The other side of Romney’s success at Bain
Mitt Romney has made his success in the business world a central theme of his presidential campaign, suggesting that it demonstrates a level of economic understanding that President Obama cannot match.
But as the Washington Post documents, Romney and his company, Bain Capital, achieved that success in part by taking jobs once held by American workers and moving them overseas to places such as China and India, where those jobs could be performed more cheaply:
During the nearly 15 years that Romney was actively involved in running Bain, a private equity firm that he founded, it owned companies that were pioneers in the practice of shipping work from the United States to overseas call centers and factories making computer components, according to filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission.
While economists debate whether the massive outsourcing of American jobs over the last generation was inevitable, Romney in recent months has lamented the toll it’s taken on the U.S. economy. He has repeatedly pledged he would protect American employment by getting tough on China.
“They’ve been able to put American businesses out of business and kill American jobs,” he told workers at a Toledo fence factory in February. “If I’m president of the United States, that’s going to end.”….
The Post documents a series of cases in which Bain-related companies relocated customer-support, call-center and manufacturing operations overseas to cut costs and raise profits. In addition, Bain was deeply involved in the creation and expansion of Modus Media, which specialized in helping other companies relocate manufacturing facilities overseas:
“Modus Media grew rapidly. In December 1997, it announced it had contracted with Microsoft to produce software and training products at a center in Australia. Modus Media said it was already serving Microsoft from Asian locations in Singapore, South Korea, Japan and Taiwan and in Europe and the United States.
Two years later, Modus Media told the SEC it was performing outsource packaging and hardware assembly for IBM, Sun Microsystems, Hewlett-Packard Co. and Dell Computer Corp. The filing disclosed that Modus had operations on four continents, including Asian facilities in Singapore, Taiwan, China and South Korea, and European facilities in Ireland and France, and a center in Australia.
“Technology companies, in particular, have increasingly sought to outsource the business processes involved in their supply chains,” the filing said. “. . . We offer a range of services that provide our clients with a one-stop shop for their outsource requirements.”
According to a news release issued by Modus Media in 1997, its expansion of outsourcing services took place in close consultation with Bain. Terry Leahy, Modus’s chairman and chief executive, was quoted in the release as saying he would be “working closely with Bain on strategic expansion.” At the time, three Bain directors sat on the corporate board of Modus.”
For Mitt Romney the business person, such a record would be unremarkable. A lot of people have made a lot of money in the last 25 years by moving jobs offshore, and if Romney and Bain Capital were pioneers in the field, as the Post suggests, there was nothing unusual, illegal or even unethical in what they did. Speaking strictly in business terms, their job was to wring out inefficiencies and maximize shareholder profit in a global economy, not to protect the jobs of American workers, and as the Romney campaign likes to stress, they did their job very well and were well-rewarded for it.
For Romney the presidential candidate, however, the situation becomes more complicated. It’s one thing for Lee Raymond, then head of Exxon Mobil, to say that “I’m not a U.S. company and I don’t make decisions based on what’s good for the U.S.” In a business sense that may be understandable; in another sense it comes across as a grating reminder that the search for profit makes no allowance for national loyalty.
In Romney’s case, will an attitude that’s acceptable and perhaps even necessary in a modern business executive be equally acceptable in a person seeking to lead the country? For some Americans — especially those who have watched as their jobs were moved overseas — the details of how Romney achieved his remarkable financial success may turn out to matter a great deal.
– Jay Bookman
Tell us what you think about the site
Customer Care »
Vacation stops, manage subscriptions and more
AJC Services
Sections
Other Editions
Visitor Agreement | Privacy Statement
© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
598 comments Add your comment
Do
June 22nd, 2012
10:04 am
Comparative Advantage. It’s one reason your stuff costs less.
Aquagirl
June 22nd, 2012
10:05 am
Aquagirl…pretend that it doesn’t happen all you want, it won’t make it true
Let me refresh your memory:
http://blogs.ajc.com/jay-bookman-blog/2012/03/22/why-drill-here-drill-now-is-an-economic-dry-hole/
Sorry your fee-fees don’t match with reality. That happens when you live in Pretendville, population: 1.
Butch Cassidy
June 22nd, 2012
10:06 am
Mike – “San Francisco has made it so expensive to run a business that local companies lost bids to a Chinese company to repair the Golden Gate Bridge. ”
You mean that an American workers weren’t willing to work 12 hours a day, 7 days a week for $12.00 a day? What a bunch of ingrates. You’re right, we need to get government out of the way as soon as possible. How else will we be able to get employees to lower their standard of living so that companies can compete with China?
