If ObamaCare dies, what then?
It’s June, and the heart of ObamaCare, the individual mandate, has just been struck down by the Supreme Court in a 5-4 vote.
What now?
In discussions today, the justices will hear debate about whether they can kill the mandate and leave the rest of the legislation intact, or whether the entire structure comes tumbling down without the mandate.
That legal debate aside, as a practical matter I think it’s clear that without the mandate, insurance companies cannot be required to cover pre-existing conditions, which goes to the heart of what health-insurance reform is supposed to achieve.
If individuals can go without insurance as long as they’re healthy, then force the insurance companies to cover them when they get ill, the whole concept of insurance goes out the window. It is no longer sustainable. That’s precisely why the Heritage Foundation, Newt Gingrich and Mitt Romney, among others, embraced and pushed the mandate approach.
So again, what happens if the mandate disappears?
In the two years since ObamaCare was signed into law, congressional Republicans have campaigned on a policy of “repeal and replace.” In truth, they have made no real attempt to do either.
If the court rules against ObamaCare, of course, “repeal” becomes moot and attention turns to the “replace” part of the problem. Replace it with what?
As I’ve noted before, when I had the chance to discuss the issue with Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell and Sen. Saxby Chambliss of Georgia, neither could offer even the slightest idea for how to solve the problem without a mandate. That is also true for the Republican Party as a whole.
What little thinking they’ve done on the issue seems to coalesce around the idea that the problem in health care is third-party insurance, whether acquired through private companies or through the government. The philosophy seems to be that if people are forced to pay out of their own pockets for health care, instead of relying on other parties to pay for it, market forces will once again come into play and the health-care market will begin to behave more like the market for wheat or automobiles.
Theoretically, it makes sense. But people don’t live theoretically. Theory doesn’t explain how a family can pay for one child’s apendectomy and another child’s broken leg out of its own resources. It doesn’t explain how an elderly couple on a fixed income can pay for their medicine and doctor visits. Pristine economic models don’t begin to get us where we need to be.
If ObamaCare is overturned, the fundamental questions that we were all asking three or four years ago will once again come to the forefront:
Is health care a human right, or can it be denied to those who are unable to pay for it? If you want to bring market forces to bear on the problem, you pretty much have to take the second approach. But so far we have been unwilling to embrace it. The Reagan-era law requiring emergency rooms to treat patients regardless of ability to pay still stands as de facto acceptance that health care is a right.
And if health care is a right — if we are not willing to deny health care to those unable to pay for it — how will we as a nation and society cover those costs? ObamaCare attempts to provide an answer to that question. If that answer proves unacceptable to a majority on the U.S. Supreme Court, what’s the next answer?
Come June, that could become a powerful question in a presidential campaign that will be hitting its full stride right about then.
– Jay Bookman
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891 comments Add your comment
TaxPayer
March 28th, 2012
4:15 pm
In memory of Bosch, please refer to her as “The Goddess Senator from Maine.”
I’ve meant to ask Bosch on more than one occassion what definition of Goddess he uses but that’s another issue.
Brosephus™
March 28th, 2012
4:16 pm
Casey
Not a bad selection although I would have personally gone with this one here.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MPJKuygePHk
John Birch
March 28th, 2012
4:16 pm
Paul – Death panels are the key to the affordable part. There are lots of pigs feeding at the heathcare trough; insurance companies, drug companies, big hospital chains, malpractice attorneys, etc. But even if you cut all that out we simply don’t produce enough to have world class healthcare available 24/7 to everyone who could benefit from it. So it becomes an allocation of scarce resources issue.
Almost 50% of health care expenses come in the last few years of life, with very little economic return. Grandma, already beset with incurable Alzheimer’s, is going to die anyway. We would be better off as a society if we took the money we waste on prolonging grandma’s life and use it to return some welfare crack ho to the work force, IMHO.
William
March 28th, 2012
4:17 pm
“We are talking about the US Constitution, aren’t we?”
Thanks for playing, but you should probably better acquaint yourself with this document. And that goes not just for you but all of us, including me. It makes little sense to allude to a document we really no little about. I have spent considerable time of late doing so and what I have discovered that, if it is truly a contract, we are violating its terms left and right (while nonetheless pretending and giving lip service to following it).
JamVet
March 28th, 2012
4:18 pm
Holy batsh*t, batman.
I don’t follow you: on the one hand you concede that appearances matter, but on the other you don’t think they should.
OF COURSE, they matter. When one goes to a job interview and in many. many other occasions in life. Do they matter when an ordinary kid in ordinary clothes is walking home from the convenience store. HELL NO!
This is not rocket science.
They either do or they don’t.</i?
You have, in your own mind, created a false dilemma. It is a logical fallacy that I have linked information about countless times. Because it occurs here a lot.
If you somehow imagine that people do NOT assess or judge others by appearance, then please tell me what planet you are from.
And if you imagine that I said that, please come and join me on the third planet from the sun.
And tell that to the next movie starlet on the red carpet.
Red herring. not relevant to this conversation.
Should they matter to the extent that you wind up shooting someone who looks bad or suspicious or disdainful of norms? Of course not. But to say flatly that appearance doesn’t matter is to stupidly ignore the factual evidence.
