Trayvon Martin aside, ’stand your ground’ law is stupid
Let’s acknowledge from the beginning that there are no grounds to believe that Florida’s “stand your ground” law can be blamed for the events leading up to the tragic shooting of Trayvon Martin.
George Zimmerman, the neighborhood watch fanatic who shot Martin, may have had no idea that Florida even had such a law. And even if he did know, that knowledge might not have changed his behavior in any way. The only thing we know for certain is that Sanford police cited the law in explaining why they lacked probable cause to arrest Zimmerman.
So setting aside the Martin tragedy, what possible purpose does a “stand your ground” law serve in the first place? What good can it possibly achieve, particularly when implemented outside the home?
Dealing with an intruder inside the home is quite a different matter. And every person of course has the right to defend themselves and others from bodily harm. That right existed before passage of “stand your ground” laws around the country; it exists today in states that did not pass “stand your ground” laws.
We’re dealing instead with something very different than mere self-defense. “Stand your ground” laws state that if an armed person faces a choice between safely withdrawing from a scene or standing his or her ground and killing someone, that person “has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force,” as Florida law puts it.
That’s what I don’t get. I understand that there are macho fools out there who believe that backing down from a fight is a worse outcome than shooting and killing another person. I just don’t see why in a civilized country the law should validate and even encourage that mentality.
– Jay Bookman
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905 comments Add your comment
Don't Forget
March 27th, 2012
6:44 pm
William
March 27th, 2012
6:32 pm
I’ll put the question to liberals here, then: do you think one has a legal (rather than merely a commonsensical) duty to retreat in order to claim self defense in a court of law? Just curious.
It’s my understanding that it depends on the state. Some you do, some you don’t.
Jay
March 27th, 2012
6:45 pm
Barking, if my wife hits me with a ballbat, I probably deserved it.
MamaSays
March 27th, 2012
6:45 pm
By the way you have to be an idiot to criticize the fact that I will not let my child run the streets, given the fact that in the worst case scenario Martin was killed by a nutcase while he was walking through the neighborhood.
Our kids need to be watched by all accounts there are racist abound
Keep Up--Te gusta losing woofinpoofs?
March 27th, 2012
6:46 pm
Oy vey the unsubstanitated claims about Zimmerman are really flying.
There has been no independent verification of any claim/evidence that Zimmerman, in fact, had a broken nose or a gash on the back of his head as alleged. Zimmerman claims a broken nose and a wounded head. The police report supports this. We cannot find a record of a hospital visit or any treatment. There are no published photos to show this broken nose which, as anyone who has had one, knows will result in swelling and blackened eyes. One can reasonably infer that if one wishes to prove he has a broken nose — say, someone who will have to defend the shooting of an unarmed teenager — there would be independent verification of the injuries to support your actions.
William
March 27th, 2012
6:46 pm
“William, my answer is yes. When the alternative is to kill someone, you have an obligation to exhaust other alternatives first.”
Thank you for the response. I guess we disagree then, because I can think of a lot of scenarios where someone might unjustly be charged with some form of homicide on these very grounds. That is undesirable as well. If we did away with such legal requirements, then I see no reason for “stand your ground” laws.
TaxPayer
March 27th, 2012
6:46 pm
Gee,
And I thought that Zimmerman fella might have possibly broke some kinda law by blowing a hole in someone armed only with Skittles. Republicans now claim that’s perfectly legal.
pogo
March 27th, 2012
6:47 pm
Ah yes, so-called “supporters” of Trayvon prove the point about the problem. One inch equals a foot to some.
http://www.local10.com/news/Police-Trayvon-protesters-ransack-store/-/1717324/9719674/-/xctonpz/-/index.html
Rick in Grayson
March 27th, 2012
6:47 pm
ragnar danneskjold: If the Supremes invalidate the mandate, doesn’t the whole Obamacare thing fall apart? I believe the insurance companies are only going along with this law because they were assured that everyone would purchase health insurance.
Without the mandate, the insurance companies will back out of this turkey or US taxpayers will be picking up the healthcare bills for all the liberals who are collecting earned income credits and food stamps.
Paul
March 27th, 2012
6:47 pm
Another topic in which many mightily avoided the topic of “I understand that there are macho fools out there who believe that backing down from a fight is a worse outcome than shooting and killing another person. I just don’t see why in a civilized country the law should validate and even encourage that mentality.”
But there were a few this time who did engage and who, hopefully, reconsidered their initial responses.
Pleasant evening, all -
barking frog
March 27th, 2012
6:47 pm
If the trees are blocking
your view of the forest,
you may be a liberal.