Joe Hussein Mama
June 22nd, 2012
10:06 am
0311 — “Uh ………….. because …………… they take jobs that many UNEMPLOYED Americans could take.”
Not by themselves, they don’t. Being in the US without documentation is a *document offense;* it’s akin to driving without your license and registration. Deportation is only carried out in the most egregious of cases.
But EMPLOYING an undocumented alien or alien without work authorization is a CRIME. You whine and moan about illegosos, but nary a word out of your mouth about the EMPLOYERS who actually ARE breaking the law in this regard.
Once again, you need to educate yourself on how immigration and employment law actually works.
“This is basic stuff.”
I know it is, and one day, I’m going to get you up to speed on it.
Grasshopper
June 22nd, 2012
10:07 am
Jay parrots the DNC talking points and produces an attack on Romney’s business experience.
It must be Friday.
It’s too bad no one can respond with a disection of Obama’s business experience — because he has none.
A business leader, governor, and Olympics president vs. law professor, community organizer (still trying to get a defintion of that one) and failed President.
Those are the choices.
Paul
June 22nd, 2012
10:08 am
JamVet
“They think that basking in the reflected glow of their 1% heroes in the US Chamber of Commerce and at Bain Capital is actually going to get them somewhere!”
That’s about as good an explanation for the phenomenon as anything I’ve heard. I’d likened it to people who like to hang around Hollywood celebrities because it makes them special. That just describes the phenomena using a different cast of characters. You provided more of the ‘why.’
Poor, deluded fools…..
Stevie Ray
June 22nd, 2012
10:08 am
JAY,
Come on man! How successful would those companies been if they paid higher dollars for labor domestically? Would you rather the entire companies go bust due to inability to compete and thus lose whatever existing domestic jobs, taxes etcetera that remain stateside or screw shareholders and same existing employee in one swoop?
This topic is both over your head and beneath your typical style…
Joe Hussein Mama
June 22nd, 2012
10:08 am
Mike — “Shifting production to where it is cheapest can only strengthen the global economy.”
Fine. Go ahead. Just don’t expect American tax breaks when the bulk of your production is done overseas.
ITS ALL BUSHS FAULT
June 22nd, 2012
10:08 am
Republicons like Mitt preach patriotism then outsource the american worker and hide there profits overseas. Vote rep = Vote against America
Joe Hussein Mama
June 22nd, 2012
10:10 am
Grasshopper — “A business leader, governor, and Olympics president”
Who y’all didn’t want in 2008.
“Those are the choices.”
So having lost in 2008, you’re now going with the second-string team from four years ago. Got it.
Butch Cassidy
June 22nd, 2012
10:10 am
Grasshopper – “Those are the choices.”
Yes. Unfortunately every decent candidate on the Right decided to sit this one out, so you got stuck with Romney. Cheer up, maybe 2016 will be better.
JamVet
June 22nd, 2012
10:10 am
Do you think Nebraska is worse off because it “imports” its oranges from Florida?
Take it up with the Republican governor of the Cornhusker State.
I suspect that unlike you pollution-coddling, anti-environmentalist, fake conservatives, he actually gives a flying ___ about the relatively pristine Ogallala National Grasslands and the SandHills.
And if you had ever once visited there, you might as well…
barking frog
June 22nd, 2012
10:11 am
There is no experience that
qualifies anyone to be
President of the Earth which
the POTUS is. Administering
a large organization can
help as can organizing
groups to improve communities and of
course holding political
office. Experience as
president is really the
only experience that counts.
Presidential term limits
allows us only one chance at
that. That leaves only one
qualifier. Platform and the
ability to enact it.
ITS ALL BUSHS FAULT
June 22nd, 2012
10:11 am
Guys like Mitt should open there businesses in China and see how there crooked shams work
Stevie Ray
June 22nd, 2012
10:12 am
Butch,
Your suggestion that $12/hour (24K per year) for unskilled labor is beneath domestic employees is ridiculous. Would you rather these companies go out of business (which is happening) by not being competitive bidders and thus lose other contributions to employment and tax base? Where are these Chinese workers coming from…temporary visas? Perhaps the SF Bridge Authority should have required domestic workers only…oooops, then taxpayers in SF get screwed…
Aquagirl
June 22nd, 2012
10:12 am
Once again, you need to educate yourself on how immigration and employment law actually works.
Go easy on the man. 0311 has been bitter ever since illegally hired workers took his lifelong dream job of picking crops in the hot sun for $5 per hour.
