Is this gov’t by the people, for the people?
In his historic Gettysburg Address, President Abraham Lincoln spoke somberly of the horrific sacrifice that had been made by so many so “that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth.”
I do not believe that this is the government of the people, by the people and for the people that Lincoln described, and that our Founding Fathers had earlier fought so hard to create:
Republican superPACs and other outside groups shaped by a loose network of prominent conservatives – including Karl Rove, the Koch brothers and Tom Donohue of the U.S. Chamber of Commerce – plan to spend roughly $1 billion on November’s elections for the White House and control of Congress, according to officials familiar with the groups’ internal operations.
That total includes previously undisclosed plans for newly aggressive spending by the Koch brothers, who are steering funding to build sophisticated, county-by-county operations in key states. POLITICO has learned that Koch-related organizations plan to spend about $400 million ahead of the 2012 elections – twice what they had been expected to commit.
Just the spending linked to the Koch network is more than the $370 million that John McCain raised for his entire presidential campaign four years ago. And the $1 billion total surpasses the $750 million that Barack Obama, one of the most prolific fundraisers ever, collected for his 2008 campaign.
As the piece notes, both Obama and Mitt Romney are expected to raise hundreds of millions of dollars on their own, to fund their own campaigns. As usual, much of that money will come from special interests seeking favors from those they help to elect, and neither party is immune to money’s gravitational pull.
However, that money will at least be traceable back to its source, and the campaigns and the candidates can at least be held accountable by the voter for how they conduct themselves in the public sphere. Neither is true of the money that will pour into superPACS. It is being raised anonymously and will be spent anonymously, with the clear intention of buying not just influence but control.
And while Democrats will attempt to compete — Politico reports that the main pro-Obama superPAC hopes to raise $100 million — the clear financial advantage will belong to conservatives. That advantage will loom particularly large in Senate and House races, where a few spare million can make a very big difference in the outcome.
If your goal is victory for a party calling itself “Republican,” that advantage is a wonderful thing. However, if by “Republican” you mean a small-government party that does not intervene in the marketplace on behalf of immensely powerful special interests, I would suggest that you look more closely at this Trojan Horse being welcomed inside your city walls. People who make billion-dollar investments have a funny way of expecting to profit from said investments.
In time, if the system is not reformed, Democrats too will be forced to bend a knee to those who believe that big money justifies having a big voice, and only the naive would believe that that such a power once unleashed can easily be reined in. It will be government of the people, by the people and for the people only in the sense that, well, corporations are people.
– Jay Bookman
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562 comments Add your comment
Adam
May 30th, 2012
4:15 pm
They BOTH suck: I agree with what you have said there about the blame and credit. I don’t think one can say that the President is not at all involved in certain major missions. If Bush had a meeting where they came to him and said “50/50 we get Osama on this one” and he said go, and his VP (let’s just pretend, seriously) had said DON’T, and Bush said go, I woudl have NO PROBLEM giving him some credit and NOT putting a bunch of people on Sunday TV trying to say he didn’t deserve credit, only the SEALs did. etc.
Mary Elizabeth
May 30th, 2012
4:16 pm
John Birch, 1:49 pm
“Mary Elizabeth – Isn’t it hard to justify enjoying the standard of living capatalism [sic] has provided while cursing the evil corporations?”
=============================================
I never “cursed” corporations, nor did I refer to them as “evil.” However, I do believe in an egalitarian society, as did our nation’s founders. Corporations, in the large majority, practice a hierarchial value system in which CEO’s salaries are extremely out of proportion to the salaries of corporate workers. Without their workers, corporations would cease to exist. Corporate powers need to be reminded of this fact, even as they contribute to the economic well being of many. Corporations should never have primary power over the laws of this nation because their vision is essentially a hierarchial, and not an egalitarian, vision. Corporations have their place in American society. However, the overriding power, within this nation, must continue rest in the hands of ordinary American workers, not in exclusive hands of the top 1% of the wealthy elite, who will continue to safeguard their own self-interests. That is primarily why you should vote a Democratic ticket in November.
They BOTH suck
May 30th, 2012
4:17 pm
Scout
From a 50K feet level I can see your point to an extent.
From ground level with both parties being able to raise what might be a total of $2B, we are far from your post in reality. Demographics clearly show that. Could one show what you are saying as a portion of the voting population? Sure they could, however it would not be a true depiction of the overall electorate
Adam
May 30th, 2012
4:18 pm
why doesnt OBAMA get SOROS, BUFFET and HOLLYWOOD to get him a billion dollar PAC?
Excuse me, but I thought somehow they were secretly funding a socialist takeover of everything IN THE WOOOOORLD or something? Surely if this was the case Obama wouldn’t NEED to ask, it would already be done.
UNCLE SAMANTHA
May 30th, 2012
4:18 pm
Sarah Gee
May 30th, 2012
4:07 pm
Jay,
Democrats sold out to big money, win at any cost a long time ago. You might remember that Obama was the first candidate to raise a billion dollars much of it from big banks and big money donors. To pretend otherwise is hypocricy but we are used to it from you.
