When the bluster fades, this is Newt Gingrich
I didn’t watch last night’s umpteenth Republican presidential debate. I had a prior commitment with some poker-playing friends, although given the night’s outcome, watching the debate would have been a smarter financial option on my part.
By all accounts, Mitt Romney again took on the role of aggressor against Newt Gingrich, and Gingrich again shrank from the confrontation.
As Politico describes it, Gingrich “simply seemed worn out and off point. Gone was the brawler who could whip up the crowd. And it’s not quite clear where he went… he did not seem to be enjoying the heat of battle as in past debates.”
At one point, Gingrich reportedly tried to rebut a Romney attack by complaining to Mitt that “you’re very quick to draw the widest possible exaggeration,” which is truly priceless considering the source. I’m sorry I missed that moment.
The Washington Post was no more kind in its after-action report, concluding that “Gingrich was just plain off his game … looked less prepared and never really recovered.“
None of that surprises me. A strong showing in this last Florida debate was crucial to Gingrich, whose post-South Carolina momentum has faded in recent days. He needed another strong, aggressive showing and did not produce it, but that is consistent with his history.
At heart, Gingrich is a bully who backs down when confronted. He likes to challenge members of the media in public, safe in the knowledge that their profession does not allow them to return fire. He is well-skilled at creating and then dismantling strawmen. And he is supremely confident when he senses that he has succeeded in intimidating his target.
But when the critical moment comes, he deflates. As speaker, he shrunk from Bill Clinton, to the point that his aides and lieutenants didn’t want to have them in the same room lest a passive Gingrich agree to too much. In these debates, once Romney decided to fight back aggressively, Newt has repeatedly retreated. In the previous debate, he was left speechless and flustered by a pressing Romney, and apparently he still hasn’t recovered his bluster.
When asked last night to discuss his campaign-trail attacks on Romney’s bank accounts in Switzerland and the Caymans, Newt pulled a Pawlenty, explaining that “I’m perfectly happy to say that in an interview on some TV show, but this is a national debate where you have a chance to get the four of us to talk about a whole range of issues.”
To which Romney responded:
“Wouldn’t it be nice if people didn’t make accusations somewhere else that they weren’t willing to defend here?”
If and when the time came, Gingrich would have done the same when pitted against Barack Obama. In baseball, they say that a player is what his numbers say he is.
This is who Gingrich is.
– Jay Bookman
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674 comments Add your comment
stands for decibels
January 27th, 2012
2:54 pm
But the fact that they have destroyed property (did you see what happened in Oakland?)
The port occupation is about the only incident of note (although there had been a tremendous amount of provocation on the part of the police prior to it) but I will give you that one.
md
January 27th, 2012
2:54 pm
“How long would it take if you saved $20 out of every paycheck for you to have 6 months worth of salary.”
Hmmm……..does it matter how long it would take??
That is the point……something saved is better than nothing saved……..and THAT my friend is a choice.
Erwin's cat
January 27th, 2012
2:55 pm
Adam – “How long would it take if you saved $20 out of every paycheck for you to have 6 months worth of salary”
208 years by your criteria….but i did it in 2
Thulsa Doom
January 27th, 2012
2:56 pm
Adam,
No one is missing the point Adam. You simply take what you earn and live within 80 or 90% of what you earn and save the rest. It may mean downgrading and driving a paid off beater of a car instead of that new Infiniti. Or not dining out as much. Or getting a $100 smart phone instead of a $500 I-phone. Or if you’re young you simply get a 2nd part time job working 15-20 hours a week and save that money and live off of the money you earn from your regular job. There is no law against working 60 hours a week although I know people who have it ingrained in their psyche that its somehow imoral, a violation of labor laws, or just plain crazy to have to work over 40 hours a week. And those people aren’t very successful either.
YOUR party SUCKS! But MINE is GRRRRRREAT! (formerly That Black Guy)
January 27th, 2012
2:56 pm
Mick
January 27th, 2012
11:03 am
Guys – I merely mention that mr. fiscal conservative is not a shining example of his politics. Also, he has missed a few payments, maybe all of us should be writing books…
Someone has not read the retractions to that story. Kinda get’s in the way of the hate.
http://www.politico.com/blogs/media/2012/01/reuters-staff-call-rubio-story-fiasco-disgrace-112574.html
http://articles.businessinsider.com/2012-01-26/politics/30665882_1_home-equity-line-payment-party-credit-card
Adam
January 27th, 2012
2:57 pm
md: Hmmm……..does it matter how long it would take??
Yes, because your point is people should do this before they enter into a loan agreement.
St Simons - the real life Andy Dufresne
January 27th, 2012
2:57 pm
when the bluster fades, this is the neocon ideology
(ir)Rational
January 27th, 2012
2:58 pm
jewcowboy – Part of me agrees, but the majority of me says the premise is ridiculous. Why shouldn’t the company try and make money? They have a duty to their board and shareholders to do so. Even so, Mitch Daniels has a point. From the numbers I’ve seen, Steve Jobs (FYI, not just responsible for Apple) created more jobs here than the Stimulus did.
