American history, as told through the two Romneys
The political debate continues to be dominated by questions involving GOP nominee Mitt Romney and his financial history, more particularly his refusal to release any tax information other than his 2010 return and an estimate of his 2011 taxes.
The decision to withhold the information has begun to perplex even conservative pundits such as William Kristol (”It’s crazy”) to George Will (”He must have calculated that there are higher costs in releasing them).” In many cases, unflattering comparisons are being drawn between Romney and his father, George, who as a candidate for the GOP nomination in 1968 began the modern practice of tax disclosure by releasing 12 years of his returns.
While that debate rages, I thought it might be interesting to study what we know of the two Romneys not for what it might tell us about their character, openness, etc., but about the time and place in which each man lived.
Take a look at the thumbnail financial descriptions posted on the right. The younger Romney, as a passive, non-working investor now drawing upon his success at Bain Capital, collected income in 2010 amounting to 439 times the median household income of his fellow Americans.
His father, during a 12-year period in which he mainly worked as chairman and president of American Motors, earned an average annual income that was 44 times that of the median household income of his fellow Americans. Adjusted for inflation, his average income of $247,743 in 1965 dollars would be $1.7 million today.
In the ’50s and ’60s, a period considered the economic heyday of a free and capitalist post-war America, George Romney paid 37 percent of his income in federal taxes.
By 2010, Romney’s son paid a total of 13.9 percent of his income in federal taxes, this in an America that is supposedly well on its way to becoming a socialist state, with a confiscatory federal government intent on stealing the wealth of its highest earners.
Reality, in other words, directly contradicts mythology, but with little apparent effect. The fact that the “socialist” meme not only survives but thrives despite its obvious absurdity is, I would argue, testimony to the perception-altering power of propaganda. Or as the elder Romney might put it, a case of brainwashing.
– Jay Bookman
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645 comments Add your comment
Tundra Dude
July 16th, 2012
6:31 pm
We have a rich history of rich presidents. Why is Romney so different?
Maybe cuz he’s hiding millions in the Caymans, Switzerland, and maybe Luxembourg.
Inquiring Minds want to know…..if none of these millions are subject to US taxation, why is it being hidden…..??
Jay
July 16th, 2012
6:32 pm
JohnnyReb, before the Bush tax cuts, it was 34 percent who paid no income tax.
A lot of the folks in question are living just on Social Security. You want to tax them more? A lot of them are poor mothers raising kids on a limited income. You want to tax them more? Others have lost their jobs and are living on unemployment or their 401ks. You want to tax them more?
And you don’t want to ask the same of someone making $21 million a year?
F. Sinkwich
July 16th, 2012
6:33 pm
At least a bit of good news:
“Opponents have locked in enough votes to block Senate ratification of the controversial Law of the Sea treaty championed by White House and the Pentagon.”
DebbieDoRight - The Only Thing Wrong With Capitalism; is Capitalists
July 16th, 2012
6:34 pm
Tom M. : if you believe Steinbeck, we’re always going to win overall. Let’s hope so anyway!
History & numbers are on our side. Remember what happened to the 1% during the French Revolution? Or another good one is what happened to them during the RUSSIAN Revolution?
History has proven time and time again, those with wealth don’t “trickle it down” — they keep hoarding it until the 99% kicks their azzes and MAKES them give it up.
They can do it the easy way, pay more taxes, or they can go the route of the French and the Russians. It’s up to them…
Soothsayer
July 16th, 2012
6:34 pm
Well, I just wandered by. I saw this over on Wingnut’s blog and I just had to share it with you. Attributed to “Ronnie Raygun” (you know who you are).
A conservative is what you get when Mommy and Daddy tell Jr. that he’s the most special person in the world, and he’s dumb enough to believe it into adulthood.
Aint’t the truth! But, then again, WTF do I know?
Same old song and dance -- Diversion, Distraction, Distortion
July 16th, 2012
6:35 pm
God forbid Obama should run for reelection on his accomplishments. But wait — he doesn’t have any accomplishments.
So if you don’t have a record to run on, you spend your time demonizing your opponent and hope the voters don’t notice what an empty suit you are.
JohnnyReb
July 16th, 2012
6:35 pm
Jay – since you are for raising the tax rate on the wealthy, please tell us what you consider “fair”?
The top 10% of wage earners pay 70% of federal income taxes now. Just how much more would they have to pay to be considered “fair”?
Common Damn Sense isn't Very Common
July 16th, 2012
6:35 pm
Jay
you have finally decoded the Johnny Reb plan for the new tax code LOL
PJ
July 16th, 2012
6:36 pm
1. Talking about apples not falling far from the tree. Mitts apple fell off, rolled down the road and was run over by a car. Where’s the family honor.
