‘… debt-ceiling standoff is an act of economic sabotage’
With congressional Republicans promising to create yet another standoff on the debt ceiling, Betsey Stevenson and Justin Wolfers, professors at the highly regarded Wharton School of Business, write in Bloomberg about the economic consequences of the first crisis last summer.
They note, for example:
“Growth in nonfarm payrolls decelerated to an average 88,000 a month during the three months of the debt-ceiling impasse, compared with an average of 176,000 in the first five months of 2011. Payroll growth subsequently recovered and has averaged 187,000 jobs a month since. Despite the rebound in job growth, employment is likely still below where it would otherwise have been.”
And consumer confidence — critical in this recovery — took an even greater and more spectacular tumble, as these numbers from Gallup demonstrate:
They conclude:
“All told, the data tell us that a debt-ceiling standoff is an act of economic sabotage. The only way to avoid this conclusion is to argue that consumers and employers were reacting to some other economic factors. But the debt ceiling was the dominant economic story at the time. No other news fits the data as well. Although the European debt crisis was a rising concern throughout 2011, the real trouble in Europe arose in the period when consumer confidence and employment were recovering.
The next debt-ceiling battle could be worse, because the stakes are even higher. In addition to the threat of default, the U.S. is facing the so-called fiscal cliff: a raft of spending cuts and tax increases that will happen at the end of this year unless Congress acts to postpone them. Another stalemate would almost certainly plunge the economy into a deep recession.”
It’s also important to note that the standoff created an historic downgrade of the USA’s credit worthiness. And for what? Congressional Republicans got a budget-cutting agreement out of the standoff, but it’s a deal that they began to repudiate almost immediately after it was announced and that they are now actively seeking to undermine.
Maybe it’s just me, but I don’t trust the wisdom or patriotism of people who willing to risk the destruction of the economy to make a political point.
– Jay Bookman
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783 comments Add your comment
Thulsa Doom
May 29th, 2012
2:37 pm
JamVet,
I’ve never met a babysitter who voluntarily declared and paid taxes on their earnings. Perhaps they exist. I just never knew any.
Lord Help Us
May 29th, 2012
2:37 pm
”Well tweety bird that is the plan.”
So, do you support the Ryan plan? It increases our national debt substantially and will require many debt increases…
JamVet
May 29th, 2012
2:38 pm
It just a recapitualion (sic) of the many absurd liberal proclamations. (Your spelling really is atrocious.)
And for the third time today I will ask you to explain yourself.
But you won’t.
Given that, how is it even possible to hold an intelligent conversation with you?
Ron Burgundy
May 29th, 2012
2:40 pm
When will we start listening to learned educators at fancy schools???!!!!
mm
May 29th, 2012
2:40 pm
“is it any wonder that leftists whine about republican unwillingness to share the blame for their lunatic policies?”
Classic denial Rags.
Common Sense isn't very Common
May 29th, 2012
2:40 pm
Normal
At least you are gray/silver
you aren’t hated as much
East Lake Ira
May 29th, 2012
2:40 pm
Ron Burgundy
May 29th, 2012
2:33 pm
I think we need to listen to “highly regarded” professors more. i mean they obviously know more about stuff then us.
At least they can spell.
JamVet
May 29th, 2012
2:40 pm
Doomy, not everyone is a Wall Street idolizing tax dodger.
The travesty of our tax system and gargantuan corporate welfare/socialism is not a secret.
Some just wish it were…
Chuck
May 29th, 2012
2:41 pm
Lord Help Us,
First thing you have lumped me in with a lot of Republicans and you want me to defend a Republican plan, I happen to think that the Republicans are as useless as the Democrats, so I am not a Republican. If you want my opinion on the Ryan Plan I will tell you. It was horrible, it barely cut anything, we need to SLASH the budget, not slow growth or symbolic cuts here or there. The one thing that I agree with Jay’s on in his original blog piece, this country is standing on an economic ledge and we need to be guided by logic, reason, and facts, not by party politics. Say what you want about Ryan’s plan, but at least he had one, the Senate has not put forth a budget in over 5 years, that is our tax dollars at work.
Ron Burgundy
May 29th, 2012
2:41 pm
I know a good way to increase tax revenues…..drill here and drill now.
Adam
May 29th, 2012
2:41 pm
Gordon: Runaway spending is built into the budget. It increases 7% a year automatically.