Adam
January 27th, 2012
2:59 pm
Doom: It may mean downgrading and driving a paid off beater of a car instead of that new Infiniti. Or not dining out as much. Or getting a $100 smart phone instead of a $500 I-phone. Or if you’re young you simply get a 2nd part time job working 15-20 hours a week and save that money and live off of the money you earn from your regular job.
All of your examples except the last one make an assumption that every single family is splurging somewhere significantly, which is not the kind of family I am talking about. Your last example assumes too much about typical youth, using an upper middle class youngster as an example (because let’s face it, the poor kids have enough trouble getting people to hire them for ONE part time job).
barking frog
January 27th, 2012
3:00 pm
The snark has pretty teeth dear
when it shows them pearly white
but when the snark bites with his teeth dear
you can really feel the bite..(tune of Mack the Knife)
Adam
January 27th, 2012
3:01 pm
Erwin: To save 6 months of salary in two years requires (assuming no other variables) 25% of each paycheck. You are fortunate that you can apply that much of your paycheck towards savings. Most families do not have that same capability.
jewcowboy
January 27th, 2012
3:02 pm
Thulsa Doom,
“That’s some good sarcasm. And it didn’t need the spoken word. A great example of what I’m talking about. Thanks jewcowboy.”
As I pointed out to (ir)Rational, I try to make my snark overt. If you do it subtlety, you run the risk of being misinterpreted.
barking frog
January 27th, 2012
3:04 pm
Ahh but jcb, misinterpretation often leads to more opportunity
for snarkism…
Adam
January 27th, 2012
3:07 pm
jewcowboy: If you do it subtlety, you run the risk of being misinterpreted.
Or if you later claim you were joking, for whatever reason, when you weren’t….
jewcowboy
January 27th, 2012
3:08 pm
(ir)Rational,
“Why shouldn’t the company try and make money?”
They should. But they also have (at least historically) had a responsibility to support the country they call home as a symbiosis. The country that provides them the opportunity to exist and thrive, should also receive the lion’s share of the benefit of their existence.
Many people still think this way: http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/gadgets/news/4249332
barking frog
January 27th, 2012
3:11 pm
jcb, kinda like US taxpayers having to bail out GM while
Georgia taxpayers were paying Kia 40 million to build
a plant for Alabama workers and not trying to help keep
GM in Atlanta.
Erwin's cat
January 27th, 2012
3:13 pm
Adam – “To save 6 months of salary in two years requires (assuming no other variables) 25% of each paycheck. You are fortunate that you can apply that much of your paycheck towards savings. Most families do not have that same capability.”
Yes Adam in some ways I am fortunate and Blessed, but lets not forget, it was the choices and sacrifices I’ve made in the past that have put me in the position to do such things today
Common Sense
January 27th, 2012
3:14 pm
I have just a few minutes and want to know how we went from Newt dissappearing to saving 6 mos. salary? Because I know when the bluster fades Newt is gone since he is only bluster, but what does that have to do with my savings? Are the cons trying to get everybody off topic again?
(ir)Rational
January 27th, 2012
3:16 pm
jewcowboy – Not everyone sees it that way, and like I said, Steve Jobs was responsible for much more than just Apple.
Hillary Fan
January 27th, 2012
3:17 pm
I hope she runs in 2012 against Obama.
Obama is a poor choice. If the Democratic party had considered Ted Kennedy instead of Carter, Reagan might never have happened.
(ir)Rational
January 27th, 2012
3:17 pm
barking frog – Everyone who works in the Kia plant is from Alabama? Huh, wasn’t aware. You got a source for that, or is it just hyperbole?
moonbat betty
January 27th, 2012
3:19 pm
Saving 6 mo. salary is a much more worthy topic than b!tching about not liking Newt.
And on sarcasm…
Yesterday, Kamchak wished that tornadoes would come through and kill me!
I cried all night
(ir)Rational
January 27th, 2012
3:20 pm
sfd – I wasn’t even talking about the port, but that did remind me. I thought they were supposed to be “for the little guy.” When they shut down the port, my brother-in-law missed about a week’s worth of work because they couldn’t get parts to continue building cars at the Honda plant in Alabama.
Kamchak
January 27th, 2012
3:21 pm
Yesterday, Kamchak wished that tornadoes would come through and kill me!
No, I warned you that inclement weather was headed our way and it wouldn’t bode well for you if a house was to fall upon you.
Hillary Fan
January 27th, 2012
3:21 pm
Hillary has the guts to make tough decisions. Obama doesn’t.
Think about that.
jewcowboy
January 27th, 2012
3:22 pm
md,
“100% of entertainment is a want, 10+% is “all other”…..not sure how that one breaks down…..and the jump to transportation which states all households with 2 cars……then factor in housing as a choice vs a need and what percentage is necessities?”