Erwin's cat
June 22nd, 2012
10:12 am
AG – I for 1 appreciates your unbiased objectivity…
zeke
June 22nd, 2012
10:13 am
In short terms that some of you non liberal leftist will understand. The socialist policies of our tyrant government that is in bed with unions, anarchist enviro nuts, and the like, IS WHAT SENT USA JOBS OUT OF THE COUNTRY! Absolutely ridiculous laws and labor rules are the problem! And tax, tax, tax will do it every time! What amazes me is that more companies have not moved their corporate office and headquarters out of the USA! Our tax policies are absurd. If a company makes a profit in say Germany, OUR IDIOT GOVERNMENT CHARGES THEM AN INCOME TAX! Instead, we should not charge them one penny tax on profits made outside the USA, and, encourage them to bring those profits and invest them here! This is a major reason that our great heritage of USA companies are being purchased by foreign companies when it should be the opposite!
JamVet
June 22nd, 2012
10:13 am
How successful would those companies been if they paid higher dollars for labor domestically?
You mean paying them a decent living wage so that they could actually afford the company’s products and services?
Unlike today, where the vast percentage of working families are just barely holding on to what they have and praying that those relatively tiny handful of men who are implementing the corproate destruction of capitalism take a slight reprieve before the next onslaught?
Doggone/GA
June 22nd, 2012
10:13 am
“Take it up with the Republican governor of the Cornhusker State”
“he actually gives a flying ___ about the relatively pristine Ogallala National Grasslands and the SandHills”
What he give a “flying___” about is the vastly more important Ogallala aquifier that is UNDER all that grassland and hills.
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
June 22nd, 2012
10:14 am
Wall Street Journal:
“Axelrod’s ObamaCare Dollars”
“Rewind to 2009. The fight over ObamaCare is raging, and a few news outlets report that something looks ethically rotten in the White House. An outside group funded by industry is paying the former firm of senior presidential adviser David Axelrod to run ads in favor of the bill. That firm, AKPD Message and Media, still owes Mr. Axelrod money and employs his son.
The story quickly died, but emails recently released by the House Energy and Commerce Committee ought to resurrect it. The emails suggest the White House was intimately involved both in creating this lobby and hiring Mr. Axelrod’s firm—which is as big an ethical no-no as it gets.”
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702304765304577480871706139792.html?mod=hp_opinion
ITS ALL BUSHS FAULT
June 22nd, 2012
10:14 am
GOP is ruining this country . Romney team tells Fla Gov Scott to stop talking about how fla economy has improved. What a tool
stands for decibels
June 22nd, 2012
10:14 am
Vincent Fort is a RACIST/BIGOT
Again, USMC: Cite, please.
getalife
June 22nd, 2012
10:15 am
willard will have Americans in soup lines like Greece.
Butch Cassidy
June 22nd, 2012
10:15 am
Stevie Ray – “Your suggestion that $12/hour (24K per year) for unskilled labor is beneath domestic employees is ridiculous. ”
You’re right, it is ridiculous. However, that’s not what I said. Read the article. The Chinese contractors were broought in to work because the are willing to work 12 HOURS A DAY, SEVEN DAYS A WEEK, FOR $12.00 A DAY NOT AN HOUR, A DAY. Now, please tell me why you think an American worker should be willing to work for $4,380.00 a year.
Stevie Ray
June 22nd, 2012
10:15 am
Barking Frog,
Seems to me that leadership skills to bring sides together despite corruption and loyalty to donators is most important…President Trillions clearly has zero leadership skills…heck he clearly is not even qualified to fix all the problems he lays off on Bush…Poor leadership = laying blame (congress or prior administrations) for inability to effect change….Failed presidency…no different from Bush, Carter et al..no prior proven leadership skills is President Spineless’ achilles heel.
ITS ALL BUSHS FAULT
June 22nd, 2012
10:17 am
Hey zeke without taxes where do you get money to by all of those nice bombs and military crap?
Peter
June 22nd, 2012
10:17 am
The GOP doesn’t care who they vote for…..last election they would put Palin in the White House a QUITTER.
This year they are going to beleive a guy who built his Fortune OUTSOURCING US jobs, but will now beleive he is the guy to create Jobs here in America.. Really ?
ITS ALL BUSHS FAULT
June 22nd, 2012
10:18 am
Without taxes we become third world ………..moorons.
Joe Hussein Mama
June 22nd, 2012
10:18 am
Stevie Ray — “Perhaps the SF Bridge Authority should have required domestic workers only…oooops, then taxpayers in SF get screwed…”
That’s strange. President Obama *agreed* to sign off on ARRA even after Congressional Republicans demanded a “Buy American” provision in it. The provision got in, and the President signed.
It pizzed the Canadians off mightily, but y’all were certainly for buying only American goods and services THEN. Not so much now, it seems.