Soothsayer
March 27th, 2012
6:47 pm
OK, let’s break this down. A guy with a 9mm goes chasing after an unarmed 17 year old kid who hasn’t done anything wrong. The guy with the 9mm confronts the teenager. Words are exchanged. The guy with the 9mm tries to “detain” the teenager (who again has done nothing wrong) perhaps grabbing his arm. The teenager withdraws his arm and the guy with the 9mm takes a swing at him. The teenager swings back and lands a good one knocking the guy with the 9mm to the ground. The enraged teenager starts pounding the back of his head on the pavement. The guy with the 9mm gets a hand free and pulls his gun and shoots the teenager. Who’s at fault here?
0311/8541/5811/1811
March 27th, 2012
6:47 pm
As an investigator I would also want to know EVERYTHING about both of their backgrounds.
Zimmerman: Has he used force (even physical) or threatened/pulled his gun before ? Does he have a history of fighting or trying to provoke fights ? Does he have a criminal record (even if just an arrest). Was he on prescription drugs. Has he ever had a mental evaluation or psychiatric care ? Has he ever been fired from a job and why, etc., etc., etc.
Martin: Autopsy – were there drugs in his system? What is his complete record? What about the “so-called” punch thrown at the bus driver, the “burglary” tool and the pieces of jewelry he had found on her person ? What were the dates he came to live there. Do those dates conincide with the “supposed” rash of burglaries in Zimmerman’s neighborhood. Do Martin’s fingerprints match any lifted from those burglary crime scenes.
LET THE CHIPS FALL WHERE THEY MAY !
William
March 27th, 2012
6:47 pm
“It’s my understanding that it depends on the state. Some you do, some you don’t.”
Correct. But I was polling the liberals here on the question.
Rick in Grayson
March 27th, 2012
6:48 pm
Jay, how often does your wife hit you with a ballbat?
Don't Forget
March 27th, 2012
6:48 pm
MamaSays
March 27th, 2012
6:42 pm
Keep it real,
Cite the law Zimmerman broke please
It will be interesting since there is not one
That’s why they are doing the investigation. Do you have facts we don’t have?
William
March 27th, 2012
6:49 pm
“OK, let’s break this down. A guy with a 9mm goes chasing after an unarmed 17 year old kid who hasn’t done anything wrong. The guy with the 9mm confronts the teenager. Words are exchanged. The guy with the 9mm tries to “detain” the teenager (who again has done nothing wrong) perhaps grabbing his arm. The teenager withdraws his arm and the guy with the 9mm takes a swing at him. The teenager swings back and lands a good one knocking the guy with the 9mm to the ground. The enraged teenager starts pounding the back of his head on the pavement. The guy with the 9mm gets a hand free and pulls his gun and shoots the teenager. Who’s at fault here?”
In that hypothetical scenario, I would say the guy with the 9mm. But what is the reality?
They BOTH suck
March 27th, 2012
6:49 pm
“all the liberals who are collecting earned income credits and food stamps.”
Only liberals collect EITC and food stamps?
Proof?
Thanks
0311/8541/5811/1811
March 27th, 2012
6:50 pm
Soothsayer @ 6:47
I assume you have access to all of the police reports, tapes, witness affidavits and future grand jury testimony under oath ???
F. Sinkwich
March 27th, 2012
6:50 pm
As I said yesterday, better to be judged by twelve than buried by six.
Many here seem to know know exactly what happened somehow. Remember Duke lacrosse.
In other news:
“While Solicitor General Donald Verrilli, Jr. made the Obama administration’s case for the constitutionality of the individual mandate in the health-care law Tuesday, Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia interrupted, telling Verrilli, “we’re not stupid.””
Judge Scalia, respectfully, lib ilks think whomever might disagree with their positions are by nature stupid and worthy of ridicule.
Regardless of your admonition, Verrilli still thinks you’re stupid. Every lib ilk here does too.
Keep Up--Te gusta losing woofinpoofs?
March 27th, 2012
6:52 pm
What about the “so-called” punch thrown at the bus driver, the “burglary” tool and the pieces of jewelry he had found on her person ? What were the dates he came to live there. Do those dates coincide with the “supposed” rash of burglaries in Zimmerman’s neighborhood. Do Martin’s fingerprints match any lifted from those burglary crime scenes.
because of course if a vigilante just fortuitously happened to get someone who might of done something, that of course would then make it all okay, even though all that determination is after the fact. Shoot first and ask questions later…….
The Real Disgusted
March 27th, 2012
6:52 pm
And you wonder why the United States Postal Service is in trouble?
A week before Christmas 2011, I downloaded some USPS software. Having a package I wanted to ship to an elderly relative in a nursing home, I decided it would be easier to pay for and print the postage by use of the software. After two trial runs, I got nothing, and I finally gave up and trudged to the post office to mail the package.