If that’s true, then why hasn’t it increased 7% annually?
2009 = 3517.7 B
2010 = 3456.2 B
2011 = 3603.1 B
Ron Burgundy
May 29th, 2012
2:42 pm
And spelling is half the battle right Ira? BWAAHAHAA!
I think we should ship more guns to mexico and see if money comes back over the lines.
Thulsa Doom
May 29th, 2012
2:43 pm
JamVet,
By the way I’m going with answer C on your quiz.
Even if the babysitter or the kid who cuts grass for $20 a yard declared their small earnings they would have little or zero tax liability so I don’t really care much that anyone with $3,000 doesn’t declare anyway. They should but in the great scheme of things its not that big a deal.
Ron Burgundy
May 29th, 2012
2:44 pm
I think America is on the right path i mean Unemployment is coming down right?….right? I mean the job force is smaller but the main point is that unemployment is coming down. Can some of these fancy learned PHD types point this out to us????
williebkind
May 29th, 2012
2:44 pm
Jamvet:
You Progressive liberals have been deceived and your mines have been poisoned. By yourselves
There corrected the spelling. Good job!
Lord Help Us
May 29th, 2012
2:44 pm
‘Say what you want about Ryan’s plan, but at least he had one, the Senate has not put forth a budget in over 5 years, that is our tax dollars at work.’
Thank you.
I detest the politics being played by the Dems re: the budget process. IMO they are playing poker trying to get the GOP to show their cards on what the Ryan Plan will cut so that they can play politics with the info.
On the other hand, the howls of anguish from the GOP about our debt while supporting a plan that will make it worse (and leaving out the details) is equally deplorable.
Thulsa Doom
May 29th, 2012
2:45 pm
Gordon: Runaway spending is built into the budget. It increases 7% a year automatically.
If that’s true, then why hasn’t it increased 7% annually?
2009 = 3517.7 B
2010 = 3456.2 B
2011 = 3603.1 B
Adam,
Easy. Because we don’t have a TARP or 800 billion dollar stimulus every year.
Dave
May 29th, 2012
2:46 pm
Another loony left-wing columnist with no solutions, no plan to slow spending, no plan to curb our debt and skyrocketing deficit. Just bash, bash, bash the Republican party. Apparently Jay thinks money grows on trees or falls from the sky.
Obama is a communist and anyone who votes Democrat is a traitor to this nation.
See how easy that was? I didn’t have to prove a thing. Just like Jay Bookman.
williebkind
May 29th, 2012
2:47 pm
“Can some of these fancy learned PHD types point this out to us????”
Go for it JamVet! You are so informed.
Adam
May 29th, 2012
2:47 pm
Lord Help Us: Au contraire, maybe the SENATE hasn’t put forth a budget, but Obama and the House Democrats have put one forth every year. And whether or not it was voted up or down, or even put to a vote, doesn’t matter in the context of “at least they had a plan,” because they all did. Every side in these situations has had a plan.
Gordon
May 29th, 2012
2:47 pm
Adam,
The problem with the Democrats plan, at least the ones I’ve heard, is that they don’t cut spending enough, and they delay the spending cuts to a later time. I think it is unfair to say Republicans generally want to maintain power and Democrats generally want to solve the problem. Both want to position themselves so that they appear to want to solve the problem, especially to their base and independent voters.
I think the larger problem is this: Democratic supporters such as yourself view Republicans as the enemy to progress, and Republican supporters view Democrats as the enemy to progress. If you take a step back, you will see that incumbents are the problem and the voters on both sides need to unite to solve this problem. Maybe the way the Republicans are going about it is wrong, but it does seem reasonable to me to put a limit on federal spending at some point. If you can’t do that, how can you say you are serious about deficit reduction? And yes, if you aren’t willing to put revenue increases on the table, the same description applies.
We will never agree on everything, but at least we should agree that we are headed for a train wreck and this problem needs to be solved. If not, it won’t really matter which side you were on.
East Lake Ira
May 29th, 2012
2:47 pm
Ron – Your inability to use the English language correctly tells me you are not that smart. Your disdain for highly educated professors tells me you do not value education.
I can only hope you have yet to breed.
That is all.
Granny Godzilla - Union Thugette
May 29th, 2012
2:47 pm
Peadawg
you cannot accept that which is not given.