Aquagirl
June 22nd, 2012
10:18 am
I for 1 appreciates your unbiased objectivity…
It’s easy to remain objective when you hate everyone equally.
Stevie Ray
June 22nd, 2012
10:19 am
Butch,
12 hours a day times 7 days times say 50 weeks is 4200 hours a year times 12 is $50K..If I’m unemployed and unskilled I take that deal.
ITS ALL BUSHS FAULT
June 22nd, 2012
10:19 am
Rep plan … publsize risk & debt and privatize profits….
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
June 22nd, 2012
10:19 am
Joe:
STRONGLY disagree.
Try jumping a border fence and see if you get a “ticket”.
Now that said, I have always been for a multi-tiered approach a few of which are:
1) SEAL the borders.
2) Continue to deport illegals that are here.
3) Provide stiff punishment for employers who knowingly hire illegals (and ENFORCE it) !
4) Remove incentives that make illegals want to stay.
It’s quite reasonable ………. we just don’t seem to have leaders with the guts to do it.
Butch Cassidy
June 22nd, 2012
10:20 am
Here is Stevie Rays vision for a glorious new America from the article regarding the Chinese contractors:
“The steel contract went to a state-owned Chinese company, Shanghai Zhenhua Heavy Industries, which had several advantages: modern production facilities, ships to deliver the steel and, of course, low-cost labor. A Chinese steel polisher makes about $12 a day.”
Joe Hussein Mama
June 22nd, 2012
10:20 am
Zeke — “If a company makes a profit in say Germany, OUR IDIOT GOVERNMENT CHARGES THEM AN INCOME TAX! Instead, we should not charge them one penny tax on profits made outside the USA, and, encourage them to bring those profits and invest them here!”
I take it you voted for Kerry in 2004, because this was one of his campaign planks.
ITS ALL BUSHS FAULT
June 22nd, 2012
10:20 am
5. Deport the GOP
Joseph
June 22nd, 2012
10:21 am
You can spin it how ever you like Jay but the massive corruption of this failed administration is starting to take its toll…. Must be racism???
http://t.co/jDxChXiv
jj
June 22nd, 2012
10:21 am
Since Jay is all about facts…
I’m sure he could give the exact number of folks put out of business by the Obama administration with regards to GM. The government decided to be judge and jury with regards to dealerships and plant closures. Exactly how many people lost their jobs because of this practice?
Butch Cassidy
June 22nd, 2012
10:22 am
Stevie Ray – “12 hours a day times 7 days times say 50 weeks is 4200 hours a year times 12 is $50K..If I’m unemployed and unskilled I take that deal.”
Are you high? The amount they get paid is $12.00 A DAY moron. That means that you make $84.00 a week or $4,368.00 a year. Math isn’t your strong suit is it.
rightwing troll
June 22nd, 2012
10:22 am
Poor Scout… kickig over every rock he can to look for conspiracy… just stick with what you know buddy… go back to excusing you and your ilk with bible verses, and promoting birtherism…
Joseph
June 22nd, 2012
10:23 am
Oh you libs can’t ignore me… Its an example of the knee jerk reactions you loons have…
barking frog
June 22nd, 2012
10:23 am
Stevie
Seems to me that leadership
skills to bring sides together
despite corruption and
loyalty to donators is most
important…
…………..
Willingness to compromise
is important but in a
campaign it is called
flip-flopping.
ITS ALL BUSHS FAULT
June 22nd, 2012
10:24 am
And when China or India or who ever we have sent technology, training and jobs too gets tired of us and kicks us out what do we get back? Nothing, thats Mitts plan
rightwing troll
June 22nd, 2012
10:25 am
So, am I to understand a Chinese company will be shipping hoards of chinese laborers over here to work on the Golden Gate Bridge?… Really???
Where’d that little nugget of wisdom and truth come from, Glenn (crying man) Beck?
Joseph
June 22nd, 2012
10:25 am
Alright freaks… I gotta go relax on the Ga Coast and spend some quality family time.. Hope Obama has a good weekend.. I’m sure he’ll be playing golf somewhere while America keeps on declining….
Normal Free...Pro Human Rights Thug...And liking it!
June 22nd, 2012
10:26 am
I know Mitt Romney is the GOP candidate for President and we have to talk about him…I get that.
What I don’t get is how people can ignore the fact that this man has sold his soul to Satan to be President. he will say anything, do anything and be anyone if he thinks that will get him votes. At best, he is just pathetic, but at worst, he’s a psychological liar, unable to give specifics about his “Programs, if Elected”, because he can’t keep his stories straight.