Today I received the following e-mail:
Dear client:
This is an email confirmation for your order of 2 online shipping label(s) with postage. Your credit card will be charged the following amount:
Transaction ID: #5464112
Print Date/Time: 03/15/2012 02:30 PM CST
Postage Amount: $23.66
Credit Card Number: XXXX XXXX XXXX XXXX
Priority Mail Regional Rate Box B # 6648 9848 0490 2425 2643 (Sequence Number 1 of 1)
I suppose I had better hope that my relative survives two more Christmases.
MamaSays
March 27th, 2012
6:52 pm
So the mere fact that he shot someone makes his act illegal ? Humm interesting usurpation of the law.
I am glad to see you libs apply new logic, now maybe we can keep one or two of the intercity murders in jail.
Usually you are citing why they should be let go.
Such hypocrites, then again you can show I am wrong by demanding an end to allowing any shooter to go free. Regardless of your liberal blindness and guilt.
By the way I still have no answer from you libs as to the hoodie wearing black stranger in your subdivision. What’s wrong you don’t wish to face your inter racist ?
Soothsayer
March 27th, 2012
6:54 pm
“I assume you have access to all of the police reports, tapes, witness affidavits and future grand jury testimony under oath ???”
What I posted was pure speculation. I never represented it as the truth of what actually happened.
OICU812
March 27th, 2012
6:54 pm
This Gestapo-wannabe called 9/11 no less than 40 times while a self-appointed neighborhood “crime watchman.” There’s something seriously wrong with that. Napoleon Syndrome on ‘roids. I didn’t know walking down the street at night in a neighborhood was a crime (albeit in Atlanta it can cost you your life – or at a minimum a broken face and stolen iPhone and wallet…just ask GA Tech students).
But I have a question: why is the media (and Al Sharpton) portraying this guy as “white” or a “white Hispanic” when he’s half white and half Hispanic? Last time I checked Obama is half white and I don’t hear anyone calling him a “white African-American.” I’d be willing to bet if Zimmerman was a good person and came up with the cure for a disease or won the Nobel Prize for something, the media would be touting him as the “First Hispanic to accomplish…”. Just a thought.
And let’s give it up to Justice Kennedy throwing out the anchor on the full steam ahead Obamacare brigade! “[It would] funamentally change the relationship between the government and the individual.” Yep, exactly what the nanny state liberal Democrats want in this nation. Their supporters of Obamacare of spun it into a commerce clause issue that everyone would be involved with the transaction of (key word WOULD be involved with). What is the left going to try and ram down our throats next in the farce of “our best interest” there and categorize it under the commerce clause, gluten-free pasta? Silly liberals.
MamaSays
March 27th, 2012
6:54 pm
Don’t forget,
You may wish to remember that since you are the one that said he violated the law by chasing Trayvon
Midori
March 27th, 2012
6:55 pm
Justice Antonin Scalia interrupted, telling Verrilli, “we’re not stupid.””
OBJECTION!!!
Soothsayer
March 27th, 2012
6:55 pm
“So the mere fact that he shot someone makes his act illegal”
Shooting (killing) an unarmed person is illegal.
0311/8541/5811/1811
March 27th, 2012
6:57 pm
Twelve & Seventeen
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/03/27/media-matters-honcho-sorry-after-blasting-drudge-for-trayvon-photo/
MamaSays
March 27th, 2012
6:59 pm
Do any of you libs live in a crime watch community ?
How many times have you called the police only for them to get there 30 mins after the incident is over ?
By the way. All you have to do is listen to a police scanner and you will hear daily that people see an incident, or suspicious person and follow them until police can get there. It’s called helping
Don't Forget
March 27th, 2012
6:59 pm
TaxPayer
March 27th, 2012
6:46 pm
Gee,
And I thought that Zimmerman fella might have possibly broke some kinda law by blowing a hole in someone armed only with Skittles. Republicans now claim that’s perfectly legal.
Well, you see, some of em scare real easy and don’t want to be responsible when the f up. Notice I said some, not all are like that.
pogo
March 27th, 2012
6:59 pm
Sharpton, Jesse and Obama should be proud. I would fully expect the first two to exploit a trajedy such as this but the President of the United States? He should have never waded into this sesspool because there is way more to this story than the initial knee jerk/inflammatory story the press put out there.
William
March 27th, 2012
6:59 pm
“OBJECTION!!!”
Overruled.
0311/8541/5811/1811
March 27th, 2012
7:00 pm
Soothsayer:
You didn’t answer my 6:50 but I’ll answer you 6:55
There are ocassions when it is perfectly legal to shoot an unarmed person.
