GOP continues to misplay auto bailout issue
Any real hope that Republicans may have had of carrying Michigan in November has probably disappeared thanks to the hard-fought GOP primary battle in that state, with Rick Santorum and Mitt Romney bidding for votes among the Republican base by trying to condemn the auto-industry rescue plan more harshly than his opponent.
But just in case, President Obama chose today, as Republican voters were going to the polls, to speak to the United Auto Workers convention and look back at recent history, when it seemed likely that both Chrysler and General Motors would go into liquidation.
Here’s part of what he had to say (full prepared text here):
“With the economy in complete freefall, there weren’t any private companies or investors willing to take a chance on the auto industry. Anyone in the financial sector could tell you that. So we could have kept giving billions of taxpayer dollars to the automakers without demanding real change or accountability in return. But that wouldn’t have solved anything. It would have just kicked the problem further on down the road. The other option we had was to do nothing, and allow these companies to fail. In fact, some politicians said we should. Some even said we should “let Detroit go bankrupt.”
Think about what that choice would have meant for this country. If we had turned our backs on you; if America had thrown in the towel; GM and Chrysler wouldn’t exist today. The suppliers and distributors that get their business from those companies would have died off, too. Then even Ford could have gone down as well. Production: shut down. Factories: shuttered. Once proud companies chopped up and sold off for scraps. And all of you – the men and women who built these companies with your own hands – would’ve been hung out to dry.
More than one million Americans across the country would have lost their jobs in the middle of the worst economic crisis since the Great Depression.
As Obama went on to note:
“About 700,000 retirees saw a reduction in the health care benefits they had earned. Many of you saw hours reduced, or pay and wages scaled back. You gave up some of your rights as workers. Promises were made to you over the years that you gave up for the sake and survival of this industry, its workers, and their families. You want to talk about values? Hard work – that’s a value. Looking out for one another – that’s a value. The idea that we’re all in it together – that I am my brother’s keeper; I am my sister’s keeper – that is a value.
But they’re still talking about you as if you’re some greedy special interest that needs to be beaten. Since when are hardworking men and women special interests? Since when is the idea that we look out for each other a bad thing?”
Given the success of the bailout, Republicans could have played the issue in one of two ways. They could acknowledge that it worked, applaud its success and move on, thus minimizing the political damage. Or they could continue to argue against all evidence that the bailout was a mistake, that they were right to oppose it and that the Americans involved didn’t deserve the help they got in keeping their jobs, their homes, their careers and their dreams.
They have chosen the second course, which frankly is pretty damn foolish.
– Jay Bookman
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403 comments Add your comment
Adam
February 28th, 2012
2:42 pm
Jimmy62: Ok, you are doing good, except…
So not only did we reward the UAW for driving GM to bankruptcy,
Please explain how the UAW was responsible for the bankruptcy, in as much detail as you can.
Doggone/GA
February 28th, 2012
2:43 pm
” UAW for driving GM to bankruptcy”
Got proof of that?
Butch Cassidy
February 28th, 2012
2:43 pm
(ir)Rational – “I already explained it downstairs. There is a magic gas prices button.”
I must have missed that. Actually with all the talk on the Right about being able to control the price of gas, you’d think someone might want to show the POTUS where the button is.
Midori
February 28th, 2012
2:44 pm
well Jay — Obama could have chosen another route.
He could have just paid them off in food stamps.
Adam
February 28th, 2012
2:44 pm
Doggone: JINX
kayaker 71
February 28th, 2012
2:44 pm
Just heard on Fox….. Bozo is going to build a soccer field for the detainees at Gitmo….. a friggin’ soccer field at a cost to the taxpayer of 750K. Cuts in the military budget are OK but we must have a soccer field for those animals to enjoy themselves. I just can’t wait until November ….. it can’t come soon enough.
Joseph
February 28th, 2012
2:44 pm
Foolish was pissing away billions of dollars when bankruptcy would have done exactly the same thing.
(ir)Rational
February 28th, 2012
2:44 pm
Butch – According to the media, only republican presidents have access to it.
Adam
February 28th, 2012
2:45 pm
Butch: you’d think someone might want to show the POTUS where the button is.
They think he knows where it is and is driving up the prices on purpose because they hear the phrase “gradual adjustment” and think it means “ZOMG INCREASE GAS PRICES!”