YOU SHOW TRUTH BUT IN VAIN
liberals do not acknowledge facts that show their hypocracy
Jefferson
May 30th, 2012
4:18 pm
The president was elected because of the GOPs lack of creditiblity and polocies that wrecked the country. There is no proof they would change anything that they did before.
Tom Middleton
May 30th, 2012
4:19 pm
Nothing to say here, Jay, for as usual, you’re spot on about everything. I mean, it’s either “We The People” take control of our government now for all time to come, or it’s turn our destiny over to those who don’t mean us well and never will.
Today’s Lincoln would be a “Big D” Democrat, that’s for sure, and this is the time to prove him right before it gets too late!
Thulsa Doom
May 30th, 2012
4:19 pm
“I’ll bite then, Doom. Show me EXACTLY where I suggested this: “. . . you think a rank and file union member is going to go strolling into Mr. Hoffa’s office and tell him how he thinks or wants his union dues to go to . . .”
Joe Mama,
Oh my God. You really can’t see that as what it is- just a rhetorical statement. And you were an English major? Bless your heart. And you take this gigantic leap making a rhetorical statement into a blatant display of dishonesty. I don’t know that you think that Joe. I’m simply making the statement that if you do or if you believe anything close to that then you can bring me back a chocolately unicorn. Geez.
Anyway, no point in responding to the rest of your post though some of it was mildly amusing- in that grade school sort of way of course. Too much gobbledeegook and besides I warned you about writing novels. Have a nice day Joe.
They BOTH suck
May 30th, 2012
4:21 pm
Oblama
Not sure if you have previously read where I have posted my thoughts on Super Pacs. I do not think they should exist and have called out Obama and Jay for Obama’s hypocrisy on this issue.
I will go further and say that limits on individuals, corporations and unions should be limited to small contributions. These crazy donations on all sides imo sort of dilutes one man, one vote.
Adam
May 30th, 2012
4:21 pm
Too much gobbledeegook and besides I warned you about writing novels.
FOLLOW THE RULES JOE (even if you don’t know what they are)
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
May 30th, 2012
4:23 pm
they BOTH suck:
Just be thankful we don’t live in a pure democracy.
The only reason we have lasted this long is that we are a Constitutional Republic.
UNCLE SAMANTHA
May 30th, 2012
4:23 pm
ADAM
could it be that maybe SOROS and BUFFET do not agree with OBAMA’s policies and actions?
could it be that Hollywood while contributing to his personal campaign think if they fund a SUPER PAC there would be a back-lash from the viewing public who are slowly retreating from paying $12 a movie ticket to fund the political whims of the HOLLYWOOD 1%ERS?
Oblama
May 30th, 2012
4:24 pm
Of course it was a stupid question – if you are stupid.
That Black Guy
May 30th, 2012
4:25 pm
Brosephus™
May 30th, 2012
3:36 pm
TBG
I just try to deal with reality. It’s too friggin’ hard trying to keep up with all the different parallel universes. BTW… if you didn’t see the link I left for a documentary “What Black Men Think” or if you haven’t seen it, you gotta check it out. As a conservative Black man, you’ll probably like it. It exposes some of the myths that get passed around, and it also exposes the more conservative thinking that Black men have. I’ll probably have a dvd copy of it before too long.
_________________________________________________________________
No Bro, I didn’t see it. Can you repost it?
They BOTH suck
May 30th, 2012
4:25 pm
Scout @ 4:23
Depending on any given time in history and the “side” one wished or wishes to pick……. what you said is very profound.
Adam
May 30th, 2012
4:25 pm
They BOTH suck: I do not think they should exist and have called out Obama and Jay for Obama’s hypocrisy on this issue.
To me, Obama supporting a SuperPAC on his side is:
Short term – Same as bringing a gun to a gun fight (instead of a knife, or fists).
Long term – it allows him and other Democrats to actually fight against those things – something the right will not do.
To me, it’s almost like the question: Would you use a cure for cancer if it was the Nazis who developed it?
Of COURSE you would.
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
May 30th, 2012
4:25 pm
josef:
Your take ?
“‘Obama … Stressed He Probably Knows About Judaism More than Any Other President’”
http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/obama-stressed-he-probably-knows-about-judaism-more-any-other-president_646293.html
Paul
May 30th, 2012
4:26 pm
Oblama
You gave Obama the credit for not aborting the mission?
Why would he have aborted the mission?
You give a person credit for not doing something there was no need to do?
BTW, the parsing (he gets credit, but not for the success. He gets half credit for this, partial credit for that, some credit for…) seems petty. As if one is merely looking for a way to be negative.
You do realize that in the planning stages it was Obama who directed the helicopter raid option, don’t you? Not the other options, such as an air strike? So how is it you don’t give credit for success for the plan he put in motion in the first place?
I’m going to have to see your response when I return – appointment in 15 minutes.
Bottom line, as I said, is all the parsing is not very becoming.
curious
May 30th, 2012
4:26 pm
Oblama. You keep referring to Oblama. Are you painting a self-portrait?
BTW. If Obama hadn’t approved the mission, it never would have happened.
Adam
May 30th, 2012
4:26 pm
could it be that maybe SOROS and BUFFET do not agree with OBAMA’s policies and actions?
If so, you wouldn’t know it from the hate being spewed at them from the same people who do the same to Obama.