I never offered a link. I commented on the lack of depth in your thinking. (As characterized by your 1:47 post)
I stand by that comment.
Adam
May 29th, 2012
2:48 pm
Thulsa: Easy. Because we don’t have a TARP or 800 billion dollar stimulus every year.
And that explains 3 years of data? Give me a break.
mm
May 29th, 2012
2:48 pm
“Well, the last stand off was the democrats fault, and it wouldn’t surprise me if they pull the same crap again.”
Classic denial Part II.
“but provides for 16,000 new IRS agents,”
Seriously, you are still spouting that lie?
What’s sad about you cons is you do not research anything. You just spout your talking points..
Chuck
May 29th, 2012
2:50 pm
HDB
For the last time I am NOT a Republican, is it so hard for people to believe that someone can think independant of a political party. I thought Reagan should have answered for selling weapons to a terror state Iran to illegally fund the Contra’s. If going after the “rich” people money was the answer then I would say O.K. make your arguement. However even President Obama says it is not about revenue but about fairness. If you truly believe that by taking more money from the rich, is really going to put more money in the pockets of the poor then you have more faith in our governement than I do. This is the same Government that declared a war on poverty in 1968 and after TRILLIONS of dollars spent, there are more people in poverty today than ever.
Ron Burgundy
May 29th, 2012
2:50 pm
Wow! Ira is mad! Hilarious. I actually went to one of the greatest learning institutions in America and have an MBA from another. i can tell you that neithe rof those degrees learned me as much as real world work. What can I say say though. I guess I am just not as smart as a guy named Ira.
I do have kids much to your dismay. Two beautiful little boys who are already learning that self accountability is the tue answer to ones problems.
Joe Hussein Mama
May 29th, 2012
2:50 pm
Dave — “I didn’t have to prove a thing. Just like Jay Bookman.”
Clearly, the fact that Jay writes *opinion* editorials has been lost on you.
Adam
May 29th, 2012
2:50 pm
Gordon: If you take a step back, you will see that incumbents are the problem and the voters on both sides need to unite to solve this problem. Maybe the way the Republicans are going about it is wrong, but it does seem reasonable to me to put a limit on federal spending at some point. If you can’t do that, how can you say you are serious about deficit reduction? And yes, if you aren’t willing to put revenue increases on the table, the same description applies.
From a step back it looks to me like a better faith effort is being presented by the Democrats, who put nearly all options on the table, if not all options, at various times that the issue has been brought up.
Ron Burgundy
May 29th, 2012
2:51 pm
Until the country starts listening to educated minds like Sandra Fluke and Al Gore we are all doomed. We cowtail to uneducated rubes like Rush Limbaugh and the CEo of Apple (who went to putrid non Ivy League Auburn)!
Lord Help Us
May 29th, 2012
2:52 pm
‘Lord Help Us: Au contraire’
Yea, but the Dems are playing politics with the budget process worse than the GOP.
This is a huge issue in this campaign and I believe the GOP is a step ahead of the Dems. The Ryan Plan with all its flaws is out there, with the support of the Congress, with the support of the GOP nominee… I do not see the equivalent on the Dem side (but will issue a mea culpa if shown otherwise).
stands for decibels
May 29th, 2012
2:52 pm
NOW YOU’RE CATCHING ON……
That “Ron Burgundy” copy/pastes crap that was debunked over two years ago on Snopes?
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/oregonstate.asp
A clown filter, Jay. Is that asking so much?
mm
May 29th, 2012
2:52 pm
“Obama is a communist and anyone who votes Democrat is a traitor to this nation.
Wow, a deep thought from the right.
Ron Burgundy
May 29th, 2012
2:52 pm
the dems have put all options on the table? How about actually proposing a budget for once in all the years they have had majority control?
Ron Burgundy
May 29th, 2012
2:53 pm
An atheist, a communist and a Kenyan all walked into a bar. the bartender says “What’ll it be Mr. president?”
Scooter
May 29th, 2012
2:54 pm
I would say enacting another entitlement program, without reforming the others, is economic sabotage.
Gordon
May 29th, 2012
2:54 pm
Adam@2:41,
Because lots of spending has been deferred until later years (Obamacare, for one example). Also, as the deficit continues to rise the interest on that debt continues to rise.
