Catholic bishop likens Obama to Stalin, Hitler
This is quite a hysterical screed, and by hysterical I do not mean that it is funny. It is not funny in the least.
It is hysterical because is driven by hysteria. It is also historically ignorant and irresponsible.
The speaker is Bishop Daniel R. Jenky, head of a Catholic diocese in Illinois. Here’s what he had to say during a weekend Mass:
“The Church survived barbarian invasions. The Church survived wave after wave of Jihads. The Church survived the age of revolution. The Church survived Nazism and Communism. And in the power of the resurrection, the Church will survive the hatred of Hollywood, the malice of the media, and the mendacious wickedness of the abortion industry.
The Church will survive the entrenched corruption and sheer incompetence of our Illinois state government, and even the calculated disdain of the president of the United States, his appointed bureaucrats in HHS, and of the current majority of the federal Senate.
May God have mercy especially on the souls of those politicians who pretend to be Catholic in church, but in their public lives, rather like Judas Iscariot, betray Jesus Christ by how they vote and how they willingly cooperate with intrinsic evil.
As Christians we must love our enemies and pray for those who persecute us, but as Christians we must also stand up for what we believe and be ready to fight to defend our faith. The days in which we live now require heroic Catholicism, not casual Catholicism. We can no longer be Catholics by accident, but instead be Catholics by conviction.
In our own families, in our parishes, where we live and where we work – like that very first apostolic generation – we must be bold witnesses to the Lordship of Jesus Christ. We must be a fearless army of Catholic men, ready to give everything we have for the Lord, who gave everything for our salvation.
Remember that in past history other governments have tried to force Christians to huddle and hide only within the confines of their churches like those first disciples before the Resurrection locked together in the Upper Room.
In the late 19th century, Bismark waged his “Kulturkamf,” a culture war against the Roman Catholic Church, closing down every Catholic school and hospital, convent and monastery in Imperial Germany. Clemenceau, nicknamed “the priest eater,” tried the same thing in France in the first decade of the 20th Century.
Hitler and Stalin, at their better moments, would just barely tolerate some churches remaining open, but would not tolerate any competition with the state in education, social services, and health care.
In clear violation of our First Amendment rights, President Obama – with his radical, pro-abortion and extreme secularist agenda, now seems intent on following a similar path.
Now things have come to such a pass in our beloved country that this is a battle that we could lose, but before the awesome judgment seat of Almighty God this is not a battle where any believing Catholic may remain neutral.”
I was raised to believe that religious leaders deserve a great deal of respect and even deference, and I hope I have raised my children with those same values. Jenky, however, deserves neither respect nor deference, because he is talking like a fool.
After all, only a fool would try to equate insurance coverage for contraception to the brutalities that were inflicted upon tens of millions of people by the likes of Stalin and Hitler. The bishop’s comments are deeply insulting and disrespectful, less to President Obama than to the many victims of the tyrants to whom Jenky attempts to link him. His comparison trivializes true human horror.
St. Peter, after all, was crucified upside down by the Romans, who also fed Christians to the lions. Hitler attempted the physical eradication of an entire religious tradition. Stalin starved millions to death in an attempt to force them to worship the state rather than a God of their own choosing.
And “President Obama, with his radical, pro-abortion and extreme secularist agenda, now seems intent on following a similar path”?
The suggestion is obscene.
(Given the bishop’s claims, it is also relevant to point out that the Catholic Church did not fight heroically against the evils of Naziism. To a large degree, it legitimized, collaborated and cooperated with it. While individual clerics of conscience sometimes spoke and acted with heroism, the church as an institution did not. It stood in silent acceptance of the murder of Jews and voluntarily surrendered its moral credibility. By that behavior, it did no worse than many other human institutions in that time and place. But it also did no better.)
While Jenky has seemed to abandon all sense of proportion, it’s important to keep in mind what’s really at issue here. The administration does not propose and has never proposed that the Catholic Church or other religious groups be forced to provide insurance coverage for contraception to their staff. Church staff members are expressly excluded from such a mandate out of respect for religious liberty.
The law does, however, require that church-affiliated institutions that perform secular functions in the secular world — schools, universities, hospitals, etc. — provide such coverage to their staff, many of whom are members of a different faith, just as every other provider of such services must do.
You would never know it from the hysteria offered by Jenky, but many Catholic-affiliated institutions have been offering contraceptive coverage to their secular staff for decades without controversy. For example, Georgetown University, which drew national attention through the Sandra Fluke controversy, is a Jesuit college that already offers contraception coverage to its faculty and staff, but not to its students. Many states, including Georgia, have also had similar laws on the books mandating such coverage for decades, again without controversy.