2. Lets play fair children. After Mitt finally shows his taxes for at lest as many as the President we can then demand both of their college transcripts and writings. We can then request any reports of misbehavior or merit from senior and junior high school. And lastly any and all drawing from kindergarten must be presented. To bad they did not do ultrasounds in the 40’s, 50’s or 60’s then we could investigate them in the womb too.
3. When Reagan started taxing unemployment compensation the argument was that this money had already been taxed. If that didn’t work for the small amount received for unemployment then it should not work for capital gains. Hell, you only get about $25.00 a day for Jury Duty and that’s taxed (Also Reagan). If the men and women in the military are taxed at the regular rate then the millionaires and billionaires whose money and interest they are protecting need to pay not only as much but more.
Jay
July 16th, 2012
6:38 pm
JohnnyReb, I asked you first: Do you want to raise taxes on all those people?
Furthermore, the reason that richest Americans pay more of the tax these days is because they also collect a lot more of the income than they used to, as the Romneys illustrate quite well. It’s not because they’re being taxed more heavily. Again, look at the percentage paid by the two Romneys. George Romney probably would have thought it grossly unfair to be pay only 13.9 percent of his income in taxes.
kayaker 71
July 16th, 2012
6:40 pm
Perhaps the “rich” wouldn’t complain about a 39% tax rate if the 49% of Americans who are paying no federal income tax would pay their “fair share”. How’s that libs….. a 39% rate for the evil 1% if those who are paying nothing are forced to pay taxes. Maybe they can somehow forgo some of their food stamp money, you know that money that, in the state of MA, pays for tattoos, manicures, booze, ammo for your gun, lottery tickets and many other things that those on the dole cannot do without. All in the spirit of being “fair”.
DebbieDoRight - The Only Thing Wrong With Capitalism; is Capitalists
July 16th, 2012
6:41 pm
Opponents have locked in enough votes to block Senate ratification of the controversial Law of the Sea treaty championed by White House and the Pentagon.”
THIS ^^^ is what i mean about the cons believing and then repeating everything that LimpBalls and Faux News tells them. It’s pathetic. Rush told ya’ll it was a bad thing, now you guys are foaming at the mouth like mad dogs.
Mr. Kerry’s office dismissed Mr. DeMint’s head-count, saying that vote counts taken months before a proposed vote are “just a snapshot of where our politics are in this instant.”
“No letter or whip count changes the fact that rock-ribbed Republican businesses and the military and every living Republican secretary of state say that this needs to happen, and that’s why it’s a matter of ‘when’ not ‘if’ for the Law of the Sea,” said Kerry spokeswoman Jodi Seth.
Ms. Seth said the senator’s decided long ago to hold off on requesting a vote on the treaty until after the November elections because “right now we’re in the middle of a white hot political campaign season where ideology is running in overdrive.”
“That’s why Senator Kerry made it clear from day one that there wouldn’t be a vote before the election and until everyone’s had the chance to evaluate the treaty on the facts and the merits away from the politics of the moment,” she said.
Vast Right Wing Conspiracy
July 16th, 2012
6:42 pm
If I were Romney, I would release my financial information as soon as Emperor Nero released his grades.
Jm (LL) -pass TSPLOST silly people
July 16th, 2012
6:42 pm
I say cut taxes for everyone (or keep them the same)
If you’ll cut spending
If not, well then the poor and middle class are going to have to pay higher taxes because the rich don’t make enough to pay all the freight democrats have loaded on the train
F. Sinkwich
July 16th, 2012
6:43 pm
“And you don’t want to ask the same of someone making $21 million a year?”
Hey Jay, how about a chart showing how unemployment will decrease to 4% if we could just increase the Mittster’s tax rate to 37%?
How about a chart showing how O’bozo’s stimulus did the same already?
How about a chart showing how Obamacare increased GDP growth to 5%?
Maybe a chart showing how Solyndra and similar boondoggles have moved us to energy independence?
I know, you can’t. O’bozo is an epic fail, from top to bottom, side to side.
He makes me nostalgic for Jimmy.
Tom Middleton
July 16th, 2012
6:43 pm
DebbieDoRight
If we don’t blink this cycle, we should be fine!
F. Sinkwich
July 16th, 2012
6:44 pm
“…until the 99% kicks their azzes and MAKES them give it up.”
Debbie is an Occutard anarchist.
Who saw that coming?
Doggone/GA
July 16th, 2012
6:45 pm
“If I were Romney, I would release my financial information as soon as Emperor Nero released his grades.”
Did Romney senior release HIS grades?
Mighty Righty
July 16th, 2012
6:45 pm
To be fair, Romney senior’s income tax paid as adjusted for inflation would have been $628,754 per year. So the message here is that successful people earn more money and pay more taxes than people who are uneducated, lack ambition, sponge off of their fellow citizens and never ever create wealth for other people let aloner a job. In short, the moochers do nothing to make our society better while complaining about and getting in the way of successful people. Our president, who I over estimated as being the dumbest president in our history is actually the dumbest human in our history. But then, I haven’t met a lot of Democrats. Obama’s statement that people who start, develop and grow business don’t start,develop and grow business is the most amazing and stupidest remark ever made by a sane human being. That remark explains why Obama doesn’t have a clue how to create one single job and why his “job” program has not worked, will not work, and has no chance of ever working. He is an economic ignoramous.
