that Romney should pay more.
Yikes!!
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/20/bill-kristol-mitt-romney-tax-rate_n_1810512.html?1345471816&ncid=edlinkusaolp00000009
JamVet
August 20th, 2012
11:33 am
Corporations, companies and businesses do NOT pay taxes.
This inane neocon nonsense again?????????
F. Sinkwich
August 20th, 2012
11:33 am
Something more for lefties to feel good about:
“A provision of President Obama’s health care law imposes a second Medicare tax on investment income for Americans classified as wealthy, effectively raising taxes on investment income and taxing investors twice. The provision, a little-known part of ObamaCare, levies a 3.8 percent Medicare tax on investment income for couples making more than $250,000 or individuals making more than $200,000 a year.”
Higher taxes !! YEE-HAAAAA
JohnnyReb
August 20th, 2012
11:34 am
Jay, your piece paints the best possible support for LIberal policies but omits details that make or break.
First and foremost, while the taxes collected may be almost the same, the people paying it are not. Almost 50% of wage earners end up either paying no federal income taxes or get back more in April than they actually paid in. A smaller number of wage earners are carrying the freight. The federal government takes from the producers and gives to the those who do not.
If tax income has been about the same, why do we have such a deficit? While war spending that Liberals like to crow about contributed, the biggest expense has been growing entitlement programs. What has Democrats done to address this? More and more spending.
While the Left does not like the plan of the Right; all you have is more of the same. More spending, more borrowing, more growing the federal government.
I think Newsweek hit the nail on the head – it’s time for Obama to hit the road – go to retirement – live off the tax payers the rest of his life. After all, that’s all he knows.
Erwin's cat
August 20th, 2012
11:34 am
Moderate Line – What is left out is the growth of non-defense spending? In 1962 49.2% of the budget was for National Defense. In 2011 non-defense 19.4%. In 1962 Social Security was 13.2% and 2011 20.1%.
The Big Lie is that Non-Defense is rising and will continue to eat of the budget.
Also, the revenues in terms of GDP is misleading because with unemployment over 8% revenues would be down because people don’t have jobs. In this way it is misleading.
In 2007 receipts were 18.5% of GDP in 1962 they were 17.8%.
—————————————-
your points certainly have merit…especially for those proportionality types
USinUK - pro-gay-marriage thug and former Girl Scout
August 20th, 2012
11:34 am
dB – 11:26 – stop. you’re blowing my mind, man!
cc
August 20th, 2012
11:35 am
getalife:
Refresh my memory, please.
How many “tax cheats” did obama appoint to high government positions? How many of them were so bad that he actually dropped them? Did he pay to have those rcords “sealed” also?
Inquiring minds want to know!
USinUK - pro-gay-marriage thug and former Girl Scout
August 20th, 2012
11:35 am
” levies a 3.8 percent Medicare tax on investment income for couples making more than $250,000 or individuals making more than $200,000 a year”
ohnoes!!!
3.8% on a quarter million!!!
Chris
August 20th, 2012
11:36 am
Your graph is a percentage of GDP. Clever, but that matters little to the average Joe. Why don’t you due the comparison of tax liability to wage growth. Then maybe you will understand the average conservative’s argument (you know we’re not all CEO’s making 100s of millions, despite what you tend to think).
GT
August 20th, 2012
11:37 am
The problem with our economy is caused by private capital not government interference or too much government. Somewhere we have confused our values of how we conduct ourselves privately and how we express ourselves publicly. The economy over borrowed privately and was allowed to by private capital investors and banks easy credit which gave us a false sense of security and gave them huge profits. Then the government under Bush bails these facilitators out of there poor decisions leaving the middle class to suffer, while the facilitators kept their wealth for doing a horrible job and then turn on the new government daring them to touch them. They got the woman pregnant and now do not want to pay child support leaving the middle class to fend for itself. If the economy was fair and if these bandits had been allowed to go under like the nature of economics calls for new opportunity arises for up current in the middle class making them the new rich and beneficiaries of this fortune and the cause of the problems goes to the back of the line. When people say the whole world would have gone into depression if we had not bail the banks out, we say the middle class is in a depression and the rich that caused it are not, the world would not be much different to our sight. Now not only do you have a world propped up by government but a government very well looking at bankruptcy in the future itself. And it will be aided in this quest for bankruptcy by a Tea Party now and only now being obstructionist, claiming no credit for us being in this position in the first place.
Erwin's cat
August 20th, 2012
11:38 am
3.8% on a quarter million!!!
or $9500…but that’s okay because they can afford it more
Chris
August 20th, 2012
11:40 am
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
Augusta National = He-man Woman Haters club.