He is supposed to be a Bishop in the Mormon Church too. If I was a Mormon, I’d be ashamed and I’d demand his resignation as Bishop. To me he always looks like a deer caught in the headlights…he really hasn’t a clue. No sane person would want him for President of our United States. I really hope Ron Paul pulls off his end around stunt and steals the nomination from Romney. At least then, we would have two men of principle on the ballot.
JamVet
June 22nd, 2012
10:26 am
Doggone, the SandHills and the thousands of awesome little spring fed lakes are there because of the aquifer, which has already been depleted to levels so low that water is no longer available for irrigation in vast parts of Kansas, Oklahoma and Texas. Without very deep, very expensive drilling.
Today’s post-Nixon Republicans – outside of the farmers, ranchers and cattlemen themselves – of course, neither know, nor care about such things. Those that did are all dead or are denounced as “anarchist enviro nuts”. (See the ranting screed offered up by zeke…)
Erwin's cat
June 22nd, 2012
10:26 am
an interesting read Scout
ITS ALL BUSHS FAULT
June 22nd, 2012
10:26 am
Joseph you are an idiot
rightwing troll
June 22nd, 2012
10:26 am
Why would anyone ignore you and your delusional rantings Joseph? It’s pure entertainment…
USMC
June 22nd, 2012
10:26 am
“Republicons like Mitt preach patriotism then outsource the american worker and hide there profits overseas. Vote rep = Vote against America”–It’s George Bush’s fault
Another example of the lack of Critical Thinking Skills on display at Jay’s blog everyday…
Butch Cassidy
June 22nd, 2012
10:27 am
rightwing troll – “So, am I to understand a Chinese company will be shipping hoards of chinese laborers over here to work on the Golden Gate Bridge?… Really???”
Actually, it’s the Bay Bridge. Other than that you are correct.
JamVet
June 22nd, 2012
10:27 am
I gotta go relax on the Ga Coast and spend some quality family time..
In my best Jim Carrey voice, I don’t care.
Joseph
June 22nd, 2012
10:27 am
Whoops Obama spends more than he raises… I guess when he’s doing the same thing with the country’s checkbook he may as well do it with his campaign… LOL…
https://twitter.com/#!/search/%23tcot
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
June 22nd, 2012
10:27 am
Erin’s cat:
Yep ………………
Holdergate
Leakgate
Axelrodgate
THey BOTH suck
June 22nd, 2012
10:28 am
USMC
You try the hamburger and sausage mix?
Doggone/GA
June 22nd, 2012
10:28 am
“12 hours a day times 7 days times say 50 weeks is 4200 hours a year times 12 is $50K..If I’m unemployed and unskilled I take that deal”
12 hours a day times 7 days times say 50 weeks is 350 days times 12 dollars A DAY is $4200
ITS ALL BUSHS FAULT
June 22nd, 2012
10:28 am
USMC thanks for your service. ITS STILL ALL BUSHS FAULT.
Joseph
June 22nd, 2012
10:28 am
JamVet:
I’ll have my Ipad with me though so I can keep in contact with u commoners…
getalife
June 22nd, 2012
10:29 am
After the gop took their jobs, houses and money, the cons would still vote gop and expect a different result.
You can’t debate insanity.
You lust have to laugh at it and vote against it.
Joseph
June 22nd, 2012
10:30 am
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801:
Don’t forget Greenenergygate and fuzzymathonjobsgate!!!
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
June 22nd, 2012
10:30 am
rightwing troll :
Now, now …………. sometimes the truth hurts.
Have to run ………….. everyone be nice and don’t pull a Kamchuk !
rightwing troll
June 22nd, 2012
10:31 am
That’s because they’re all just a lottery ticket away from being a 1%er… They have to protect thier soon to be fortunes from the eevil liburals…
ITS ALL BUSHS FAULT
June 22nd, 2012
10:31 am
GOPERS slow and stupid
kayaker 71
June 22nd, 2012
10:31 am
So, now Botox Nancy wants us to believe that this hoopla about Holder is a vast right wing plot to suppress voters rights. Even the most staunch liberal must be wiping the coffee off of his computer screen after hearing this. That gaze of hers, the studious look in those buggy brown eyes……. it must make you liberals really proud to have such a stalwart, icon of justice representing you. And the people of San Francisco in fruit and nut land…….I’m speechless.
Joseph
June 22nd, 2012
10:31 am
getalife:
You can’t debate insanity. I totally agree. So why do you freaks on the left keep banging your heads against the wall trying to convince yourselves Obama is doing a good job???