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
May 30th, 2012
4:27 pm
Of course it was a stupid question – if you are stupid.
Stupid is as stupid
doesasks.UNCLE SAMANTHA
May 30th, 2012
4:27 pm
THEY BOTH SUCK-I will go further and say that limits on individuals, corporations and unions should be limited to small contributions. These crazy donations on all sides imo sort of dilutes one man, one vote.
we must have Congress pass laws that RESTRICT campaigns to such…….. for instance only contributions to a Congressional candidate from actual constitutes in that district……….
if the SCOTUS then over-turns on free speech…………
THEN AMEND THE CONSTITUITON
once amended……… the SCOTUS cannot legislate
St Simons - we're on Island time
May 30th, 2012
4:28 pm
for those checking in late to the blog – the last 9 pages -
bu…bu…bu..Obama
bu..bu….timmy does it tooo-ooo
bu..bu….uuuuuuuunions
there. quick summary.
They BOTH suck
May 30th, 2012
4:28 pm
TBG: Info that Bro posted last night
http://documentarychannel.com/movie.php?currID=10403&t=What-Black-Men-Think
Janks Morton presents a searing examination of the role that myths, stereotypes and misrepresentations have played in the decimation of modern era black relationships, and how the symbiotic relationship between government, the media and black leadership perpetuates misinformation to further marginalize the role of black men in society. Since the triumphs of the civil rights legislations of the early 1960’s havoc and decimation has been wreaked on the Black family with a specific devastation on the Black man. With negative imagery of the media, the failed policy of the great society and modern era black leadership abandoning tenets that historically held the community together, a new form of mental slavery has perpetuated an undeclared civil war in the Black Community…
Seems that there are many pseudo experts here, so here’s the golden opportunity to find out what we think as though you’re doing the interviewing yourself.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ISSm41HNQFk&feature=player_embedded
* Link
* Report this comment
Adam
May 30th, 2012
4:28 pm
Paul: You gave Obama the credit for not aborting the mission?
Why would he have aborted the mission?
WRONG WRONG question Paul. You are falling into his trap, where he pretended that a mission was already underway and THEN he was asked “So, you want to pull the plug on this thing?”
In reality, it was a proposal to go in after intelligence gathering. No mission even existed until he said go.
Adam
May 30th, 2012
4:29 pm
I am out for the day, see you all later!
JamVet
May 30th, 2012
4:30 pm
Jack, and American women not voting in 2010 is what allowed the GOP to win like they did.
I am pretty certain that the sluts, prostitutes and FemiNazis are not going to make that mistake again in 2012…
They BOTH suck
May 30th, 2012
4:30 pm
Adam
I understand your point and Jay brought that up one time when I was calling out Obama. It is a valid point, however Obama is still a hypocrite on that particular issue.
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
May 30th, 2012
4:30 pm
‘Warren: “I Was The First Nursing Mother To Take A Bar Exam” In NJ”
Now “Princess Summerfall Winterspring” claims she was nursing her papoose during her bar exam !
What the HECK does that have to do with anything?
John Galt
May 30th, 2012
4:30 pm
Jay, are you stupid or dishonest?
Every known source has the President raising far more funds than the Republicans- and you know it. The unions have gone dollar for dollar with the corporations in every recent election cycle, if not exceeding them.
This is even below YOU, and you are as full of the Kool Aid as anyone I know-
Peadawg
May 30th, 2012
4:30 pm
“bu..bu….timmy does it tooo-ooo”
To be fair, our blog-host Jay played that one to begin with.
They BOTH suck
May 30th, 2012
4:31 pm
Uncle Sam
Politically we are probably much more different than alike at least based on the posts I have read, however we do agree on this issue.
All this money from funneling into these campaigns is not for the benefit of the average citizen……… Not saying that avg. Joe never benefits, but on the whole……. I have my doubts to say the least
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
May 30th, 2012
4:33 pm
“Everybody doesn’t like something, but nobody doesn’t like Sara Lee.”
– Thomas Jefferson
Peadawg
May 30th, 2012
4:33 pm
“Every known source”
Got links? And not Hannity or Rush please.
BTW, I’m not saying you’re wrong, just asking for a link b/c I’m curious.
JamVet
May 30th, 2012
4:34 pm
Corporations have their place in American society. However, the overriding power, within this nation, must continue rest in the hands of ordinary American workers, not in exclusive hands of the top 1% of the wealthy elite, who will continue to safeguard their own self-interests. That is primarily why you should vote a Democratic ticket in November.
Bravo!
The people who work for the corporations are of course real people, but the corporate “entity” should never be given equal constitutional rights to real human beings.
Even Business Week magazine, in a 2000 editorial, declared that “corporations should get out of politics.”
We cannot have equal justice under law between real people and corporations like Exxon Mobil.
Multinational corporations can be in 1000 places around the world at the same time obstructing governments, states, buying and renting politicians, and going to Washington to get bailed out by taxpayers.
Congress did not legislate corporate personhood. The courts performed this jolting display of runaway activism all by themselves.
The courts destroyed the semblance of equal protection under law because there is no way even an individual billionaire can approximate the raw power of these large corporations with their privileged immunities, and their control over technology, capital and labor.