DebbieDoRight
February 28th, 2012
2:45 pm
JKL2: New Michigan campaign slogan: Vote obama–get a check
New Democratic Slogan — Vote Dem – Get a REALITY Check!!!
New Repub slogan — Vote Repub — Get a Cross and some ammo!!
New Newt Slogan — Vote for me — Or the New-Ex-Mrs. Gingrich Gets It!
New Rick Sanitarium Slogan — Duh!
New Ron Paul Slogan — I’m consistent! (I’m also constipated and cranky but hey — that’s consistent too!)
Adam
February 28th, 2012
2:45 pm
Just heard on Fox
Annnnnnnnnd I stopped reading.
Joseph
February 28th, 2012
2:45 pm
I’m sure the UAW is happy. They are the one’s reeping the benefits and in return are donating money to Obama…
Let's not count our chickens, K?
February 28th, 2012
2:46 pm
jm (aka, mistah pryvat equity) – how come your pe boys didn’t want a piece of the auto pie?
Joseph
February 28th, 2012
2:47 pm
Just like with the stimulus… The American tax payer got the short end of the stick…
(ir)Rational
February 28th, 2012
2:47 pm
DDR – Isn’t being consistent the opposite of being constipated? Wait, no that’s regular. Sorry.
Joe Hussein Mama
February 28th, 2012
2:47 pm
Jimmy62 — “Obama ignored the secured creditors (who only put up their money in the first place because they were supposed to be first in line in bankruptcy), and out UAW at the front of the line and gave them over 50% of the company. It was literally stolen from those secured creditors to give to the group who was as responsible as anyone for the failure of the company.”
If it was a bailout and not an actual bankruptcy, then *how,* exactly, were the secured creditors “stolen” from? You yourself admit that no actual bankruptcy happened.
So if there was no actual bankruptcy, then why would the secured creditors go first?
Paul
February 28th, 2012
2:47 pm
harvey
“Given most of us don’t get to keep a job if there isn’t anything to do, or get a pension, the auto bailout sucks. So does the bailout king.”
So I take it you don’t agree with the President’s values?
“Looking out for one another – that’s a value. The idea that we’re all in it together – that I am my brother’s keeper; I am my sister’s keeper – that is a value”
“My brother’s keeper.” Hmmmm…. I wonder where he got that socialist idea…..
Fire in the Hole
February 28th, 2012
2:48 pm
Obama stole Gm and gave it to the union thugs and Jay and the rest of you say nothing about the true owners property rights. How would you like the government to steal your lifetime investments?
ByteMe - Liberal Thug
February 28th, 2012
2:48 pm
The UAW wasn’t a secured creditor. In a bankruptcy the secured creditors go first.
That would be in a typical bankruptcy. This wasn’t one of those. This was a deal whereby the governments of the US and Canada did a deal along with the UAW’s pension and healthcare trusts (not the workers directly) to bail out GM. Otherwise, the company would have been liquidated and no one would get much of anything… and you’d have complained about that when it came to picking the next President (”He let GM fail!!”).
Paul
February 28th, 2012
2:48 pm
kayaker 71
“Bozo is going to build a soccer field for the detainees at Gitmo….. a friggin’ soccer field at a cost to the taxpayer of 750K.”
Are you saying the Defense budget has waste and inefficiencies and can be cut?
CJ
February 28th, 2012
2:48 pm
The anti-bailout attitude of many is surreal. America has long history of successful bailouts, including but not limited to bailouts of railroads, car companies, airlines, saving and loans, Mexico, and others. These actions were almost unanimously successful and always uncontroversial until conservatism took a hard right when Obama won the election.
Mitzymy
February 28th, 2012
2:49 pm
Obama did the right thing by bailing out Detroit. Now GM is the number One auto maker in the whole wide world. It would have been a foreign auto maker like Toyota. 1 million employees were not in the unemployment line, which is still long. Detroit is coming back, and the bailouts helped. Don’t expect the Repubs to give Obama credit for anything he has done, but expect them to blame him for whatever goes wrong, whether its his fault or not. The problem with them is that the man in the white house is not white.
