No vision, focus or direction in state transportation plans
State transportation officials have pulled the plug on the $1 billion “express lane” project on I-75 and I-575, thanks in part to behind-the-scenes pressure from Gov. Nathan Deal.
Reportedly, the “public-private partnership” envisioned to finance the deal was becoming less and less of a true partnership. The taxpayer subsidy demanded by investors in the project had grown from $300 million to $450 million or more, while still leaving control, operation and profits in private hands.
If that’s indeed the case, the cancellation was wise. But what now? The abandonment of the I-75 project ought to be an alarm bell alerting taxpayers to a deeper, more troubling problem. This is the second time that a toll project in that corridor has been proposed to private contractors and then withdrawn. As AJC reporter Ariel Hart points out, Georgia has now invested more than $50 million in that effort with nothing to show for it.
Why? Because transportation planning in this state continues to be plagued by a lack of focus, direction, vision and accountability. The state Department of Transportation is seeking its fourth commissioner in four years and is hamstrung by a divided board. Apparently, nobody can run the place. The department itself has been split in two by legislators, with a commissioner performing some functions and a state planning director performing others. At times, the State Road and Tollway Authority, a separate agency, seems to take the lead; at times it doesn’t. The governor’s office also plays a powerful role from time to time, as it apparently did in this case, but intervening when needed is not the same thing as providing steady guidance and vision.
In addition, the state Legislature has punted funding problems to regional agencies around the state, in effect telling local governments that if they want to build transit projects, they’re on their own. But state officials balk at giving those regional agencies the authority needed to operate transit efficiently. It is a mess, and that mess grows out of three unresolved problems:
– State officials, particularly in the Legislature, cannot bring themselves to acknowledge that mass transit is a necessity. Admitting that things have changed, that metro Atlanta has grown to the point that it has to pursue transit aggressively just like every other major metro region on the planet, represents a profound cultural shift that some Georgians aren’t ready to accept.
– The state needs to commit more money to transportation. It cannot build a world-class logistics and supply system founded on its ports and do it on a starvation transportation budget. It cannot attract corporate headquarters and biotech to a region choking in traffic. Passage of the 1-cent transportation sales tax in metro Atlanta next year represents the minimum of what must be done. “If we don’t pass it, the signal is disastrous,” economist Donald Ratajczak warned the Council on Quality Growth this month. “It makes us very difficult to attract anybody.”
Unfortunately, the sudden cancellation of the I-75 toll project only adds to the perception of indecision and incompetence, making passage of the sales tax less likely. Which lead us to …
– The state needs a rational, professional and accountable system of transportation decision-making. Competing visions, agendas and bureaucracies do not work. Every step taken in the last 20 years has served to cloud rather than clarify lines of responsibility, and we are reaping the consequences.
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450 comments Add your comment
Thulsa Doom
December 19th, 2011
1:48 pm
And on this day in history in 2007, President George W. Bush signed energy legislation that increased average vehicle’s fuel economy by 2020 to 35 miles per gallon, a 40 percent hike.
Gawd those libs must hate them green Repub presidents.
Keep Up the Good Fight!
December 19th, 2011
1:49 pm
St, Simons, but you don’t get bonus credit card points on your Visa Rainbow Card for cash.
Redneck Convert (R--and proud of it)
December 19th, 2011
1:50 pm
Well, what I want to know is, why is Raghead worried about where the airport is at? Didn’t we get rid of him—I mean, didn’t he move to Florida a couple years ago after his boss at his old work place found out he spent 90% of his time blogging? One thing’s for sure, we don’t need a airport up here. A airport brings Those People and Those People bring crime and all kind of welfare problems.
Brosephus
December 19th, 2011
1:50 pm
Pray tell me, which mass transit systems do you know of in this country, or in any other, that finance themselves solely through fares?
In a pure, free market that was completely free of regulation, there is the possibility that some company would see the need for transportation and construct a business model that would execute the best mass transit for the lowest cost possible and still manage to be profitable.
USMC
December 19th, 2011
1:52 pm
“There is some truth in that. Despite some awards they’ve gotten, it’s clear they are generally run incompetently”–JM
Hey JM! I agree with you, but the “AWARDS” part means N-O-T-H-I-N-G.
The Atlanta Public Schools and Beverly Hall WON many “AWARDS”, and we all know the REST of the story.
How was your Bluegrass concert in L5P last weekend? Sounded like a blast.
Jm
December 19th, 2011
1:53 pm
Usmc. It’s also an issue of purpose.
