Why Wall Street execs want to silence their shareholders

Last year, the Securities and Exchange Commission approved a new “say on pay” policy that allows shareholders to vote on the pay package for a company’s top executives.

You wouldn’t think that would be a particularly controversial measure. For one thing, the vote isn’t even binding; it is advisory only. And shouldn’t shareholders — the people who actually own a company — be allowed to at least voice an opinion about how their own top employees are paid? Surely that is consistent with free-enterprise market principles, right?

Republicans, however, have fought the measure tooth and nail. It was approved by the SEC by a party-line 3-2 vote, with Republican appointees to the panel trying vainly to delay, weaken or kill it. They also fought it in Congress, voting against “say on pay” in party-line votes in 2009, back when Democrats still had enough votes to pass it.

As the Chicago Tribune reported back then:

“Rep. Pete Sessions (R-Texas), in a comment echoed by fellow Republicans, assailed the (say-on-pay) measure as “unprecedented government intervention in the free enterprise system.”

“This bill is an invitation for political meddling at its worst in the private confines of companies that are trying to work hard to create jobs,” complained Rep. Peter J. Roskam (R-Ill.)

I find those complaints hard to fathom. It is government interference to give the owners of a company a voice — a non-binding voice! — in what its executives are paid?

This week, we got a chance to see the rule in action, and also to see why Republicans continue to fight it so hard. Shareholders at Citigroup, one of the 10 largest banks in the world, voted 55-45 percent on Tuesday to object to the pay packages granted to CEO Vikram Pandit, as well as to bonus and compensation packages for other top executives. By one count, Pandit collected as much as $49 million in pay, stock options, retention bonuses and other compensation last year, even though the company’s performance has lagged.

The Citigroup investor rebellion came after the nation’s largest corporate-governance experts, Institutional Shareholder Services and Glass Lewis & Co., both recommended against approval of the pay package on grounds that it was too generous and wasn’t linked to company performance.

Glass Lewis, for example, gave the company’s executive pay plan an “F”, explaining:

“Having repaid its TARP funds in 2010, the Company was not subject to restrictions governing the structure of compensation paid to its highest-paid executives during 2011. In turn, the Company has implemented incentive plans rampant with significant issues that, in our opinion, warrant shareholder attention. It is clear to us that the Company has squandered the opportunity to form well-designed, objective incentive plans at the lifting of TARP restrictions, opting instead for often discretionary awards that may qualify as a misuse of company capital.”

In other words, the executives were paying themselves more than they were worth and more than they had earned. (When Pandit became CEO in December 2007, Citigroup was selling at a little over $300 a share. Yesterday it closed at $35.08 a share.)

It’s going to be interesting to see what happens now. According to ISS, only 2 percent of executive pay packages were rejected by shareholders last year, so the action by Citigroup investors is pretty noteworthy, suggesting it’s an egregious case. On the other hand, because the Tuesday vote was non-binding, Pandit and Citigroup’s board of directors are under no legal obligation to honor it.

In addition, pay packages for other major Wall Street firms are also coming up for shareholder review, and those companies are also probably nervous about a shareholder revolt.

All of this strikes me as a very good thing. This is not government interference in free markets; this is stockholders regaining just the slightest bit of control over their own property. And it is almost inexplicable to me that Republicans view it as a bad thing.

I say “almost inexplicable,” because blind loyalty to the top 0.001 percent is the only explanation I can offer. If you have a better one, please, let’s hear it.

– Jay Bookman

946 comments Add your comment

Keep Up the Good Fight!

April 19th, 2012
9:12 am

It is simply stupifying that there is opposition to this at any grassroots level. Corporate leaders are beginning to see a revolt by shareholders against their greed.

Maximum

April 19th, 2012
9:12 am

“Corporations are people, my friend.”

They are job creators, for sure. These are boom times for low wage child labor in the developing world, as US multinationals outsource the American Dream.
.

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
9:16 am

blind loyalty to the top 0.001 percent is the only explanation I can offer. If you have a better one, please, let’s hear it.

here ya go:

Money = speech

Actual speech = something else.

Thomas

April 19th, 2012
9:16 am

All shareholders should get a vote on matters such as often very egregious exec comp. Keep in mind they often can vote the loudest possible by selling the shares.

Taxpayers should be able vote on Congress pay, no?

ty webb

April 19th, 2012
9:18 am

what’s the point?…symbolism? just what we need, more nonbinding measures.

massachusetts refugee thug

April 19th, 2012
9:19 am

it’s like that old vulcan proverb – “we’re all for free market principles, except when we’re not.”

Mick

April 19th, 2012
9:19 am

Nice column, didn’t know that was happening. More power to the people -right on…

Jay

April 19th, 2012
9:20 am

“Taxpayers should be able vote on Congress pay, no?”

So Thomas, you propose that we abandon the republic model and go straight to pure democracy?

F. Sinkwich

April 19th, 2012
9:20 am

“And shouldn’t shareholders — the people who actually own a company — be allowed to at least voice an opinion about how their own top employees are paid? ”

They do already, Jay. Why didn’t you point that out?

They can vote out the Board of Directors or simply sell their stock in protest.

The SEC has NO business mucking around making up stupid rules like this one.

Jay

April 19th, 2012
9:22 am

“They can vote out the Board of Directors or simply sell their stock in protest.”

That might be one reason that Citigroup stock has fallen from $300 to $35. And still the message hasn’t gotten through; still the ransacking continues.

Fly-on-the-Wall

April 19th, 2012
9:22 am

Ty, symbolism maybe but it is important symbolism. In the past share holders couldn’t even get the chance to have a voice/vote like this. At least this way the shareholders of the company can tell the management that they think the compensation plan sucks.

Fly-on-the-Wall

April 19th, 2012
9:24 am

Sinkwich – yes the government should be doing this because up until now the PEOPLE who own shares in the COMPANY couldn’t do anything about it. Now they at least have the right to vote.

Concerned Mother

April 19th, 2012
9:24 am

Off topic/subject

Warren Buffett shed light on a problem that plagues our economy: Many of the wealthiest people pay a lower tax rate than middle class families. Unfair, and even counter-productive, tax breaks for corporations and the very wealthy shortchange needed investments for women and their families.

Women have a particular stake in ensuring that those with the greatest ability to pay contribute their fair share of taxes. Taxes provide the revenues needed to protect and strengthen programs vital to women and their families at every stage of their lives, including programs to protect our health, access higher education, obtain quality child care, meet basic needs, and achieve a secure retirement. But current unfair tax preferences for the very wealthy and corporations shortchange needed investments in critical programs. This year, for example, millionaires will receive an average tax cut of $143,000 as a result of tax cuts enacted since 2001: an amount that could send 18 children to Head Start, or provide child care assistance to 24 children, or help 37 students attend college with Pell Grants, or deliver a meal a day for a year to 249 seniors, or provide 551 people with family planning services. (4)

Investments in programs that could help millions of Americans still struggling to get back on their feet have been frozen or cut in the name of deficit reduction, and deeper cuts are scheduled. While long-term deficit reduction is needed, the burden of deficit reduction so far has fallen entirely on the spending side of the budget.

The very wealthiest Americans have not been required to contribute a penny in additional revenues, even though their incomes have soared and tax cuts that disproportionately benefit the wealthiest are a major cause of the nation’s large and growing debt.

This is flat out unfair.

Thomas

April 19th, 2012
9:25 am

So Thomas, you propose that we abandon the republic model and go straight to pure democracy

Interesting leap which is rather non sensical.

Butch Cassidy

April 19th, 2012
9:26 am

Jay – “When Pandit became CEO in December 2007, Citigroup was selling at a little over $300 a share.”

Aaand that’s why in November 2007, I cashed out virtually all my Citi stock. Pandit is an ass, and is HIGHLY overated as a CEO. However, his arrival is what prompted me to get out of the money game and leave Citi in July of 2008, and I haven’t looked back. Maybe I should send him a thank you card? :)

Fly-on-the-Wall

April 19th, 2012
9:26 am

Voting out the Board is next to impossible unless the large institutional share holders join in. My guess would be that if those large institutional holders knew that the rest of the share holders weren’t happy then they might look at the pay issue but up until now they haven’t done that because they haven’t been able to hear from the rest of us.

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
9:28 am

what’s the point?…symbolism? just what we need, more nonbinding measures.

Nope. I’d go with Thomas’ suggestion. If they voice their displeasure with a non-binding vote and the board still gives them the pay packages anyway, then you sell your shares. If the board does not want to listen to the shareholders, then why be one in the first place. I think that is what Republicans fear. Imagine the panic that would grip Wall Street if shareholders start dropping shares when their objections are ignored.

JohnnyReb

April 19th, 2012
9:28 am

Republican opposition is not that we agree with uncontrolled executive pay. Instead, opposition is against government intervention. Keep the camel’s nose from under the tent.

Corporations have Board of Directors who are voted in annually by shareholders. The board is the place for shareholders to steer the company, not through another government regulation.

Lyman Hall

April 19th, 2012
9:29 am

No one puts a gun to CitiBank stockholders and forces them to invest.
.
Unlike the 100 million working Americans that are forced to bankroll the Federal Government Pension Nazis,

TGT

April 19th, 2012
9:31 am

So I suppose Jay is also opposed to union leaders trying to silence the voice of employees via the secret ballot, right?

JohnnyReb

April 19th, 2012
9:32 am

The bigger story is that too much of the economy now goes through about 4 or 5 major banks.

Obama’s fix has resulted in truly creating banks too big to fail.

Not only shareholders, but all citizens should be demanding the big banks be broken up so that should one fail the economy will survive without taxpayers again bailing it/them out.

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
9:33 am

Hi, Lyman!

I’m still waiting on those Obama stump speeches where, as you had claimed, he campaigned for the legalization of pot.

Find any yet?

Paul

April 19th, 2012
9:33 am

Jay

I think I’ll have to see if Rep Sessions is going to hold a town hall meeting near me. Mind if I use your words without attribution so he can’t go off with an answer about the liberal media?

(His Dallas-area district is home to a number of corporate headquarters. Small wonder he bows to them).

Thomas

You might want to learn about the differences between a republic and a ‘pure democracy’ before posting anything else on the subject -

Jay

April 19th, 2012
9:35 am

“Not only shareholders, but all citizens should be demanding the big banks be broken up so that should one fail the economy will survive without taxpayers again bailing it/them out.

I agree, JohnnyReb. That’s the approach that many Democrats wanted to take, but the Republicans threw a hissy fit and refused to allow it.

Fly-on-the-Wall

April 19th, 2012
9:36 am

Government intervention – my foot! Geez, the government allows people to VOTE and the cons complain. I don’t call that intervention I call it fixing a problem that needed to be fixed.

Jay

April 19th, 2012
9:36 am

So I suppose Jay is also opposed to union leaders trying to silence the voice of employees via the secret ballot, right?

TGT, if you’re asking whether I’m opposed to the card-check system as opposed to secret balloting, yes I am and have said so on this blog.

kayaker 71

April 19th, 2012
9:37 am

Bookman,

You fail to mention that Pandit was paid at the rate of only $1/yr as salary for two years prior to this vote. If you figure the 15M spread out over 5 yrs, 5m/yr is not bad compensation. As you say, the shareholders vote is only advisory. The Board has no obligation to follow it.

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
9:37 am

yes I am and have said so on this blog.

and I give Jay crap for it every. single. time.

right Jay?

carlosgvv

April 19th, 2012
9:38 am

Republicans do not oppose this because of any blind loyalty. I can assure you they clearly know where all their election and re-election funding comes from and will defend the financial greed of their corporate masters any way and every way they can. They make no effort at all to hide this. And yet, millions and millons of Americans still slavishly defend these bought and paid for politicians. That, I admit, is totally beyond my comprehension.

Paul

April 19th, 2012
9:38 am

silly stands for decibels

Sources? Cites? That’s not the point. You’re just supposed to type whatever gives you a warm, fuzzy feeling and gets you the most attention, then you move on and do it again!

mm

April 19th, 2012
9:38 am

“The SEC has NO business mucking around making up stupid rules like this one.”

No suprise there. If Jay said the sky was blue, we’d see some truly stupid arguments from the right.

ty webb

April 19th, 2012
9:39 am

Fly-on-the wall,
the shareholders already get a vote(the board of directors), if the Board isn’t serving them well, then they can change it…or drop their shares.

HDB

April 19th, 2012
9:39 am

JohnnyReb

April 19th, 2012
9:32 am
The bigger story is that too much of the economy now goes through about 4 or 5 major banks.

Obama’s fix has resulted in truly creating banks too big to fail.”

“Too big to fail” was done under the auspices of Henry Paulson, Ben Bernanke, and Timothy Geitner during the BUSH Adminstration! You need to check out Andrew Ross Sorkin’s book/movie “Too Big to Fail” to know the facts!!

Joseph

April 19th, 2012
9:40 am

Still beating the class warfare drum Jay… That dog is tired….

Butch Cassidy

April 19th, 2012
9:40 am

JohnnyReb – “Obama’s fix has resulted in truly creating banks too big to fail.”

Except that it was Bush in October 2008 who signed TARP in order to right the financial ship. At that time, Banks that were already considered too big to fail became even bigger due to the infusion of cash from TARP.

Facts are your friend, don’t fear them.

Paul

April 19th, 2012
9:40 am

kayaker 71

And why was he paid a dollar a year? Because he was donating the rest to charity? Because he was voluntarily setting himself up as a beacon of restraint for other companies?

Or was it because his performance dictated something else?

mm

April 19th, 2012
9:42 am

” If you figure the 15M spread out over 5 yrs, 5m/yr is not bad compensation”

What a stretch. Obviously, you know that is not what really happened. But truth to a con is like antibiotics to a germ.

mm

April 19th, 2012
9:42 am

We need to win the war on cons.

ByteMe - Political thug for sale

April 19th, 2012
9:43 am

For those of you who haven’t been on the inside of this, here’s how the executive compensation game is played rigged:

The board of directors — men and women brought on board often by other directors — forms an executive compensation committee. The committee then hires an executive compensation consultant, who is paid by the company and is kept around only at the discretion of the board of directors (the same people whose pay they are consulting on). The executive compensation consultant usually works for a large firm that does other HR consulting that they’d love to do at that company, so there’s a bit of a conflict of interest going on.

The compensation executive devises a plan for compensation: the compensation of the executives is tied to the average of executive pay at the 5-10 largest similar firms. That’s so that the plan is “competitive” with those other firms who might not be competing to hire these incompetent buffoons, but that’s not considered.

The board loves this plan, of course, so they implement it. Now this firm is paying its executives in the top 5 or 10 (because the average would be in the middle of that), so the lowest of the top 5 or 10 drops out of the list for the moment… until the next time their compensation comes up for review and then they’ll do the same thing.

This is how executive compensation keeps going up at the highest levels even if it’s not tied to performance or pretty much anything other than a competition between the largest firms to see who can pay their executives the most.

If you are a shareholder and this is what is happening at a company you own, vote out every member of the compensation committee until they change the game.

Paul

April 19th, 2012
9:43 am

Butch Cassidy 9:40

Please don’t do that. JohnnyReb was already gasping from finding out Jay agreed with his plan, as did Congressional Democrats, but Republicans blocked it.

I fear your post may have pushed him over the edge with a heart attack!

JohnnyReb – you okay?!!?

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
9:44 am

You’re just supposed to type whatever gives you a warm, fuzzy feeling

Or one could admit one was w-r-o-n-g… so guys like me stop bugging one about one’s wrongidity.

barking frog

April 19th, 2012
9:44 am

Government sponsored
robber barons still going
strong.

TGT

April 19th, 2012
9:44 am

Good for you Jay! Just making sure you were being consistant. (I don’t read your every post.)

Jay

April 19th, 2012
9:46 am

You fail to mention that Pandit was paid at the rate of only $1/yr as salary for two years prior to this vote.

And you, kayaker, fail to point out that Citigroup bought out Pandit’s hedge fund company for $800 million and then shut that company down because it was losing them money. It wrote off that $800 million as a loss.

Pandit, however, made out like a bandit. In 2011 alone, Citi paid Pandit $80 million as part of that deal.

So his altruistic little $1 salary is more than a little misleading, don’t you think?,

TGT

April 19th, 2012
9:46 am

Excuse me, consistent.

stevie ray...clowns to the left, jokers to the right..here I am...

April 19th, 2012
9:47 am

Jay,

One of the most popular rights shareholders practice (more than they probably should) is Directors and Officers suits….these come in two forms..first and most prevelant is derivative actions related to drop in stock…a boon for lawyers as very expensive to litigate. The other less popular is actions against D&O’s for mismanagement and not acting in best interest of shareholders….this can be very powerful tool against indiotic rogue C-suite folks who need liability coverage for these exposures and won’t get same with such selfish actions…

Jefferson

April 19th, 2012
9:48 am

Regulate public companies pay and make dividends a priority with profits, private owned companies should do as they wish as long as it is legal.

Rightwing Troll

April 19th, 2012
9:48 am

If Jay or Obama said “the sky is blue”… the tards would be jumping up and down insisting it was purple…

Rightwing Troll

April 19th, 2012
9:50 am

But, but… job creators… marxist kenyan… socialist…. Obama wants to take your guns…

Talking Head

April 19th, 2012
9:52 am

I wouldn’t categorize this as government interference into a private buisness just yet, although this action by the SEC is heading in that direction. Obviously as Jay pointed out this is just an ‘advisory’ vote and has no binding action. However this should give the C-suite of a company a heads up on how they are perceived by the rest of the company. Ultimately the C-suite executives will decide what they should get paid, and the board of directors will either approve or disapprove their requests.

If the SEC tries to mandate a vote to determine executive pay, then I will have a problem because government will then be infringing on a private buisness.

In other news

April 19th, 2012
9:52 am

Jay has never owned and operated a business

Jay has never dealt with a payroll

Jay does not have any money in the stock market

Jay continues to make up diversions and excuses for the dog eating president

Butch Cassidy

April 19th, 2012
9:53 am

Strange, I don’t recall any Right Wing howling in 1984 (when Reagen was President) when the government stepped in and broke up the Bell system.

stevie ray...clowns to the left, jokers to the right..here I am...

April 19th, 2012
9:53 am

TROLL,

If you are going to be master of the obvious, you may want to also suggest the same goes for the “tards” on the left saying black when “tards” on right say white….

Soothsayer

April 19th, 2012
9:54 am

Well, Jay, $49,000,000.00 doesn’t go as far as it used to!

In other news

April 19th, 2012
9:55 am

I don’t recall Jay being upset at Wall Street donors who gave money to Obama. I don’t recall Jay being upset that BP gave more money to Obama than any other candidate.

Selective outrage is Jay’s middle name. Well that, and Jay “I suck on tv when a mangirl interviews me Bookman.”

Paul

April 19th, 2012
9:56 am

Butch Cassidy

It’s like Rightwing Troll said – Reagan wasn’t a marxist socialist Kenyan Muslim who wanted to take away guns -

Generation$crewed

April 19th, 2012
9:57 am

What is the big deal?

Its a non-binding vote. Hell we as citizens have been taking non-binding votes for a while in the form of polls. It seems the people have spoken over and over again that as a group we hate how congress works(look at the polls favorability ratings).

But with bad poll after bad poll have we seen congress change? NO

So I guess my question is other than political partisan blogs and political fundraisers what is the actual point of having these votes? Since it is non-binding and all kinda like a poll

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
9:57 am

Talking Head

Might wanna check with others here on the Right. Some have already thrown the government interference flag…

Butch Cassidy

April 19th, 2012
9:57 am

Talking Head – “If the SEC tries to mandate a vote to determine executive pay, then I will have a problem because government will then be infringing on a private buisness.”

First, Mom and Pops and LLC’s are “private businesses”. Anything involving shareholders are public entities and should be regulated.

Second. Have you recoverd yet from the break up of AT&T under Reagan?

Joe the Prophet

April 19th, 2012
9:58 am

My old party, the Republicans, should go back and read Matthew 7, all of it…particularly 16:end…..Then they should read Mark 11: 15-19…….

Guidance for this year’s election is there for us ALL to witness…!!!! Just ask Boehner…!!!!!

barking frog

April 19th, 2012
10:00 am

Corporations are created
by government charter.
When disputes arise they
are settled in government
courts. When they get in
trouble they seek
government bankruptcy
protection or government
loans. What is private about
this enterprise?

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
10:00 am

“Some have already thrown the government interference flag…”

And this is a classic example of: “government steps in when the private sector fails to step up”

kayaker 71

April 19th, 2012
10:03 am

Bookman, 9:46,

Pandit’s hedge fund is a separate issue. We are talking about CEO compensation and shareholder votes, nothing else. Pandit took a $1/yr salary for two years as a pledge to the Board and the shareholders that he would reject compensation until the company gained profitability. When the company showed five straight quarters of profitability, his compensation package was raised considerably. Pandit joined Citigroup in Dec 2007. If you spread out that compensation package of 15M, that’s only 3M and change/yr as salary. The decision to buy Pandit’s hedge fund, however, was not a condition of hire. Citigroup stated at the time that it was investing in the venture because it saw a significant alternative to traditional investing. BTW, your old liberal buddy, Robert Rubin was a Citi board member a the time and was the ramrod behind the purchase.

JohnnyReb

April 19th, 2012
10:03 am

JohnnyReb is alive and well, thank you. I have to puntucate my blogging with work.

I trully don’t know who is to blame for allowing a concentration of big banks – if Jay says Repbulicans opposed a break up, I believe him. I don’t recall every stating Republicans are always correct.

I do know the majority of recovery has been under Obama. And, in my opinion the concentration of banks is a more serious problem than executive pay, credit card rules, or whatever Dodd-Frank may have or will do.

Recon 0311 2533

April 19th, 2012
10:04 am

Meanwhile new unemployment filings disappoint expectations. The fell from 388,000 to 366,000 but only a sleight drop. They were expected to drop by over 10,000. 45% of the unemployed have remained so for over six months. Not a good outlook for new job creation.

In other news

April 19th, 2012
10:04 am

If I had a dog it would look like the one Obama ate.

USinUK - ex-pat thug

April 19th, 2012
10:04 am

“Still beating the class warfare drum Jay… That dog is tired….”

bollocks.

he’s beating the DEMOCRACY drum …

no wonder you’re tone-deaf to it

In other news

April 19th, 2012
10:06 am

“That dog is tired….”

Did he eat the tired dog?

Paul

April 19th, 2012
10:06 am

JohnnyReb

You’re not only well, you’re thriving!

JohnnyReb

April 19th, 2012
10:06 am

BTW – the feds don’t have to dictate specifics of a bank breakup. All they need to do is insist it ocuurs with an outcome that spreads risk over a wider base.

Ayn Rant

April 19th, 2012
10:07 am

Of course, shareholders should have a say in selecting and compensating the CEO and Board members. Eliminating proxy votes by company executives would also be a useful step.

The overpaid, underperforming CEOs of Big Business are financial manipulators, not entrepreneurs, industrialist, or inventors. Their outrageous compensation and benefits are a form of asset-stripping of American business: the funds could be put to better use for research and development of new products and services.

Scandalously, exorbitant CEO compensation and benefits are subsidized by the taxpayers, as tax-deductible business expenses.

Let’s tax the scoundrels fairly by bringing back the 70% top tax bracket that was in effect during the periods of greatest economic growth in our history!

mm

April 19th, 2012
10:07 am

The game is definitely rigged. Most of the board members are CEO’s for other companies.

EJ Moosa

April 19th, 2012
10:08 am

Meanwhile, unemployment numbers are rising, and instead of addressing the anemic recovery of Obama, you want to address an issue that the shareholders have addressed on their own.

At least we will have change we can believe in come November.

Your guy has already lost the election. You better start figuring out ways to minimize your losses in the Houes and the Senate.

http://www.nolanchart.com/article9563-obamas-goose-is-cooked.html

Adam

April 19th, 2012
10:08 am

Did anyone yell wealth envy yet? Or did that one die once Mitt used it ineffectively?

stevie ray...clowns to the left, jokers to the right..here I am...

April 19th, 2012
10:08 am

JOE PROPHET,

The bible…REALLY?

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
10:08 am

And this is a classic example of: “government steps in when the private sector fails to step up”

You and I both know that. I find it quite amusing AND predictable that the private sector cheerleaders never acknowledge their “team’s” failure that causes the government intervention. :)

In other news

April 19th, 2012
10:09 am

“Meanwhile, unemployment numbers are rising”

But Jay said it was getting better. It must be true because Jay says so.

USinUK - ex-pat thug

April 19th, 2012
10:09 am

oh, and by the way …

HI PEEPS!!!

Jay

April 19th, 2012
10:09 am

“Pandit’s hedge fund is a separate issue. We are talking about CEO compensation and shareholder votes, nothing else.

Wrong. Personally, I’d be more than willing to take a $1 annual salary if you also agreed to pay $800 million for my money-losing hedge-fund operation.

For one thing, the $1 would be taxed as earned income while my share of that $800 million would be a capital gain and taxed much lower.

SWEEEETTT!

Paul

April 19th, 2012
10:09 am

USinUK

HI! Was just thinking about sending you a Google mail to say, ‘come home, oh lost one…. we miss your wit and your recipes!”

getakife

April 19th, 2012
10:09 am

It disrupts their precious pay.

Those poor billionaires.

JohnnyReb

April 19th, 2012
10:09 am

Executive pay has a way of correcting itself. The correction often occurs after the fact, but it does occur. Look no further than our own Delta Air Lines. Back when Mullin was in control, the bonus rules for executives were changed to break the tie to results – that resulted in executives receiving bonuses while the company went into the toilet. Where is Mullin and his minons now?

kayaker 71

April 19th, 2012
10:10 am

In other news, 10:04,

Best post of the day.

Butch Cassidy

April 19th, 2012
10:10 am

JohnnyReb – “I trully don’t know who is to blame for allowing a concentration of big banks”

I’ll be happy to to tell you. It was Paulsen, Geithner, Bernake, and to a large extent the Bush Administration. During the meltdown, Lehman Brothers was allowed to collapse, as well as Bear Sterns. Merrill Lynch was acquired by Bank of America as was CountryWide. The larger banks had to absorb the smaller ones to ensure that the assets remained in tact so that they could continue lending. TARP was created in order to achieve this goal. Thus, where there used to be 16 to 20 banks, we were left with a much smaller number that were now even bigger in size and assets. Hence, thanks to the Bush Administration and TARP, we ended up with TOO BIG TO FAIL.

Hope that helps, and doesn’t in anyway diminish your blind loyalty to the Republican party.

USinUK - ex-pat thug

April 19th, 2012
10:10 am

“I find it quite amusing AND predictable that the private sector cheerleaders never acknowledge their “team’s” failure that causes the government intervention”

but … but … but … the market will ALWAYS right itself … right ??? ummm … hello … ?? anyone???

Paul

April 19th, 2012
10:11 am

(USinUK – on this blog, it’s “hi perps” not “hi peeps”… or maybe pervs…. that works, too….)

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
10:11 am

“I find it quite amusing AND predictable that the private sector cheerleaders never acknowledge their “team’s” failure that causes the government intervention”

Yep!

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
10:12 am

Mmmmmmmmmmmmm…. red headed ex-pat thug ;)

ragnar danneskjold

April 19th, 2012
10:13 am

Not sure why government should have any role in setting internal policies at companies, but I like the idea of voters voting on pay packages for the politicians.

MiltonMan

April 19th, 2012
10:13 am

Nice try Jay but it isn’t going to happen. The money elite are often time majority shareholders in the company they run. Also, do you have a say on how much the POTUS and elected officials are paid???

USinUK - ex-pat thug

April 19th, 2012
10:13 am

Brocephus … red-headed ex-pat thug … in glasses :-)

Hi Paul!!!! I kinda like pervs … it fits with my USinner attitude …

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
10:13 am

The fell from 388,000 to 366,000 but only a sleight drop. They were expected to drop by over 10,000.

Did you miss some numbers somewhere??

388,000 – 366,000 = 22,000 > 10,000

ragnar danneskjold

April 19th, 2012
10:14 am

And for the bureaucrats. Why should any government employee not a SEAL have a salary greater than $100,000?

Butch Cassidy

April 19th, 2012
10:14 am

MIltonMan – “Also, do you have a say on how much the POTUS and elected officials are paid???”

Of course not. where did you get the idea that the United States was a publicly traded for profit entity?

Paul

April 19th, 2012
10:14 am

“Mmmmmmmmmmmmm…. red headed ex-pat thug ;)

See, USinUK? I told you ‘pervs’ works, too!

oh…. HI Borsephus!

JohnnyReb

April 19th, 2012
10:15 am

Thanks Butch for the explanation on the bank consolidation.

I’m not as blind as it may appear, it’s just that the other side has more objectionable ideas than does the Right.

If Bush, et al created the concentration, why didn’t Obama and company fix it before he lost complete control via the mid-terms?

USinUK - ex-pat thug

April 19th, 2012
10:15 am

“Also, do you have a say on how much the POTUS and elected officials are paid???”

hrm.

living in a country = being a part owner of a business

some people seem to have missed a few days in civics class …

kayaker 71

April 19th, 2012
10:15 am

Bookman, 10:09,

Sort of like Franklin Raines, who I am not sure I have heard you mention. Cooked the books before he took off with 190M of Fannie money. No liberal outrage, no media condemnation to speak of (except Fox News). Sort of like Bozo. Can’t criticize him. We might be called names. And Fannie is still in the tank.

MiltonMan

April 19th, 2012
10:15 am

“…he’s beating the DEMOCRACY drum …”

Which the US clearly is not.

Mick

April 19th, 2012
10:16 am

usinuk

Where have you been? Been missing your tart responses…

Paul

April 19th, 2012
10:17 am

ragnar

“Why should any government employee not a SEAL have a salary greater than $100,000?”

So government can attract the best and the brightest from private industry to bring their private sector, executive experience to bear on government operations.

Just ask the GSA and Secret Service.

USinUK - ex-pat thug

April 19th, 2012
10:17 am

“Why should any government employee not a SEAL have a salary greater than $100,000?”

yes.

because all government employees = DMV employees.

oy.

Jay

April 19th, 2012
10:17 am

I’ve been highly critical of Raines, kayaker. If they could find criminal charges to nail him on, I’d be just fine with that.

Talking Head

April 19th, 2012
10:17 am

So Mitt Romney used to make his dog ride on top of the car when the family went on vacation, and Obama used to eat dogs. If I were a dog, I would not feel to good about the next 4 years.

USinUK - ex-pat thug

April 19th, 2012
10:18 am

“Just ask the GSA and Secret Service.”

actually, you might not want to ask the secret service about paychecks right now …

Adam

April 19th, 2012
10:18 am

Also, do you have a say on how much the POTUS and elected officials are paid???

Second time it’s been mentioned. One more from someone else and I think we can safely assume this is the new right wing Tu quoque talking point.

MiltonMan

April 19th, 2012
10:18 am

“hrm.

living in a country = being a part owner of a business

some people seem to have missed a few days in civics class”

…says the person who thinks the US is a democratic society. Interesting. Please inform us of the last time you voted for a pay raise for any elected official.

Soothsayer

April 19th, 2012
10:18 am

Well
.
I just spent the last 15 minutes or so
.
reviewing blog posts from the past few months
.
And I can safely say………the Lyman Hall
.
is……..none other than
.
our old buddy……..Lm
.
I guess……..he just got tired
,
of being run off the blog
.
so many times under……….his
.
old nom de blogue.
.
The reason I…….know this
.
is because his posting style
.
is unmistakable……….he just
.
inserts a period between

line……….breaks now.

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
10:18 am

So Thomas, you propose that we abandon the republic model and go straight to pure democracy?

Jay–I’m confused by your position today. Corporations are essentially run as a “republic”, in which an elected board of directors makes all of the decisions regarding CEO compensation, etc. So, are you proposing a fundamental change in the way large, publicly traded corporations are administered?? If so, then why wouldn’t you support the public directly voting on the salaries of Congress and the President?? If not, then what does this new proposal actually accomplish other than give shareholders a meaningless way to vent??

In other news

April 19th, 2012
10:18 am

“So Mitt Romney used to make his dog ride on top of the car when the family went on vacation, and Obama used to eat dogs.

At least Mitt’s dog didn’t have to worry about being eaten.

Soothsayer

April 19th, 2012
10:19 am

In other news

April 19th, 2012
10:19 am

Obama is knee deep in debt, prostitutes, dog meat and doo doo.

Face it folks, he’s done in November and no amount of crying will help you.

Recon 0311 2533

April 19th, 2012
10:19 am

388,000 – 366,000 = 22,000 > 10,000

My bad, 388,000 down 2k to 386,000.

Butch Cassidy

April 19th, 2012
10:19 am

JohnnyReb – ” If Bush, et al created the concentration, why didn’t Obama and company fix it before he lost complete control via the mid-terms?”

You mean why didn’t he break up the banks in the middle of the largest economic meltdown since the Great Depression? I seriously doubt that you or anyone else would give him kudos for such a move. Besides, look how upset people get when the idea of limiting CEO compensation comes up in discussion.