First of all, I don’t know what world you live in, but “100% of entertainment: is not a want. I’m not going to get into specific percentages, but unless you want people jumping in front of trains and off of buildings, the human being as a species needs entertain.
“10+% is “all other”…..not sure how that one breaks down” ~ Since it is isn’t broken down, I would say it would probably include things like cc payments, presents, a new sofa, etc. But I really don’t know and the article doesn’t clarify it.
“and the jump to transportation which states all households with 2 cars” ~ For many households, two cars is not a choice, but a need. You can argue that for some it is a choice, but that is not what my original point was.
“then factor in housing as a choice vs a need” ~ I for one need housing. Their average is $1400 a month. The average 3 br apt in Atlanta is $1,592. http://www.mynewplace.com/city/atlanta-apartments-for-rent-georgia
RB from Gwinnett
January 27th, 2012
3:23 pm
You’re entitled to what you’re willing to work for and nothing more.
Steve - USA (I support "None Of The Above")
January 27th, 2012
3:23 pm
(mostly)Rational,
Thank God you saved and had money when your wife lost your job. That is the whole point of saving, life has ups and downs and you have to survive the downs. You can’t just live on the edge and hope for the best. Of course there are people who struggle to stay ahead their whole life but I just don’t buy this attitude that is the majority.
I guess I feel strongly about this because I changed my attitude about money and I am a little over the top like a reformed smoker. When I was in my second year of marriage I was doing my taxes and it dawned on me that we had made $75,000+ combined and I had like $1.23 in my checking account. My wife came from a family that spent everything they had and never saved anything. Not all of that was by situation, they just spent money on crap and stayed poor their whole life.
My wife and I decided to try and save. Like as Adam says children because we each threw 5 bucks into the box every Saturday. After just getting a couple hundred in there my wife got excited about saving. We got to to point we were each putting in $250 a week into saving. Everyone thought we were crazy, why save money when I could lease a Beamer like they did?
My wife still drives her 2000 Accord because she loves it and it runs great. Adam see’s a world where everyone is a victim and I just don’t see it that way. I see plenty of people in Georgia living way, way over there heads. Did the middle class get wiped out or did it commit suicide by trying to live like millionares. I bought my first investment home before I bought my own home.
When I moved to Georgia I didn’t buy the max house I could buy, I bought a modest one. My wife got very ill and neither of us worked for 4 years while I cared for her. The insurance cost us $1500 a month the last year. Saving and living a debt free life is what got us through until the Dr’s.at Emory did two 9 hour brain surgeries to give her back the life she had before.
I am sick of hearing people claim people they have no control over their own damn situation.
Rant over.
moonbat betty
January 27th, 2012
3:24 pm
Hillary- Strong enough for a man, but made for a woman
barking frog
January 27th, 2012
3:24 pm
(ir)rational, http://www.nationalenquirer.com/
josef
January 27th, 2012
3:24 pm
Well, so Jay didn’t watch the debate either, eh? Everybody deserves a day off. I know I was in last night and didn’t say anything about it, but I betcha I had some excitement not many of y’all have had. When’s the last time you were put in neighborhood lock-down stay inside by Homeland Security and all concerned?
359 more days
January 27th, 2012
3:25 pm
Jay and the rest of the blog,,
Why all the hate? Why all the half truths?
Doesn’t your choice for POTUS have a good enough record that would not require the type of hatred that is spewed out on this blog? It is just like negative ads? If you can’t run on your own accomplishments, then don’t run.
I realize the hatred comes from both sides of the aisle, and I for one would like to see it end, but I know that won’t happen, human nature won’t let it.
I was recently advised by an avid liberal that I owed respect to the current POTUS, just becasue of his office, he may be right, but. I also think that respect is something that you earn.
moonbat betty
January 27th, 2012
3:25 pm
I’m gonna wash that man right outta my hair!
~Hillary Clinton
josef
January 27th, 2012
3:25 pm
Savings…Granddaddy’s Golden Rule of finance…pay yourself first…
Thulsa Doom
January 27th, 2012
3:25 pm
jewcowboy,
I appreciate a good snark. Even one at my expense and your one directed at me about voice and tone had me roaring.
I think you’re right about some of mine. They probably need to be a lot more overt as they go right over the heads of some on here.
Matti
January 27th, 2012
3:26 pm
josef,
Please expound.
Kamchak
January 27th, 2012
3:28 pm
Adam see’s a world where everyone is a victim…
Why don’t you let Adam describe what he sees, sport rather than attribute views to someone other than yourself.
md
January 27th, 2012
3:28 pm
“Between then and now, I managed to save about 4 months salary and then spend it all when my wife lost her job a couple of years back.”
No, by your and Adam’s reasoning, you shouldn’t have saved the 4 months……..
jewcowboy
January 27th, 2012
3:28 pm
Thulsa Doom,
“There is no law against working 60 hours a week although I know people who have it ingrained in their psyche that its somehow imoral, a violation of labor laws, or just plain crazy to have to work over 40 hours a week.”