One is when a police officer is being knocked unconscious by an unarmed assailant. You may (and should) shoot them.
MamaSays
March 27th, 2012
7:00 pm
Soothsayer,
Why can’t you libs just be what you say you are. – fair ?
You know that shooting someone is not in and of itself illegal. I know you know that
0311/8541/5811/1811
March 27th, 2012
7:02 pm
Keep Up–Te gusta losing woofinpoofs? @ 6:52 :
It is my “understanding” that Zimmerman was following Martin in part because of the way he was looking at houses. Now, as an investigator I would want Zimmerman to explain that and then go from there. It’s a fair enough reason to “try” to solve burglary cases.
0311/8541/5811/1811
March 27th, 2012
7:03 pm
MamaSays:
Sheep
Woves
Sheepdogs
Soothsayer
March 27th, 2012
7:05 pm
“Why can’t you libs just be what you say you are. – fair ?
You know that shooting someone is not in and of itself illegal. I know you know that.
Well, heck, my neighbor pissed me off and I just (for the heck of it) shot the shyte out of him. The other people in the neighborhood called the police but they said “it’s not illegal to shoot someone, sorry. Call us back when you have some real crime to report!”
Mama Says: WTF country do you live in?
Midori
March 27th, 2012
7:05 pm
Trayvon Martin made his own 911 call before his death; FBI investigates
Continue reading on Examiner.com Trayvon Martin made his own 911 call before his death; FBI investigates – National unsolved cases | Examiner.com http://www.examiner.com/unsolved-cases-in-national/trayvon-martin-made-his-own-911-call-before-his-death-fbi-investigates#ixzz1qMSpUHjv
William
March 27th, 2012
7:06 pm
“Judge Scalia, respectfully, lib ilks think whomever might disagree with their positions are by nature stupid and worthy of ridicule. Regardless of your admonition, Verrilli still thinks you’re stupid. Every lib ilk here does too.”
I looked at this exchange. Verrilli was detailing one of the central problems facing us, which I think no one is going to argue with. It is the particular solution he is defending that is problematic. I don’t see how you can avoid compelling people to buy health insurance if they want medical care, now or in the future. But how do you do it? I think by the force of consequences rather than by force of the gun. Pass a law that no one can receive medical care if they can’t afford it and don’t have health insurance. Then make sure everyone understands the consequences very well. Then it remains one personal responsibility rather than that of the government. Because once the government starts dictating things to us like this, who really knows where it will lead?
Jay
March 27th, 2012
7:08 pm
A true sheepdog could never fit down all those rabbit holes.
Keep Up--Te gusta losing woofinpoofs?
March 27th, 2012
7:08 pm
Scout, “looking at houses” is now suspicious activity. Sorry, you are making excuses and trying to introduced pure speculation as a justification. As to the overall point regarding Stand Your Ground laws, that again is unrelated to the purpose of the laws. As noted in Iowa where they are trying to pass a similar law (and Iowa already has a castle law):
I think Iowans have a right to defend themselves where they have a right to be present. To require an Iowan to retreat when they feel threatened, I think, that’s an asinine proposal.” http://globegazette.com/news/iowa/iowa-lawmaker-will-push-stand-your-ground-despite-florida-teen/article_ee3df0dc-762f-11e1-8fee-0019bb2963f4.html#ixzz1qKFULdlA
Again, let’s remember the law apparently provides a basis to allow pursuit even when “threatened”. Absurd.
Strong Woman
March 27th, 2012
7:08 pm
Trayvon is being persecuted in the media just like women are everyday!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pojL_35QlSI&ob=av2e
Don't Forget
March 27th, 2012
7:08 pm
MamaSays
March 27th, 2012
6:54 pm
Don’t forget,
You may wish to remember that since you are the one that said he violated the law by chasing Trayvon
Mama you just can’t seem to get anything right today can you? I did not say he violated the law by chasing Trayvon. But hey, I’ll give you credit for FINALLY posting something that didn’t have the word “liberal” in it. I see how you are.
Recon 0311 2533
March 27th, 2012
7:09 pm
“Shooting (killing) an unarmed person is illegal.”
Nope…lets say for an example you have 5′4″, 110 Lbs. armed female being confronted by 6′2″ 210 Lbs. unarmed male. The male is advancing in a threatening manner, the female fearing for her life draws her weapon and shoots the unarmed male to death. Ruling, the shooting was justifiable because given the males size superiority he had the ability to kill or maim the female.
Orange12
March 27th, 2012
7:10 pm
http://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statutes/2011/Chapter0776/All
stands for decibels
March 27th, 2012
7:10 pm
I have one that is 17 and he will never walk to the store by himself.