The sovereignty of the people is subordinated to the sovereignty of the giant multinational corporations.
But the constitution still reads, “we the people”, not we the corporations.
Corporations were chartered in the early nineteenth century by state governments to be our servants, not our masters.
They are now our masters.
Time to restore the supremacy of real people.
http://www.votenader.org/issues/corporate-personhood/
That Black Guy
May 30th, 2012
4:35 pm
Matti
May 30th, 2012
3:39 pm
The hyper-partisanship is too much fun for people who like to lash out and unleash their frustrations by blaming others. (Yes, I’m guilty sometimes too.)
______________________________________________________________________________
Matti, you are soooo correct.
I was reading about the guy in Miami that ate the homeless guy’s face, and within 5 or 8 comments the blame shifted to Obama and Bush, dem and repub.
Now that was just sad.
pogo
May 30th, 2012
4:35 pm
Obama can take taxpayer money, give the unions, companies like GE and GM and big banks access to it (against the wishes of the taxpayers) and they in turn send those very same dollars back to fund Obama’s campaign. And Jay you see nothing wrong with this? Bain Capital is helping fund Obama for goddsake! And you have the nerve to critisize the republicans for taking corporate cash? Are you really this blind? Yes, you are.
And as for the future of America’s children, check out the increase in the national deficit under three years of Obama vrs. 8 years of Bush. There is no comparison. Bush was bad enough but just look at what Obama’s has done (or not done) to control it. The national debt is going to be the generation killer you espouse to hate Jay. It is already 100% of the GNP. You can drink the kool-aid only so long but when it comes to your childrens future, even you, the most diehard liberal I have ever seen, must know that the prospects are bad for the younger folks and that Obama is doing nothing to stop the hemmoraging. Under Obama the national debt has risen more in three years than it took the loser Bush 8 years to achieve. I have come to the conclusion that Obama really is, most unequivocalbly most scincerely, DUMB. He doesn’t have a clue what he is doing. It is incredible to see intelligent people sell out the future of this country for ideology as Jay does here daily.
Wilmer "Redneck" Convert (R--and proud of it)
May 30th, 2012
4:38 pm
Well, I see we got about 9 pages of feuding about a few million bucks in political contributions, while our freedom is being taken away by the guvmint as we fight.
The state of Idaho has just banned the sale of a brand called Five Wives Vodka. The state claims the name is offensive to many. Well, I don’t know about you, but if some guy is stupid enough to be nagged and spent to the poorhouse by five wives, I’m not the least offended. Serves the sucker right. He better hope they don’t all file for divorce at the same time.
I’m about to head back to the warehouse for my check-in. It won’t be long till I’m on the way to Simpsons Trailer Park and Fox News. Have a good night everybody.
JamVet
May 30th, 2012
4:39 pm
Every known source has the President raising far more funds than the Republicans- and you know it.
Correct.
Nearly four years ago I noted that Barack Obama was the first Democratic candidate ever for President of the United States to outraise his opponent in corporate campaign financing.
The very first.
I also wrote then, and have NO reason to change my mind, that once the GOP candidate resumes his rightful and historical place as the champion of corporate cash, all of the John Galts will crawl back under the woodwork and once again, make nary a peep.
Selective indignation at it’s GOP best…
UNCLE SAMANTHA
May 30th, 2012
4:39 pm
They BOTH suck
May 30th, 2012
4:31 pm
Uncle Sam
Politically we are probably much more different than alike at least based on the posts I have read, however we do agree on this issue.
=====================================================================
and even in disagreement we could still sit at the table and come to agreements on actions to solve problems like THEY USE TO DO IN WASHINGTON
GT
May 30th, 2012
4:39 pm
Actually if everybody votes O wins, it is our side that is expected to sit out the dance this time around.
It is your side that ties the religious train of emotions like a Elmer Gantry tent revival to this. There will be people stepping out of the voting booths, throwing the curtains back and crotches down and expecting to walk because they have voted against the devil, born not of here, himself.
Thulsa Doom
May 30th, 2012
4:40 pm
I’ll bite then, Doom. Show me EXACTLY where I suggested this: “. . . you think a rank and file union member is going to go strolling into Mr. Hoffa’s office and tell him how he thinks or wants his union dues to go to . . .”
I said nothing of the sort, and you know it. To represent that statement as anything other than dishonesty is absolutely reprehensible.- Joe Mama
Joe mama,
I just realized just how truly dishonest you really are.
In that sentence you truncated and left off where I said the word IF. In that statement I wrote ” “IF” you think a rank and file….”. I never said ” you think” which is the way you presented it back to me- you went out of your way to leave out that word IF.
That “IF” changes the entire context of the statement. And you damn well know that. Which is why you truncated and left it off in the statement you sent back to me in which you accused me of dishonesty by saying I was representing what you think. I never said you “think” this. I said “IF you think…” You blatantly lied and are a dishonest man. And the proof of how you did it is right there for everyone on the blog to see.
Joe Hussein Mama
May 30th, 2012
4:42 pm
Doom — “Joe Mama, Oh my God. You really can’t see that as what it is- just a rhetorical statement.”