I can’t remember, but someone posted this before: http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/10/12/1025555/-Open-Letter-to-that-53-Guy
I think this about sums it up for me:
“If a family could live a good life with one wage-earner working a 40-hour job, then the American Dream was realized. If the income from that job could pay the bills, buy a car, pay for the kids’ braces, allow the family to save enough money for a down payment on a house and still leave some money for retirement and maybe for a college fund for the kids, then we were living the American Dream. ”
“We can have a reasonable standard for what level of work qualifies you for the American Dream, and work to build a society that realizes that dream, or we can chew each other to the bone in a nightmare of merciless competition and mutual contempt.”
“Look kid, I don’t want you to “get by” working two jobs and 60 to 70 hours a week. If you’re willing to put in that kind of effort, I want you to get rich. I want you to have a comprehensive healthcare plan. I want you vacationing in the Bahamas every couple of years, with your beautiful wife and healthy, happy kids. I want you rewarded for your hard work, and I want your exceptional effort to reap exceptional rewards. I want you to accumulate wealth and invest it in Wall Street. And I want you to make more money from those investments.”
Hillary Fan
January 27th, 2012
3:29 pm
359
Hillary has earned America’s respect as a good leader.
Obama has been, shall we say, comparatively spineless. He can’t even get the respect of idiotic AZ governor Jan Brewer. Much less the despotic tyrants of the world.
Doggone/GA
January 27th, 2012
3:29 pm
“Please expound”
It’s a basic principle of fiscal soundness. Decide how much you need to save, put that amount in savings FIRST…and then make your spending choices on what you have left.
Steve - USA (I support "None Of The Above")
January 27th, 2012
3:29 pm
Kamchak,
Why don’t STFU instead of making snarky comments all day. Guess what sport, I am not joking.
Matti
January 27th, 2012
3:30 pm
Um…. I meant about the lock-down thing, but thanks for assuming I don’t have two GD brain cells to rub together.
Kamchak
January 27th, 2012
3:31 pm
Awww, poor wittle Stevie-poo got his tender feefees all hurted.
jewcowboy
January 27th, 2012
3:31 pm
(ir)Rational,
“From the numbers I’ve seen, Steve Jobs (FYI, not just responsible for Apple) created more jobs here than the Stimulus did.”
Interesting read:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/bretswanson/2012/01/27/steve-jobs-jobs-vs-jobs/
JOE Cool
January 27th, 2012
3:31 pm
“Hillary has the guts to make tough decisions”
Like which decisions?
Steve - USA (I support "None Of The Above")
January 27th, 2012
3:32 pm
Kamchak,
Poor little Kammie is living in poverty and life isn’t fair. Boo hoo
Corey
January 27th, 2012
3:32 pm
Since most of us don’t stay on topic. I need not apologize for starying off topic. But I digress. If you research the Stimulus pie chart you will see that the biggest single slice was for tax cuts- 275 billion, which has been showing up in our pay checks since the passage of the stimulus. The second biggest slice was for an increase in medicaid matching rate- 87 billion, followed by aid to states for fiscal relief 79 billion. What perplexes me is that Republicans always cheer for tax cuts, and while the bigest single portion of the stimuls was tax cuts they deride the stimulus. Notice, the second biggest slice of the stimuls (87 billion) was not even half the size of the tax cut portion of the stimulus (276 billion). Also notice that the third largest portion of the stimulus – aid to state governments – was bemoaned primarily by red state governors in front of the cameras, but they happily fed at stimulus trough when the cameras were not around. Republican voters, do you ever notice the hypocrisy spewed by the people you vote for not even a wee bit?
josef
January 27th, 2012
3:32 pm
irRational
“Adam – I find it weird, you and I have been agreeing more and more recently. Is it just that you’re getting smarter or that the people here are getting crazier?”
Nyanh…our children are just growing up right before our very eyes…
Joe Hussein Mama
January 27th, 2012
3:32 pm
359 — “I was recently advised by an avid liberal that I owed respect to the current POTUS, just becasue of his office, he may be right, but. I also think that respect is something that you earn.”
I was and am right. You owe respect to the President, whether you like him personally or not.
And whether you find it ludicrous and unbelievable or not, yes, I always referred to President Bush as “President Bush,” “the President,” “Mr. Bush” and (in some cases) “President Bush (the younger).”
Serious people who have serious arguments to make and who want to be treated seriously will BEHAVE as if they want to be taken seriously. And that means treating the office of the Presidency with respect, even if you don’t like the guy who happens to be serving in it just then.
jewcowboy
January 27th, 2012
3:32 pm
barking frog,
“The snark has pretty teeth dear”
JOE Cool
January 27th, 2012
3:33 pm
I see “Calender Boy” has showed up…..