Marta was set up by some as a means to serve the poor with inexpensive (sort of) buy obviously inefficient transportation
Now that the city and everyone, nit just the poor, need to use the infrastructure, all the previous capital was poorly invested for this second purpose
Blame lack of vision, or leadership, or political manipulation, the outcome has been awful for the city
Brosephus
December 19th, 2011
1:54 pm
USMC
If you want to improve MARTA, the first thing that needs to be done is either fund MARTA from under the Gold Dome or remove the overregulating rule from under the Gold Dome. Politicians have a way of effing up everything they get involved in, and MARTA’s proof positive that GA politicians are quite good at effing things up. The real reason that MARTA is a disaster is because the state wants to control what they do without giving them a damn penny to do it. Just another in the ongoing tasks of making all things public completely dysfunctional. After all, you can’t blame the government for being the problem if the government actually functions as it should, can you?
Keep Up the Good Fight!
December 19th, 2011
1:54 pm
Brosephus, you forgot how that free market train would actually go out and buy the needed ROW without regulation and government assistance, you know like the robber barons in the 1800’s….. Oh wait.
Brosephus
December 19th, 2011
1:55 pm
Marta was set up by some as a means to serve the poor with inexpensive (sort of) buy obviously inefficient transportation
Flag on the play… We have unsportsmanlike bullsh*t!!!! 15 yard penalty and an automatic 1st down.
Jm
December 19th, 2011
1:56 pm
Usmc
Concert was awesome. Terrific skills those guys have.
Brosephus
December 19th, 2011
1:57 pm
Keep
We don’t need no steenkin’ regulations!!!
Jm
December 19th, 2011
2:00 pm
Bro
Wrong. Ask Sam Massell
Thulsa Doom
December 19th, 2011
2:01 pm
“I am not necessarily against the Liberal Utopian-idea of Massive transit reaching all corners of Georgia, but can we please import some Yankees from New York City/Portland to at least run the system more competently ??? Seriously”
I would agree with you on that. Its clear the folks in Atl don’t know what they’re doing in managing Marta. On the other hand Amtrak in the northeastern corridor is run by yankees and I’m not sure that Amtrak has ever even had a profitable year in its history. If so it sure hasn’t been profitable lately.
Speaking of profitability anyone know if Marta has ever made a profit or if its been perpetually subsidized by Joe Taxpayer.
I read one time where some idiot sarcastically asked why the private sector had never built mass transit like Marta. Um. It could be because Marta loses money and therefore the private sector would never have built a money losing project like Marta to begin with. I’m surprised we haven’t seen some idiot today asking why the private sector doesn’t build a mass transit system like Marta.
USMC
December 19th, 2011
2:01 pm
“Politicians have a way of effing up everything they get involved in”–Brocephus
Boy, ain’t that the truth!
(disclaimer: the word “boy” is in no way meant as a derogatory racial epithet. Any intentions of twisting this word to mean such racial epithet is strictly prohibited)
That Black guy
December 19th, 2011
2:03 pm
Bosch
December 19th, 2011
8:41 am
miltonMan,
The only one who mentioned politics was you. Therefore if it is libs who are making this a political issue, that would be you — so when did you start identifying yourself as a Lib?
Really? MiltonMan was the only one?
Jefferson
December 19th, 2011
7:58 am
Services for nothing, the GOP fools again.
Adam
December 19th, 2011
8:06 am
Where’s the reliable “This is Obama’s fault” crowd? I need my daily conservabot crack!
Paul
December 19th, 2011
8:15 am
Is this an example of how Republicans know how to run government like a business?
independent thinker
December 19th, 2011
8:18 am
How come no one has blamed this on Obama?
LinkReport this comment.Butch Cassidy
December 19th, 2011
8:19 am
indepnedent thinker – “How come no one has blamed this on Obama?”
Because Hannity, Boortz and Limbaugh haven’t told the sheep what to think yet.
USNC
December 19th, 2011
8:24 am
privatize it!
as all GOPpers know privatizing fixes all that ails you.
All of thos e comments were BEFORE MiltonMan’s post, but YEAH, he was the first to make it political.
Jm
December 19th, 2011
2:03 pm
Bro wrong again
Regulations on government good, regulation on Americans bad
(see the bill of rights and constitution for a list of regulations on government).
And good ones at that
allen981
December 19th, 2011
2:03 pm
Every lib will sound the call for mass transit until they die, ignoring the real facts of transit across the world.
First, the costs are astronomical, but that of course, doesn’t scare Bookman, other libs, or Obama. Start building any type of transit line that links Duluth to Smryna and see what the costs are, both economically and ecologically. And, how is it that we could build a billion-dollar transit line and be called heroes, but a new highway for $500 million makes us villains?