HDB

April 19th, 2012
10:19 am

Butch Cassidy

April 19th, 2012
10:10 am
JohnnyReb – “I trully don’t know who is to blame for allowing a concentration of big banks”

I’ll be happy to to tell you. It was Paulsen, Geithner, Bernake, and to a large extent the Bush Administration. During the meltdown, Lehman Brothers was allowed to collapse, as well as Bear Sterns.”

Bear was acquired by JP Morgan/Chase Manhattan…Jamie Dimon ios the CEO!! All was done during the Bush Years…..

Paul

April 19th, 2012
10:20 am

JohnnyReb

“why didn’t Obama and company fix it before he lost complete control via the mid-terms?”

Wikipedia has some pretty good sources on Dodd-Frank.

“The initial version of the bill passed the House along party lines in December by a vote of 223-202,[1] and passed the Senate with amendments in May 2010 with a vote of 59-39[1] once again along party lines.[1″

Bottom line: Republicans hated Wall Street Reform and bitterly fought it.

Mick

April 19th, 2012
10:20 am

Personally, I love hot dogs especially nathans…

In other news

April 19th, 2012
10:20 am

“All was done during the Bush Years…..”

Blaming Bush will no longer help the left. Get over it and go home.

USinUK - ex-pat thug

April 19th, 2012
10:21 am

“Please inform us of the last time you voted for a pay raise for any elected official.”

how about you inform us about the last time you were part owner of a business yet had no say in it.

Butch Cassidy

April 19th, 2012
10:21 am

HDB – “Bear was acquired by JP Morgan/Chase Manhattan…Jamie Dimon ios the CEO!! All was done during the Bush Years”

Exactly right. I probably should have clarified that had JPM/Chase not stepped in, BS would be on the same page as LB.

getakife

April 19th, 2012
10:22 am

cons want the wealthy to control all the wealth so their kids have no chance of making a decent living.

Jay

April 19th, 2012
10:22 am

If this is merely a meaningless way to vent, Bruno, why have corporate America and the GOP fought it so hard?

The answer is, because it’s far from meaningless and they know it.

The Citigroup board is now on notice from its own shareholders that its practices are unacceptable. Legally, they can ignore it. But I don’t think that would turn out to be a smart business decision. We’ll have to see just how “meaningless” this turns out to be….

Tall

April 19th, 2012
10:22 am

Mr. Bookman:

There are probably more details here than meet the eye. Can you find out who the campaign donors are?

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
10:22 am

G’mornin’ Paul!!

Mick

April 19th, 2012
10:22 am

Let me try again…hey usinuk! whats the matter for you? Squidleys got your tongue?

MiltonMan

April 19th, 2012
10:23 am

Libs – please tell the rest of us here what exactly is “fair compensation” for a CEO.

We are still waiting for Obama to celarly define what a rich person is in this country. Is it a single person who makes up to $200k; “married” couple who make up to $250k or people making over $1 million?

I just received a notice from my employer that my “cadillac” medical insurance plan benefits will be considered taxable income starting 1 Jan 2013. Thanks Obozo!

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
10:24 am

“…says the person who thinks the US is a democratic society”

Yep, some people were DEFINTELY missing from Civics class

Paul

April 19th, 2012
10:25 am

Hey Mick!

“Been missing your tart responses…”

Did you mean the responses were ‘tart’ or did you mean they were responses from a tart?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_slang#T

MiltonMan

April 19th, 2012
10:25 am

“how about you inform us about the last time you were part owner of a business yet had no say in it.”

My last job. I worked for a private company.

Good God libs are easy. Any other “gems” there champ???

Steve - USA (I support "None Of The Above")

April 19th, 2012
10:25 am

If you don’t have a voice then don’t be a shareholder.

Lyman Hall

April 19th, 2012
10:26 am

Soothsayer -
.
The State-Sponsored Media may “ban” me……………………they will never “run me off”.
.
The truth will out…………………………………………………………..goob.

Butch Cassidy

April 19th, 2012
10:26 am

MiltonMan – “Libs – please tell the rest of us here what exactly is “fair compensation” for a CEO.”

Can’t speak for the “libs”, but I wouldn’t be opposed to CEO comp being roughly 40 times that of the lowest paid worker in the organization, and was tied specifically to the performance of the company along with the provision that if the CEO fails to meet expectations that he will be given the same severance package as any other rank and file employee.

Hope that helps.

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
10:26 am

Recon

gotcha…

In other news

April 19th, 2012
10:26 am

Doggone/GA

Not to mention business classes. Jay Bookman was a history major but thinks he’s an economist. Go figure. Next he’ll be telling us how to wage war and win. Oh wait…

Adam

April 19th, 2012
10:26 am

MiltonMan: Definitions are only meaningful to you and your ilk because you intend to then fight them on that basis, instead of talking about whether or not things are actually moral or not. It’s a method of trying to win an argument by changing the terms of the argument. I know plenty of people who do this, and I am not playing your game.

Instead, I challenge YOU; If you want ANYONE to answer your questions on definitions, first you must submit your own definitions, and they have to be reasonable definitions – not off-the-wall definitions you just made up to be hyperbolic in an attempt to get people to play your silly game.

kayaker 71

April 19th, 2012
10:27 am

As a rule, the shareholders of any corporation should have a say in how the corporation is run, including CEO compensation. As part owners of the corporation, they have that right. As long as it is kept within the private sector, so be it. However, when the government gets involved, it is another issue. Corporate America already has enough regulation and rules to last three lifetimes….. they don’t need any more. But Bozo and the liberals continue to demonize those of means to gain votes in the upcoming election. Is there nothing that this clown does that is not centered on getting re-elected?

Mick

April 19th, 2012
10:27 am

paul

Well, shiver me timbers, I’ll take the double entendre of course…

Jefferson

April 19th, 2012
10:28 am

Why does a US representative have a 1.5 mil staff and supply budget ?

In other news

April 19th, 2012
10:28 am

There seem to be lots of backseat CEO’s pretending to know what they’re talking about. People who sit on a blog all day talking about how they know how companies are owned and operated.

MiltonMan

April 19th, 2012
10:28 am

“cons want the wealthy to control all the wealth so their kids have no chance of making a decent living.”

Wow. Brush up on circular dependency there chief!

USinUK - ex-pat thug

April 19th, 2012
10:30 am

hey mick!!!

how’s the weather???

no, don’t tell me.

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
10:32 am

The Citigroup board is now on notice from its own shareholders that its practices are unacceptable. Legally, they can ignore it. But I don’t think that would turn out to be a smart business decision. We’ll have to see just how “meaningless” this turns out to be….

Last time I checked, the President and Congress have been put on notice that THEIR practices are unacceptable as well, yet I don’t see any response yet. ObamaCare is opposed by a substantial majority of folks, and I don’t see anyone supporting the Senate’s failure to approve a federal budget.

Personally, I think Thomas raised a good point. What’s good for the goose should be good for the gander.

stevie ray...clowns to the left, jokers to the right..here I am...

April 19th, 2012
10:32 am

KAYAKER

Great point but when you dig deeper, that Raines crook is base of an ever heightening iceberg…both sides have a long history of making piles of dough a board members and others…Emanuel, Kerry, Johnson, Paulson, Gingrich….

Jefferson

April 19th, 2012
10:32 am

Minority shareholders has very little say and with the inventions of 401s to prop up the market most workers feeding the system are just being fleeceed of what they should be getting for what they are giving. If you want to control everything, stay private — otherwise be prepared to be fair to all not just the majority share holders.

USinUK - ex-pat thug

April 19th, 2012
10:32 am

I second Butch’s proposition (but would limit it to 20x)

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
10:33 am

“As long as it is kept within the private sector, so be it. However, when the government gets involved, it is another issue”

Government steps in when the private sector fails to step up

MiltonMan

April 19th, 2012
10:33 am

“I know plenty of people who do this, and I am not playing your game.”

Yet you respond via a dissertation???

Please point out where my definitions are “made-up”.

Kudos to Butch for a straight-forward response to the original question with a sound answer that I would agree with from an implementation stand-point.

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
10:33 am

USinUK–Glad to see you back on board. Any truth to the rumor that you’ll be lighting the Olympic Flame this year?? After all, being Queen of the Bookman Blog does have its perks. ;-)

godless heathen©

April 19th, 2012
10:33 am

OK, I’ve heard about Romney and his dog story, but where did this about Obama eating a dog come from?

Mick

April 19th, 2012
10:34 am

usinuk

The weather is cherry!! C’mon down for a spell…I’ve invited just about everybody on this blog, friend or foe, to stop by…so far no takers but someone will pop up eventually, then I can share some magic…

carlosgvv

April 19th, 2012
10:34 am

The intense level of vitriol and hatred shown by conservatives here towards Obama is not in keeping with his performance as President. I can only conclude that what you cons really want is a whiter White House. The roots of racism run much deeper than I wanted to admit.

Paul

April 19th, 2012
10:35 am

MiltonMan

“how about you inform us about the last time you were part owner of a business yet had no say in it .”

My last job. I worked for a private company.

Good God libs are easy. Any other “gems” there champ???”

Do I understand you were part owner of a business but had no say in it?

Golly… I wonder what the other owners knew that we don’t?

Or… did you mean you were an employee of a private, not a public company, had no ownership of it, and you’re comparing that who owns part of a company having no say in how it’s run?

And you say Libs are easy?!!?

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
10:35 am

As a rule, the shareholders of any corporation should have a say in how the corporation is run, including CEO compensation. As part owners of the corporation, they have that right. As long as it is kept within the private sector, so be it.

Sounds very reasonable, and I don’t think you’d find many outside toe GOP contingent in Congress that would disagree with you. My only question would be how would that be enforced if you don’t want government involved? Who would step forward for the shareholders if the corporations violate that agreement and silence the voices of the shareholders?

USinUK - ex-pat thug

April 19th, 2012
10:35 am

Bruno – :lol: you mean, being Queen of Bookmanialand gets you a tiara … and MORE??? talk about a wealth of blessings!!!

Mick – would love to visit – we’ve had ALL the weather this week … hail … rain … sun … wind …

saywhat?

April 19th, 2012
10:36 am

Related to the “corporations are people” meme, anybody else notice that the conservative supreme court justices no longer believe that when it applies to holding corporations responsible for committing torture?

USinUK - ex-pat thug

April 19th, 2012
10:36 am

“My last job. I worked for a private company.”

worked for /= part owner

(no wonder they didn’t want you to operate heavy machinery)

kayaker 71

April 19th, 2012
10:36 am

Stevie Ray, 10:32,

Very few of us outside the corporate boardrooms know what is really going on. And as long as our presidential candidates of either party continue to take gazillions of dollars in campaign contributions from them, with significant strings attached, we will continue to have a corrupt, crooked government. I don’t trust any of them.

Steve - USA (I support "None Of The Above")

April 19th, 2012
10:37 am

“OK, I’ve heard about Romney and his dog story, but where did this about Obama eating a dog come from?”

I believe it was a quote from one of his books. No truth though that he said it tasted just like Chicken.

getakife

April 19th, 2012
10:37 am

It’s a shame cons will not fight for their kids to have a better chance to make it because they chose to fight for billionaires.

Grasshopper

April 19th, 2012
10:37 am

Hey jay,

I agree with you! Nice job.

Paul

April 19th, 2012
10:38 am

godless heathen

“I’ve heard about Romney and his dog story, but where did this about Obama eating a dog come from?”

From MadeUpOutrage, Inc.

It’s a growth industry.

MiltonMan

April 19th, 2012
10:38 am

“OK, I’ve heard about Romney and his dog story, but where did this about Obama eating a dog come from?”

Of course you will not hear – nicely swept under the carpet by our friendly liberal media.

Obama wrote about this in his book – “Dreams of my Father”

saywhat?

April 19th, 2012
10:38 am

I’ll see miltonmans “libs are easy” and raise him a “cons are simple”.

zeke

April 19th, 2012
10:39 am

So Jay, why don’t you work tirelessly to do the same for the USA taxpayers? Congress is out of control! They need to have not only their pay, but, the allowance for office(s) and support people, travel and expenses, health insurance and other benefits, retirement compensation, , and, every other thing they do to be voted on by the taxpayers! Not the 50% who pay no income tax, but, by the 50% that do!

Butch Cassidy

April 19th, 2012
10:39 am

US in UK – “I second Butch’s proposition (but would limit it to 20x)”

20 is a little low. If you factor that the lowest paid person in theory is making 24K a year, 20 is really only about $500k. For a CEO, and the responsibilities he has for the organization, even I would say that’s too little. However, at 40 he is going to clear in excess of 1 million a year. Anyone should be able to survive on $19,230.00 a week in my opinion.

Mick

April 19th, 2012
10:39 am

If I had to put money on it, either jamvet, bruno or even jay might pop up sometime in the future. It would be a hoot to knock a few back with yaker or good ole rb! By the time they left, they be registering democrat!!!

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
10:39 am

Butch @ 10:26

Put that between 25% – 30% and I could co-sign that one with you. Another alternative would be to restructure worker pay packages to give them stock options, but not to the extent of execs, based on performance. You then give the worker even more incentive to be more productive as the better the company does, the better their pay could potentially become. You’d also do away with other incentive bonuses as the options would take place of that.

Becky

April 19th, 2012
10:40 am

Kayaker-I love how you include yourself in the corporate boardroom scenario. I hope I do not have any stock in any company of which you are a part as you spend your days on this blog and not actually working. Know what I mean?

kayaker 71

April 19th, 2012
10:40 am

carlos, 10:34,

When will you liberals stop pinning racism on the criticism of this clown in the WH. He is an abject failure, has no significant record and should still be in Chicago. There are numerous black Republicans that I would be glad to vote for. Just not this Muslim wannabe.

barking frog

April 19th, 2012
10:40 am

getakife
were you once getalife?

Steve - USA (I support "None Of The Above")

April 19th, 2012
10:40 am

“From MadeUpOutrage, Inc. – It’s a growth industry.”

No doubt, both parties use it often.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
10:40 am

“I don’t trust any of them.”

Especially those running campaign ads in Spanish, which basically means the majority of those who are or were running for the Repub nomination as well as Obama

MiltonMan

April 19th, 2012
10:41 am

“It’s a shame cons will not fight for their kids to have a better chance to make it because they chose to fight for billionaires.”

Every heard of multi-tasking chief??? We all fight for billionaires, fight for our kids (you know that BS known as stay-home moms), fight to keep the oppressed down, etc., etc.

You libs should try it every so often.

lovelyliz

April 19th, 2012
10:41 am

If corporations are “people” too shouldn’t the entire “family” have a say in how the “family’s” $$$$$ is spent?

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
10:42 am

“Just not this Muslim wannabe”

Would you vote for any Muslim?

ty webb

April 19th, 2012
10:42 am

“When will you liberals stop pinning racism on the criticism of this clown in the WH.”

It’s really all they got…besides “inherited” of course.

saywhat?

April 19th, 2012
10:42 am

MiltonMan

April 19th, 2012
10:38 am

Of course you will not hear – nicely swept under the carpet by our friendly liberal media.

Obama wrote about this in his book – “Dreams of my Father”
_____________________________________________________

The liberal media has conspired to edit every book sold to conservatives to hide the information from them for the past 17 years, but one unaltered copy mysteriously slipped out. Either that or it took the simple cons that long to read a single book. You decide.

Mick

April 19th, 2012
10:42 am

**Just not this Muslim wannabe**

Yeah, there’s your sign…

getalife

April 19th, 2012
10:42 am

frog,

I was but changed.

Like a tad pole to a frog.

kayaker 71

April 19th, 2012
10:43 am

Becky, 10:40,

I retired after spending nearly 43 yrs putting people back together. I spend my days on this blog to irritate liberals like you….. as much as I can.

Mick

April 19th, 2012
10:44 am

**I spend my days on this blog to irritate liberals like you**

Irritate us? I think not mr. poison ivy…

getalife

April 19th, 2012
10:44 am

The end game to corporate power is they control all the wealth.

Tell your kids who you fought for cons when they can’t never leave your house.

TM

April 19th, 2012
10:44 am

Haven’t read all the comments but shouldn’t this same rule apply to government and we vote on the salary of our leaders

USinUK - ex-pat thug

April 19th, 2012
10:44 am

“From MadeUpOutrage, Inc.

It’s a growth industry.”

:lol:

and worldnutsdaily is their paper of record.

MiltonMan

April 19th, 2012
10:45 am

Dang – hate to leave this one but I have to go make my “evil rich boss” some even more money.

barking frog

April 19th, 2012
10:45 am

getalife
change and hope to be
better?

TaxPayer

April 19th, 2012
10:45 am

Are Republicans on here today trying to convince us that job creators such as Pandit could create so many more jobs for us if we would just give them more bigger tax cuts. And wouldn’t it be a novel idea to actually let shareholders have a little say in the company they own other than voting yes or no to approve the company’s selection of company directors and other such worthless activities. I wouldn’t waste my money on Citi or BAC or any other company that would pay their executives outrageous sums of money for doing a horrible job.

Paul

April 19th, 2012
10:45 am

Steve

That’s why it’s growing so well -

USinUK - ex-pat thug

April 19th, 2012
10:45 am

“I retired after spending nearly 43 yrs putting people back together”

you worked at the Barbie factory?

getalife

April 19th, 2012
10:46 am

kay,

A doctor?

MiltonMan

April 19th, 2012
10:46 am

“The end game to corporate power is they control all the wealth.

Tell your kids who you fought for cons when they can’t never leave your house.”

Gotta love that double negative so kindly brought to us via an APS education.

kayaker 71

April 19th, 2012
10:47 am

Suck, 10:42,

I learned all I want to know about Islam on September 11, 2001. When we stop spending gazillions of dollars of our federal budget protecting ourselves against these idiots, I might be a bit more tolerant. And as to the Spanish speaking ads, that was a significant mistake on my part. Apologize to the whole blog for that one.

MiltonMan

April 19th, 2012
10:47 am

““I retired after spending nearly 43 yrs putting people back together”

you worked at the Barbie factory?”

That actually is down-right hilarious. Thanks for the laugh US!

Peadawg

April 19th, 2012
10:47 am

“Why Wall Street execs want to silence their shareholders”

B/c they are a bunch of greedy b*sta*ds.

Becky

April 19th, 2012
10:47 am

Dang it- I was going to suggest the Mr. Potato Head factory.

Paul

April 19th, 2012
10:48 am

kayaker

“I spend my days on this blog to irritate liberals like you….. as much as I can.”

Yeah, and some of us like to return the favor.

Wanna talk about why ex-military cons love socialized medicine for themselves but hate it for those they were sworn to protect?

:-)

(just kidding, I think we’ve beat that to death for now)

Butch Cassidy

April 19th, 2012
10:48 am

Bro – “Another alternative would be to restructure worker pay packages to give them stock options, but not to the extent of execs, based on performance.You then give the worker even more incentive to be more productive as the better the company does, the better their pay could potentially become. ”

And that my friend, is how it used to be. Both employee and CEO had vested interests in the companies performance, so everyone shared the risks and the rewards. It’s not a coincidence that employee loyalty began to subside when pensions were replaced with 401k’s and management training and OTJ programs were eliminated. It also concides with the advent of viewing the employees as potential liabilities to the P&L rather than assets to the company. Too bad we can’t go back.

kayaker 71

April 19th, 2012
10:49 am

getalife, 10:46,

Yep.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
10:49 am

Bro

“Another alternative would be to restructure worker pay packages to give them stock options, but not to the extent of execs, based on performance”

When a profit sharing margin is achieved, a major employer down at the airport does a combination company performance and individual performance for the payout of the rank and file……

HDB

April 19th, 2012
10:50 am

MiltonMan

April 19th, 2012
10:41 am
“….fight to keep the oppressed down, etc., etc.”

Gee, you ADMIT it!! The light of truth…..

BTW: it a big difference between a 5-8 year old child eating a foreigh delicacy (dog is an Asian delicacy) vs. strapping a dog on the roof of a moving car and s#!t running down the rear window!! A very big difference!! What we eat here can repulse some Asians as do some of what Asians eat repulse Americans…..that’s part of the American superiority problem that occurs when we go overseas……

getalife

April 19th, 2012
10:50 am

Why do cons pretend to be doctors?

md, bruno and now kay.

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
10:51 am

I believe it was a quote from one of his books. No truth though that he said it tasted just like Chicken.

It was from a book he’d written and published in 1995.

People started giggling about Mitt’s dog-on-wagon story back in 2007.

http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2007/06/27/raising_sons_rising_expectations/?page=full

so for the record, it’s taken the Team Mittens Rapid-Response sub-committee five years to get around to read a political opponent’s memoirs, to see if there might be something in there worth using.

Steve - USA (I support "None Of The Above")

April 19th, 2012
10:51 am

Kayaker,

Still have a license? I could buy you a nice lunch in return for an Oxycodone Rx.

j/k

Mick

April 19th, 2012
10:52 am

Great caesars ghost! Yaker was a doc? Well, many thanks for putting people back together, there is no politics in the healing act…

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
10:53 am

kayaker

How are you doing this morning?

I was just messing with you about the Spanish ads. I don’t think anyone who posts here on a regular basis hasn’t made an oversight before……..

It is those on both sides, who know all the facts, yet post a percentage of them as if it were the entire story that can get irritating at times.

TaxPayer

April 19th, 2012
10:53 am

Why do cons pretend to be doctors?

I hear some masseuses make good money.

kayaker 71

April 19th, 2012
10:53 am

Steve, 10:51,

No, gave it all up in 2003. Too many 3:00AM phone calls. But lunch would be nice.

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
10:53 am

Yet you respond via a dissertation?

I got this from Milton the other day.

Apparently 9 lines = “dissertation” at Winger U.

Mick

April 19th, 2012
10:55 am

getalife

Why would anyone lie on a blog? What would it prove?

carlosgvv

April 19th, 2012
10:55 am

kayaker 71

And who are these “numerous Black Republicans” you speak of?

JohnnyReb

April 19th, 2012
10:55 am

Favorite Barbie joke

Divorced Barbie – she got rid of Ken but kept all his things!

JamVet

April 19th, 2012
10:55 am

Paging Dr. Bruno, are we on for Greg Lake tonight?

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
10:56 am

“I could buy you a nice lunch in return for an Oxycodone Rx.”

It would have to be a nice lunch……. Those can be pricey on the black market

TaxPayer

April 19th, 2012
10:56 am

Why would anyone lie on a blog?What would it prove?

Many of us wonder the same thing.

getalife

April 19th, 2012
10:57 am

“I hear some masseuses make good money.”

Yeah, I guess they are ashamed of their real jobs.

Mick

April 19th, 2012
10:57 am

jamvet

Think the crimson king will be on the set list?

USinUK - ex-pat thug

April 19th, 2012
10:58 am

“Divorced Barbie – she got rid of Ken but kept all his things!”

:lol:

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
10:58 am

“Another alternative would be to restructure worker pay packages to give them stock options, but not to the extent of execs, based on performance. You then give the worker even more incentive to be more productive as the better the company does, the better their pay could potentially become.”

The only problem with that is that the company could fail for reasons beyond the average workers control, but they would be the ones taking it on the chin…as they are now, but at least with a set rate of pay they’re getting properly compensated for the work they are doing now.

JamVet

April 19th, 2012
10:58 am

I’d be surprised, but really have no idea what to expect, Mick.

Saw the Ting Tings Monday night and had a great time…

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
10:59 am

“I retired after spending nearly 43 yrs putting people back together”

you worked at the Barbie factory?

Now.. Thasss funny!!!! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

—————————–

It’s not a coincidence that employee loyalty began to subside when pensions were replaced with 401k’s and management training and OTJ programs were eliminated.

Never really thought about those things all being connected before, but I’d buy that…

—————————–

They BOTH

I can eliminate anything involving the Feds with that one. :)

RB from Gwinnett

April 19th, 2012
10:59 am

What has the pay package of the AJC’s CEO looked like over the past few years, Jay? As they have been diving at double the national average. I suspect you own stock, so why don’t you share with us how you would vote on that pay package.

getalife

April 19th, 2012
10:59 am

“Those can be pricey on the black market.”

How much do you pay?

USinUK - ex-pat thug

April 19th, 2012
11:01 am

“It’s not a coincidence that employee loyalty began to subside when pensions were replaced with 401k’s and management training and OTJ programs were eliminated.”

and, let’s not forget … sending jobs to Mexico / China / India …

Mick

April 19th, 2012
11:02 am

rb

That’s a great question but why should anyone share what they vote? Most consider voting a private personal matter…

Butch Cassidy

April 19th, 2012
11:03 am

US inUK – “and, let’s not forget … sending jobs to Mexico / China / India …”

That also falls into my analogy of looking at employees as liabilities to the P&L rather than assets to the organization.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
11:04 am

“How much do you pay?”

More than a #1 at chick-fila……… and that’s even if you get a large drink and fries

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
11:04 am

What has the pay package of the AJC’s CEO looked like

Dunno about the CEO, but I actually have a real good idea what a few Cox wage slaves like, oh, this radio guy whose name rhymes with “Squeal Snorts”, happen to pull down.

Let’s just say it’s a buttload more than 20x or even 40x the lowest salaried employee’s annual pay.

kayaker 71

April 19th, 2012
11:04 am

carlos, 10:55,

Start off with Herman. I think he would have made a good candidate and a good president. He just made too many mistakes in his private life. I wish that JC Watts had stayed in the public arena a bit longer. He is a very intelligent man, a good father and someone we could trust. Allen West is a big too inexperienced and probably needs a bit of maturity to run the country. Condi Rice would be my first choice…… NSA director, Sec of State with a lot of road miles…. respected throughout the world as an intelligent, honest diplomat. Colon Powell, a moderate Republican, would be high on my list, as well. Although not presidential candidates, I also have a great deal of respect for Juan Williams on Fox, Thomas Sowell, Shelby Steele, Bill Cosby, Larry Elder and John McWhorter, to name a few.

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
11:05 am

Doggone @ 10:58

I wouldn’t do away with a set pay as a base. I’d give the workers the same type of package as the execs but just on a smaller scale. You start with a base and then add options based on whatever guidelines the company sets.

getalife

April 19th, 2012
11:05 am

Both,

Why do you think they call it dope?

Jay

April 19th, 2012
11:06 am

RB, Cox is a privately owned company whose stock is not publicly traded, so the salaries of its top executives are not public knowledge. I have no stock in it.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
11:07 am

Because it is for dopes……

And you are naive if you think I’m buying Oxy’s or any other drug on the black market

It was a joke

hahahaha

get it

RB from Gwinnett

April 19th, 2012
11:09 am

Mick, you think it’s ok for Jay to bash the CEO of other companies in a news forum of a major city, but not be asked about the same issue a little closer to home?

getalife

April 19th, 2012
11:10 am

“Because it is for dopes……”

Exactly and those suffering from chronic pain have to beg for opiates because of dopes abusing opiates.

Mick

April 19th, 2012
11:10 am

**Condi Rice would be my first choice…… NSA director, Sec of State with a lot of road miles…. respected throughout the world as an intelligent, honest diplomat**

Can let that one go by…she was not that well respected on the world stage. Even though she was fluent in russian, they really weren’t too impressed. She was not really that good at any of her positions in the previous administration. Who could’ve imagined using jets as weapons? Wow! Certainly the NSA director should…

TaxPayer

April 19th, 2012
11:11 am

Now might not be a good time to be joking about illicit drugs given that there was new just yesterday of an internet drug ring getting busted and one of the ring leaders was apparently a Milton Man. They thought they had a fool proof system to remain anonymous. :roll:

Mick

April 19th, 2012
11:12 am

rb

I just gave you my opinion about voting, I thought you raised a good question but apparently, it’s not relevant…

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
11:12 am

Tax Payer

Maybe someone was posting from a cell this morning while they were waiting to post bail

TaxPayer

April 19th, 2012
11:12 am

I wonder if the owners of privately owned companies get to vote on executive compensation?

USinUK - ex-pat thug

April 19th, 2012
11:13 am

“That also falls into my analogy of looking at employees as liabilities to the P&L rather than assets to the organization.”

EXACTLY!!!

Granny Godzilla - Union Thugette

April 19th, 2012
11:13 am

Isn’t the dog story race at 2 for Mitt and 1 for President Obama?

Mitt

dog on car

money man Malek BBQ’d dog

Obama

at some dog at a meal in Indonesia as a little boy

(I remember dogs hanging in butcher shop windows all over China right next to the ducks and pigs and some stuff I didn’t recognize)

Butch Cassidy

April 19th, 2012
11:14 am

RB from Gwinnett – “you think it’s ok for Jay to bash the CEO of other companies in a news forum of a major city, but not be asked about the same issue a little closer to home?”

Well, since Cox is a privately held company,I would say it’s you who needs to learn the difference between apples and oranges.

kayaker 71

April 19th, 2012
11:16 am

Granny, 11:13,

When I lived in Hawaii, you had to watch your black Labs pretty close, especially if you lived near a Phillipino community.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
11:16 am

“I wouldn’t do away with a set pay as a base. I’d give the workers the same type of package as the execs but just on a smaller scale. You start with a base and then add options based on whatever guidelines the company sets.”

Yes, I understood that…but the problem is that it becomes a way for the company to pay their workers less for a given job. Take a line through the minimum wage for employees who get tips. It’s a LOT lower than the base minimum wage…but those workers are paid, essentially as you are saying, a base rate and then performance based “bonuses”

getalife

April 19th, 2012
11:18 am

Now kay was a doctor that lived in Hawaii.

Granny Godzilla - Union Thugette

April 19th, 2012
11:18 am

K71

LABS? Well my old Joe would be considered “well-marbled”….

HDB

April 19th, 2012
11:19 am

kayaker 71
April 19th, 2012
11:04 am

Lest you forget: Colin Powell got PILLORIED by Republicans for his support of Barack Obama, and his support of Affirmative Action and a woman’s right to choose! He got BOOED off the stage at the GOP Convention. Bill Cosby (Dr. William H. Cosby) is a staunch DEMOCRAT!! Allen West was FORCED to retire his commission in the Army for cruelty to a Iraqi prisoner. Herman Cain showed his level of lunacy….and the same as Alan Keyes!! You can do better!!!

Out of all of them, Colin Powell and Condi Rice are the best in the party…but the base of the GOP won’t even consider the possibility!!!

kayaker 71

April 19th, 2012
11:19 am

Outta here….. off to the wood shop. Been trying to learn a little blues on my new electric guitar. Fingers on the left hand are a little sore. Save the Tatas ….. certainly two of God’s wonderful creations.

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
11:23 am

Doggone

Ok, I see your point, and that would be a serious issue to deal with.

In other news

April 19th, 2012
11:24 am

” I have no stock in it.”

Like I stated, Jay has no idea what he’s talking about when it comes to economics.

USinUK - ex-pat thug

April 19th, 2012
11:25 am

“certainly two of God’s wonderful creations”

:lol:

one of my favorite George Carlinisms … “ever wonder why you have a PAIR of panties, but only one bra???”

Dirty Dawg

April 19th, 2012
11:26 am

Recall some 25-30 years back, stories were circulating that groups like The Conference Board and the national Chamber of Commerce, came to realize that big-name entertainers, rock-stars, actors and sports stars once they discovered collective bargaining, we’re making many-times more than they, the leaders of America’s economy, were…and decided that they would remedy that. Over time, and with shared agreement among Boards of Directors’ Compensation Committees, they were going to see to it. As a result, CEOs and other top-tier management went from making 20-30 times the lowest-paid of their workers to hundreds of times as much. Hell, they even pay each others Board Members $250-$500 thousand a year just to serve, aka attend four or five meetings.

The result is an out of control compensation system that has seen to it that ‘top’ management gets theirs while the rest of us are left to scramble for the scraps. Frankly, I’m not surprised that these guys would fight this shareholder oversight, cause they know what they’re gonna find and they won’t like it…then the retribution won’t be pleasant.

In other news

April 19th, 2012
11:26 am

“Out of all of them, Colin Powell and Condi Rice are the best in the party…but the base of the GOP won’t even consider the possibility!!!”

I’d take the ones you mentioned over the following Democrats

Cynthia McKinney

Al Sharpton

Jesse Jackson

Sheila Jackson

William Jefferson

Maxine Waters

Libertarian

April 19th, 2012
11:29 am

If its not binding, who cares. Sounds like another gimmick like the Buffett Rule. Aren’t there more important things congress could be doing?

In other news

April 19th, 2012
11:31 am

“Aren’t there more important things congress could be doing?”

Cowboy poetry.

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
11:32 am

Paging Dr. Bruno, are we on for Greg Lake tonight?

No, unless you’re willing to fly to wherever he is tonight. Concert in Atlanta is next Thursday. Be there or be square.

ragnar danneskjold

April 19th, 2012
11:35 am

Dear Paul @ 10:17, ha. Best quote of the day, David Burge: “If you can’t come up with 100 instant jokes about the President of the US eating a dog, you have no business calling yourself a comedian.”

