Let’s unleash the true power of the job creators!

With a net worth somewhere in the neighborhood of $1 billion, venture capitalist Nick Hanauer is very successful at what he does. Among other smart moves, he was an early investor in Amazon.

Like many of his peers, Hanauer has strong opinions about the wisdom of taxing the rich and the importance of what have come to be called “job creators.” Here’s part of what he had to say on the subject in a recent speech (full text available here):

“I have started or helped start, dozens of businesses and initially hired lots of people. But if no one could have afforded to buy what we had to sell, my businesses would all have failed and all those jobs would have evaporated.

That’s why I can say with confidence that rich people don’t create jobs, nor do businesses, large or small. What does lead to more employment is a “circle of life”-like feedback loop between customers and businesses. And only consumers can set in motion this virtuous cycle of increasing demand and hiring. In this sense, an ordinary middle-class consumer is far more of a job creator than a capitalist like me….

Anyone who’s ever run a business knows that hiring more people is a capitalist’s course of last resort, something we do only when increasing customer demand requires it. In this sense, calling ourselves job creators isn’t just inaccurate, it’s disingenuous.

That’s why our current policies are so upside down. When you have a tax system in which most of the exemptions and the lowest rates benefit the richest, all in the name of job creation, all that happens is that the rich get richer.

Since 1980 the share of income for the richest Americans has more than tripled while effective tax rates have declined by close to 50%.

If it were true that lower tax rates and more wealth for the wealthy would lead to more job creation, then today we would be drowning in jobs. And yet unemployment and under-employment is at record highs….

We’ve had it backward for the last 30 years. Rich businesspeople like me don’t create jobs. Rather they are a consequence of an eco-systemic feedback loop animated by middle-class consumers, and when they thrive, businesses grow and hire, and owners profit. That’s why taxing the rich to pay for investments that benefit all is a great deal for both the middle class and the rich.

So here’s an idea worth spreading.

In a capitalist economy, the true job creators are consumers, the middle class. And taxing the rich to make investments that grow the middle class is the single smartest thing we can do for the middle class, the poor and the rich.”

Discuss among yourselves.

– Jay Bookman

447 comments Add your comment

ByteMe - Political thug

May 16th, 2012
5:52 pm

So why aren’t the consumers consuming?

Job insecurity, high personal debt. But, lately, they have been consuming up a storm, just nothing like it was when they were able to use their house as their personal ATM.

Peter

May 16th, 2012
5:52 pm

The GOP will not get it………for instance on Kyle’s silly blog he states there is no war on women, because a FEW women will run for office for the GOP……..I think 12 total.

Since those 12 make up the demographics of the united States he must be correct ?

Of course he never actually tells us what the War on Women is…..or how their rights are being infringed on by the religious groups, and MEN.

DebbieDoRight - A Pro Gay Rights Loving, Anti LimpBalls Hating, Feminazi!

May 16th, 2012
5:53 pm

ld: Think of it. Latino “anchor babies” raised here with “American Values” are feared and/or loathed now by many; others deem the term derrogatory or politically incorrect and, understandably, want laws to prevent discrimination.

Why do you guys fear brown people so? It’s amazing.

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

May 16th, 2012
5:54 pm

So why aren’t the consumers consuming?

It was answered here — I’m guessing you’re not aware of the shrinking middle class, number of people unemployed, and the overall wage stagnation of the middle class???? That whole spending binge of the 2000’s was done on credit, not wages and/or earnings….

But I would amend that it wasn’t just the spending of 2000s, it’s been the spending habits of a generation that finally culminated with mortgages companies urging consumers to use their abodes as ATM machines.

Mark in mid-town

May 16th, 2012
5:54 pm

Jay Bookman provides from Nick Hanauer:

“Since 1980 the share of income for the richest Americans has more than tripled while effective tax rates have declined by close to 50%.

If it were true that lower tax rates and more wealth for the wealthy would lead to more job creation, then today we would be drowning in jobs. And yet unemployment and under-employment is at record highs…”
———————————————————————————————
Let’s apply some scrutiny to that. We had some pretty extraordinary job growth from 1984 thru about 2000, probably the best on record for such a prolonged period of time. The largest growth in income share for the wealthy easily happened under Clinton, the 2nd most under Reagan. As well, I think the share of income for the wealthy increased about as much under Clinton as it did under Reagan, Bush I, Bush II and Obama combined. We had some pretty impressive job growth under both Clinton and Reagan. So somehow I doubt that the increase in income share for the wealthy has been what has caused job creation to be so poor during the current recovery from recession. Here is a link to different view of why job growth stinks and it’s from Home Depot co-founder Bernie Marcus: http://news.investors.com/article/611360/201205141814/cut-regulation-and-small-business-will-create-jobs.htm

Peter

May 16th, 2012
5:54 pm

So why aren’t the consumers consuming?