Common Sense isn't very Common
January 27th, 2012
3:33 pm
Josef – In lockdown? someone report you to ICE? Did they tell them you were from NEW Mexico
md
January 27th, 2012
3:33 pm
“Yes, because your point is people should do this before they enter into a loan agreement.”
And this is what happens when one assumes or has a bad day with interpretations…….
If you care to go back to the original statement, I merely said financial planners recommend a 6 month emergency fund………..must have been in your head that it was linked to “before entering into a loan agreement”………for I never said any such thing.
Erwin's cat
January 27th, 2012
3:34 pm
Corey – do you really think the right has a monopoly on hypocrisy?
Thulsa Doom
January 27th, 2012
3:34 pm
“All of your examples except the last one make an assumption that every single family is splurging somewhere significantly, which is not the kind of family I am talking about.”
Adam, I understand that but I’m just saying that I know a lot of families who complain to me that they can’t really afford to save or spend money on cheap term insurance or on health insurance which I do agree is very expensive. But they’ll tell me this with 2 brand new cars sitting in the driveway of a 400k house. To me its about priorities and from what I’ve seen in my everyday experiences a lot of people don’t have the right priorities. Conversely I have seen people cutting expenses to the bone that are barely making it. And those people I really do feel for. And I spend some time trying to find ways to help them. I have a lady I have to call after 7 tonight, a Friday night, because I want her to know about some various charities and options to help her cancer stricken husband get some help with his meds. I’m just saying I see some people who really do struggle but more often I see people just making poor choices.
“Your last example assumes too much about typical youth, using an upper middle class youngster as an example (because let’s face it, the poor kids have enough trouble getting people to hire them for ONE part time job)”.
I don’t know if I agree with that. Seems there are plenty of youngsters who traveled 3,000 miles with little cash and only the clothes on their back, who can’t even speak English, who seem to be able to find jobs here. Why can’t our youngsters?
josef
January 27th, 2012
3:36 pm
MATTI
Neighbor two doors down came home and found a suspicious package from Afghanistan…not to tell his business, but he’s somebody…in a matter of a few minutes this neighborhood was truly shut down…as my next-door-neighbor said, not quite the way I’d like to have been reassured, but they were here and on the job so quick it made your head spin…
jewcowboy
January 27th, 2012
3:37 pm
josef,
“When’s the last time you were put in neighborhood lock-down stay inside by Homeland Security and all concerned?”
Yowza! What the heck happened?
Thulsa Doom
January 27th, 2012
3:38 pm
md,
Yep. Most recommend a minumum of 3-6 months emergency fund. You should at least have 3 months worth saved up if you can’t get 6 months saved up. And if you have your credit cards paid off as a last resort you can charge some stuff and worry about paying it off later when you get back to work. The problem again is that credit card debt is a norm amongst families not living within their means.
Matti
January 27th, 2012
3:39 pm
josef,
Whoa! That would rattle my nerves for sure! Ack! Is everything okay now?
md
January 27th, 2012
3:39 pm
“First of all, I don’t know what world you live in, but “100% of entertainment: is not a want. I’m not going to get into specific percentages, but unless you want people jumping in front of trains and off of buildings, the human being as a species needs entertain.”
Now you are starting to sound like Adam……..ever heard of a park? or Beach? or hiking in the woods?
All free………won’t cost you a dime.
Choices……..
359 more days
January 27th, 2012
3:40 pm
Joe Hussein Mama
January 27th, 2012
3:32 pm
Thanks for your civil response.
Does the “Respect Thing” also apply to candidates who oppose your leader, or is it right to call them and their familes names………….just wondering
Oh Joe, I see that you are here also, welcome
josef
January 27th, 2012
3:41 pm
Common…
Funny you should say that…one of the neighbors was saying “I thought at first it might be the migra…but they ain’t got them resources!”
Quagmire
January 27th, 2012
3:42 pm
359 and Hillary Fan – actually you are both right
359 days until the re-election of President Barack Obama
Hillary is a great leader, she has done an excellent job for our county and would make a Great President one day. But I think it was President Barack that gave the order to get Osama(remember he said he would during his campaign). How many dictators have falling since he’s been in office puting American soliders or starting a make-believe War.
Peace….going to look at my next wife, Kate Beckinsale
Erwin's cat
January 27th, 2012
3:43 pm
Is … “I respect the office, but not the man”..parallel to “I support the troops, but not the war”?
(ir)Rational
January 27th, 2012
3:44 pm
Steve – I have never said, and you will never hear me say that I have no control over my situation. Having empathy for another’s is something else entirely. I save barely anything if anything at all because I’m living paycheck to paycheck. I bought my house WAY too young (21), but that was a choice I made. Do I have control over my entire situation? No. I can’t find another job (I’ve been looking for the past year and a half), and any jobs I’ve seen open aren’t in Atlanta. Which wouldn’t be a problem except I have responsibilities here, such as my house. Also, my wife is in law school so we can’t really move til she graduates.