Butch Cassidy
February 28th, 2012
2:49 pm
Since it seems that the UAW caused the demise of the auto industry, perhaps Jimmy62 could enlighten us as to what caused the demise of Bear Sterns and Lehman Brothers, were they overrun with auto workers as well?
(ir)Rational
February 28th, 2012
2:50 pm
DDR – NO! If he is constipated, does that mean he is full of sh*t?
Paul
February 28th, 2012
2:50 pm
Hi Midori!!
Bruno
February 28th, 2012
2:50 pm
Me too, but why does your side want to interfere with free trade in order to get cheap fuel? Sounds a lot like socialism to me.
For starters, you’ll not find one post from me talking about high gas prices, especially not in any kind of political context. Secondly, I speak for myself, not for any group. Having said that, the Lib hyperbole about a Con takeover of the oil industry is just that–meaningless hyperbole. As Jm mentioned above, there are a few things the federal govt can do to facilitate the oil industry’s ability to keep the supply plentiful, which I see no problem doing since cheap energy helps us all. Very different from an industry takeover.
Adam
February 28th, 2012
2:50 pm
(ir)Rational @ 2:50p
ByteMe - Liberal Thug
February 28th, 2012
2:51 pm
The problem with them is that the man in the white house is not white.
No, that’s not it. The problem with them is that TVs in Rightwingnutistan only tune to one channel and the Internet is limited to a very few sites.
Adam
February 28th, 2012
2:52 pm
Bruno: As Jm mentioned above, there are a few things the federal govt can do to facilitate the oil industry’s ability to keep the supply plentiful, which I see no problem doing since cheap energy helps us all. Very different from an industry takeover.
And also completely ineffective at producing said results, as the past few decades of ramping up production and reducing dependency (increasing supply, reducing demand) can easily demonstrate.
ByteMe - Liberal Thug
February 28th, 2012
2:52 pm
perhaps Jimmy62 could enlighten us as to what caused the demise of Bear Sterns and Lehman Brothers, were they overrun with auto workers as well?
They would have still been around if they had a few union thugs, I swear!!
Butch Cassidy
February 28th, 2012
2:53 pm
Bruno – “there are a few things the federal govt can do to facilitate the oil industry’s ability to keep the supply plentiful”
However, plentiful and affordable are not the same thing as indicated on numerous occasions. We are producing and exporting oil in record numbers, but it has had little effect on the price of a gallon of gas.
Joe Hussein Mama
February 28th, 2012
2:55 pm
Bruno — “the Lib hyperbole about a Con takeover of the oil industry is just that–meaningless hyperbole.”
Not in the least. Domestically produced petroleum is sold on the world market. The only way ‘our gas’ can be kept ‘here at home,’ the way some of our conservative friends and associates recommend, is via nationalization of part of all of the petroleum industry.
If our conservative friends and associates have some other particular mechanism in mind to accomplish the goal of keeping ‘our gas’ here ‘at home,’ then it is incumbent upon them to tell us about it. Absent that, they’re simply setting up a wonderful opportunity for me and the rest of the Left to accurately rebrand them as the SOSHULISTS they’ve been shrieking about since 2008.
IOW, if they’ve got a non-socialist means in mind to do it, then speak up or GTFO.
Butch Cassidy
February 28th, 2012
2:55 pm
ByteMe – Liberal Thug – “They would have still been around if they had a few union thugs, I swear!!”
Of course. Outside of the auto industry, you won’t find a more heavily unionized or regulated industry than banking.
Erwin's cat
February 28th, 2012
2:56 pm
I wouldn’t call TARP successful until it’s all been paid back….just sayin’
gm
February 28th, 2012
2:56 pm
I mean the rep candidates are the most stupid people on this earth, how are you going to argue some body jobs being saved, I dont care if you are rep or dem if its look like you are going to be kicked out in the streets you could care less where the money comes from.
Now you have satan himself Rick S. bashing Obama for telling people to go to college, what planet to the far right come from? this man is trying take America back to the 19th century, then you have the iditot Dick Morris on Sean the 3 times college drop out Hannity saying Obama is going to lose in a land slide, the same idiot who said Obama will lose to MCcain, but idiots on the right watch these nut bags and say they are reporting fair and balance news, what does this tell you about their viewers?