TaxPayer
July 16th, 2012
6:46 pm
Here’s some more of those taxing numbers: In 2009, 35,349,092 returns reporting AGI’s of less than $19,000 paid no federal income tax. Well, how is that possible. A married filing joint return would be able to claim two standard exemptions and one standard deduction for a total of $18,700 that can be earned in wages without paying any federal income taxes. And remember, the standard exemption and standard deduction are the ones that all tax return filers are allowed to claim, even if they make millions of dollars in earnings. But, at least some of those people that made less than $19,000 had to pay federal income taxes, right. Well, yes, 9 million returns with AGI’s of less than $19,000 paid some amount of federal income taxes.
tiredofIT
July 16th, 2012
6:47 pm
I wonder who the republicans have as a backup candidate. If Waffle’s keep it up he may have to dropout.
F. Sinkwich
July 16th, 2012
6:48 pm
“George Romney probably would have thought it grossly unfair to be pay only 13.9 percent of his income in taxes.”
And O’bozo’s momma and papa probably would have thought it grossly unfair that the US isn’t under communism, the system they taught him to revere.
Ever read his book?
Logic
July 16th, 2012
6:50 pm
Jay,
Why don’t you ever talk about the 48% of Americans that are total deadbeats…they pay NO INCOME taxes? Your hero (Obama) always talks about fairness…what is fair about 48% not pay ANY INCOME TAX?
Peter
July 16th, 2012
6:50 pm
Here is the results from the Bian capitol deal and the Steel company they bought and closed.
Our ruling
Obama’s ad, and the news release announcing it, packed a lot of claims about Romney’s tenure at Bain Capital and how it handled its investment in a Kansas City steel mill.
We are checking this claim: “After purchasing the company, Mitt Romney and his partners loaded it with debt, closed the Kansas City plant and walked away with a healthy profit, leaving hundreds of employees out of work with their pensions in jeopardy.”
We found, through corporate filings, interviews and investigations by other news organizations, that the statement is accurate but needs some clarification. First, it’s true that Bain added significantly to GST’s debt load while paying dividends to itself. The plant’s closure, however, happened after Romney had left daily operations at Bain, though he led Bain during six years of its majority investment in the plant. And other, outside factors were at work, making the steel industry a tough business. Steel prices were low and electricity costs were high, and those forces drove other steel mills out of business around the same time.
The statement’s last two claims are solid: Bain (and Romney) made a profit from taking over GST, and the employees lost many benefits their union had negotiated, including supplemental pension payments. The federal government had to step in to shore up the fund.
We rate the claim Mostly True.
josef
July 16th, 2012
6:50 pm
Anti-Obamistas..ooohhhh! Y’all need to take a break and watch “Political Animals” and get some good new one-liners!
DebbieDoRight - The Only Thing Wrong With Capitalism; is Capitalists
July 16th, 2012
6:51 pm
k71: Maybe they can somehow forgo some of their food stamp money, you know that money that, in the state of MA, pays for tattoos … …..blah, blah, blah, blah, blah
k71 — let’s hope that these things NEVAH happen to you, (if they do, please tell those on the blog so that we can get a good AHA! moment):
Bankruptcy due to a prolonged illnes of you or a family member
Bankruptcy due to your job being shipped overseas, or if you work for yourself –
–Bankruptcy due to no one having the money to “buy your wares”.
Bankruptcy due to some investment banker asconding of your money and going to South America to live in luxury.
Bankruptcy due to a catclysmic stock market crash that affects you because you, unwisely, put all your money in MItt For Pres stock.
Bankruptcy due to your out of control spending
And, my favorite….
Bankruptcy due to divorce (’cause your wife/significant other finally leaves you because she/he’s sick and tired of your crap AND he/she takes all your money and spends it on that no-good tax-dodging Mexican illegal yard guy who was cutting MORE than your grass).
Mitt Romney Booed For Dodging Tax Return Question CNN Debate 01-19-2012
July 16th, 2012
6:51 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=totRt7wks5I&feature=related
Peter
July 16th, 2012
6:52 pm
I guess the Republican’s have already forgotten about the Iraq war..and how they are to pay for it !
JohnnyReb
July 16th, 2012
6:53 pm
Jay – the wife and I are small business people. Because we are an S-Corp the income shows on our personal return. We take all the legal deductions and have one of the most prestigious accounting firms on the South side of town. We still pay over 30% rate. We dont take vacation more than a day or two at a time and never stop working except for a few hours in the evening (I cheat and blog some during the day, as you know).