Then quit saying it.
And take one gigantic chill pill and try speaking for yourself instead of me, OK?
Thanks…
Don't Forget
March 28th, 2012
4:19 pm
SFD
Once upon a time, the US, like every other civilized nation on the planet, thought it was kind of irresponsible to allow pharmaceutical companies to directly advertise prescription drugs to potential users.
Well, most of the time I don’t think it’s helpful. They say “ask your doc if you should be on profiteva”.
If your doc is doing his/her job they’ve already considered it and you just end up wasting time explaining why they aren’t on it or why another med was a better choice. Since I only do hospital medicine this rarely comes up. I suppose the exception might be for problems that the patient hasn’t told their doc about because they assumed that nothing could be done. Good example would be viagra and other ED drugs but most of the time patients seem comfortable talking about problems that are pretty personal. Remember, pharmaceutical companies don’t take the hippocratic oath.
Casey Kasem
March 28th, 2012
4:20 pm
Brocephus
Win the letters come in from distraught bloggers looking to be consoled with a fitting tune and I can read the disappointment in their posts; I just go with the selection that comes to mind
Thulsa Doom with his boot on liberal throats
March 28th, 2012
4:20 pm
William,
I see that you’ve been nipped on the ankle by the class clown. But you are mistaken- he is not the class clown. Actually he’s known as the chihuahua. And this is how he rolls…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ATPi3VQsEv0
pogo
March 28th, 2012
4:23 pm
Off topic a little bit here but yesterday there was a story in the papers about an actress eating her own placenta after birth. Today there is one about Alicia Silverstone regurgitating food into her baby’s mouth like a pelican. What in the hell is wrong with these people?
Paul
March 28th, 2012
4:24 pm
John Birch
“But even if you cut all that out we simply don’t produce enough to have world class healthcare available 24/7 to everyone who could benefit from it.”
So are you making the case that our pre-ACA system, counting only those with insurance, do not have a world class healthcare system available to all policyholders?
Brosephus™
March 28th, 2012
4:24 pm
Casey
No problem. Your selection just lacked a bit of an edge to it.
Paul
March 28th, 2012
4:25 pm
William 4:17
Thanks, but I missed the part where any of those listed items are rights or not -
willie lynch
March 28th, 2012
4:26 pm
Fred ™
March 28th, 2012
1:14 pm
LOL! Absolutely. Does anyone have an answer? Just asking.
Thulsa Doom with his boot on liberal throats
March 28th, 2012
4:27 pm
From my standpoint, the acceptance of this extension represents our commitment —my commitment, our family’s commitment—to the University of Alabama for the rest of our career.” Nick Saban on his contract extension for life March 24th,2012
And across the college football nation they then cowered in fear. There was great wailing and gnashing of teeth.
JamVet
March 28th, 2012
4:29 pm
…someone who looks bad or suspicious or disdainful of norms?
And this part of that screed really does point to that racism I was alluding to in this incident. And likely why you howled about it, though it was not even directed at you.
Why?
Because exactly like the corporal’s drivel, this has NOTHING to do with that kid that lost his life because some idiot with a gun had a hard on for playing Rambo.
Own it, William.
If he doesn’t look and act exactly like you he is bad/suspicious/disdainful.
Redneck Convert (R--and proud of it)
March 28th, 2012
4:29 pm
To the Republican readers, yesterday’s news about Jan “Hanoi” Fonda will play the leading role as PRESIDENT RONALD REAGAN (LOL) I mean Nancy Reagan. Surely he is rolling in his grave with that news, for years from now future bloggers will discuss Nancy’s role as acting President because it will be released that during his secod term his illness was worst than reported and she wanted to insure the continuation his legacy.
Well, you got to admit we was alot better off when this country was run by astrology. Ever since we stopped looking at astrology signs, it’s been nothing but wars and debt.
But I’ll draw the line at letting Jane Fonda run the country.
Thulsa Doom with his boot on liberal throats
March 28th, 2012
4:29 pm
pogo,
They got to figure out ways to stay in the news during those long interludes between movies. After all wasn’t clueless made something like 10 years ago?
Casey Kasem
March 28th, 2012
4:30 pm
Bro
Instead of disappointment and sadness about you being in the “elite”, if I would haved received word and read disdain in that sad bloggers post………… it could have been
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DEeRL94Rzbw
However, I go to great efforts to match the song with the sentiment
William
March 28th, 2012
4:34 pm
“Based on your posts, you perceive the way a person dresses as an indication of how that person acts. Based on that dress, a person who dresses like a thug, is perceived as a thug and that would be a person to fear or be wary of. I don’t agree with that, and that’s why I made that statement. If I read your posts wrong, then feel free to correct me. I don’t mind constructive criticism if I’m wrong.”
Again, dressing a certain way is behavioral…it is, in fact, an action. It almost seems like you don’t think that it is – that should be construed as something separate and different from an action. Do you want to dispute that?