Second, even in cities that have built their reputations on transit – i.e., London, New York, or Paris – the systems are slow and incredibly inefficient. Ever take the tube from Harrod’s to Heathrow? Or how about a train from Manhattan to JFK? They take forever, and always will, regardless of the high speed tech you try and use. Part of the reason for that is that all – I repeat ALL – large legacy transit systems are remnants of the 19th century and do not reflect the reality of a modern world.
And, then there is the cost to a transit customer. How about a nice little 30-mile commute on the transit system from Windsor to central London? Sounds delightful, and it is, if you’ve got $80 to $100 a day to fund your commute.
Don’t get me started on ideas such as a Griffiin/Atlanta train, or high speed rail to Savannah, Charlotte, or Chattanooga. The costs there – both to build and to use – would be prohibitively high and would serve very few people. Got a business meeting in one of those places, or anywhere in the Southeast for that matter? Take a plane – it’s fast, far more economical, and far, far safer.
These issues don’t stop the liberal mantra, however. It’s build heavy rail, build light rail, build, spend, build spend. Yet, low cost ideas that use existing infrastructure – i.e., a dedicated bus lanes on 285 – are immediately deemed unacceptable.
We need to think beyond the confines of ‘transit’ to a point where individuals are encouraged to use technology to work from home and where companies are encouraged to locate in areas with nearby affordable housing. We need to build cars that get 50-plus MPG with near zero emissions. We need to find low cost ways that preserve our freedom, not limit it.
I’m sick of hearing how we need ‘transit.’ We don’t need more ‘transit,’ we need thinkers and doers who approach a 21st century issue with 21st century ideas.
MARTA Rida
December 19th, 2011
2:03 pm
Question to all: If MARTA rail is expanded, should it “follow” the Interstates, or be constructed to connect the cities and activity centers and encourage higher densities?
Connect to activity centers and encourage higher densities, like Portland, OR. This would create transit villages where people can drop-off laundry and pick-up groceries while exiting the transit stations, see proposed Edgewood/Candler Park Station transit village. Why add to the congestion around interchanges with adding transit stations?
USMC
December 19th, 2011
2:09 pm
“Speaking of profitability anyone know if Marta has ever made a profit or if its been perpetually subsidized by Joe Taxpayer.”
I don’t know, but the Marta trains & stations display more ADVERTISEMENTS than you see on tv.
I Wonder whose slush fund gets all of the ad money???? HMMMM…
The same “Beverly Hall” type Affirmative Action, KnuckleDragger is sitting at the top of MARTA.
But But But But…. she has won several awards and has a PHD from the back of the Cracker Jack Box. (not directed at you, JM)
UNBELIEVABLE!
Thulsa Doom
December 19th, 2011
2:10 pm
“the possibility that some company would see the need for transportation and construct a business model that would execute the best mass transit for the lowest cost possible and still manage to be profitable”
Brocephus,
I don’t remember the specifics of it but there was a brouhaha by the Marta folks over that Hispanic van svc that is competing with Marta. They charge a dollar a ride, cheaper than Marta of course, and they primarily service Hispanics along Buford Highway and other areas of town that have significant Hispanic and immigrant populations. And they still make money. Everyone that has driven down in buckhead or near buford highway probably knows the van/taxi svcs that I’m referring to. Anyway I don’t remember what happened but the Marta folks were none too happy with these enterprising little company. Apparently this little company can make money at $1 a ride whereas marta can’t at $1.75. Go figure.
That Black guy
December 19th, 2011
2:12 pm
Adam
December 19th, 2011
9:23 am
The wingnuts must be on vacation. Still no mention of how this is Obama’s fault, or attempted hijack to something about Fast and Furious or Solyndra. You’re SLIPPING, people!
So, Bosch, it’s ok if Adam tries to push this topic partisian, as long a a repub on con doesn’t do it?
Thulsa Doom
December 19th, 2011
2:14 pm
“I don’t know, but the Marta trains & stations display more ADVERTISEMENTS than you see on tv.”
Yes. I don’t think I’ve ever seen a marta bus go by that doesn’t have at least one advertisement for a personal injury lawyer like Ken Nugent- “one call does it all”.
Thulsa Doom
December 19th, 2011
2:19 pm
Oh lawdy,
That black guy just nailed Bosch to the wall with the facts.
USMC
December 19th, 2011
2:22 pm
“The wingnuts must be on vacation. Still no mention of how this is Obama’s fault, or attempted hijack to something about Fast and Furious or Solyndra. You’re SLIPPING, people!”–The Black Brocephus
OKAY, OKAY! It’s all Comrade General Secretary Obama’s Fault!!!
