When high-speed chases end tragically
I’ve held off on posting about this until we knew more about what happened, but this news helps to clarify a tragic situation:
The Georgia State Patrol trooper involved in the New Year’s Eve crash that killed the wife of Braves trainer Jeff Porter has been fired.
In a statement released Friday, Col. Mark W. McDonough, commissioner of the state Department of Public Safety, said that while the investigation into Saturday’s wreck in downtown Atlanta is continuing, Trooper 1st Class Donald Crozier was terminated on Thursday….
Kathy Porter was a passenger in the Ford Expedition being driven by her husband, Jeff. The Ford was struck by Crozier’s Dodge Charger patrol car at the intersection of Capitol Avenue and Memorial Drive. Kathy Porter died; her husband, as well as the couple’s son, David, and a third passenger were injured.
By now, most if not all law-enforcement agencies have clear policies regarding hot pursuit. The State Patrol’s actions in terminating this officer suggest that he acted in violation of those policies when he hit the Porter vehicle. (Crozier was reportedly en route to joining a high-speed chase on nearby I-20 when the accident occurred.)
The National Highway Transportation Safety Administration estimates that some 360 people are killed each year in high-speed pursuits, although the actual number may be higher because no mechanism exists to collect that data nationally. Kathy Porter has now joined that number.
Like Porter, roughly a third of those killed are innocent victims. You don’t fire a gun at a suspect in a room of crowded people, even if it means that he might escape, and chasing a suspect at high speed on crowded streets raises similar questions of risk vs. benefit. You put innocent lives at risk.
In 2005, a survey of 15 Georgia law-enforcement agencies reported that they had engaged in more than 400 pursuits in the previous year. More than a quarter of those pursuits resulted in an accident, and more than half were initiated as result of a traffic offense. Only one chase in eight was related to a suspected felony.
Georgia courts give law enforcement considerable leeway as long as officers do not act in reckless disregard for public safety, meaning that they observe department policy. However, as the state Supreme Court has noted, while it’s desirable that suspects be apprehended, “it is equally as important that innocent persons, whether or not connected with the emergency to be met, not be maimed or killed in the operation.”
– Jay Bookman
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245 comments Add your comment
Kamchak
January 6th, 2012
1:43 pm
(Crozier was reportedly en route to joining a high-speed chase on nearby I-20 when the accident occurred.)
Was the guy being chased that much of a threat they had to use extreme measures like a high speed chase?
Did they catch the guy who was being chased?
Jay
January 6th, 2012
1:47 pm
I’d like to know the answer to those questions as well, but such details aren’t being released.
kitty
January 6th, 2012
1:47 pm
doesn’t matter if they caught the guy IMO. These sort of chases should only be used when someone dangerous is fleeing from the police, not when someone drives off from a traffic ticket unless they have reason to believe that person is a serious danger. People die for no reason…innocent people. IF they guy violated policy he should also be prosecuted for manslaughter or something like that for killing Kathy Porter. My sympathies to her family for their loss.
Cutty
January 6th, 2012
1:51 pm
Would the firing had been different had the victim not been the wife of the Braves trainer, but rather someone from the Capital View neighborhood?
Jay
January 6th, 2012
1:51 pm
That too is a fine question, Cutty.
Jimmy62
January 6th, 2012
1:52 pm
Let’s get rid of no-knock raids, too. A lot of innocent people get hurt by over-testosteroned SWAT teams looking to justify their jobs by performing military operations on private citizens on American soil,
Steve - USA
January 6th, 2012
1:53 pm
Cutty,
I would think it’s safe to say high profile situations are always handled differently and no that’s not a good thing.
JMHO
Sarah
January 6th, 2012
1:53 pm
I agree Kitty. This officer showed total disregard for human life when he blew through that intersection and did not stop. I hope he gets the punishment he deserves. My sympathies to her family.
Granny Godzilla
January 6th, 2012
1:55 pm
My sympathies to the family.
Normal
January 6th, 2012
1:57 pm
Capital Avenue and Memorial…how far is that intersection from I-20?