We are in the group Obama wants to raise our rate. You don’t hear me saying take it from Romney or someone else wealthier than I. They worked to get what they have, just like my wife and I have done.
I don’t need the government to spread my money around. It’s mine, not the government’s, and I don’t like at all what they are doing with it or want to do with it.
Those less fortunate than I – I’m ok with asistance to those incapable of working, but the idea that capable people are on the government assistance when they could be working, compared to how I work, is repulsive.
Woodstock Mike
July 16th, 2012
6:53 pm
This whole fake idea that higher income taxes on the rich is going to have any real effect on our economy really proves how unintelligent Democrats are…
Higher taxes on the rich is merely a political issue, Obama could really care less, but if he didn’t say he wanted to raise taxes on the rich he wouldn’t get elected. That simple.
Creating jobs is the issue this election, and everyone knows taxing the wealthy doesn’t create jobs for anyone. If you actually believe that taxing the wealthy creates jobs that’s scary.
TaxPayer
July 16th, 2012
6:53 pm
Sixty-three of the 8274 returns filed in 2009 with AGI’s greater than $10,000,000 paid no federal income tax.
Redneck Convert (R--and proud of it)
July 16th, 2012
6:53 pm
If I were Romney, I would release my financial information as soon as Emperor Nero released his grades.
Well, this is one more reason why I won’t run for President. To tell the truth, I’m a bit bashful about my school grades, tho I never made it to high school or even thru the 5th grade, tho I tried the 5th grade three times till I turned 16 and could quit. This is the Land of Freedom. You shouldn’t have to be a Norman Einsteen to be elected President. The way people go on and on about Obama’s grades just seems so unfair. Even if I hate the guy I got to feel sorry for him. I expect there’s lots of people spouting off on this blog that would be blushing if somebody leaked their school grades.
josef
July 16th, 2012
6:54 pm
LOGIC
You silly fool…economic deadbeats? Pray tell who’s doing all that low-paid dirt work with little or no health insurance, etc. etc. Have you ever worked out a household budget at TWO minimum wage jobs? Probably not. Those of y’all spouting this line don’t have sense enough to find your asses with both hands and a flashlight..
Woodstock Mike
July 16th, 2012
6:55 pm
I’ve never understood why in a poor economic time Democrats believe it’s smart to give the citizens less money and the government more? Something doesn’t sound right about that but call me crazy!!
Doggone/GA
July 16th, 2012
6:55 pm
“I wonder who the republicans have as a backup candidate. If Waffle’s keep it up he may have to dropout”
Not to worry. Ron Paul is waiting in the wings to stage a coup at the convention.
Common Damn Sense isn't Very Common
July 16th, 2012
6:56 pm
DDR@6:51 pm
That’s why I luves you girl
Jay
July 16th, 2012
6:57 pm
Here, in context, is what Mighty Righty has been instructed by his minders to believe is “the most amazing and stupidest remark ever made by a sane human being.”
“There are a lot of wealthy, successful Americans who agree with me — because they want to give something back. They know they didn’t — look, if you’ve been successful, you didn’t get there on your own. You didn’t get there on your own. I’m always struck by people who think, well, it must be because I was just so smart. There are a lot of smart people out there. It must be because I worked harder than everybody else. Let me tell you something — there are a whole bunch of hardworking people out there. (Applause.)
If you were successful, somebody along the line gave you some help. There was a great teacher somewhere in your life. Somebody helped to create this unbelievable American system that we have that allowed you to thrive. Somebody invested in roads and bridges. If you’ve got a business — you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen. The Internet didn’t get invented on its own. Government research created the Internet so that all the companies could make money off the Internet.
The point is, is that when we succeed, we succeed because of our individual initiative, but also because we do things together. ”
Yeah, a wacky guy that Obama.
Seriously, is this all you guys got? Is that really how little it takes to make you feel all feisty and self-justified in your petulant little anger?
Doggone/GA
July 16th, 2012
6:57 pm
“Why don’t you ever talk about the 48% of Americans that are total deadbeats”
Typical con lazy assed deadbeat…wanting someone else to do their job for them.
blogspot.com is ready when you are, if you ever get up the energy.
TaxPayer
July 16th, 2012
6:57 pm
The average federal income tax paid was 25% of AGI for individual tax returns filed in 2009 with AGI’s from $1 million to less than $10 million.
F. Sinkwich
July 16th, 2012
6:58 pm
If O’bozo was accused, arrested, and charged with “Loving the USA,” the prosecutors, realizing they have no case, would immediately move for dismissal.
He’d walk every time.
tiredofIT
July 16th, 2012
6:58 pm
Anybody but Romney!
Senior Citizen Kane
July 16th, 2012
6:59 pm
What, exactly, does this have to do with Romney’s qualifications to be president? Anything to avoid discussing real issues. Of course, if I were part of the Obama machine, I’d want to avoid real issues too.