There, are you happy, now?
Keep Up the Good Fight!
December 19th, 2011
2:24 pm
And we all know that Ken Nugent is spells Doom for the Thelma.
And of course all those “bus lines” along Buford also provide accessibility buses and pick up, and have never been shut down because of, say, failure to prove adequate insurance. And of course, cherry picking service of course demonstrates these same “bus lines” can compete throughout the city. But of course someone must have failed Economics 101.
Facts don’t matter to the conned, just nonsense.
Brosephus
December 19th, 2011
2:27 pm
Regulations on government good, regulation on Americans bad
I see you didn’t take your meds today. Regulations on government is regulations on Americans, or are you suggesting that our government is not made up of Americans? As to your earlier one, Sam Massel was not the only person involved with the planning of MARTA, so why would taking one person’s view automatically extrapolate to the entire consensus? If MARTA had been done as proposed without the prevailing 1960ish attitude of “us” vs “them”, Atlanta could probably be a world class city with that success spreading throughout GA. Instead, the divisive thinking then has pretty much ensured GA as nothing but a sub-40ish state in relation to the rest of the country.
TaxPayer
December 19th, 2011
2:28 pm
“the possibility that some company would see the need for transportation and construct a business model that would execute the best mass transit for the lowest cost possible and still manage to be profitable”
But the automobile has already been invented. The private investors made the automobile and people liked them so much that they got together and agreed to tax themselves to publicly fund the roads needed in order to make the private venture portion — i.e., the automobile itself and the fuel and tires, etc. — profitable. Can you just imagine Henry Ford building roads in order to have a market for his automobile.
Thulsa Doom
December 19th, 2011
2:33 pm
“And of course all those “bus lines” along Buford also provide accessibility buses and pick up, and have never been shut down because of, say, failure to prove adequate insurance.’keep
And of course keep can prove all or even most of them are operating without proper insurance.
“And of course, cherry picking service of course demonstrates these same “bus lines” can compete throughout the city”.- keep
Oh. I see. So when you mention a competitor beating marta at its own game its then “cherry picking”. How convenient.
“But of course someone must have failed Economics 101″. -keep
Says the ambulance chaser to the guy that actually has an economics degree.
Adam
December 19th, 2011
2:40 pm
Satire gets (mostly) a free pass. As long as the host can detect it. Apparently though, even obvious humor isn’t so obvious to everyone. Don’t blame yourself, though, even though Herman Cain would suggest otherwise
Keep Up the Good Fight!
December 19th, 2011
2:41 pm
Thelm, your attempts at personal insults aside. I can’t help it that Nugent is whipping your butt daily.
http://www.ajc.com/metro/content/metro/dekalb/stories/2008/10/07/royal_bus_buford.html
Surely Economics 101 would teach you that a limited route along a few roads versus service to 2 counties in their entirety is cherry picking….. You failed. You also failed to prove they provide the additional community services for accessibility, home pick up. I am sure your argument has additional weaknesses but go ahead, prove your point with real facts and not nonsense.
Brosephus
December 19th, 2011
2:41 pm
Apparently this little company can make money at $1 a ride whereas marta can’t at $1.75. Go figure.
Does that little company have the same regulations that MARTA has in relation to how it uses it’s money? There’s this little catch to MARTA that it’s 1% sales tax has to be split 50/50 between capital and operational costs. I don’t think that company has any restrictions on how it must allocate it’s funding. That would enable it to operate at a much more efficient level than MARTA.
Redneck Convert (R--and proud of it)
December 19th, 2011
2:43 pm
Yes. I don’t think I’ve ever seen a marta bus go by that doesn’t have at least one advertisement for a personal injury lawyer like Ken Nugent- “one call does it all”
Well, me, I’m partial to the signs on the back of the little Mexican buses on Buford Hwy. when I’m down that way: “Been hit? Call Neil Flit.”.
Thulsa Doom
December 19th, 2011
2:47 pm
Brocephus,
Very true. That little van co. doesn’t have the enormous fixed costs of marta. And of course it doesn’t have the restrictions that marta has. But it doesn’t have the bureaucracy that marta has nor the advantage of govt subsidy including the sales tax.
Its just kinda neat to see the little guy take a bite out of the big guy is all. Kinda like the sand flea taking little nips at the ankles of Doomy. Only difference being that the little buford van/taxi wins against its goliath.
MARTA Rida
December 19th, 2011
2:49 pm
I read one time where some idiot sarcastically asked why the private sector had never built mass transit like Marta.