*Sure* it is. That’s why you said this:
Doom — “Quite a stretch Joe. That’s not a “dishonest” misrepresentation of your point in any way, shape, or fashion. That’s just me making a point that you know to be true and you just don’t like it.”
And this:
“Your bogus charge of dishonesty is the usual shyte we can always expect from you when you don’t like someone’s point.”
Half an hour ago, you were crowing about your “point” that I somehow ‘knew to be true,’ but now you’re backpedaling and calling it a “rhetorical statement.” Uh huh.
“And you were an English major? Bless your heart. And you take this gigantic leap making a rhetorical statement into a blatant display of dishonesty. I don’t know that you think that Joe.”
That right. You certainly don’t, because I don’t think anything of the sort, have never *said* anything of the sort and didn’t even *suggest* anything of the sort.
“I’m simply making the statement that if you do or if you believe anything close to that then you can bring me back a chocolately unicorn. Geez.”
If I didn’t say it, suggest it or otherwise indicate that I believed anything close to it, then why would you feel the need to *say* it in the first place, Doom? And then crow about your “point?” A “point” that I ‘knew to be true?’
“Anyway, no point in responding to the rest of your post”
You’ve already admitted to not having the staying power, so no problem.
“though some of it was mildly amusing- in that grade school sort of way of course.”
Well, you don’t give me much to work with, young man.
“Too much gobbledeegook”
Oh, that’s right — I promised to keep the syllable count down, didn’t I?
“and besides I warned you about writing novels.”
I didn’t take it as a warning. I took it more as a ‘heads up, because I’m going to have to drop out of the run since I can’t keep up’ advisory from you. But to each their own.
“Have a nice day Joe.
And you as well, Doom.
Don Abernethy
May 30th, 2012
4:42 pm
Spoken like a true dedicated liberal. Corporations need to close down and lay off everyone.
UNCLE SAMANTHA
May 30th, 2012
4:42 pm
JamVet
May 30th, 2012
4:34 pm
if you want corporations out of politics would you also move unions out of politics?
That Black Guy
May 30th, 2012
4:44 pm
Adam
May 30th, 2012
4:05 pm
TBG: Others here have called you out for it.
Dave R did on a regular basis. I shouldn’t have to explain why he doesn’t count. But it has been a while since anyone said I did this. I’m sorry if I am doing it way more regularly and I don’t notice it, but if it is as bad as you say I am sure there would be more than just a few people here and there saying that I do this more regularly. It’s not like people here don’t speak up when something bothers a majority.
_________________________________________________________________________
I’m done with it.
Just please stop putting words in my mouth. If you want to know what I am trying to say, just ask.
Thanks
Liberal Chicks are UGLY
May 30th, 2012
4:45 pm
Well, if that were true, then that idiotic and unconstitutional healthcare bill wouldn’t have passed because the majority of people were overwelmingly against it.
So no, it’s not a government for the people by the people. Right now it’s a government for democrats by democrats and everybody else can go to hell.
Right now, we are essentially leaderless.
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
May 30th, 2012
4:45 pm
You can drink the kool-aid only so long…
“Build a better mousetrap and the world will beat a path to your door”, but only if you “get your foot in the door. “He who lives by the sword, shall die by the sword”, especially if you try to “catch a falling knife.” “You scratch my back, and I’ll scratch yours” and you’ll never be “left at the altar.” If you “keep your nose to the grindstone,” you’ll always “knock it out of the ballpark.”
Took a while...
May 30th, 2012
4:45 pm
“Just the spending linked to the Koch network is more than the $370 million that John McCain raised for his entire presidential campaign four years ago. And the $1 billion total surpasses the $750 million that Barack Obama, one of the most prolific fundraisers ever, collected for his 2008 campaign.”
Took 3 1/2 years, but at least it finally made it out there that the 2008 election was bought, pure and simple. Raise 2x whatever anyone else, you’ll win. Hats off to then Senator Obama. He’s been paying that back ever since by spending, spending, spending and borrowing, borrowing, borrowing.
Until less than 10 years ago, Wal-mart never spent anything on lobbying. Then the government came down on them (like Microsoft before them) and they were basically required to go spend millions to lobby. That is what companies do when governments want nothing more than to regulate, create “partnerships” with them, etc. It’s been happening in our government for decades and goes right along with the explosion in spending by EVERY President we’ve had since…well, sad to say, since maybe the 20s? Until someone actually shrinks the government and doesn’t try to engineer our economy as Progressives/Fascists are wont to do, it will only get worse.
Liberal Chicks are UGLY
May 30th, 2012
4:46 pm
One thing I can say about liberals, whether they win or lose, they are still idiots. Winning doesn’t fix stupid, it just makes it popular.
They BOTH suck
May 30th, 2012
4:48 pm
“Winning doesn’t fix stupid, it just makes it popular.”
You considered Bush to be a liberal?
That Black Guy
May 30th, 2012
4:49 pm
They BOTH suck
May 30th, 2012
4:14 pm
Oblama
So as I posted earlier, keep flailing. NOPE, wait a second Better for you to stop, best you could do would be to punch yourself……….
GT
May 30th, 2012
4:50 pm
Oil Prices are well below 90 a barrel today, lowest since 2008. I feel the earth moving under my feet.