Thulsa Doom
May 29th, 2012
2:54 pm
Adam,
What is your point? My point is that if there is a 7% automatic increase that even after accounting for that the deficit should be decreasing because the TARP and stimulus programs which I think happened in FY 2009 are no longer around going forward. Therefore you would think that deficits would be substantially smaller in years following the year in which TARP and stimulus counted. But they are not.
HDB
May 29th, 2012
2:54 pm
Ron Burgundy
May 29th, 2012
2:36 pm
SOURCE, please……you don’t even know where Corvallis IS! (Oregon, not Washongton State)….
Mick
May 29th, 2012
2:54 pm
chuck
I guess if you are neither dem or repub, then you just might be an Iino – independent in name only…
mm
May 29th, 2012
2:54 pm
“The Ryan Plan with all its flaws is out there, with the support of the Congress,”
Correction needed. Remove Congress, insert GOP.
Adam
May 29th, 2012
2:55 pm
Chuck If you truly believe that by taking more money from the rich, is really going to put more money in the pockets of the poor then you have more faith in our governement than I do
Exactly. That’s not the point. Obama and the Democrats were NEVER about redistributing wealth (this is basically what you are talking about here). They were about the rich paying fairer tax rates than they currently do. All told, many rich people pay less of a percentage of their income than do the middle class. There are some outliers but that is the trend. Fixing this particular problem will not be a magic bullet, but it is the right thing to do. Either that, or give more targeted cuts tot he middle class to make up for the difference. However, I oppose any new tax cuts because we have already cut our revenue to the bone.
Basically, taxing the rich more is about fair tax rates in a progressive tax system. And it is only a small piece of the puzzle when it comes to deficit reduction, which is why ANY plan that proposes raising taxes on the rich also comes with a number of other reforms designed to help close the deficit hole. See the latest House Democrat budget proposal.
mm
May 29th, 2012
2:55 pm
“because the TARP and stimulus programs which I think happened in FY 2009 are no longer around going forward”
The stimulus was a 3 year program.
Adam
May 29th, 2012
2:55 pm
Gordon: Because lots of spending has been deferred until later years (Obamacare, for one example). Also, as the deficit continues to rise the interest on that debt continues to rise.
But that still means that 7% figure isn’t as automatic as you said though, right?
Ron Burgundy
May 29th, 2012
2:56 pm
I think we need another trillion dollars of stimulus. Its obvious it was working until the money ran out.
Adam
May 29th, 2012
2:57 pm
Thulsa: What is your point? My point is that if there is a 7% automatic increase that even after accounting for that the deficit should be decreasing because the TARP and stimulus programs which I think happened in FY 2009 are no longer around going forward. Therefore you would think that deficits would be substantially smaller in years following the year in which TARP and stimulus counted. But they are not.
The figures I presented were federal dollars spent ONLY. They did not include revenue at all. Thus, any TARP receipts were not in those numbers.
Lord Help Us
May 29th, 2012
2:57 pm
‘Correction needed. Remove Congress, insert GOP.’
Noted…the house has voted (overwhelming, on a party-line basis) for the Ryan Plan, the Senate has not…
Ron Burgundy
May 29th, 2012
2:57 pm
Raising taxes has work for NYC. they have managed to loses millionaires in droves from their fair city. Much better off without those nasty rich people.
Butch Cassidy
May 29th, 2012
2:58 pm
Chuck – “so for you taxing the rich is not about the economy but about punishing the rich,”
If by punishing you mean raising my taxes to 39.5% then, then by all means, “punish” away. Hell, over the weekend in Vegas I must have tipped at least 2k between the dealer and the waitress, so you may as well call me a job creator too.
Adam
May 29th, 2012
2:59 pm
Ron: It would be better if you said: An atheist, a Christian, and a Muslim walk into a bar and the bartender says “What’ll it be Mr. President?”
Same punchline: A big spender, a fiscal conservative, a terrorist sympathizer, and a terrorist killer walk into a bar.
Recon 0311 2533
May 29th, 2012
2:59 pm
“And for what? Congressional Republicans got a budget-cutting agreement out of the standoff, but it’s a deal that they began to repudiate almost immediately after it was announced”
According to Boehner, Obama walked the agreement back and insisted on only tax increases after his left wing base went ballistic over possible adjustments to Medicare. So who do you believe? If you’re a conservative you’re going to place more credence on Boehners’s version of events. If you’re a left winger you’ll go with Jay’s version. Given our huge and ever growing deficit with the question of patriotism and destruction of the economy I don’t see how anyone can call themselves a patriot by minimizing the need for cost cutting and entitlement reform, while only demanding tax increases on the wealthy. Taxing the wealthy, programs that make more Americans dependent on the government and defense cuts is all the Democrats want to propose. That doesn’t sound patriotic to me.