Secondly, the way a person dresses is an indication of something. I can be discomforted when people dress oddly but not really fearful. Kids who dress like “goths” don’t have a reputation for killing others. Gangsters do. I am not adept at distinguishing “wannabees” from actual “gangstas”. Thus they can sometimes (depending on contextual clues) evoke fear from me. Yet people like JV want to intimate that I am therefore racist. I don’t care what race the “wannabee” is (and there are plenty of whites who are this or actual gangsters), he still may cause me undue concern. It is the group one is associating with (even just in his appearance) that is problematic for me, not his race.
They BOTH suck
March 28th, 2012
4:36 pm
“Kids who dress like “goths” don’t have a reputation for killing others.”
Columbine come to mind?
William
March 28th, 2012
4:37 pm
“Thanks, but I missed the part where any of those listed items are rights or not ”
Let’s start at the beginning. Please tell me how you define a right. It makes not sense to talk much about them without a working definition.
TaxPayer
March 28th, 2012
4:38 pm
RIP Jim.
Brosephus™
March 28th, 2012
4:40 pm
Casey
I’m gonna have to play that one a few times….
———————
pogo
You questioned it far better than me. After hearing that stuff, I couldn’t formulate words to make a response. The best I could muster was one of those head tilted to the side looks that dogs do.
———————-
Doom
Sounds like there’s gonna be a rough decade in store for members of the SEC West.
Thulsa Doom with his boot on liberal throats
March 28th, 2012
4:40 pm
They both suck,
Columbine is a good example. But its only one.
Don't Forget
March 28th, 2012
4:41 pm
sfd–Far more egregious, IMO, is the practice by which the pharmaceutical companies give direct kickbacks to MDs for prescribing certain brand-name drugs. Add getting rid of that shenanigans to my list of “bottom-up” solutions.
This one kind of surprised me because I’ve never taken nor have I been offered one red cent. In residency the drug reps would bring lunch fairly often in exchange for 5 minutes of time to try to convince us why their med was better than another but there was NEVER any reward for actually prescribing. They would usually bring cheap pens, sticky notes and other cheap crap but all that went away with the “new” pharma rules. Years ago, I hear they would pay for conferences including hotels, limos etc. but those days were long gone by the time I got into the business. Since then, I’ve had a few slices of pizza but they were bought for the nurses and I was just mooching.
I googled the subject of kickbacks because I was skeptical since I’d never even heard of anyone I know doing this and was surprised to see that it apparently does happen. I’m not sure how extensive the problem is but I can see no good reason why this should be legal and would question the ethics of any physician who accepted actual monetary reimbursement or gifts for prescribing something that wasn’t indicated.
Thulsa Doom with his boot on liberal throats
March 28th, 2012
4:41 pm
Brocephus,
I have but one thing to say to the rest of the SEC.
Abandon ye all hope.
pogo
March 28th, 2012
4:44 pm
Thulsa, methinks they have lost the couple of marbles they had.
As for the topic, the government couldn’t even control the costs of the two existing public healthcare programs, medicaid and medicare. They have overseen the squandering of billions and billions of taxpayer dollars in these two (thus the reason both are soon to be insolvent) and there is no way in hell the Federal Government can control the costs of another one. It just created another public healthcare program on the backs of those that fit within a very small finite bracket who work and who have healthcare. The much ballyhooed mandate was a non-starter. Millions of people would have just ignored it and millions more would fall into the category where they would be given a waiver from the mandate. This bill is a turd and it needs to be flushed. It was crap when it came to be and it will be crap when it dies.
As for Obama, at least the Russians and Pravda love him. They know a weakling patsy when they see one.
Schip
March 28th, 2012
4:44 pm
If ObamaCare dies, what then? How about something that would actually help the problem of cost. This bill was smoke and mirrors with delays in implementation to hide the fact that it will cost a fortune. As a self-employed person I need some leverage to buy something affordable. Great if you work for a large company, but the rest of us have been getting screwed with no tax write-off and high premiums, co-pays and lousy coverage. Obamacare did not fix that.
Proud to be me!
March 28th, 2012
4:44 pm
For some reason there are those who think the world will end of ObamaCare ends — guess what, it won’t. What happens is the heatlh care system needs revamping but not to the tune of ObamaCare. Both sides agree there needs to be changes . . . maybe next time both sides can have input . . .not just a liberal, twenty-five hundred plus pages, rammed through by hook and crook bill.
Wade Hampton
March 28th, 2012
4:44 pm
I think that Paul probably wears petticoats in private………
and Brosephus uses a name for Satan.
.
Quite applicable for a tapeworm of the Federal government.
Thulsa Doom with his boot on liberal throats
March 28th, 2012
4:45 pm
“If he doesn’t look and act exactly like you he is bad/suspicious/disdainful.”
JamVet,
Actually if he doesn’t look like me I would call him damn ugly, weak, and pathetically hopeless when it comes to the womens.
JamVet
March 28th, 2012
4:46 pm
Thus they can sometimes (depending on contextual clues) evoke fear from me. Yet people like JV want to intimate that I am therefore racist.
NO.
I’m not intimating anything, I’m saying you and Scout are racists because you use these racist stereotypes to include the late Trayvon Martin of being what he was not.