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
11:36 am

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
11:32 am

Paging Dr. Bruno, are we on for Greg Lake tonight?

No, unless you’re willing to fly to wherever he is tonight. Concert in Atlanta is next Thursday. Be there or be square.
+++++++++++++++++++++++

LOL

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
11:36 am

barking frog

April 19th, 2012
11:38 am

getalife
does our president eat
frog?

Butch Cassidy

April 19th, 2012
11:42 am

in other words – “Like I stated, Jay has no idea what he’s talking about when it comes to economics.”

This from the person who apparently doesn’t know the difference between a publicly traded company and a privately held one.

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
11:42 am

in other religious extremism news (h/t Rude Pundit), apparently God’s punishing those Secret Service dudes for decades of our imposition of homoseckshul practice…

Government Funded Moral Breakdown – Is it any wonder that young White House Secret Servicemen and military servicemen have been caught consorting with prostitutes abroad; that GSA managers partied extravagantly in Las Vegas at taxpayer expense? For decades our government has engaged in profligate borrowing and spending, stubbornly funded Planned Parenthood (against the protest of parents) to teach children that “anything goes”; that mistakes can be “covered up” without parents ever knowing; to help teenage sex rings ply their trade right here in America, etc. The administration in power has imposed homosexual practice upon our military and has mandated that religious schools provide contraception, sterilization and abortifacient drugs to all students and staff – at taxpayer expense! What can we expect to come if things are not reversed?

Normal, Plain and Simple

April 19th, 2012
11:43 am

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
11:43 am

Will Mitt submit his VP short list to the religious extremists during his visit to Liberty, so they can veto the ones determined to be insufficiently Godly? Stay tuned.

barking frog

April 19th, 2012
11:45 am

Jay,
can you break the boldface
thing on the word press?

barking frog

April 19th, 2012
11:51 am

let them use CAPS..

USinUK - ex-pat thug

April 19th, 2012
11:51 am

“Will Mitt submit his VP short list to the religious extremists during his visit to Liberty, so they can veto the ones determined to be insufficiently Godly?”

I dunno … could it be THAT much worse than Caribou Barbie???

USinUK - ex-pat thug

April 19th, 2012
11:52 am

planned parenthood made the secret service buy hookers???

wow.

they ARE powerful.

getalife

April 19th, 2012
11:53 am

“does our president eat
frog?”

No but the Cajuns love to eat your legs.

USinUK - ex-pat thug

April 19th, 2012
11:55 am

“No but the Cajuns love to eat your legs”

speaking of … finally got around to watching the Princess and the Frog … Ray is one of the best Cajun characters in ages “women like a man with a BIG. BACK. PORCH.” classic.

sheepdawg

April 19th, 2012
11:56 am

republicans once again exposed and have to create lies to explain why. way to go Jay!!! keep it up

Gator Joe

April 19th, 2012
11:57 am

Jay:
This “gentleman” Pandit, and his board of directors won’t be starving to death anytime soon. These greedy, arrogant people oppose any regulation that may, may affect their exhorbitant profits. Whether it’s clean air and water, worker health and safety, or their out-of-line compensation, nothing is acceptable to them. It’s not enough they buy and pay for our legislators, or fashion their own laws (see ALEC), high time to rein them in.

barking frog

April 19th, 2012
11:57 am

getalife
yeh they suck crawfish too.

weetamoe

April 19th, 2012
11:58 am

I have been sending in my proxy votes for the last couple of weeks. I’m pretty well satisfied with most companies.
How many ways are they going to cook the dogs served on the Warren Buffet table? Will there be barbecue sauce?

USinUK - ex-pat thug

April 19th, 2012
11:59 am

getalife

April 19th, 2012
12:01 pm

Watch “Swamp People” to see the Cajuns living off the swamp.

The two brothers are hilarious.

Paul

April 19th, 2012
12:07 pm

sfd

I suppose Mitt could begin by talking about the Christian virtue of complete, not misleading, honesty.

“Liberty University, founded by the late Dr. Jerry Falwell, is the largest Christian university in the world, according to its website.”

Enrollment

Residential enrollment: 12,500
Online enrollment: over 70,000
Total enrollment: exceeds 82,500

Or, he could say, “it depends on what your definition of largest is…”

I suppose it’s good to get the obligatory appearance and speech out to that part of the constituency early on. Over and, hopefully, forgotten. It needs to be boilerplate vanilla.

UNCLE SAMANTHA

April 19th, 2012
12:08 pm

JAY
let me get this right….. you think the stockholders should be involved in what the pay is for the executives………

did you think the stockholders should have had a say with GM and Chrysler about the BAILOUT decision when the bondholders and stockholders got hosed with the arrangements that did not follow a normal bankruptcy?

Boris Badnoff

April 19th, 2012
12:10 pm

This is certainly an issue that impacts me. Back when that yahoo cowboy Dubya was in office, the only stock I owned had a dividend payment of 26 cents per share. Now, due to the brilliant economic policies and masterful leadership of Our Beloved Messiah, my dividend is one penny per share. Should I send the money to the campaign to give us four more years of The Light That Illuminates the Universe or save it for a possible rendezvous with Colombian massage therapists?

Jack

April 19th, 2012
12:10 pm

If I ‘m not satified with the way a company is being operated, I sell the stock and move on.

getalife

April 19th, 2012
12:11 pm

Liberty students should ask willard about planet kolob.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
12:12 pm

“Liberty University, founded by the late Dr. Jerry Falwell, is the largest Christian university in the world, according to its website.”

See, here’s how it’s not a lie: all those “other so-called Christian Universities aren’t really run by TRUE Christians”

UNCLE SAMANTHA

April 19th, 2012
12:12 pm

Boris
is that stock in SKANK of AMERICA?

barking frog

April 19th, 2012
12:13 pm

getalife
does willard have kolob
kool aid?

getalife

April 19th, 2012
12:14 pm

Bank of America lost 633 million so you cons need to make sure they get their bonuses.

Quick, save the billionaires cons.

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
12:14 pm

LOL Get. I like Troy. “It’s a tree shaker, it’s a tree shaker.”

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCRbDQefxIg

UNCLE SAMANTHA

April 19th, 2012
12:14 pm

Jack
How dare you attempt to use the mechanisms of market forces and choice………. you and other stockholders cannot be trusted to make a right decision……. you must be relieved of that burden to a more educated group

Next you are going to say if you don’t like the taste of burgers at McDonalds then you won’t go there and buy any? How absurd

Becky

April 19th, 2012
12:15 pm

The term messiah has been used several times yesterday and today. Please advise which talking radio head said it first.

getalife

April 19th, 2012
12:15 pm

“does willard have kolob
kool aid?”

Not sure where planet kolob is located.

Nobody will ask willard.

Paul

April 19th, 2012
12:17 pm

getalife

I’da thought you’d be more of a Swamp Think kinda guy –

http://tinyurl.com/7qp4yl6

Joe Hussein Mama

April 19th, 2012
12:18 pm

I heard a news story the other day that claimed that Google planned a stock split, since its share price has now gone so high. I wasn’t clear on whether or not new, additional shares would be issued in addition to the newly split shares.

However, there was a catch. The newly split shares aren’t going to get voting rights. The voting shares that are already extant will split, but no one’s getting any *new* or *additional* voting rights as a consequence of the split. End result? Sergei Brin and the rest of Google’s founders will still own about 70 percent of Google’s voting shares — just like they do now.

F. Sinkwich

April 19th, 2012
12:18 pm

I’m not nearly as concerned about CEOs as I am about Bo.

Anyone seen him lately?

Paul

April 19th, 2012
12:20 pm

Boris

“This is certainly an issue that impacts me. Back when that yahoo cowboy Dubya was in office, the only stock I owned had a dividend payment of 26 cents per share. Now, due to the brilliant economic policies and masterful leadership of Our Beloved Messiah, my dividend is one penny per share.”

You may want to do a little, what’s that word? Oh yeah… ‘research’….

and see who was president for 8 years when the crash occurred.

and see who put thru TARP to keep the financial system from crashing.

then try to figure out which president was tasked with putting Humpty Dumpty together again -

Joe Hussein Mama

April 19th, 2012
12:21 pm

USinUK — “planned parenthood made the secret service buy hookers??? wow. they ARE powerful.”

To borrow from Chris Rock, no one ever had to SELL a hooker. Hookers pretty much sell themselves.

Rock’s original observation was about drugs, but I trust you all get the connection.

Paul

April 19th, 2012
12:21 pm

Jack

“If I ‘m not satified with the way a company is being operated, I sell the stock and move on.”

Great leadership advice for owners, there -

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
12:22 pm

The complete and utter stupidity shown by people defending the CEO’s is mind boggling. One forgets how dense and mind numbingly insipid these neocon sheep really are until something like this comes along.

Then they start parroting their favorite right wing talk show host and tossing out phrases that have so little bearing on the situation that it’s scary to see how anyone could think they do.

“Let the market work”
“Communism”
“Damn Socialists”

Just damn. And THESE are the folks who want to run the Country……..

F. Sinkwich

April 19th, 2012
12:22 pm

I guess Joe H. doesn’t do math well.

If for example you own 10% of a company’s shares before a split, you’ll still own 10% afterwards.

Duh.

Joe Hussein Mama

April 19th, 2012
12:23 pm

B. Badnoff — “Should I send the money to the campaign to give us four more years of The Light That Illuminates the Universe or save it for a possible rendezvous with Colombian massage therapists?”

Neither. Sell the stock, write the capital loss off against this year’s capital gains and then invest the proceeds in a subscription to Barron’s, the Wall Street Journal and the Financial Times. Do something productive with your assets instead of griping about how the old gray dividend ain’t what she used to be.

getalife

April 19th, 2012
12:24 pm

Paul,

There are many things that crawl out of the swamp.

Swamp People eats all of them.

RP

April 19th, 2012
12:26 pm

Citigroup shares have gone from $300 a share to $35 dollar a share….but that actually includes a reverse stock split last year, so really shares have gone from $300 a share to $3.50 a share. As a stockholder who voted against this raise I am pretty perturbed that the executives of this company think they are doing a good job.

barking frog

April 19th, 2012
12:26 pm

F.
Bo is now three-legged,
you don’t eat a dog that
expensive all at one time.

Joe Hussein Mama

April 19th, 2012
12:26 pm

F. Sinkiewicz — “I guess Joe H. doesn’t do math well. If for example you own 10% of a company’s shares before a split, you’ll still own 10% afterwards. Duh.”

I guess Fishy doesn’t pay attention well. If your new shares are NON-VOTING shares, you actually *lose* voting power.

D’oh! (laughing, pointing) :D

Mary Elizabeth

April 19th, 2012
12:27 pm

Dirty Dawg, excellent points at 11:26 am, and I would add that through those stealthy manueverings, among others, this nation’s “Age of Greed” consciousness has been extended. It’s past time for the dawn to break and to shine its light on this avarice, which is not what our nation was designed to perpetuate.

Also, I want to take this opportunity to thank you for your very kind remarks regarding my post of a few days ago.

Paul

April 19th, 2012
12:28 pm

Doggone/GA

“See, here’s how it’s not a lie: all those “other so-called Christian Universities aren’t really run by TRUE Christians””

Excellent point. By their reckoning, they’re probably the ONLY Christian university -

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
12:29 pm

“By their reckoning, they’re probably the ONLY Christian university”

Exactly!

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
12:29 pm

Yo getalife: Is this some of your kin? (watch at least until the fish cuts her leg lol).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WrX7q-a9b2M&feature=related

Paul

April 19th, 2012
12:29 pm

getalife

“Swamp People eats all of them.”

I guess that answers the question, “Whatever happened to Adrienne Barbeau?”

Adam

April 19th, 2012
12:32 pm

MiltonMan: Please point out where my definitions are “made-up”.

You haven’t given any definitions at all, yet you expect others to. I await your own definitions, at which point I will point out if you made them up or not based on the merits.

Oscar

April 19th, 2012
12:32 pm

The shareholders vote and elect the members of the Board. Time to start getting organized and run some candidates who will vote to reduce saleries. Considering the number of shareholders in large corporations, that would take a lot of money and organiztion, with little payoff. Only alternative is for voters to vote for candidates for congress that will pass more effective laws to give shareholders more say.

In order words, vote democrat, not GOP.

Adam

April 19th, 2012
12:35 pm

Of course you will not hear – nicely swept under the carpet by our friendly liberal media.

Sorry dude, the media is mostly conservative, not liberal. I have pointed out previous studies on the matter, but a new one out yesterday reinforces the point:

http://www.fair.org/index.php?page=4519

Now go ahead and tell me you don’t trust the source, defining it as liberal, because you have no REAL defense against this.

You guys should be happy, you’re getting your way and everyone is listening to you more than the liberals. But noooooo, it has to be all 100% conservative or else there’s no “balance.” The irony is not lost on the rest of the world.

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
12:36 pm

By their reckoning, they’re probably the ONLY Christian university

I know your tongue is in cheek, but when you hear some folks going on about criticism that is “anti-Christian”, generally what they really mean is “anti-MY BRAND OF Christianity, which is the only real version worthy of mention.”

And not to sound like a broken record, but I’ve yet to find anyone among our regular commenters, who claims to be pro-religious liberty, who is willing to denounce the states that either have passed, or are in the process of passing, blatantly discriminatory laws aimed at Muslims.

Oscar

April 19th, 2012
12:37 pm

barking frog

April 19th, 2012
11:51 am
let them use CAPS..

________

No, not caps. Anything but caps.

getalife

April 19th, 2012
12:37 pm

Fred,

She is a good shot but does not hold on to the gars and got her tore up.

The gars have sharp teeth so don’t swim in the swamp.

There is another show about rednecks in Monroe that made millions on duck calls.

That family is hilarious.

Adam

April 19th, 2012
12:38 pm

stands: so for the record, it’s taken the Team Mittens Rapid-Response sub-committee five years to get around to read a political opponent’s memoirs, to see if there might be something in there worth using.

By comparison, liberal outlets only took 3-4 days to find a clip of Romney equating work to employment and contrasting it with being a stay at home mom, after the phony outrage over the “she never worked a day in her life” comment.

getalife

April 19th, 2012
12:38 pm

Oops her leg.

Adam

April 19th, 2012
12:39 pm

stands: Apparently 9 lines = “dissertation” at Winger U.

And apparently a bill can’t be 2700 pages if you expect a Supreme Court justice to actually READ IT before rendering a decision to strike the whole thing down.

Paul

April 19th, 2012
12:40 pm

sfd

Okay…

I do denounce all those self-serving bigots who don’t understand the Constitution who are trying to impose anything other than live-and-let-live policies for all our citizens.

Why not

April 19th, 2012
12:42 pm

let them make all the business decisions, then?

Becky

April 19th, 2012
12:42 pm

Fess up people-anyone know any graduates of Liberty U? I do not. Are they banished to the everafter if they don’t graduate and enter the preaching and passing the plate field?

Adam

April 19th, 2012
12:43 pm

Butch: Well, since Cox is a privately held company,I would say it’s you who needs to learn the difference between apples and oranges.

Not a new thing for RB. He makes many leaps that have no sound logical basis to anyone except himself and maybe some other simple minded and easily persuaded individuals.

I suspect when I furnish my study results he will have at least one excuse why he’s still right about all his workers just wanting to be lazy, and THAT is the only reason why they won’t stay. :roll:

RB from Gwinnett

April 19th, 2012
12:44 pm

“Sorry dude, the media is mostly conservative, not liberal”

Earth to Adam, come in please….

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
12:44 pm

I miss your point dB (12:36). From what I read, the States you refer to passed laws thta clarify that OUR laws and OUR Constitution supercede Sharia law. What’s so horrible about that? You might be a freaking Celtic Druid, but that exempt you from United States murder laws if you try to engage in human sacrifice.

You are making a mountain out of a mole hill as are the hard line extremist Muslims who wish to live by 3rd century laws. Citing the Koran is NOT an acceptable defense for hacking off the right hand of a thief anymore than using the Bible strictures that it’s ok to beat your wife as long as the stick is no bigger around than your thumb.

Better pick a better hill to die on or to put your fainting couch on……..

barking frog

April 19th, 2012
12:45 pm

If 40 million can’t afford
health insurance, how
is ordering them to
buy it going to help?

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
12:46 pm

RB from Gwinnett

April 19th, 2012
12:44 pm

“Sorry dude, the media is mostly conservative, not liberal”

Earth to Adam, come in please….
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

RB don’t waste your breath. Adam himself is merely “moderately” democratic, not a flaming liberal lol.

Adam

April 19th, 2012
12:47 pm

RB: Earth to Adam, come in please…

You are one of the very last people to talk about coming from a position of being in any small way “grounded” in reality.

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
12:47 pm

I do denounce all those self-serving bigots who don’t understand the Constitution who are trying to impose anything other than live-and-let-live policies for all our citizens.

heh. somehow I don’t think of you when I think of those who whinge about the “religious liberty” at inopportune times, but thanks.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
12:47 pm

Becky

I know two graduates of Liberty

One is surely right wing and the other is more of a moderate

USinUK - ex-pat thug

April 19th, 2012
12:48 pm

““By their reckoning, they’re probably the ONLY Christian university””

well that would DEFINITELY clear up the “no, we won’t cover BC pills because we’re a Christian university” issue …

Adam

April 19th, 2012
12:48 pm

Those who think the media is liberal are just thinking that because they’ve been trained to. Actual recent data shows otherwise. I have lots of proof, but if you’re just going to sit there and not believe it no matter what proof I give you, there’s no point. Personally, I expect better of you, Fred.

Paul

April 19th, 2012
12:51 pm

sfd

Just trying to get the ball rolling.

But… I think it already stopped.

barking frog

April 19th, 2012
12:52 pm

Fred™
please stop disappointing
Adam.

RB from Gwinnett

April 19th, 2012
12:56 pm

Adam, “You are one of the very last people to talk about coming from a position of being in any small way “grounded” in reality.”

Coming from you, Adam, that is totally meaningless to me.

Mick

April 19th, 2012
12:56 pm

The liberal media is a myth…

paulo 977

April 19th, 2012
12:58 pm

jay…….This is not government interference in free markets; this is stockholders regaining just the slightest bit of control over their own property. And it is almost inexplicable to me that Republicans view it as a bad thing.
__________________________________________

Sure it is a bad thing for them…. they still hold themselves ‘ masters’ in a master/ worker relationship!….. The unfortunate part is that the large base of the republican party has a large segment that is oblivious to the fact that they support a party that has no interest in serving them by catering to their needs and interests !!!

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
12:59 pm

Let’s see this “proof” there Adam lol. And while you are at it, show me where the AJC has given their endorsement to a Republican candidate for any MAJOR State or federal office (where a Democrat is running, it doesn’t count if there are two pubs and no Dem).

I’ll wait.

getalife

April 19th, 2012
12:59 pm

corporate media give the gop a free pass on their unpatriotic behavior.

Oscar

April 19th, 2012
12:59 pm

Adam

April 19th, 2012
12:48 pm
Those who think the media is liberal are just thinking that because they’ve been trained to. Actual recent data shows otherwise. I have lots of proof, but if you’re just going to sit there and not believe it no matter what proof I give you, there’s no point. Personally, I expect better of you, Fred

___

I spent a few minutes on google looking at recent studies and could not find a single one that said that media had a conservative biase. All the ones I could find reported a liberal bias.

Would like to know about the studies you found.

barking frog

April 19th, 2012
1:00 pm

The Constitution prohibits
the Congress from
establishing a religion or
stopping the practice of
religion which is also
binding on all governments.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
1:01 pm

“show me where the AJC has given their endorsement to a Republican candidate ”

That is not a NEWS function, that is an EDITORIAL function.

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
1:01 pm

From what I read, the States you refer to passed laws thta clarify that OUR laws and OUR Constitution supercede Sharia law. What’s so horrible about that?

well at best, it’s utterly superfluous–we don’t need local laws piling on what’s already clearly in our constitution.

but there are two other issues that should be seriously considered.

1) it is clearly aimed directly at Muslims; it sends a pretty nasty message to millions of American citizens. but beyond that

2) consider any number of legal agreements private citizens might work out between one another. Wills, property settlement disputes, etc. Such state laws open the doors for these otherwise legal documents to be challenged because they may have been composed with the assistance of islamic tribunals, or simply in accordance with islamic principals.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
1:02 pm

Fred

Better yet.. why don’t you show Adam the “liberal bias” in an non editorial AJC article from today?

That will settle it for sure

Adam

April 19th, 2012
1:02 pm

Fred™
please stop disappointing
Adam.

Yeah follow the RULES Fred :roll:

Fred, Oscar, I already posted one such study. Did you really just miss it?

Fred: And what does the AJC endorsing a Republican candidate have to do with the media, as a whole, being mostly conservative or mostly liberal? You do realize I am speaking of more than one outlet right?

Hold on while I go and get the studies.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
1:03 pm

“All the ones I could find reported a liberal bias.”

And did they give examples of NEWS stories that were slanted liberal?

paulo 977

April 19th, 2012
1:04 pm

Adam….Sorry dude, the media is mostly conservative, not liberal. I have pointed out previous studies on the matter, but a new one out yesterday reinforces the point:
__________________________________________

Absolutely …. MSNBC is the only reporter of facts

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
1:04 pm

Adam

And you show Fred and RB a non editorial article from Fox or the Moonie Times that has “conservative bias”

Maybe that will stop the crying all around

Or will it?

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
1:05 pm

I see no issue here. What’s wrong with giving shareholders the right to vote on runaway executive compensation? I don’t like govt getting involved but govt isn’t getting involved. They are just making it easier for shareholders to have more say and influence- you know, the folks who actually own the company.

I also wonder if all the interlocking directorates has just created a big ole good ole boy network that is allowing boards to just pass off on ridiculous pay packages for ridiculously poor performance. This just evens things up a bit.

And how and why the hell is this man being rewarded an exorbitant amount of money for presiding over a company’s stock value declining from $300 to $35. Jeez. Doomy could do that for a cool 1 million. Some of this executive compensation for pi$$ poor performance is getting just plain ridiculous. Nothing wrong with empowering shareholders a little more to rein it in a bit.

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
1:06 pm

dB: I’ll give you that part 2 could be tricky, but part 1? I dunno. Europe has recently had a TON of problems cropping up over Sharia law. As to sending a nasty message to millins of Americans? I’m not so concerned, these same “millions of Americans” you are refering to if you are refering to Muslims, sent US a nasty message by refusing to publicly condemn the attack on the world trade center. Either one, the planes OR the bomb. They have refused to condemn ANY terrorist acts commited against the United States to the best of my knowledge. It’s hard to get worked up about folks who by their silence seem accepting of attacks against my nation and my freedoms.

But that’s just how I see it. I don’t like Baptists either lol.

Adam

April 19th, 2012
1:06 pm

Ocsar, Fred, you are free to click through any of these to their sources:

http://www.internetcampus.com/bias.htm
http://articles.latimes.com/2011/oct/17/news/la-pn-obama-press-study-20111017
and my previous one

I only get 2 links per post. Let me know if you absolutely need more proof.

Oscar

April 19th, 2012
1:06 pm

Adam

Yes, I missed it, but went back and found it. pasted below. I vaguelyI remember hearing about this when it came out.

http://www.fair.org/index.php?page=4519

RB from Gwinnett

April 19th, 2012
1:08 pm

Can we also give the people actually paying taxes a little more say in how it’s spent too? That seems fair.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
1:08 pm

TD

I’m with you……… I have no issue with what a CEO makes, however it should be transparent to all shareholders and hopefully the board ties a huge portion to company performance

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
1:08 pm

Studies like this Adam? Granted it’s from 2005, but it WAS the first one that popped up when I googled Media Bias. Noe I did not specify bias to the left or the right………

http://newsroom.ucla.edu/portal/ucla/Media-Bias-Is-Real-Finds-UCLA-6664.aspx

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
1:09 pm

I’m not so concerned, these same “millions of Americans” you are refering to if you are refering to Muslims, sent US a nasty message by refusing to publicly condemn the attack on the world trade center

Fred, you pretty much lost me there.

Oscar

April 19th, 2012
1:09 pm

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
1:03 pm
“All the ones I could find reported a liberal bias.”

And did they give examples of NEWS stories that were slanted liberal?

__________

Google news bias or news bias study and look at them yourself.

the articles i looked at gave only the results, no examples.

Adam

April 19th, 2012
1:10 pm

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
1:11 pm

“the articles i looked at gave only the results, no examples”

then how can you be certain they were judging NEWS bias and not editorial bias? They are not one and the same. NEWS media…get it?

Lyman Hall

April 19th, 2012
1:12 pm

“Why Wall Street execs want to silence their shareholders”
.
As do the Federalies want to silence its dissadents.(not a word about NDAA 2012 from the civil right loving progs)………………but the states are fighting back!

RICHMOND, Va. – On Wednesday, the Virginia legislature overwhelmingly passed a law that forbids state agencies from cooperating with any federal attempt to exercise the indefinite detention without due process provisions written into sections 1021 and 1022 of the National Defense Authorization Act.
.
Go Virginny.
Georgia should be next.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
1:12 pm

“Can we also give the people actually paying taxes a little more say in how it’s spent too? ”

It is called voting………. Problem is that too many people will vote the same goons in….. over and over and over………..

Party 1st is not a winning ticket regardless of which party

ragnar danneskjold

April 19th, 2012
1:13 pm

From the twitterverse:

Loved that old Obama commercial “My bologne has a first name, It’s B-E-N-J-I. ”

Barack Obama walks into a bar. Bartender brings his drink, and Obama says: “Hey, I ordered a greyhound, not a vodka and grapefruit!”

“I bet President Obama would never put Bo on top of a car.” Roast him on the engine instead!

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
1:13 pm

putting my post @ 1.09 another way–

Fred, your tender feefees being hurted because not enough Muslims were vocal enough on your TeeVee or your radio or your intertubes, post-9/11?

Really bad basis for determining the constitutionality of a state law.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
1:14 pm

I did I know that RB, Fred or Adam would not be running to pick a non editorial article to validate their stance on “bias”?

Somethings are just too easy

But keep up the pillow fight

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
1:15 pm

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
1:09 pm

I’m not so concerned, these same “millions of Americans” you are refering to if you are refering to Muslims, sent US a nasty message by refusing to publicly condemn the attack on the world trade center

Fred, you pretty much lost me there.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Why? Did they in fact speak out against the senseless violence? Did I miss it?
Do you have love in YOUR heart for the idiots who act like Trayvon Martin deserved to be shot down like a dog in an old western street? I don’t. They disgust me.

Oscar

April 19th, 2012
1:15 pm

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
1:11 pm
“the articles i looked at gave only the results, no examples”

then how can you be certain they were judging NEWS bias and not editorial bias? They are not one and the same. NEWS media…get it?

________

Well, I can’t be certain, and didn’t say I was. By your logic, one can never rely on the posted results of any study without checking out all the research. Don’t have time for that .

jj

April 19th, 2012
1:18 pm

Jay please publish your salary and benefits and let the readers decide if you are over or under paid. We will then decide if we keep you or vote you off the island.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
1:20 pm

“By your logic, one can never rely on the posted results of any study without checking out all the research.”

Nope, but you could make the elementary determination that the study actually says what you claim it says. If the study IS claiming NEWS bias they ought to be capable of, at a minimum, linking to some examples of slanted NEWS reports.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
1:20 pm

“We will then decide if we keep you or vote you off the island.”

Do you own stock in Cox Enterprises?

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
1:21 pm

Did they in fact speak out against the senseless violence? Did I miss it?

Who are the “they” you speak of? Do I really need to link you to Muslims who denounced the attacks?

Jeez Louise, are thousands of Iranians Muslim-y enough for you?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5377914.stm

In Iran, vast crowds turned out on the streets and held candlelit vigils for the victims. Sixty-thousand spectators respected a minute’s silence at Tehran’s football stadium.

Seriously, dude, what kind of a crap-hole media diet have you been gorging, that you’re unaware of such things?

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
1:21 pm

Good God, Adam actually thinks the news media has a conservative bias. What is that kid smoking today? Then again what is he smoking today as opposed to any other day? The link at the bottom of the page details survey after survey after survey after survey of the media going back decades showing a ridiculous tilt towards Dem candidates that aint even close. These are numerous surveys conducted across Washington correspondents, national major newspapers, the major networks and television meda, etc. Its not even close. What manner of an abject fool actually believes the media has a conservative bias?

In March and April 2005, the University of Connecticut’s Department of Public Policy surveyed 300 journalists nationwide — 120 who worked in the television industry and 180 who worked at newspapers and asked for whom they voted in the 2004 presidential election. In a report released May 16, 2005, the researchers disclosed that the journalists they surveyed selected Democratic challenger John Kerry over incumbent Republican President George W. Bush by a wide margin, 52 percent to 19 percent (with 1 percent choosing far-left independent candidate Ralph Nader). One out of five journalists (21 percent) refused to disclose their vote, while another six percent either didn’t vote or said they did not know for whom they voted.

More than half of the journalists surveyed (52%) said they voted for Democrat John Kerry in the 2004 presidential election, while fewer than one-fifth (19%) said they voted for Republican George W. Bush. The public chose Bush, 51 to 48 percent.

When asked “generally speaking, do you consider yourself a Democrat, Republican, an Independent, or something else?” more than three times as many journalists (33%) said they were Democrats than said they were Republicans (10%).

While about half of the journalists said they were “moderate,” 28 percent said they thought of themselves as liberals, compared to just 10 percent who said they were conservative.

One out of eight journalists (13%) said they considered themselves “strongly liberal,” compared to just three percent who reported being “strongly conservative,” a four-to-one disparity.

When asked about the Bill of Rights, nearly all journalists deemed “essential” the right of a fair trial (97%), a free press (96%), freedom of religion (95%) and free speech (92%), and 80 percent called “essential” the judicially-derived “right to privacy.” But only 25 percent of the journalists termed the “right to own firearms” essential, while 42 percent called that right “important but not essential,” and 31 percent of journalists rejected the Second Amendment as “not important.”

http://archive.mrc.org/biasbasics/biasbasics3.asp

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
1:21 pm

meant to say “How did I know…………..”

My bad

Mick

April 19th, 2012
1:22 pm

ragnar

Those dog jokes were rather weak…if you are gonna go there at least try to throw us a good bone…

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
1:23 pm

Fred, is your wiki broken, I wonder?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reactions_to_the_September_11_attacks

Muslim Americans

In a Joint Statement by American Muslim Alliance, American Muslim Council, Association of Muslim Scientists and Engineers, Association of Muslim Social Scientists, Council on American-Islamic Relations, Islamic Medical Association of North America, Islamic Circle of North America, Islamic Society of North America, Ministry of Imam W. Deen Mohammed, Muslim American Society and Muslim Public Affairs Council, stated:[5]

“American Muslims utterly condemn the vicious and cowardly acts of terrorism against innocent civilians. We join with all Americans in calling for the swift apprehension and punishment of the perpetrators. No political cause could ever be assisted by such immoral acts.”

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
1:25 pm

“One out of eight journalists (13%) said they considered themselves “strongly liberal,” compared to just three percent who reported being “strongly conservative,” a four-to-one disparity”

Yep, that’s the one that gets quoted every time this subject comes up…again. That does not prove NEWS bias. Only slanted NEWS stories would prove NEWS bias…and I have yet to see anyone come up with a study that found slanted NEWS stories.

Oscar

April 19th, 2012
1:25 pm

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
1:20 pm
______

What’s your point. My statement said that most of the articles I looked at reported a liberal bias.

What does your research show.

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
1:26 pm

Adam, should I point out to TD that a majority of assembly line workers votin’ Democrat don’t make the plant “librully biased”, or do you want to have some fun with that?

Mick

April 19th, 2012
1:26 pm

ragnar

Errr….make that a funny bone…

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
1:27 pm

dB: The “constitutionality” of the laws has already been proven. I cited you two very good and very specific examples. Nor will females be forced into the barbaric Sharia law practice of genital mutilation.

Again, all I see is a reaffirmation of US law over Sharia law. I’m sorry you feel the Muslims have the “right” to do as they please and piss all over US law. I don’t see it that way. It’s no more an issue of “religious freedom” than is the case of making “christian” employers follow American laws on birth control and such.

How do you see it as a difference? Because one is Muslim and one is Christian?

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
1:28 pm

you feel the Muslims have the “right” to do as they please and piss all over US law.

Kindly cite where I’ve asserted such a thing.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
1:28 pm

“What does your research show”

That when asked, NO ONE has been able to give even one example of a slanted NEWS story.

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
1:29 pm

jj

April 19th, 2012
1:18 pm

Jay please publish your salary and benefits and let the readers decide if you are over or under paid. We will then decide if we keep you or vote you off the island.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Now THAT was particularly insipid. But sadly, that illogical blather is typical of today’s ‘Republican.”

And jj actually THINKS he/she said something clever, insightful, AND witty.

Just damn.