Ron Burgundy
May 29th, 2012
3:01 pm
Whats the difference between Disneys Simba and Obama?
One is an African Lion and the other is a lying African.
Thulsa Doom
May 29th, 2012
3:01 pm
mm
May 29th, 2012
2:55 pm
The stimulus was a 3 year failure.
Typo correction on page 5 please. Doomy on it!
Mick
May 29th, 2012
3:01 pm
butch
Why are you so liberal about being taxed more? Could it be that 3 or 4 more points in taxes will barely put a dent in your mercedes or could it be that you are not a greedy self absorbed money grubber?
JamVet
May 29th, 2012
3:02 pm
There corrected the spelling.
And your grammar also languishes at the elementary school level.
But, it is all good, willie.
You have nothing of substance by reply, so you do all that you can do. (But you ain’t no army of one!)
Yet you have the temerity to ask questions of me though you NEVER answer any – in a cogent manner, if at all – when they are posed to you.
Three consecutive times I have asked you to do so and three consecutive times you have declined to explain yourself.
You don’t debate. You are not remotely interested in doing so. You do the blogging version of hide and seek.
And at this point in my life, I’m not into childhood games…
jm
May 29th, 2012
3:02 pm
Ron Burgundy 3:01 – sick lame pathetic
And also abuse of darn good name in your handle.
Joe Hussein Mama
May 29th, 2012
3:02 pm
Gordon — “Maybe the way the Republicans are going about it is wrong, but it does seem reasonable to me to put a limit on federal spending at some point. If you can’t do that, how can you say you are serious about deficit reduction?”
I have proposed the following several times to conservative posters. Each time I’ve done it, the poster in question has responded to the effect of ‘it’s a good idea and I could get behind it, but it’ll never happen.’ See what you think of it.
Congress chooses a budget baseline. A given year’s budget could be used, perhaps with some tweaks and adjustment. Once approved via the Constitutional Amendment process, that budget becomes an absolute HARD CEILING on expenditures. Short of a national emergency or war, Congress is legally unable to authorize spending over the amounts listed in the budgets baseline. If the Federal Honeybee Program gets $80,000 a year, then it can’t have more at all. Period.
Spending can be *reduced permanently* in any given area and for any line item, but saved amounts DO NOT become eligible for spending elsewhere. So if the Federal Honeybee Program gets cut to $40,000, the National Unwashed Hippie Preserve can’t lay claim to that extra $40K the honeybees used to get. That excess money goes to service outstanding debt.
If revenues are increased by any means, the excess goes DIRECTLY to servicing outstanding debt.
So — we have here a suggestion that puts HARD LIMITS on spending, and prohibits spending increases. Congress can’t violate it short of a national emergency, declaration of war or re-amendment of the Constitution. We have the assurance that any increase in revenues will go to service outstanding debt, so we have part of what conservatives want (spending limits and cuts) and part of what liberals want (assurance that debt will be serviced) and a high hurdle that would have to be surmounted in order to violate the limits.
There might be some tweaks necessary in order to provide for emergency relief (perhaps the President is permitted to disburse funds from a National Emergency Fund for hurricane/tornado/flood/earthquake/etc. relief, but otherwise, no exception.
What do you think?
Chuck
May 29th, 2012
3:02 pm
Adam if you truely believe that the super rich that you are talking about will ever pay more then you have never read history, what will happen is that the super rich will send their lobbyist to Congress and remind them were they get their re-election funds from (both Dems and Repubs) and all of a sudden you will see a loop hole here and a loop hole there and then the only people paying more is guys like me, a small privately held business owner, who’s income is also his operating expense which has just decreased by 4 to 5 percent, all because I can’t afford a lobbyist.
The Truth
May 29th, 2012
3:02 pm
DawgDad
May 29th, 2012
2:20 pm
“Speak for yourself, “The Truth”. Half-truth doesn’t qualify as truth. Reagan had a Democrat Congress which heavily influenced spending (drove much of it), and yes, there was a different mind-set at the time regarding deficits prevailing in BOTH parties.”