The private sector built transit lines in the early 1900’s, before cars where popular and roads where subsidized, then sold them to the government because cars got so popular and the lines couldn’t make a profit.
Matti's Practical Anger
December 19th, 2011
2:50 pm
Action Alert for WORKING people:
The GOP House members are breaking their promise: “We will end the practice of packaging unpopular bills with “must-pass” legislation to circumvent the will of the American people. Instead, we will advance major legislation one issue at a time.” (GOP Pledge to America, page 33)
They’re holding the tax cuts for working Americans hostage to give their oil-industry buddies a big fat favor. Why won’t they fight for OUR tax cuts like they fought or their own? Call your Congressweasel TODAY (vote is this evening) to remind him or her you are aware they’re breaking their promise, and that you feel USED.
Thulsa Doom
December 19th, 2011
2:51 pm
Neil Flit? Sounds like we got an endless supply of these ambulance chasers.
Adam
December 19th, 2011
2:52 pm
Matti: Don’t worry. Apparently the House GOP doesn’t like it because it is only 2 months. Well, that’s what they SAY the reason is. Really they don’t like it because it’s not what they sent to the Senate.
Brosephus
December 19th, 2011
2:52 pm
Doom
MARTA is one of many examples where politicians set things up to fail so that they can point to it and claim that government does not work. I honestly do not understand how and why the state legislature has to have a board overseeing MARTA when the state legislature does not contribute to it’s basic funding. Things would probably work much better if we had legislators that actually legislated ONLY instead of trying to run day-to-day governmental operations. That’s why agencies have directors and other people. Let them run it.
Every time a politician gets involved in things, they screw it up. Our country would be so much better if we actually made sure that legislators did their jobs and their jobs only. Leave the other stuff to the people who are supposed to do it. If a politician doesn’t like it, then quit the legislature and take a job with the agency directly.
Thulsa Doom
December 19th, 2011
2:55 pm
MARTA rida,
Interesting tidbit. I guess private enterprise doesn’t do them today because they now know that they won’t make money precisely because of cars.
Thulsa Doom
December 19th, 2011
3:01 pm
“Every time a politician gets involved in things, they screw it up.”
Sage wisdom there bro. But there is a certain % of our electorate who think for whatever bizarre reason that politicians through the tool of govt can fix everything. As you point out they can’t. And anyone with common sense should be able to realize that on any particular issue or industry that politicians don’t have the deep scope of understanding to really be making effective policy.
Brosephus
December 19th, 2011
3:05 pm
Doom
The only thing I want politicians to fix is the clusterf**k they’ve caused. However, given the fact that I feel that they’ve been purposely screwing things up since the 50’s and 60’s, I don’t think we’ll ever get things fixed.
GT
December 19th, 2011
3:05 pm
Vision can come back and hang a politician. It is easier to stand for nothing or “I have changed, much more mature now”, than to really take a stance. There is nothing to hang on too in a blind man which usually is the last man standing in politics.
Paulo977
December 19th, 2011
3:06 pm
Mountain
Man
:And to get to the shuttle you have to walk through Underground! Thanks, I will drive…..!!!
______________
Hmmmmmmmmm ….checked your weight recently ? How about your eyes for sensitivity to color?
Obozonomics
December 19th, 2011
3:07 pm
Just remember it is all Bush’s fault…
Thulsa Doom
December 19th, 2011
3:13 pm
“I don’t think we’ll ever get things fixed.”
Probably not. But its our fault too for continuing to re-elect the same clowns with everyone thinking that the problem is someone else’s congressman.
Brosephus
December 19th, 2011
3:13 pm
Just remember it is all Bush’s fault…
AmVet
December 19th, 2011
3:14 pm
Meat, we’ve been over this 736 times already.
Nothing is George Bush’s fault.
After Washington, Jefferson and Lincoln he was the greatest US president ever.
And you know that.
Which is why you voted for him twice…
Matti's Practical Anger
December 19th, 2011
3:14 pm
Adam,
My take on the 2-month deal is that it’s the only way the wussy Dems in the Senate could get enough “bi-partisan” cooperation to keep arguing over which sweetheart GOP donor perks would accompany a longer extension. I wish the Dems would grow enough spine to simply point out the TRUTH on a regular basis. The facts are on their side, but they’re too eskeered to tick off the Repuglies, lest they start hollering more false accusations of their throats being violated in an unseemly manner.
Thulsa Doom
December 19th, 2011
3:14 pm
“How about your eyes for sensitivity to color?”
Race card! Ha. You just knew they couldn’t go all day without pulling it out.