The administration proposal is also well within the constitutional confines established by the Supreme Court. As Justice Antonin Scalia, himself a stalwart Catholic, wrote in “Employment Division v. Smith” (1990):
“We have never held that an individual’s religious beliefs excuse him from compliance with an otherwise valid law prohibiting conduct that the state is free to regulate. On the contrary, the record of more than a century of our free exercise jurisprudence contradicts that proposition.”
Jenky, on the other hand, argues that church law must take precedence over civil law even when the church is operating in the secular arena, and he seems eager to engage in battle to ensure that happens. He would apparently classify Scalia as just another Judas Iscariot, ready to “betray Jesus Christ by how they vote and how they willingly cooperate with intrinsic evil.”
As I said, he has exposed himself as a fool.
– Jay Bookman
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803 comments Add your comment
They BOTH suck
April 18th, 2012
3:08 pm
Mighty Righty @ 3:04
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/08/us/politics/08beliefs.html
Except for your assertion, what evidence do you have that shows a change from how Catholics voted in 2008?
Always helpful to gain new insights and read interesting information.
Thanks
Paul
April 18th, 2012
3:08 pm
Adam 2:41
Now that is an excellent point.
rightwing troll
April 18th, 2012
3:08 pm
“rightwing troll
Can you think of one major institution that’s been around for years that hasn’t had some sort of a scandal?”
No. You’ll find I’m an equal opportunity despiser of all purveyors of evil, and any large religious institution is exactly that. Beware of men spouting bible verses, always…
Joe Hussein Mama
April 18th, 2012
3:09 pm
Righty –”Frankly, most of us are fed up with the constant attacks on our christanity, our beliefs and our GOD from you non believers.”
Can a fatwa be far behind?
Recon 0311 2533
April 18th, 2012
3:09 pm
TBS, umm, unless you know something I don’t, Mccain won’t be running again.
Fred ™
April 18th, 2012
3:10 pm
Speaking of rape, pillage, murder, and plunder, I just remembered I have 2 episodes of Game of Thrones I could watch. Well either that or clean up the house and make my wife happy……… let me think about this………………….
Game of Thrones. Most definitely. (that took about half a nano second to decide).
Thulsa Doom
April 18th, 2012
3:11 pm
Size matters!- JamVet
Yep. So I’ve been told.
Fred ™
April 18th, 2012
3:11 pm
Wow. Really?
Fred ™
April 18th, 2012
3:11 pm
Where was I factually incorrect?
They BOTH suck
April 18th, 2012
3:12 pm
Recon
I understand he is not, however I.m sure you knew I was referring to the 08 election…. If you didn’t, well that is what I was referring to and again those names could have been replaced to make the same argument you are making today
Joe Hussein Mama
April 18th, 2012
3:12 pm
Doom — “Yep. So I’ve been told.”
With disappointment in her voice.
My, My, My
April 18th, 2012
3:12 pm
I have not heard ONE “christian” white Bishop/Minister offer an opinion about the whole outcry!
should be
I have not heard ONE “christian” white “SOUTHERN BAPTIST” Bishop/Minister offer an opinion about the whole outcry!
Paul
April 18th, 2012
3:12 pm
rightwing troll
So you don’t have much use for Gautama Buddha or Ghandi?
Old timer
April 18th, 2012
3:13 pm
If itnsoundsmlike a duck…..
My Party has ALL the answers. Your party is full of poopyheads! (formerly That Black Guy)
April 18th, 2012
3:13 pm
Jay
April 18th, 2012
2:09 pm
No, Party, can’t say I do…
____________________________________________________________________________
Jay, in Jersey where I grew up, “jenky” means someone shady or untrustworthy.
Fred ™
April 18th, 2012
3:13 pm
Thulsa Doom
April 18th, 2012
3:11 pm
Size matters!- JamVet
Yep. So I’ve been told.
++++++++++++++++++++++++
Been found wanting have you lol?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UaEC-lWSlmI
Road Scholar
April 18th, 2012
3:15 pm
I wonder if he was also repulsed this much by the molestation of little boys? What does he have to say about that?
They BOTH suck
April 18th, 2012
3:15 pm
Recon
After all man, McCain did pick Palin
Regardless of who that team was running against, you didn’t think a win was in order, did you?
My Party has ALL the answers. Your party is full of poopyheads! (formerly That Black Guy)
April 18th, 2012
3:17 pm
gm
April 18th, 2012
2:10 pm
Why should anyone be surprised of white bishops, and priest, these are the people that hung blacks back in the 19th and 20th century in the name of Jessus.
We never hear about Obama commitment to family and morales or the 1st lady out there fighting for widows who lost members in the miltary instead these devils who pretend to be Priest support men like Newt G. and remain silent while they rape litte boys.
_______________________________________________________________________________
gm, like I used to tell my nephew when he would say dumb things:
Think about what you want to say.