St Simons - we're on Island Thug time
February 28th, 2012
2:56 pm
Mitt Rmoney – “let them go bankrupt”
this cycle’s “let em eat cake”
never…live…it…down…
I swear, he’s like Boy Blunder & Dan Quayle, with hair gel
(ir)Rational
February 28th, 2012
2:57 pm
Adam – Thank you, thank you. I’ll be here all week, and don’t forget to tip your waiters.
Thulsa Doom
February 28th, 2012
2:57 pm
“Given the success of the bailout”
The taxpayers have been paid back all of the billions from GM? I was not aware of that.
ByteMe - Liberal Thug
February 28th, 2012
2:57 pm
I wouldn’t call TARP successful until it’s all been paid back
All the while moaning about the government’s continued ownership of these companies while they wait for their stock prices to appreciate? No thanks. Not buying what you’re selling. Get them stabilized and get out and consider it an “investment” in getting people back to work.
ty webb
February 28th, 2012
2:59 pm
“gm”(the commenter appearing at 2:56, not the auto co.) speaks well for the democrat party. I can think of no other person who exemplifies the intellect of the left…Kudos!..resist you much.
ByteMe - Liberal Thug
February 28th, 2012
3:02 pm
Any Rightwingnutistan resident willing to go on record as saying they would have supported Obama for letting GM and Chrysler fail and putting a million more people out of work?
Thulsa Doom
February 28th, 2012
3:03 pm
“We are producing and exporting oil in record numbers,”
Butch Cassidy,
I’m not sure about that. We may in fact be exporting in record numbers but I thought we were only at a 10 year high in terms of domestic production and that if you look at the 20 year high in production we are at roughly 70% of the alltime high in production. Not sure but it seems that’s what I heard that in news on CNN or Faux news.
ty webb
February 28th, 2012
3:04 pm
I would have supported both Bush and Obama letting GM and Chrysler declare bankruptcy.
Butch Cassidy
February 28th, 2012
3:04 pm
ByteMe – Liberal Thug – “Any Rightwingnutistan resident willing to go on record as saying they would have supported Obama for letting GM and Chrysler fail and putting a million more people out of work?”
I don’t know why they wouldn’t. Afterall, those people losing their jobs would have been union workers, not REAL Americans.
F. Sinkwich
February 28th, 2012
3:06 pm
Oh, good.
Do I still have to pay $7,500 to every doofus who buys a POS Volt?
Butch Cassidy
February 28th, 2012
3:06 pm
ty webb- “I would have supported both Bush and Obama letting GM and Chrysler declare bankruptcy.”
Excellent. Don’t forget to pick up your Patriotic American Flag Snuggie and Hannity doll as you exit the lobby.
Bruno
February 28th, 2012
3:07 pm
And also completely ineffective at producing said results, as the past few decades of ramping up production and reducing dependency (increasing supply, reducing demand) can easily demonstrate.
Adam, et. al.–The reason you don’t see any posts from me regarding gas prices in a political context is that we’re dealing with a finite resource and an ever-increasing demand world-wide. So prices pretty much only have one direction to go: up. The only issue is how quickly. Too steep of an increase would wreak havoc on our economy due to our dependence on the trucking industry to bring our goods to us. As such, I’m fine with the govt. facilitating private industry. Which is a far cry from Joe Mama’s mumbo-jumbo @ 2:55.
One of these days, “alternative” fuel sources will be cheaper than gas. Until that day comes, no need for all the hand-wringing.
Butch Cassidy
February 28th, 2012
3:07 pm
Thulsa Doom – “Seemed like I heard that term more often in the brokerage industry than anywhere else in life.”
Is that a surprise coming from me? You know where I spent my career.
Midori
February 28th, 2012
3:08 pm
Hi Paul
got your food stamps yet?
I understand Obama sent them to all us on this blog, courtesy of Federal Express.
Joe Hussein Mama
February 28th, 2012
3:08 pm
F. Sinkiewicz — “Do I still have to pay $7,500 to every doofus who buys a POS Volt?”
I’m going to go buy one just so I can get in your wallet.
Peadawg
February 28th, 2012
3:08 pm
“I would have supported both Bush and Obama letting GM and Chrysler declare bankruptcy.”