Poor kid. Sucks having an overprotective, paranoid parent.
Soothsayer
March 27th, 2012
7:12 pm
I love listening to these young people cavalierly discuss healthcare on this blog. Just wait until your health insurance is $750.00/month (just for you). Then, let me hear your justifications and platitudes. Don’t forget that, long before that, your employer will have cut you loose in favor of a younger employee. Enjoy your youth while you’re young — it’s fleeting indeed. Just wait! You’ll see!
F. Sinkwich
March 27th, 2012
7:13 pm
I think I found out where all the Occutards went:
“North Miami Beach police said surveillance video shows dozens of high school students demonstrating in the Trayvon Martin case Friday ransacking a Walgreens store. The incident occurred during a walkout from North Miami Beach Senior High School in support of Martin, 17, who was fatally shot in Sanford.”
stands for decibels
March 27th, 2012
7:13 pm
The stand your ground laws are stupid.
The people who honestly believe such laws make them any safer are also stupid.
Boris Badnoff
March 27th, 2012
7:14 pm
This is how liberals avoid Stand Your Ground
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2121100/Man-saws-foot-avoid-work-continue-claiming-jobless-benefits.html
I can’t conceive of myself shooting anyone for any reason. For one thing I’m not Annie Oakley. I’d miss the bad guy and hit some innocent bystander downloading Russian porn on his cell phone. For another there is no one I hate enough to take their life. It ain’t worth it. Plus I’d go to prison and the food there worse than road kill.
What Jay didn’t tell you is the bats his wife hits him with are foosball bats.
F. Sinkwich
March 27th, 2012
7:15 pm
“I love listening to these young people cavalierly discuss healthcare on this blog. Just wait until your health insurance is $750.00/month (just for you).”
Just vote for O’bozo. Your HC will be free!
Sooth sez so.
Recon 0311 2533
March 27th, 2012
7:16 pm
“The stand your ground laws are stupid.”
How so in your opinion?
Soothsayer
March 27th, 2012
7:17 pm
Fish Sandwich: who pays for your healthcare insurance?
William
March 27th, 2012
7:18 pm
“The stand your ground laws are stupid. The people who honestly believe such laws make them any safer are also stupid.”
As a reaction to duty to flee laws, I understand their existence. And I support them as long as the former exist. Yet I do not own a gun. I must be really stupid (and not just because I post on this blog)!
Keep Up--Te gusta losing woofinpoofs?
March 27th, 2012
7:19 pm
Sooth, I am all for amending the individual mandate to permit an opt out. If you have a permanent “opt out” tatoo and post a $1 million bond, no medical person SHALL ever treat you for anything unless you pay cash in advance. Ambulences and fire departments would let them die unless they had the money on their body to pay in cash.
Soothsayer
March 27th, 2012
7:22 pm
It’s OK to look for just a minute — I won’t tell anyone!
Recon 0311 2533
March 27th, 2012
7:22 pm
I think Nazi Germany tatooed people as a means for group identification.
Soothsayer
March 27th, 2012
7:24 pm
Keep: the truth is I don’t have health insurance — I can’t afford it. I am looking forward to being eligible for Medicare in a few more years.
F. Sinkwich
March 27th, 2012
7:24 pm
Hey Jay, no Cheney blog yet? You know, how old he is, got a heart that should have gone to someone younger, etc.
Discovery Channel might have an angle for you:
“Will Dick Cheney’s new heart make him a gentler, mellower guy? Some medical experts think it’s possible.”
Gotta luv haters of the lib ilk…
F. Sinkwich
March 27th, 2012
7:26 pm
“Fish Sandwich: who pays for your healthcare insurance?”
That’s my problem, Sooth. Thanks for asking.
Why do you care?
Soothsayer
March 27th, 2012
7:27 pm
Fish Sandwich: I don’t know if we’ve ever had a blogger on this blog with a sourer disposition than you. Man, you need some help!
Keep Up--Te gusta losing woofinpoofs?
March 27th, 2012
7:28 pm
Sooth, I understand that some people may have to be without it now. It’s a shame because as a friend who fell off a roof found out after over $1 million in medical bills, bankruptcy is usually the only recourse, even with charity. But fortunately the law makes provisions for those who cannot afford it and not for those who can but merely chose not to.
hsn
March 27th, 2012
7:30 pm
Mamasays,
My answer is I will be cautious with ANYONE regardless of race.
There are chillingly disturbing aspects of this case and I have questions for u:
1. If Martin were a white male, do u think Zimm would have shot him?
2. If a 26 year old black male executed a 17 year old white male minor, do u think the police would have given him his gun, taken him ar his word and just asked him to go?
These questions justify the racial bias suspicions that many harbor in the case. They are not just emotional cries from lefties.