Just because you Cons can’t see the truth if it slapped you in the face, doesn’t mean that what I stated isn’t true.
Your hero Ronald Reagan proposed massive deficit spending in HIS budget, not the Democrats’ budget because the budget is proposed by the PRESIDENT, so please do pee on me and tell me that it’s raining. (You guys blame Obama for not passing a budget, yet you blame Democrats for Reagan’s own deficit spending in his budget.) Not to mention the fiscal conservative patron saint Reagan was the one that said “Deficits don’t matter”. What utter hypocricy. Not to mention your hero Bush had two unfunded wars that were “off of the books” which didn’t count against his ridiculous deficit spending.
Thulsa Doom
May 29th, 2012
3:03 pm
Ron Burgundy,
Damn those Obama jokes were funny. You’re quickly becoming the bane of the lib’s existence. keep em coming.
Adam
May 29th, 2012
3:03 pm
Thulsa: You and other conservatives have yet to explain to me how less than 100% success constitutes failure. No wonder you want to see his college record. One B anywhere in his history = FAILURE.
Ron Burgundy
May 29th, 2012
3:03 pm
I think we should let the government handle as much of the GDP as possible. I mean hey….they have done a bang up job with Medicare and SS.
Lyndon Johnson would speak about how welfare would solve poverty creating a helping hand. Bang up job with that one as 49% of all American households have a member getting a “helping hand”.
How about another housing credit. Housing booms are always started by govt help.
Adam
May 29th, 2012
3:04 pm
Chuck: That may be so, but it’s an entirely different subject from discussing what the Democrats want to do versus what the Republicans want to do.
Soothsayer
May 29th, 2012
3:04 pm
Well, it shore seems like this Ron Burgundy feller has done got it all figgured out. Waste in the stimulus, infantile jokes. Something tells me he cain’t explain why his party got the boot after their last guy was president.
TaxPayer
May 29th, 2012
3:05 pm
Have any of the Republicans discussed their party’s plans to actually reduce the debt. If so, which plan of theirs would that be.
jm
May 29th, 2012
3:06 pm
Blogs rip MSNBC’s Chris Hayes on ‘heroes’
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0512/76799.html
“Why do I feel so uncomfortable about the word ‘hero’?” Hayes said. “I feel uncomfortable about the word hero because it seems to me that it is so rhetorically proximate to justifications for more war. Um, and, I don’t want to obviously desecrate or disrespect memory of anyone that’s fallen, and obviously there are individual circumstances in which there is genuine, tremendous heroism, you know, hail of gunfire, rescuing fellow soldiers and things like that. But it seems to me that we marshal this word in a way that is problematic. But maybe I’m wrong about that.”
Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0512/76799.html#ixzz1wHrjAB5p
Sick liberals.
Butch Cassidy
May 29th, 2012
3:07 pm
Mick – “butch
Why are you so liberal about being taxed more? Could it be that 3 or 4 more points in taxes will barely put a dent in your mercedes or could it be that you are not a greedy self absorbed money grubber?”
Yes on the first (if I drove a Mercedes). And yes on the second. Of course, I can still balance out what I pay on earned income against what I don’t pay on capitol gains. So in reality it’s just a wash. For some reason, people think that anyone with an accumulation of wealth only has a singular stream of income that is going to be hard hit by a whopping 3-4 point increase. I guess that’s where all the “punishing the rich” mantra comes from.
Adam
May 29th, 2012
3:07 pm
JHM: I think that’s a bit harsh. Plus I am not seeing where in this process there is an accounting for revenues that happen to be below those spending levels. Plus, I can see political football being played with line items – permanently dropped.
Ron Burgundy
May 29th, 2012
3:07 pm
What do Obama and Osama have in common?
They both have friends who bombed the Pentagon.
John Birch
May 29th, 2012
3:08 pm
Obama begged for this mess by completely ignoring the recommendations of the Restoring America’s Future bi-partisan task force. And his administration and the Dem congress ran about $4.8T in deficits the last three years so someone has to try and stop the madness.
Steve - USA (I support "None Of The Above")
May 29th, 2012
3:08 pm
Jay – “Joseph, it’s my opinion that the modern Republican Party, as currently constituted, poses a real threat to my country, to my children’s future prosperity and to basic rules of logic and reason.”
I totally agree, I also happen to feel the same way about the Democratic Party.