Run it through your mental filter.
If it makes sense to you.
Then DON’T say it.
Fred ™
April 18th, 2012
3:17 pm
Road Scholar
April 18th, 2012
3:15 pm
I wonder if he was also repulsed this much by the molestation of little boys? What does he have to say about that?
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Careful. My post along those lines got pulled………
Thulsa Doom
April 18th, 2012
3:17 pm
–”Frankly, most of us are fed up with the constant attacks on our christanity, our beliefs and our GOD from you non believers.”
I’m not much for attacks on people of religious persuasion either or someone’s individual beliefs in God. But I’ve no problem with criticism of organized religion and in particular some institutions moreso than others. If you study history you will see the Catholic church for 2000 years has been a great force of oppression and all sorts of evil. The recent covering up of the pedophile scandals and the willful silence of the church during the holocaust does nothing to silence those criticisms. Many Catholics and catholic leaders and priests are very good people. But as for the institution and its historical transgressions I don’t care for it much.
Fred ™
April 18th, 2012
3:18 pm
Former black Guy @ 3:17: Amen. I reckon GM never watched that wicked cool iCarly episode that the First Lady did………..
Recon 0311 2533
April 18th, 2012
3:19 pm
TBS a genuine move to cut spending, reform entitlements and reform the tax code where all pay something, followed then by tax increases would probably gain the support from most voters. The odds of that happening this year? Slim to none and as Dan Rather would say “Slim is fixing to ride out of town”.
Fred ™
April 18th, 2012
3:19 pm
TD: And don’t forget the Holy Crusades and the Spanish inquisition.
Thulsa Doom
April 18th, 2012
3:20 pm
Fred and Joe Mama,
I didn’t say in what context I had been told that so ya’ll simmer down now- ya hear? For all ya’ll know I mighta been told that in the glowing aftermath of a fine Doomy performance. Or not…
JamVet
April 18th, 2012
3:20 pm
Ah, for the good old days when our hardscrabble Baptists DESPISED the papists and every other denomination/false religion.
I guess having run everybody else off, they have little choice but to cuddle up next to them now!
Of course, one cannot go by appearances. He doesn’t look like a twisted liar but he does have a nice hat, doesn’t he?
http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/jenky.jpg
Soothsayer
April 18th, 2012
3:21 pm
I find it amazing that the Catholic Church would assail our President or anyone else for that matter given it’s history of sexual abuse and Inquisitions. How many countless people were tortured or died as the result of the Inquisiton?
Fred ™
April 18th, 2012
3:22 pm
Recon 0311 2533
April 18th, 2012
3:19 pm
TBS a genuine move to cut spending, reform entitlements and reform the tax code where all pay something, followed then by tax increases would probably gain the support from most voters. The odds of that happening this year? Slim to none and as Dan Rather would say “Slim is fixing to ride out of town”.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Or last year when Obama proposed EXACTLY that and the Republican controlled Congress killed it. You see, it required RICH PEOPLE to pay some taxes and we can’t have that can we?
Brosephus™
April 18th, 2012
3:24 pm
It should be remembered that tax cuts are also part of overall Keynesian economic policy.
True enough, but how many Keyensian routinely break out in song and dance on how tax cuts spur economic growth?
They BOTH suck
April 18th, 2012
3:24 pm
Recon @ 3:19
I agree, but once again whomever wins better get ready to inform their “faithful” that changes need to be made……..
That is going to rile up either “base”, however if it does not occur and Obama bows to his base or Romney does the same………. long term we could be in trouble
Thulsa Doom
April 18th, 2012
3:25 pm
Fred,
That and here in Latin America the evils perpetrated on local indigenous populations were particularly severe. In my studies of Latin America the church holds as much or more responsibility for the lack of advancement and oppression as any other factor. And for centuries the church and the sword worked hand in the form of far right dictatorships operating with the blessing of the church. Just a fact.
Pizza
April 18th, 2012
3:25 pm
So we have Bishop Daniel Jenky and Ted Nugent making such statements but what Hilary Rosen said was outrageous ? I’m confused . . . .
carlosgvv
April 18th, 2012
3:26 pm
Mary Elizabeth
Since there is not a shred of hard evidence that God even exists, why do you speak of a Creator as though it is a proven fact?
My Party has ALL the answers. Your party is full of poopyheads! (formerly That Black Guy)
April 18th, 2012
3:27 pm
Mick
April 18th, 2012
2:42 pm
Somebody please wheel out the fainting couch for old zedd…
_____________________________________________________________________
No, let him hit the floor.
Recon 0311 2533
April 18th, 2012
3:27 pm
How many countless people were tortured or died as a result of Nazi Germany, atheist communist Soviet Russia or atheist communist China, North Korea and Radical Islam?