Jm-pass TSPLOST silly people
June 22nd, 2012
10:31 am
Jay = DNC
St Simons - he-ne-ha
June 22nd, 2012
10:32 am
as the ‘incumbent crosses 50′ (in the words of J Carville and Karl Rove),
I see the cons becoming more & more unhinged, in blogs, posts,
inflamed language, in general derangement. (disclaimer: not this blog,
the unhinged derangement is there, but not danger, we’re too ‘erudite’)
Shep Smith of FOX (network, its not news) has noticed the same thing.
And i quote – “There are people now, who are way out there on a limb. And I think they’re just out there on a limb with the email they send us. Because I read it, and they are out there. I mean, out there in a scary place…. I could read a hundred of them like this…. I mean just from today. People who are so amped up and so angry for reasons that are absolutely wrong, ridiculous, preposterous.”
More and more it seems like people are taking the extra step and taking the gun out.” – Shep Smith
I fear this too. Its fairly, and now statistically obvious that we are probably
going to have 4 more years of Obama before President Hillary or Warren
take over and I believe that will be too much for these wingnuts. I fear a
Timothy McVeigh event sometime after November, these people are so
unhinged.
Hell, with what this Republican pahhty has deteriorated to, I honestly
would not be shocked if they had a Timothy McVeigh tribute at their
convention, televised and all.
That’s the view from de island, mon. Chill, cons. We survived Lil Nero,
you will survive Obama the Mammmba (thwack!) now les go surfin
rightwing troll
June 22nd, 2012
10:32 am
Actually the truth will set you free… you should try it sometime…
Joe Hussein Mama
June 22nd, 2012
10:33 am
0311 — “Joe: STRONGLY disagree.”
Disagree all you want. You’re still wrong on this point.
“Try jumping a border fence and see if you get a “ticket”.”
Pay attention, Marine. I did not SAY “ticket.” I also did not SAY “jumping a border fence.”
I said that being here without documentation is a document offense, akin to driving without license and registration, and that’s a fact. You need to read the applicable laws; I think they will surprise you.
“Now that said, I have always been for a multi-tiered approach a few of which are:
1) SEAL the borders.”
Impractical from a number of standpoints. I’m not opposed to it, but it’s impractical for the objective we want (fewer undocumented aliens in the country).
“2) Continue to deport illegals that are here.”
This is not done that often. Again, you need to read the applicable laws.
“3) Provide stiff punishment for employers who knowingly hire illegals (and ENFORCE it) !
4) Remove incentives that make illegals want to stay.”
These are the two keys. IMO (and I posted about this a week or two ago), we need a high-tech national ID document (like a national ID card) that is extremely difficult to forge or falsify, and which any citizen can get. It could fulfill several purposes:
Drivers license
Voter ID
Proof of authorization to work in the US
Proof of citizenship (so you can apply for unemployment or SNAP)
Medicare/Medicaid ID
We also set up a Bracero (guest worker) program so that people can come here to work and have some assurance that they won’t be hassled. Maybe Braceros that comply with the program rules could get some kind of accelerated credit toward applying for citizenship, provided they break no laws and abide by the program rules — perhaps allow them to count the time they work in the US, even if they go back and forth to their home country. So aliens who are here legally could get a card too, but it would be different and wouldn’t allow them to vote, for example.
Employers would HAVE to check EVERY current or prospective employee against a national database. Employing an unauthorized individual should carry a VERY stiff fine; I’d say a percentage of the business’ annual gross. Unless businesses get a broken and bloody nose because they employed illegosos, they will never get the message.
“It’s quite reasonable ………. we just don’t seem to have leaders with the guts to do it.”
I’m quite reasonable on this matter too, but it irritates the hell out of me when people like you scream bloody murder about illegosos without being informed on the topic.
Stevie Ray
June 22nd, 2012
10:33 am
Butch, I’m an actuary so I’m good with numbers…at 12 dollars a day I would agree with you point however, should taxpayers get screwed to employ domestic folks at much higher salary? If the cost in China is $400 million, how much more would it cost tax payers assuming $12 an hour which is probably light once the unions demand union workers? The name calling is a sign of weakness daddio…your opinion of me is none of my business.
Doggone/GA
June 22nd, 2012
10:34 am
“Doggone, the SandHills and the thousands of awesome little spring fed lakes are there because of the aquifer, which has already been depleted to levels so low that water is no longer available for irrigation in vast parts of Kansas, Oklahoma and Texas”
And low or not, it’s not polluted. The Governor stated his fear for the pollution of the aquifer if he pipline was built over it. And it’s not the aquifer that feeds those springs and lakes, I don’t think. Most of the aquifer is too deep to feed surface water. And the replenishment rate is so slow, that it’s considered that surface water (ie: rain) does little to the amount of water avaliable. It is ancient water in that aquifer, not “modern” water.