DebbieDoRight - The Only Thing Wrong With Capitalism; is Capitalists
July 16th, 2012
7:00 pm
Stinkwitch: Debbie is an Occutard anarchist
Oh stinky, stinky, stinky (heavy sigh); you are sooo juvenile!! Just because I don’t believe in the 1% getting a free ride, I’m considered an anarchist? So our Pledge of Alliegiance should say:
I pledge allegiance to the rich people of the United States of America, and to the money for which they stands, one million dollars hidden under tax shelters and loopholes, indivisible, with liberty and justice for them only.
StinkWitch: Ever read his book?
Yes. Apparently you couldn’t — too many big words in there I bet.
tiredofIT
July 16th, 2012
7:02 pm
What, exactly, does this have to do with Romney’s qualifications to be president?
–
Most ridiculousness question of the day.
Obama's Coolest Moments
July 16th, 2012
7:03 pm
Gotta love our President!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wXPE2OTgH4&feature=related
josef
July 16th, 2012
7:03 pm
DDDR
Hey, Girlfriend! Need the boa back….the sorry, lazy, low-down, good-for-nothing government employee deadbeat got called in back to work today…got to put on my best drag act…new principal!
bman
July 16th, 2012
7:03 pm
I believe Romney should release tax records several years back. We (citizens) deserve to know as much about someone who could be President as possible.
We sort of got away from the – who is this guy, what does he stand for etc… back in 2008. Even after 4 years, we still know very little about the current Prez.
Senior Citizen Kane
July 16th, 2012
7:04 pm
Most ridiculousness question? An Obama supporter for sure!
Common Damn Sense isn't Very Common
July 16th, 2012
7:04 pm
josef
6:54 pm
Those of y’all spouting this line don’t have sense enough to find your asses with both hands and a flashlight..
——————————————-
How could they hold the flashlight if they were trying to find their asses with both hands?
Inquiring minds want to know.
Lucifer
July 16th, 2012
7:05 pm
Truth 6:24 — Yes, we’re on the same page. I can’t wait until closer to the election when the ole “Etch a Sketch” comment from his campaign mouthpiece takes on a life of its own and bites him in the butt.
Erwin's cat
July 16th, 2012
7:06 pm
“George Romney probably would have thought it grossly unfair to be pay only 13.9 percent of his income in taxes.”
and then he would have paid it and moved on just like everyone else on this blog
what has he given to his church and charities? seriously i don’t know
Jay
July 16th, 2012
7:06 pm
I see that you continue to try to dodge my question, JohnnyReb:
Do you propose to raise taxes on the people I listed earlier? Or do you lack the conviction to apply your line of argument to actual, real-life human beings just trying to make it day to day?
Lucifer
July 16th, 2012
7:08 pm
Common sense 7:04 — If you’re searching for your ass with both hands who’s holding the flashlight?
F. Sinkwich
July 16th, 2012
7:08 pm
“They worked to get what they have, just like my wife and I have done.”
As Jay pointed out, Johnny, you don’t deserve your success. Your and your wife rode on the backs of others. Therefore, you must relinquish a greater and greater portion of your income to the government so that it can redistribute it to those it deems more worthy.
It’s the Marxist way. Jay and his lib ilk minions here wake up every morning and recite:
“From those according to their abilities…”
DebbieDoRight - The Only Thing Wrong With Capitalism; is Capitalists
July 16th, 2012
7:10 pm
josef: Hey, Girlfriend! Need the boa back….the sorry, lazy, low-down, good-for-nothing government employee deadbeat got called in back to work today…got to put on my best drag act…new principal!
Hey josef!!! you got called in to work!? In JULY?!?! You guys going t the “year round” system?
Oh and the boa is in the cleaners — Mr DoRight and i had a “skype” date last week and he wanted me to wear the boa. And some high heels.
josef
July 16th, 2012
7:11 pm
Common Sense, Lucifer
Think about it…well, maybe not…
Jay
July 16th, 2012
7:12 pm
Sinkwich, since you clearly can’t argue intelligently against what I actually say, you find it easier to invent silly statements, attribute them to me and then try to argue against those.
You fool no one but yourself by doing so, but I suspect that’s the audience you’re most worried about anyway.
DebbieDoRight - The Only Thing Wrong With Capitalism; is Capitalists
July 16th, 2012
7:12 pm
Its better than reciting – I think I can. I think I can. And then running around with your head up your stinky azz.
tiredofIT
July 16th, 2012
7:13 pm
Senior Citizen Kane: So you think that the guy that is running on his experience as a powerful and wealthy business man should discuss his major achievement, Bain? He certainly seems confused about serveal issues. Please explain; “retroactively retired”?