Doggone/GA
April 18th, 2012
3:28 pm
“Since there is not a shred of hard evidence that God even exists, why do you speak of a Creator as though it is a proven fact?”
If you don’t agree, why do you care?
Becky
April 18th, 2012
3:28 pm
recon-are you suggesting the religion with the most blood on its hands wins?
Adam
April 18th, 2012
3:29 pm
Recon: atheist communist
Out of curiosity, how many people do YOU think in either of those countries you described this way felt that they were killing in the name of atheism?
Fred ™
April 18th, 2012
3:31 pm
TD: Look also at the role of the Catholic Church in Ireland. ESPECIALLY during the famine years.
I try to be tolerant and “respectful” of the Catholic Church, but in my opinion they are about one nanometer better than Southern Baptists.
But then I don;t know what to say. I made a post that contains the same thing as at least 8 posts I have just read and it got pulled. So maybe I’ll just go down to 3 dollar and have a beer.
If you are off work come on down. 3 dollar on Chamblee Tucker………….. (invite applies to anyone lol. I’ll be the fat guy with the big fat loud opinionated mouth. You can’t miss me.)
Thulsa Doom
April 18th, 2012
3:31 pm
Brocephus,
What it all comes down to for me is who most efficiently allocates a dollar’s worth of resources and to me its the private sector- especially in terms of capital. I just believe that a dollar in the private sector whether in the hands of an individual or an employer is far more efficiently spent than by a bureaucrat in govt. And regulatory environment. That I think is what separates the Reagan revolution- the deregulation which began under Carter and was advanced by Reagan. And instead of a pro business, less burdensome regulatory environment that we saw under Reagan i think we have the opposite under O and that its what is chiefly holding us back. There are other systemic and structural changes such as outsourcing that have been going on forever and aren’t going to change though no matter who is potus. Nuff said about that. Doomy gonna go get some work done.
Paul
April 18th, 2012
3:31 pm
Sooth
“I find it amazing that the Catholic Church would assail our President”
I don’t believe a bishop speaks for the Catholic Church.
And when you hearken back to the Inquisition you play right into the hands of the “Islam’s not a religion, it’s a socio-political war machine” crowd.
They BOTH suck
April 18th, 2012
3:32 pm
“How many countless people were tortured or died as a result of Nazi Germany, atheist communist Soviet Russia or atheist communist China, North Korea and Radical Islam?”
I think it is safe to say that throughout history millions of people have been killed directly or indirectly by “religious” and “secular” individuals and institutions of some sort or another
Pointing out atrocities on one side will not make atrocities committed by the other side go away or some how lesson the impact of what was done in the name of _____________.
Fred ™
April 18th, 2012
3:33 pm
Pizza
April 18th, 2012
3:25 pm
So we have Bishop Daniel Jenky and Ted Nugent making such statements but what Hilary Rosen said was outrageous ? I’m confused . . . .
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
No confusion necessary. All three made outrageous asshat comments.
Joe Hussein Mama
April 18th, 2012
3:33 pm
Doom — “I didn’t say in what context I had been told that so ya’ll simmer down now- ya hear?”
Man. you set yourself up for that. Fred and I just walked right thru the open door.
“For all ya’ll know I mighta been told that in the glowing aftermath of a fine Doomy performance.”
Come on. You know there was no winning reply.
“Or not…”
Don’t give me another setup, because I’ll take it.
Jefferson
April 18th, 2012
3:34 pm
Don’t sound like a non profit to me, maybe taxes should be in order…
barking frog
April 18th, 2012
3:34 pm
Thomas Jefferson believed
in freedom….for himself!!
-Sally Hemming
MICHAEL FERRI
April 18th, 2012
3:34 pm
Well put, Mr. Bookman. And this man has a degree in history. Shameful. One wonders if Bishop Jenky is out to make some noise in order to be noticed way out there in Peoria by the other members of the US hierarchy and Curia. He may be feeling too removed from the large urban dioceses of Chicago, Boston and New York where the front line action is. What better way to be seen and heard by Dolan in New York and the Pope in Rome than to fire off an incendiary salvo in the culture wars. His rhetoric really goes beyond much of what I seen put out by the Church hierarchs. He should apologize to President Obama. I bet he’s bucking for a red beanie!
Paul
April 18th, 2012
3:35 pm
carlosgvv
Any explanations how the earth and the life we see here is reconciled with the second law of thermodynamics re. entropy?
Recon 0311 2533
April 18th, 2012
3:36 pm
Fred-Or last year when Obama proposed EXACTLY that and the Republican controlled Congress killed it. You see, it required RICH PEOPLE to pay some taxes and we can’t have that can we?