What about the banks that were bailed out? Were you in favor of them going bankrupt too? Just curious…answer honestly please.
kayaker 71
February 28th, 2012
3:08 pm
Paul,
I would rather buy 40 dollar toilet seats than spend one dime of taxpayer money making fanatic Muslims happier. Sure, we do need cuts in the military budget but a soccer field? Even the Democratic pundits on Fox were laughing. There is no possible way that you can spin this into something positive. Just another bad decision…. there have been a wealth of them in the last three years.
Redneck Convert (R--and proud of it)
February 28th, 2012
3:08 pm
Well, I got to admit I had a selfish reason to oppose that bailout. I wanted GM and Chrysler to go down hard and take all the suppliers with them. See, when millions of people are out of work they get depressed. And when people get depressed they drink. And when they drink they buy lots of beer. And when they buy lots of beer my 401k beer stock shoots thru the roof.
So I guess it’s more than just letting Free Innerprize work and sticking it to the auto unions. So shoot me. It ain’t as tho I’m the only Republican that wants to make a little money from other peoples misery. If Drs. and insurance co. can make a mint from people being sick I reckon it won’t kill anybody for a beer truck driver to fatten his 401k.
Have a good p.m. everybody.
DebbieDoRight
February 28th, 2012
3:08 pm
ir(Rational): DDR – NO! If he is constipated, does that mean he is full of sh*t?
Aren’t ALL of them?
Joe Hussein Mama
February 28th, 2012
3:09 pm
Bruno — ” Which is a far cry from Joe Mama’s mumbo-jumbo @ 2:55.”
Your concession is noted and appreciated.
Butch Cassidy
February 28th, 2012
3:09 pm
F. Sinkwhich – “Do I still have to pay $7,500 to every doofus who buys a POS Volt?”
Only if you don’t pay me back the tax money that went toward the SUV credits under Bush.
ty webb
February 28th, 2012
3:09 pm
yes, peadawg, the banks too.
Thulsa Doom
February 28th, 2012
3:09 pm
Irrational,
I already told you its W who has the secret computer with levers and buttons that push the price of oil up and down depending on how much his oil buddies want to screw us from day to day. Me and my merry band of ruffians are going to steal it back as an act of patriotism. We want even you libs to have cheap gas.
Steve - USA (I support "None Of The Above")
February 28th, 2012
3:09 pm
Jimmy62@2:40
Spot on. You better be ready for a massive spin of those facts in 1…2…
Joseph
February 28th, 2012
3:09 pm
http://blog.heritage.org/2012/02/27/obamacares-top-5-broken-promises/
ByteMe - Liberal Thug
February 28th, 2012
3:10 pm
We may in fact be exporting in record numbers but I thought we were only at a 10 year high in terms of domestic production
This is true. Highest since 2003, I just read.
But we have more rigs drilling for oil in the Gulf and elsewhere.
So think about this: we have more places we’re drilling, but less oil being produced. Why is that? Not enough in the ground? The oil companies don’t want to put the supply on the market which might lower the price? Not sure.
Joe Hussein Mama
February 28th, 2012
3:10 pm
K71 — “I would rather buy 40 dollar toilet seats than spend one dime of taxpayer money making fanatic Muslims happier.”
Clearly you haven’t been to Home Depot lately.
Erwin's cat
February 28th, 2012
3:11 pm
Butch – be sure to tell your boss to pay you in prestige instead of dollars…it’s worth more
ByteMe - Liberal Thug
February 28th, 2012
3:11 pm
Thank you for going on record, ty. I’m sure you’ll be hearing about it from everyone else for the next year at least
Butch Cassidy
February 28th, 2012
3:11 pm
Joseph – “http://blog.heritage.org/2012/02/27/obamacares-top-5-broken-promises/”
Dude, the Heritage Foundation is to the Right as the Huffington Post is to the Left, and neither carries much credibility when looking for the truth.
barking frog
February 28th, 2012
3:13 pm
It’s not that the white house is not
white, It’s that the white house is not
right.
Butch Cassidy
February 28th, 2012
3:13 pm
Erwin’s cat – “Butch – be sure to tell your boss to pay you in prestige instead of dollars…it’s worth more”
Actually, being retired from the Financial industry, I’m pretty familiar with how much prestige you can get by being a BSD.
