On Herman Cain, Donald Trump and an eager Newt Gingrich

As the political world waits with bated breath for word of Herman Cain’s decision (scheduled for 11 a.m. tentatively rescheduled to 1:30), a couple of interesting tidbits about the GOP debate schedule:

– The GOP race has, at times, seemed more like a reality show than a political process, a fact that probably worries the wiser heads in the party because it diminishes the candidates as well as the party in the eyes of the public. Given all that, bringing in reality star Donald Trump to moderate a debate sounds like a disastrous decision. Will it bring more eyeballs to the TV to watch? Probably. But they’ll be drawn by the circus potential, and Trump being Trump, that potential will probably be realized.

Who’s next? Snooki? I hear she votes Republican.

– Recognizing that the race has come down to two competitors, Mitt Romney and Newt Gingrich, Human Events and Red State went to the two campaigns to propose a two-man debate between them later this month. Gingrich quickly accepted; Romney turned them down. RealClearPolitics reports:

“As Joe Guerriero, publisher of Human Events and Red State, put it to RCP: “Newt was all over it, and the Romney camp basically said no. It wasn’t a harsh no, but it was a no.”

A Gingrich spokesman confirmed to RCP that the candidate was interested and accepted the invitation, but a Romney spokeswoman didn’t return a request for comment.”

In strategic terms, I understand why Romney’s people turned down the invitation. But the optics aren’t good. It plays into Gingrich’s reputation as a superior debater ready to take on Barack Obama, and makes Romney look like he’s avoiding a confrontation, which plays into a less positive piece of his own reputation.

– Finally, Politico has a nice piece up about the internal, eternal war being waged between Good Newt and Bad Newt, focusing particularly on Bad Newt’s flair for pomposity (he beats even Trump in that regard, although I’ll concede it’s not by much). Some key moments include:

“The degree to which I challenge the establishment and the degree to which I’m willing to follow ideas and solutions to their natural consequence without regard to Republican or Democratic political correctness makes me probably the most experienced outsider in modern times,” he told Radio Iowa.

Even descriptions of his wife Callista fall prey to aggrandizement: “She actually describes herself as being a cross between Nancy Reagan and Laura Bush with just a slight bit of Jackie Kennedy tossed in and I think there is, somewhere swirling in there, the model Callista would like to live up to.”…

“I’m waiting for him to say, ‘Literally, I’m the smartest guy to ever run for president,’ ” said the (unaligned GOP) insider, adding that comparisons of Callista as Nancy Reagan fuel the notion that he thinks of himself as a new incarnation of The Gipper. “He’s now kind of like the crazy scientist that’s having his science proven correct….and you just don’t know what the hell’s gonna happen next.”…

Gingrich “only has two modes — attack and brag,” explained one veteran GOP strategist.

– Jay Bookman

444 comments Add your comment

Midori

December 3rd, 2011
9:06 am

Morning all.

Will this clown car ever park?

Midori

December 3rd, 2011
9:06 am

oooo — firsties!! :)

Thulsa Doom

December 3rd, 2011
9:16 am

Actually the clown car has been parked at the white house for almost 3 years. And the clown car, just like the economy under the clown driver, is stuck in park.

Cain & Fable

December 3rd, 2011
9:16 am

Running for President Checklist

Sexually harass coworkers…check
Have extramarital affair…check

DON’T RUN……Check

carlosgvv

December 3rd, 2011
9:23 am

In a country of over 300 million it’s next to impossible to believe the current cast of characters is the best we can come up with for president. In fact, it’s much easier to believe that our politcal system is essentially ruined and we need to start over. Maybe it’s just a matter of time before we get a restart. The question is who will do the restarting and what will we wind up with?

Vinny

December 3rd, 2011
9:26 am

You libs elected the gaff-o-minute machine Biden and the disaster-in-chief,Barry “Obumbles” Obama, into office and you have the gall to criticise the Republican candidates?

I can’t believe you numbskulls are going to run Obama again next year. He and Joe have been a disaster.

Jm

December 3rd, 2011
9:27 am

Regarding the Trump thing. I’m just flabbergasted. What a joke. Maybe they’ll put him on the back bench…. But no matter, it still looks ridiculous

Midori

December 3rd, 2011
9:29 am

Vinny and Thulsa – I don’t know which is the bigger joke: you guys or your excellent “field” :lol:

Kamchak

December 3rd, 2011
9:30 am

“She actually describes herself as being a cross between Nancy Reagan and Laura Bush with just a slight bit of Jackie Kennedy…

The truth is a bit more sordid than that.

A Washington insider, banging the Speaker of the House while he was still married.

Jm

December 3rd, 2011
9:30 am

Calista is a joke

Newt as President is a complete roll of the dice. You have no idea what you’d get. Possibly semi chaos.

Romney 2012

Jm

December 3rd, 2011
9:32 am

I agree with kam at 9:30

I have to go throw up now

Vinny

December 3rd, 2011
9:35 am

Midori- The biggest joke is Barry Obama and his sidekick Joe Biden.
They have screwed up America .