Perhaps all a licking their collective wounds after the implosion of the US while Bush was in office, and the cry of DEPRESSION was the case, and corporate America had to be bailed out, but family’s never got bailed out.only screwed.

Today the GOP doesn’t want to help family’s….. only corporate America…..like they did under Bush.and we see how that turned out.

Maybe a few have gotten smarter, saved more, and cut their expenses, and credit card bills ?

pogo

May 16th, 2012
5:55 pm

Yep, the “Greece card”. The new (or old, depending upon the intelligence of the person) liberal tactic is to belittle those annoying things that are real and contridictory to their iprogressive ideology. America’s “Greece”, California is already falling Jm. They had demonstrations within hours after their elected and very liberal leader Jerry Brown spoke the word “spending cuts”. That particular term is not to even be mentioned in the liberal mantra without fear of severe public disobedience. We have a nation that is populated by entitled peoples of all socio-economic levels who think they should not have to sacrifice anything for them to continue to live their lifestyles as they wish. And these people are not specific to the so-called “rich” or “1%”. The problem is, Jay and his progressive followers think that only 1% of this nation should pay and that everyone else should be entitled to whatever they want whenever they want it courtesy of the taxpayer. That is the thought process that they base entire elections upon. And so does Obama, but it is not working anymore.

Jimmy62

May 16th, 2012
5:55 pm

So according to this guy we should be helping the middle class. That’s great. So how come every left wing program in existence serves to take money from the middle class and give it to the poor?

barking frog

May 16th, 2012
5:55 pm

Byte Me
and zuck does not get
taxed on the value of
his stock because the
government chooses
to not tax that asset.
This needs to change.

ByteMe - Political thug

May 16th, 2012
5:56 pm

The new (or old, depending upon the intelligence of the person) liberal tactic is to belittle those annoying things that are real and contridictory to their iprogressive ideology

I see what you did there. You belittled those annoying things that are real and contradictory to your oppressive ideology. :)

Generation$crewed

May 16th, 2012
5:58 pm

ByteMe – Political thug
May 16th, 2012
5:52 pm

Who’s fault is the personal debt?

If they have been consuming why have the job numbers not reflected that spending?

How do either of those have anything to do with the top 1% tax rate?

Paul

May 16th, 2012
5:58 pm

Afternoon, Generation

“Is Hanauer blaming the consumers for the slow job growth?
I mean after all everyone has lower tax rates now, not just the rich but everyone is keeping more of their earned money. So why are they being greedy and not spending it?”

and your other question.

Can’t speak for him but my thoughts.

No, I don’t think he’s blaming consumers. He’s describing a cycle. There are inputs to segments, that segment leads to the next with its input and inputs from elsewhere. So it is not proper to ‘blame’ a segment. Each segment relies on many inputs to be successful. Many of those inputs are not under the control of those who comprise the segment.

People don’t spend for many reasons. One example: You have a job. Many of your friends and family lost theirs. You’re unsure about what the future holds. You decide to pay down your debt and not take on any new debt. Then things start to pick up – business orders are up, equipment’s being shipped. But you’re still wary. You get a tax cut. You keep paying down debt, not running up the credit cards, put some away to build up a cushion to protect yourself.

That’s probably the most obvious, and most often cited example, as it’s valid and many people can relate to it. It’s your place in the cycle and you and many others affect the next segment in the cycle, and on it goes.

Erwin's cat

May 16th, 2012
5:59 pm

i agree with the article that consumers drive our economy, been saying it….outside of taxing the rich did the article describe how to drive the consumers to consume?…did i miss it?

DebbieDoRight - A Pro Gay Rights Loving, Anti LimpBalls Hating, Feminazi!

May 16th, 2012
6:01 pm

Of course he never actually tells us what the War on Women is…..or how their rights are being infringed on by the religious groups, and MEN

Kyle is a master at camouflage. I visit his site sometimes — a lot of the posters who were banned on this blog are over there………egging each other on in their ignorance.

Brosephus™

May 16th, 2012
6:01 pm

Paul

I find it funny because those who berate me and others for our thinking are so effed up in who they uphold as somebody worthy to be a role model. Overall, it IS sad that some would look up to that kind of thinking though.

—————————-

So its the consumers fault who used credit to falsely keep the economy afloat with “fake” money?