JamVet
May 30th, 2012
4:51 pm
if you want corporations out of politics would you also move unions out of politics?
Of course.
Labor unions play an enormously important role in this country (before they were systematically destroyed by the plutocrats and their GOP flunkies anyway), but buying off politicians is not that role.
Between them being gutted and the only other voice for working Americans being effectively silenced – the government – is it any wonder that most working people in this country earn virtually no more money than they did in 1973?
Yet, some here seem to think that is a great thing. You tell me…
RC, I dig the new moniker.
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
May 30th, 2012
4:51 pm
NOPE, wait a second Better for you to stop, best you could do would be to punch yourself……….
Sting like a butterfly, float like a bee….
JamVet
May 30th, 2012
4:52 pm
Corporations need to close down and lay off everyone.
Don, do you always write like an upset 15 year old?
They BOTH suck
May 30th, 2012
4:52 pm
TBG
You get the link I posted? I read where you asked Bro for it. I knew he had posted it last night.
That Black Guy
May 30th, 2012
4:52 pm
Adam
May 30th, 2012
4:21 pm
Too much gobbledeegook and besides I warned you about writing novels.
FOLLOW THE RULES JOE (even if you don’t know what they are)
__________________________________________________________
Touché
Joe Hussein Mama
May 30th, 2012
4:53 pm
Doom — “I just realized just how truly dishonest you really are.”
And now you’re going to play the wounded. Lovely.
“In that sentence you truncated and left off where I said the word IF. In that statement I wrote ” “IF” you think a rank and file….”. I never said ” you think” which is the way you presented it back to me- you went out of your way to leave out that word IF.”
Really? Did I? Deliberately? And you’d know that *how,* exactly?
“That “IF” changes the entire context of the statement. And you damn well know that.”
What I KNOW is that I never said anything *remotely* resembling ‘hey, unions are so egalitarian that any rank-and-file union guy can march into Hoffa’s office and tell him what to do with his dues,’ yet that didn’t stop you from trotting that out and trumpeting it as a “point” that I somehow ‘knew to be true.’ And when you were confronted on it, you backed down and instead called it a “rhetorical statement.”
“Which is why you truncated and left it off in the statement you sent back to me in which you accused me of dishonesty by saying I was representing what you think. I never said you “think” this. I said “IF you think…”
Once again, given that I never said or suggested anything remotely like that, there was absolutely no reason whatsoever for you to make that crap up and then call it a “point” that I ‘knew to be true.’
“You blatantly lied and are a dishonest man.”
No, Doom. That would be *you.*
“And the proof of how you did it is right there for everyone on the blog to see.”
Yes, Doom, the proof of you being called out and backpedaling on your “point” certainly is right there.
Oblama
May 30th, 2012
4:53 pm
Both Sides Suck – I have taken on both sides many times on this blog. Especially on unbridled Fed spending. I have also stated that I am neither Dem nor Repub and didn’t vote for “W” or Oblama. I’m not for abortion on demand, I’m not for gay marriage. I’m not for socialism. I’m for government of, by and for the people (citizens of the U.S.A.) I’m not for this huge expansion of the government in to areas where it doesn’t belong. Currently we have government of, by and for the politicians. We need TERM LIMITS in Congress for BOTH sides. This election is not about race warfare/ sex warfare/ class warfare/ age warfare/ victim warfare/ …….. it is about the economy, jobs and how to reduce this alarming FED debt. You have a right to your opinion – even if I don’t know what it is. I’m a sheep for the preservation of this country and it’s freedom. No political party owns me. Going to work now so I can pay my taxes. By the way did you see where 3.4 million citizens have left New York State over the last 6 years? Why? High taxes and government over-regulation were listed as the top two reasons. I’m a fiscal conservative and proud of it. We need a balanced budget amendment to the Constitution to bring sanity back to Congress and to reduce the outside influence of lobbyists and big money.
Oblama
May 30th, 2012
4:55 pm
gone today – here tomorow.
TaxPayer
May 30th, 2012
4:55 pm
Republicans went on and on. And on. And on and on… about how their lives, their very existence, was in jeopardy because it took so many dollars to fill up their Hummers. President Obama delivered them from their high oil prices and what do they do. Not so much as a thank you. Some people are just so ungrateful. I’m aghast.
UNCLE SAMANTHA
May 30th, 2012
4:55 pm
JAMVET
there is hope for the future
most reasonable people would not mind limitations on elections
however, us citizens would have to draft legislation and force it on congress
it can be done
TaxPayer
May 30th, 2012
4:57 pm
Oil Prices are well below 90 a barrel today, lowest since 2008. I feel the earth moving under my feet.
No fracking wonder.
That Black Guy
May 30th, 2012
4:57 pm
They BOTH suck
May 30th, 2012
4:28 pm
Thanks, I sent it to my home email and will check it out after work.
Thulsa Doom
May 30th, 2012
4:58 pm
Joe mama,
You truncated my statement in a deceitful and misleading manner and I laid it out right there for anyone on the blog to see. You lied. Plain and simple.