Of course the other version is that Obama reneged on that agreement because his base was going ballistic about entitlement reform and so he informed Boehner that it would have to be all tax increases on the wealthy. Boehner said no. Choose who you want to believe but either way the problem remains and I don’t see much from the Democrats in the form of real solutions. The “Buffett Rule” won’t get it and even Obama admits that, while he’s given up governing in favor of campaigning.
Joe Hussein Mama
April 18th, 2012
3:38 pm
Recon — “How many countless people were tortured or died as a result of Nazi Germany”
Theists.
“atheist communist Soviet Russia”
Not officially atheist. Read their Constitution.
“or atheist communist China”
Not officially atheist. Read their Constitution.
“North Korea”
Not officially atheist. In fact, there’s a multi-party system there, and a minority religious party (the Chondoists) actually holds seats in the People’s Assembly.
“and Radical Islam?”
Dude, Islam’s a *theistic religion.* You’ve got to think about what you post before you post it.
There was only one officially atheist nation in the entire 20th Century, and you’re not even close.
If you want to play Theist Body Count versus Atheist Body Count, I’m game.
Thulsa Doom
April 18th, 2012
3:39 pm
Fred,
I try to be respectful also but I know the history of the church. And I’ve nothing against Catholics in general, or mormons,baptists, or anyone of any religious persuasion. I just think that any monolithic man made institution whether it be a church or a government- Nazis, Commies, whatever inevitably breeds the drunken corruption of power and hegemony over people. JMHO of course. And I think people lose their individuality and independent thinking in the midst of a mass of people being commanded by a single orator- Hitler’s Germany, these mega churches preaching cotton candy prosperity- tythe 10% and you’ll be materially blessed while I drive in my Jags and fly church owned jets, etc.
Allright. Doomy on a soapbox and its time to go. Fred I would join you down at 3 dollar, get into a loud politcal argument with you, and then we could beat the hell out of each other. But alas I got some work to do and some folks to call back. Doomy out.
carlosgvv
April 18th, 2012
3:40 pm
Doggone/GA – 3:28
So, if someone posts something here you don’t agree with, you just keep silent and don’t post anything?
Joseph
April 18th, 2012
3:40 pm
The thing you simply don’t understand Jay is that more and more people are thinking this way. Read and understand Obama’s policys and perhaps maybe you will understand.
Recon 0311 2533
April 18th, 2012
3:41 pm
Adam, they were killing in the name of communism and atheism is a part of that political ideology. The other I referenced kills in the name of Islam.
Jefferson
April 18th, 2012
3:42 pm
For a while I was thinking they needed zoning laws on how close an elementary school could be to a catholic church…
Adam
April 18th, 2012
3:45 pm
Recon: Ok so they were killing for an ideology. But I think trying to say that atheism is part of communism is wrong, even though they wanted to stamp out other religions in favor of reading their little red book – frankly I’d call that a religion in its own right, even if it doesn’t ascribe supernatural deities.
carlosgvv
April 18th, 2012
3:45 pm
Paul – 3:35
From the first seconds of The Big Bang till now the Universe has been steadly going to ever larger amounts of entropy. The window of opportunity for life to exist, while in the billions of years, will eventually cease as entropy increases. In about 10,000 trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion years, entropy will be complete as the universe will be unable to become more disordered.
Recon 0311 2533
April 18th, 2012
3:45 pm
Joe, You’re incorrect on your understanding of those ideologies, so I don’t need to think about what I post any further than I have.
Brosephus™
April 18th, 2012
3:48 pm
I just believe that a dollar in the private sector whether in the hands of an individual or an employer is far more efficiently spent than by a bureaucrat in govt.
That might be the case, or it might not. Right now, the private sector is not doing what you claim they do so well, and it’s not due to a lack of capital.
Now, this is where you respond with the regulation stuff …
Don't Forget
April 18th, 2012
3:50 pm
RIP Dick Clark.
Moderate Line
April 18th, 2012
3:50 pm
I see this article some misleading. He did not compare Stalin and Hitler to Obama. He basically stated we survived A so we will survive B. I did not see anything saying A is like B.
Recon 0311 2533
April 18th, 2012
3:50 pm
Adam, call it what you wish but those I referenced with the obvious exception of Islam practice atheism. Now of course that doesn’t make all non-believer atheists communists much less killers and torturers.
They BOTH suck
April 18th, 2012
3:52 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzsOYtGNHtk
Redneck Convert (R--and proud of it)
April 18th, 2012
3:52 pm
Well, it’s not much of a blog topic but it’s better than arguing about making somebody pee in a cup, I reckon. I don’t pay any attention to what Catholics say anyway. People that worship a bunch of idols and try and make others stray from the one true faith, which is found in the Holiness and Baptist churches, ain’t worth answering. I reckon if I was Catholic I’d be against birth control in insurance too, especially seeing as how there ain’t never been a altar boy that got in the Family Way.