Soothsayer
March 27th, 2012
7:30 pm
“That’s my problem, Sooth. Thanks for asking.
Why do you care?”
Because I’d be willing to bet that you don’t pay for it yourself. And I’d be willing to be even further that it’s being furnished to you on the taxpayer’s dime! That’s why I care! Ordinarily, I wouldn’t really give a shyte except that you constantly pontificate about and endlessly blame those who can’t afford healthcare insurance.
Keep Up--Te gusta losing woofinpoofs?
March 27th, 2012
7:31 pm
Yes, because every tatoo is immediately comparable to Nazi Germany……
Could you be any sillier…oh wait, I have seen your posts, yes you can.
stands for decibels
March 27th, 2012
7:31 pm
How so in your opinion?
for the reasons given by Jay in his post. to wit: “I understand that there are macho fools out there who believe that backing down from a fight is a worse outcome than shooting and killing another person. I just don’t see why in a civilized country the law should validate and even encourage that mentality.”
Such a sentiment should fall into the category of “bleedin’ obvious” to rational people.
Soothsayer
March 27th, 2012
7:31 pm
Keep: that’s why I always hire someone to work on the roof. Those guys climb all over the place like it’s nothing. Scares the crap out of me!
Recon 0311 2533
March 27th, 2012
7:32 pm
Providers allow you to make monthly payments that you can afford and will forgive a large portion of their bill. The lefts use of financial ruin is greatly exaggerated.
Chattahoochee Hiker
March 27th, 2012
7:34 pm
I just read where Gary Hilton pleaded guilty to killing the elderly NC couple on a hike. Too bad Mr. Bookman can’t ask Meridith Emerson, the lady in Florida, and this couple in NC how they feel about the stand your ground law.
stands for decibels
March 27th, 2012
7:34 pm
Yet I do not own a gun. I must be really stupid (and not just because I post on this blog)!
hmm. Not sure where anyone got the notion that I think people who own firearms are any more or less stupid than those who don’t. But for the record, I don’t believe that to be the case.
anyway, what’s even sillier (stupider? sure, that’s a word, right?) would be me, arguing at length about this with people who are dug in on the issue, and I can’t hang out here, so I’ll just wish a pleasant evening to all.
Recon 0311 2533
March 27th, 2012
7:34 pm
“Such a sentiment should fall into the category of “bleedin’ obvious” to rational people.”
An opinion minus an explanation of reasoned thought. Oh well not unexpected.
MamaSays
March 27th, 2012
7:35 pm
Keep it real,
Your blog at 6:32pm
Said Zimmerman was breaking the law by chasing Trayvon.
You may wish to look back. Before you slam me.
Soothsayer,
You are applying your on standards into the law.
Go shoot your neighbor and see if the police tell you it not illegal to shoot someone.
Then get your other neighbor to come to your house jump you, beat your head into the concrete and then you shoot him. Bet the police have a different outlook on that shooting than they would on your other one.
It’s called circumstances. They are all different.
Oh almost forgot to call you a liberal
You folks cannot be serious
Tell you what I will attend rally at the Capitol in which you demand incarceration in all shooting incidents. I will support you 100%.
Then again I am sure you will want some exceptions built into it.
See I know that for every one white person who will be incarcerated there will be 19 less black murderers walking the streets of Atlanta. See you folks can’t grasp the fact that the black community suffers from its own predators. 9 out of 10 blacks killed are killed by other blacks. Are you ready to put all of them in jail ?
Or do you just wish to put the whites that kill blacks in jail ?
Still waiting on my hoodie answers from you do good let them all go tree hungers. ( actually I support liberal enviro policy but I figured that sounded good )
Then I can take my family to a game or out to eat without worrying if one of them will attack me.
Orange12
March 27th, 2012
7:36 pm
The law appears to be well written and easy to understand. In the Martin/Zimmerman dispute: A witness has stated that Martin was on top of Zimmerman pummeling him. This is a forcible felony and the use of deadly force to prevent a forcible is lawful per Florida Law Statutes.
Soothsayer
March 27th, 2012
7:36 pm
“Providers allow you to make monthly payments that you can afford and will forgive a large portion of their bill. The lefts use of financial ruin is greatly exaggerated.”
Hmmmm . . . a million dollars at $1,000.00 a month. That would be a thousand months or 83 years! Oh! Wait! I forgot the interest!
Have to start over!
I don’t know about you, but a $1,000 a month wouldn’t be any problem at all! Heck! I’ve got a thousand dollars just laying around all the time with nothing to do with it!
0311/8541/5811/1811
March 27th, 2012
7:38 pm
Midori:
If that is true that Martin called 911 then that is a good point.