Brosephus
December 19th, 2011
3:15 pm
Doom
I haven’t voted for an incumbent in a while now. Last election, I didn’t check a single one. Where there was none, I voted for a different party or wrote “somebody else” as a write in.
Thulsa Doom
December 19th, 2011
3:17 pm
AmVet,
Washington, Jefferson, Lincoln. You left out Reagan and his 16 million jobs. W was greater than Reagan? Say it aint so.
Thulsa Doom
December 19th, 2011
3:19 pm
Bro,
I usually check libertarian all the way down the line but check R if there is only an r and a d. I just figure its the lesser of 2 evils. Between Deal and King Roy I either voted L or didn’t even choose. Can’t remember cause that was the choice between 2 evils period.
USMC
December 19th, 2011
3:20 pm
“Every time a politician gets involved in things, they screw it up.”—poco(the republican in Dem clothing)
–Sort of states the case for SMALLER government, doesn’t it???
moonbat betty
December 19th, 2011
3:21 pm
Here’s a Transportation plan that might work:
Tear Atlanta (and Metro) down and start over from scratch.
williebkind
December 19th, 2011
3:24 pm
No doubt it is OBAMA’s fault.
Brosephus
December 19th, 2011
3:24 pm
Doom
I can’t go the libertarian route as I don’t ascribe to all their beliefs. I generally don’t vote by side to start with. I’ve noticed that there are fewer and fewer contested offices nowadays because of the wicked state of gerrymandering that we’ve allowed to happen. Look at jm’s 2:03 statement. We don’t even look at government service as being American anymore, and I happen to think that we have the best form of government in the entire world. When that’s the prevailing attitude, it’s no wonder that we have to choose the lesser evil. Our country is being bought/sold from right under our feet, but we’re too caught up in the partisaned bs that’s stirred up to even notice what’s going on behind the curtain.
williebkind
December 19th, 2011
3:25 pm
moonbat betty
December 19th, 2011
3:21 pm
“Tear Atlanta (and Metro) down and start over from scratch.”
They did that in 1864-1865 then the liberals moved in.
Brosephus
December 19th, 2011
3:25 pm
Sort of states the case for SMALLER government, doesn’t it???
Nope, it states the case for EFFECTIVE government, and not one that overreaches it’s job.
USMC
December 19th, 2011
3:26 pm
“No doubt it is OBAMA’s fault.”
We already came to that conclusion earlier, Willie B.!
Brosephus
December 19th, 2011
3:27 pm
No doubt it is OBAMA’s fault.
USMC
December 19th, 2011
3:28 pm
“Nope, it states the case for EFFECTIVE government, and not one that overreaches it’s job.”
–Sounds like Brother Herman Cain got to you! Welcome aboard.
Iconoclast
December 19th, 2011
3:28 pm
Resurrect the Gwinnett Mafia, aka “the asphalt mob”. Maybe they were self-serving, but they were (dogmatically) conservative Republicans who, while seeking to rename everything for Ronald Reagan, somehow managed to put asphalt in everyone’s back yard, making access to their cronies’ shopping malls attainable by every race, color, and class of Atlanta wannabe.
Matti's Practical Anger
December 19th, 2011
3:29 pm
Tear Atlanta (and Metro) down and start over from scratch.
Now there’s an original idea! NOT. It was done in 1864/1865. Sorry if you’re not happy with the results. Feel free to remain well outside the area where you won’t have to think about it.
AmVet
December 19th, 2011
3:30 pm
Hiya Doom,
Hope you an yours are having a great holiday season so far.
Ronnie Raygun?
He’s probably somewhere around 10th in my book. (On a list of the last 12 presidents!)
williebkind
December 19th, 2011
3:32 pm
Thulsa Doom I can understand that but since the liberals took over the d-party I can not for the love of mankind vote d-party. When r-party member gets elected it is to make business rich and prosper but when a d-party gets elected it is usually by the citizens who want something for nothing. Now we have “I want to live like native Americans but you do the hard work to feed and clothe me” special interests. You know the socialist group where they dont work but pick a group to work for them while they attend school and become academic geniuses–like Obama.
Brosephus
December 19th, 2011
3:32 pm
Nope, I think Herman Cain is a jackass.
Keep Up the Good Fight!
December 19th, 2011
3:35 pm
Brosephus: I think Herman Cain is a jackass
How can you say that about a man who has touched so many?
AmVet
December 19th, 2011
3:37 pm
Re, that first 3:32,
Now who can argue with that?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ke5Mr5eCF2U
Brosephus
December 19th, 2011
3:39 pm
Keep
I can say that easily. That guy is not prepared to be mayor of a major city, much less POTUS. When you can’t answer simple questions that you should be able to, that makes you a jackass in my book. Never bite off more than you can chew, and Cain looked like a shih tzu trying to eat a cape buffalo in one bite.