Jimmy62

April 19th, 2012
1:31 pm

I’d be willing to bet that most of the GOP members who are against this haven’t been up for election since the Tea Party got started.

ragnar danneskjold

April 19th, 2012
1:33 pm

Dear Mick @ 1:22, ha.

Throw the Bookman at 'em

April 19th, 2012
1:34 pm

Jay, you should get double the pay for having to deal with the misguided, mental-midget and mean-spirited masses that come to this space. Bravo, brother!

ragnar danneskjold

April 19th, 2012
1:34 pm

Dear Mick, speaking of lame jokes, Why did Michelle Obama buy a three-legged dog? She wanted Barack to eat lean meat!

TiredOfIt

April 19th, 2012
1:36 pm

Put all of their pay on a W2.

Recon 0311 2533

April 19th, 2012
1:38 pm

“and I have yet to see anyone come up with a study that found slanted NEWS stories.”

Bernard Goldberg who has worked in the MSM and several years at CBS has written books on the subject one simply entitled ‘Bias”. BTW…he identified himself as a liberal for several years but became disenchanted with the news media because of the pervasive left wing slanted reporting.

Union

April 19th, 2012
1:38 pm

news IS biased.. just depends on which side of the fence youre on as to the slant of the bias. case in point… the media has it in for suv’s.. they always cause wrecks, kill people, etc. cars never seem to.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
1:38 pm

“he identified himself as a liberal for several years but became disenchanted with the news media because of the pervasive left wing slanted reporting.”

Got an example?

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
1:40 pm

Fred, one last thing–I’ll let a guy who is a whole lot more eloquent than I am explain some of this…

On the movement to ban Shariah law in America

“It’s crazy, basically. It’s this idea that Shariah is some kind of movement to take over the United States or a conspiracy to overturn American freedoms. That isn’t what Shariah is. There are certainly hard-line interpretations of Islamic law. But these measures don’t even claim to restrict themselves to that. They claim to prevent the courts from taking any account at all of the Shariah, which potentially means that a court can’t, for example, take account of someone’s will. If someone says they want to be buried according to Muslim rituals laid down in the Shariah, a court would theoretically not be able to take account of that. And, of course, it’s possible to say, ‘That’s not what the law’s aimed at. The law’s aimed at something very different.’ But as everyone should know by now, liberties begin to erode when you have laws that are too widely drawn.

“And laws which say that under no circumstances can a court take any account of the Shariah are necessarily discriminatory. They’re necessarily over-broad. And they necessarily create communal dissension for no good purpose. Because it’s perceived by Muslims as an attack on Islam. … I am absolutely sure that many of the people who support the laws and their sponsors are genuinely motivated by fear of Islamic extremism. Islamic extremism is something which I’m fearful of. I was around on Sept. 11 and July 7 here in London when Islamic extremists blew lots of people up. I’m no fan of violent extremism from Muslims, but these laws don’t target that. They simply target the body of beliefs that Muslims call the Shariah.”

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
1:41 pm

dB: Your whole “stand” on the issue screams to me that you think it’s perfectly acceptable for Sharia Law to supersede US law. What other conclusion is there to draw? I have already explained how I don’t see these new “laws” as anything evil. Redundant? Maybe, but so often in today’s thinking if something isn’t specifically “prohibited” it’s allowed. People go to weird extremes to try to “prove” their abhorrent behavior is “protected” by the bill of rights or Constitution.

Just the other day on the new liberal talk radio station (thanks for reminding me about that even though you did it indirectly and without knowledge lol) I heard one of the hosts justifying universal healthcare by stating “Life, Liberty and the pursuit of happiness.” How can you have LIFE without proper healthcare. How can you pursue HAPPINESS if you are sick blah blah……………

Whatever man. I don’t see the conflict on that one anymore than I saw the big deal on some city denying a Mosque due to zoning laws. My buddy had a Christian church be denied for the same reason. It happens.

Sharia law IS a big issue to Muslims and they HAVE been trying to use it to circumvent laws and Gov’t through out the world. A little preventive measures here are peachy keen to me. I don’t want to follow Sharia law anymore than I want to follow Baptist or Catholic law……….

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
1:42 pm

LOL dB; We keep posting at roughly the same time…….

Recon 0311 2533

April 19th, 2012
1:42 pm

“Got an example?”

Read his book it’s filled with them.

Oscar

April 19th, 2012
1:42 pm

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
1:28 pm
“What does your research show”

That when asked, NO ONE has been able to give even one example of a slanted NEWS story

_________

Knock yourself out reading these.

http://www.akdart.com/med6.html

Adam

April 19th, 2012
1:44 pm

Thulsa: Your post has two flaws. One, it cites the same 2005 study that has already been presented, which is contradicted by the more recent studies that I posted. 2) It fails to recognize the difference between news bias and editorial bias.

They BOTH suck: Two of the links I posted may be editorial articles, but the studies which they base their editorial on are not.

Mick

April 19th, 2012
1:46 pm

Bernie goldberg = hack, enough said…

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
1:46 pm

We keep posting at roughly the same time…

yeah.

I don’t want to follow Sharia law anymore than I want to follow Baptist or Catholic law…

also yeah.

Look, I loathe hard-line religious extremism and would never argue on behalf of their perceived right to stone adulterers, or to discriminate against gays or whatnot. That’s not the point I was making against these backwater a-holes’ legislation, not at all.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
1:46 pm

“Knock yourself out reading these.”

Sorry, that link won’t open from where I’m logged in. But I’ve never heard of “akdart” – are they a news media organization? If the news is SO slanted “liberal” is should SURELY be supremely easy to find examples in the NEWS media. Give it a try, see what you can find.

Oscar

April 19th, 2012
1:47 pm

Recon 0311 2533

April 19th, 2012
1:48 pm

“Bernie goldberg = hack, enough said…”

mick, I would wager you never read his book.

Adam

April 19th, 2012
1:49 pm

And if you guys are seriously looking for books on the subject, this one is a good one, full of examples and cites for your reading pleasure:

http://www.amazon.com/What-Liberal-Media-Truth-about/dp/0465001777

Now, granted, it’s a 2003 book. But that’s why I cite more recent studies. Another thing to note is you are not likely to find many sources claiming outright conservative media bias, because of the fact that conservative media bias likes to clamp down on dissent hard and fast. Plus, there’s just no money in claiming that the media is conservative. There is PLENTY of dollars for anyone who publishes claiming the media is liberal, even if it’s a flawed analysis.

Adam

April 19th, 2012
1:50 pm

And btw, I’ve made this case at least twice before. It seems some of you have collective amnesia about that. I’m not talking about Oscar and Fred, as they do not seem to have been around when I did this before.

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
1:51 pm

Adam: Really? You provide a study that compares 4 talk shows on Sunday morning, anotheron ethat compares FOX news and Wolf Blitzer and that is “proof” lol? Ok. I guess it WASN’T you who said that FOX is cable and therefore not representative of the ‘media.”

Wow.

Adam

April 19th, 2012
1:51 pm

stands: Adam, should I point out to TD that a majority of assembly line workers votin’ Democrat don’t make the plant “librully biased”, or do you want to have some fun with that?

Feel free. I’m trying to stick entirely to factual data here and see what happens :D

Butch Cassidy

April 19th, 2012
1:52 pm

RB from Gwinnett – “Can we also give the people actually paying taxes a little more say in how it’s spent too?That seems fair.”

Sure, but first I suggest an intelligence test. First question: Do you know the differnce between a “publicly” traded company and a “privately” held one? Oops, You already failed RB. No input for you on tax policy. However, if you can tell me what Cox Communication shares are trading at today, I may give you a pass.

Mick

April 19th, 2012
1:52 pm

recon

Your wager would be a winner, except I did peruse a few chapters which left me very unimpressed or convinced of his viewpoint…

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
1:53 pm

“They BOTH suck: Two of the links I posted may be editorial articles, but the studies which they base their editorial on are not.”

Adam if it is so pervasive one way or another why can’t you find an article from today

Smae goes for RB and Fred

All three of you were in a pillow fight and produced studies that the other side denounced……

Articles? Not so much

But keep the pillow fight going……. You three might even progress into thumb wrestling

Matti

April 19th, 2012
1:53 pm

Big oil companies get a 5800% return on every dollar they spend on Congress.
http://www.bartcop.com/oil-lobby-zz.jpg

I can’t afford to pay my Congressman enough to care what I think! Dang.

Logical Dude

April 19th, 2012
1:54 pm

Adam
April 19th, 2012 1:10 pm Fred, Oscar: There’s also THIS little piece of propaganda masquerading as a fact check:

I checked the link, and if you actually read the article, the headline is WRONG. It has a rating of PANTS OF FIRE. (pretty much their highest level of lying).

So, please read the article that you post to, and not just the headline. :)

So, yes, Republicans HAVE introduced many jobs bills.

Adam

April 19th, 2012
1:54 pm

Fred: I guess it WASN’T you who said that FOX is cable and therefore not representative of the ‘media.”

You are correct, I did not say that. It would be foolish to ignore Fox as a media outlet, since a lot of people watch it. Besides, if I include MSNBC at all, I have to include anything and everything that has more viewership and calls itself news.

And I suggest you read the cited material more carefully. You seem to be looking for anything you can superficially use to prove me wrong.

Adam

April 19th, 2012
1:56 pm

Logical Dude: So, please read the article that you post to, and not just the headline.

I did read the article, as you can see from my complete takedown here:

http://www.leftrazoredge.com/2012/01/26/politifact-is-no-longer-relevant/

I’ll take your apology on your statement any time you’re ready.

So, yes, Republicans HAVE introduced many jobs bills.

You will also see why this is NOT true if you read my takedown.

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
1:56 pm

Look, I loathe hard-line religious extremism and would never argue on behalf of their perceived right to stone adulterers, or to discriminate against gays or whatnot. That’s not the point I was making against these backwater a-holes’ legislation, not at all.

I think I see what you are saying now. It’s the “law of unintended consequences” that you are worried about. Like with the ADA (Americans with Disabilities Act). It was a good idea but too broad. Now we have lawsuits by narcoleptics who get turned down for jobs as truck drivers or quadriplegics who get turned down for jobs tossing packages around…………

Or the same problems gay couples have with wills even though they have been drawn up legally. “Straight” family members come in challenge and get everything tossed because of a t that wasn’t crossed right or something.

Time to go. Later.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
1:58 pm

“And btw, I’ve made this case at least twice before. It seems some of you have collective amnesia about that”

The Grand Pu Bah…… arbitrator of all that is right…….. in his mind

Dude….. you need to chill sometimes. While we probably agree on many issues…… you are not the end all of end all on any given issue

But you have pizazz……. That can be a good thing

276 more days

April 19th, 2012
1:58 pm

Oscar

April 19th, 2012
1:06 pm

Adam

Yes, I missed it, but went back and found it. pasted below. I vaguelyI remember hearing about this when it came out.

http://www.fair.org/index.php?page=4519

Oscar, Did you happen to see the period they were talking about, duh, not too many Democratic runners for the POTUS, but there were a lot of the Republicans, kinda like that was where the news was

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
1:59 pm

Adam,

Wrong sir. My post has not one but numerous articles on media bias. You only read one. You gotta lotta reading to do. You only had one study which is a computer based study. The first one not only didn’t show any conservative bias but actually proved my point more so than yours.

But here’s a point from doggone which is particularly comical.

“Yep, that’s the one that gets quoted every time this subject comes up…again. That does not prove NEWS bias. Only slanted NEWS stories would prove NEWS bias…and I have yet to see anyone come up with a study that found slanted NEWS stories”

Yes. Of course. And folks like Doggone and Adam actually believe that one’s bias never creeps into their reporting. Never happens folks. Ever. That’s just too funny. If you guys believe that then you probably believe in the tooth fairy. Thanks for the laugh Adam and Doggone.

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
2:01 pm

No input for you on tax policy. However, if you can tell me what Cox Communication shares are trading at today, I may give you a pass.

That is TOO easy. Shares are trading for whatever price I can talk Barbara Cox Anthony and Anne Cox Chambers to sell me stock at.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
2:01 pm

Out for a few hours…………

Adam………….. keep up the effort just don’t get so excited that you hyperventilate

saywhat?

April 19th, 2012
2:01 pm

Recon 0311 2533

April 19th, 2012
1:48 pm
“Bernie goldberg = hack, enough said…”

mick, I would wager you never read his book.
_______________________________________
I think my niece colored in it though.

Adam

April 19th, 2012
2:02 pm

They BOTH suck: Adam if it is so pervasive one way or another why can’t you find an article from today

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/04/19/new-obama-plan-test-job-keep-unemployment-benefits/

The so-called Bridge to Work program

Am I restricted to just today or can I go all week?

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
2:02 pm

“Big oil companies get a 5800% return on every dollar they spend on Congress”

Yep. Textbook case of flawed and fallacious thinking.

Oscar

April 19th, 2012
2:02 pm

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
1:46 pm
—————-

I don’t really think anyone is intentionally biased in their reporting. People report what they see. And we all see things as influenced by our own bias. Whether something is biased or not depends on your point of view.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
2:02 pm

“Yes. Of course. And folks like Doggone and Adam actually believe that one’s bias never creeps into their reporting. Never happens folks. Ever.”

What about editorial bias? News reporters have editors, do they not?

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
2:05 pm

“People report what they see. And we all see things as influenced by our own bias. Whether something is biased or not depends on your point of view.”

But the claim is not that “some people reporting the news are biased”…the claim is that the NEWS MEDIA are biased. No exceptions. There’s no proof that it is anywhere near as pervasive as that claim says.

Adam

April 19th, 2012
2:05 pm

Thulsa: My post has not one but numerous articles on media bias. You only read one.

You only posted from one article. You make no reference to any others. So, nice try.

Logical Dude

April 19th, 2012
2:05 pm

Adam: I did read the article, as you can see from my complete takedown here:
http://www.leftrazoredge.com/2012/01/26/politifact-is-no-longer-relevant/ I’ll take your apology on your statement any time you’re ready.

Thanks for the link. You probably should have posted THIS link instead of the politifact link.

I misread what your point was, since you only posted a link. and at the politifact link, they don’t explicitly say near the top that the headline is false, only an easy to miss “pants on fire” graphic.

I apologize for reading too much into your posting only a link, instead of an actual statement about the link. :)

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
2:05 pm

stands for decibels,

And going by your logic if every newspaper and tv outlet was run by acknowedged communist party members then you probably believe they would present unbiased news stories on capitalism don’tcha? To deny that they don’t inject their own biases into reporting on even a small scale is nothing short of hilarious. Gawd that’s funny.

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
2:06 pm

Are you crapping me Adam? You are using FOX.COM to ‘prove” a lack of left wing media bias?

Just damn. There went ALL hope of rational discussion. Geez, maybe I should post Huff as a rebuttal…….. oh wait, I’m not that stupid…….

My Party has ALL the answers. Your party is full of poopyheads! (formerly That Black Guy)

April 19th, 2012
2:06 pm

Paul

April 19th, 2012
10:38 am
godless heathen

“I’ve heard about Romney and his dog story, but where did this about Obama eating a dog come from?”

From MadeUpOutrage, Inc.
___________________________________________________________________________

And with the Help of BOTH sides they are realizing RECORD profits.

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
2:07 pm

The so-called Bridge to Work program

har. “From the so-called ‘President’…” one expects to read.

I’ve ingested unhealthy doses of fox news channel’s supposed “straight news”, pre- prime-time programming over the years. Used to tune in while using a gym’s treadmills mid-day.

More recently, I watched some of Fox & Friends at some diner counter where it was playing. These days, the eye-rolling and mocking tone whenever they cite an Administration initiative is pretty palpable.

And they’re entitled to do it; that’s fine, knock yerselves out. Just don’t claim to be fair and balanced.

Peadawg

April 19th, 2012
2:07 pm

“Adam,

Wrong sir. My post has not one but numerous articles on media bias. You only read one. You gotta lotta reading to do.”

Not sure what y’all are arguing about but it pretty well documented that Adam has reading comprehension problems. So don’t go too hard on ‘em, Thulsa.

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
2:09 pm

To deny that they don’t inject their own biases into reporting on even a small scale

dude. Reporters don’t run media conglomerates, ‘k?

and the biases these guys/gals inject general include a hypersensitivity to accusations of liberal bias, which leads to a whole lotta equivalency given to climate change deniers and suchlike.

Adam

April 19th, 2012
2:10 pm

Logical Dude: Accepted. I thought I was pretty clear on what my point was, but I do accept that I wasn’t.

Basically, the entire thing was
1) define what Republicans think a job bill is and what Democrats think a jobs bill is
2) Take a side – The Republican version of what a jobs bill is, is correct, the Democrat version is wrong
3) Make a rating based on taking that side.

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
2:11 pm

general include shoulda been “generally include.” or “General Lee include”.

and I *gotta* leave this time-suck. Later, maybe, if Jay’s got clean sheetz.

Adam

April 19th, 2012
2:11 pm

Fred: You are using FOX.COM to ‘prove” a lack of left wing media bias?

They BOTH suck was asking for an example of a current news article that had a slant. I found one. What’s the problem?

Mick

April 19th, 2012
2:11 pm

stands@2:09

I concur with that analysis…

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
2:11 pm

Adam,

No sir. I’ll go back and check but the link should have been posted there which enumerates various other studies and surveys going back decades. Nevertheless here it is again.

http://archive.mrc.org/biasbasics/biasbasics3.asp

Adam

April 19th, 2012
2:13 pm

Peadawg: Well documented? Show me said documentation. And btw, simply having people *assert* it isn’t good enough.

Adam

April 19th, 2012
2:15 pm

Thulsa: There are studies going back at least that far that also show conservative bias. However, my major point is that RECENTLY (and you can go back and double check my posts all about this today to make sure I am not moving goal posts) the media is more conservative than liberal. And that people who immediately reject this notion are conditioned to do so because of the years of hearing “liberal media bias” as a buzz phrase.

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
2:15 pm

and I *gotta* leave this time-suck. Later, maybe, if Jay’s got clean sheetz.

Truer word have never been spoken lol. You come on to make one comment and the next thing you know you’ve been reading and commenting for an hour or more……. and you realize how much time has been sucked away.

LOL Maybe the AJC could change the name here to Jay’s Time Suck……………

BADA BING

April 19th, 2012
2:16 pm

Missing Dog
Washington DC Area
Last Seen In the 1500-1700 Blocks, Pennsylvania Ave.
Reward

276 more days

April 19th, 2012
2:16 pm

When are you libs going to stop attacking Romney for how he spends his money and start attacking O’Bama for the way he spends your money?

Peadawg

April 19th, 2012
2:17 pm

BADA BING
April 19th, 2012
2:16 pm

:lol:

“Get back in that pot!!!”

Adam

April 19th, 2012
2:18 pm

Thulsa:
Further studies on the bias:
http://www.fair.org/index.php?page=12
98 article on the liberal media claim:
http://www.fair.org/index.php?page=2447

I am sure there is more, but like I said it’s hard to find data on this from multiple outlets since there’s more money in just playing to the pre-existing bias that there’s a “liberal media bias.”

Mick

April 19th, 2012
2:18 pm

**When are you libs**

As sson as you cons realize that congress holds the purse strings…

Oscar

April 19th, 2012
2:19 pm

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
2:05 pm
“People report what they see. And we all see things as influenced by our own bias. Whether something is biased or not depends on your point of view.”

But the claim is not that “some people reporting the news are biased”…the claim is that the NEWS MEDIA are biased. No exceptions. There’s no proof that it is anywhere near as pervasive as that claim says.

______________

Then I would agree with you. That kind of claim would be false. And would be a biased claim.

F. Sinkwich

April 19th, 2012
2:19 pm

This meme never gets old. It’s about the dog:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nEBN8wOKjMo

Adam

April 19th, 2012
2:21 pm

Doggone, Oscar: I do happen to think there is always bias in the media. However, that bias is not always based on the same straight line. For example, a news story may have bias that has nothing to do with left vs. right politics. It might also be very slight. But when it comes to political news, and political guests, and so on, the general media has been shown to lean right, rather than left, recently.

Becky

April 19th, 2012
2:25 pm

You know, Romney wishes the tale of how the family dog was strapped to a roof would just go away but don’t bet on it. This one act defines his lack of character and compassion. And Miss Ann allowed it as well.

There is no copmparison to what they did to a dog riding in the back of a pickup truck or sticking their head out the window. Your dog’s vet does not condone this either.

As far as President Obama eating a dog-he was 8 years old! and considered a delicacy where he was.

BADA BING

April 19th, 2012
2:25 pm

What do you call a POTUS with a dog?
A Vegetarian.

What do you call a POTUS with 4 dogs?
A Rancher.

jj

April 19th, 2012
2:26 pm

Fred, sorry that you are unable to enjoy a little humor. Based on your point of view and writng style it is clear you are well educated and articulate in espousing your views, it’s just too bad your sense of humor was removed somewhere along the line.
Have a good day.

Becky

April 19th, 2012
2:26 pm

And the dog jokes are not remotely funny but I guess simple minds for simple thoughts. I’m looking at you bada bing

Peadawg

April 19th, 2012
2:26 pm

Personally, Becky, I wish BOTH stories would go away. Let’s focus on the REAL issues, shall we?

Becky

April 19th, 2012
2:27 pm

Peadawg-I must hold my elected officials to higher standards than you.

276 more days

April 19th, 2012
2:28 pm

Wonder if O’Bama has ever had a Three Dog Night?

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
2:28 pm

Well now lets see. Jake Tapper of ABC openly acknowledging that Obama enjoyed a tilt from the news media.

But since I’m taking you to school Adam I might as well do it with the same guy who headed the Harvard center for journalism excellence from you know- that same computer link that you showed earlier. I got news for ya young man. He’s singing a whooooooole different tune here on media bias. It was so bad that even the liberal PBS acknowledged it.

One of the things that is the backdrop behind this is, in the first six weeks of this general election phase, in our estimate, 78 percent of the stories that we’ve studied have featured Obama as a significant presence in the stories, and 51 percent have featured McCain. Obviously, stories can feature both candidates in a significant way. That’s a 50 percent advantage for Barack Obama. Exposure doesn’t guarantee success, but it is a necessary ingredient to success, and Obama has more of that ingredient right now. And this trip helps, even if its questions are tough, if you handle those questions effectively.

In response to a probe by Woodruff about the responsibility of journalists to equalize coverage of the two candidates, Rosenstiel argued that even if Obama is more newsworthy than McCain, the media must be careful to not tilt the situation in favor of Obama:

I think there is a problem potentially if the press creates what is, in effect, an un-level playing field. Unlike other news events, the news media are, in a sense, the job interviewers on behalf of the public in a presidential campaign. And I think we have to worry, as journalists, if we disadvantage one candidate consistently over a long period of time.

But I do think that, even if newsworthiness justifies a lot of this, there is another concern that journalists have to be worried about, which is, in effect, tilting the situation so that McCain doesn’t have as fair a shot.

And, ending the segment on the note that Obama is getting unprecedented treatment by the media, Tyndall declared:

The phenomenon that we’re talking about here is not that McCain is being ignored, that he’s not able to get his word out in the mainstream media. It’s that this thing, Barack Obama, is head and shoulders a different category of treatment of a candidate that we’ve ever seen before. So it’s not that McCain is getting the short end of the stick. It’s that — you know, Obama is not getting a stick. He’s getting a different category. He’s getting a log, not a stick.

Now that even PBS has acknowledged the glowing media treatment of Obama, will the rest of the mainstream media follow suit? And more importantly, will they begin to be more fair and balanced, or will they stick to their gushing ways to help their candidate of choice?

Remember that name Rosenstiel Adam???

Reiterating the findings of a recent Project for Excellence in Journalism study, noted by NewsBusters’ Editor Matthew Sheffield, Rosenstiel also explained that Obama has received significantly more coverage than John McCain and, accordingly, the media have given Obama an advantage

Read more: http://newsbusters.org/blogs/lyndsi-thomas/2008/07/28/pbs-acknowledges-media-bias-campaign-08#ixzz1sQhVCMBc

http://www.timesfreepress.com/news/2012/jan/23/0123-fp4-tilting-on-the-scales-a-little-bit/

Adam

April 19th, 2012
2:29 pm

Personally, Becky, I wish BOTH stories would go away. Let’s focus on the REAL issues, shall we?

I’m with ya there.

Joe Hussein Mama

April 19th, 2012
2:29 pm

Doom — “The link at the bottom of the page details survey after survey after survey after survey of the media going back decades showing a ridiculous tilt towards Dem candidates that aint even close. These are numerous surveys conducted across Washington correspondents, national major newspapers, the major networks and television meda, etc. Its not even close. What manner of an abject fool actually believes the media has a conservative bias?”

Logical fallacy. Cum hoc ergo propter hoc, more commonly known as ‘correlation is not causation.’

The fact that someone voted for or supported a political candidate does not in any way establish that their reporting is or will necessarily be skewed in any specific political direction.

Seamus

April 19th, 2012
2:29 pm

I had fun on vacation. Don’t know what happened to that Obama dog. He sort of disappeared.

Peadawg

April 19th, 2012
2:30 pm

“Peadawg-I must hold my elected officials to higher standards than you.” – I never said either one was right in what they did. Eating dog and strapping a dog to the top of your car are both sick.

I just said that the dog issues distract from the economy, job, taxes, etc.

Adam

April 19th, 2012
2:31 pm

Thulsa: Jake Tapper of ABC openly acknowledging that Obama enjoyed a tilt from the news media.

Funny, that’s not what Pew Research found more recently: http://www.journalism.org/analysis_report/cr

Remember now, McCain vs Obama was in 2008. I’m talking about SINCE then.

BADA BING

April 19th, 2012
2:33 pm

Both of them have a dog story because they are trying to get a leg up on each other.

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
2:34 pm

“dude. Reporters don’t run media conglomerates, ‘k?”

stands for decibels,

Dude. CEOs of media conglomerates do not sit in the effing newsroom deciding what stories to lead with, what stories to run, etc. Jeez. The reporters, editors, etc. do all that. Do you think the CEO of Cox enterprises comes and tells Jay or the AJC news editors or editorial board what to write and what to cover? Seriously?

Oscar

April 19th, 2012
2:37 pm

Adam

April 19th, 2012
2:21 pm
_____

The only general news show I watch of the Sunday morning shows is the one hosted now by George
Stephanopoulos. I can’t say that it is biased. It seems to be represented by people from both, or all sides.
I did read that link you posted that indicates recent guest shows show a conservative male point of view. Don’t think that is true of George’s.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
2:38 pm

“Eating dog and strapping a dog to the top of your car are both sick.”

Why? Why is eating dog any different from eating rabbit, or cow, or chicken? And why is putting a dog in a crate on the roof of a car any different from putting a dog in a crate in the back of an uncovered pick-up truck?

Joe Hussein Mama

April 19th, 2012
2:40 pm

Doom — “Yes. Of course. And folks like Doggone and Adam actually believe that one’s bias never creeps into their reporting. Never happens folks. Ever.”

Nobody’s saying that. They’re saying that while it may very well happen, you haven’t demonstrated it. It’s a long road from ‘common sense says this is going to happen sometimes’ to “ZOMG LOOK RIGHT THERE, I FOUND IT.”

And you’re acting like one is automatically equal to the other.

Seamus

April 19th, 2012
2:43 pm

Doggone – People eat dogs? Is that what happened to that poor Obama mutt? I’m shocked. SHOCKED.

Peadawg

April 19th, 2012
2:43 pm

“Why? Why is eating dog any different from eating rabbit, or cow, or chicken? And why is putting a dog in a crate on the roof of a car any different from putting a dog in a crate in the back of an uncovered pick-up truck?”

To a lot of people (including me) dogs are part your family. Would I eat a family member? Um no.

Putting a dog in a crate on the top, back, front, side, etc. of a car/truck/suv is really dangerous imo. One bad bump, one bad turn and BAM the crate can pop out of the back or off the top.

That’s the last I’m saying about that. Wanna talk about real issues? Let’s do it.

BADA BING

April 19th, 2012
2:45 pm

I wish that the 2 candidates would “Sit” down together, “Shake” hands and openly discuss the issues. We could lick our wounds and begin the heeling process, find out what is really gnawing at us.

Mick

April 19th, 2012
2:46 pm

doom

**Dude. CEOs of media conglomerates do not sit in the effing newsroom deciding what stories to lead with, what stories to run, etc. Jeez. The reporters, editors, etc. do all that**

Ever heard of roger ailes? He kinda does all that…

Adam

April 19th, 2012
2:48 pm

Oscar: I agree that some either don’t have a bias or can be perceived to not have a bias, by and large. But I do see studies that indicate a more conservative slant. I also don’t see a correlation between “liberal media bias,” if correct, and public opinion following that. Seems to me that if it IS true, the opposite occurs. I happen to think it’s not true, and that news outlets have tacked too far to the right in an attempt to avoid the “liberal media” label, whether or not it is true.

Joe Hussein Mama

April 19th, 2012
2:48 pm

Doggone — “Why? Why is eating dog any different from eating rabbit, or cow, or chicken?”

We were warned about the possibility of encountering dog meat before going to Korea, and some of us asked the KATUSAs (Korean soldiers who are attached to American units to help in linguistic and cultural ways) about it. The KATUSAs looked a little uncomfortable, but they admitted that yes, some Korean people eat dog, but that it was mostly the ‘older country people’ who still did it. One KATUSA corporal told me that among those who still ate dog, a *yellow* dog was the most prized.

So far as I know, nobody in my unit found or encountered dog meat while we were over there. If anyone did, they must not have said anything about it.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
2:48 pm

“To a lot of people (including me) dogs are part your family. Would I eat a family member? Um no”

Nor would I, but I don’t expect everyone in the world to hold to MY cultural norms. I eat cow after all, and they are sacred to others who would be shocked at eating them.

“One bad bump, one bad turn and BAM the crate can pop out of the back or off the top”

Not if they are properly tied down, they don’t. And riding in a crate is much safer, overall, than letting a dog ride loose in the car.

Oscar

April 19th, 2012
2:49 pm

Tieing a dog in an open air crate on top of your car for a twelve hour drive is poor judgment. The dog sufferered acute diarrrehia and Mitt pulled over and hosed the dog and the car down and kept going. When released the dog ran away and kept running away until Mitt gave it away. Clearly, the dog suffered trama and Mitt is guilty of cruelty to animals.
Man like that does not make reasonable decisions and should not be elected president.

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
2:49 pm

“However, my major point is that RECENTLY (and you can go back and double check my posts all about this today to make sure I am not moving goal posts) the media is more conservative than liberal.’

Nope. I read your links and quite frankly the first link you posted stated essentially nothing that really supported your claim.

That brings me to your 2nd link- the computerized study from the pew research center for journalistic excellence at Harvard. Did you take the time to read the methodology of how that study is conducted? It is the only credible study that shows that Obama has received negative press? And do you know why? Its actually pretty simple if you think about it. Given the sad state of the economy, high unemployment, high deficit and debt spending, etc. all of these horrible hard news stories are going to count as automatic negative stories towards Barack Obama. Doesn’t matter that they are true. Or that they are just the everyday hard news.

And as I just pointed out to you the same guy in charge of that study is the same guy who proffered the study I just showed above where Obama enjoyed a huge press advantage in the election against McCain. Good grief people in the media didn’t even try to dispute the fact that the news coverage was biased.

Terry Moran ABC news- Obama “lowered” himself into taking the office of the presidency. Sure he did Terry. The office was beneath him huh?

The editor of Newsweek who wrote that Obama was “sorta like a God, looking down on it all”

Uh huh. Someone tell God looking down on us to do something about this horrific economic recovery.

No bias there huh Adam?

Or Chris “I get a thrill up my leg when Obama speaks” Matthews.

Speaking of God I saw where Michelle Obama stated in a passage eerily close to a biblical passage that we’ve been brought out of darkness and into the sunlight yesterday. Be sure to tell Obama um, I meant to say God, that I appreciate him bringing me out of the darkness and into his sunlight.

Adam

April 19th, 2012
2:50 pm

BADA BING: As much as I dislike the dog stories, I do find your puns hilarious :D

Mick

April 19th, 2012
2:50 pm

Dog, iguana, gator, horse, cow, what’s the freakin problem here?

Joe Hussein Mama

April 19th, 2012
2:52 pm

Mick — “Dog, iguana, gator, horse, cow, what’s the freakin problem here?”

NOM NOM NOM

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
2:53 pm

“The dog sufferered acute diarrrehia and Mitt pulled over and hosed the dog and the car down and kept going.”

And that can happen no matter where you put the crate, or even if the dog is riding loose in the car.

” When released the dog ran away and kept running away until Mitt gave it away.”

And you have proof that he did not have that problem before the ride? If the dog persistently ran away, it was much more likely to be a lifelong, ingrained habit that had nothing to do with the car ride.

“Clearly, the dog suffered trama and Mitt is guilty of cruelty to animals”

Nope, not so clear. You are correlating two things that you have no proof were related to each other. I had a dog that lived to be 15 years old who LOVED to ride in the car, in a crate, and he also had an intermiittent problem with running away. There’s no proof that the car ride had anything to do with the dog’s running away problem. Some dogs are just wanderer’s by nature.