Yes and no. If the consumers did not use credit to keep the economy afloat, we would have crashed and burned decades ago. The majority of the blame goes to those who’s policies has led to wage stagnation and dwindling job growth here in the US. The problem goes back beyond the 2000’s. The problems we’ve just seen had their seeds planted back in the 70’s and 80’s, IMHO.

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

May 16th, 2012
6:01 pm

Yep, the “Greece card”.

Perhaps if you would spend less time ogling the contents of other people’s grocery carts and what they are paying for in food stamps, you could educate yourself on the complex derivatives that Wall Street sold Greece prior to their collapse.

But that would mean that you turn to news outlets that report actual news rather than talking point.

Peter

May 16th, 2012
6:01 pm

How about everyone who owned a home before Bush has now lost 20% plus of their equity ?

perhaps after Bush….. American’s are scarred of what could happen next…..heck the next GOP president might start another war, and run up the deficit worse than Bush ?

pogo

May 16th, 2012
6:03 pm

As for Hanauer, why didn’t Jay just post something about what Chris Rock or David Letterman had to say about the rich not being job creators? He would have captured the same amount of creedence. Man, this is sad.

Paul

May 16th, 2012
6:03 pm

Erwin’s cat

I didn’t read it as dealing with that – more as addressing those who insist on calling people like Hanauer ‘job creators.’ It appeared more an effort by one whom Republicans would hold up as a premier job creator, base on his wealth, to say to Republican ‘you are not looking at this correctly, therefore the policies you are proposing are seriously flawed.’

Erwin's cat

May 16th, 2012
6:04 pm

my 5:59 is where I get stuck…consumers won’t consume w/o money and security that comes from having a job and a positive future outlook, but a job more importantly, companies won’t hire w/o consumer demand to support it…it’s a chicken and egg thing from what i can tell…a life cycle, but a vicious one at that…..taxing the consumer is counter productive

GT

May 16th, 2012
6:05 pm

Like Walmart sucked the life out of small town America, big business sucks any hope out of a creative America. Mass production even in our music. Every town has the same restaurants, banks and entertainment. The same way money is buying politics it is buying our lives. Company goes public and the caring goes with it. The less they care about humans the less they need humans, and the less there is a middle class. The Republicans talk about the Democrats being socialist. Go to your doctor or lawyer and tell me how much you feel like a number, it didn’t use to be that way. Isn’t that what we hate about so called socialism, we all are the same? That pretty much is what conservatives stand for, yet they get support from the very class of people they are destroying.

Paul

May 16th, 2012
6:05 pm

pogo

We get you don’t like that Hanauer challenged Republicans on their idea that rich people and businesses don’t create jobs. We get it. So tell us why Hanauer is mistaken.

Moderate Line

May 16th, 2012
6:06 pm

Since the recession revenues are down 14.6% and spending is up 21%. That is three years in the row revenues have been down and spending has been up in such a dramatic fashion. But yet job growth is anemic.

So if you believe government spending will produce jobs you are wrong. If you believe tax cuts will produce jobs you are wrong.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/omb

Paul

May 16th, 2012
6:06 pm

pogo

correction: We get you don’t like that Hanauer challenged Republicans on their idea that rich people and businesses create jobs.

pogo

May 16th, 2012
6:06 pm

What are those “actual news outlets” exactly? Do you know of any? I don’t.

As for the food carts, I will continue to “ogle” because it is my damned money paying for them and I see that I have every right to. How easy it must be not have a “vested interest”, so to speak. Since you spend hours upon hours here everyday I would say you don’t. You probably can make yourself believe that you do, can’t you?

Paul

May 16th, 2012
6:09 pm

Erwin’s cat

Did you see the part where Hanauer said hiring people is the absolute last thing most businesses will do? They do it only when they absolutely have to. It’s purely reactive. They do it only when they have to.

They do not, as many on the Right seem to portray, get a bunch of money, then say “I’m gonna hire a bunch of people and create jobs and the system will support them!!!”

Sarah Gee

May 16th, 2012
6:09 pm

Obama’s budget is so bad that NOT ONE democrat would vote for it. Can’t find that news in the new AJC and heaven knows Jay does not want to talk about it.

Erwin's cat

May 16th, 2012
6:09 pm

Paul I don’t care which direction the finger gets pointed…not taxing the rich doesn’t address the problem either and I wouldn’t summarily dismiss the rich as job creators…some do create jobs even if it’s a landscaper, but they aren’t part of the super rich crowd either

Lucifer

May 16th, 2012
6:10 pm

The rich in this country really don’t know how well off they are. However, if they continue to push the envelope with their greed in eliminating the middle class and enslaving the 99 percent to their whims, they better be prepared for revolution. We’re not talking Kent State here. We are talking about millions of disgruntled and previously spoiled and pampered middle-classers, who will prefer to fight than be reduced to groveling for food. You Koch Brothers and the rest of your ilk, you better change your ways or the empires that you have built over generations will be reduced to rubble by the rowdy rascals you seek to displace.