Don
December 19th, 2011
3:39 pm
“Thulsa Doom
December 19th, 2011
2:55 pm”
Transit lines were built in the early 20th century by land speculators. They built lines out from the city to farmland they had purchased. The transit line made development of housing possible and profitable. Once they had raked in the dough from development, they ran the transit line for a while and when it started bleeding red ink, sold it off to the gov’t.
One poster says “Georgia without Atlanta is Mississippi”. I agree. I’ll add “Atlanta without MARTA is Detroit”.
moonbat betty
December 19th, 2011
3:41 pm
I gave you vision, focus and direction as Jay complained there was none.
…or you can continue to bitch about Nathan Deal.
Take your pick.
Keep Up the Good Fight!
December 19th, 2011
3:43 pm
AmVet….. great link!
Live like a Native American…… who showed the Pilgrims how to survive. Seems that the native Americans lived and fed themselves sufficiently before the Euros showed up.
Keep Up the Good Fight!
December 19th, 2011
3:47 pm
Brosephus, I can agree with all you say about Cain. Still he did touch a few…..at least based on the complaints.
There are probably others he touched. 
josef
December 19th, 2011
3:54 pm
“Some Georgians need to get out of the way.”
Oh, and which ones would they be?
“Tear it down and srart over…”
Yeah, look at what that can lead to.
Jokes aside, it’s the problem you have in any state/country where the big city gets too big for its britches and saps the resources from the hinterlands without giving back…
Thulsa Doom
December 19th, 2011
3:55 pm
“I’ve noticed that there are fewer and fewer contested offices nowadays because of the wicked state of gerrymandering that we’ve allowed to happen.’- Brocephus
Bro,
Yeah. I’ve kinda noticed the same thing. And because of gerrymandering its made things even more partisan because now districts are solidly r or d with little chance of changing. The last I read on the subject was that there are really only 60 house seats that in a typical election are up for grabs now. The rest are solidly in one camp or the other. That mean’s that white pols in solidly repub districts have little or no interest in representing all the people in their district other than their base group. Same with black pols in their districts.
The purpose was obviously to guarantee that minorities were represented by creating majority black districts but the downside is that they have little voice in other districts where their votes are written off. The law of unintended consequences at work imho.
Thulsa Doom
December 19th, 2011
3:55 pm
josef,
Get the hell outta the way.
USMC
December 19th, 2011
3:56 pm
“Nope, I think Herman Cain is a jackass.”
That sounds Racist!
moonbat betty
December 19th, 2011
3:56 pm
Is it not time for thread of newt?
josef
December 19th, 2011
3:58 pm
“Georgia without Atlanta is Mississippi…”
And what’s wrong with that…Mississippi has been able through careful and forward looking planning to avoid a single hydra city and to spread out its development into the secondary and tertiary cities, keeping its rural population more stable in that they have access to industrial/technological jobs without having to relocate to the city…best of both worlds…it’s development plan should be studied…
josef
December 19th, 2011
4:01 pm
moonbat
Bring up the Late Misunderstanding…we’ll get one
Thulsa
Basically that’s what’s at work…the capitalist running dogs of the Occupation.imperialism…Carpetbaggers and Scalwags in bidness since 1865….
moonbat betty
December 19th, 2011
4:03 pm
I’m going to ask Ben Franklin what he thinks and get back to you guys…
Brosephus
December 19th, 2011
4:03 pm
The purpose was obviously to guarantee that minorities were represented by creating majority black districts but the downside is that they have little voice in other districts where their votes are written off. The law of unintended consequences at work imho.
That’s not the complete issue from where I sit. That’s part of it, but the other half of it is a group that refuses to cede power. When you have to fix the election to ensure you get elected, it should say more about your lack of ability and more about your thirst for power and office. A good legislator will get elected and re-elected regardless of how his district is shaped or made up. When you only have to work to please a few, your decision making skills suffer because you no longer have to look at the totality of the circumstances or long term effects.
Jm
December 19th, 2011
4:07 pm
Bro
Drop the 50-50 thing
It’s a good rule to keep incompetent bureaucrats from turning marta into a modern LIRR (look it up)
Jm
December 19th, 2011
4:09 pm
Bro
And if you need help, LIRR turned into a POS breaking down all the time because of capital disinvestment from clueless administrators
Brosephus
December 19th, 2011
4:11 pm
jm
I personally think that if the GA Assembly isn’t gonna fund MARTA from the general budget, they don’t need a single word in how MARTA operates. Incompetent bureaucrats arise from legislators attempting to be agency heads. If we quit trying to make MBA’s more important than they really are, there are qualified people who can run these things and do a damn good job at it. If you won’t allow your gardener to perform a root canal on you, why would you let a representative dictate MARTA’s operation?