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
2:55 pm

Oscar,

Enough about tying his crate to the roof of the car. Sheesh. Should we start complaining about the thousands if not millions of men in pickup trucks who’ve driven around with their dogs in the bed of the pickup- open to the air and open to flying 100 feet in case of an accident? Or the folks who drive with their dogs in car where the dog is completely unsecured. Millions of folks do it every day. And ya know what? If they crash fifi goes flying headfirst through that windshield. In terms of overall safety that dog attached to the top of the roof safe in a confined crate was 10 times safer than the standard by which millions of people drive around every day with their dogs completely unsecured in their cars or trucks.

Mick

April 19th, 2012
2:57 pm

doom

What can you do? It’s dog eat dog kinda day…

Joe Hussein Mama

April 19th, 2012
2:58 pm

I can haz catburger?

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
3:02 pm

“The fact that someone voted for or supported a political candidate does not in any way establish that their reporting is or will necessarily be skewed in any specific political direction.”

Joe Mama,

And if you believe that then I’ld like to sell you my beachfront condo in Omaha. To posit such nonsense strains credulity sir. Cheap too on that oceanfront condo!

Mick

April 19th, 2012
3:05 pm

**To posit such nonsense strains credulity sir**

There’s been an epidemic of that sort going around lately…

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
3:05 pm

“To posit such nonsense strains credulity sir”

So you totally and completely reject the standard that a reporter can be unbiased in their reporting? If that is true you should have NO TROUBLE AT ALL giving us hundreds of examples of biased news reporting.

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
3:06 pm

Mick,

A dog eat dog day! Tee hee. When i was a child I do vaguely remember the laotians down the street with the kids chasing a dog trying to beat and kill it for dinner. Nasty. But in the end just a cultural difference. My mom was telling me about a church lady friend of hers whose relatives out in the country still hunt and eat squireels which are just damn rodents. Nasty. I thought mom was going to lose it talking about it.

getalife

April 19th, 2012
3:06 pm

willard tortured the crap out of Seamus.

Oscar

April 19th, 2012
3:06 pm

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
2:55 pm
______

I grew up in the countryin the old days. Spent many a mile riding in the open back of the pick up truck in the open air. Enjoyed it. That was before seat belts were required. Used to drive around with dogs back there also.
Don’t see being tied to the roof in a crate though. Think that would be a different experience altogether.

Redneck Convert (R--and proud of it)

April 19th, 2012
3:07 pm

Well dropping $49 million on pay here and there can sure put a crease in the bottom line. But I reckon a person is entitled to spend money the way they want to. And corporations are persons, right? The Supreme Court says so. How’d you like if the guvmint stepped in and told you that you were paying too much for a car?

Besides, if you can buy a election by making unlimited contributions, seems to me you ought to be able to buy the person you want to run your corporation by give him unlimited pay.

As for the stockholders, F them and the horse they rode in on I reckon they can gripe a little. Long as they don’t get in the way of the big shots running the place like they want to run it.

Have a good p.m. everybody.

Becky

April 19th, 2012
3:09 pm

I think the best vp candidate for the cruel mittens is michael vick. They have the same attitude towards dogs and they have about the same intellect. Vick is almost as rich as Mittens too so they have even more in common.

Mick

April 19th, 2012
3:10 pm

doom

When I was in NYC, one of the best pics I took was of a calico cat sitting defiantly in front of a chinese restaurant off canal street – classic…

Oscar

April 19th, 2012
3:11 pm

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
2:53 pm

_______

Surely you are not suggesting that my personal bias against Romney is showing up in my reporting of the incident are you. Gads what a thought.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
3:12 pm

“Don’t see being tied to the roof in a crate though. Think that would be a different experience altogether.”

Not if it’s properly done and the dog is acclimated to being in a crate.

Joe Hussein Mama

April 19th, 2012
3:14 pm

Doom — “And if you believe that then I’ld like to sell you my beachfront condo in Omaha. To posit such nonsense strains credulity sir. Cheap too on that oceanfront condo!”

A reporter’s political affiliation does not necessarily mean that his reporting is automatically going to be biased in favor of his affiliation. Look at Mike Wallace, for crying out loud.

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
3:14 pm

“So you totally and completely reject the standard that a reporter can be unbiased in their reporting?”

I didn’t say that. Just saying that their biases and prejudices seep into their reporting. Maybe not all the time but certainly some of the time. And even if its not conscious it can happen unconsciously.

“If that is true you should have NO TROUBLE AT ALL giving us hundreds of examples of biased news reporting.”

Already did that ma’am. I’ve already given a handful of small examples with terry moran of ABC news, the newsweek editor, I could give a Dianne Sawyer example on global warming where she was blatantly trying to push the weather man into stating those tornadoes that hit Joplin,MO. and Tuscalossa, AL were the result of global warming. Poor weather guy was about shocked. And I posted an example above from the source that Adam thinks makes his case- the Pew research center, that showed incredibly lopsided coverage during the last presidential election in favor of Obama. Hell I think several of us even remember Obama being interviewed by Oreilly or someone where he tacitly acknowledged preferable media treatment. If you want to see several hundred more go to mrc.com. They’re there. And when October comes around and the overwhelming majority of major newspapers around the country all make Obama their endorsed candidate you’ll still be sitting there claiming there’s no media bias. Won’t you?

Becky

April 19th, 2012
3:14 pm

Doggone-can you not understand the poor dog was traumatized by the entire episode? A 12 hour car ride in freezing weather only to be hosed down by your owner? It is truly sickening.

Oblama

April 19th, 2012
3:15 pm

Jay – maybe subscribers to the AJC should have a say so as to who AJC hires and how much they are paid? Do you really want to go there? Stock holders, as individuals, own a small piece of a company. That does not mean they have the intelligence, knowledge or experience to give advice on how to run the company or pay it’s employees. As usual, another effort of socialists to destroy what has made this country the best place in the world to live. I have lived in Europe (Italy, Spain & Belgium) and in Australia (Sidney) and in Brazil. There is no place better than the U.S.A. Jay – I would have thought that by now you would be praising our Governor for the recent success he has had in bringing Baxter International (1,500 jobs in bio-science), Toyota, Carter’s (clothing manufacturing ) and Caterpillar (1,000 + jobs) to Georgia during this difficult economic time – with the long continued flat nation wide employment rate. Can’t bring yourself to give a non Dem credit for a good job can you?

BADA BING

April 19th, 2012
3:15 pm

TV Listings
The Food Network
Thursday April 19

8:00 Lassie
9:00 The Westminster Dog Show
11:00 Rin Tin Tin

Joe Hussein Mama

April 19th, 2012
3:16 pm

Doom — “I didn’t say that. Just saying that their biases and prejudices seep into their reporting. Maybe not all the time but certainly some of the time. And even if its not conscious it can happen unconsciously.”

I don’t reject that. I’m just saying that you haven’t *demonstrated* any cases of it.

As I said earlier, it’s a long way from ‘common sense says that this should happen sometimes’ to ‘ZOMG LOOK RIGHT THERE AT IT,’ but you’re acting like they’re next-door neighbors.

Becky

April 19th, 2012
3:17 pm

My scroll finger is working overtime today. Feel free to scroll past my posts as well.

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
3:19 pm

“A reporter’s political affiliation does not necessarily mean that his reporting is automatically going to be biased in favor of his affiliation”

Not automatically of course. But I think it seeps in there. And when the numbers are so lopsided in favor of liberal journalists i think that incremental edge in conscious or unconscious bias starts to add up. And in some cases such as with the newsweek editor, terry moran, Dan Rather, the bias just takes on a life of its own with the craziness of what they say or do. I mean Dan Rather? Good grief the guy tried to sway a presidential election with a completely bogus story weeks before the election. And then CBS called the election in florida in favor of Gore, driving away several thousand Republican voters in the central panhandle on the way home from work who didn’t bother going to vote since the election had already been called. How and why they called such a close election to Gore is nothing short of shameful.

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
3:20 pm

excuse me the western panhandle of florida

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

April 19th, 2012
3:21 pm

Jay – maybe subscribers to the AJC should have a say so as to who AJC hires and how much they are paid?

False equivalence alert.

“Customers” does not equal “owners.”

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
3:21 pm

“Surely you are not suggesting that my personal bias against Romney is showing up in my reporting of the incident are you. Gads what a thought”

Well, I have a pretty strong bias against him too…but unlike the “To posit such nonsense strains credulity sir” – I don’t have any trouble looking at the incident with UNBIASED eyes.

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
3:22 pm

Joe mama,

Then go back and read my previous posts. I’ve demonstrated several and just did a few more for ya. Or is saying Obama is “sorta like a God” not good enough fer ya??? And read the pew research center link that I posted earlier on the obama/mccain election. That one article speaks volumes.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
3:24 pm

“Doggone-can you not understand the poor dog was traumatized by the entire episode? A 12 hour car ride in freezing weather only to be hosed down by your owner? It is truly sickening”

Having had dogs for 30 years, including show and performance dogs, as well as “just plain pets” – yes, I can see that it MIGHT happen. What I can’t see is that “testimony” of someone determined to put it is as bad a light as possible is evidence that it WAS that bad.

JamVet

April 19th, 2012
3:26 pm

In other words, the executives were paying themselves more than they were worth and more than they had earned.

You still don’t get it, do you Jay?

Republican rubes LOVE getting stepped on.

They can’t get enough.

The sheep are making no more money – in real terms – than they did in the 1970s and they LOVE it!

Supply side capitalism, doncha know?

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
3:26 pm

“I don’t have any trouble looking at the incident with UNBIASED eyes”

Yes. Of course. Doggone is completely UNBIASED and without any prejudices. Uh huh.

td

April 19th, 2012
3:26 pm

Jay,

I am sure you will probably not care but I will tell you that this hard core conservative agrees with you on this article. If these executives do not want their compensation packages challenged then stay a private company. Stockholders should have a right to address what it wants to pay its CEO.

I would go for a deal that says if I (the investor) is making money then you the CEO should be rewarded handsomely but if I am losing money then you the CEO should be paying money back to the corporation.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
3:28 pm

“Yes. Of course. Doggone is completely UNBIASED and without any prejudices. Uh huh”

YOU make it a general statement….*I* limited to one PARTICULAR incident.

Becky

April 19th, 2012
3:29 pm

Doggone-Apparently it was that bad to the dog as it kept running away. I don’t buy your wandering dog story either if you have had show and performance dogs I would hope they would be in contained environment and not running loose off leash.

This story is not going away as much as Romney and his supporters wish it would.

JamVet

April 19th, 2012
3:31 pm

I say “almost inexplicable,” because blind loyalty to the top 0.001 percent is the only explanation I can offer. If you have a better one, please, let’s hear it.

Nope.

That is it.

Unfounded, unwarranted, counter-productive, self-flagellating blind loyalty to the very men who are stepping on them.

These fake conservatives have been programmed to do one thing – hate everything liberal. Even when it makes perfect sense, they will fight it because that is paramount.

They stand totally ALONE against every subset of every democracy in the entire world.

And they are fiercely proud of their collective stupidity…

carlosgvv

April 19th, 2012
3:32 pm

I’ve always believed you can tell a lot about a man by seeing how he treats his pets. Many women will tell you their fathers always told them “never trust a man who doesn’t like dogs”. Putting your family dog in a crate and tying the crate to the car roof for a long car trip indicates a deep and cold lact of feeling for anyone other than yourself. Eight years of pain, blood and death from a heartless George W. Bush was more than enough of that kind of mentality.

Peadawg

April 19th, 2012
3:32 pm

What helps you deflect from the real issues at hand, Becky.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
3:34 pm

“Doggone-Apparently it was that bad to the dog as it kept running away.”

And you are prepared to prove that the problem did not exist until AFTER that car ride…right?

” I don’t buy your wandering dog story either if you have had show and performance dogs I would hope they would be in contained environment and not running loose off leash”

Hon, that’s why I now have 6 foot fences instead of 4 foot. That particular “wanderer” was a talented fence jumper. Cost me a FORTUNE to replace my fences to keep him in. Then he turned to digging out and it cost me another small fortune to fix it so he couldn’t do that either.

BADA BING

April 19th, 2012
3:35 pm

The Pres can’t eat a Greyhound because Michelle won’t let him have fast food.

Peadawg

April 19th, 2012
3:35 pm

ditto my 3:32 to carlos as well

Oscar

April 19th, 2012
3:35 pm

Twelve hours on the top of a car going eighty on an interstate highway. does not sound good.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
3:35 pm

“Putting your family dog in a crate and tying the crate to the car roof for a long car trip indicates a deep and cold lact of feeling for anyone other than yourself”

No, actually it doesn’t. It depends on how it was done and how used to being in a crate while traveling the dog is. If effect…whether you like it or not…it’s no different from putting the dog in a crate in the back of an uncovered pick-up truck.

Redneck Convert (R--and proud of it)

April 19th, 2012
3:37 pm

Well, I would never put old Ace on the top of my truck. He rides in the front seat with me. Heck, I think so much of him I’d let him drive if it wasn’t for the cops.

Oblama

April 19th, 2012
3:37 pm

Gone today – here tomorrow

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
3:37 pm

“Twelve hours on the top of a car going eighty on an interstate highway. does not sound good”

No, if you’re not familiar with dogs that travel in crates…it doesn’t. That doesn’t neccessarily mean it IS bad. I’ve been threatened with having the SPCA called on me for having my dogs in crates at all.

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

April 19th, 2012
3:38 pm

What helps you deflect from the real issues at hand, Becky.

Moral character is the main issue we use when judging and deciding our elected leaders. Obviously, Becky finds this instance to be illustrative of Romney’s moral character.

Peadawg

April 19th, 2012
3:39 pm

Becky and carlos give Obama a pass for eating dog.

Disgusting. Absolutely pathetic.

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
3:39 pm

“can you not understand the poor dog was traumatized by the entire episode?”

Becky,

Are you a retriever mind reader? How do you know that the dog was traumatized? Did it ever occur to you that maybe he just had diarrhea and had to go? That would seem more plausible seeing as how it was a stream of poop and not a couple of poop logs. Didn’t think bout that did ya?

” A 12 hour car ride in freezing weather only to be hosed down by your owner? It is truly sickening.”

Since you were there maybe you can tell us if it was a summer vacation or if the Romneys set off for Ontario in the dead of winter. And perhaps you can tell us exactly what the temperature was that day? Or are you just ASSuming things?

Hosing the dog off? Perhaps he woulda been better off in his own feces in your little mind.

Finn McCool (Class Warfare === Stopping Rich People from TAKING MORE of OUR MONEY)

April 19th, 2012
3:40 pm

excellent article describing the difference between public debt (government) and private debt (individuals and families):

Think of federal budget deficits themselves as barometers of economic activity: when economic activity declines, tax revenues plunge and social welfare expenditures rise as more people are thrown out of work. As a consequence, in bad economic times, there are higher deficits; conversely, when prosperity returns, deficits decrease.

http://www.salon.com/2012/04/19/deficit_dogma_debunked/

Peadawg

April 19th, 2012
3:40 pm

“Moral character is the main issue we use when judging and deciding our elected leaders.”

In that case both Obama and Romney are scumbags. Eating dog vs. putting your dog on the top of the roof…hhhmmmmm……

Normal, Plain and Simple

April 19th, 2012
3:44 pm

Pea,
What is the big deal about eating dog? I ate dog in Viet Nam and while the first time was accidental, I learned that when in Rome…you know the rest. If he had a dog feast at the rose garden, then be appalled, but otherwise…come on…geez.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
3:44 pm

“In that case both Obama and Romney are scumbags. Eating dog vs. putting your dog on the top of the roof…hhhmmmmm”

There’s nothing immoral about either one…except to those who are determined to see immorality where it doesn’t exist.

Peadawg

April 19th, 2012
3:45 pm

“What is the big deal about eating dog?” – I don’t eat family members, sorry.

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
3:45 pm

I’ll bet there are people who never secured their dogs who had accidents and then watched in horror as their dogs went flying either through the windshield or through the air if they were standing up in the back of a pickup truck. The more moral thing to do would be to put them in a safe, tied down crate.

Anyone care to debate if its safer to be completely unsecured or if its safer to be tied down in a crate to where a dog isn’t going to go flying through the windshield or 100 feet in the air if they are in the bed of a truck.

I’m real curious to see someone try and say the dog woulda been safer not being in his crate.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
3:45 pm

Who let the dogs out?

Damn it is a slow news day

moonbat betty

April 19th, 2012
3:45 pm

RC Convert,

I hope your dog wears a seatbelt. If you were to get into an accident with Fido in the front seat, he would most likely be injured or killed.

Back in the early 80’s and earlier, most people didn’t wear seat belts (including kids) either.

Dogs ride in the back of pickup trucks all the time (not saying that I would do that to my dog)

Times have changed…

Surely Obama smoked on airline flights where children were confined to breathe his smoke?

Call Child Protection Services!!

Seamus

April 19th, 2012
3:46 pm

“That would seem more plausible seeing as how it was a stream of poop and not a couple of poop logs.”

Actually, I stole some turkey off the counter. Was good, too. I think the term is projectile… I actually had a good laugh watching the old f@rt hosing down the car and kennel.

Adam

April 19th, 2012
3:46 pm

Peadawg: So Obama eats dog? I wonder what is keeping him from eating Bo. I mean, if he just can’t help himself, or something, as “giving Obama a pass on eating dog” suggests….

moonbat betty

April 19th, 2012
3:47 pm

And Romney did construct a wind break for the crate so the dog would not be exposed to the wind.

Peadawg

April 19th, 2012
3:47 pm

“Who let the dogs out?”

When the party was nice, the party was jumpin’ (Hey, Yippie, Yi, Yo)

USMC

April 19th, 2012
3:47 pm

“Why Wall Street execs want to silence their shareholders”–Jay

More Party Talking Points from Obama’s WAR ON SUCCESS! :-)

Peadawg

April 19th, 2012
3:48 pm

“Peadawg: So Obama eats dog?” – You must have missed the story about Obama eating dogs when he was younger.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
3:49 pm

“I don’t eat family members, sorry.”

Maybe not, but under the right circumstances that family member WOULD eat you. It actually happened to a woman who had the same breed that I have…who died in her house and was not found until almost 2 weeks later.

Seamus

April 19th, 2012
3:49 pm

“I wonder what is keeping him from eating Bo.”

Bo is missing his right rear leg. Bo is a good dog, and even Obama won’t eat a good dog all at once.

Peadawg

April 19th, 2012
3:49 pm

Dude, USMC, ‘war on women’, ‘war on success’, etc. are soooo yesterday.

Let’s talk about the ‘war on dogs’…you know…something that reeeeaaaally matters!!!

Adam

April 19th, 2012
3:49 pm

Peadawg: No, I didn’t. The point of me saying “So Obama eats dog?” is to put it in a PRESENT context. And seeing as you didn’t notice, I can assume you think he still does this, or at least have no problem leaving the implication out there.

moonbat betty

April 19th, 2012
3:49 pm

Well at least Romney didn’t do like Griswald in Vacation and forget to untie the dog’s leash from the bumper.

Stephen

April 19th, 2012
3:50 pm

The true vulture capitalists are the CEOs like Pandit. They are where the Republicans get all their money when running for office. George H. W. Bush was in the pocket of the billionaires and his son merely referred tot them as “my supporters.” Pleasing the .001 group is a get way to get cash to run for office; it comes in large chunks.

So, we have a vicious circle: The wealthy .001 give to their friends in Congress and Congress clears the way for the .001 group to get richer and richer. Plutocracy is too kind a word to use to refer to the wealth .001 group.

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
3:50 pm

Ya’ll need to go argue with my vet who told me that a lot of dogs like their crate and view their crate as a sort of security zone where they are at ease because they feel protected from the world. Dog psychology and human psychology would be 2 different things.

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

April 19th, 2012
3:51 pm

Eating dog vs. putting your dog on the top of the roof…hhhmmmmm……

I wouldn’t classify anyone that eats dog meat as a “scumbag.” It’s not something that I would eat, but I’m not so provincial to believe that my dietary habits are moral. It’s how we treat our pets — those creatures that rely on our good judgment — that makes one a “scumbag” in my book. Why couldn’t the Romneys kennel their pet, or leave him with a trusted family member or neighbor? That would’ve been a kinder alternative to caging him to the top of a moving vehicle.

Normal, Plain and Simple

April 19th, 2012
3:51 pm

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
3:52 pm

I feel it only appropriate to bring him out given the topic.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ATPi3VQsEv0

Normal, Plain and Simple

April 19th, 2012
3:54 pm

President Obama eating dog when he was young is just another manufactured reason to foster hatred for the man. Pitiful Republican diversion.

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
3:54 pm

Reading this blog sometimes remind me of this photo…

http://edge.ebaumsworld.com/mediaFiles/picture/251172/80602679.png

*Language alert in the caption….

—————————–

“What is the big deal about eating dog?” – I don’t eat family members, sorry.

I would gather that if you were in a country that served dog meat, you wouldn’t be served YOUR pet. Don’t go to India and expect to eat any beef either. They don’t eat their family members.

Oscar

April 19th, 2012
3:54 pm

http://www.peta.org/b/thepetafiles/archive/tags/Mitt+romney/default.aspx

Home | Get Active | Living | TV | Shop | About PETA | Donate Now JoinSign in

About Us Contact Us Archives April 2012 (47) March 2012 (66) February 2012 (71) January 2012 (95) December 2011 (105) November 2011 (110) October 2011 (116) September 2011 (113) August 2011 (112) July 2011 (95) June 2011 (109) May 2011 (110) April 2011 (108) March 2011 (125) February 2011 (98) January 2011 (103) December 2010 (97) November 2010 (96) October 2010 (104) September 2010 (103) August 2010 (124) July 2010 (109) June 2010 (122) May 2010 (102) April 2010 (127) March 2010 (121) February 2010 (93) January 2010 (80) December 2009 (83) November 2009 (95) October 2009 (89) September 2009 (104) August 2009 (95) July 2009 (97) June 2009 (98) May 2009 (81) April 2009 (114) March 2009 (88) February 2009 (67) January 2009 (72) December 2008 (82) November 2008 (65) October 2008 (87) September 2008 (15) August 2008 (70) July 2008 (79) June 2008 (87) May 2008 (63) April 2008 (63) March 2008 (63) February 2008 (64) January 2008 (61) December 2007 (55) November 2007 (68) October 2007 (72) September 2007 (66) August 2007 (75) July 2007 (69) June 2007 (64) May 2007 (64) April 2007 (68) March 2007 (66) February 2007 (67) January 2007 (35) December 2006 (28) November 2006 (28) October 2006 (5)…
Mitt Romney’s Cruel VacationWritten by PETA
Posted 06-28-2007, 12:07 PM
94 Comments
Slate/Creative Commons
Did you happen to see this Boston Globe story about Mitt Romney? The reporter opened the piece with a Romney family story about Mitt strapping the family’s Irish Setter, Seamus, to the roof of his station wagon for a twelve hour drive from Boston to Ontario. When the terrified dog lost control of his bowels and his waste covered the roof and back window of the car, Romney apparently calmly pulled over and simply sprayed the car—and the dog—down with a hose and hopped back on the highway.

Unfortunately, there is no punch line; I am not kidding. The reporter thought this was a fine example of Romney’s “emotion-free crisis management” style, but who knows. Here’s what PETA’s president, Ingrid Newkirk said to an enquiring press:

“First, as a charity we can’t and don’t endorse or oppose any candidate for public office, but I can say (and not just as a person who grew up with an Irish Setter!) that any individual who does something like that may have what scientists term the absence of the mirror neuron, i.e., a pin-pointable absence in the brain of the characteristic which allows the individual to feel basic compassion. The implications are frightening. Anyone who suspects that they are not able to feel empathy for others needs to be aware of the existence of this condition. What is also worrying is that Mr. Romney seems to hold the very old fashioned idea that he needs to actively show he is heartless, hence the hunting claims he has made. Not subsistence hunting, but pride in killing defenseless animals for sport, for fun, for show. In the case of the dog on the roof of the car, if this is true, quite remarkably it obviously wasn’t for show as only his own children were watching, a lesson in cruelty that was also wrong for them to witness. There was also the obviousness of the situation. Thinking of the wind, the weather, the speed, the vulnerability, the isolation on the roof, it is commonsense that any dog who’s under extreme stress might show that stress by losing control of his bowels: that alone should have been sufficient indication that the dog was, basically, being tortured. If you wouldn’t strap your child to the roof of your car, you have no business doing that to the family dog! I don’t know who would find that acceptable. Mr. Romney needs to tell the world he realizes this was not humane. People do stupid things and one day realize it, so better late than never.”Thanks to Ana Marie Cox, founder of Wonkette, now Time.com’s Washington Editor, for noticing the story on Boston.com and jumping on it.

Adam

April 19th, 2012
3:55 pm

Anyway, the dog thing is ridiculous, on both sides, in my opinion. Even as a dog lover, I don’t see the point, politically, of focusing on either story. It doesn’t really motivate a whole lot of people against or for a candidate.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
3:56 pm

“That would’ve been a kinder alternative to caging him to the top of a moving vehicle.”

Again, not neccessarily. I had a friend years ago who could not leave her dog with anyone else, or he would not eat. She found that out when she boarded him and he almost died of starvation. She had to cut her vacation short to go and get him.

There is nothing INHERENTLY wrong with putting a crated dog on the top of a car…IF it’s done correctly, and IF the dog is used to traveling in a crate. I could do it to mine and they wouldn’t care, as long as they got to go along.

BADA BING

April 19th, 2012
3:56 pm

The Pres’s favorite dish is an obese Daschund. Cause it’s low fat.

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

April 19th, 2012
3:57 pm

Don’t go to India and expect to eat any beef either. They don’t eat their family members.

People in this country keep pigs as pets.

That ain’t gonna stop me from eating ribs.

Just sayin’.

JamVet

April 19th, 2012
3:58 pm

Stephen, look no farther than that second 3:47.

The 99% have not even moved beyond 1973 wages, yet the Repulibots think they are successful and things are just hunky dory in America.

And most of them can’t even afford their health insurance.

Insane…

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
3:59 pm

“Romney apparently calmly pulled over and simply sprayed the car—and the dog—down with a hose and hopped back on the highway”

And I’ve had to do exactly the same thing, the only difference is MY dog was IN the car and I had to hose him, the crate AND the inside of the car (well, in this case the van)

stands for decibels

April 19th, 2012
4:00 pm

Obama and Romney are scumbags. Eating dog

erm, you realize this is something that he was fed, as a boy, while in Indonesia, yes? Couldn’t have been any older than 10? How much of a choice do you think he had in the matter?

/drive-by

Joe Hussein Mama

April 19th, 2012
4:00 pm

Doom — “And then CBS called the election in florida in favor of Gore, driving away several thousand Republican voters in the central panhandle on the way home from work who didn’t bother going to vote since the election had already been called. How and why they called such a close election to Gore is nothing short of shameful.”

Try living in Hawaii. They don’t go on DST, so they’re six hours ahead of the East Coast in the summer, and five hours ahead in the fall in winter. When the polls close in Hawaii, it’s already midnight or later on the East Coast, and several states have already been called.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
4:01 pm

“The Pres’s favorite dish is an obese Daschund. Cause it’s low fat”

Ummm…not only is that not funny, it’s not even logical. “Obese” means HIGH in fat.

Oblama

April 19th, 2012
4:01 pm

K- Not true. As a subscriber to the AJC I have an investment in the AJC and should have a say so on who they hire and how much they are paid. Just attempting to “reason” like the Oblama socialists on the lunatic fringe. Perhaps the corporations should go where they are better appreciated since the current President is demonizing them. I am sure Latin America and Asia would welcome them with open arms. Share holders already have a say so. They can sell their stock.

Joe Hussein Mama

April 19th, 2012
4:02 pm

Doom — “Then go back and read my previous posts. I’ve demonstrated several and just did a few more for ya. Or is saying Obama is “sorta like a God” not good enough fer ya???”

You don’t honestly think that that sort of expression slipped into *news* reportage, do you?

I’m starting to wonder if you’re deliberately blurring the distinction between news reportage and editorial comments.

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
4:02 pm

That ain’t gonna stop me from eating ribs.

Damn right!! ;)

or Chick Fil A either because of pet chickens.

godless heathen©

April 19th, 2012
4:02 pm

PETA’s comment is brought into the discussion. This the PETA that thinks fishing is animal cruelty?

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

April 19th, 2012
4:03 pm

There is nothing INHERENTLY wrong with putting a crated dog on the top of a car…IF it’s done correctly, and IF the dog is used to traveling in a crate.

And I would think it’s up to the individual animal. The animal may be distressed even if it’s done correctly. I think there is enough evidence in this case to suspect that traveling on top of the car distressed this animal.

Please note that I used the word “suspect.” I have no proof whatsoever of conclusive evidence.

Hilary Rosen

April 19th, 2012
4:03 pm

Can we get serious here? I need to vent. I met Sandra Fluke, was going to give her my birth control pills. After all, my girlfriend can’t knock me up, and no man has passed thru here in a long time. Well, that cheap b*tch, complaining about a $9 prescription, has a new Bimmer and a new smart phone. Can you imagine the nerve? I didn’t even give her the shampoo. God knows she needs it.

Scooter

April 19th, 2012
4:04 pm

Isn’t that sweet of the Democrats to give shareholders a non-binding, advisory say, LOL? Just more feel good political pandering that has no affect other than fomenting resentment and animosity amongst Americans.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
4:04 pm

“That ain’t gonna stop me from eating ribs”

Amen to that! I couldn’t have a pig as a pet, they ALL look like pork chops on the hoof to me.

td

April 19th, 2012
4:04 pm

Dogs suck and cats rule. BTW: Where are all you pet lovers on flying your animals across the country in a non- climate controlled compartments on airplanes?

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
4:04 pm

This the PETA that thinks fishing is animal cruelty?

Not my PETA – People Eating Tasty Animals.

BADA BING

April 19th, 2012
4:06 pm

Doggone…low is the key word here….as to the ground

Joe Hussein Mama

April 19th, 2012
4:06 pm

Oblama — “As a subscriber to the AJC I have an investment in the AJC and should have a say so on who they hire and how much they are paid.”

No. You’re just a customer. If you want to be more than that, then buy some shares of Cox Communications.

You purchase a product with your subscription, which you then receive in your driveway every (most?) morning. You’re not an investor.

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
4:06 pm

td

My pets are swiming in their aquarium. They don’t go anywhere until they do the backstroke.

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

April 19th, 2012
4:06 pm

As a subscriber to the AJC I have an investment in the AJC…

Once again — “customer” does not equal “investor.”

Please invest in a dictionary, otherwise you would look like an uninformed tool.

td

April 19th, 2012
4:07 pm

JamVet

April 19th, 2012
3:58 pm

Stephen, look no farther than that second 3:47.

The 99% have not even moved beyond 1973 wages

And you are getting these numbers from where? Please do not tell us it was the same two French socialist economist that Jay referenced in his article a few days ago.

Joe Hussein Mama

April 19th, 2012
4:08 pm

Doggone — “Amen to that! I couldn’t have a pig as a pet, they ALL look like pork chops on the hoof to me.”

Did you ever see the British TV comedy The Young Ones? One of the characters had a pet pig named “Bacon Sandwich.” :D

G Mare 71( got the living' the red state BLUES!)

April 19th, 2012
4:09 pm

Too tasteless, “Hilary;” go away.

BADA BING

April 19th, 2012
4:09 pm

Obama
Batters
And
Marinates
Animals

td

April 19th, 2012
4:09 pm

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
4:06 pm

td

My pets are swiming in their aquarium. They don’t go anywhere until they do the backstroke.

LOL. My cat goes everywhere with us on vacation. He thought he was in heaven last year on the beach. I think he thought he was in the worlds largest litter box.

Adam

April 19th, 2012
4:10 pm

“You feed a pig an apple, it makes bacon. That’s magic, or the best recycling program EVER”

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
4:10 pm

In regards to animals, there are not very many that are safe back at home. Bambi’s mom has to watch her back, and so does Thumper. Being cute don’t save that hide.

:)

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
4:11 pm

JHM – no never did see that…but I’d like to have a dollar for every pet pig in the world named “pork chop”!

Oblama

April 19th, 2012
4:12 pm

Congress determines their own pay and votes themselves an annual raise despite the fact they are running a deficit year after year. If they worked for a corporation they would surely be overpaid – based on their performance. In fact if they worked for a corporation they would likely be fired for ineptness, fraud, and bringing the company near bankruptcy (the U.S.A.). They may even be in prison for insider trading, receiving bribes , etc., etc. etc. But since they are Congress and their Boss agrees with their agenda they receive little to no unbiased oversight. It is time for Congress to live like the rest of us Jay. Their power to give themselves raises should be taken from them. An independent source outside of the Fed government should have investigative oversight over the Fed’s activities and report annually to the citizens of the U.S.A. in a “stock holders” meeting. Don’t you agree?

moonbat betty

April 19th, 2012
4:12 pm

carlosgvv

April 19th, 2012
4:13 pm

I wonder if Romney’s obvious lack of compassion for his dog was caused by his Mormon upbringing? Is he thoroughly filled with that Christian myth which says people are “a little lower than the angels” and animals are just “beasts of the field”? And/or is he simply unable to feel empathy for others? We definitely don’t need a combination religious nut/sociopath in the White House.