Erwin's cat

May 16th, 2012
6:11 pm

Paul, as I’ve said I am a big advocate of the consumer driven economy model…not sure it’s the best, model but it’s accurate today to me the casual observer

DebbieDoRight - A Pro Gay Rights Loving, Anti LimpBalls Hating, Feminazi!

May 16th, 2012
6:11 pm

As for the food carts, I will continue to “ogle” because it is my damned money paying for them and I see that I have every right to

how is it “your” money? And don’t you think it’s better to feed the poor, (like Jesus said), then the poor doing like the starving French did, and revolt and kill up a bunch of rich people (job creators)?

Thomas

May 16th, 2012
6:12 pm

“What does lead to more employment is a “circle of life”-like feedback loop between customers and businesses” ???? Really, please also share with us your banana pudding recipe as well.

It takes a sucker to pontificate on what is an obvious BS statement- so the business was created and owned by whom- business goblins?

“When you have a tax system in which most of the exemptions and the lowest rates benefit the richest”???? Versus the 14% of folks who are gov’t subsidized for work and the 50% who pay no federal income tax.

Obama $10 million and climing. He will easily surpass Gore and Clinton- keep following though.

simplify and broaden. the only thing holding the great American worker back is the igorant nut cases on the both extremes.

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

May 16th, 2012
6:12 pm

What are those “actual news outlets” exactly?

PBS’s Frontline did an episode on just this very issue. It wasn’t only Greece, but many municipalities in Europe and the U.S. including a much needed sewer project in Birmingham Ala.

Do you know of any?

See above.

I don’t.

That is painfully obvious, but I’ll act shocked and awed if it’ll make you feel any better.

:shock:

Brosephus™

May 16th, 2012
6:19 pm

because it is my damned money paying for them and I see that I have every right to

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

With all the millions and millions of taxpayers, you are able to track down the very tax dollars you pay. Gimme a effin’ break. Once that money leaves your possession, it is no longer yours.

Generation$crewed

May 16th, 2012
6:20 pm

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes
May 16th, 2012
5:54 pm

So how does raising taxes on only the rich help that?

How does low taxes result in a loss of middle class income or a stagnation?

Everyone’s taxes were lowered so how did that not give consumers more spending power? Should have kept consumption up. But many got greedy and consumed waaaay more than they could afford. Thus causing defaults and instead of steady growth for a long period the consumer decided on high growth for a short time, however at some point the tradeoff was a complete halt of non-necessity consumption in order to pay off for the time of greed.

So how were taxes responsible for that personal choice, that became a collective failure?

Erwin's cat

May 16th, 2012
6:21 pm

I just read the posts before I arrived to the party
Kam @5:54…well said

Paul

May 16th, 2012
6:21 pm

Erwin’s cat

“not taxing the rich doesn’t address the problem either and I wouldn’t summarily dismiss the rich as job creators”

I didn’t read it in the context of not taxing the rich solves problems. I read it as countering Republicans’ contention that raising the marginal rate by 4.5% or increasing cap gains tax will kill jobs.

I’ve picked that up about you – the consumer-driven economy model. So I’ll submit that current Republican advocacy specifically rejects that model, that it’s ‘rich job creators’ who drive the economy and if they can hold on to all their wealth they will use that wealth to hire people and drive the economy.

Hanauer’s thesis seems much closer to what you’ve advocated, as i read you both.

getalife

May 16th, 2012
6:22 pm

The gop are job killers.

Paul

May 16th, 2012
6:23 pm

Thomas

Care to post again?

This time with some actual, cogent arguments to refute what Hanauer said?

F. Sinkwich

May 16th, 2012
6:24 pm

Did this guilt-ridden, self-loathing lib ilk stroke an extra check to Uncle Sam?

Nope.

But he could use some therapy.

getalife

May 16th, 2012
6:25 pm

The gop are fighting against our recovery and the proof is another self inflicted attack on the debt to give us our second downgrade.

What good are they?

Brosephus™

May 16th, 2012
6:25 pm

How does low taxes result in a loss of middle class income or a stagnation?

Wage stagnation goes all the way back to the 70’s and has nothing to do with rates of taxation. Therefore low taxes does not have a thing to do with what you’re asking.

martin the calvinist

May 16th, 2012
6:26 pm

The Democrats are creators of gov’t dependent people….

stands for decibels

May 16th, 2012
6:26 pm

two things:

1. read the whole thing.