Common Damn Sense isn't Very Common
July 16th, 2012
7:13 pm
So if I consult at a company and through my efforts the company saves millions possibly and regains a solid footing in the marketplace the owners made it on their own?
Jm (LL) -pass TSPLOST silly people
July 16th, 2012
7:13 pm
Jay 6:57
The heart of the matter is that Obama doesn’t strike the right balance
He barely, at best cursorily, recognizes individual achievement and contribution
Everyone obviously recognizes it’s a networked economy where people are dependent on others, businesses know that as much as anyone
But no one in their right mind would ever insert this statement
Jm (LL) -pass TSPLOST silly people
July 16th, 2012
7:14 pm
“If you’ve got a business — you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen.”
Insane statement
Obama is a closet commie, socialist, whatever
Good riddance
josef
July 16th, 2012
7:16 pm
DDR
Not year ’round school, but year round work (even if I’m not getting paid for it…) I won’t be in the classroom much this year. I’ve got a new assignment this year. I was looking over the job description duties/responsibilities today…boiled down? Be the diplomat! I’ll be in here in the p.m.’s to leave work behind, believe me!
The boa AND heels…hmmm…high heeled boots?
Lucifer
July 16th, 2012
7:17 pm
Truer words were never spoken — From Ann Coulter: “If we chose Christie for our nominee we’ll win. If we chose Romney we’ll lose. Nuff said.
kayaker 71
July 16th, 2012
7:17 pm
DDR,
So, you think that it is alright for those on food stamps to spend the government’s money on tattoos, booze, ammo, lottery tickets, manicures….. the bill went through the MA legislature which is dominated by liberals and was the first bi-partisan bill that had been passed in many years to restrict the limits on food stamp purchases. And when it came to the governor, Duvall Patrick, a good black governor who wants to maintain the black vote, he refused to sign it. Wouldn’t want to lose the black vote, now would we? And the worst part…… the recipient can take that EBT card and go to any ATM in MA and draw cash from the balance to pay for any damn thing that they want.
Recon 0311 2533
July 16th, 2012
7:18 pm
And so the one stands at the podium and declares that my kingdom has made you what you are independent private sector entreprenueur, therefore you must give back 38% and more to my benevolent kingdom that made you the success you are.
DebbieDoRight - The Only Thing Wrong With Capitalism; is Capitalists
July 16th, 2012
7:19 pm
The owners made it on their own daggummitt!!
Well they had LITTLE help from tax breaks…
And some help from lax laws……
And we can’t forget that help from those “illegals” that they pretend to NOT know they’re hiring………
oh and from paying only cursory taxes on their first 2million……
oh and subsidies…….
oh and insider trading…………..
oh right i forgot about those tax shelters and the fact that a lot of corporations don’t pay taxes…………….
oh wait, and let’s not forget the dumbing down of schools by taking out Evolution and putting in creationism in all text books…….the dumber the students, the dumber the populace……….
yep — they did it ALL ON THIER OWN and don’t you forget it!
TaxPayer
July 16th, 2012
7:21 pm
I suppose cons could always push to get rid of those nasty personal exemptions and that standard deduction since those two things prevent millions of folks making under $19,000 per year from paying any federal income taxes. Then again, if you get rid of their deductions and exemptions, shouldn’t you get rid of them for all filers, just to be fair.
Bernie
July 16th, 2012
7:22 pm
Mitt America wants YOU to show your PAPERS!
Senior Citizen Kane
July 16th, 2012
7:22 pm
Tiredofit:
The hypocrisy of the Obama criticism of Romney and Bain is monumental. Check out the resume of Michael Rattner, the man Obama named car czar. Then check out the tactics he used to restructure GM. It all might sound vaguely familiar.
F. Sinkwich
July 16th, 2012
7:23 pm
“Sinkwich, since you clearly can’t argue intelligently against what I actually say, it’s no doubt easier to invent statements, attribute them to me and then try to argue against those.”
Jay, I read, then interpret.
If you could provide an example, I’d be happy to respond.
tiredofIT
July 16th, 2012
7:23 pm
Michael Rattner is not running for President.
Senior Citizen Kane
July 16th, 2012
7:23 pm
Sorry, Steven Rattner
josef
July 16th, 2012
7:24 pm
All you folks talking about “the black vote.” Blacks comprise 13% of the population. Not exactly enough to get in a dither about whether you’ve got ‘em or not…even if you COULD lump them all together.
bman
July 16th, 2012
7:24 pm
If you fail with your business, dont pat yourself too much on the back. You didn’t get there all by yourself. Someone else helped make that failure happen.
Expect less
Obama 2012
Erwin's cat
July 16th, 2012
7:25 pm
Well they had LITTLE help from tax breaks…
And some help from lax laws……
do tell
Soothsayer
July 16th, 2012
7:26 pm
OK, here’s the entire Fright-Wing Neoliberal Mantra. Know it. Own it. If any of this sounds vaguely familiar to you, it’s because it’s what we’ve (and most of the World) has been living under for the past 40+ years. Most attributed to Milton Friedman –the arch-Neoliberalist.