Joe Hussein Mama

April 19th, 2012
4:14 pm

Doggone — “JHM – no never did see that…”

The same character tried to claim his pet was actually a *ferret.*

“but I’d like to have a dollar for every pet pig in the world named “pork chop”!”

Many moons ago, I used to post on Yahoo Stocks! as Porkchopicus of Borg. ;)

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
4:14 pm

“You feed a pig an apple, it makes bacon. That’s magic, or the best recycling program EVER”

Between that one and the pork chops on the hoof, my stomach’s cramping from laughing so hard….. :lol:

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
4:15 pm

Ya’ll can have your pigs. But if you eff with my jackass and my 2 goats that amble up to my back fence for some apples and carrots then I’m on your ass. Same with my shi-Tzu. But now if you steal and make a small sausage out of my girlfriend’s annoying little chihuahua then I’ll have to send you a thank you card- and a check. And the excedrin that I will no longer need.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
4:16 pm

Bro – “and so does Thumper”

Did you know that rabbits are one of the few animals that will not protect their young? A doe rabbit will abandon her young to save herself.

td

April 19th, 2012
4:20 pm

Doggone/GA,

They know it only takes about 8 more weeks to pop out another 8 to 10.

Reminds me of some other category but I will not say it or the blog may explode.

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

April 19th, 2012
4:21 pm

And the excedrin that I will no longer need.

Some unsolicited advice — Excedrin is a combination of acetaminophen, aspirin, and caffeine. People who drink alcohol should never take acetaminophen due to the risk of liver damage.

Butch Cassidy

April 19th, 2012
4:22 pm

Oblama – “Not true. As a subscriber to the AJC I have an investment in the AJC and should have a say so on who they hire and how much they are paid. ”

Yeah, that’s just stupid. Ever wonder why you don’t get a shareholders report when you buy a 7 layer burrito at Taco Bell? Or, do you feel that every purchase you make should come with a proxy voter form?

Oblama

April 19th, 2012
4:25 pm

Even CEO’s don’t have the power to give themselves annual raises – but Congress does. Time for oversight of Congress from an outside the Fed , independent source.

carlosgvv

April 19th, 2012
4:25 pm

Doggone/GA

Dogs are pack animals. They belong with you and your family. It you take it upon yourself to own a dog, you are responsible for treating it properly. That means you let the dog stay in the house most of the time , not in a dog house in the back yard, and you do NOT crate the dog and tie dog and crate on top of a car.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
4:25 pm

“People who drink alcohol should never take acetaminophen due to the risk of liver damage”

Not a problem for me…I can’t take anything with aspirin in it anyway

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
4:26 pm

“They know it only takes about 8 more weeks to pop out another 8 to 10″

Yeah, well…there’s a LOT of truth to “breeding like rabbits”!

carlosgvv

April 19th, 2012
4:27 pm

Peadog – 3:35

My 3:32 post was an indication of how Romney’s treatment of his dog reflects a serious character defect that we don’t need in the White House. Are you so dense you couldn’t see that?

Oblama

April 19th, 2012
4:29 pm

B.C. – What a great idea from the left. We should receive an annual report from every service and product we pay for. Then there would be as much expense and red tape as with the inept Fed government. THANKS!

Paul

April 19th, 2012
4:30 pm

Okay, I gotta admit – as tiring and as questionable as I find the general (not individualized) outrage over the dog in a crate story, I laughed out loud reading those exchanges. Especially visualizing the bloggers while posting.

Doggone/GA

“And riding in a crate is much safer, overall, than letting a dog ride loose in the car.”

That is the most salient point I’ve yet heard. Why didn’t talking heads note that? Answer: because it doesn’t advance their political agenda. In fact, it discredits them and would not only dial the hysteria back, it should defuse it.

Bada Bing – looking forward to a pleasant summer. Nothing to do with climate change. White House announced there wouldn’t be any dog days of summer -

td

April 19th, 2012
4:31 pm

carlosgvv

April 19th, 2012
4:27 pm

And Obama’s smoking shows a serious character flaw in him. Both men, like all men, are not perfect.

Butch Cassidy

April 19th, 2012
4:32 pm

Oblama – “What a great idea from the left. We should receive an annual report from every service and product we pay for.”

Wasn’t an idea, and I’m not on the “Left” of anything. I believe it was you who though that because you subscribe to the AJC, that you should have a say in how much people make.I guess you missed the class on identifying the differences betwen PUBLICLY traded companies and PRIVATELY held ones.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
4:33 pm

“Dogs are pack animals”

Dogs are also highly adaptable and resilient animals who can become accustomed to a wide variety of living situations. YOUR ideas of what are correct are not the be-all and end-all of living with dogs.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
4:34 pm

“My 3:32 post was an indication of how Romney’s treatment of his dog reflects a serious character defect that we don’t need in the White House. Are you so dense you couldn’t see that?”

Maybe it is YOU who is so dense you can’t see that YOUR assessment is not neccessarily the correct one.

Mudfoot

April 19th, 2012
4:34 pm

Hey Porkchopicus

Had to roll out yesterday but saw yer question this am. Have hired 16 vets of the signal corps so far from as far away as Cali. Great employees (they tend to have attitude, which is good in this business. Most cell towers aren’t located in the upper-crust areas and some spots are downright dangerous to the point that our police escorts leave at 5 and won’t come back til daylight the next day) These guys have a sense of responsibility and appreciate working for someone who wants them to succeed. Great tip my friend, and much appreciated.

godless heathen©

April 19th, 2012
4:34 pm

acetaminophen is Tylenol, not aspirin.

Bummer about Levon Helm. He was doing some great stuff recently also.

carlosgvv

April 19th, 2012
4:35 pm

td

So cruelty to animals and smoking are equal character flaws in your eyes? Yes, that’s just about what I expected out of you.

Paul

April 19th, 2012
4:35 pm

Becky

“I don’t buy your wandering dog story either if you have had show and performance dogs I would hope they would be in contained environment and not running loose off leash.”

Having read Doggone/GA’s posts for years, I’ll vouch for her. She has, on numerous occasions, talked about her dogs and her experiences. Also about going to some natural areas on exploring hikes. Yes, dogs do run free in such circumstances.

I take it you have limited experience with dog ownership . Not to put too fine a point on it, but I’ve always been leery of unmarried marriage counselors or adults with no kids who are quick to judge the actions of parents.

Oblama

April 19th, 2012
4:38 pm

Alcohol alone can cause liver damage of course, as can acetaminophen alone (tylenol,etc.) – when used on a long term or over excessive basis. I know some of my comparisons are “overboard” (sorry you can’t recognize satire) Some of Oblama’s supporters are overboard. For example, those clowns Ben & Jerry. The thing about them is they are serious and serious stupid is dangerous.

St Simons- island off the coast of New Somalia

April 19th, 2012
4:38 pm

The Republicans sold their stock in Amerka a long long time ago.
When they moved to that galaxy far far away

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
4:38 pm

Thanks Paul!

Don't Forget

April 19th, 2012
4:38 pm

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

April 19th, 2012
4:39 pm

Dogs are pack animals.

Most, if not all animals have groupings and maybe adopted by humans into their clan (Flock of birds, sheep; a pack of dogs; a clowder of cats; a murder of crows; a herd of cows etc) . That in and of itself is no reason not to ingest any specie of animal.

But I would agree that were I to adopt an animal into my clan, it would be repugnant for me to eat that individual.

Oblama

April 19th, 2012
4:41 pm

Does Oblama smoking in an enclosed space around his children and pets count as a character flaw since it is bad for their health?

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
4:41 pm

“as can acetaminophen alone (tylenol,etc.) – when used on a long term or over excessive basis”

acetominophen has the additional problem of being extremely toxic to some people. I knew someone who found out the “hard way” – she died almost immediately after taking some that was prescribed by her doctor for neck pain, It’s got something to do with how a person’s body does (or doesn’t) handle iron. I don’t know the details. But I do know someone else with that same problem and she NEVER takes acetominophen, and she religiously gives blood every month to keep the iron from building up too high.

Oblama

April 19th, 2012
4:42 pm

Is the President drug tested like an employee of a corporation – especially since he admitted doing weed and cocaine?

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
4:44 pm

“Is the President drug tested like an employee of a corporation – especially since he admitted doing weed and cocaine?”

Only his doctor knows for sure

td

April 19th, 2012
4:46 pm

carlosgvv

April 19th, 2012
4:35 pm

td

So cruelty to animals and smoking are equal character flaws in your eyes? Yes, that’s just about what I expected out of you.

Cruelty to animals: also called animal abuse or animal neglect, is the infliction of suffering or harm upon non-human animals, for purposes other than self-defense.

Now can you prove the dog suffered?

As far as smoking goes, yes I am pretty sure most people will agree that it is a character flaw.

BADA BING

April 19th, 2012
4:46 pm

Hung Chow Chinese Restaurant
Washington DC

#10 Presidential Special
Pekingese Duck & Noodles and Poodles
Serves 4

Paul

April 19th, 2012
4:48 pm

carlosgvv

“We definitely don’t need a combination religious nut/sociopath in the White House.”

Your comments are getting into the realm of lalaland – don’t exactly persuade fence-sitters who peruse blogs.

Doggone/GA

No prob. And Becky – I’ve had some knock-down, drag outs with Doggone/GA. She’s pretty passionate about what she knows, doesn’t let people who ‘feel’ something’s valid override her experiential knowledge and will definitely not concede a point until one comes up with some valid data to justify so doing.

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

April 19th, 2012
4:48 pm

As far as smoking goes, yes I am pretty sure most people will agree that it is a character flaw.

Nicotine addiction is a character flaw?

Joe Hussein Mama

April 19th, 2012
4:50 pm

Mudfoot — “Most cell towers aren’t located in the upper-crust areas and some spots are downright dangerous to the point that our police escorts leave at 5 and won’t come back til daylight the next day)”

Scary! :eek:

“These guys have a sense of responsibility and appreciate working for someone who wants them to succeed. Great tip my friend, and much appreciated.”

Hey, it was a win-win. You get quality employees, and some of my brother (and sister?) Signal Corps vets get jobs in the civilian sector. Thank you for hiring veterans, my friend. :)

Oblama

April 19th, 2012
4:52 pm

Not poodles – but Chow dogs are on the menu in certain Asian countries. There is one that I fondly remember in Vietnam but can’t recall the name right now. That black tongue laid out on the plate is something special.

(ir)Rational

April 19th, 2012
4:52 pm

Maybe not nicotine addiction Kam, but being a Chelsea fan is MOST DEFINITELY a character flaw. I was really sad to see that Messi didn’t do better against the Blues yesterday. :( Oh, and hi.

carlosgvv

April 19th, 2012
4:53 pm

Doggone/GA – 4:33

Those ideas are not MINE. They are the ideas of canine experts with many years of experience and study. And, just because dogs are adaptable and resilient doesn’t mean you should be indifferent to how you treat them. Cruelty to animals is a character flaw that, more often than not, indicates a serious pyschological disorder.

Aquagirl

April 19th, 2012
4:53 pm

Now can you prove the dog suffered?

I’m not an expert in canine behavior, but $#!^ running down the windows might be a non-verbal cue.

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

April 19th, 2012
4:57 pm

…but being a Chelsea fan is MOST DEFINITELY a character flaw.

I will fly my flawed flag proudly, then.

Don’t forget, we are also playing Liverpool in the final for the FA cup.

Oblama

April 19th, 2012
4:58 pm

K – Getting addicted to anything shows weakness and can be considered a character flaw. For example, I am addicted to trail mix. Unfortunately it is loaded with calories. If someone wants to smoke that’s unfortunate, not smart, and addictive but it is their business since it’s still legal. Then when they get sick they can get on Oblama Care. Smoking around children and pets is a character flaw as it shows a lack of concern for the health of others.

Recon 0311 2533

April 19th, 2012
4:59 pm

Lets see, class warfare, war against woman, war against dogs…give peace a chance. Isn’t it time for clean sheets.

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
5:00 pm

“Some unsolicited advice — Excedrin is a combination of acetaminophen, aspirin, and caffeine. People who drink alcohol should never take acetaminophen due to the risk of liver damage”

Kamchak,

That would be sage advice. I did know that about acetominophen but not about excedrin. In any event I don’t take anything within a couple of days of having drinken any alcohol because of that. I think its much worse if you take acet in tandem with alcohol. Not sure if it does any damage at all if you take it without alcohol. If there’s a doc in the house perhaps they can verify a bit better whether you should take it at all if you drink regularly.

(ir)Rational

April 19th, 2012
5:02 pm

Kam – Yeah, yeah, yeah. Arsenal are going to destroy y’all this Saturday. :) And while being a Chelsea fan could be seen as a character flaw, it is nothing in comparison to being a Manchester (United or City) fan. Having said that, if Chelsea beats my two favorite teams in a four day period, I might have to re-evaluate my choices.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
5:03 pm

“Those ideas are not MINE. They are the ideas of canine experts with many years of experience and study.”

yes, and I am very familiar with some of those “experts” – especially the ones that are full of baloney.

” And, just because dogs are adaptable and resilient doesn’t mean you should be indifferent to how you treat them. Cruelty to animals is a character flaw that, more often than not, indicates a serious pyschological disorder”

And where is the proof that what Romney did was either indifferent or cruel? What is “cruel” to some people is just their own perception and has no basis in reality. I would call what the Romney’s did unkind at best…but if they were evacuating (for example) from a disaster and that was the only way to keep their dog with them, would you STILL castigate them for doing it?

With 30 years experience, ranging over travel to all states east of the Mississippi, and a few west of that river…and over 25 dogs, I do not see any inherent cruelty or indifference in what they did. I would not do the same by choice, but that does not mean I think they were wrong to do it and it does not mean I wouldn’t do it if it was needed.

Boris Badnoff

April 19th, 2012
5:03 pm

Most people are speciests. They adore cute animals such a puppy dogs, kitty cats, tweetie birds, etc. But I, like most of you, despise insects. Did not the same God that created cats and dogs also create cockroaches? If some one mistreats a dog or cat the furies of hades descend on them. But no one cares when an ant colony is destroyed, or a spider squished. At my hovel I have millipedes. They do not harm me in any way but I kill them on sight because of my hatred for anything with more than 4 legs. If you have squirted insecticide on one of God’s creatures for no reason, who are you to criticize a rich guy for strapping a pooch on the roof of a car. Besides the mutt liked it. All liberals need to unite and demand Roach Rights.

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

April 19th, 2012
5:03 pm

Getting addicted to anything shows weakness and can be considered a character flaw.

We are making great strides against addiction now, because we are treating it as a disease and not a stigma.

For example, I am addicted to trail mix.

No, you are very fond of trail mix and you trivialize those with addictions with that type of toolish comment.

Oblama

April 19th, 2012
5:04 pm

All you Oblama supporting socialists have a good day! Got to go work out so I don’t have to depend on the government to take care of me. Gone today – here tomorrow.

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
5:04 pm

Dang. Didn’t see all the other posts on acetaminophen. I think I’ll quit taking it period although I rarely take it to begin with- probably a handful of times a year at most.

Paul

April 19th, 2012
5:05 pm

Recon

You think the dog and pony show is wearing thin?

That a couple of bloggers are being dogged?

Or that some bloggers respond quite well to a talking point dog whistle?

But I do think most of the points have been made. After all, every dog has its day -

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
5:05 pm

“I’m not an expert in canine behavior, but $#!^ running down the windows might be a non-verbal cue”

And that could just as easily happened INSIDE the car. Some dogs have strange physiolgical reactions to being excited about traveling. I had one that drooled so much from excitement that I would have to stop and empty his crate out every couple of hours. He only, finally, stopped doing that when he grew up enough to start participating in his favorite sport.

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
5:06 pm

Did you know that rabbits are one of the few animals that will not protect their young?

I didn’t know that, but that explains things that I saw growing up. Many a time I’ve walked up on the young with mommy nowhere to be found.

(ir)Rational

April 19th, 2012
5:07 pm

And I’m out. Kam – if I don’t make it on tomorrow, have fun watching Arsenal take down Chelsea Saturday morning. :)

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

April 19th, 2012
5:08 pm

And while being a Chelsea fan could be seen as a character flaw, it is nothing in comparison to being a Manchester (United or City) fan.

That reminds me — HEY JEROME! ARE YOU AROUND? WHY DIDN’T YOUR EVIL RED DEVILS MAKE IT PAST GROUP STAGE IN THE UCL, HUH?

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
5:08 pm

I’m out for a while…need to get out of the house

JamVet

April 19th, 2012
5:08 pm

Newsflash.

This just in.

Ted Nutjob and the Secret Service have just concluded their meeting about where to find the best whores.

Oblama

April 19th, 2012
5:09 pm

K – I apologize for that toolish comment. Uhhh, just what is a toolish comment and why am I apologizing? ‘Cause the President has made apologizing when you are not guilty a very “stylish” thing.

Joe Hussein Mama

April 19th, 2012
5:10 pm

Aquagirl — “I’m not an expert in canine behavior, but $#!^ running down the windows might be a non-verbal cue.”

That’s always been how *I* signal distress.

Recon 0311 2533

April 19th, 2012
5:10 pm

Paul, my dog has its day every day. Spoiled rotten.

Don't Forget

April 19th, 2012
5:11 pm

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
4:41 pm

“as can acetaminophen alone (tylenol,etc.) – when used on a long term or over excessive basis”

acetominophen has the additional problem of being extremely toxic to some people. I knew someone who found out the “hard way” – she died almost immediately after taking some that was prescribed by her doctor for neck pain, It’s got something to do with how a person’s body does (or doesn’t) handle iron. I don’t know the details. But I do know someone else with that same problem and she NEVER takes acetominophen, and she religiously gives blood every month to keep the iron from building up too high.

You’re talking about hereditary hemochromatosis a disorder that causes excessive iron absorption in the intestines and iron build up in the tissues. It affects multiple organs, most frequently the liver. The tylenol simply aggravated the underlying liver disease. The treatment is phlebotomy.

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
5:11 pm

That’s always been how *I* signal distress.

If we ever get a chance to meet in person, I will try to look as non-threatening as possible. I would hate for you to have to light up the Bat signal. :lol:

Dirty Dawg

April 19th, 2012
5:13 pm

ME…Mary Elizabeth that is…you’re most welcome. And I was serious about the Democratic Party in Georgia’s only chance of ever again winning a statewide race will be if they run a woman. Of course she’d have to be tough and smart, plus the Republicans would have to have continued their assault on women’s rights.

Oblama

April 19th, 2012
5:13 pm

JamVet – Now haven’t you learned anything in this P.C. world? You can’t go around calling whores,whores.

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
5:13 pm

carlosgvv,

What you view as crating a dog being cruel is just plain poppycock. If anything a dog is a helluva lot safer in a crate on top of car then he is being totally unsecured sitting inside of a car and going flying if the car gets into an accident. What exactly is your complaint? That he was exposed to wind? Most dog owners that I’ve seen their dogs try to stick their heads out the window to experience the wind and smell everything. Or the ones in the bed of a pickup truck seem to love the open air. So is that the problem?

Or is it that he was placed on top of the car? So what. I see cattle hearded in cattle trailers and chickens in trailers on the way to market that are sitting in pens in those 18 wheel trailers that are sitting up a helluva lot higher than a crate on top of a station wagon. Are they being treated inhumanely with all that wind and sitting up higher than what Romney’s dog was exposed to?

And as far the dog pooping you don’t know that it was because he was terrified. Coulda been the dog just had the runs/diarrhea.

Aquagirl

April 19th, 2012
5:13 pm

Some dogs have strange physiolgical reactions to being excited about traveling.

I usually go with the most likely explanation in any scenario. “The dog was so happy it was $#!^ing uncontrollably” is not a likely explanation.

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
5:14 pm

“hearded”- too funny

Oblama

April 19th, 2012
5:15 pm

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
5:17 pm

$#!^ running down the windows might be a non-verbal cue.”

Or it could mean the obvious. That the dog just has diarrhea and that it has nothing to do with him being scared or not.

Paul

April 19th, 2012
5:18 pm

Recon

Spoiled? Mine’s just excessively pampered. Shoulda’ seen my wife’s face when I came back from a trip to Harrods with a jeweled collar -

dbm

April 19th, 2012
5:23 pm

Please forgive me if I overlooked a post where this was addressed. What are the rules regarding shareholder-initiated votes?

dbm

April 19th, 2012
5:28 pm

mm

April 19th, 2012
9:38 am

Rightwing Troll

April 19th, 2012
9:48 am

If the government started forcing people to say the sky was blue, I would object.

Joe Hussein Mama

April 19th, 2012
5:29 pm

Aquagirl — ““The dog was so happy it was $#!^ing uncontrollably”

ZOMG CAR TRIP CAR TRIP LET’S GO LET’S GO LET’S GO GO GOOOOOOO

saywhat?

April 19th, 2012
5:30 pm

Aquagirl — ““The dog was so happy it was $#!^ing uncontrollably”

You mean it doesn’t only happen to me?

carlosgvv

April 19th, 2012
5:31 pm

Paul 4:48

So George W. Bush was a great president and getting us into two wars was a great thing and having many thousands of our troops killed, wounded and maimed was a great thing and spending billions and billions of dollars on these wars was a great thing? And you want more of the same in the White House? And I am the one in lalaland?

Joe Hussein Mama

April 19th, 2012
5:31 pm

Brosephus — “If we ever get a chance to meet in person, I will try to look as non-threatening as possible. I would hate for you to have to light up the Bat signal.”

In one of his routines, George Carlin used to comment on the horrifying mental image he got from the word “s&%t-fit” and how he NEVER wanted to be around someone who was having one. :D

Thulsa Doom

April 19th, 2012
5:33 pm

And you want more of the same in the White House?- Carlosgvv

W is running for president again?

carlosgvv

April 19th, 2012
5:33 pm

Doggone/GA

If reincarnation is real and I come back as a dog, I hope with all my heart not to EVER be owned by you.

Paul

April 19th, 2012
5:33 pm

carlosgvv

I was referring to the dog remarks and Romney remarks.

Aquagirl

April 19th, 2012
5:34 pm

Or it could mean the obvious. That the dog just has diarrhea and that it has nothing to do with him being scared or not.

Oh, much better. Because nothing says “dog lover” like trapping one in the equivalent of a overfilled porta-potty and strapping it to the roof of the car.

saywhat?

April 19th, 2012
5:36 pm

What do you call a dog with no legs?

Anything you want. Its not coming anyway.

getalife

April 19th, 2012
5:38 pm

Just because Seamus ate the turkey, willard tortured the crap out of Seamus.

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
5:40 pm

Aquagirl

April 19th, 2012
5:40 pm

What do you call a dog with no legs?

Cigarette, because you take him outside for a drag. HAHAHA….haha..ha. ha.

JamVet

April 19th, 2012
5:40 pm

Tis true, George Walker Bush can never again leave a massive trail of destruction and death in his wake while he resides at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue.

I believe that the republic rightfully has grave concerns that George Willard Bush would produce just about the same results…

barking frog

April 19th, 2012
5:41 pm

Because
nothing says “dog lover” like
trapping one in the
equivalent of a overfilled
porta-potty and strapping it
to the roof of a car.
mmmmmmmmmmmmmm
nothin says lovin like
puppy from the oven

Redneck Convert (R--and proud of it)

April 19th, 2012
5:45 pm

Well, seems to me people are mighty desperate to get Obama out of office and keep Romney from getting in. When you got to resort to talking about eating or mistreating a dog, you’re about out of ammo.

pogo

April 19th, 2012
5:45 pm

Jay tries to make a case that the Republicans are the only ones that are in bed with big money and they are the only ones who try to fashion our laws in favour of large corporations and banks. That is just plain sad. Pages and pages could be written on Obama, Geithners and Bernanke’s relationship and their love of the big money people on Wall Street and in the big banks. In the last three years the big banks that sucked up TARP funds have not been split up but have grown even stronger and even more controlling. Like some leaders in the past, Obama does not mind if big banks or corporations get bigger and get more control just as long as the government has increased control of them. The big corporations that supported Obama have been showered with stimulus dollars and have been the beneficiaries of his use of agencies such as the EPA as a tool to further their interests (and his). Jay are you this naieve?

Joe Hussein Mama

April 19th, 2012
5:50 pm

Shorter pogo — WAAAAAAAAAH, you do it TOO.

JamVet

April 19th, 2012
5:52 pm

Nineteen years ago today a huge Republican hero self-immolated himself and dozens of innocent people.

Here’s to hoping that you are still cooking, David Koresh.

josef

April 19th, 2012
5:53 pm

Dang, it’s truly a slow news day,

PAUL

Well, you left EOI to me and ZamVet last p.m. Ha! I told you I should steer clear of him. He WAS on the rag…had a straight male butch attack, he did…

ZamVet

Heh, heh. Went back and read over the posts. Change the whyfor of pedophile priests and put in coach and they read the same… :-)

dbm

April 19th, 2012
5:53 pm

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
5:40 pm

I would be objecting to the use of government force, not to the statement itself. Obviously you would be confused by my objection, so I would have to make clear that I agree that the sky is blue, that I can tell this just by looking at it, and that I welcome scientific analysis such as you present.

I would object to the government forcing people to say ANYTHING, even if it was something I say a lot and consider important.

Paul

April 19th, 2012
5:56 pm

“Well, seems to me people are mighty desperate to get Obama out of office and keep Romney from getting in. When you got to resort to talking about eating or mistreating a dog, you’re about out of ammo.”

Who’da thunk Redneck Convert would win the Post of the Day award?

josef

aannnnnnd…… you didn’t do anything to exacerbate the situation, did you, hmmmmmm?

Mudfoot

April 19th, 2012
5:57 pm

Joe Barack Obama Mama

“win win situation”

No doubt. I’m always looking for good people and vets can do this job and remain relatively sane (unlike most folk). Let me know if you have more prospects in mind. I can’t usually blog very long at a sitting and usually read more than I post but will get the message. (Climbing towers ain’t easy with 80 lbs of gear strapped to ya so physical capability is required, but I’ll at least interview anyone you refer)

josef

April 19th, 2012
6:00 pm

PAUL

Moi? Would I do any such thing? Now, today, it’s Thursday…gloves off!

carlosgvv

April 19th, 2012
6:07 pm

Doom – 5:33

While Romney tries to be different, his mentality seems to be a George W. Bush clone job.

josef

April 19th, 2012
6:12 pm

ZamVet

And remember, google is your enemy as well as your friend…data? Take a look at this…

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/features/cover/news/2000/04/14/nack_nightmare/

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
6:16 pm

Obviously you would be confused by my objection

Obviously, you could be no further from the truth. I would not be confused at all. I would simply laugh my ass off at your knee jerk reaction. I would also laugh my ass off at anybody else who thought the sky was ACTUALLY blue. Air has no color unless it’s polluted with something else. The “blue” color that people associate with the sky is only light being reflected and refracted at different wavelengths.

Mighty Righty

April 19th, 2012
6:18 pm

I agree with the premise that shareholders in a compa should be allowed to approve of executive pay. A shareholder can of course divest him or her self of the stock any company if the share holder disagrees with the actions of the company. Share holders are not indentured servants. However it is none of the governments business how a private company pays its people. On the other hand the government (read we the people) also own business like Solyndra, Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, et al. Strange how the government doesn’t want we the people (read shareholders)who own or at least subsidize these failures to have any say what so ever. The same government that cannot successfully run or even make an intelligent investment in its own business thinks it should substitute its proven stupidty for the wisdom of private enterprise. I suggest the government but the H— out of private business and tend to its own business. I for one would like to see the government do somehing, anything well before it tells others what to do. Let them cast the first stone so to speak. How about it Jay? How about complaining about the incompetent, ignorance on display every day by the Washington wizards who have no business experience at all let alone successful business experience telling business how to run their business? It is the very atitude demonstrated by this topic mostly on the left that has caused 20 million of our people give or take to be unemployed. Our economy will never vigorously grow again until the government gets out of the way and tends to its own problems. I pray that when the Republicans take over this November they eliminate all Obama administration regulations and most of the other regulations that have been imposed with good intentions on our economy over the last twenty years. Unleash free enterprise and this country will once again provide a healthy, wealthy future for our children, grand children and the world.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
6:22 pm

“I pray that when the Republicans take over this November they eliminate all Obama administration regulations..”

To whom are you praying and how do you know your God isn’t in favor of those regulations?

JamVet

April 19th, 2012
6:25 pm

Table 7. Percent of Student Targets by

Job Title Percent
Teacher 18
Coach 15
Substitute Teachers 13
Bus Driver 12
Teacher’s Aide 11
Other School Employee 10
Security Guard 10
Principal 6
Counselor 5
Total 100
Source: Shakeshaft, 2003; AAUW, 2001

http://www2.ed.gov/rschstat/research/pubs/misconductreview/report.pdf

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

April 19th, 2012
6:25 pm

To whom are you praying…

Ayn Rand.

…and how do you know your God isn’t in favor of those regulations?

See above.

Becky

April 19th, 2012
6:26 pm

Paul-you make some mighty strange assumptions. Why would you think I am an unmarried childless person? where did that come from?

And doggone if you have had 25 dogs in 30 years I am beginning to think some of them came to a bad ending. Really? Most of our dogs live to their late teens. perhaps you have been tossing some off the roof of your van?

Thulsa-Mittens himself said the trip was in November-me thinks it was probably chilly to have the wind whipping the poor shivering WET and soiled dog after it was hosed off. It does not matter if it got sick from fear or not. It should not have had to suffer.

One of the worst things about all this is Mittens himself has said he is sorry, sorry it got out what had happened and he has in no way apologized or said he could have done things differently. Ann just stood by and said nothing herself? These people are cruel and heartless and clueles as are some of you thinking this is all okay.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
6:28 pm

Kam

I just love those kind of posts……..

It is cheap humor, however it they do amuse me to no end

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
6:29 pm

Kam

Wasn’t Rand an Atheist?

I could be wrong and she could still be someone’s God……… just sayn

truedat

April 19th, 2012
6:32 pm

Are corporate executives moral people?

I am trying to understand the mindset of the corporate executive. For example if you’re the CEO of Verizon how do you reconcile the following things in your mind?

The company is a healthy and profitable.
You just became CEO last year and your pay went from 7 million dollars to 24 million dollars.
You continue to send American jobs overseas.
You want to take away employees pensions, healthcare plans and a dozen other important benefits.
You claim that the union employee is from the nonprofitable wireline side of the business when you have got to know full well that wireless traffic and FIOs TV and internet would not exist without the wireline side of the business.

I can certainly understand the obligation the executive feels to make the stock price go higher but at what point does he look in the mirror and say to himself
“As an American do I have anykind of obligation to try to keep the middle class alive in this country?”
“If corporations send every American job possible overseas and cut the salaries of the remaining workers, is it possible that people will no longer have any spare money to buy cell phone plans, FIOS and other products?”
“Is it unfair of me to take 24 million dollars in compensation in a single year as I look to take back 20k worth of compensation from a typical middle class worker?”

I personally do not understand how a person can totally disconnect these things in his mind.

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
6:35 pm

In one of his routines, George Carlin used to comment on the horrifying mental image he got from the word “s&%t-fit” and how he NEVER wanted to be around someone who was having one.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

April 19th, 2012
6:37 pm

I could be wrong and she could still be someone’s God……… just sayn

You’re not wrong, and she is (wrong and someone’s god).

Ironic, ain’t it?

Mighty Righty

April 19th, 2012
6:38 pm

TBS, I don’t know about your belief, but my God is not a Socialist, Communist, Nazi, Facist. My God blessed us with rights that are not to be taken away by a government. In November, my God will rectify past mistakes made by men. Amen.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
6:38 pm

Kam

Irony cuts deep sometimes………

josef

April 19th, 2012
6:39 pm

ZamVet

Hands over ears going lalalalal I can’t hear you…ALL of those figures you cite are WAAAAY under reality…this is a topic that is just beginning to be discussed. DID you read the article?

Those professions, like the priesthood, are tailor made for the pedophile…

But coaches? Sports? That great bastion of het male butt slapping and naked showering? You sound just like Scout and Del with their “not in MY Corps…”

All in all, if it weren’t such a tragic topic, it would be the height of hilarity…

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
6:39 pm

“I usually go with the most likely explanation in any scenario. “The dog was so happy it was $#!^ing uncontrollably” is not a likely explanation”

Maybe not to you, but having dealt with just such a reaction numerous times over the last 30 years…your “likelyhood” is very likely. That’s not to mean you are wrong, it’s just that neither of us KNOWS for sure…and one explanation is as good as the other in the absence of proof.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
6:40 pm

“TBS, I don’t know about your belief, but my God is not a Socialist, Communist, Nazi, Facist.”