Ron Burgundy
May 29th, 2012
3:09 pm
The last president got the boot cause of the financial collapse centered around Fannie and Freddie. In 2004 Bush tried to push a financial reform bill geared towards cleaning up Freddie and Fannie but Dodd and Frank blocked. in 2009 Frank and Dood reformed the financial industry but carelessly ommitted Freddie and Fannie,
TaxPayer
May 29th, 2012
3:09 pm
They both have friends who bombed the Pentagon.
I think it’s a stretch to claim that President Obama considers the Bushes, Cheneys, et al, “friends”.
Mick
May 29th, 2012
3:10 pm
butch
Thanks…how was vegas? Are they starting to recover much?
Bill Ayers
May 29th, 2012
3:10 pm
I think Obama is doing a heckuva job. I couldn’t have done more damage to the pentagon if I had bombed it myself.
Adam
May 29th, 2012
3:10 pm
jm: I find this funny. You probably didn’t even know who Chris Hayes was before that.
You chickenhawks need to CALM THE F*** DOWN when someone suggests you are overplaying the “‘MERICKA F*** YEAH” card.
stands for decibels
May 29th, 2012
3:11 pm
Yeah, how dare Chris Hayes ask us to think about the meanings behind the words we use!
Sick bast@rd.
TaxPayer
May 29th, 2012
3:11 pm
Last I checked, Lehman brothers collapsed. AIG collapsed. Fannie and Freddie. Nope. No collapse.
Joe Hussein Mama
May 29th, 2012
3:11 pm
Adam — “JHM: I think that’s a bit harsh. Plus I am not seeing where in this process there is an accounting for revenues that happen to be below those spending levels. Plus, I can see political football being played with line items – permanently dropped.”
I deliberately suggested something harsh to both sides — but which gave both sides something they wanted — as a means to stimulating discussion. Please, by all means, kick it around and see if you think there’s anything of value in the idea.
With respect to revenues possibly falling below expected levels — *that* is the incentive to cut spending and to increase revenues — to build surpluses into our budgets rather than deficits.
Butch Cassidy
May 29th, 2012
3:11 pm
Ron Burgundy – “The last president got the boot cause of the financial collapse centered around Fannie and Freddie.”
Actually the last president didn’t “get the boot”. He had served 2 terms and was ineligible to run for a third.
mm
May 29th, 2012
3:11 pm
“I don’t see how anyone can call themselves a patriot by minimizing the need for cost cutting and entitlement reform, while only demanding tax increases on the wealthy.”
Fact check. The dems have offered spending cuts with revenue increases. The cons own the one way street. They only want spending cuts.
“The stimulus was a 3 year failure”
It created over 2 million jobs, but you can call it whatever you want. Republican policies have been in place for 10 years and still have not created 2 million jobs.
JamVet
May 29th, 2012
3:12 pm
Doomy, C is incorrect.
485,000 Americans made between $100,000 and $500,000 and paid ZERO in federal income taxes.
Thanks to our perverse and pernicious tax code…
Mick
May 29th, 2012
3:12 pm
ron
What a fraud, as if fannie and freddie were the only game in town…remember bush’s ownership society that pushed home ownership? Yes, you picked a good name, one that is associated with a dunce…
Hank Johnson
May 29th, 2012
3:12 pm
This talk of democratic house members not proposing a budget is ludicrous. I sat down with jon Lewis and Nancy Pelosi to propse a budget that not balanced our finanes but balanced Guam!
Soothsayer
May 29th, 2012
3:12 pm
“They both have friends who bombed the Pentagon.”
Ron, I thought a airplane hit the pentagon ‘though I ain’t never seen no picture of it hittin’ the pentagon, have you? Maybe you could post one for us.
Chuck
May 29th, 2012
3:13 pm
Adam
It doesn’t matter what either of them say they want to do, because the know the end result. Their big donors will not be effected but then they can say “see there we stuck it to them”. I have to live and operate in the real world, the problem with all politicans is they are always SAYING, that all they ever do. Almost none of the members of congress has ever had to build a business from the ground up, alot of them have never worked in the private sector where they actually have to make a profit to succeed.