They BOTH suck
May 30th, 2012
5:00 pm
Oblama
Not sure how many left New York, however the state has seen a population increase from 2000 to 2010 People move for various reasons. Taxes could be on of many, but don’t let facts get in the way of a good story
http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/36000.html
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
May 30th, 2012
5:00 pm
We need TERM LIMITS in Congress for BOTH sides.
Geez, not this crap again.
We already have TERM LIMITS, they’re called ELECTIONS.
Seeing as how re-election rates for congress critters is in the 80-90% range the only people whinging about TERM LIMITS are cry babies boo-hooing about other people’s representatives and not their own.
GT
May 30th, 2012
5:01 pm
What did Newt say 2.50 a gallon, may do it without him? You know if this drops below 80 a barrel fracking is too expensive to compete.
JohnnyReb
May 30th, 2012
5:01 pm
“President Obama delivered them from their high oil prices ….”
First it was, Obama can’t control oil prices. Now, it’s the messiah delivered lower oil prices.
Is that a Flip Flop or just hypocrisy?
Joe Hussein Mama
May 30th, 2012
5:04 pm
Doom — “You truncated my statement in a deceitful and misleading manner”
You mean your “point” that I ‘knew to be true?’ Sorry, I did no such thing, and you know that to be true.
“and I laid it out right there for anyone on the blog to see.”
First it’s a “point” that I ‘know to be true,’ then it’s a “rhetorical statement.” Ho hum.
“You lied.”
Oh, Doomy, I know you’d like to believe that. T’aint true, though. That said, maybe you should give *yourself* a good look in the mirror.
“Plain and simple.”
I don’t know what you look like; you may indeed be plain-looking. But if you say you’re “simple,” I’ll go along with that.
GT
May 30th, 2012
5:05 pm
If O could control that it would have never gone up in the first place, but as oil goes down the economy does better. It is all luck, but if you want to blame the man for someone else’s child, when it comes out beautiful he gets the unearn credit for that too.
curious
May 30th, 2012
5:06 pm
Who’s paying all those lobbyists in Washington? They can’t all be part of the liberal machince, can they?
UNCLE SAMANTHA
May 30th, 2012
5:06 pm
THEY BOTH SUCK
sorry but you are manipulating the fact that NY is losing population proportional to the rest of the country…………. FUZZY MATH
http://www.gallup.com/poll/145397/states-losing-congressional-seats-tilt-democratic.aspx
They BOTH suck
May 30th, 2012
5:11 pm
Uncle Sam
That may be true, but saying 3m left New York is meaningless when they have in fact seen an overall population growth, which of course would mean those being born in NY and others moving into the state…….
TaxPayer
May 30th, 2012
5:12 pm
Fracking is truly one of those catch 22’s. The technology came into use as a result of extensive research into methods that would extract more useable product from a drill site which only came about as a result of higher oil and gas prices and now the new technology is leading to a glut of supply which is leading to lower energy prices which will lead to more reserves being capped off in order to wait for higher prices. You gotta love it.
G Mare 71(PLEASE VOTE NO ON TSPLOST)
May 30th, 2012
5:12 pm
Jefferson@4:14: YEP!
They BOTH suck
May 30th, 2012
5:13 pm
JMH and Doom
I declare a draw in your Battle Royal pillow fight…………
JamVet
May 30th, 2012
5:13 pm
us citizens would have to draft legislation and force it on congress
it can be done
Perhaps, but I am doubtful.
Why?
Because congress had nothing to do with it in the first place.
All this GOP BS about strict constructionists is just that.
Corporate personhood is simply a creation of the courts – nothing more. It is a fiction that was never legislated as the law of the land.
And I mock those robed sell outs and their self-destructive sycophants with the following…
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all Corporations are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator – the United States Supreme Court – with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of the Almighty Dollar. — That to secure these rights, Corporations are instituted among Men, deriving their unjust powers without the consent of real human beings…
UNCLE SAMANTHA
May 30th, 2012
5:14 pm
they both suck
you are being a fuzzy mather………………
just like liberals call an increase in spending a CUT
They BOTH suck
May 30th, 2012
5:16 pm
Uncle Sam
Are you not the one using fuzzy math by introducing a stat that neither Oblama or I mentioned?
He spoke of 3m leaving the state and taxes.
I’m not arguing that 3m left, but their population has increased……………
And while some have left for tax purposes, he nor you have provided any stats to back up that assertion as it being the prevailing reason
Joe Hussein Mama
May 30th, 2012
5:16 pm
TBS — “JMH and Doom I declare a draw in your Battle Royal pillow fight…………”
I know, right?
I’m going home to play with my wife before Doomy’s pwecious feefees get hurt.
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
May 30th, 2012
5:16 pm
Fuzzy Mather — the golf playing younger brother of Cotton Mather.
TaxPayer
May 30th, 2012
5:16 pm
Is that a Flip Flop or just hypocrisy?
Neither. Cons were the ones pointing the finger at Obama and whining about high oil and gas prices. Now that prices are dropping, I’m choosing to use that favored Republican technique of claiming causation from correlation.