Plese provide text from the Bible or other literature to back up your claim as to what political belief system that God has or doesn’t have?

Thanks

Adam

April 19th, 2012
6:40 pm

I have to say, seriously and genuinely, it’s nice to see a lot of people in good humor over these past few pages :D

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
6:40 pm

saywhat?

April 19th, 2012
5:36 pm

What do you call a dog with no legs?

Anything you want. Its not coming anyway.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

What do you do with a dog that has no legs?

Take it for a drag……..

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
6:41 pm

“My God blessed us with rights that are not to be taken away by a government.”

Did your God personally speak of those rights or are you referring to the Declaration of Independence?

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
6:41 pm

“I hope with all my heart not to EVER be owned by you.”

That’s fine. I wouldn’t want to own you anyway. I prefer dogs that have some sense.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
6:43 pm

Oh don’t tell me he is a Republican

From the book of Reagan
Chapter 10
versus 5 thru 10

Was that correct?

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

April 19th, 2012
6:44 pm

“My god’s better than your god.
My god’s better than yours.
My god’s better ‘cuz he eats Ken-L-Ration
My god’s better than yours”
– Thomas Jefferson

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
6:44 pm

“And doggone if you have had 25 dogs in 30 years I am beginning to think some of them came to a bad ending.”

You would be wrong.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
6:45 pm

Mighty Wrong

I have a Bible as well as a Koran handy……. for other sources I will use the internet to validate the info you provide

Waiting

thanks

Thomas

April 19th, 2012
6:48 pm

Why are there so many folks completely scared and lacking of any initiative to go write a business plan, attract SBA and friends and family capital, and go start a business? It is the American way. Solve your problems. The SBA is handing money out. I cannot fathom sitting opressed by an elitist, over paid CEO when there is nothing but opportunity.

Complaining and protesting is like a kid screaming at their parents for more ice cream. Every tool you need, unless you are disabled, is there. Folks are so scared to succeed it is sad.

Becky

April 19th, 2012
6:48 pm

Well doggone-I will make an a$$umption about you, perhaps you are the purveyor of one of those horrid puppy mills where dogs live in crates and never see daylight since you have no problem with this one dog’s treatment. Maybe Michael Vick is a close personal friend as well?

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
6:49 pm

josef

April 19th, 2012
6:39 pm

ZamVet

Hands over ears going lalalalal I can’t hear you…ALL of those figures you cite are WAAAAY under reality…this is a topic that is just beginning to be discussed. DID you read the article?

Those professions, like the priesthood, are tailor made for the pedophile…

But coaches? Sports? That great bastion of het male butt slapping and naked showering? You sound just like Scout and Del with their “not in MY Corps…”

All in all, if it weren’t such a tragic topic, it would be the height of hilarity…
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Careful Joey. They’ll toss you out of the double nought secret agent blog brotherhood and THEN where will you be?

josef

April 19th, 2012
6:49 pm

Doggone

All’s I can say is anytime I get in a tiff with you, I just remind myself that you like dogs and they like you…that’s about the best character recommendation I can think of. Except maybe for cat people! :-)

BTW the Unmentionable now retired and having the time to spend with a dog is looking at Catahoula Hawg Dogs…any comments on them from an expert?

Becky

April 19th, 2012
6:49 pm

I’m off to go hug my dog.

Midori

April 19th, 2012
6:49 pm

josef

April 19th, 2012
6:50 pm

Doggone

Ooops…he just corrected me…that’s Catahoula Hawg HOUND!

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
6:51 pm

“Well doggone-I will make an a$$umption about you, perhaps you are the purveyor of one of those horrid puppy mills where dogs live in crates and never see daylight since you have no problem with this one dog’s treatment. Maybe Michael Vick is a close personal friend as well?”

You would be wrong.

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
6:52 pm

Midori: That was awesome. My little guy is a Dachshund. They are just adorable.

josef

April 19th, 2012
6:53 pm

FRED

Heh, heh… Friday Night all will be forgiven for a few hours…but I CAN just see him sitting there hands over ears…it’s been giving us quite the chuckle here at home. And Unmentionable IS a sports devotee…

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
6:53 pm

“All’s I can say is anytime I get in a tiff with you, I just remind myself that you like dogs and they like you…that’s about the best character recommendation I can think of. Except maybe for cat people! ”

Thanks! And if it helps, I like cats too. My last one lived to be 18 1/2 years old. The only reason I don’t have any now is because of all the traveling I have done. It was enough having to deal with up to 10 dogs on the road, I didn’t want to have to deal with a cat too. And I didn’t want any living creature left behind at home when I was on the road.

TaxPayer

April 19th, 2012
6:53 pm

It sounds as thought someone’s God is pretty petty if said God has nothing better to do than to dabble in lame politics. I thought that sort of day to day stuff would have been left to the minions.

godless heathen

April 19th, 2012
6:55 pm

“Here’s to hoping that you are still cooking, David Koresh.”

Ahhh, a crispy Christian reference.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
6:55 pm

Mighty

Just so we are clear, I was not making fun of your religion or your belief in that religion…

However I was making light and challenging you to provide info to meet your assertions in terms of political affiliation and ideology…….

If you do not want to or can’t answer with more than your “interpretation” that is perfectly ok with me……..

Be back in a little while

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
6:56 pm

“BTW the Unmentionable now retired and having the time to spend with a dog is looking at Catahoula Hawg Dogs…any comments on them from an expert?”

They are strong, tough working dogs. Any dog that has to work with hogs is. Being working dogs they require a job, and if you don’t give them one they’ll find one…and it might not be to your liking! They need something vigorous and physical to do. If you can’t work them, then something like agility is a good subsitute, as it is a physical activity and they have to think about what they are doing as well. They have a LOT of energy. If he can’t commit to a regular, pretty rigorous exercise program, they might not be the best choice.

Mighty Righty

April 19th, 2012
6:56 pm

TBS, You may be reading challenged. You should look into that. I clearly stated I was expressing MY beliefs.

Mudfoot

April 19th, 2012
6:56 pm

Josef

regarding your choice of dog, ‘Catahoulas are smart, sometimes too smart, they bark alot and will drive you crazy unless you excersize them enough. Don’t know how many kids are in your environment or how often but I wouldn’t leave them alone with the dog, they’ve been bred to be agressive and they are protective. They also tend to follow their nose if allowed or unsupervised. Great dogs if your lifestyle fits.

Paul

April 19th, 2012
6:56 pm

Evening, Becky

“Paul-you make some mighty strange assumptions. Why would you think I am an unmarried childless person? where did that come from?”

I try to choose my words pretty carefully. No need to read into them that which isn’t there. I wrote:
“I take it you have limited experience with dog ownership . Not to put too fine a point on it, but I’ve always been leery of unmarried marriage counselors or adults with no kids who are quick to judge the actions of parents.”

I neither wrote (nor thought) you were childless nor did I write or think you are an unmarried marriage counselor.

It’s an analogy.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
6:58 pm

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
6:59 pm

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
6:59 pm

TBS

That’s what I thought

Well hope your God isn’t an Obama fan and backs those regs..

F. Sinkwich

April 19th, 2012
7:00 pm

A couple of days ago I posted a spontaneous thought to commemorate an important day for many here.

I went back to read it — its elegance, coherence, relevance, and cadence actually brought a tear to my eye.

I realize many of you were each celebrating the day in your own way, with your families and such, and therefore might have missed it, no fault of your own.

“Today is the day of tithing and offering at the alter of the almighty federal government, knower of all things good, solver of all societal ills, and ensurer of social justice and equality of outcomes for all.

We bow our heads in awe of its magnificence, and pledge to extract substantial additional tribute from those who dared succeed on their own.

Let us face northeast, toward Mecca DC, and quietly recite in unison:

I pledge my allegiance, to the wisdom, of the US Federal Government.
And to the parasites, to which it gives.
One entity, under Obama, who knows what’s best for all.

Amen.”

* All Rights Reserved.

josef

April 19th, 2012
7:01 pm

Dog People…

He’s waiting until we get to the tar paper shotgun on the bayou…he’s a hunter so he’s “at home” with working dogs…he’s grew up hunting wild pigs…he says that’s how he caught me! :-)

godless heathen

April 19th, 2012
7:01 pm

When my lab gives me the sad eyes because I have to go to work, I explain to him that I have to work to buy Purina and gh food. And that if I don’t work the first thing that goes will be the Purina, and then the gh food, and then he’ll be turning on the spit. (Actually I doubt it, but he doesn’t know that.)

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
7:04 pm

Sink

What did the guy at the gas station think about your prayer?

Don't Forget

April 19th, 2012
7:04 pm

Doggone

You put the luggage on the roof, dog in the car. It’s just common sense.

Fred ™

April 19th, 2012
7:04 pm

Does anyone actually read the sht F. Sinkwich posts?

josef

April 19th, 2012
7:05 pm

Doggone

Ours is a cat neighborhood…several of us look after each other’s cats when their people are away from home…

Me? I love all kinds of animals…draw the line at snakes, though!

Paul

April 19th, 2012
7:05 pm

6:48

AAAANNNNNDDDDD Becky cedes the argument to Doggone/GA.

We have a WINNAHHH!!!!!

Adam

April 19th, 2012
7:05 pm

My God blessed us with rights that are not to be taken away by a government

You talk to God? You’re religious.
God talks to you? You’re psychotic.

Paul

April 19th, 2012
7:07 pm

Hi Midori!!!

:-)

Adam

April 19th, 2012
7:08 pm

Becky

April 19th, 2012
7:08 pm

um Paul-don’t think so in my world. I never ever concede on something I feel strongly about.

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

April 19th, 2012
7:08 pm

…actually brought a tear to my eye.

Mine too!

But not for “its elegance, coherence, relevance, and cadence”.

Mine were tears born of hilarity.

Yours were ilky tears.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
7:13 pm

“You put the luggage on the roof, dog in the car. It’s just common sense”

Yeah, well…I already said it wasn’t something *I* would do unless circumstances forced it. And you know what is said about common sense not being so common. But my point is that it is not an INHERENTLY evil choice.

Becky

April 19th, 2012
7:13 pm

I don’t think Ann should be thinking about a new china pattern for the WH. She lost her fans (of which I was one at one time) when she declared it was “their turn” to be residents of the WH. She is looking more common by the day even with all that money. Money can’t buy class but they sure are spending it like they can! LOL.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
7:14 pm

“We have a WINNAHHH!!!!!”

Would her head explode if she ever found out that the 3 dogs I currently have sleep in bed with me every night?

Mighty Righty

April 19th, 2012
7:15 pm

F. Sinkwich, I too was quite moved by the sincerity of your message of wisdom which was inspired no doubt by provedence. I hereby request your permission to forward copies of the transcribed inspiration to the multitude with whom I correspond, with credit of course.

josef

April 19th, 2012
7:15 pm

PAUL

Analogies, metaphors, and allusions have no place in Blogland…don’t you never read the memos, either?

BECKY
“I never ever concede on something I feel strongly about.”

Give it a try…you might learn a lot about yourself…

F. Sinkwich

April 19th, 2012
7:15 pm

“…actually brought a tear to my eye.

Mine too!”

Thanks, Kam.

I thought I was the only sensitive person here…

Midori

April 19th, 2012
7:17 pm

Hi Fred :)

Hi Paul :)

Doggone — those are just ADORABLE!!! :)

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

April 19th, 2012
7:19 pm

“If you wanna be my lover, you gotta get with my friends
(Gotta get with my friends)
Make it last forever, friendship never ends”
– Thomas Jefferson

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
7:19 pm

“Doggone — those are just ADORABLE!!!”

Yeah, I thought so too!

F. Sinkwich

April 19th, 2012
7:20 pm

MR, thanks for your kind response.

You have my permission to propagate the word, to all, with no encumbrances.

Claim it as your own if you wish.

josef

April 19th, 2012
7:20 pm

“Wasn’t Rand an atheist?”

You mean she didn’t believe in herself?

Aquagirl

April 19th, 2012
7:21 pm

That’s not to mean you are wrong, it’s just that neither of us KNOWS for sure…and one explanation is as good as the other in the absence of proof.

I can buy that….You go with 50/50, I go with preponderance of the evidence. You say tomato, I say tomahto…

I’ve never said Mitt is some kind of dog hater or psycho. The dog probably had a pretty good life. But it’s strange someone would relate this as a lighthearted vacation story, or proof of crisis-management ability or whatever and then get defensive and dodgy when anyone expressed reservations. It’s just….odd.

Don't Forget

April 19th, 2012
7:22 pm

Becky,
She lost her fans (of which I was one at one time) when she declared it was “their turn” to be residents of the WH.

The ultimate sense of entitlement huh? Pretty amazing she thinks that way.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
7:25 pm

“But it’s strange someone would relate this as a lighthearted vacation story, or proof of crisis-management ability or whatever and then get defensive and dodgy when anyone expressed reservations.”

What it tells ME is that he really has no conception of how other people feel…which I see in other things about his interactions with people as he campaigns. I think he simply has no idea that he can be criticized or that others would feel differently from how he, himself, feels about things.

I heard a story last night about FDR’s funeral trip. Thousands of people came out along the route to pay their respects, and one person asked another if he knew FDR. And the reply was “No, but he knew me”

The problem with Romney, as I see it, is that no one would ever say that about him…unless they were a billionaire.

Becky

April 19th, 2012
7:26 pm

Doggone-glad we can finally agree on something!

Don't Forget

April 19th, 2012
7:27 pm

Doggone
But my point is that it is not an INHERENTLY evil choice.

No, it’s not. But it sure tells me a lot about a guy who puts material things ahead of a family pet.

Anybody who is hurting economically and votes for this guy because they think he will be better at getting things going better hope they are right. Because I don’t think they’re gonna get much sympathy or concern from this guy.

BADA BING

April 19th, 2012
7:28 pm

Fri music suggestions
Elvis-Hound Dog
Baja Men- Who let the dogs out
Bow Wow Wow-I want Candy
3 Dog Night-Jerimia was a bull frog
ATL Rythym Section-Dog Days

josef

April 19th, 2012
7:29 pm

Okay, I’ll jump in on the out-of-touch Romney…I don’t automatically think it’s because of his wealth or even the Golden Ghetto isolation. I think he’s pretty much a cold duck by nature.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
7:30 pm

“Doggone-glad we can finally agree on something!”

Thank you. Now if we can just agree not to make hurtful assumptions about each other. I’ll have to admit that I found your assumptions about me to be pretty damn ugly.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
7:31 pm

“Because I don’t think they’re gonna get much sympathy or concern from this guy”

That’s how he comes across to me too.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
7:32 pm

” I think he’s pretty much a cold duck by nature.”

I wouldn’t be surprised, but his money does go a long way towards insulating him from the real-world consequences of that.

Don't Forget

April 19th, 2012
7:32 pm

FNM should be about the “dirt farmer” IMO.

dbm

April 19th, 2012
7:34 pm

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
6:16 pm

It would not be a knee jerk reaction. It would be standing up for the principle that the government should not be forcing people to say things, regardless of what the statement is.

You are playing games with the meaning of the statement “the sky is blue”. The sky is not the same as the air. The sky is what we see when we look up outdoors. When we say “the sky is blue”, we are not saying there is a blue object or substance. We are saying that when we look up outdoors, we see an expanse of blue.

F. Sinkwich

April 19th, 2012
7:35 pm

My tear ducts are dry, washed down my cheeks in awe of the words I penned and have bequeathed to MR.

I still smile at the mirth of Rag, who so eloquently encapsulated the recent controversy about our president’s palate for canine:

“My bologna has a first name, it’s B-E-N-G-I…”

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

April 19th, 2012
7:35 pm

Fri music suggestions

Sat.- Thurs. suggestion
Don’t quit your day job
’cause comedy isn’t
your forte.

Don't Forget

April 19th, 2012
7:35 pm

Josef, agreed, and it probably has a lot to do with WHY he was so successful. He’s gonna look at the macroeconomics and the bottom line. If the middle class benefits it will be secondary and not by design.

josef

April 19th, 2012
7:35 pm

Doggone
@ 7:32

I would agree with that.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
7:38 pm

josef @ 7:20

hahahahaha

maybe both………..

Don't Forget

April 19th, 2012
7:38 pm

Fishy, Obama was a child when he tried that. Around my house we ate what we were served.

josef

April 19th, 2012
7:41 pm

Don’t Forget…

I would agree with that, too. It’s one of the reasons I am not a big fan of the “successful businessman” as a candidate for this office. Too much of “the bottom line” mentality and data driven analyses is not, imuo, a good thing in a position which requires subtlety and diplomacy.

Aquagirl

April 19th, 2012
7:42 pm

What it tells ME is that he really has no conception of how other people feel…which I see in other things about his interactions with people as he campaigns.

Bingo. I got the same feeling when Mitt said “we have to let the housing market correct itself.” Maybe we do, but he sounded like he was discussing the color of the tablecloth. Not people losing their homes.

This fits with the guy who didn’t really understand all the kerfluffle about that Viet Nam thingy.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
7:46 pm

Aquagirl – he’s the only person I think I’ve ever seen that looks uncomfortable in blue jeans!

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
7:47 pm

“he’s the only person I think I’ve ever seen that looks uncomfortable in blue jeans!”

Besides Kerry………….. While I thought Kerry was a better choice then Bush…… he tried and tried but couldn’t pull off that middle man shtick

Unfortunately Bush was a better ACTOR at doing it

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
7:48 pm

Why are there so many folks completely scared and lacking of any initiative to go write a business plan, attract SBA and friends and family capital, and go start a business?

Yeah right. All the business plan in the world won’t help a business when nobody has money to spend on your business in the first place. If your business ain’t bending over for the monied class, you won’t have much of a customer base right now.

It is the American way.

It WAS the American way. Now, the American way is simply to start a ticking timebomb and sell it to someone else before it blows up. Either that, or start something and then ship it overseas. There are a few exceptions, but what used to be the norm has now become the exception.

Our economy is going through the same thing rivers go through when we dam them up. When they are unimpeded, water flows from the river’s head all the way to the ocean where it evaporates and starts the cycle over again. The more the river is blocked and water is removed, the less water that remains in the cycle to keep the river flowing. If you go long enough, then you end up like the Colorado River…

Historically the Colorado River discharged about 15.1 million acre-feet (18.6 km3) into the Gulf each year, corresponding to an average flow of 20,900 cu ft/s (590 m3/s).[41] Since the beginning of the 20th century, flows have steadily declined, and in most years after 1960 the Colorado River has run dry before reaching the sea.[41] This substantial reduction in flow can be attributed to irrigation and municipal diversions, evaporation from reservoirs, and likely climate change.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colorado_River

What we need in our economy right now is for those who are holding up the flow of currency to release the currency into the system. I can’t recall the number of times I’ve heard it repeated that if a wealthy person gave out all their money, they would end up getting it right back because others would spend it and they would work hard to get it again. Well, when it’s not circulating as it should, our consumption-fueled economy suffers like it’s currently doing.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
7:50 pm

“Unfortunately Bush was a better ACTOR at doing it”

See, I don’t think he was acting. He always struck me as being a “redneck” trapped in a rich man’s world…but missing the common touch, because he wasn’t truly familiar with it.

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
7:53 pm

dbm
April 19th, 2012
7:34 pm

I am playing games because I seriously believe the likelyhood of the government ever “forcing” us to say something as stupid as that is about as likely as, for lack of a better allegory, the National Zoo displaying skittle-poopin’ unicorns. The only way we even remotely travel that road is if we continue to allow personal freedoms to be eroded under the guise of pushing ideological beliefs such as requiring people to undergo unreasonable and unwarranted searches for the sake of appeasing the base.

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
7:55 pm

the Golden Ghetto isolation

So wrong… But I bet he’s got major street cred over there amongst “those” people. :)

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
7:56 pm

Doggone

We would just have to disagree…… Not knocking his wealth but except for being Governor, Bush lived in the Dallas Country Clubs for years.

He buys a ranch in 1999 and throws his name in the hat for President. Instead of photo ops at the Country Club now he has a “life set” to drive an F250 and wear Texas ties…….

I used to laugh and joke with my conservative friends about it and they said I was cynical…..

Well Bush hasn’t been seen on that ranch lately but he does have a new pad he purchase before leaving office in one of the swankest country clubs where? You got it back in the Big D…..

Like I told my buddies…… it was a “live set” for photo ops from the start……. Made for tv “Im just like you middle America”

Sad thing…….. It not only worked once, but twice

It was a show from start to end

godless heathen

April 19th, 2012
7:56 pm

“I think he’s pretty much a cold duck by nature.”

I read one analysis of Romney that that was “the Mormon way”. I dunno. But he’s never be as “likable” a guy as Presidents Obama or Clinton. I think W would have been fun to hang out with also – back in his drinking days.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
7:59 pm

Bro

Major Cred………

Rumor has it when he hits Rodeo Dr he sings “Picture me rolln” under his breath

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
8:00 pm

“I think W would have been fun to hang out with also – back in his drinking days.”

Back when he was “Smokn whiskey and drinkn cocaine”

Kamchak ~ Thug from the Steppes

April 19th, 2012
8:00 pm

He buys a ranch in 1999…

Only it wasn’t a “ranch” when he bought it.

It was a pig farm.

Midori

April 19th, 2012
8:01 pm

I see Kammy is on a roll as usual :)

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
8:01 pm

“We would just have to disagree”

I don’t think we disagree as much as you think. Bush always seemed to me to be the embodiment of what my Father used to say: “Educated beyond his intelligence”

And that’s not to mean he was stupid, it just means that the money behind him kept him from getting the kind of education that probably would have made him happy and successful. Instead, he was pushed into a world he wasn’t really suited for, and then insulated from his mistakes by the money with which he was surrounded.

I disliked him intensely as a President, and I disliked intensely the decisions that he made (or that were made for him) – but I’ve also, always, felt sorry for him.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
8:02 pm

Kam

Got you…….. My whole point is that is was a “show” from the start. For people that claim to dislike Hollywood, they did a great acting job with Rancher W…..

josef

April 19th, 2012
8:02 pm

Doggone

I would pretty much agree with you on your characterization of Bush. I always kinda felt sorry for him. He just didn’t fit in anywhere. At Yale, he was a Texas yee-haw. In Texas, he was a Northeastern elite. He always struck me as that kid who wanted to be popular and accepted as “one of the gang” and to do so he was always something of a fawner, tolerated, but never really let in, tolerated by the movers and shakers, manipulated for the entrees his name brought. It, imuo, marked his presidency.

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
8:02 pm

They BOTH

I heard his Gulfstream’s rollin’ on 20’s… with spinners.

Mighty Righty

April 19th, 2012
8:04 pm

I know it is fashionable for the left to try to make a big deal out of Romney’s wealth implying somehow he obtained the wealth through less than honorable means. As far as I know his wealth was obtained through hard work and wise investments. That is a path available to all of us. Obama on the other hand, grew up in less than ideal circumstances but some how was able to attend both Columbia and Harvard, two very expensive universities. Thie manner which allowed him to is another of many Obama secrets. His transcripts and admission documents are secret unlike all prior modern presidential candidates. While the Deflectocrats scream for Romney’s tax returns they remain silent about the most commonly available documents concerning Obama that prior presidents released without fear or hesitation. Strange, but a different topic. Back to wealth. The Obama’s are a 2012 version of the Beverly Hillbillies. Suddenly rich, living in the big mansion, with access to the worlds most lavish and largest jets, it is apparent they don’t know how to act. Million dollar vacations in the most luxurious homes and hotels. Taking friends as well as family members on worldwide trips. Listing the daughters as consultants to avoid paying even the minimal transportation charges the governement normaly imposes on family members for non essential trips. Lavish dinners, hundred dollars a bottle wines and the most expensive foods. Certainly the president works hard, and is entitled to these luxuries. But our children and their children will be picking up the tab. This out of control spending during the worst economic times since the depression by a president that claims he wants fairness. Where is the fairness in this spending binge while 20 million americans are out of work and another umpteen million live below the poverty line.and we are borrowing trillions of dollars to support this spending binge government. Is there no common sense in this white house? We elected a representative to represent us. We did not elect a ruler. He is not a king. He is not a monarch.

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
8:05 pm

Josef – very well put. He was born into a world that wasn’t really “his” – but because of that, he couldn’t go “down” to the world that would fit him. It’s not a comfortable situation.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
8:06 pm

Bro

Bet it has some awesome hydraulics and I’m not just talking for the wing flaps and landing gear

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
8:09 pm

“Taking friends as well as family members on worldwide trips.”

Did Laura ever take friends anywhere while in the WH?

Keep crying MR

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
8:11 pm

Anybody who is hurting economically and votes for this guy because they think he will be better at getting things going better hope they are right. Because I don’t think they’re gonna get much sympathy or concern from this guy.

DF–A healthy economy cures nearly all ills, and beats the crap out of “sympathy and concern”. You gotta start thinking more holistically. ;-)

I disliked him intensely as a President, and I disliked intensely the decisions that he made (or that were made for him) – but I’ve also, always, felt sorry for him.

Doggone–Considering that Obama has continued virtually every objectionable policy which started under Bush, including but not limited to the Patriot Act, Gitmo, bank bailouts, Iraq/Afghanistan + a few new conflicts, do you feel that same level of intense dislike?? Or is it something personal about Bush that you don’t see in Obama that motivates your feelings??

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
8:12 pm

“We did not elect a ruler. He is not a king. He is not a monarch.”

Who said any different? I know that many right leaning pundits love to imply that, but who on the left that is followed to any degree said different

Maybe there is someone…….. Fill us in; so I can say that they are out of line for saying such

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
8:13 pm

Bruno

If you voted for Bush, why change from Bush Light?

just kidding…… we disagree on many things, but on several policies you are dead on with your last post

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
8:14 pm

“including but not limited to the Patriot Act, Gitmo, bank bailouts, Iraq/Afghanistan + a few new conflicts, do you feel that same level of intense dislike?? ”

Why should it? I don’t pretend to be objective in my likes and dislikes. I’m not happy with all of Obama’s policies, anything else doesn’t matter.

Don't Forget

April 19th, 2012
8:15 pm

I would agree with that, too. It’s one of the reasons I am not a big fan of the “successful businessman” as a candidate for this office.Too much of “the bottom line” mentality and data driven analyses is not, imuo, a good thing in a position which requires subtlety and diplomacy.

Same here and the second reason is that trying to run the government like a business is like trying to drive a boat like it was a car.

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
8:15 pm

They BOTH

I think I found a clip of of his “Golden Ghetto 1″ :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e9EckOAXHKk

*Language alert!!

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
8:17 pm

“Same here and the second reason is that trying to run the government like a business is like trying to drive a boat like it was a car”

I would have said it was like trying to drive a car like it was a boat.

I remember

April 19th, 2012
8:17 pm

Jay’s premise is the standard liberal line “you just want to….” fill in the blank with some preposterous but darkly ominous threat. I am just over listening to the libs standard garbage line..you just want to…
Jay has lost his crediblity and how he is losing any sense of originality or thought that he once had.

His glory of joining Rachel Madow on the least watched TV in America seems to have gone to his already soft head.

dbm

April 19th, 2012
8:18 pm

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
7:53 pm

I was using that example because others brought up the statement “the sky is blue” and I wanted to respond by making clear the distinction between objecting to something and objecting to the government forcing people to do it. I do not expect the government ever to force people to say “the sky is blue”, even if we do wind up with a totalitarian dictatorship, unless they happen to choose that out of many options as a way of rawly asserting their power.

Your last sentence is half correct. One of various ways we can start to “travel that road is if we continue to allow personal freedoms to be eroded under the guise of pushing ideological beliefs such as requiring people to undergo unreasonable and unwarranted searches for the sake of appeasing the base.”

Actually we have already traveled quite a way down that road. Fortunately there is still a long way to go before we reach dictatorship. Let’s hope the travel doesn’t speed up.

josef

April 19th, 2012
8:19 pm

BROSEPHUS

I feel much the same way about Obama as I do Bush, only in reverse. Instead of being UNcomfortable in his contrived environment, he is TOO comfortable there. He did move smoothly into the in crowd, its values being his. For all his rhetorical sweet talking, he is just as out of touch with the common citizen as Bush ever was, he just is the manipulator and not the manipulated.

That’s one of the reasons I liked Clinton as much as I did…what you see is what you get.

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
8:19 pm

The Obama’s are a 2012 version of the Beverly Hillbillies. Suddenly rich, living in the big mansion, with access to the worlds most lavish and largest jets, it is apparent they don’t know how to act.

You know, MR, I think you just provided a good counterpoint to josef’s and Doggone’s less than flattering characterization of Bush. You can add to your list the charge of “wannabe”, as Obama uses his position to cozy up to various celebrities, including hip-hop moguls. Here’s the guest list from his 50th “Hip Hop” Birthday Party:

“–GUESTS: Al Sharpton, Patrick Gaspard, UBS Investment Bank President Robert Wolf, FCC Chair Julius Genachowski, Leader Nancy and Paul Pelosi, Secretary Tim Geithner, Secretary Arne Duncan, U.S. Trade Rep. Ron Kirk, Secretary Hillary Clinton, Attorney General Eric Holder, Secretary Kathleen Sebelius, Rep./DNC Chair Debbie Wasserman Schultz, former Virginia Gov. and DNC Chair Tim Kaine, Anita Dunn and Bob Bauer, Robert Gibbs, David Axelrod, David Plouffe, Valerie Jarrett, Michael Strautmanis, Pete Rouse, Bill Daley, Deputy Chief of Staff Alyssa Mastromonaco, Denis McDonough, John Brennan, Rahm Emanuel, Tina Tchen, White House chef Sam Kass, Julianna Smoot, Marty Nesbitt, Eric Whitaker, Linda Douglass, and many more.

–CELEBS: Jay-Z, Hill Harper, Chris Rock, Charles Barkley, Steve Harvey, Tom Hanks and Rita Wilson, Grant Hill, Gayle King.

–Also present: Chicago pals, law-school friends, donors – and lots of kids of friends, who stole the show by doing dance routines to the hip-hop songs, in the center of the East Room.”

http://nation.foxnews.com/president-obama/2011/08/05/obama-parties-chris-rock-jay-z-and-whoopi-while-rome-burns

F. Sinkwich

April 19th, 2012
8:20 pm

Lib ilks have a hard time dealing with their messiah’s indisputable failures. Instead of defending his loserness, they choose to attack his predecessor whom I think hasn’t been in office for 3 1/2 years.

When does O’bozo accept responsibility for ANYTHING?

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
8:20 pm

Bro

I forgot that scene. It is great

“Fred G. Sanford… and the G is for going places. Now we ready to roll”

hahahahahaha

Don't Forget

April 19th, 2012
8:21 pm

Bruno
A healthy economy cures nearly all ills, and beats the crap out of “sympathy and concern”.

Agreed mostly although I’d say “most ills” . The problem is that there’s no way you can always have a healthy economy. So without the sympathy and concern you got nothing .

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
8:22 pm

“Lib ilks have a hard time dealing with their messiah’s indisputable failures.”

Who is the lib messiah?
Who named him that?
When did this occur?

Fill us in……….

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
8:24 pm

“For all his rhetorical sweet talking, he is just as out of touch with the common citizen as Bush ever was”

Yes, I agree. I pretty much wrote him off with how the bank bailouts were handled. Everything for the bankers and NOTHING for the “little people” that were hurt the most.

Adam

April 19th, 2012
8:27 pm

Lib ilks have a hard time dealing with their messiah’s indisputable failures.

Now, I know you guys actually don’t believe Jesus would support helping the poor with anything other than taking money away from them, but I am finding it hard to find a “failure” on Jesus’ part.

Oh wait, you meant your phony idea that liberals think that OBAMA is a messiah, somehow. Carry on….

F. Sinkwich

April 19th, 2012
8:27 pm

“Who is the lib messiah?”

O’bozo.

“Who named him that?”

Lib ilks. MSM. Leeches. Miscreants. Loafers.

“When did this occur?”

2007, but took off in 2008.

Thanks for asking.

Adam

April 19th, 2012
8:29 pm

If you need any further proof that Sinkwich is a bald faced liar, there it is.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
8:29 pm

“I am just over listening to the libs standard garbage line..you just want to…”

Be over it…………. I’m over a lot of conservative leaning talk, but seeing this is a free country. I will have to live with it………

I suggest you try and live with it as well……

The rhetoric and hyperbole from both sides has been with us for years and years……. and it isn’t going anywhere

But I trust you will make it and be ok

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
8:29 pm

Bruno If you voted for Bush, why change from Bush Light?

If you can find my old posts on the former W2W blog, you’ll see that I was very critical of Bush near the end of his term, and never supported the Patriot Act or even waterboarding (though I still don’t think it equates to severe torture). However, there’s no way in Hell that I could have picked either Gore or Kerry over Bush.