However, under Florida law (Just like Zimmerman should have) he should have:
Kept going to his home
Held his ground
Instead the evidence “apparently shows he went toward Zimmerman” and provoked a fight.
Time (and a grand jury) will tell.
MamaSays
March 27th, 2012
7:38 pm
Ain’t gonna read anymore, I am going to go walk. God I hope that if I get into an altercation it is with a white person, I will have no rights if it’s with a minority
Keep Up--Te gusta losing woofinpoofs?
March 27th, 2012
7:38 pm
The lefts use of financial ruin is greatly exaggerated.
And yet the bankruptcy cases say otherwise. I wonder how many payments of $19.99 it would take to pay a $1 million in bills amount a variety of medical providers with interest and late fees and of course, each would wait patiently for their turn in payment.
I predicted a sillier post and I see you followed through.
F. Sinkwich
March 27th, 2012
7:38 pm
“Fish Sandwich: I don’t know if we’ve ever had a blogger on this blog with a sourer disposition than you. Man, you need some help!”
I guess you don’t read very many of the postings here. But I do get agitated reading posts from those who, like O’bozo, want to destroy my country. Just me, I guess.
By the way, I’m not on Medicare yet.
The Real Disgusted
March 27th, 2012
7:39 pm
Keep: the truth is I don’t have health insurance — I can’t afford it. I am looking forward to being eligible for Medicare in a few more years.
Lotsa luck in finding physicians who will accept Medicare. If I didn’t have group health insurance, I would be in sad shape today. As reimbursement rates continue to decline and claim processing slows to a crawl, you’ll find that even more physicians will refuse to accept Medicare. I carry it only because dropping it would result in catastrophic rates if I ever decided to rejoin. Otherwise, it’s 100 bucks a month down the crapper.
0311/8541/5811/1811
March 27th, 2012
7:40 pm
Well, I see JAY finally came out and addressed the “Scout” personally.
However, instead of engaging in debate he chose to just take a shot (no pun intended) at me.
One would expect better of a journalist with the AJC.
They BOTH suck
March 27th, 2012
7:41 pm
“Ain’t gonna read anymore, I am going to go walk. God I hope that if I get into an altercation it is with a white person, I will have no rights if it’s with a minority”
You took the Kinks way to seriously…… because “paranoia is destroying you”
Keep Up--Te gusta losing woofinpoofs?
March 27th, 2012
7:41 pm
Instead the evidence “apparently shows he went toward Zimmerman” and provoked a fight
Funny thing about this “evidence”, you have no basis for it. Puure speculation and you ignore Zimmerman’s pursuit.
ragnar danneskjold
March 27th, 2012
7:43 pm
Dear Rick @ 6:47, “If the Supremes invalidate the mandate, doesn’t the whole Obamacare thing fall apart? I believe the insurance companies are only going along with this law because they were assured that everyone would purchase health insurance. Without the mandate, the insurance companies will back out of this turkey or US taxpayers will be picking up the healthcare bills”
Not necessarily. While there are reasonable doubts about the economics of ObamaCare even now, invalidation of the individual mandate does not particularly mean none of the law will survive. The Supremes are, as Chauncey, mere attorneys, and not particularly versed in economics. Insurance companies do not have the option of backing out of “the turkey,” only of “getting out of the business.” The economics of the bill already made that a foregone conclusion, but invalidation of the individual mandate will accelerate the process. So November you will choose between your insurance company or “the one whom we have awaited.” To borrow Kissinger’s line, it is a pity they both cannot lose.
Don't Forget
March 27th, 2012
7:43 pm
Mama says
“You are walking through your complex or subdivision, it’s dark and you notice you are walking toward a black male, wearing a hoodie. The male is 6-3 ft tall and although you live there you have never seen him before.
Will you admit you have thoughts that are not politically correct in your head ?”
ABSOLUTELY NOT! Why the hell should I? Because he’s black? Because he’s wearing a hoodie? Because he’s 6′3″? Unfreakingbelievable.
F. Sinkwich
March 27th, 2012
7:44 pm
Keep and Sooth want the government to take money from some people to give it to others, at the point of a gun.
Just so they feel better about themselves.
Go figure.
But to all you mush-head lib ilk leaning young-uns out there, vote for O’bozo and you’ll get tons of stuff for free!
MamaSays
March 27th, 2012
7:44 pm
Dang it Hns,
You cannot make your racial assumptions to justify your racial assumptions.
The truth is everyday in America police are arresting white people. Look at the booking photos AJC puts up.
Your assumption proves that you will never allow a white person to defend themselves.
The fact is that if you are scared and getting beaten you will do what you have to to live.