2. if you can’t do Item One above, read this, which isn’t in Jay’s pull-quote but worth remembering:

The annual earnings of people like me are hundreds, if not thousands, of times greater than those of the median American, but we don’t buy hundreds or thousands of times more stuff. My family owns three cars, not 3,000. I buy a few pairs of pants and a few shirts a year, just like most American men. Like everyone else, we go out to eat with friends and family only occasionally.

I can’t buy enough of anything to make up for the fact that millions of unemployed and underemployed Americans can’t buy any new clothes or cars or enjoy any meals out. Or to make up for the decreasing consumption of the vast majority of American families that are barely squeaking by, buried by spiraling costs and trapped by stagnant or declining wages.

Here’s an incredible fact. If the typical American family still got today the same share of income they earned in 1980, they would earn about 25% more and have an astounding $13,000 more a year. Where would the economy be if that were the case?

martin the calvinist

May 16th, 2012
6:28 pm

the economy is healthier when we as a nation of manufacturors. The fact is, we’ve been on a slow fade since Clinton signed Nafta in the early 90’s. We are too dependant on consumer spending as an economy.

Erwin's cat

May 16th, 2012
6:28 pm

Paul, I’ll submit though that consumers don’t consume w/o jobs…..so are jobs are the job creators….how F’d up is that?

stands for decibels

May 16th, 2012
6:29 pm

I will continue to “ogle” because it is my damned money paying for them

pogo, on those occasions when I willingly read your posts in hopes of seeing something truly a-holish from a stereotypical right winger, I am rarely disappointed. Kudos!

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

May 16th, 2012
6:31 pm

So how does raising taxes on only the rich help that?

I never said that it did, sport.

How does low taxes result in a loss of middle class income or a stagnation?

I believe that the initial tax cuts of the early 2000s were used not to consume more goods and services but to pay down debt.

Everyone’s taxes were lowered so how did that not give consumers more spending power?

See above.

Should have kept consumption up.

See above.

But many got greedy and consumed waaaay more than they could afford.

Absolutely.

Thus causing defaults and instead of steady growth for a long period the consumer decided on high growth for a short time…

That is the nature of a one time tax cut, the consumer uses the initial windfall to pay down debt, then a fancy mortgage broker comes along with a promise of refinancing their home at a lower rate and giving the poor shmuck $x to go out and buy that new bass boat.

So how were taxes responsible for that personal choice, that became a collective failure?

See above.

curious

May 16th, 2012
6:32 pm

Who crafted the automatic budget cuts that will kick in 1 jan 2013? Weren’t they the result of bipartisan agreement?

Why not let them happen? It’ll be painful, but at least they seemed to make all parts of the country get involved in solving this problem.

I contend that every $ spent helps creare jobs. Putting them under the mattress or in a Swiss bank account isn’t helping.

Erwin's cat

May 16th, 2012
6:33 pm

get – “What good are they?

ya can’t have up w/o down, left w/o right, black w/o white….water w/o carriers :D

JamVet

May 16th, 2012
6:33 pm

OK, faux conservative capitalists, answer this simple question.

From 2008 through 2011, who paid more in federal income taxes?

A) The teenage high school girl who made $1300 in babysitting each year.
B) General Electric, Boeing and Verizon Communications combined

Eugene Patrick Devany

May 16th, 2012
6:34 pm

“an ordinary middle-class consumer is far more of a job creator than a capitalist like me”, is brilliant. The tax code has redistributed income and wealth to the top for over 20 years and the middle class has lost much of its ability to ignite the economy.

Consider the 2-4-8 Tax Blend which can be described in one sentence. Tax individual and corporate income at a flat 8% rate (with no deductions, credits or loopholes), tax individual net wealth at 2% (excluding $15,000 cash and retirement funds) and impose a 4% Value Added Sales Tax (VAT) on business. The 2-4-8 Tax Blend has the lowest rates and will produce about $500 billion more than current federal revenue with no need for payroll, estate, and capital gains taxes or deferral of foreign income.

Eugene Patrick Devany, JD, MPA
http://www.TaxNetWealth.com

Hootinanny Yum Yum

May 16th, 2012
6:35 pm

So, if all the stimulus dollars had been given to consumers instead of building infrastructure and promoting green energy, the economy quite possibly would be cranking along even stronger right now.

I think that would have been a good thing. And, I would have liked to seen the stimulus returned to taxpayers based on the percentage they’ve paid taxes in the preceding five years.

Would have been very nice.