Why should it? I don’t pretend to be objective in my likes and dislikes. I’m not happy with all of Obama’s policies, anything else doesn’t matter.

Again, Doggone, if it’s just something personal you don’t like about Bush, that’s ok. I can’t say that I intensely dislike Obama in any personal way, I just don’t want him to be President. There are a few politicians who rub me the wrong way as people, chief among them Nancy Pelosi.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
8:31 pm

Sinkwich
No need to be an angry man and lie

I was just asking you to back up your assertions………

Hint: the guy at the gas station will probably not serve as a good therapist, but maybe your insurance covers one that is licensed……….. check into it……… ASAP

F. Sinkwich

April 19th, 2012
8:32 pm

“Oh wait, you meant your phony idea that liberals think that OBAMA is a messiah, somehow. Carry on….”

I know it’s hard for doofuses, be there is such a thing as a dictionary.

Messiah: noun, a professed or accepted leader of some hope or cause.

Look it up.

carlosgvv

April 19th, 2012
8:32 pm

Brosephus – 7:48 – “those who are holding up the flow of currency to release the currency”

Of course you know that many of those here with less than average reading comprehension skills will interpret that as Godless Marxist Socialist liberal anti-American wealth distribution thinking and will lambast you accordingly.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
8:33 pm

Bruno

You know I was messing with you………….

I wasn’t a huge Gore or Kerry fan, but Bush?

We were just on opposite sides but same line of thinking

Adam

April 19th, 2012
8:34 pm

Messiah: noun, a professed or accepted leader of some hope or cause.

Well then I guess that makes Rush Limbaugh, John Boehner, Mitch McConnell, and a number of other people Messiah’s as well. I’ll remember that. Thanks for the info ;)

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
8:34 pm

Sink

You want someone else to look up a definition of something YOU and many on the right proclaim and project on to others?

what an fn clown?

But keep posting… you provide some of the best laughs on this blog

Don't Forget

April 19th, 2012
8:35 pm

I don’t blame Bush, I blame supply side economics of which Bush is a disciple. Every economic problem we have right now is a result of the recession and the collapse of the financial and housing markets. And ALL of that was the result of supply side economics.

Aquagirl

April 19th, 2012
8:36 pm

“Who named him that?”
Lib ilks.

Sinky needs therapy for that ilkphobia.

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
8:37 pm

Agreed mostly although I’d say “most ills” . The problem is that there’s no way you can always have a healthy economy. So without the sympathy and concern you got nothing .

Unfortunately, DF, under Obama, I still got nothing out of all his “sympathy and concern” except stuck with a big bill. I received no bailout moneys or TARP funds, I don’t get food stamps, I received no unemployment money despite being out of work for 2 months in 2010, I already owned a home and car so got no assistance there, I have an affordable mortgage so didn’t qualify for mortgage assistance, and I’m not in a union. At the same time, despite ably paying for all the health care I’ve ever received, I’m now expected to pay for everyone else’s as well.

I’m not sure if I can stand any more of this “sympathy and concern”, friend.

Recon 0311 2533

April 19th, 2012
8:38 pm

The last two or three thread topics must be intended as significant issue avoidance as the discourse now has degenerates into meaningless banter. I guess it’s because things aren’t going so well lately for Obama and the Democrats.

barking frog

April 19th, 2012
8:41 pm

Recon
are marines amphibians?

Old Goober

April 19th, 2012
8:43 pm

Aw, c’mon! Some of you act like children. Do you really think the nature of White House guest lists will change, except for political affiliation, if a Republican becomes president? Do you really believe that a Republican president will be any less exclusive or take less expensive vacations? The only real difference is that some of you conservatives now blasting Obama will be falling all over each other to lick Romney’s rectum—that and the fact that the House will be extremely anxious to act on the President’s requests, while the Senate Republicans will discover a deplorable vacancy rate in the judiciary and be anxious to approve nominees.

Go sell your garbage to some newcomer to the political scene.

Recon 0311 2533

April 19th, 2012
8:45 pm

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
8:45 pm

And ALL of that was the result of supply side economics.

I think that’s vastly oversimplifying things. The housing bubble was fueled by bad banking policies and crazy consumers. I’m not sure how either of those components can be attributed to supply side economics. Please elaborate.

F. Sinkwich

April 19th, 2012
8:46 pm

Obviously you born with a silver spoon in your mouth, Bruno.

C’mon now, ante up!

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
8:47 pm

Recon @ 8:45

Heard that earlier today.

Pretty pathetic…….

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
8:47 pm

dbm
April 19th, 2012
8:18 pm

I saw that you were not the first one that stated that. I should have specified that in my post to you. For that oversight, I appologize if I made it seem like I was attributing that statement to you as if it were your original thought. I would disagree with you a bit on saying that we’ve traveled a ways down that road already. I would instead say that we had almost made it off that street, given our overall history, and recently we did a 180 turn and are going in the wrong direction. I don’t think we would see a dictatorship in this country as the ideologies are so far apart that we would see a true “civil war” with a splitting of the country in half before we see a dictatorship by either ideology. I hope to see neither of those happen.

———————–

josef

It wasn’t me talking about the differences/similarities of Bush and Bush 2.0 *Now with enhanced melanin, but you already know how I feel about the two. Obama reminds me of Clinton when it comes to the smooth talk. I’d agree with you in that both Bush and Obama appear ill-fitted for their contrived environments.

Don't Forget

April 19th, 2012
8:49 pm

Bruno, what I was mainly referring to was Romney’s comments that suggested we didn’t need to care about people losing their homes but rather we needed to let the market work it out and let the chips fall where they may. That’s just cold hearted. I had some challenges in this recession (remember I’ve been in practice less than 2 years) but I got through it ok and am doing fine now. Like you, I had a reasonable mortgage and very little debt. But it’s not about me or anyone else that’s doing ok now for that matter. It’s about people who are in trouble largely because of the shennanigans of Wall Street.

F. Sinkwich

April 19th, 2012
8:50 pm

Not our fault.
Bush sucks.

Obama/Biden 2012

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
8:50 pm

Some of you act like children…….The only real difference is that some of you conservatives now blasting Obama will be falling all over each other to lick Romney’s rectum—

Old Goober–Maybe you should proofread your posts before hitting the submit button. I haven’t met many folks past middle school who think that rectum licking references are an example of being “grownup”.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
8:52 pm

Sinkwich

When you have the time, you need to thank the Recon’s, Thulsa’s, Bruno’s and Scout’s of this blog.

Even when I disagree, it is evident that they bring much more than talking points, rhetoric and frankly the BS you bring

If this were a covered dish dinner………. you would be struggling to show up with paper cups and napkins……….. No substance at all

Mighty Righty

April 19th, 2012
8:52 pm

A note for the Bush bashers: W is the only president with an MBA. After graduating from Yale with better grades than John Kerry, Bush obtained and MBA from Harvard no less. You Obamanistas should take note that both Kerry and Bush and Gore released their college transcripts. They had nothing to hide. I am not a Bush fan. I think he screwed up by not leaving Iraq after the capture of Hussein. I think he contributed to the housing mess by not fighting the Democrats over Fannie and Freddie. But blame should go where it is deserved. The whacky left over look the financial impact 9/11 had on our economy. Eight months after Bush took office our Airlines and travel industry were virtually destroyed with devestating effects through out our entire economy. No intelligent thought can blame the collapse of the good economy inherited from Clinton on Bush with out remembering the effects of 9/11.. The fact is 9/11 was a disaster not caused by Bush. The fact that he was delt that catastrophe and the economy essitially recovered from it is certainly to his credit. Also, Bush did not blame Clinton for the problem. He shut up and fixed the problem unlike Barack Oblamea.

Recon 0311 2533

April 19th, 2012
8:52 pm

Supply side has historically delivered results, while keynesian economics has resulted in where we are today. Anyone who refuses to understand this must either have their head stuck deep in the sand or have O.D.’d on far-left Kool-Aid.

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
8:52 pm

carlos

Let them lambaste until their pectorals sieze up. If I need to, I could translate that into elementary language so that everybody could understand it. A consumption based economy needs consumption in order for it to run properly. No consumption hurts the economy. Hoarding massive amounts of cash is the opposite of consumption. Hoarding cash outside of the economy is even worse. Customers don’t appear out of thin air. If you don’t create jobs and make sure they actually pay worth a damn, you don’t give people the opportunity to become a customer.

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
8:52 pm

Obviously you born with a silver spoon in your mouth, Bruno.

Nah, though I did try to steal josef’s spoon once. Sucker was too fast for me.

Don't Forget

April 19th, 2012
8:55 pm

I think that’s vastly oversimplifying things. The housing bubble was fueled by bad banking policies and crazy consumers. I’m not sure how either of those components can be attributed to supply side economics. Please elaborate.

Ok. The bad banking policies were the result of financial deregulation. The commercial banks joined with the investment side and sold crap to the rest of the economy. They knew they were bad loans but didn’t care and they were obviously much more aware of this than the consumers who believed their “pie in the sky” sales pitches. I blame those who committed the fraud, not those who fell for it.

F. Sinkwich

April 19th, 2012
8:55 pm

” It’s about people who are in trouble largely because of the shennanigans of Wall Street.”

Can’t any of you lib ilks man-up around here and accept the fact that you’re in dire straits because you’re just stoopid?

You idiots signed the contract, right?

No one held a gun at your head, right?

Get over it.

Pussies.

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
8:56 pm

Bruno, what I was mainly referring to was Romney’s comments that suggested we didn’t need to care about people losing their homes but rather we needed to let the market work it out and let the chips fall where they may. That’s just cold hearted.

Well, my core temperature must be in the 30s, then, because that’s exactly the same course of action that I support. Markets operate via supply and demand. Following the building boom, we ended up with millions of vacant homes and commercial properties. The market can only right itself when demand eventually catches up to the supply. Using artificial means to alleviate the short-term suffering can only prolong the inevitable and creates more long-term harm in the form of new debt.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
8:58 pm

“Also, Bush did not blame Clinton for the problem”

Are you sure you are confident in that statement?

F. Sinkwich

April 19th, 2012
8:59 pm

“If this were a covered dish dinner………. you would be struggling to show up with paper cups and napkins……….. No substance at all”

You obviously didn’t see my post about your solemn day last Tuesday.

Perhaps I should re-post…

You’ll be moved, I guarantee it.

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
8:59 pm

Also, Bush did not blame Clinton for the problem. He shut up and fixed the problem unlike Barack Oblamea.

Well, as much as I hate the blame game, there are times that I don’t fault Obama for doing just that. If he didn’t stand up for himself, the history books would probably say that everything was smooth sailing on 1/19/09 since that’s how many of his detractors come off on their criticisms of his policies.

As a sidebar on the blame game, it’s a bit hypocritical to blast Obama for blaming Bush when his detractors still blame his policies. In the real world, he hasn’t seen the light of day in his “policies” since the summer of 2010. The question should be why are those who fault him for blaming Bush doing the same thing in blaming his policies when he had at most a full calendar year to enact his “agenda”? The GOP has, as many gleefully proclaimed, stopped his agenda. So, maybe people should be questioning if the gridlock itself is the reason for all our woes at this current time.

Florida lawmaker Chris Smith blasts Gov. Rick Scott for moving 'at tortoise speed' in reviewing 'Stand Your Ground' law

April 19th, 2012
8:59 pm

A Florida lawmaker is accusing Gov. Rick Scott of moving “at tortoise speed” in examining whether changes are needed to the the state’s controversial “Stand Your Ground” law after the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin by a community watch volunteer.
Scott on Thursday named the members of a 17-person Task Force on Citizen Safety and Protection that will thoroughly examine the controversial 2005 Florida law that says citizens do not have to retreat if attacked and can use deadly force if they “reasonably believe” they are in danger.

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/04/19/11288073-florida-lawmaker-chris-smith-blasts-gov-rick-scott-for-moving-at-tortoise-speed-in-reviewing-stand-your-ground-law?lite

Aquagirl

April 19th, 2012
8:59 pm

If this were a covered dish dinner………. you would be struggling to show up with paper cups and napkins

can’t breath thru the laughing fit…agh

dbm

April 19th, 2012
9:01 pm

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
8:47 pm

Apology accepted.

There are a number of things that constitute giant steps down that road and that show no signs so far of being undone. Three examples:

1. Antitrust laws.

2. Nationalizing the airwaves instead of treating the right to broadcast on a given frequency in a given geographical area as private property in fundamentally the same manner as land.

3. The vastness. pervasiveness, and intrusiveness of government regulation of business.

Maybe we’ll get a dictatorship that claims to compromise between the ideologies and take the best of both. Maybe we’ll get a dictatorship that claims to be a short-term response to an emergency.

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
9:04 pm

Ok. The bad banking policies were the result of financial deregulation.

I guess you could characterize the deregulation as an example of “supply side economics’ in a general way, though many would argue that it was just plain irresponsible to allow the excessive credit leveraging which turned a potentially manageable catastrophe into a tsunami.

I blame those who committed the fraud, not those who fell for it.

Sinkwich said it better @ 8:55 than I could.

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
9:08 pm

dbm
April 19th, 2012
9:01 pm

Are you saying those three things have to be undone in order not to go down that road? Just trying to make sure I’m reading your post correctly…

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
9:10 pm

The GOP has, as many gleefully proclaimed, stopped his agenda. So, maybe people should be questioning if the gridlock itself is the reason for all our woes at this current time.

Gridlock and obstinence blows both ways, Brosephus. The Republicans weren’t even consulted during the first two years of Obama’s term, and the Dem Senate STILL refuses to pass a budget so that the two sides can compromise. But, tip of the cap to the Dems who have won the PR war, since otherwise intelligent people like yourself see it as a one-sided affair.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
9:10 pm

Sink

Post what you need to post…….

If it is funny I will laugh……………

I’m not your mommy or daddy so I will not be holding your hand

dbm

April 19th, 2012
9:12 pm

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
9:08 pm

I’m saying those three things constitute going part way down that road, and make it harder to keep from going farther down.

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
9:13 pm

I guess you could characterize the deregulation as an example of “supply side economics’ in a general way, though many would argue that it was just plain irresponsible to allow the excessive credit leveraging which turned a potentially manageable catastrophe into a tsunami.

Wouldn’t sensible regulation stop that irresponsibility or restrain it much better? I’m all about giving people a chance to do right. If you can’t do right on your own, then sometimes you need those guidelines to keep you from straying off the path. Money is one of those things that I feel can make even the most honest and trustworthy person lose control and do things far outside of what they would normally even fantasize about doing.

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
9:13 pm

(remember I’ve been in practice less than 2 years)

Coming up on 26 years myself, DF. Rookie. ;-)

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
9:13 pm

Bruno @ 9:10

Those are great points.

With that said couldn’t the same be said when Obama offered up a combination of spending decreases and tax increases but was laughed down Pennsylvania Ave by Republicans.

dbm

April 19th, 2012
9:14 pm

I have to leave now, and it may be days before I can check back.

barking frog

April 19th, 2012
9:14 pm

Bro
get the date of the coup
so i can short the market.

Recon 0311 2533

April 19th, 2012
9:17 pm

Making Florida’s ‘Stand your ground law” the villain in this tragedy is stupid. Stand your ground only protects someone who uses deadly force protection from prosecutors who try to force them into proving that they did not fail in retreating from the danger. It does not change the generally accepted rule of Ability, Opportunity, and Jeopardy. Ability=did the deceased attacker possess the ABILITY to maim or kill. Did the deceased attacker have the OPPORTUNITY to maim or kill. Would a reasonable clear thinking person in that same circumstance have reason to believe that they were in JEOPARDY of being killed or maimed. Zimmerman IMO negated a “stand your ground” defense by unlawfully pursuing and confronting Travon Martin.

Mighty Righty

April 19th, 2012
9:17 pm

Brosephus: Your conclusion soesn’t make any sense. Please rewrite so it makes sense. However, I do understand the constant barrage of deflecting Oblamea’s record of failure by attempting to imply the Republican congress is not co-operating. One, Oblamea had two years of no opposition in either the house or the senate to pass anything his heart desired. Two, Why would anyone co-operate with an idealogue who only proposes more destruction? In the twi years he did control the house and senate all he did was push an unconstitutional law through in the middle of the night that wasn’t read or understood by the Deflectocrats and was over the objections of the american people. The law is so bad, today no Democrat even wants to mention it. With absolute control over the government he couldn’t even pass a budget. Even now his party still controls the senate and he still can’t get anything done. Even his Deflectocrat party has again turned down his budget.

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
9:17 pm

dbm
April 19th, 2012
9:12 pm

Ok. I got’cha. I could see both pros and cons on each one of those things, so we’d probably be at least in partial agreement. I’d love to believe that we could control things without the need for government involvement and such. However, I also acknowlege that man is fallible, and we will make mistakes. Some will end up being more costly than others.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
9:19 pm

“Why would anyone co-operate with an idealogue who only proposes more destruction? ”

Time to take a long and hard look in the mirror

Guess you live on a one way street, but that is ok…… many on both sides do or at least act in that manner

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
9:19 pm

Mighty Righty

I’ll rewrite when you actually write something legible that I can understand. That crap you posted up there ^^^ ain’t it…

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
9:21 pm

Recon @ 9:17

Will be interesting to see what Zimmerman’s attorney’s defense strategy will be…….. unless they plead down to a manslaughter charge

Doggone/GA

April 19th, 2012
9:21 pm

I see that reasonable discussion has died again. Too bad, it was nice while it lasted.

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
9:21 pm

Money is one of those things that I feel can make even the most honest and trustworthy person lose control and do things far outside of what they would normally even fantasize about doing.

I hope I won’t shock you by agreeing wholeheartedly. As I said to DF the other night, I have no recollection of Glass-Steagal being repealed. I remember no special mention in the press, though DF found a great video of a Congressman who warned of its consequences.

You’re not going to find many folks out there who think ALL regulation is bad, other than extreme Libertarians.

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
9:22 pm

frog

I don’t know about messing with that coup crowd. If I get around those meetings trying to swipe info, they might try to terminate a brother with extreme prejudice. :)

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
9:23 pm

I see that reasonable discussion has died again. Too bad, it was nice while it lasted.

“Reasonable discussion” meaning you and josef trashing Bush??

barking frog

April 19th, 2012
9:26 pm

Bro
yep, too bad dbm and
all the other dictator
expecters don’t have
method or time frame.

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
9:28 pm

Bruno

Doesn’t shock me at all as I don’t see you as one that spouts the lines without thinking. I have no problem with people who think and analyze things through. I don’t necessarily feel the same about those who spout without using their cerebral cortex first.

You’re not going to find many folks out there who think ALL regulation is bad, other than extreme Libertarians.

That reminds me of one of my biggest gripes with many conservatives. I hate to hear the standard response of “I am for smaller government” when there is no attempt to define what constitutes a smaller government. Personally, I don’t think the size is anywhere near as important as the effectiveness. Anytime I ask a person what defines a small government and how will we know when we get to that point, I usually get that blank stare in return. Then either the number of fed employees or regulations, typically EPA, will be spouted off as though there are cue cards behind me.

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
9:30 pm

Well, looks like all the musicphiles are out for the evening, but I though of this cool Bryan Adams tune to add to the Canadian Rocker tribute:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XqxLt5KWDik&ob=av2e

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
9:33 pm

Mick

April 19th, 2012
9:34 pm

bruno

Not entirely, here’s some classic bubblegum-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XfuBREMXxts

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
9:35 pm

frog

You can corner the market. I’m going to do my Bill Duke impression…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PR37Z5DzsTg

;)

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
9:36 pm

barking frog

April 19th, 2012
9:40 pm

Bro
not me. too old.

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
9:41 pm

That reminds me of one of my biggest gripes with many conservatives. I hate to hear the standard response of “I am for smaller government” when there is no attempt to define what constitutes a smaller government. Personally, I don’t think the size is anywhere near as important as the effectiveness.

Bro–I guess the best way I can explain it is via a sports analogy. No matter which sport I played, I always ended up as the defensive “captain”. In baseball, I was the catcher. In both soccer and ice hockey, I was the goalie. I was put at defensive end in my short-lived football career. No matter the sport, or coach, I was always put on defense. Why?? It’s a mindset–the same mindset which makes the the standard response of “I am for smaller government” sound very appealing to me as well.

As for your charge that that mindset needs to be translated into specific action steps, I couldn’t agree more. I can guarandamntee you that I could find a ton of ways to save money in our budget if I were in charge. My ex-wife didn’t call me “The World’s Cheapest Man” for nothing. It really can’t be that hard, I just think that both parties lack the political will to do what’s necessary.

Mick

April 19th, 2012
9:43 pm

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
9:43 pm

“It really can’t be that hard, I just think that both parties lack the political will to do what’s necessary.”

Best line of the day……….

moonbat betty

April 19th, 2012
9:44 pm

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
9:45 pm

barking frog

April 19th, 2012
9:45 pm

“I remain a simple man
who has more questions
than answers. Please join
me as I seek to turn that
tide.” – Bill Duke

from his website

Recon 0311 2533

April 19th, 2012
9:46 pm

Brosephus, Most conservatives can answer your question easily. I come from from a business background where you had to submit a budgeted business plan and then defend it. You either justified your plan along with projected necessary supporting staff or you failed to do so. If you failed to do so your budget was disapproved and you went back to the drawing board and you only got one more chance before your job was on the line. Government doesn’t work that way but if it did we would have a right sized government that we sadly do not have today. Strong case for term limits and getting people rotating into government form the private sector without aspirations for a political career because a career in government wouldn’t be available.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
9:47 pm

moonbat

We were on the same wavelength

Clapton……. solo and Blindfaith

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
9:50 pm

Mick

April 19th, 2012
9:51 pm

moonbat betty

April 19th, 2012
9:53 pm

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
9:53 pm

Don't Forget

April 19th, 2012
9:55 pm

Well, my core temperature must be in the 30s, then, because that’s exactly the same course of action that I support. Markets operate via supply and demand. Following the building boom, we ended up with millions of vacant homes and commercial properties. The market can only right itself when demand eventually catches up to the supply.

Agreed, but that’s not where the problem lies. The value of the properties WILL find the bottom. The problem is that the bubble was created by all these ridiculous and fraudulent loans and left the people who fell for this garbage with upside down loans and a devastated economy where jobs are very scarce. At the very least the banks should allow these people to refinance to make their payments more manageable and I think an pretty persuasive argument can be made that some principle reduction is warranted as well. We agreed that it was bad banking policies that created the problem and there is documentation through internal communication at these firms that they knew exactly what they were doing. Why should the consumer who fell for the fraud bear the burden. Instead we have the banks who made this mess as the only sector that has fully recovered. That’s not right. As far as I’m concerned the banks should not be prospering until the economy they wrecked has recovered. They acted like con men and should be treated that way.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
9:56 pm

Played him with Clapton on my last post

Joe Bonamassa is one of my favs……… especially in todays era

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRxqYoZiYPU&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hytToent3kw&feature=related

He can flat out light it up…………..

Soothsayer

April 19th, 2012
9:56 pm

moonbat betty

April 19th, 2012
9:57 pm

To all the Wall Street Execs:

c/o Bookman

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-tRXewCAmU

Soothsayer

April 19th, 2012
10:02 pm

Recon 0311 2533

April 19th, 2012
10:03 pm

I always liked JFK even though some of his photographs made him look like Alfred E. Newman as “what me worry” in Mad Magazine. He was among the last of the conservative Democrats.

Soothsayer

April 19th, 2012
10:07 pm

moonbat betty

April 19th, 2012
10:11 pm

Thanks, Sooth.

Now go stick your head in a toilet.

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
10:11 pm

Damn–looks like I opened the musical floodgates!! Good selections everyone!!

Recon 0311 2533

April 19th, 2012
10:15 pm

Soothsayer

April 19th, 2012
10:15 pm

Oscar

April 19th, 2012
10:18 pm

Mighty Righty

April 19th, 2012
9:17 pm
_____

You got your facts all screwed up in this post. It takes 60 votes in the senate to bring a bill to a vote. Democrats don’t have that.
In the two years you mentioned, you state that the president controlled both houses. That’s just not true. Complete control of a party by a president has not existed in a long time. Even if they all called themselves democrats, they were made up of a number of factions, not in agreement and certainly not in control of the majority leader or the president.

Recon 0311 2533

April 19th, 2012
10:18 pm

“Now go stick your head in a toilet.”

but be careful not to flush.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
10:21 pm

Black Country Communion

The band Bonamassa is in when he isn’t doing is solo gig

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aB_JQWX9uOE&feature=related

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
10:22 pm

It really can’t be that hard, I just think that both parties lack the political will to do what’s necessary.

Couldn’t have said it better myself.

———————-

Strong case for term limits and getting people rotating into government form the private sector without aspirations for a political career because a career in government wouldn’t be available.

I don’t agree with term limits beyond what we currently have. Enacting term limits is the lazy man’s kill switch. If you’re afraid of somebody getting that hooked into a job, then vote them out. It’s not an impossible task. You simply have to know where to start.

The easier and more effective way to do it is to start from the lower ranks and work your way up, IMHO. Starting at the state and local level does two things. First, it puts the entire party on notice as all fundraising begins on the local level. The other thing is that I feel the major problem we have is due to gerrymandering. Cleaning house on the state level would be the way to do away with that. A rep will be less inclined to do stupid sh*t when he/she knows that they are only 3 votes from losing their next election. Instead of simply pushing the agenda for the far ideologues, they would have to temper their actions to appeal to everybody. Regardless of what people think, there are people of all political ideologies in this country, and they all deserve representation in DC.

As to getting people rotated into government from the private sector, it sounds like a very laudable task. I don’t think that would work based on current trends. Now, the thing is to do your g-time, get all the knowledge and training, and then go to the public sector. Going that route, you’re almost guaranteed to double or triple your income. Check the number of generals that retire and become consultants. Look at the retirees from the CIA, NSA, FBI, and other intelligence agencies that have gone into security consulting. It would be a monumental task to get people to leave a job with very good pay to come and work for the government.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
10:22 pm

Recon

Great Dr John selection

Soothsayer

April 19th, 2012
10:22 pm

moonbat betty

April 19th, 2012
10:23 pm

I like it, Recon 10:15.

Let the good times roll.

Soothsayer

April 19th, 2012
10:26 pm

moonbat betty

April 19th, 2012
10:29 pm

Soothsayer

April 19th, 2012
10:30 pm

Soothsayer

April 19th, 2012
10:31 pm

Moonbat: you have some serious issues you need to deal with.

0311/8541/5811/1811/1801

April 19th, 2012
10:32 pm

Recon 0311 2533

April 19th, 2012
10:33 pm

“It would be a monumental task to get people to leave a job with very good pay to come and work for the government.”

Some would say it should be that way but that’s not necessarily the case today. You still didn’t address the budget cycle in the private sector verses the same or lack there of in the federal government.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
10:33 pm

moonbat betty

April 19th, 2012
10:34 pm

GFY.

Good for you, soothsayer.

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
10:35 pm

Scout

Hope you have had a good week. Saw where he was sick, but didn’t know he had passed. Nice choice

moonbat betty

April 19th, 2012
10:38 pm

TBS, nice 10:33

0311/8541/5811/1811/1801

April 19th, 2012
10:41 pm

They BOTH suck:

Just been real busy.

Here’s another good one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4MbsimrlWL8

Soothsayer

April 19th, 2012
10:42 pm

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
10:42 pm

Recon 0311 2533

April 19th, 2012
10:47 pm

Taps y’all…out

moonbat betty

April 19th, 2012
10:48 pm

Thanks TBS, great stuff!

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
10:49 pm

Your welcome

We are hit and miss, probably mostly miss on politics……… but I’ve caught some of your music links

Great taste…………..

Bruno and I are like that as well

0311/8541/5811/1811/1801

April 19th, 2012
10:49 pm

RECON:

There are thousands of people running around trying to pretend they were Vietnam Veterans.

I don’t know anyone who is pretending to have been at Woodstock !

Oscar

April 19th, 2012
10:50 pm

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
10:52 pm

moonbat betty

April 19th, 2012
10:55 pm

This is what they sent with my cat’s cremains.

and this is all that will be said at my funeral:

When I am gone, release me. Let me go
I have so many things to see and do.
You mustn’t tie yourself to me with tears, Be
happy, we had so many years.

I gave you my love and you can only guess
How much you gave to me in happiness.
I thank you for the love you each have shown
But now it’s time I traveled alone.

So grieve a while for me if grieve you must
Then let your grief be comforted by trust.
It’s only for a while that we must part
So bless those memories in your heart.

I won’t be far away for life goes on
So if you need me , call and I will come.
Though you can’t see or touch me, I’ll be near
with all my love around you soft and clear.

And then, when you must come this way alone,
I’ll greet you with a smile and

“Welcome You Home”.

Good night gentle souls.

Brosephus™

April 19th, 2012
10:59 pm

You still didn’t address the budget cycle in the private sector verses the same or lack there of in the federal government.

I don’t think the two processes have the same purpose. I remember when the saying used to be that you had to spend money to make money. Today’s business leaders seem to march to the beat of a different drummer. On the public sector side, I feel that the difference in missions from the private sector makes it difficult to make one on one comparisons. There is no profit motive in the public sector. That makes the underlying motives in budgeting different, IMHO.

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
11:07 pm

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
11:13 pm

0311/8541/5811/1811/1801

April 19th, 2012
11:16 pm

Oscar:

That was a good version also.

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
11:21 pm

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
11:24 pm

moonbat betty

April 19th, 2012
11:27 pm

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
11:29 pm

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
11:31 pm

Psychedelic, betty. The mathematical figure displayed comes form fractal geometry and is known as the Mandelbrot Set.

Back at ya:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ihKzJyZNHEI&feature=related

They BOTH suck

April 19th, 2012
11:32 pm

Leave you with this great tune

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vdp42fYKFZ8

Have a great night and an even better tomorrow

moonbat betty

April 19th, 2012
11:36 pm

Bruno, I’ve heard, and it’s amazing.

Neutrinos back at you, home boy

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aaw25N8yxNY

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
11:37 pm

Awesome Dire Straits, TBS. One of my favorites.

Bruno

April 19th, 2012
11:48 pm

Oscar

April 20th, 2012
12:00 am

moonbat betty

April 20th, 2012
12:00 am

Ha Ha TBS, I don’t think anyone has had the bawls to play that yet. props…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVT8t0oHdWY

G Mare 71( got the living' the red state BLUES!)

April 20th, 2012
12:09 am

That is nice, Betty. Thanks for sharing. After my precious Daisy went to sleep in my arms, the vet practice sent a card about the paw prints in your heart. Yeah, I cried all over again. I’ve had dogs since, but Daisy’s prints are indelible it seems. Okay, wiping the tears, going to bed.

moonbat betty

April 20th, 2012
12:26 am

G Mare, G’nite.

me too.

Your loved ones will always be in your heart.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JteS9cakGN8

Normal, plain and simple

April 20th, 2012
7:48 am

Staying home today, not feeling that good, but it IS…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oNxMXDIzSCI&feature=player_embedded

Mick

April 20th, 2012
7:50 am

Normal

Get well friend cuz your health is your wealth! No major tragedies this week! That breaks a streak of six weeks running…happy friday all!

Joe Hussein Mama

April 20th, 2012
9:19 am

Righty — “However it is none of the governments business how a private company pays its people.”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minimum_wage_in_the_United_States

Overruled. Next?

“TBS, I don’t know about your belief, but my God is not a Socialist, Communist, Nazi, Facist.”

Really? ‘Cause I’d say that a lot of Jesus’s teachings seem to be pretty Socialist and Communist in nature.

“He who does not work, neither shall he eat.”

–Vladimir Lenin and The Bible

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/He_who_does_not_work,_neither_shall_he_eat

“Thou shalt not steal.”

–The Ten Commandments

“Do not steal even a needle or a piece of thread from the People.”

–Mao’s Little Red Book

“My God blessed us with rights that are not to be taken away by a government.”

The Declaration of Independence isn’t a legal document. And the Constitution makes quite clear that We The People granted OURSELVES our rights.

“In November, my God will rectify past mistakes made by men. Amen.”

If your god is all that, then let’s see him do it right now.

Jm

April 20th, 2012
9:25 am

I agree

Shareholder rights.

blackdragon

April 20th, 2012
11:38 am

So, paying top executives more will provide more jobs? I would think that taking the millions of dollars a corporation wants to pay a handful of executives in bonuses, etc could be better used to hire additional staff. Could somebody explain to me how paying a select few well above their worth creates jobs?

dbm

April 22nd, 2012
8:42 am

Joe Hussein Mama

April 20th, 2012
9:19 am

Calling “Thou shalt not steal” socialism is almost as silly as calling “Thou shalt not kill” Naziism.

dbm

April 22nd, 2012
8:55 am

barking frog

April 19th, 2012
9:26 pm

I am not a dictator expecter. I don’t expect a dictatorship any time soon. It was Brosephus who brought up the issue of dictatorship. I made clear that I think we have a long way to go before we get there.