___________________________________________________
Augusta National = A private club that can do what it wants. It has the freedom to choose its members, and that freedom burns liberals.
Michael
August 20th, 2012
11:40 am
We have a strange mixture of events occurring now. The US has dropped a vehicle using a jet-propelled crane onto Mars. That vehicle is now preparing to fire a laser to disintegrate a rock and conduct experiments. For me, that action puts the US first in an important field in the 21st century.
Next week republicans will gather in Tampa to bemoan the government and complain about taxes.
Meanwhile, I’m willing to bet that the team in the Goddard space center pay ordinary income taxes at rates significantly higher than Mitt. This is because one of the odious parts of the tax cuts enabled Mitt to treat his carried interest (bonus) as a capital gain. So, our tax system rewards investment bankers and punishes scientists. For me that is not a strategy for success.
Also, given the influence of the tea party the republicans will propose moving forward boldly into the 18th century.
Jackie
August 20th, 2012
11:40 am
The current tax code as muddled and complicated as it is, how does any of us that file income tax returns not be a tax cheat? If you have ever been audited and have had to be additional taxes for a tax year because of filing errors, were you not a tax cheat?
Happy Trails
August 20th, 2012
11:40 am
“you know we’re not all CEO’s making 100s of millions, despite what you tend to think”
That is true, however you are a water carrier for many who are in the higher income brackets.
They would say thank you, but are currently busy “trickling down on you”
hiram
August 20th, 2012
11:42 am
This entire conversation is about the short term, a blip on the radar screen of time. I don’t want to step on anyone’s toes, but the D vs R argument is nearing an ironic end.
A democracy is based on mathmatics. You don’t have to be the firstest with the mostest, just the mostest.
The current irreversible shift in the country’s demographics, which favors the Democrats, can be completely attributed to the Repubicans.
While the Republican electorate was focused on weighty issues like gay marriage and guns, the relative handful at the top, were opening the country’s floodgates for a short term source of cheap labor(all Democrats), without any consideration as to the long term effects on their party.
In other words, while successfully distracting the clueless(majority of the party), they literally sold the rope to hang themselves, along with the rest of the party.
Soothsayer
August 20th, 2012
11:43 am
Corporations, companies and businesses do NOT pay taxes.
At last, a con gets something right.
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
August 20th, 2012
11:43 am
…and that freedom burns liberals.
No but by all means continue to speak for me, sport.
Chris
August 20th, 2012
11:44 am
Happy Trails
“you know we’re not all CEO’s making 100s of millions, despite what you tend to think”
That is true, however you are a water carrier for many who are in the higher income brackets.
They would say thank you, but are currently busy “trickling down on you”
____________________________________________________
How am I a water carrier if I don’t work for them and don’t expect anything to trickle down from them? When you think for yourself and how you can get yourself into a better position without relying on the work of others, you will find a much more liberating existence.
Fearful!
August 20th, 2012
11:44 am
Nice pic of Ryan and Akin:
http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/08/19/712251/how-todd-akin-and-paul-ryan-partnered-to-redefine-rape/
Happy Trails
August 20th, 2012
11:45 am
keep carrying that water
I own my own business thank you, but keep swinging when you are not carrying their water
Redneck Convert (R--and proud of it)
August 20th, 2012
11:46 am
Augusta National adds first 2 female members
Well, it’s a sad day for us men. Most of us go to the golf course to get away from the nagging and honey-do lists. Now we’re going to get a steady diet of 6-hr. rounds behind a bunch of cookie-bakers. This ain’t right. And I knew it was bound to come when I seen that picture of this Karen Handel and that awful swing on the front of the Neighbor newspaper a couple years ago. I just hope they don’t invade Billy Bob’s.
Chris
August 20th, 2012
11:46 am
‘The current irreversible shift in the country’s demographics, which favors the Democrats, can be completely attributed to the Repubicans.’
This has been said for years, but as people age, they tend to grow up and think like adults, and tend to start voting Republican.
F. Sinkwich
August 20th, 2012
11:47 am
“ohnoes!!!
3.8% on a quarter million!!!”
Usinuk took her ignorant pills this AM I see. May have OD’d.
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
August 20th, 2012
11:49 am
…and tend to start voting Republican.
VOTE REPUBLICAN: It’s Easier Than Thinking!