Also heard on Lush Limpballs every day.
The supremacy of the free market. The market was to rule supreme, unrestrained by the intervention of government, labor unions, or anything else (other than corporate monopoly power) that constrained the operation of market forces, regardless of how much social disorder, suffering or exploitation results. Any undesirable effects are to be ascribed simply to “unidentified interventions” which, when they were identified, could be eliminated, and the problem solved thereby. Monopolies were simply assumed, against all evidence, to be self-limiting (though no one ever managed to explain how DeBeers Consolidated Mines had managed to create and maintain a worldwide monopoly on the diamond business for more than a century).
Cutting, and eliminating when possible, expenditure for social services. Again, in the name of reducing government interference in the market, it was not necessary for government to involve itself in social welfare programs. To explain the obvious suffering that results, it is therefore claimed that when the poor suffer, it is due to their own laziness that they do not better themselves. That the accumulation of money was equivalent to the accumulation of power, with its attendant distortion of the functionings of the market, was not a concern. That this led inevitably to the disempowerment of the poor was not a concern – the poor were blamed for their condition by claiming their “inferiority” or “bad decisions.” Social justice was a non-issue.
Deregulation. If government is interfering in the market, it will only lead to a loss of profits, and therefore, government regulation had to be assumed to be bad. Therefore, it has to be reduced or eliminated, even in monopolistic situations. One neoliberal, Grover Norquist, an official in the George W. Bush administration commented that he wanted to reduce the size of government to the point where he “could drown it in the bathtub” – and then go on to do so.
Privatization. Since government is assumed, as a given, to be inefficient, lazy, bloated and uneconomical in the provisioning of goods and services, it was only reasonable to presume that private enterprise could and would perform the delivery of services in a more efficient manner, and hence any activity that delivers goods or services to citizens should and must be privatized. Never was an explanation offered for the contrary incentive of capitalism – that the capitalist’s basic profit-driven incentive is to charge as much money as possible for providing as few goods and services as possible.
Elimination of the concept of “Community” or the “Common Good.” Since this is antithetical to the notion of privatization and “rugged individualism,” the concept of the commons (the air we must all breathe, the water we must all drink, etc.) to them, reeks faintly of Communism, it is assumed to be bad, wrong, and hence is oppositional to the “neoliberal” agenda. Such notions as public health, public education, etc., are to be replaced by private initiative, as anything else is simply considered to be a manifestation of lassitude, indolence and governmental dependence.
Such as it is. This, in a nutshell, is the “disease” that infects America, yea the World.
Jm (LL) -pass TSPLOST silly people
July 16th, 2012
7:26 pm
Coulter is a moron
kayaker 71
July 16th, 2012
7:26 pm
“You private businesses didn’t make that business succeed on it’s own”. “If it hadn’t been for government, you would have never succeeded.” “Government invented the internet”. “You can keep your own doctor”. “You can keep your own health insurance plan”. “Anyone making under 250K/yr will not have to pay increased income taxes….. not one thin dime”. “This Affordable Health Care act will cost only 940B dollars”. “The Affordable Health Care Act will not cost the American taxpayer any additional outlay.”. All lies.
Common Damn Sense isn't Very Common
July 16th, 2012
7:27 pm
Kay@7:17
cut the crap about SNAP funds. Some busimesses may illegally accept SNAP/EBT cards for non-eligible purchases but the rules are:
http://www.massresources.org/snap-use-benefits.html#items
and
http://asktheexpert.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/5267
JohnnyReb
July 16th, 2012
7:30 pm
Jay – I have no problem reducing assistance to all but the elderly and handicapped. That would prompt those capable to go to work even if it was at minimum wage.
Now, you answer my question – what is a fair rate? I pay over 30% now and Obama wants to raise my rate on AGI in excess of $250K. You think that is fair?
Thomas
July 16th, 2012
7:30 pm
So it seems unanimous- we have in one corner a candidate born rounding third sliding into home and in the other a person who became Pres with no discernible accomplishments other than organizing folks and having books written about himself. Sounds like the great American taxpayer is the loser once again.
kayaker 71
July 16th, 2012
7:30 pm
Common Sense, 7:27,
Not in MA.
Common Damn Sense isn't Very Common
July 16th, 2012
7:32 pm
Kay
the first website is for Mass.
JohnnyReb
July 16th, 2012
7:32 pm
josef
July 16th, 2012
7:24 pm
All you folks talking about “the black vote.” Blacks comprise 13% of the population. Not exactly enough to get in a dither about whether you’ve got ‘em or not…even if you COULD lump them all together.