But at least we know one preacher that will vote Republican. And that’s a good start.
Have a good p.m. everybody.
Hootinanny Yum Yum
April 18th, 2012
3:52 pm
Yeah, I hate extremist preachers…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=seo0yAxlpHo
Jack
April 18th, 2012
3:53 pm
Did you actually read/listen to Bishop Jenky’s homily? Or did you read the CNN/NYT headline and crap out a blog? In no way does the Bishop imply a moral equivalency between contraception and the holocaust. Maybe next time you can RTFA before you engage in public defecation.
Peadawg
April 18th, 2012
3:54 pm
2 Black guys are suing ‘The Bachelor’ for being racist b/c they were passed over and there’s never been a black bachelor. There’s a Black Miss America, BET, etc. Go make a ‘Black Bachelor’ and stfu. So stupid.
Pass the Cheesy Grits Please
April 18th, 2012
3:54 pm
The Catholic church has been way out of touch for a long time now.
They still see things like pedophilia as a sin not a crime.
Thats a problem.
Joe Hussein Mama
April 18th, 2012
3:55 pm
Recon — “Adam, they were killing in the name of communism and atheism is a part of that political ideology.”
No, it’s not. Communism is an *economic* system, not a political one. Totalitarianism, which may be what you’re thinking of, often employs a ‘cult of personality’ in order to help keep the masses in line, but there are examples of religious totalitarianism in history. The Jonestown Massacre would be a good place to start, and if that’s not troubling enough for you, read up on the recent history (last 20 years or so) of Rwanda.
Atheism is *rarely* an explicit or official part of any governmental system.
“The other I referenced kills in the name of Islam.”
Which is a theistic religion. WTF?
Joseph
April 18th, 2012
3:55 pm
Obama is the 5 trillion dollar man…. What an awesome title…. LOL…
Paul
April 18th, 2012
3:56 pm
carlosgvv
I dunno about that. Seems to me the Big Bang hit, matter goes flying outward, and somehow instead of going to expanding disorganization we experienced matter coalescing, planets forming, life appearing, evolution occurring resulting in increasing specialization, differentiation.. organs and plants and cells moving away from entropy towards some pretty spectacular organization.
I think sometimes people get bogged down in their simplistic definitions of “God” and what some followers have done and hang everything on their limited understanding.
Joe Hussein Mama
April 18th, 2012
3:59 pm
Recon — “Joe, You’re incorrect on your understanding of those ideologies”
No, I’m not.
“so I don’t need to think about what I post any further than I have.”
Well, that’s a shame, because I’d be pleased to help you out.
With all due respect, I find most atheists to be a lot more informed about theist beliefs, doctrine and practice than theists are informed about atheist thought and philosophy. I’m sorry we won’t be able to have a discussion on the topic.
They BOTH suck
April 18th, 2012
4:00 pm
Yum Yum @ 3:52
I’m with you 100%
With that said why no post from the late Jerry Fawell? at one time he had much more sway with conservatives who vote Repub than Wright has ever had in the Democratic Party
Don’t forget Pat Robertson: Didn’t he run for the Republican nomination?
If you need quotes from them……. let me know, otherwise they can be found via Google, yahoo, bing, etc
Corey
April 18th, 2012
4:02 pm
Child molesting priests, hypocritical closeted, mega church ministers who rail against gays, the bishop Long types who pray on young males while grooming them until the age of consent in Georgia and then behave like vampires having lunch and on and on, but we dare question their “God ordained” authority. Chrsitianity like its other Abrahamic cousins is being strangled by these so called “God ordained” men. Don’t even get me started on cousin Islam’s “holy” men.
Recon 0311 2533
April 18th, 2012
4:02 pm
Oh come on Joe you’re smarter than that, of course communism is a political system the economic component has been a failure, which is why communist China has abandoned it. That’s why you have a communist party controlled by the ruling class in communist countries.
barking frog
April 18th, 2012
4:03 pm
so long Dick..
Aquagirl
April 18th, 2012
4:04 pm
Aquagirl, are you the one who came up with the “Commander McBunnypants” moniker for Bush for him “Mission Accomplished” outfit?
I so totally WISH I could take the credit for that one.
Mary Elizabeth
April 18th, 2012
4:06 pm
“Mary Elizabeth
Since there is not a shred of hard evidence that God even exists, why do you speak of a Creator as though it is a proven fact?”
===================================================
Carlos, the best way I can answer your question, is simply to say God exists for me, in my perception, and God may not exist in yours. I write from my perspective. In addition, I will answer you simply by restating a few words from my previous post, knowing that the “hard evidence” you mention is not available:
“The Bishop’s communicated spirituality reinforces my perceptions that more important than words and logic, where religion is concerned, is spiritual depth and connection to the Creator in ways that transcend words and analytical thought.”