Paul
January 6th, 2012
1:57 pm
“a survey of 15 Georgia law-enforcement agencies reported that they had engaged in more than 400 pursuits in the previous year.”
And I wonder what prompted the pursuit (other than the driver fled). Running a stop sign? Going 8 mph over the limit? Right tire skimming the white line? As opposed to ‘murder suspect fleeing’ or ‘armed robbery suspect fleeing.’
“(Crozier was reportedly en route to joining a high-speed chase on nearby I-20 when the accident occurred.)”
Every time I pass by a pulled-over care with three or four law-enforcement cars behind it, Ihave to wonder, does the number of stops an officer participates in affect awards, promotion and pay? “Officer Speedo participated in 18 pursuits that led to the apprehension of 1 murder suspect, 3 armed robbery suspects and 14 teenagers out after curfew.”
stands for decibels
January 6th, 2012
1:59 pm
That too is a fine question, Cutty.
I’ll admit it was the first question that popped into my head, but was fearful it would seem petty or exploitative to ask…
Mostly I just can’t fathom how horrible it must be to be in Jeff Porter’s shoes. Perhaps his loss will lead to a rational overhaul of policy on this matter.
Normal
January 6th, 2012
1:59 pm
…as far as the “No Knock Policy goes…I hate it because you can’t yell, “Dave’s not here” anymore.
(I wonder how many will get that?)
AngryRedMarsWoman
January 6th, 2012
2:01 pm
I grew up around the police (my daddy being the local fire chief) and am married to a cop, so I speak from – well, simply from where I sit and thus what I have to say is anecdotal and probably meaningless. There are a lot of good cops out there. There are also too many individuals wearing the uniform who do so not necessarily to help the public, but rather because they love the thrill of the chase and the grit of the bust…and the feeling of being “above”. The call comes out….lights and sirens and the blinders go up and the adrenaline is flowing. There is a fine line that we ask our “heroes” (police, fire, military) to walk and sometimes even the good ones will cross it….and there are some who spend their entire career on the wrong side of it. Like the rest of you, I am ignorant of the specifics in this case, but I am fairly certain that the officer wasn’t out there with the intention of hurting an innocent person – violation of policy, bad judgment….sad for all.
My deepest sympathies to the Porter family…..
Kamchak
January 6th, 2012
2:01 pm
I hope he gets the punishment he deserves.
This was clearly a tragic accident. I think the citizens of Georgia deserve a better high-speed chase policy. Let’s start holding policy deciders responsible.
Joe Hussein Mama
January 6th, 2012
2:02 pm
Normal — “Capital Avenue and Memorial…how far is that intersection from I-20?”
Not far at all. IIRC, Capital and Memorial meet underneath the Connector, just about one exit north of I-20. It’s in that rabbit warren down where 75, 85 and 20 all intersect.
Joe Hussein Mama
January 6th, 2012
2:03 pm
Let’s see if this linkee works.
http://mapq.st/zKY7CP
Old Timer
January 6th, 2012
2:04 pm
And I wonder what prompted the pursuit (other than the driver fled). Running a stop sign? Going 8 mph over the limit? Right tire skimming the white line? As opposed to ‘murder suspect fleeing’ or ‘armed robbery suspect fleeing.’
From what I’ve read, I gather that the fleeing suspect was on a motorcycle—not exactly a weapon of mass destruction. I think the truth is that too many people who should never be allowed near a badge other than from behind bars get all testosteroned up when chasing a fleeing vehicle—for instance, we read numerous accounts of beatings occurring after a chase has ended. Let’s pity the devastated family and then be grateful that a misfit has been removed from the force that’s supposed to protect us.
JohnnyReb
January 6th, 2012
2:05 pm
Lights and sirens on offical cars are for separating traffic so the vehicle can get through, not for speeding in hopes innocent people get out of the way.
On a skeptical note however, the troopers firing is suspect, especially this soon with no mention of past violations. Manslaugher is serious, don’t misunderstand me, but this one smacks of politics. It won’t be a surprise if dismissal is overturned should the trooper pursue an appeal.