(ir)Rational
February 28th, 2012
3:14 pm
DDR – Well, at least two of them are. I have it on good authority that Newt enjoys a nice enema from time to time. (I’m going to have to jump off a high building to erase that image from my head)
Thulsa – Obviously, we’re both joking, but you cross the line when you lump me in with the liberals. I’m just not a republican. I am conservative, and I will never again associate myself with a party because I think for myself. It enables me to see where some people have done good when I might not agree with them on anything else (and the opposite of that too). Anyway, since you crossed the line, I challenge you to a duel. As the challenged party, I believe you have the right to choose weapons.
ByteMe - Liberal Thug
February 28th, 2012
3:14 pm
Peadawg: I would have been happier to put the banks through the same process as was done with GM and Chrysler. Fire their boards, kill off the stock and give the bondholders a big haircut, right-size their assets to something that’s not TBTF, and then spin them back out to the open market as an IPO after resolving the legal issues behind the massive mortgage and securities fraud they engaged in.
Thulsa Doom
February 28th, 2012
3:14 pm
Butch Cassidy,
I notice sherriff Bookman took my comment about the big swinging thingie into moderation land. My years in the brokerage industry were the only times I heard that term- and we heard it often. And if you opened a whale or were at the top in gross you certainly did strut around the bullpen like the big swinging thingie that you were for the day.
Bruno
February 28th, 2012
3:14 pm
Get them stabilized and get out and consider it an “investment” in getting people back to work.
Butch–The govt has no place being part-owner of any industry.
Per the union’s culpability in bankrupting GM and Chrysler, don’t some of you think that an average cost per employee of somewhere around $75 per hour might put a little strain on a company??
ByteMe - Liberal Thug
February 28th, 2012
3:15 pm
Butch: the Heritage Foundation… weren’t they the ones who said that healthcare should be restructured by requiring everyone to pay insurance… you know, a mandate?
Erwin's cat
February 28th, 2012
3:15 pm
and how does letting GM file bankruptcy equal losing millions of jobs?
Butch Cassidy
February 28th, 2012
3:16 pm
Thulsa Doom – “And if you opened a whale or were at the top in gross you certainly did strut around the bullpen like the big swinging thingie that you were for the day.”
Exactly, you didn’t think I spent my career opening “super saver” accounts for widows did you?
ByteMe - Liberal Thug
February 28th, 2012
3:16 pm
don’t some of you think that an average cost per employee of somewhere around $75 per hour might put a little strain on a company??
Don’t you think that their management might have had something to do with that labor contract?
Thulsa Doom
February 28th, 2012
3:17 pm
“Anyway, since you crossed the line, I challenge you to a duel. As the challenged party, I believe you have the right to choose weapons.”
I choose my big swinging thingie. You can borrow Butch Cassidy’s if you don’t have one. He’s probably got a really big one if he retired from the brokerage industry.
TaxPayer
February 28th, 2012
3:17 pm
Given the sentiments of the devout followers of the Republican faith that post here, I see no alternative for the GOP candidates but to continue to cut their own throats for votes. Works for me.
Bernie
February 28th, 2012
3:17 pm
Mullah Rick, Richie Rich Mitt, and Newt the Poot have all taken a big Bite ot the Republican Dumb Dumb
Sandwich and now they expectect the American People to do it again. I am sorry, The leadership of the RepublicanParty has failed on so many levels along with the misadventures of W. has taken its toll on a great Country that was the envy of the world.
gm
February 28th, 2012
3:17 pm
kayaker 71
Yea fox now theres a true source, the same fox that said Obama was going to lose in 2008, now we know why you are a misinformed bottle of hate screw ball.
Democratic pundits on Fox those are Democratics those are people who are rep but to get on tv they have to lie and say they are Dem, wow that Sean Hannity really know how to research I guess after 4 colleges of droping out makes him a ringer.
(ir)Rational
February 28th, 2012
3:17 pm
ByteMe – Why, it occurs to me that you could be correct. And apparently Forbes agrees:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/aroy/2011/10/20/how-a-conservative-think-tank-invented-the-individual-mandate/
ByteMe - Liberal Thug
February 28th, 2012
3:18 pm
irR: but but but, isn’t Forbes part of the liberal media elite???
(ir)Rational
February 28th, 2012
3:19 pm
Thulsa – I was just planning to hurt you, not kill you.