Brosephus™
March 28th, 2012
4:47 pm
William
I guess that’s where you and I differ. I grew up in the rap industry and saw many wannabe posers who bluffed the crap out of people. I’ve seen many people who dressed as thugs who were anything but thugs in real life. I’ve had many discussions with members of biker clubs, even 1%er’s. I guess I don’t have as much of a fear of people’s dress. About the only group of people I won’t approach are people affiliated with White supremacist movements, and that’s for obvious reasons. I have probably encountered some unknowingly, but if they’re making themselves obvious, I won’t attempt to engage them unless it’s job related. Then, I have a vast array of tools that are available if things get out of control.
I have no problem with your view on things, as that’s your perception. I applaud you for being honest about such things as many people refuse to take an introspective look at how they act and react to others around them.
Thulsa Doom with his boot on liberal throats
March 28th, 2012
4:48 pm
pogo,
I forgot the name of the economics principle but as it goes the more you subsidize something the more expensive it becomes. The perfect example is the cost of a college education. The next best examples would probably be Medicare and Medicaid. And yet people do not learn.
“People have no grasp of what they do.” The original Thulsa Doom Mr. James Earl Jones
William
March 28th, 2012
4:48 pm
“And this part of that screed really does point to that racism I was alluding to in this incident. And likely why you howled about it, though it was not even directed at you.”
You have an active imagination, I will say that for you – I wouldn’t have characterized my response (or yours either) as a “howl”. Try some Frost instead of Ginsberg. And may or may not indicate racism. Read my follow-up post to Brosephus.
JamVet
March 28th, 2012
4:49 pm
Doomy, thanks for trying to lighten the mood, buddy, but I’m not laughing.
This stereotyping crap sucks.
Goons and ganstas with tattoos and guns and criminal records have nothing to do with this kid.
Nothing.
He was just a normal high school kid staying and his dad’s place and minding his own business.
And I’m not about to let these cretins include him in their delusional grouping of anybody who looks remotely similar to him…
pogo
March 28th, 2012
4:51 pm
Bro, when I read it it was absolutely stunning. This is sickening but what if Alicia happens to have a stomach virus and it hasn’t bloomed to its full glory yet in her body? She chews the food, transfers the virus and wallah! Her baby is sick. What a Fushing idiot. Note: “Fushing”, copied from a Stephen King story about a boy and a guitar pick. Something about a spider that can’t speak correctly.
As for the self-carniverous placenta eater, there are no words that I can even say about this except “pass the chianti and the fava beans, I am about to eat myself”.
Brosephus™
March 28th, 2012
4:51 pm
Brosephus uses a name for Satan.
Doesn’t everybody do that? Satan… Prince of Darkness… Lucifer… Beelzebub… Sardo Numpsa… Anything Bobby Boucher’s mom doesn’t like…
Brosephus™
March 28th, 2012
4:53 pm
As for the self-carniverous placenta eater, there are no words that I can even say about this except “pass the chianti and the fava beans, I am about to eat myself”.
Damn, you got me light headed from laughing at that one… Gotta step back from the pc for a min to regain my wits.
Billybob
March 28th, 2012
4:54 pm
john birch,
the day we try to put a dollar sign $$$$$$ on a human life is the day i stand up and say hell no……….isn’t it funny how liberal/leftists always have a ‘fix’ to situations that consists of a dollar amount………continuing to throw money at social problems for decades now with ever-growing poverty and angst while never acknowledging that the fix might have to come from the individual person no matter what they do………these next few months should be fun watching obama make excuses and blaming one for another’s problems while fomenting the reawakening of the reagan democrats……this was for you jay……
William
March 28th, 2012
4:54 pm
“I’m not intimating anything, I’m saying you and Scout are racists because you use these racist stereotypes to include the late Trayvon Martin of being what he was not.”
And you are stupid because you can’t read (from the same post even):
“I don’t care what race the “wannabee” is (and there are plenty of whites who are this or actual gangsters), he still may cause me undue concern. It is the group one is associating with (even just in his appearance) that is problematic for me, not his race.”
So why don’t you keep your racist allegations to yourself or apply them there (since you seem to have no difficulty prejudging others).
Rockerbabe
March 28th, 2012
4:54 pm
Medicare for all American citizens who want it, irrespective of age.
Fred ™
March 28th, 2012
4:54 pm
Thulsa Doom with his boot on liberal throats
March 28th, 2012
4:20 pm
William,
I see that you’ve been nipped on the ankle by the class clown. But you are mistaken- he is not the class clown. Actually he’s known as the chihuahua. And this is how he rolls…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ATPi3VQsEv0
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Dude. You are SO sick. I don’t know where you got that from. LOL I don’t WANT to know where you got it from (but I saved it for future use lol).
I also don’t know why Jay banned the term leg humper as a descriptive term for pests. I had never heard it before this blog but just damn did (does) it apply sometimes lol. I can’t think of a better one. Sand fleas just doesn’t have the same visual lol.