Peadawg
January 6th, 2012
2:05 pm
“The Georgia State Patrol trooper involved in the New Year’s Eve crash that killed the wife of Braves trainer Jeff Porter has been fired.”
GOOD. Now lets prosecute him for vehicular homicide, murder, SOMETHING. Just b/c he was a cop doesn’t excuse him for his actions.
Off topic a little bit but when it comes it comes to police officers breaking laws (especially speeding) that regular citizens get tickets for, it’s absolutely ridiculous.
Dave
January 6th, 2012
2:06 pm
@Normal…….. “No, no, I’m Dave. Let me in man. I’ve got the stuff.” Yep, got it.
Joe Hussein Mama
January 6th, 2012
2:06 pm
Old Timer — “Let’s pity the devastated family and then be grateful that a misfit has been removed from the force that’s supposed to protect us.”
Hell of a price to pay to get one bad apple out of the barrel.
Misty Fyed
January 6th, 2012
2:09 pm
The problem is the cops usually don’t know why the person is running. They could be drunk. They could be stupid kids. They could be a wanted serial killer with a victim in the back seat. Everyone hates when an innocent victim is injured, but could you imagine the response if a victim is found dead and the police had the suspect pulled over but before they found the victim, the suspect fled at a high speed. Fearful of high speed chases, the police failed to give chase.
Also imagine the response if the police banned all high speed chases. Why would anyone ever pull over or even slow down? Just cover your tag and take off.
Butch Cassidy
January 6th, 2012
2:10 pm
Just a question. Has anyone ever done a study as to whether speeding fatalities decrease when a police officer is parked on the side of the road running radar? My point being that rather than waiting for the errant driver to come into target range, couldn’t the police prescence be better served elserwhere?
jewcowboy
January 6th, 2012
2:11 pm
“You don’t fire a gun at a suspect in a room of crowded people, even if it means that he might escape”
Wait a second. I grew up watching 70’s police shows. You mean a police officer is not supposed to shoot at a suspect on a crowded street or out the window of a speeding car with one hand while steering with another?
Butch Cassidy
January 6th, 2012
2:12 pm
jewcowboy – “You mean a police officer is not supposed to shoot at a suspect on a crowded street or out the window of a speeding car with one hand while steering with another?”
Only if said officer is driving a red Ford Grand Torino.
stands for decibels
January 6th, 2012
2:14 pm
On a skeptical note however, the troopers firing is suspect, especially this soon with no mention of past violations. Manslaugher is serious, don’t misunderstand me, but this one smacks of politics. It won’t be a surprise if dismissal is overturned should the trooper pursue an appeal.
Such thoughts have crossed my mind as well, and it dovetails with my (and Cutty’s) earlier thoughts of what sort of fate would befall a more ordinary Joe, or an ordinary Joe’s wife, dying under similar circumstances.
Of course (as you’d indicated) they’re just suspicions at this point, I don’t really know much about the likelihood of such drastic disciplinary actions taking place, or how quickly… perhaps someone who does know, will pipe in with some stats for us.
jewcowboy
January 6th, 2012
2:15 pm
Butch Cassidy,
“Only if said officer is driving a red Ford Grand Torino.”
5-0
January 6th, 2012
2:16 pm
This event was tragic, but to hear you libs talk about bad apples, complaining about speeding cops, and the imfamous “I know a cop so I know what I’m talking about” attitude sickens me. You guys are sheep.
5-0
January 6th, 2012
2:18 pm
Butch Cassidy….
That is a great idea right up until the point some speeding kid runs your mom into a ditch. Then you’ll complain about why the cops weren’t using radar controlling the speeders.
jewcowboy
January 6th, 2012
2:18 pm
5-0
“but to hear you libs talk about”
Looking at the comments and who has said what on here, you might want to check who you are calling libs…
Jm
January 6th, 2012
2:19 pm
Cutty 1:51
Speculative but probably accurate answer: no
Jm
January 6th, 2012
2:20 pm
Whoops. “yes”, not “no”
Kamchak
January 6th, 2012
2:21 pm
Also imagine the response if the police banned all high speed chases. Why would anyone ever pull over or even slow down?