Jeff
February 28th, 2012
3:19 pm
Keep barking about how Republicans equal free gas. Most Democrat voters are at an intelligence level that will believe that. Maybe we’ll get their votes,
(ir)Rational
February 28th, 2012
3:19 pm
ByteMe – I honestly have no idea (and I’m not playing dense here).
Joe Hussein Mama
February 28th, 2012
3:19 pm
Bruno — “Per the union’s culpability in bankrupting GM and Chrysler, don’t some of you think that an average cost per employee of somewhere around $75 per hour might put a little strain on a company??”
If management *agreed* to it, then how’s that the union’s fault?
Butch Cassidy
February 28th, 2012
3:19 pm
(ir)Rational – “And apparently Forbes agrees:”
Forbes? Well you know what a left wing leaning, communist, socialistic manifesto rag that publication is.
Thulsa Doom
February 28th, 2012
3:19 pm
“Exactly, you didn’t think I spent my career opening “super saver” accounts for widows did you?”
No pikers in Butch Cassidy’s book.
Doggone/GA
February 28th, 2012
3:21 pm
“I notice sherriff Bookman took my comment about the big swinging thingie into moderation land”
Are you REALLY so damn arrogant as to think you’re SO important that Jay has nothing better to do than sit around on the off chance you MIGHT post something stupid? You got caught by the blue-nosed bitch, an AUTOMATED system. You’ve spelled something on the no-no list, or used a no-no word.
Try again, maybe you can be less stupid and it’ll go through this time.
(ir)Rational
February 28th, 2012
3:23 pm
Butch and ByteMe – I’m going to go out on a limb and guess that Forbes is more right leaning?
DebbieDoRight
February 28th, 2012
3:23 pm
“It was certainly successful for the unions, for the taxpayers, not so much
Aren’t the people in Unions taxpayers too? Duh!
Adam: For every 1% increase in union membership among the workforce, the wages of EVERY employee, union or non union, rises by about $156/year on average. Look it up, and weep
That’s what “The Man” doesn’t like!! If we make more money then we can afford to do things like move into better neighborhoods….
….which has better school districts…..
….which would make our kids smarter and more likely to attend college…….
…..which would DEPLETE the slave labor pool!!!
Duh!
Goldie
February 28th, 2012
3:23 pm
Thank God we have President Obama and the Dems in the White House, saving Americans from the Repub’s scorch-n-burn policies!
getalife
February 28th, 2012
3:24 pm
Did our sc vote on corporate immunity yet?
5-4 ?
Thulsa Doom
February 28th, 2012
3:24 pm
Irational,
I don’t wanna get hurt. May have to address you going forward as “Mr. deep thinking independent voice of dissent”.
Butch Cassidy
February 28th, 2012
3:25 pm
(ir)Rational – “Butch and ByteMe – I’m going to go out on a limb and guess that Forbes is more right leaning?”
I think so, but watch Steve Forbes on Fox sometime and draw your own conlusion. : )
Erwin's cat
February 28th, 2012
3:25 pm
Doggone @3:21
..true story
Reminds me of a conversation I overheard at a recent international meeting…An American asked a Frenchman…Why do the French hate America so much? The Frenchman: You Americans are so arrogant, what makes you think you are so important that we hate only you?
Butch Cassidy
February 28th, 2012
3:25 pm
Oops conclusion.
yuzeyurbrane
February 28th, 2012
3:26 pm
They are in their own bubble, oblivious to reality.
(ir)Rational
February 28th, 2012
3:27 pm
DDR – Well, if you live in Atlanta, you don’t have to live in a good neighborhood to go to a good school. They’ll just redistrict you and put you in one. And that isn’t meant to be offensive to anyone, just speaking the truth. My neighborhood just (well, is in the process) got redistricted from E. Rivers to Bolton Academy. Now when the children on my street go to school in the morning they have to pass one elementary school to get to another. I don’t know why exactly, but that’s what the city decided.
ByteMe - Liberal Thug
February 28th, 2012
3:27 pm
irR: Steve Forbes ran for Republican nomination in 1996 and 2000 and supported Rick Perry this year.
(ir)Rational
February 28th, 2012
3:28 pm
Thulsa – I was just suggesting picking a different weapon, but that works too.
Butch – I don’t typically watch Fox News, simply because when I sit down and want to watch the news, they’re doing commentary.