USinUK - pro-gay-marriage thug and former Girl Scout
August 20th, 2012
11:49 am
“but that’s okay because they can afford it more”
even Adam Smith said that it was a moral imperative that the wealthy paid more
Erwin's cat
August 20th, 2012
11:51 am
USinUK – even Adam Smith said that it was a moral imperative that the wealthy paid more
and they do
No Artificial Flavors
August 20th, 2012
11:51 am
To My hard-core republican friends and family perception is reality when it comes to taxes. The problem is their perception is based on willful ignorance of the facts, such as the data presented. However, we don’t have a taxing problem, we have a spending problem. Government is trying to be all things to all people without letting people just be people in many instances of life.
Mama Says
August 20th, 2012
11:52 am
I forgot Sooth,
if cons dont agree with you we are wrong.
Granny, if you are truly worried about the poor, demand that the goverment be accountable for the money they do take from us instead of simply supporting more theft.
by the way its not funny that people are poor. its funny that you rich libs claim to represent them while you rake in the money for yourselves
USinUK - pro-gay-marriage thug and former Girl Scout
August 20th, 2012
11:52 am
Erwin – obviously, they don’t, given what we DO know about Mittens and his returns.
JohnnyReb
August 20th, 2012
11:53 am
Augusta National yields to PC. I hate to see this. A private club is pressured so much that it throws its traditions under the bus to shut up the Left. First group; a white and a black. Next it will be a Latino and Asian. Political correctness must be maintained.
Obama is over
August 20th, 2012
11:53 am
Gadem @ 10:28
The Aug. 6th cover of Newsweek featured a picture of Romney with the title “Romney the wimp” so your bias against liberal comment is false. Your comments attacking Niall Ferguson are sad because you can’t defend the text of the article and have to attack him personally. Ferguson essentially summarizes what everybody already knows- the Obama agenda has been a miserable failure. The challenge now is for Obama to actually release a plan to address the issues facing America: entitlement reform, tax reform, energy independence, national security, etc.The trustees of Social Security announced last month that Social Security disability insurance will be insolvent by 2016. Other than taxing the rich, does Obama have a plan? As far as Jay’s pretty chart goes, I would argue that the economic growth of the Clinton years was a result of the capital gains rate being lowered and not income tax rate increases. Of course Obama wants to raise both the capital gains rate and the dividend tax rate. These increases will not generate the revenue Obama thinks, will injure retirees looking to supplement income, and encourage investment overseas. The Obama administration is intellectually bankrupt, has no new ideas to solve anything, and has to go.
USinUK - pro-gay-marriage thug and former Girl Scout
August 20th, 2012
11:53 am
“its funny that you rich libs claim to represent them while you rake in the money for yourselves”
not NEARLY as funny as you people who claim to be Christians who don’t want to do anything about it
Erwin's cat
August 20th, 2012
11:54 am
USinUK – Erwin – obviously, they don’t, given what we DO know about Mittens and his returns.
Mitt paid $6-7M in 1 year
what did you pay?
Joe Hussein Mama
August 20th, 2012
11:56 am
Chris — “This has been said for years, but as people age, they tend to grow up and think like adults, and tend to start voting Republican.”
It was exactly the reverse for me; I grew up, started *thinking* and began to vote Democratic after 20 years of voting Republican.
And the same is true for a lot of other voters who have turned away from the GOP in recent years.
Chris
August 20th, 2012
11:57 am
I’ll tell you who I am a water carrier for: the people who don’t want to improve their lot in life; people who declare that things ‘just aren’t fair’ and so someone else should subsidize the standard of living of what they think they’re entitled to; the able bodied people who ask you for change outside gas stations who think they shouldn’t need to work; the people who say ‘my occupation is X’ and collect unemployment instead of taking a job that is not X or retraining for another job. And quite frankly, I’m tired of carrying the water for THOSE people.
Joe Hussein Mama
August 20th, 2012
11:58 am
Chris — “I’ll tell you who I am a water carrier for: the people who don’t want to improve their lot in life”
I do not think that phrase means what you think it means.
USinUK - pro-gay-marriage thug and former Girl Scout
August 20th, 2012
12:00 pm
“Mitt paid $6-7M in 1 year what did you pay?”
And that is WHAT %%% of his income??? and what %%% SHOULD he be paying???
sorry, but dollars don’t interest me – percentage does.
Jackie
August 20th, 2012
12:01 pm
I wonder if those folks with a degree above that of a Bachelor and experience of more than 20 years that can not get a job of any kind because “they are over qualified…”, or, “…have been unemployed for more than 6 months” are the ones who don’t deserve consideration?
USinUK - pro-gay-marriage thug and former Girl Scout
August 20th, 2012
12:02 pm
Weekly Standard editor Bill Kristol said Monday that he thinks Mitt Romney should pay a higher tax rate, calling the rate he pays on his investments “weird.”