They don’t seem to be pulling over or slowing down when they are being chased.
Why don’t we try something different?
jewcowboy
January 6th, 2012
2:24 pm
Kamchak,
“Why don’t we try something different?”
we could.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2003/dec/21/transport.ukcrime
Normal
January 6th, 2012
2:24 pm
Dave,
Figures you’d get it…
ty webb
January 6th, 2012
2:25 pm
it seems that with all the cameras now on interstates, highway, and streets, it should be easier to track those running from police, so that we could somewhat “head them off at the pass”, eliminating chases.
stands for decibels
January 6th, 2012
2:25 pm
you might want to check who you are calling libs…
remember, JCB–to vast swaths of America, it’s
“Liberal” = stuff/people I don’t happen to like
(thirty, forty years of what amount to empty-net shots on that term will do that.)
Finn McCool
January 6th, 2012
2:26 pm
Also imagine the response if the police banned all high speed chases. Why would anyone ever pull over or even slow down?
Reminded me of the section in the Hunter Thompson book Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas – just slow down and put your turn signal on but don’t ever pull over.
jewcowboy
January 6th, 2012
2:27 pm
ty webb,
Or remotely stop them. See the link at 2.24.
jewcowboy
January 6th, 2012
2:28 pm
stands for decibels,
“Liberal” = stuff/people I don’t happen to like”
Too true.
ty webb
January 6th, 2012
2:28 pm
I blame those Duke boys.
Matti's resolve
January 6th, 2012
2:28 pm
What a senseless tragedy. Automobiles ARE dangerous weapons, and caution should be exercised at all times. We teach this to our children. (I do; you’d better!) There’s no reason to exempt law enforcement officers from this basic tenet.
God bless that poor woman’s family!
Get Real
January 6th, 2012
2:30 pm
My understanding is he was not even chasing anyone, he got called to the scene of a wreck…..which makes it much worse
getalife
January 6th, 2012
2:32 pm
Very sad.
Mr_B
January 6th, 2012
2:32 pm
I’ll be happy to accept the “lib” label, but I’d be a little more comfortable with the whole situation if the trooper in question weren’t being tried and fried in the court of public opinion. Was he acting under orders to pursue? Had he acted in a manner inconsistant with his traing? We don’t know, and the rush to terminate the cop doesn’t make it any clearer.
This guy may be a cowboy with no regard for the safety of the community that he’s supposed to be protecting or he may be a decent guy trying to do what he tought was the right thing with tragic consequences. I’d like to find out which before I condemn him.
ty webb
January 6th, 2012
2:33 pm
jewcowboy,
interesting story…it should definitely make anyone with “OnStar”(or any comparable service) think real hard.
AngryRedMarsWoman
January 6th, 2012
2:34 pm
Sorry, 5-0, but in my lifetime I have known a few cops who IMHO should not have been wearing a badge. I am a lawyer…and I know some bad lawyers. I work in the healthcare industry…and I know of bad doctors. I am a mom…and I have seen some parents who should not be entrusted with the care of children. But you don’t have to be a “whatever” to know a bad “whatever”. When this story broke it was my husband – 15 years active duty military, 10+ years wearing a badge – who turned to me and said “there are way too many guys out there who just can’t wait to get in a chase or pull someone over…and I work with quite a few of those dangerous a-holes.” So, you know, your blind defense of your breatheren (assuming you are in fact LE) is not as honorable as you think it is. Bad lawyers make me sick and I want them drummed out of the profession…the “good” cops I know feel the same about their “bad apples” as well. bahhhhhh bahhhhh
Matti's resolve
January 6th, 2012
2:38 pm
AngryRedMarsWoman,
Nicely put.
jewcowboy
January 6th, 2012
2:43 pm
ty webb,
“it should definitely make anyone with “OnStar”(or any comparable service) think real hard.”
That made me think of a video I saw a while back.
“700+ HP Hennessey Cadillac CTS-V: 11.07 @ 128 MPH – OnStar Emergency?”
http://youtu.be/8As1zshWxn0