JamVet
June 22nd, 2012
10:36 am
You bought an ipad?
Jeez what a rube.
You probably drink Budweiser too…
Joe Hussein Mama
June 22nd, 2012
10:37 am
Stevie Ray — “If the cost in China is $400 million, how much more would it cost tax payers assuming $12 an hour which is probably light once the unions demand union workers?”
I don’t mind paying more in order to buy American.
I love my country and my countrymen more than I love saving a buck.
Jm-pass TSPLOST silly people
June 22nd, 2012
10:37 am
” in another sense it comes across as a grating reminder that the search for profit makes no allowance for national loyalty”
Utter BS
Joseph
June 22nd, 2012
10:37 am
I know you loons hate FOX News but they are of course the most sane network for news coverage. Check out token lib Bob Beckel on The Five… He’s a prime example of the left and their insanity. He bangs his head against the wall daily and makes no sense. The foam and the vitriol that spews from this man’s mouth is hilarious.. Facts and figures simply don’t matter as in the case of all on the left. Beckel will simply revert back to howling about Bush when he finally realizes he can’t make the case for Obama.
mark
June 22nd, 2012
10:38 am
Buy local,shop local, grow local. Then we will have american jobs. Like the Exxon man said, he don’t care about us!! He make them billions a year in profits, while our govt gives him tremendous tax breaks and access to our resources as cut rate prices. He does really care what our elected officals give him. Vote them all out!!! It is time for more than a two party system.
josef
June 22nd, 2012
10:38 am
St Simon’s
Shep Smith is one of the few sane voices left.
Jm-pass TSPLOST silly people
June 22nd, 2012
10:38 am
Actually most of this column is pure rubbish
Granny Godzilla - Union Thugette
June 22nd, 2012
10:39 am
OOPS…Y’all missed one.
GOPginnedupscandaldujourgate.
and
ginnedupscandalscosttaxpayersmoneygate
Stevie Ray
June 22nd, 2012
10:39 am
Doggone,
Agreed and my bad but my point is how much more would it cost taxpayers in California to have the bridge built domestically union shops? Is that irrelevant? Should we enact laws that require no outsourcing of jobs or heavy industry work to foreign countries and further damage our ability to compete globally? Help me understand how your alternative is more cost effective?
Lord Help Us
June 22nd, 2012
10:40 am
‘ Check out token lib Bob Beckel on The Five… He’s a prime example of the left and their insanity. He bangs his head against the wall daily and makes no sense. ‘
That is his job description. The fact that you think he represents the left’ is further evidence of you inability to think for yourself…
Butch Cassidy
June 22nd, 2012
10:40 am
Steviv Ray – “Butch, I’m an actuary so I’m good with numbers…at 12 dollars a day I would agree with you point however, should taxpayers get screwed to employ domestic folks at much higher salary? If the cost in China is $400 million, how much more would it cost tax payers assuming $12 an hour which is probably light once the unions demand union workers? The name calling is a sign of weakness daddio…your opinion of me is none of my business.”
Stop moving the goal posts. I was responding to another poster that was bragging about the Chinese business model. It wasn’t a matter of paying someone $12.00 an hour, it’s a matter of importing labor to work for $12.00 a day. It’s BS and you know it. The only way to compete is to lower the wage scale to match. Which makes me wonder why you support the eliminiation of the Middle Class and the American way of life?
rightwing troll
June 22nd, 2012
10:40 am
“should taxpayers get screwed to employ domestic folks at much higher salary?”
Here’s the rub… the domestic folks ARE the taxpayers… should the domestic folks/taxpayers have to accept substandard wages so the company can continue to earn record profits? Those 12.00/hr chinese workers live in hovels and substandard housing, have no health insurance and live on rice. Is that what the American middle class needs to look like?
Jimmy62
June 22nd, 2012
10:41 am
It’s funny how you seem to assume that whatever Romney did in business is exactly what he’ll do as President, yet you refuse to associate Obama with any of his past actions and associations. He was definitely a socialist at one time, yet you denied he would be a socialist President, he was friends with a domestic terrorist, yet you denied that would have any affect on his actions, he listened to racist sermons, and you told us that had no effect on his character…. Yet everything from Romney’s past apparently explains exactly what he will do when he wins the election.
It’s almost like you have an unreasonable double standard depending on if you are speaking of Romney or Obama.