Thulsa Doom with his boot on liberal throats
March 28th, 2012
4:55 pm
“About the only group of people I won’t approach are people affiliated with White supremacist movements”
Brocephus,
According to the FBI there are about 3,000 white supremacists and their sympathizers, most of them holed up out west in Idaho, Montana, etc. I did see about 20 years ago the klan here in Georgia on a local news broadcast talking about a rally they were going to hold. All 2 of them. Incidentally the rally never took place seeing as how not even the 2 Georgia members showed up.
Other than an internet presence I’m not even sure they even exist in the state of Georgia. In my entire life in the deep south I’ve never seen one. Maybe they do exist. I just haven’t seen or heard of em. Cept on here with all the overblown klan sheet references. Makes you wonder just how damn stupid people on here are that they keep bringing up sheet references.
pogo
March 28th, 2012
4:55 pm
Got to love those old “Tenured” professors Doom. They don’t have to produce anything and they make big, big checks. And their colleges have to continuously raise tuition to pay for these old, lazy parasites. College in this country has become nothing more than a feeding ground for the lazy and the greedy.
Fred ™
March 28th, 2012
4:59 pm
willie lynch
March 28th, 2012
4:26 pm
Fred ™
March 28th, 2012
1:14 pm
LOL! Absolutely. Does anyone have an answer? Just asking.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I doubt it my brother. The ONLY one I have seen with a good answer to that is Bruno. No one else from the Republican side has had anything to say other than “Obama sucks.”
Billybob
March 28th, 2012
4:59 pm
thanks for the cynthia tucker reference pogo………..
Wade Hampton
March 28th, 2012
5:00 pm
The “klan” has been re-defined as to anyone that doesn’t agree with Washington centralized planning…………………………..of your life.
.
See Satan/Brocephus.
William
March 28th, 2012
5:01 pm
“I see that you’ve been nipped on the ankle by the class clown. But you are mistaken- he is not the class clown. Actually he’s known as the chihuahua.”
LOL, TD. True wit is something that one obviously has. I would say you have more of it than him and NOT because you linked to a video but because you said something other than “you’re a dufus,,,ha…ha…ha”. There was actually an argument in your humor.
JamVet
March 28th, 2012
5:01 pm
Towncrier, your new name does not help.
You’re the same old say stupid sh*t and then try to backtrack it kinda guy
You’ve been busted trying to portray this kid as bad and suspicious and disdainful.
ALL based on some dumbass appearance thing you made up that doesn’t even apply to him.
So spin away, but the jig is up. (LOL at my racist double entendre!)
Fred ™
March 28th, 2012
5:03 pm
Thulsa Doom with his boot on liberal throats
March 28th, 2012
4:27 pm
From my standpoint, the acceptance of this extension represents our commitment —my commitment, our family’s commitment—to the University of Alabama for the rest of our career.” Nick Saban on his contract extension for life March 24th,2012
And across the college football nation they then cowered in fear. There was great wailing and gnashing of teeth.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
While in Alabama there was the opening of booster checkbooks for “the payoffs and the rip offs that nobody saw……”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7uKjo_URBo
Billybob
March 28th, 2012
5:07 pm
i’ve been working for a long time and not once have i been guaranteed that after 6 years i will never be fired, and get a great pension at retirement………we wonder why colleges and univ’s are crawling with leftists……….it’s how you have obama…….with no consequences therein forms a radical nature which is what is leading the democratic party into deep doo-doo in nov
pogo
March 28th, 2012
5:08 pm
I did say “Professor” Billybob! Cynthia doesn’t fit that definition and for the life of me I cannot understand why they (Georgia) would hire a bitter racist like her to teach anything.
Fred ™
March 28th, 2012
5:09 pm
Brosephus™
March 28th, 2012
4:40 pm
Casey
I’m gonna have to play that one a few times….
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Sweet. So you and one of your other “elitists” using an alt make fun of me. Normally I would have expected better of you than that. But that was before I found out you are an elitist.
Next you’re going to tell me you are a Baptist and have french ancestry………
Paul
March 28th, 2012
5:10 pm
William 4:37
“Let’s start at the beginning. Please tell me how you define a right. It makes not sense to talk much about them without a working definition.”
Cosby began with ““Health Care is not a right…please tell me where it states in the constitution or any of the founding fathers papers that it is a “RIGHT”. ””
As he got the ball rolling, I was asking him for clarification of what’s a right. You then came in with an opinion that seemed to say no one here really understands the Constitution. You then came back asking me to define a concept that Cosby led with but left undefined. So if you’d like to further interject into such a conversation and apparently take over for Cosby, I think it’s appropriate for you to define your position and give your idea of what constitutes a right.
William
March 28th, 2012
5:10 pm
“You’re the same old say stupid sh*t and then try to backtrack it kinda guy”
Wow…that is just moronic. I will put my contributions to this blog up against yours any day. They are in the main simply more substantive.
“You’ve been busted trying to portray this kid as bad and suspicious and disdainful. ALL based on some dumbass appearance thing you made up that doesn’t even apply to him.”
Good thing you are not a DA. Why don’t you go through my posts the past few days and see what I have said about the Trayvon shooting. I would, but you – the way you act – are not worth the time it would take. But since you made charge, why don’t you prove it? Put up or shut up. I’m calling your bluff.