As far as my situation, I still drive the car my father-in-law bought my wife when she graduated high school and he didn’t feel comfortable with her driving a ‘89 Camry in Atlanta. I pay for mine and my wife’s insurance out of pocket because I’ve never had a job that offered “benefits.” At least not more than a paycheck. It’s great that you can/could afford to save $250 a week, but I’m doing good to have $5 left over after paying my bills and buying food. If I do have that $5 left over, it goes into the savings account. The choices I’ve made in life have gotten me to where I am, and there aren’t many that I would change. I mean, I guess I could have chosen to not take my wife to the ER when she wouldn’t quit throwing up, and I could still identify what I had cooked two nights prior (including the spices I had used) for dinner in her vomit. Heck, that would have saved me somewhere around $15,000. But what kind of person would I have been if I had done that? I guess what I’m saying is, everyone’s situation is different. You shouldn’t judge people because they can’t save as much as you could.
My rant is over, and I have to leave. Gotta run some errands for work and then I’m heading home for the weekend. May check in later.
jewcowboy
January 27th, 2012
3:44 pm
Thulsa Doom,
“Why can’t our youngsters?”
Perhaps it’s because for the past several generations, parents have been telling thier children that the path to prosperity is through education, and has used as an illustration of failure images of working at McDonald’s or other such jobs.
With that image of failure ingrained in us since birth, is it any wonder younger generations would rather sponge off Mom and Dad than admit “failure” by working one of these jobs?
Hillary Fan
January 27th, 2012
3:45 pm
Hillary is dealing with the European crisis and keeping Obama from screwing everything up with his rhetoric.
See november comments.
jewcowboy
January 27th, 2012
3:46 pm
josef,
“but they were here and on the job so quick it made your head spin…”
That is how you know they weren’t APD.
Adam
January 27th, 2012
3:46 pm
md: No, by your and Adam’s reasoning, you shouldn’t have saved the 4 months…
Would you care to go back and tell me where in my posts I said anything even remotely like that?
What Steve did was admirable. But let’s face it, he came from a place where they were spending a lot on things they didn’t need. It is obvious that in that situation if you can stop yourself from buying the non-essentials then you will certainly be able to save a lot faster, especially if non-essentials are a significant portion of your budget.
But you’re all missing the point. A lot of families do NOT have this problem as much as you think they do (and don’t get me started with how personal experience does NOT trump statistics). If families are, say, spending $10 a week more than they should, then they can sock that $10 away. If their wages and bills stay exactly the same, then so does their ability to save. They cannot suddenly jump from $10 to $250 like a family that has been splurging. These numbers are just examples, but hopefully you get the point. Wages for many families have stayed the same while costs have actually gone up. Because of that, the ability to save is less and less.
If you’re going for personal experience, I save every month. But I also do not have a family and have a number of other atypical issues. My personal experience is basically irrelevant except to say I do not consider myself a victim at all. What I AM saying is that some people are not as fortunate as I am. Some people did not have the same opportunities as me, and thus did not have the same set of choices available to them.
It is always good when someone can be the example of the underdog who rises against all odds but the fact is they rose AGAINST ALL ODDS. The odds being against someone in these types of situations cannot be ignored simply to go “well, all you had to do was save (more money than you possibly could in too short a time frame to survive the global economic crisis anyway).” It’s dishonest to say everyone can follow this rule, or even most people. It’s also immoral to judge people that way without knowing their situation. Heck, even if you think you know their situation you shouldn’t be so judgmental.
But I write stuff like that and the people who have gotten lucky IN ADDITION to making SOME good choices judge everyone else unworthy for not being able to do the same, at the same time, even though the circumstances and available choices are very different. It’s treating the rest of the world like children – a common conservative trait.
Stop it and get a reality check.
md
January 27th, 2012
3:46 pm
“Yes Adam in some ways I am fortunate and Blessed, but lets not forget, it was the choices and sacrifices I’ve made in the past that have put me in the position to do such things today”
One actually has to understand how choices compound to understand your comment……and you are really asking for it to introduce a concept such as sacrifices……….
Joe Hussein Mama
January 27th, 2012
3:47 pm
359 — “Thanks for your civil response.”
It’s certainly more civil than your recent intemperate and ragey responses to me.
“Does the “Respect Thing” also apply to candidates who oppose your leader, or is it right to call them and their familes names………….just wondering”
Depends on the circumstances. If Newt Gingrich weren’t such an aggressive, hypocritical gasbag, I’d probably say the same thing about him as I do about President Obama. I’ve criticized Senator Santorum, Congressman Paul and Congresswoman Bachmann, but to the best of my recollection, I haven’t called any of them names.
I have a pretty special place in my heart for Newt. He was doing pretty much the same thing Bill Clinton was at just about the same time Bill Clinton was doing it, but Newt thinks that President Clinton should have been kicked out of office and Newt thinks he deserves to be *in* office. If that’s the kind of respect he wants to show to the Presidency, then I see no reason to show *him* any respect.