Thulsa Doom
May 29th, 2012
3:14 pm
Adam,
I would like to see his academic records and transcripts for a few reasons. No. 1 I would like to know how a guy got into 2 Ivy league schools with academics based upon what he wrote which is in his own words in his own book and I paraphrase ” my last 2 years of high school was a haze, I attended class sparingly, drank a lot of beer, and engaged in drugs enthusiastically”. How does that guy get into Columbia and Harvard Adam?
Secondly, I would like to know if he applied to get in as a Kenyan knowing full well that he is an American or if he applied as an American. That bio presented where it says he is a Kenyan indicates that while I believe he is an American that he may have applied as a Kenyan.
Thirdly I would like to know what he studied. How much economics, how much if any business courses, etc.
These are all fair, reasonable questions. If the Wash Post is going to go back 47 years to when romney was in high school then it only seems reasonable to query as to how O got into 2 Ivy league schools considering that in his own words he attended class sparingly in his last 2 years of high school all the way imbibing in alcohol and drugs- in his own words of course.
Skip
May 29th, 2012
3:14 pm
jm, I have the same problem with the everyone’s a hero line I’m also a lib. add in a Marine Sgt. and Viet Vet .How about you?
Ron Burgundy
May 29th, 2012
3:14 pm
Its unpatriotic to run up these types of deficits. Who said that?
As soon as more people leave the job force and unemployment gets down to a manageable number we will be fine.
TaxPayer
May 29th, 2012
3:15 pm
Maybe it’s just me, but I don’t trust the wisdom or patriotism of people who willing to risk the destruction of the economy to make a political point.
It’s not just you. More and more people are seeing through the GOP rhetoric to their true lack of character. Republicans are neither wise or patriotic. They care about themselves and they are willing to enrich themselves at anyone’s expense and by any means.
jm
May 29th, 2012
3:15 pm
Adam
I know exactly who the guy is: he’s the turkey I’ve seen on MSNBC that is either gay or acts incredibly effeminate.
I don’t care which. But you really should try something more substantive to try to defend your liberal co-conspirator dirtbags.
Of course, it is difficult to defend the defenseless. Like calling people who die serving their country non-heroes. Pathetic. U and Chris.
Ron Burgundy
May 29th, 2012
3:15 pm
I have no problem with Obama smoking weed, but I do have a problem with him coining the phrase “intercepting” duirng a smoke session. thats justa dbag move.
JamVet
May 29th, 2012
3:15 pm
collapse centered around Fannie and Freddie
Absolutely the least factual and stupidest thing posted today.
getalife
May 29th, 2012
3:16 pm
Stay the course on job creation.
Keep on rocking in the free world.
Peace and prosperity.
Butch Cassidy
May 29th, 2012
3:16 pm
MIck – “Thanks…how was vegas? Are they starting to recover much?”
Vegas was great, but it’s still not back up to the glory days when I used to go there in the 80’s, 90’s and early 2000’s. Back then all the tables were standing room only. Even with a Memorial Day weekend, there were a lot of dealers standing with empty tables, and the hotel bars were only about half full.
On the plus side, several of my friends that live out there were able to pick up houses for less than half of the original price. One girl I know was able to buy a home that originally sold for $700,000 for less than $250,000.
Steve - USA (I support "None Of The Above")
May 29th, 2012
3:17 pm
“Ron, I thought a airplane hit the pentagon ‘though I ain’t never seen no picture of it hittin’ the pentagon, have you? Maybe you could post one for us.”
I am in a great mood and ready for a belly laugh. Where did flight 77 go then?
stands for decibels
May 29th, 2012
3:17 pm
Absolutely the least factual and stupidest thing posted today.
Hmm.
Well, when one considers that it’s physically impossible to “center *around*” anything… ok.
Soothsayer
May 29th, 2012
3:17 pm
Doomy: I’d like to know how Dubyer figgured out how to pour p*ss out of a boot.
jm
May 29th, 2012
3:18 pm
Skip 3:14 – I don’t care who or what you are.
I believe those who die serving our country are heroes of the highest order. If you don’t, so be it. Glad I don’t know you.
Recon 0311 2533
May 29th, 2012
3:18 pm
“Fact check. The dems have offered spending cuts with revenue increases. The cons own the one way street. They only want spending cuts.”
You get partial credit for the revenue increases, however, the Democrats want revenue increases only through increased taxes on wealthy Americans and not through tax reform as Republicans have proposed. As for spending cuts they’ve proposed nothing except cuts in defense spending. Hell they can’t even pass a budget.