Oblama
May 30th, 2012
5:17 pm
When did bailing some one out become a conservative thing? Liberals have bailed out their share. It’s plain to see. Dems bail out their big money and Repubs bail out theirs. Both are wrong. Bailing out the private sector by the government is just wrong. I have never been for it. a true conservative is against bailouts. Picking and choosing who to bail out won’t work. The government should not be in the bail out business.
Thogwummpy
May 30th, 2012
5:18 pm
If we don’t check it (and I mean NOW…this coming Novemeber), we’ll be in an irreversible tail-spin into a government by the political class, for the laziest voters, and against the productive taxpayer. It’s an old power formula (even Roman philosopher Sallust warned us when he said, “for those seeking power, the poor man in the most useful”), and once the Socialist/Marxist radicals have achieved this via their infection in the Democrat Party, they can not be dislodged save a revolution by another generation—as the fire of Constitutional liberty will be doused; given it’s impediments to totalitarian authority. Look, you find a nation state that claims it’s run by “The People”…and you’ll find a place where the citizens are being oppressed and abused. And the seductive candy that they wrap their poison into….it’s called “fairness”.
Thomas
May 30th, 2012
5:19 pm
What did Newt say 2.50 a gallon, may do it without him? You know if this drops below 80 a barrel fracking is too expensive to compete.
GT- what are your thoughts on backwardation and cantango and their effect on the oil markets? Is it your thoughts that fracking is 100% susceptible to the spot market? Are you of the opinion that the futures price is of no importance?
They BOTH suck
May 30th, 2012
5:19 pm
Uncle Sam
Nice try. That might work on talk radio but not with me
An increase in population is an increase in population. The fact that a particular state’s INCREASE doesn’t coincide with the overall increase in the US and how House Seats are allocated, is meaningless to the point made by Oblama and countered by TBS.
But if that stat you provided makes you feel good… Go with it, even if the population of NY has INCREASED……….
Thulsa Doom
May 30th, 2012
5:21 pm
Joe Mama,
Sorry ma’am but everyone can see where you truncated my statement in order to lie about what was said. You lied, you got caught, and everyone can see it.
UNCLE SAMANTHA
May 30th, 2012
5:22 pm
they both suck
i will give you that point but you must concede that R’s aren’t CUTTING government but only SLOWING THE GROWTH while in fact spending INCREASES under the so called CUTS
They BOTH suck
May 30th, 2012
5:23 pm
Oblama
It may not fit your definition of conservative, but US government has been bailing out big bizz for sometime now and also subsidizing others…….. that would include those of all stripes on both sides of the aisle
UNCLE SAMANTHA
May 30th, 2012
5:23 pm
fuzzy math prevails
They BOTH suck
May 30th, 2012
5:25 pm
Uncle Sam
yes, many times the left argues “cuts” when in fact it is a decrease in the growth rate…….
Some would argue that doesn’t include inflation. Even with that said, a decrease in growth is not a cut to the overall expenditure in question.
Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
May 30th, 2012
5:30 pm
You lied, you got caught, and everyone can see it.
You attributed a sentiment to him that he didn’t even suggest.
The word “if” don’t even enter into it.
Talk about putting words into someone else’s mouth.
josef
May 30th, 2012
5:31 pm
SCOUT
“Your take ?
“‘Obama … Stressed He Probably Knows About Judaism More than Any Other President’”
My take? Unmitigated chutzpah!
That honor would be a toss up among George Washington, Thomas Jefferson or James Monroe, followed by either Jefferson Davis, Harry Truman, or (GASP!) U. S. Grant. Obama’s not even in the top ten there. And why Grant? He learned the hard way, but give the blood thirsty old drunk his credit, he DID learn. After reading Sarna’s “When General Grant Expelled the Jews,” I had to do a reassessment.
Do I think that Obama is anti-Semitic or anti-Israel? Not in the least, but I don’t think he’s some great scholar on things Jewish either.
Thulsa Doom
May 30th, 2012
5:34 pm
They both suck,
I’m cool with it. But the man lied and I showed how he did it plain as day. He’s just mad he got caught. If you’ll notice he kept dancing around the fact that he truncated what I said in his copy and paste and once he was caught red handed he just kept dancing and trying to make jokes around it.
Otherwise I’m having a good day. Got a lot done this morning and got some impodent stuff done in between blog posting. What up with you? Aint talked to you in a while. You still excited about voting for Romney? Jest messin witcha.
They BOTH suck
May 30th, 2012
5:36 pm
TD
Doing well, thanks. I was messing with both JHM and yourself with that post.
Hope you had a great holiday weekend.
TaxPayer
May 30th, 2012
5:36 pm
What is it that Doom is claiming that everyone can see. How about a string of posts so we can go back through just the relevent ones and confirm this claim.
Oblama
May 30th, 2012
5:37 pm
Gas in Buffalo is about 50 cents a gallon higher than in Atlanta. Taxes. I was in Buffalo, Niagara Falls and Toronto last week on vacation. Taxes on food, gas, etc. are very high in New York. But compared to taxes in Canada they are low. I paid 20 % in taxes on my dinner there. Canada is beautiful but very expensive. Socialized medicine isn’t cheap.
"Liberal Chicks are UGLY""'s Mamma is FUGLY
May 30th, 2012
5:38 pm
Evenin’. Anyone find my new screen name offensive?