_______________
Then why is what seems every decision that comes down the pike framed around what it will or will not do for blacks?
josef
July 16th, 2012
7:33 pm
Common Sense
That SNAP one is about the funniest thing they’ve come up with yet. This is probably the only government program that IS putting more money into the private sector and creating jobs. The more groceries you buy, the greater Whole Foods profit, the more farm products they buy, the more farmworkers they put to work, the more truckers to get it to the processors, the more jobs at the processing plant, the more trucks to get it to market, the more stock clerks, check out personnel….etc. etc. This is trickle down at its best…
tiredofIT
July 16th, 2012
7:33 pm
Romney’s Bain Yielded Private Gains, Socialized Losses
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-07-15/romney-s-bain-yielded-private-gains-socialized-losses.html
Senior Citizen Kane
July 16th, 2012
7:33 pm
You’re right, TiredofIt, Rattner is not running for president. Therefore, he can state the truth:
“I don’t think there’s anything Bain Capital did that they need to be embarrassed about.”
DebbieDoRight - The Only Thing Wrong With Capitalism; is Capitalists
July 16th, 2012
7:34 pm
josef you won’t be able to work with kids anymore? but you LOVE working with the kids!! that sucks!!
Oh and no, not boots it was a pair that looked like this:
http://www.amiclubwear.com/shoes-heels-elf-brandy-2red.html
There’s something about a tall girl in a pair of tall shoes that really makes him ………… “smile”.
k71: DDR,
So, you think that it is alright for those on food stamps to spend the government’s money on tattoos, booze, ammo, lottery tickets, manicures….. the bill went through the MA legislature
K71 my tax money go towards the state of GEORGIA in order to facilitate such things as road construction, UI, etc.
You’re having problems with Mass — sorry but I have my own problems and I’m just not that worked up over Mass.’s problems.
Jm (LL) -pass TSPLOST silly people
July 16th, 2012
7:35 pm
Bman 7:24 good point
The banks are obviously not at fault for almost blowing up the financial system with too much leverage
Someone else is
And the steel companies that go bankrupt, also not the fault of management
kayaker 71
July 16th, 2012
7:35 pm
Common Sense, 7:32,
Then why would a bi-partisan bill pass the MA legislature to restrict use of this program if there was not this fraud going on. The MA legislature has over 200 Democrats and only 17 Republicans. The whole bunch felt a need to pass restrictions for usage. Think there was a reason for this?
Recon 0311 2533
July 16th, 2012
7:36 pm
The swine bow down to the “One” who tells them to worship and the “One” commands them to accept only him as their ruler and they do in their unconditional surrendered obedience.
josef
July 16th, 2012
7:38 pm
Johnny Reb
Not being snarky, but you tell me…you seem to be as taken with it as any black I know of…
I’m not arguing that it’s not quite the meme, and no small part of it has to do with a coterie of self-appointed mouthpieces whose rent and reputations are predicated on keeping it going, but they have their strange bedfellows playing the same game. It’s a diversion by both groups and has little or no relation to the outcome of an election in the national arena. It’s, imauo, a waste of both “sides’” shot.
Soothsayer
July 16th, 2012
7:38 pm
tiredofIT: you ought to ashamed of posting an article from that shameless LIBERAL rag, Bloomberg! Do you really expect any of the Fright-Wing here to believe anything from THEM?
kayaker 71
July 16th, 2012
7:39 pm
joseph, 7:33,
Yeah, but wouldn’t it be much better if those buying these commodities were doing it with a salary from a good paying job? No food stamps, no government involvement, no government dependency….. all done on their own without the government involved.
Joseph
July 16th, 2012
7:39 pm
Honestly jay why raise taxes when Oblama and the dems won’t cut spending… And by the way why are they just now worrying about the debt??? Seems to me that should have been thought of from day 1 instead of spending close to 6 trillion dollars in 4 years….
Common Damn Sense isn't Very Common
July 16th, 2012
7:41 pm
Kay
Like I stated. Some of the good small business peoples that are so adored may be allowing SNAP/EBT card holders to purchase items that are not supposed to be allowed.
That happens in every state (not just Mass).
Blame the store owners for accepting illegal purchases
josef
July 16th, 2012
7:41 pm
DDR
I’ll still be doing a lot of work with the kids, just not so much in the classroom. They’re still front and center in what I’ll be doing. The positive side of this is that I’ll be less tied to a schedule and will be able to allot my time more effectively…it will be more in line with my role as an interpreter…
Jm
July 16th, 2012
7:42 pm
Another headline under the category of “Atlanta is stupid”
So, smoking in restaurants and bars is ok. But smoking in the open air of a park is illegal.
So stupid it defies words. Almost.
http://www.ajc.com/news/atlanta/atlanta-passes-smoking-ban-1479016.html
josef
July 16th, 2012
7:43 pm
KAYAKER
Where are those jobs, though? And you’d be surprised perhaps at home much of the food stamp budget goes to the working poor.