Billybob
March 28th, 2012
5:11 pm
we’d have to ask them their thoughts on that……….i would love to take one of her classes to see how much i can ‘learn’……..
Paul
March 28th, 2012
5:14 pm
Proud to be me!
“For some reason there are those who think the world will end of ObamaCare ends — guess what, it won’t.”
It just might if you’ve a possibly fatal condition and were unable to obtain health insurance.
Or if you have it and the company decides to drop you because of an unrelated matter.
Or if you have a condition, lose your job and employer-based insurance and cannot obtain new insurance.
If you’re in one of those categories, your world just might end.
Thulsa Doom with his boot on liberal throats
March 28th, 2012
5:16 pm
Fred,
It took me a little searching to find that yappy chihuahua but it works. I damn near fell outta my chair laughing when I first saw it. And then Doomy say to himself “Who dis remind me of?”. Thanks for saying I have a sick mind. I’ll take that as a complement.
JamVet
March 28th, 2012
5:19 pm
Aye, there’s the rub.
I told you exactly how the corporal inanely made stereotypical comments that did not apply to this kid, when the only topic at hand was……..Trayvon martin. I asked him to explain how they applied and he refused. Repeatedly.
So what do you do?
Rather than you write, yes, of course, you’re right, those vile and incorrect stereotypes have nothing whatsoever to do with that young man – again the ONLY thing I have been discussing with him and you – and anyone who uses them in a discussion of him is way out of line.
Yet…..
You do the very same thing!
Come up with a bunch of sophist nonsense not remotely related to that incident – again the ONLY thing that I have been discussing with you – and when I ask you to explain what in the wide, wide world of sports it has to do with him, down the rabbit hole you go.
Good times in Loonyville…
But it’s all good, you’ve had your chances, you’ll get no more…
Paul
March 28th, 2012
5:19 pm
Brosephus
Your Satan comment in response to a new name guy.
We do seem to have an increased number of cowards who don’t post under their usual names, don’t we?
Frustrated cowards at that -
Fred ™
March 28th, 2012
5:22 pm
Or if you have a condition, lose your job and employer-based insurance and cannot obtain new insurance.
My best friend was diagnosed with stage 4 cancer in February. He had been unable to work since January. His companies insurance was paying his treatment and bills. His employer is keeping him on the books as long as he can, (without committing insurance fraud).
What is he to do? He has worked all his life, his youngest son is in college now. He has no “extra” money. Once his boss fires him and medicare takes over he’s a dead man walking…….. and not walking long or far. It sucks.
barking frog
March 28th, 2012
5:23 pm
mitt bashing sheets..
William
March 28th, 2012
5:23 pm
“As he got the ball rolling, I was asking him for clarification of what’s a right. You then came in with an opinion that seemed to say no one here really understands the Constitution. You then came back asking me to define a concept that Cosby led with but left undefined. So if you’d like to further interject into such a conversation and apparently take over for Cosby, I think it’s appropriate for you to define your position and give your idea of what constitutes a right.”
Fair enough. Frankly, I think a definition is very difficult apart from those explicitly defined in the Bill of Rights. If one takes the [Federalist] position that all power not explicitly defined in the Constitution resides in the people or states or both (there is debate on this issue, as it is not perfectly clear from the single sentence 9th Amendment), then there must ensue line drawing by whoever regarding whatever. That is why I am explicitly defining rights in either the federal or state constitutions, so that there is no line drawing. Presently, I am leaning toward allowing the variability of rights not defined in the Constitution to be defined by states. This way, there might not be any universal right gay marriage or abortion, but certain state might grant them. That way, there no tyranny by the majority or minority.
What say you?
Thulsa Doom with his boot on liberal throats
March 28th, 2012
5:23 pm
Fred,
As an Auburn friend and fan once told me “If’n you aint cheatin you aint tryin”.
Thulsa Doom with his boot on liberal throats
March 28th, 2012
5:26 pm
Uh ohs. JamVet is pulling out the sophist card. That’s pulling the triple dog dare in blogspeak.
Paul
March 28th, 2012
5:27 pm
Fred
Minds steeped in theory and sound bites change when someone they know or meet illustrates the reality.
Thanks, and the best to your friend and his family.
William
March 28th, 2012
5:28 pm
“Good times in Loonyville…But it’s all good, you’ve had your chances, you’ll get no more…”
So, JamVet, is that how you answer the challenge to put up or shut up – by deflecting? Is that how you disown responsibility for making false accusations? Geez…get some intellectual honesty, please.
William
March 28th, 2012
5:28 pm
“Uh ohs. JamVet is pulling out the sophist card. That’s pulling the triple dog dare in blogspeak.”
Sophistry, thy name is JamVet.
Billybob
March 28th, 2012
5:29 pm
i’m very sorry about your friend fred but i have to ask a question…….what would his treatment under obamacare be………a bureaucratic death panel that leftist claim don’t exist would seal his fate………see there are no easy answers either way on this one……except to make good choices about this issue going forward constitutionally……
Paul
March 28th, 2012
5:31 pm
William
“Frankly, I think a definition is very difficult apart from those explicitly defined in the Bill of Rights.”