F. Sinkwich

May 16th, 2012
6:36 pm

“President Obama’s budget suffered a second embarrassing defeat Wednesday, when senators voted 99-0 to reject it. Coupled with the House’s rejection in March, 414-0, that means Mr. Obama’s budget has failed to win a single vote in support this year.”

Huh?

This can’t be true, is it?

Matti

May 16th, 2012
6:36 pm

So why aren’t the consumers consuming?

Years of caring for a family on stagnant wages and increasing costs of everything, combined with severe, worsening public negativity, limited job opportunities, and the prevalence of companies who slash personnel then demand people do more with less, all make me think this level of existence is really as good as it ever gets. Self deprivation gets easier, I suppose, or maybe I just don’t care anymore, now resigned to the overwhelming likelihood that — if I worked this many years and paid my bills and tried to make prudent decisions to only get this far — there’s just no point in imagining a future made brighter by some measure of financial independence, the illusion of security, or the opportunity to travel and enjoy life outside a cold, gray, over-air-conditioned cubicle. For my generation, the “golden years” are only a fantasy. Reality = do more with less, then do less with less, then get sick and spend the final months squabbling with blue cross ’till death eases the burden. None of this motivates me to run to the outlet mall or that awful worst-buy store. Maybe others feel differently.

Erwin's cat

May 16th, 2012
6:37 pm

Jam – A)
who employed more people A or B?

Paul

May 16th, 2012
6:37 pm

stands for decibels

Sounds like the guy has a conscience as well as a good sense of what drives the business cycle.

No wonder so many don’t understand what he’s saying.

Erwin’s cat

I’d say ‘a whole bunch!”

Spent some time with a young man who’s in college and still undecided about a career. Has some good options. I tried to gently steer him towards not just what he’s interested in, but what will likely give some surety of employment and lead to opportunities down the line.

I couldn’t be happier than if he were able to consume all kinds of stuff that his fellow citizens have created.

stands for decibels 6:29

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2E0CkSXKOfc#t=00m32s

F. Sinkwich

May 16th, 2012
6:38 pm

“A) The teenage high school girl who made $1300 in babysitting each year.”

She paid zero taxes. No FICA, Med, nothing.

Did I win?

St Simons - he-ne-ha

May 16th, 2012
6:38 pm

yes, of course. This is the crux of the obvious truth that supply-side
jaysus economics is a lie, and jobs, activity, all of it comes from
the demand side.

How bad an accountant would I be to advise any of my clients to
hire because youre rich & a job creator. Nooo, you hire as a last
resort because of demand. Of course you do. So the next time
you hear a walmart republican parroting some stupid talking point
off the radio about “yer punishin duh job creators,” you can know
absolutely they’re full of crap.

Paul

May 16th, 2012
6:41 pm

curious

“Who crafted the automatic budget cuts that will kick in 1 jan 2013? Weren’t they the result of bipartisan agreement?

Why not let them happen? It’ll be painful, but at least they seemed to make all parts of the country get involved in solving this problem.”

Yup. Bipartisan. Repubs and Dems couldn’t agree on reductions so agreed sequestrations would kick in.

Why not let them happen? Republicans are fighting it, hard. Why? I’d say because they’re not real big on accountability and keeping their word.

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

May 16th, 2012
6:41 pm

So, if all the stimulus dollars had been given to consumers instead of building infrastructure and promoting green energy, the economy quite possibly would be cranking along even stronger right now.

I can very well imagine the howls of poutrage resonating from the AM radio band about that big fat __________ lady standing in line at the store with her __________ kids all wearing the latest Nikes, talking on iphones and multiple carts loaded with cigarettes/beer/steaks/lobster all paid for with TAX PAYER DOLLARS!

JamVet

May 16th, 2012
6:41 pm

Cat, correct.

And how f&cking perverse is that, huh?

That that could exist in the United States of America!!

Some of these fat cats need to be taken out and shot.

JamVet

May 16th, 2012
6:42 pm

Along with their idiotic flunkies…

Mick

May 16th, 2012
6:43 pm

jay

Congratulations!

Very clever column indeed! Nice perspective of some real common sense, which, by the way, isn’t really too common these days as we can all plainly read right before our insightful eyes. You can lead a horse to water but…stubborn as a mule, stuck on stupid, it’s a cliche’s paradise of the bizarro! Still, just a wonderful world of whiners, what are you gonna do???

Erwin's cat

May 16th, 2012
6:45 pm

Jam – one could say that the corps that pay no taxes produce the middle class that does….even more perverse….but

Erwin's cat

May 16th, 2012
6:46 pm

that’s corporations not the Marines in “corps”

F. Sinkwich

May 16th, 2012
6:47 pm

“Some of these fat cats need to be taken out and shot.”