The police did not arrest because the actual real life facts supported Zimmernam. Two witnesses saw Trayvon on top of him beating his face in. One says he looked at Zimmernan as he was yelling for help. Why can’t you see that it is you who is judging this case by the racial standard ?
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
March 27th, 2012
7:46 pm
Is the president going to make a statement regarding the three black suspects who shot the white Mississippi student ?
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-57405322-504083/3rd-suspect-arrested-in-miss-state-students-shooting-death/
getalife
March 27th, 2012
7:46 pm
No scout holes.
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
March 27th, 2012
7:47 pm
Keep Up–Te gusta losing woofinpoofs? :
If you will notice that’s why I said “apparently”. The grand jury will decide.
Martin Williams
March 27th, 2012
7:48 pm
Jay, what do you expect from Southern States. Georgia got almost the same law. I can put a bullet in your you know what because I don’t like the way you looked at me. The NRA and gun makers love this kind of stuff especially taking all that blood money to the bank in name of the right to bear arms. If I have the right to bear arms per constitution, why is their an age limit Jay?
Midori
March 27th, 2012
7:49 pm
Angela B. Corey, a veteran prosecutor, said she is well aware of the public’s demands for answers in the shooting death of 17-year-old Trayvon Martin in what has become a racially charged case triggering nationwide outrage.
“We stepped into this case Thursday night,” Corey told The Times. “We’re asking — we’re begging people — just give us a chance.”
In a sign of how feverishly her team is working on the case, Corey said her probe could possibly result in state charges that bypass the need for the Seminole County Grand Jury, which is slated to convene April 10 to hear the case.
“It’s possible that we’ll just make a decision without the grand jury,” she said.
MamaSays
March 27th, 2012
7:49 pm
Don’t forget,
You are a liar. Plan and simple.
Either that or you are better than Jessie Jackson with whom you now have a disagreement.
I can also tell by your answer that you have never lived in or worked integrate inter city nor have you ever been approached a black man in the inter city at night.
By the way if you are black
Try walking down a country road and see if you feel some fear when the pick up full of whites guys pulls up to you.
Either way. Fear is there and if it isn’t your will be the next victim
Midori
March 27th, 2012
7:51 pm
Instead the evidence “apparently shows he went toward Zimmerman” and provoked a fight.
no, it doesn’t.
Don't Forget
March 27th, 2012
7:52 pm
The Real Disgusted
March 27th, 2012
7:39 pm
Lotsa luck in finding physicians who will accept Medicare.
More TOTAL BS!
http://newoldage.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/07/06/found-doctors-who-take-medicare/
Now, medicaid…….. that’s another story.
MamaSays
March 27th, 2012
7:53 pm
Midori,
Are you working on this case ?
How do you know everything about it ?
What I have put up has been reported in the media. Where do you get your facts ?
Keep Up--Te gusta losing woofinpoofs?
March 27th, 2012
7:53 pm
Scout ‘apparently” now means “pure speculation and just make up anything”? You do have your own lexicon.
“Apparently the evidence shows little green men did the shooting” — Thomas Jefferson
Midori
March 27th, 2012
7:54 pm
Mamasays,
I’m working it about as much as you are.
And I know how to read. Another plus for me.
Tom(Independent-Viet Vet)
March 27th, 2012
7:54 pm
I will say this again, Zimmerman lived in a gated community that in the past 18 months had 10 burglaries. His neighbors and he formed a Neighborhood Watch to look for suspicious activity since the Police apparently could not stop it. They were concerned about their families and their property. The suspects in these break-ins were described as young black males by the victims. The men in this community chose to patrol their community and not cower behind the blinds at their homes and peer out sheepishly. The 17 yr old young man was suspicious because of the previously mentioned lookout not because he had skittles or ice tea. Zimmerman had blood on his face(possible broken nose) and blood on back of his head from having his head slammed onto the pavement. If the Police had did a better job of patrolling this residental complex, perhaps a neighborhood watch patrol would have been unnecessary! I will tell you this, as a retired cop of 30 yrs, if a suspect(young or old) was slamming my head into pavement, I most certainly would have shot him off me. People are beat to death every day in this world that we live in. Some of you, irregardless of the facts, want to see it your way no matter what! You must be prepared to protect your community(home), family and yourself at all times. Bad people are out there and you will encounter them at some point in your life!!
0311/8541/5811/1811/1801
March 27th, 2012
7:54 pm
The real tragedy in America is not white on black crime (if this was a crime) because that is rare.
Black on black crime is out of control ……….. I don’t see anyone “marching” about that.
Midori
March 27th, 2012
7:55 pm
one more thing Mamasays — I fear for your son.
Doesn’t he get laughed at when he goes to school wearing Pampers?