There is more mystery in the universe than we can conceive. All is not logic. “God is love.”
Paul
April 18th, 2012
4:06 pm
Aquagirl
Seriously, why would anyone want to display such a degree of ignorance about military flight suits and survival gear?
Adam
April 18th, 2012
4:06 pm
Recon: I just find it hard to believe that someone who believes there isn’t a god would be motivated to kill BECAUSE they believe there isn’t a god.
Joe Hussein Mama
April 18th, 2012
4:07 pm
Recon — “Adam, call it what you wish but those I referenced with the obvious exception of Islam practice atheism.”
No. Here are a couple of nuggets for you to start with; they directly refute one of your claims.
“Cheondoism has become increasingly popular in both South Korea with the revival of Korean nationalism, and particularly in North Korea, where, according to government’s statistics, it is the major religion of the country, followed by 12% of the total population.” (emphasis mine)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cheondoism
“Religions: nonreligious 55.6%, atheist 15.6%, traditional beliefs 12.3%, Ch’ondogyo (Religion of the Heavenly Way) 12.9%, Christian 2.1%, Buddhist 1.5% (2000)”
http://www.worldstatesmen.org/Korea_North.htm
Bruno
April 18th, 2012
4:07 pm
From the first seconds of The Big Bang till now the Universe has been steadly going to ever larger amounts of entropy. The window of opportunity for life to exist, while in the billions of years, will eventually cease as entropy increases. In about 10,000 trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion years, entropy will be complete as the universe will be unable to become more disordered.
Carlos–For someone who is critical of religion, you sure are asking us to make a huge leap of faith to believe that gobbledegook. No one has the faintest idea of how the Universe began, let alone how it will end. The bottom line is that life is a non-entropic process, and can’t be “explained” by Science at all.
JamVet
April 18th, 2012
4:08 pm
It is truly staffering that this dufus said, “The Church survived Nazism…”
Survived, hell!
It helped the Nazis!
Adolf Hitler became chancellor on January 30, 1933. On March 23 he addressed the Reichstag, in the course of which he acknowledged Christian belief as the “unshakeable foundation of the moral and ethical life of our people”. Cardinal Bertram, on March 28, announced that the bishops had dropped their prohibitions against Nazi membership. The bishops’ decision opened the way for a Concordat between the Holy See and Hitler’s government. The Concordat was signed on July 20, 1933.
With the sole exception of the southern part of the state of Baden, Germany’s Catholic population, particularly in rural areas, barely withheld support from the Nazi Party until its takeover of power in 1933.
1925 – At a conference of Catholic academicians in Innsbruck, Austria, Bishop Sigismund Waitz calls the Jews an “alien people” who had corrupted England, France, Italy, and especially America
1933 – In a series of Advent sermons, Cardinal Faulhaber of Munich defends the Old Testament against Nazi attacks but emphasizes that it is not his intention to defend contemporary Jewry, saying that a distinction has to be drawn between Jews living before and after the crucifixion of Jesus.
1937 – Austrian bishop Alois Hudal publishes a book defending Nazi racial ideology, supporting laws preventing a flood of Jewish immigrants, and criticizing the “Jewish” press for playing off Austrians against Germans. His book receives the support of Archbishop (later Cardinal) Theodor Innitzer of Vienna
1939 – Josef Tiso, a Catholic priest with a doctorate in theology, became president of independent Slovakia. An extremist hater of Jews, he allied Slovakia with Nazi Germany and, with strong objections from the Vatican, deported most Slovakian Jews to their deaths in the camps. He declared: “It is a Christian action to expel the Jews, because it is for the good of the people, which is thus getting rid of its pests.” Monsignor Tiso was executed after the war as a war criminal.
1941 through 1945 – The “Final Solution” takes place in Nazi-occupied Europe. This Holocaust, the killing of some six million Jews, “happened in the ‘heartland’ of Western Christian Europe… It happened with the passive acquiescence or active collaboration of most European Christians, and no decisive protest from church leadership, Catholic or protestant.”
Someone tell the twisted bishop to quit spitting on us Jews by comparing President Obama to his organization…
Corey
April 18th, 2012
4:08 pm
Organized religion is the only entity where all manner of ridiculous proclamations and falsehoods demand a protective wall be erected to shield it form serious inquiry. However, religious holy men and their sheep demand that a religious microscope be used when examining science.
Hootinanny Yum Yum
April 18th, 2012
4:09 pm
They BOTH Suck,
Anytime you can show me where Bush, Clinton, Bush, Reagan, Carter of any other past president’s spent years listening to a preacher spew hate from the pulpit I’ll be glad to do a search on Google, yahoo, bing, etc.