Jammie is a violent sort.

Imagine the brew-ha-ha if one suggested the same “justice” for moochers.

Jay would ban that one for life.

Lib ilk Jammie, just like that reprehensible bigot, Redneck, gets a free pass-a-roo.

No surprise.

Hootinanny Yum Yum

May 16th, 2012
6:48 pm

“I can very well imagine the howls of poutrage resonating from the AM radio band about that big fat __________ lady standing in line at the store with her __________ kids all wearing the latest Nikes, talking on iphones and multiple carts loaded with cigarettes/beer/steaks/lobster all paid for with TAX PAYER DOLLARS!”

All paid for by taxes returned to the taxpayers. Wouldn’t have heard a peep out of anyone. Maybe the citizens who didn’t pay taxes would have complained, but not the taxpayers.

JamVet

May 16th, 2012
6:50 pm

Cat, I am beyond sick of these Republican socialists and their Democratic allies and what they have done to this wonderful country.

And these gutless right wing f-nuts act so agog as to why hard working, tax paying Americans have take to the streets in protest????!!!!

And the friggin’ cowards are just gonna sit there and take it.

For what?

ANOTHER FORTY YEARS?!

Erwin's cat

May 16th, 2012
6:54 pm

Jam…life is too short to assign blame…lets get the donkey outta the ditch first…there’s always time for blame

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

May 16th, 2012
6:55 pm

All paid for by taxes returned to the taxpayers.

Funny, that’s how food stamps work and yet at least once a week someone here is citing the welfare queen in the grocery store as an example of waste.

Wouldn’t have heard a peep out of anyone.

Available evidence here proves otherwise.

Redneck Convert (R--and proud of it)

May 16th, 2012
6:59 pm

Lib ilk Jammie, just like that reprehensible bigot, Redneck, gets a free pass-a-roo.

Well, now that Sinkus is here I can call it a night. No need for two rednecks. Sinkus is a redneck too, only he uses big words.

Erwin's cat

May 16th, 2012
7:00 pm

so…is it all about the bubble?….is the econ bubble driven?….property, labor, gold, etc pick one?

Paul

May 16th, 2012
7:04 pm

“Sinkus is a redneck too, only he uses big words”

ilk?

Hootinanny Yum Yum

May 16th, 2012
7:06 pm

Regarding a comment I made on an earlier sheet of Jay’s.

For the second time this year, the President’s budget fails to pass the Senate.

I say, we clean out the Executive and Legislative branches of government and start over.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/blog/inside-politics/2012/may/16/obama-budget-defeated-99-0-senate/

St Simons - he-ne-ha

May 16th, 2012
7:08 pm

wow, you have to be thick-headed as a mule to remain on the wrong
side of this truth.

Hootinanny Yum Yum

May 16th, 2012
7:08 pm

No, Kammie. That’s not how it works.

Read the post. Taxpayer money back to taxpayers.

I know it’s difficult to focus. But try.

Critical thinking. It does a body good.

Hootinanny Yum Yum

May 16th, 2012
7:12 pm

Kammie,

I know it’s not Friday, but your posts just bring this song to mind.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Lx52sBLtKI

JamVet

May 16th, 2012
7:13 pm

Yum, I’m kinda wading in mid-stream here, but are you positing that those absurd little tax “breaks” for us working stiffs amounted to a hill of beans?

We both know who got the lion’s share of those breaks.

The professional tax avoiders and dodgers at the top of the food chain, yes?

Jm

May 16th, 2012
7:16 pm

“California was doing just fine, with a big ole surplus under Governor Gray”

Um. Lie.

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

May 16th, 2012
7:17 pm

That’s not how it works.

Read the post. Taxpayer money back to taxpayers.

Food stamps go back to stores.

Is it your contention that the stores and their employees along with the vendors (and their employees) whose goods are paid for by those food stamps aren’t taxpayers?

Critical thinking, it does a body good.

F. Sinkwich

May 16th, 2012
7:17 pm

“We both know who got the lion’s share of those breaks.”

The 47% of wage earners who pay zero federal income tax?

Them?

I thought so.

Bummer.

Jm

May 16th, 2012
7:21 pm

Bro
“Wanna talk about how many jobs he created? He didn’t do anything other than invest money. That’s just like saying that the winner of the MegaMillions created jobs by putting money into the lottery pool.”

Capital intensive businesses require: capital

If its so simple, please go form a bank and make loans, go build an office building, a power plant, or a dot com with hundreds of employees, without money, just your labor

Sorry bro, you win dumbest post of the day

Hootinanny Yum Yum

May 16th, 2012
7:22 pm

JamVet, you might be.