I think so, too. This topic has been on the blog several times. I’ve approached it from a legal standpoint but that didn’t resonate too well with some bloggers. What I walked away with was what I see in so many cases: if it’s something I don’t like, it’s “N.” If it’s something I do like then it IS “N.” (But I’ll probably ignore the concept and rename it ’cause it feels better that way).
I do agree that states – and it’s an established principle – are free to define rights not enumerated at the federal level.
And at the federal level, I’ll offer what we see as a right changes and evolves over time. We now view primary education as a right and band together to provide it, even if we’ve no children in school. Greater good and all that.
Headin’ upstairs -
Paul
March 28th, 2012
5:33 pm
William
Correction: if it’s something I don’t like, it’s NOT “N.” If it’s something I do like then it IS “N.” (speaking of rights and such).
Jay
March 28th, 2012
5:33 pm
“…a bureaucratic death panel that leftist claim don’t exist would seal his fate…
That’s an outright, absolute, 100 percent total lie, Billybob. You guys just make stuff up and then cling to it like a little toddler clings to the remnants of his little blinky. It’s sad, really.
And funny too.
JamVet
March 28th, 2012
5:38 pm
So corporal junior, you won’t admit that your “appearance” fears were directly related to the Martin kid. The only salient question being, why did you bring them up in relation to a discussion of him?
Why did you try to connect him with your fearful images of bogeymen?
You got some splainin’ to do ricky.
..
Fred ™
March 28th, 2012
5:39 pm
Billybob
March 28th, 2012
5:29 pm
i’m very sorry about your friend fred but i have to ask a question…….what would his treatment under obamacare be………a bureaucratic death panel that leftist claim don’t exist would seal his fate………
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Take those lies and jam them up your ass. There is no death panel. Never was, never will be. What is WRONG with you people?
How would he fare under Obamacare, the REAL Obamacare not the mythical one with the death panels and the rest of the lies idiots like to spout off about? I don’t know. I didn’t study it enough.
Billybob
March 28th, 2012
5:40 pm
jay,
an unelected bureaucratic panel would decide his friends fate based on cost analysis and what his life is deemed as worth $$$$$………..you don’t want to acknowledge what is in this bill, describe it how you want, but this does happen in obamacare……but you know what jay, it doesn’t matter b/c the supreme court will be stopping this liberal power grab in its tracks in june………
Billybob
March 28th, 2012
5:42 pm
and fred i was sincere take it for what it’s worth…..
Jay
March 28th, 2012
5:44 pm
an unelected bureaucratic panel would decide his friends fate based on cost analysis and what his life is deemed as worth $$$$$………..you don’t want to acknowledge what is in this bill, describe it how you want, but this does happen in obamacare
Absolute bull-oney. Complete fabrication.
Proud to be me!
March 28th, 2012
6:04 pm
Jay
March 28th, 2012
5:33 pm
“…a bureaucratic death panel that leftist claim don’t exist would seal his fate…
That’s an outright, absolute, 100 percent total lie, Billybob. You guys just make stuff up and then cling to it like a little toddler clings to the remnants of his little blinky. It’s sad, really.
And funny too.
Jay, it exists just like Congressman Ryan’s proposal with regard to SS will result in “Granny being pushed over the cliff”. Right!!! Just say’n . . . now that’s made up stuff!!!
Mark
March 28th, 2012
6:23 pm
Georgia doesn’t have a health care pool for those who cannot buy health care insurance. 9 million people were denied access to health care insurance in the US, over the last three years. So no health care insurance bill, no insurance for Georgians not lucky enough to have been cherry picked by a hand full of approved insurance companies authorized to sell insurance. With a weak Insurance Commissioner (like Georgia continually puts in office), this means the insurance companies can use any ridiculous excuse to deny you coverage. AND boy, they sure do, especially if you are over 50 years of age. Do you have untreated bunions? Arthritis? Allergies? Asthma? Pre-diabetes? Most people are under the false impression that only the direly sick are rejected. Don’t let your COBRA expire, or you will have nothing available to you if you have ANY pre-existing condition. And, God help you if you have to convert a COBRA to an individual policy; it could cost you as much as 700% of their basic insurance premiums fee (10-15K a year, before you even start paying towards your high deductibles). Few people can sustain these cost for very long. Everything you worked for could be gone, taken from you, just because Georgia does not take care of its own, very well.
Call Governor Deal and ask him why Georgia is one of only a few states that has yet to start a high risk pool. Where’s his Plan B, if his lawsuit causes the downfall of the Affordable Health Care Act and the destruction of ObamaCare? If he gives a darn about Georgians, he should have his running shoes on, ready to go.
Jay
March 28th, 2012
6:29 pm
For example, I see that the Democrats have already dug up the fact that the plant closings in question cost 4,300 jobs.
Jay
March 28th, 2012
6:48 pm
Paul, how did you find this blog in the first place? Just curious. You know, from Texas and all.
middle of the road
March 28th, 2012
6:55 pm
These Suprem Court Justices are crazy. Comparing Obamacare to forcing people to buy broccoli? First of all, Obamacare doesn’t stipulate WHAT KIND of insurance you buy, just that you have insurance. A more apt analogy would be that all people are required to buy food of some kind.