Adam
December 19th, 2011
4:11 pm
Correction: When a politician gets involved, he doesn’t mess with the program or project in question in the ways *I* would, therefore he must be wrong, therefore he screwed up, therefore all politicians suck, therefore the government needs to be starved of revenue.
This is what qualifies as logic for some conservatives. And you and I both only WISH it was a straw man….
Brosephus
December 19th, 2011
4:13 pm
jm
MARTA’s doomed from the start because they don’t have adequate funding to even operate as a bare bones outfit. Until you get past that part, none of the other stuff really matters.
ODD OWL
December 19th, 2011
4:17 pm
The Republican controlled Georgia State Legislature has become an Ole Boys Oligarchy. Governor Nathan Deal, the Grand Wizard of states rights and the Republicans have used gerrymandering to usurp total political power in Georgia. Democrats make up about 48% of the voters in Georgia, but don’t have any political power. We Democrats demand a power sharing arrangement. The Georgia state Legislature must embrace proportional representation. We Democrats demand 48% of the political power in the State Government. Georgia Democrats need to get the lead out, energize themselves and get to work. They seem to be in some kind of melancolic malaise. Georgia Democrats need to bring in the Constitutional scholar Lani Guinier to handle the negotiations with the Rebel Republicans.
Obama is over
December 19th, 2011
4:26 pm
Apparantly Adam likes the way the politicos have been handling everything. Maybe he was one of the folks meeting the Head of the Marta board for a romantic rendezvous in Hartsfield bathrooms a few years ago.
josef
December 19th, 2011
4:29 pm
Odd Owl
“…handle the negotiations with the Rebel Republicans.”
Call ‘em what they are…Scalawags sucking up to the Carpetbaggers…
pogo
December 19th, 2011
4:31 pm
Well said Josef.
Brosephus
December 19th, 2011
4:34 pm
ODD OWL
It does no good to ask for political power when you’ll still end up with a bunch of jackasses in office. Change the political climate to remove career politicians, and things might get better without having to proportion representation.
josef
December 19th, 2011
4:36 pm
Pogo
I don’t know what else to call it…Atlanta, Georgia and the whole South seems to have sold its soul to the devil just so they can have some commodity cheese to put on their grits…
Victor Midtown
December 19th, 2011
4:37 pm
Sometime, I think the problem is too much imagination. Can we just build the BeltLine … without the inevitable “design competition” and the boring “art components.” Just lay down the track, erect station shelters and ticket machines and get it rolling. What we need are simple, functional, accessible and affordable transportation projects – that can be done quickly and we all can – literally – get on board.
josef
December 19th, 2011
4:40 pm
Victor
“What we need are simple, functional, accessible and affordable transportation projects – that can be done quickly and we all can – literally – get on board.”
It wouldn’t hurt to have a population that doesn’t think it’s too good to use it…
kayaker 71
December 19th, 2011
4:45 pm
Odd Owl,
You had something other than a “proportional arrangement” during the 130 or so years that the Democrats held sway over the Georgia General Assembly until early in this decade. It’s our turn at the trough. Lani Guinier, the “Quota Queen”…… and why would you chose her as a Constitutional scholar to deal with the Evil Republicans?
md
December 19th, 2011
4:47 pm
I’d say there are many outside the Atl that could give a rats patoudie about Atl’s traffic problems……
josef
December 19th, 2011
4:49 pm
md
True…but, well, they’re an inferior lot of atavists who are just in the way…they need to be told their place and stay in it…
Keep Up the Good Fight!
December 19th, 2011
4:50 pm
Brosephus…. here’s a good story for you about a simple businessman who was tired of being yanked around by federal regulations and just decided that he could be a better yanker by just doing it on his own. See what happens when the government gets out of the way!
md
December 19th, 2011
4:52 pm
“It wouldn’t hurt to have a population that doesn’t think it’s too good to use it…”
Don’t think that’s the issue with the “outliers”……way back when, I tried to use it coming in from the burbs…….but the stations weren’t accessible enough to make it worthwhile. By the time I sat in traffic to get to the station, I could just as easily sit in traffic to get to my destination……..and have the option of having a car when I got there. There is something to be said about being able to change plans at the spur of the moment………like an inpromtu date where the trains don’t go.