My premise is that rather than pump massive tax dollars into infrastructure and green energy (or any other shovel ready project on the books); we would have been better served by giving all that money back to taxpayers that actually paid taxes. Base the percentage of the whole enchilada returned to a particular taxpayer on how what percentage of income taxes a person actually paid.

Those at the top that avoided paying taxes and those at the bottom who didn’t pay income tax would get zip.

Give it back to the middle class. But hey; it’s really just a moot point.

JamVet

May 16th, 2012
7:22 pm

Hootinanny Yum Yum

May 16th, 2012
7:24 pm

Kammie, spin it any way you want. It’s still a turd sandwich.

godless heathen

May 16th, 2012
7:25 pm

“Anyone who’s ever run a business knows that hiring more people is a capitalist’s course of last resort, something we do only when increasing customer demand requires it. In this sense, calling ourselves job creators isn’t just inaccurate, it’s disingenuous.”

Yet many progressives here will continue to whine that corps are sitting on their money instead of hiring people. Like business is some jobs program. Why hire people if you don’t need them to make money?

Hootinanny Yum Yum

May 16th, 2012
7:26 pm

Hey, who took a snapshot of me…?

http://tinyurl.com/clz9rxf

Jm

May 16th, 2012
7:26 pm

Mark 5:54 don’t confuse the liberals with facts please

Tom(Independent-Viet Vet USAF)

May 16th, 2012
7:26 pm

Look, Obama has had 3 1/2 yrs and it is not working.Let’s give Romney the opportunity now. Romney’s policies may not work also, but it can be no worst than Obama’s. If Romney’s does not work, then try someone new next in line. Eventually someone will be successful, probably not in this retiree’s life though?

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

May 16th, 2012
7:27 pm

It’s still a turd sandwich.

I knew that you didn’t have the critical thinking skills, sport.

You just won me a ten spot.

barking frog

May 16th, 2012
7:28 pm

Enter your comments here

tireofit

May 16th, 2012
7:30 pm

To all of you who are so concerned how much the very rich for taxes, I have one question, seriously, why do you care???? What else concerns you as much?

Don't let the door hit you...

May 16th, 2012
7:31 pm

jm
May 16th, 2012
4:41 pm
Facebook Co-Founder May Gain Choosing Singapore Over U.S.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-05-12/facebook-co-founder-may-gain-choosing-singapore-over-u-s-.html
oops. guess this Jay blog post is already toast

Funny how the cons don’t see this guy as a turncoat traitor, or un-american. Just shows they are like the four–year-olds in Time Magazine sucking on the teet of their corporate masters.

Hootinanny Yum Yum

May 16th, 2012
7:32 pm

Sometimes it requires critical thinking to admit it’s just a turd sandwich. Too many times, we continue to throw money at a problem that’s not going to get better.

And, it makes me all warm and fuzzy to think I helped increase your net worth.

By the way, I still love it when you say “sport”. I get all goose pimply. Kind of reminds of Thurston Howell III from Gilligan’s Island.

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

May 16th, 2012
7:32 pm

To all of you who are so concerned how much the very rich for taxes… [...] What else concerns you as much?

Proper sentence structure immediately leaps to mind.

Doggone/GA

May 16th, 2012
7:33 pm

“Yet many progressives here will continue to whine that corps are sitting on their money instead of hiring people”

Nope. Try again.

JamVet

May 16th, 2012
7:33 pm

Yum, sounds good in theory, but I believe it is a band aid on a hemorrhaging patient.

A few more hundred bucks is gonna mean diddly squat to the average American man with a wife and two kids who pays $1850 for his family health insurance. Like the self-employed professional photographer I met last night.

Wages in this country have been crushed for 40 years. And now a huge percentage of Americans cannot even keep up.

The result of Reaganomics and his very successful efforts to destroy the only two voices with any power who will stand up for working Americans.

So now we have dozens and dozens of Fortune 1000 corporations, making record profits – to the tune of BILLIONS of dollars per year – and who pay not one thin dime in federal income tax in any given year.

Yet the immoral Republican idiots and here, b*tch endlessly about the 47% who average a pitiful $32,400 per year. To divvy up between several household members!

Go figure…

F. Sinkwich

May 16th, 2012
7:34 pm

Poor Jammie.

It must be very difficult going through life blaming your failure as an individual and a citizen on mythical bogeymen rather than looking in the mirror and accepting inevitable personal defeat due to your poor life choices and low self-esteem.

JamVet

May 16th, 2012
7:35 pm

how much the very rich for taxes, I have one question, seriously, why do you care????

JUSTICE.

You should read up on it sometime. It’s really good stuff!