Newt’s skank of a wife, of course, is a different story entirely. As far as I’m concerned, she’s cut from the same stained blue cloth as Monica Lewinsky.
josef
January 27th, 2012
3:47 pm
THULSA
Grandaddy…(1) have on hand in checking/cash three months (2) have in quick access savings 6 months (3) have unemcumbered in readily liquidable investments one year…then you can begin long term investments not to be touched barring exhausting of all other reseources
Lesson one…if you can’t pay cash for it, you can’t afford it
Lesson two…if you have more in the red column than the black column, you’re in trouble
Lesson three…don’t talk about what you have with anybody you don’t share bed, blanket and bathroom
Steve - USA (I support "None Of The Above")
January 27th, 2012
3:48 pm
(ir)Rational,
Thanks for the input. Good luck with the job hunting.
jewcowboy
January 27th, 2012
3:49 pm
md,
“All free………won’t cost you a dime.”
As I said, I won’t squabble over percentages, but you are smoking something if you think you can have entertainment (especially with kids) for free 100% of the time. And what you’re smoking will come out of your entertainment budget, unless you are in CA and have glaucoma.
getalife
January 27th, 2012
3:49 pm
“in a matter of a few minutes this neighborhood was truly shut down”.
Black helicopters?
josef
January 27th, 2012
3:50 pm
jewcowboy
Knew it was big time when the APD was put to traffic control at the entries to the neighborhood and the black SUV boys were directing things down this way…
Joe Hussein Mama
January 27th, 2012
3:51 pm
(ir)Rational — “The choices I’ve made in life have gotten me to where I am, and there aren’t many that I would change. I mean, I guess I could have chosen to not take my wife to the ER when she wouldn’t quit throwing up, and I could still identify what I had cooked two nights prior (including the spices I had used) for dinner in her vomit. Heck, that would have saved me somewhere around $15,000. But what kind of person would I have been if I had done that? I guess what I’m saying is, everyone’s situation is different. You shouldn’t judge people because they can’t save as much as you could.”
I sympathize. My first wife was diagnosed with diabetes about a month after we were married. And with me in the Army, that first year was tough.
Stick with it and stick by each other. Even if you hit a rough patch and things don’t last (and I have every hope for you two that they *will* last), you will still feel better about having done the right things along the way.
josef
January 27th, 2012
3:51 pm
getalife
No helicopters…all on the ground…
getalife
January 27th, 2012
3:52 pm
josef,
What was in the package?
jewcowboy
January 27th, 2012
3:53 pm
josef,
“and the black SUV boys were directing things down this way…”
I remember a couple years ago, being on the Connector, and was passed by 10 black Yukon’s in row. My thought, “That can’t be good.”
md
January 27th, 2012
3:53 pm
“and any jobs I’ve seen open aren’t in Atlanta. Which wouldn’t be a problem except I have responsibilities here, such as my house. Also, my wife is in law school so we can’t really move til she graduates.”
And I would point out that those are choices……not necessarily ones you want to make, but choices none the less.
You actually can move, but you choose not too………that is where the choices come into play.
Steve - USA (I support "None Of The Above")
January 27th, 2012
3:54 pm
Adam,
I actually think we agree more than we might think, the difference may lie in what percentage of people are in each category.
A. People who can improve their own situation with a little sacrifice.
B. People who have nothing to sacrifice.
Perhaps you estimate the number in “A” and I underestimate the number in “B”.
I have to go meet the Queen and do a little walk in the park, enjoy the weekend.
BTW – I forgot who mentioned it but they added some park usage fee’s in our national forest for 2012.
md
January 27th, 2012
3:55 pm
Gee Adam……nice long list of assumptions………all from the statement that financial planners recommend having a 6 month slush fund.
What part of “recommend” do you not understand??
Matti
January 27th, 2012
3:56 pm
The important thing is that we’ll always have people who have never met us and know nothing about our lives and the obstacles we’ve faced, who are willing to JUDGE us and our choices. Right?
md
January 27th, 2012
4:00 pm
“As I said, I won’t squabble over percentages, but you are smoking something if you think you can have entertainment (especially with kids) for free 100% of the time. And what you’re smoking will come out of your entertainment budget, unless you are in CA and have glaucoma.”
I have, do and will continue to do……as it is my choice.
Not to mention it is much healthier than camping out at the bar……been there, done that.
Go out and explore the many parks all around us that our dollars have already(still) pay for……ride the bike, swim, etc etc……..having to spend money on entertainment IS a choice.
Kamchak
January 27th, 2012
4:01 pm
The important thing is that we’ll always have people who have never met us and know nothing about our lives and the obstacles we’ve faced, who are willing to JUDGE us and our choices. Right?