Otherwise, all I hear from you is blah, blah, blah, blah…
Pizzaman
April 18th, 2012
4:09 pm
For the second time in 68 years I am extremely ashamed of my Church.
Recon 0311 2533
April 18th, 2012
4:09 pm
“Well, that’s a shame, because I’d be pleased to help you out.”
Joe, before you can help me out or anyone else you’ll have to help yourself first. Now it wasn’t my intent to suggest that all atheists are communists or to condemn atheism even though it is contrary to my beliefs I merely pointed out that communists are religious non-believers. I intended no offense to your belief as I believe that we’re all free to make our own choices.
Pass the Cheesy Grits Please
April 18th, 2012
4:09 pm
There is more mystery in the universe than we can conceive. All is not logic. “God is love.”
That maybe the dumbest thing ive ever read.
Talking Head
April 18th, 2012
4:11 pm
There goes JamVet again, on his delusional quest to persecute Christians and somehow change history so that Hitler supported Christianity.
Dude is off his rocker, time to take your meds.
Bruno
April 18th, 2012
4:12 pm
RIP Dick Clark.
DF–It’s somewhat of a cliche to urge people to celebrate someone’s life rather than mourning their passing, but in the case of Dick Clark, that’s what I’m going to do. What else could the man have accomplished??
They BOTH suck
April 18th, 2012
4:13 pm
yum yum
blather all you like……..
Fawell and Robertson have had and have more influence on the Republican Party than Wright EVER had or has within the Democrat Party
We wont even talk about Dobson………….or whatever his name is
You being so close minded cant even see the tree in your eye no matter what the facts are……..
I live on a two way street……. How bout you?
Joe Hussein Mama
April 18th, 2012
4:13 pm
Recon — “Oh come on Joe you’re smarter than that, of course communism is a political system”
I’m sorry, Recon, but Communism is an *economic* philosophy and system; the economic assumptions of Communism underpin any political system that would be used to achieve it.
“the economic component has been a failure, which is why communist China has abandoned it.”
Come now. Even the Chinese themselves speak of “Socialism with a Chinese face” these days.
“That’s why you have a communist party controlled by the ruling class in communist countries.”
Looking at the Chinese economy these days, it’s pretty hard to make a credible case that they’re still Communist. I agree that they’re not far from a totalitarian political structure, but it’s hard to argue, given the socioeconomic class structure there, that they are in any way a traditional, classless, Communist society.
Bruno
April 18th, 2012
4:14 pm
To tell you how long Dick Clark was around, he had an episode of “This Is Your Life” dedicated to him in 1959.
https://plus.google.com/114533730002435254466/posts/AshXhyrd22L
They BOTH suck
April 18th, 2012
4:14 pm
“quest to persecute Christians”
Keep up the one liners
You are getting better at that comedian act
“persecute”
bwhahahahahahahah
barking frog
April 18th, 2012
4:15 pm
the swastika is the cross
in motion…
Paul
April 18th, 2012
4:16 pm
Corey
“Organized religion is the only entity where all manner of ridiculous proclamations and falsehoods demand a protective wall be erected to shield it form serious inquiry.”
Really? Who’s prevented from doing any doctrinal inquiry?
Pass the Cheesy Grits Please
April 18th, 2012
4:17 pm
Im an atheist. And certainly not a communist.
Just cause I don’t believe in a white bearded guy who lives in the clouds on lollypop lane or any other nonsense religious people believe doesn’t make someone a communist.
In fact I would argue the opposite. In a free society like America we are protected from Religion.
10 percent of Americans are Atheists. Ill bet the number is closer to 1 in 4.
Alot of people don’t believe in God but wouldn’t admit it over the phone or in public etc.
Its the fastest growing ” religion ” in the US and I’m all for it.
Its time to move on to Science and reason and away from old superstitions and hokus pokus.
When there is lightning it isn’t Zeus. Its a static discharge in our atmosphere.
Hootinanny Yum Yum
April 18th, 2012
4:18 pm
I do tend to be closed minded. My therapist and I have agreed it’s best if I stay away from Jay’s blog and others like it. The less time I spend here the better my anxiety, depression and anger are.
The love fest among the liberal regulars here and hate they spew is just too much for me to stomach.
Bruno
April 18th, 2012
4:19 pm
That maybe the dumbest thing ive ever read.
Grits–As a lover of Science, I can find no fault with ME’s statement, other than her supposition that there has to be an embodied Creator. As convenient as human logic is, it doesn’t begin to explain the Great Mystery of our existence. Intelligent people recognize that fact.
Joseph
April 18th, 2012
4:19 pm
Obama ate dog meat?????