Joseph
June 22nd, 2012
10:41 am
JamVet:
Actually the IPAD was a gift. I got really good friends… It’s much better than sitting in a public library like many of you loons do don’t you think??
stands for decibels
June 22nd, 2012
10:41 am
Shifting gears a bit (I’m allowed, right? I mean, since nobody’s actually discussing Jay’s topic any more?)–
Nate Silver has a really nice piece on the “house effect” at the various name-brand polling firms.
http://fivethirtyeight.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/06/22/calculating-house-effects-of-polling-firms/
Short version–if it’s Pew, you subtract 3.2% for Democratic bias; if it’s Gallup, you subtract 2.5% for Republican bias. As Nate points out, that’s gonna produce “a fairly wide spread in the polls this year.”
(Only a bit surprised that Rassmussen was only +1.3% R, and not surpassing Gallup. But Rassy’s notoriety comes more from its public-policy question verbiage, not its straight-up “who will you vote for” stuff.)
rightwing troll
June 22nd, 2012
10:41 am
Especially when it’s thier government dollars being spent?
barking frog
June 22nd, 2012
10:41 am
Jm
rubbish has once been
useful.
JamVet
June 22nd, 2012
10:41 am
As you travel the Sandhills Scenic Journey Byway you’ll discover incredible world class natural wonders, including the Nebraska sandhills, which are the largest area of grass stabilized sand dunes in the western hemisphere, covering more than 19,000 square miles.
Beneath the sandhills and the byway is the Ogallala Aquifer, the largest aquifer in the United States. Numerous rivers, creeks, lakes, ponds and wetlands are all spring fed via the aquifer, creating diverse ecosystems and supporting a wide range of wildlife. The region’s Loup River System is the most constant flowing river system in the world – thanks to the Ogallala Aquifer.
The ecosystem helps support the largest concentration of the sandhill cranes that traverse Nebraska every spring, spending several weeks along the Platte River valley near Grand Island on their spring migration northward. Millions of other birds also move through the region.
http://www.sandhillsjourney.com/page.php?pageid=16
Joseph
June 22nd, 2012
10:42 am
Lord Help Us:
He worked for Jimmy Carter… I would think that was liberal enough. The thing is though even though beckel is a complete loon he makes more sense than Bookman and the minnows that follow him….
JamVet
June 22nd, 2012
10:43 am
Then your friends are rubes. There are MUCH better tablets than that and for less money.
But you Republiguppies are easily manipulated and poorly informed…
East Cobb RINO
June 22nd, 2012
10:43 am
Romney Tailors ‘First 100 Days’ Ads to Swing States
http://news.yahoo.com/romney-tailors-first-100-days-ads-swing-states-125231830–abc-news-politics.html
4 down – 46 to go. Maybe Mittens has multiple personality disorder. That could explain the various postions he takes on the same subject.
Stevie Ray
June 22nd, 2012
10:43 am
Joe,
Understood but if you were a California taxpayer,forgetting the fact that they they are virtually bankrupt, and you had a $400M bid from overseas compared to say an $800M bid, would you still pay for overage? As an aside, it’s been years since US could produce steel anywhere near as competitively with China. Part is due to expensive union labor as well as China dumping cheap steel into our markets…Would you pay twice for a lesser quality US manufactured auto?
Jm-pass TSPLOST silly people
June 22nd, 2012
10:44 am
Froggie
Rubbish may be useful for a frog
Less so for everyday people
Doggone/GA
June 22nd, 2012
10:44 am
“Help me understand how your alternative is more cost effective?”
Henry Ford increased the pay to most of his workers so they could afford to buy the products they were making.
rightwing troll
June 22nd, 2012
10:44 am
“Bookman and the minnows that follow him….”
I guess that includes you since you live here…
Liberal Chicks are UGLY
June 22nd, 2012
10:45 am
With all the recent mess ups by obama, a ficticious recovery, Fast and Furious, 2/3’s of Americans hating the Health care blunder, etc. No wondder you lot are all bitter… I think obama may have a chance at losing this thing. Romney is no peach either, so that would most certainly be humilating, because it’s not about Romney winning, it’s about firing obama. He is making himself a pariah at the wrong time….Keep up the god work obama, we may just be done with your stupidity after all! Woohoo!
Stay bitter liberals!
stands for decibels
June 22nd, 2012
10:45 am
Which makes me wonder why you support the eliminiation of the Middle Class and the American way of life?
I was thinking “that’s a tad harsh,” and then I went back to the comment that prompted it, to wit:
at 12 dollars a day I would agree with you point however, should taxpayers get screwed to employ domestic folks at much higher salary?
That’s really quite chilling, the notion that it would be “screwing taxpayers” if we are to pay a living wage to workers on a construction project.