“I personally — if I were designing the tax code — would have a tax code in which Mitt Romney paid more than 13 percent, given what I know about the kind of investments he made money from,” Kristol said
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/20/bill-kristol-mitt-romney-tax-rate_n_1810512.html
I mean, criminey – when your own SIDE says you’re not paying your fair share, that speaks VOLUMES
RB from Gwinnett
August 20th, 2012
12:10 pm
USinUK, “not NEARLY as funny as you people who claim to be Christians who don’t want to do anything about it”
Tell me USinUK, how long does one need to be on welfare/section 8/food stamps/free lunches/etc before they stop being poor?
If you can’t give a definitive answer to that question, you aren’t doing anything about it either.
JamVet
August 20th, 2012
12:10 pm
JKL2, go cry to your mommy.
Though you can’t, times change…
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
August 20th, 2012
12:12 pm
Augusta National SHEETS!
Sagegirl
August 20th, 2012
12:13 pm
A bit off topic… I just saw a film on one of the movie channels called ‘INSIDE JOB’. It’s about the financial crisis that has led to us to where we sit today. It’s an eye opener with a lot of white collar bad guys in the middle of this mess. None of them lost a penny while hundreds of thousands lost everything. In fact they’re still making ridiculous amouts of money off the backs of the middle class and poor. Here’s a short storyline:
‘Inside Job’ provides a comprehensive analysis of the global financial crisis of 2008, which at a cost over $20 trillion, caused millions of people to lose their jobs and homes in the worst recession since the Great Depression, and nearly resulted in a global financial collapse. Through exhaustive research and extensive interviews with key financial insiders, politicians, journalists, and academics, the film traces the rise of a rogue industry which has corrupted politics, regulation, and academia.
Check it out if you can, but be warned… you’ll be mad as hell.
USinUK - pro-gay-marriage thug and former Girl Scout
August 20th, 2012
12:14 pm
“Tell me USinUK, how long does one need to be on welfare/section 8/food stamps/free lunches/etc before they stop being poor?”
woooooooooooohooooooooooo, BOY are those food stamp queens raking in the cash
http://www.nlchp.org/content/pubs/Food%20Stamp%20Basics1.pdf
yep. boy, howdy, they’re getting rich-rich-rich.
TaxPayer
August 20th, 2012
12:15 pm
Erwin don’t do percentages.
Jefferson
August 20th, 2012
12:19 pm
I bet the so callet 13% Romney paid was on taxable income, not income. No telling what taxes he evaded with deductions only a Arthur Anderson auditor would approve.
Show the returns, see what the real truth is. Otherwise, tax cheat.
RB from Gwinnett
August 20th, 2012
12:19 pm
USinUK, “sorry, but dollars don’t interest me – percentage does.”
I call BS!!! Most of you people whining about Mitt’s 13% are paying 0% and whining as if it’s not fair. And you’re comparing capital gains tax rates to income tax rates and you know thats apples and oranges.
AND, just so we’re clear, MITT ROMNEY DID NOT WRITE THE TAX CODE. He would have to be a complete idiot to pay more than he’s required to. Your favorite son Warren Buffet who thinks he should pay more is in court with the IRS trying to keep his company from paying what it does owe much less more.
Geez, the wealth envy from you liberals is just pathetic.
hiram
August 20th, 2012
12:28 pm
I’m neither a D, R or TP, because, if you pull back the curtain, they all suc. Honesty in government is apparently beyond the capability of humans.
For Democrats here, why hasn’t Obama’s DOJ prosecuted the Wall Street crooks who crashed the entire world’s economy?
Both parties are complicit to the monied interest(who stole most of it), but people are so predisposed to a herd mentality, that they refuse acknowledge it.
The country needs a legitimate third party, made up of mainstream people, who are capable of rationale thinking, but biology will prevent it from ever happening.
Mighty Righty
August 20th, 2012
12:32 pm
So the liberals have been lying all along that the rich are gettting richer while the poor are getting poorer and therr reasoning for this is tax cuts for the rich! Thank you Jay for bringing out the truth. I knew the left were lying therough their teeth just trying to stir up class warfare.
Liberal Hack
August 20th, 2012
12:44 pm
libs and their distain for the military spending is rather hypocritical sense they want to increase spending on just about everywhere else, well most of them, (there are reasonable libs on this blog who think otherwise)
lets’ compromise, we cut the national defense budget dollar for dollar what we pay planned parenthood, why do we need to give them another dollar since Obama care pay’s for contraception and other womens needs?
gadem
August 20th, 2012
12:49 pm
Mama says crocodiles are so ornery ’cause they have all them teeth and no toothbrush…Mama, you are wrong again.