The current insurance situation is akin to if the Federal Govt had passed a law that if you came into a grocery store and ssaid you were hungry, the store HAD to give you food even if you did not pay. So young people found out they should just take advantage of that and get their food for free rather than pay for it (free riders).
middle of the road
March 28th, 2012
6:58 pm
According to the conservatives, he should die.
Not really, they just say that you and I have to pay for his treatment whether he ever had or wanted insurance. He could have been making $80,000 a year and decided not to buy insurance because he was “healthy” and now we have to pay his bills for him. Where is the “individual responsibility” that cons are always crowing about?
William
March 28th, 2012
7:01 pm
“So corporal junior, you won’t admit that your “appearance” fears were directly related to the Martin kid. The only salient question being, why did you bring them up in relation to a discussion of him?”
Because of Congressman Rush’ actions today, not because of the shooting. Follow what I said instead of being an inquisitor.
William
March 28th, 2012
7:02 pm
“You guys just make stuff up and then cling to it like a little toddler clings to the remnants of his little blinky. It’s sad, really.”
That is funny, Jay. It’s good to get some laughs here now and again.
Vast Right Wing Conspiracy
March 28th, 2012
8:05 pm
“If Obamacare dies, what then?” – We rejoice, because tyranny has been thwarted!
ld
March 29th, 2012
1:32 am
WHEN, hopefully, the Obamacare boondoggle is killed off by the Supremes…
W/federal block grants (in lieu of federal funding of Medicaid), substantially enhance existing county health departments and county supported hospitals to enable clinics to be opened that will serve the basic needs of some of the poorest of the poor (increasing who is served and what care is offered over time as space/funding permit).
Expect emergencies (and some that really aren’t) to continue to show up at ER and make some provisions for it.
Also, authorize the clinics to accept only those persons w/valid state photo ID and/or who have pre-registered. Get as many to pre-register as possible before services are actually needed to guage needs of community for these reduced/sliding fee services.
Have every licensed medical professional and facility be REQUIRED to contribute some degree of care on a sliding fee scale for the privilege of being licenced in the state. Have the clinics BOTH provide basic care and have the authority to refer patients to specialists in exchange for serious liability reform.
Initially, care may be only for poor who are children and/or elderly and/or disabled; later,contingent upon funding, possibly include unemployed and/or unemployable adults.
Initially those cases might include flu shots and/or treatment and shots and/or treatment for other communicable diseases, specifically including treatment for TB which, if not properly done only results in disease resistent drugs and relapse. Then, maybe, add treating chronic diseases–high BP; diabetes, etc. At some point add prenatal care. Decide on priorities in communities best interest and address those first.
Only add treatment for non-life-threatening health problems as funding permits.
For as long as gov’t permits “non-profit” status, create a non-profit which would enable business and/or individuals to fund certain types of care. Perhaps some might specifically want to donate to pre-natal care or dental care for children.
This at least STARTS the process of trying to provide affordable care to the truly needy w/o locking taxpayers into an entitlement program. It also enables the state via health departments to track patterns of health problems and determine how best to address them.
Yes, there may be some stigma attached to needing to go to the health department for help; however, this is a small price to pay for reduced price services. Requiring patients to go to a gov’t office might even discourage some abuse–
Politically incorrect alert:
If photo ID and/or pre-registering is required, this could make sure that services go to US citizens only or at least first; and,
If drug addicts and drunks don’t want to have their addictions identified, then those that may be “voluntarily” creating some of their health problems might not show up at all–and/or their problems might well be placed at the bottom of the list of priorities.
.
sthomas
March 29th, 2012
5:05 am
@ Talking Head. I don’t see employers raising anyone’s salalry because the employer is no longer subsidizing health insurance. .
Watkins
March 29th, 2012
10:39 am
First, we should recall way back in Massachusetts “Romney saw it as a traditional Republican moral issue of personal responsibility, getting rid of the free riders in the system, not as much of an economic issue,” Mr. Gruber said. “Not only were the Republicans for it, the liberals hated it. People forget that.”
We have to hope the Supreme Court sees that the mandate is not a “game-changer” in the relationship between Gov’t and the people under the Commerce Clause. The mandate is a narrowly tailored construct designed to protect the integrity of the health delivery system. The ad hoc system we have now – that is, premiums and health costs are overpriced to account for the indeterminate number of ‘free’ services that will be delivered to those who can’t or won’t pay. The health and safety of the populace is at risk as the current monopolistic system dissintegrates. One wonders how opponents will react to denial of care in a post Obamacare world.
As to what happens if it goes? I favor a single payer system, but realize I’m in a minority. What about only allowing people to make the choice to enroll once every 5 years. It’s still a choice, but they run serious risks. My prediction is most would enroll.
Watkins
March 29th, 2012
10:43 am
…. additonal note. Hopefully, most understand that the high cost of healthcare is due to our broken system. For those who think they’d just pay, take a look at someone’s hospital bill and the insurance summary. Those without insurance will pay 5 to 10 times more for the same service.