Matti, I agree 100% with that but I would add to, “are willing to JUDGE us and our choices by the choices they themselves made.
josef
January 27th, 2012
4:01 pm
getalife
Not much being said about that yet…news said it was “not anything” I haven’t had a chance to talk to the neighbor yet…figure he needs his rest!
jewcowboy
Yep, when we saw all the black SUV’s wheeling in one right behind the other, we figured it wasn’t anything good…and then when we saw which neighbor it was, we KNEW it couldn’t be good…
Okay FNM…
md
January 27th, 2012
4:03 pm
“The important thing is that we’ll always have people who have never met us and know nothing about our lives and the obstacles we’ve faced, who are willing to JUDGE us and our choices. Right?”
Most likely…….especially if those choices require others to supplement them…….like the 1/3 that drop out of assistance program #1.
Society has bad apples all across the spectrum…….it isn’t restricted to the “greedy rich”.
Thulsa Doom
January 27th, 2012
4:04 pm
jewcowboy,
I’ll agree with you on that bit about education and Mcdonalds being a loser dead end job mentally for most people. And that’s a shame cause when I grew up a kid working at McDonalds was viewed by parents simply teaching their kid what its like to work in the real world and giving them an early start on a work ethic.
And I’m not talking about a 25-30 year old. I’m talking about 16-22 or someone just starting out entry level after college delivering pizzas part time. And if you are 40 years old or older and you have to suck it up and get a part time job telemarketing or at the mall or whatever then you just have to suck it up and do what you have to do. I was always taught to never look down on anybody’s work no matter how menial. At least they’re working and not sitting on their ass collecting welfare. I would hope that people have higher aspirations then a life long career in McDonalds but there’s nothing wrong with getting a start there and learning a work ethic. And also if you stay at Mcdonalds or start off as a bagger at Kroger’s you will eventually work your way into management if you have any sense at all. In our instant gratification society that’s just a harder and harder thing for people to focus on.
md
January 27th, 2012
4:05 pm
“Matti, I agree 100% with that but I would add to, “are willing to JUDGE us and our choices by the choices they themselves made.”
Only if those choices actually infringe on others…………otherwise, who cares.
Welcome to the Occupation
January 27th, 2012
4:05 pm
Steve – USA: “I am sick of hearing people claim people they have no control over their own damn situation.”
I appreciate your concern for retaining a sense of self-help and responsibility, but I think you may underestimate the way that your ability to even take such virtues for granted is predicated on the solidarity of workers and a social compact won through that solidarity such as the one created in the New Deal era in this country in the past century. Absent such a social compact, you will have fewer and fewer options for the use of those qualities of self-reliance, and increasingly, like the exploited laborers in China, you’ll go where you’re told.
Adam
January 27th, 2012
4:05 pm
md: What part of “recommend” do you not understand??
You did turn it into SHOULD a few times.
Skip
January 27th, 2012
4:07 pm
I put 60% down five years ago, turned out to be the worst financial decision I’ve ever made.
Thulsa Doom
January 27th, 2012
4:08 pm
josef,
That’s some pretty sage advice on finances @ 3:47. I always thought most of that was common sense also but to a lot of people its not. And its certainly not common sense to Congress or the president or the previous potus. And that’s a bigger shame.
359 more days
January 27th, 2012
4:08 pm
Joe Hussein Mama
January 27th, 2012
3:47 pm
359 — “Thanks for your civil response.”
It’s certainly more civil than your recent intemperate and ragey responses to me.
Joe, I am sorry if I hurt your feelings. Sometimes in our attempts to supply the “other side of the story” we react to people rather than problems.
Truce?
jewcowboy
January 27th, 2012
4:10 pm
md,
“I have, do and will continue to do……as it is my choice.”
Your internet to be entertained on this blog is not free, unless you are doing it a public library or at work. And if you are doing it at work, aren’t you stealing from your employer?
“ride the bike”
Yep..those are free. I’m just not into absolutes as you can see.
Welcome to the Occupation
January 27th, 2012
4:10 pm
md: “Society has bad apples all across the spectrum…….it isn’t restricted to the “greedy rich”.”
But only in a klepto-system like the one that we increasingly are becoming do the ‘bad apples’ consolidate themselves as a class and use their power to reap ever greater wealth and advantage.
marc
January 27th, 2012
4:10 pm
I can’t imagine how the GOP must feel……realizing that with each GOP debate how good they make our radical, socialist, muslim, foreign born President look..to make matters worst..the damn economy keeps ticking up….as do the foreign policy / war wins….things really are getting better!….oh! this must be the “disaster” the right wing radio / tv mouths keep talking about…President Obama is turning out to be the right guy at the right time…..Americans really do have a knack for picking the right person….. Next move forward?..finding a gal….I would vote for Pelosi just to see Hannity’s head explode on air…..but I heard she’s a buddhist who was born in Vancouver….darn.
Common Sense isn't very Common
January 27th, 2012
4:11 pm
Matti – I judge you to be sane.
The rest of us here happen to be bat shyte crazy