Towncrier
August 20th, 2012
12:58 pm
“In other words, the image of an ever-gluttonous government that serves as the basis of modern conservatism is false.”
How does this claim follow from the fact that government spending, as a percentage of the GDP, has increased almost five times what it was in 1930 (where you chart begins)? Taxes are but one side of the equation. Conservatives feel government is bigger than it should be, period.
It Ain't A LIE If THEY Believe it
August 20th, 2012
1:27 pm
In this political climate dominated by false notions about taxation is that
the great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie, deliberate, contrived
and dishonest, but the myth, persistent, persuasive and unrealistic.
Reality
August 20th, 2012
1:30 pm
Jay, It doesn’t seem to make any difference whether we elect a Democrat or Republican. Its always the same results. The politicans in Washington spend more than they bring in every time. I’m for helping people but we can only do what the budget allows. And yes, I’m on So. Sec. and DON’T say its an entitlement. I’ve been putting money in that since I was 18 and am now in my 70’s. Politicians are going to satisfy their constituency. No matter the cost. I consider myself independant on politics. But both partys know how to swing votes their way. Pres. O’bama is a nice looking, clean cut man with a nice looking average American family. And he makes a great speech. But in my humble opinion thats where it ends. He just does’nt have the education, experience, and background to take America back to financial stability. I’m going to vote for the candidate that has those traits. Getting the country back on track financialy is going to be painful for everybody. But its gotta be done. God help us if we don’t.
Cons believe it Is easy to get people to believe a BIG lie...than a lot of SMALL lies
August 20th, 2012
1:33 pm
@Mighty Righty
August 20th, 2012
12:32 pm
So the liberals have been lying all along that the rich are gettting richer while the poor are getting poorer and therr reasoning for this is tax cuts for the rich! Thank you Jay for bringing out the truth. I knew the left were lying therough their teeth just trying to stir up class warfare.
_________________________________________________
LIBERALS LYING?
I don’t think so.
CONS have the market on lying.
Just listen to Myth Robme.
The truth ain’t in him
Welcome to the Occupation
August 20th, 2012
1:36 pm
Chris: “This has been said for years, but as people age, they tend to grow up and think like adults, and tend to start voting Republican.”
And little do they know that in doing so they’re digging a grave for their nation.
Welcome to the Occupation
August 20th, 2012
1:41 pm
There seems to be a predominance of Bubbathink on this blog.
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
August 20th, 2012
1:44 pm
stands for decibels (SfBA) :
……….. and Obama should release his college records concerning how it was paid for and his student status.
independent thinker
August 20th, 2012
2:00 pm
When Mitt said he never paid less than 13% in taxes, was he referring to all taxes including property and sales tax or just income taxes??? there is only one way to find out.
Karl Rove
August 20th, 2012
2:05 pm
Republicans never deficit spend. We just never pay attention to where the funding comes from. Let the Democrats worry about that. That’s why my boy Paul is not a hypocrite in voting for unfunded Medicare Drugs to get George W reelected. Now he can blame the Democrats for both the Medicare deficit and Obama cutting Medicare- makes sense to me.
Welcome to the Occupation
August 20th, 2012
2:11 pm
Scout, you like this right-winger Romney, because he’s of the right. Right?
Cons believe it Is easy to get people to believe a BIG lie...than a lot of SMALL lies
August 20th, 2012
3:44 pm
@Welcome to the Occupation
August 20th, 2012
1:41 pm
There seems to be a predominance of Bubbathink on this blog.
___________________________________________________________
There is also a predominance of Honey Boo Boo’s on this blog to.
Jym Allyn
August 20th, 2012
6:28 pm
By definition, if the statement comes from a “Conservative” it is a lie. That is why I quit the Republican Party after 40 years.
Jym Allyn
August 20th, 2012
6:29 pm
Tragically, today’s “Conservatives” are like alcoholics in that they don’t know when they are lying. That is why Melodie Beattie’s book “Co-Dependent No More” needs to be required political reading.
MikeT
August 22nd, 2012
4:12 am
Wrong question. Give Washington more money, less money, whatever. The government cannot solve any problem. It is hopelessly broken. Why focus on the wrong thing. Cut spending to every foreign concern by 20%, now. Obviously this is not a long term solution.
Spending needs to be stated by its real cost. Cost + interest. Government needs to balance the budget based on those numbers.
It is ridiculous that we are made to think that the middle class should feel guilty by thinking that the government should make good on the promise of social security. We paid our money to a ponzie scheme. They made the promise and accepted our money. Cut money to other concerns. We need to insist that they make good on their promise.