It will be great to see them tossed out of office in 2012.

Jm

December 3rd, 2011
9:36 am

Don’t re-elect the impotent President Obama

(I can only agree with hard core liberals for so many posts in one day)

Vinny

December 3rd, 2011
9:36 am

Obama only has two modes – blame, and blame.

ByteMe

December 3rd, 2011
9:36 am

Huntsman quickly blew off Trump — the others are still considering it last I saw — but he DID accept a one-on-one debate with Newt… that it seems Romney turned down. Hmmm…..

Thulsa Doom

December 3rd, 2011
9:37 am

Midori,

At least our “field” wouldn’t wage an all out assault on the American economy the way Obama is doing. Elmer Fudd would be a better potus than the community organizer. At least Elmer couldn’t do further damage.

ByteMe

December 3rd, 2011
9:38 am

Poor Vinnie voted for the cranky old guy and the hot chick with more lift in her bra than in her head.

ByteMe

December 3rd, 2011
9:39 am

Yeah, Thulsa, an “all out assault on our economy” that has corporations with larger profits than ever before.

So I’ll bet you are thinking now “yeah, he failed at that too!” :roll:

Jay

December 3rd, 2011
9:39 am

George Will today is also funny re: Gingrich:

Granted, his grandiose rhetoric celebrating his “transformative” self is entertaining: Recently he compared his revival of his campaign to Sam Walton’s and Ray Kroc’s creations of Wal-Mart and McDonald’s, two of America’s largest private-sector employers. There is almost artistic vulgarity in Gingrich’s unrepented role as a hired larynx for interests profiting from such government follies as ethanol and cheap mortgages. His Olympian sense of exemption from standards and logic allowed him, fresh from pocketing $1.6 million from Freddie Mac (for services as a “historian”), to say, “If you want to put people in jail,” look at “the politicians who profited from” Washington’s environment.

His temperament — intellectual hubris distilled — makes him blown about by gusts of enthusiasm for intellectual fads, from 1990s futurism to “Lean Six Sigma” today. On Election Eve 1994, he said a disturbed South Carolina mother drowning her children “vividly reminds” Americans “how sick the society is getting, and how much we need to change things. . . . The only way you get change is to vote Republican.” Compare this grotesque opportunism — tarted up as sociology — with his devious recasting of it in a letter to the Nov. 18, 1994, Wall Street Journal (http://bit.ly/vFbjAk). And remember his recent swoon over the theory that “Kenyan, anti-colonial” thinking explains Barack Obama.

Gingrich, who would have made a marvelous Marxist, believes everything is related to everything else and only he understands how. Conservatism, in contrast, is both cause and effect of modesty about understanding society’s complexities, controlling its trajectory and improving upon its spontaneous order. Conservatism inoculates against the hubristic volatility that Gingrich exemplifies and Genesis deplores: “Unstable as water, thou shalt not excel.”

Midori

December 3rd, 2011
9:41 am

well Vinny – we shall see, won’t we?

Craig Lee

December 3rd, 2011
9:44 am

Hey guys “HE’S RUNNING A CONTRACT” get it ? Nobody cares he’s got a young pretty wife and you’re right, I’m 62 and he is the smartest, best informed, experienced man to ever run in my lifetime. He got your guy Bill re-elected didn’t he ? The Gingrich Obama debates will be like one of his history classes in the 70’s except Obama will be the dumbest guy in the room. I’m excited to see this

Midori

December 3rd, 2011
9:44 am

Byte,

that simpleton jibberish doesn’t even deserve acknowledgement.

He/they whip it out faster than Barney Fife pulling out his one-bullet revolver.

Kamchak

December 3rd, 2011
9:44 am

Off topic — my day of sports viewing starts off pretty fine

Blue Lions 3
Newcastle 0

Go Dawgs

Common Sense

December 3rd, 2011
9:46 am

Who was more eager to run for President than Obama, who launched his campaign for the office just after taking the office of Senator.

That probably explains why he must be so much in need of yet another vacation. The constant campaigning the last five years has left him too exhausted to even deal with the issues confronting America.

Well, that and his incompetence.

ByteMe

December 3rd, 2011
9:46 am

Anyone else get Andy Borowitz’s “Farewell Message from Herman Cain”?

But before I go, let me share with you my final thoughts on my campaign. After months of crisscrossing this great land of ours and participating in over three hundred televised debates, I am being disqualified because of an extramarital affair. And that raises the following question: are you f—ing kidding me?

I mean, let’s get real. I never heard of Libya. I didn’t know whether that CNN dude’s name was Wolf or Blitz. And my only training for running the #1 nation in the world was running its #8 pizza chain. Yet none of that, I repeat, none of that disqualified me. In fact, I was the front-f—ing-runner, as long as I kept my 9-9-9 in my pants. (I have no idea what I meant by that — I just like saying 9-9-9.)

But here’s the part that really kills me. You’re kicking me to the curb because I was messing around, and instead you’re going with… Newt Gingrich? I repeat: are you f—ing kidding me? Oh, I know what you’re saying: you love Newt because he’s an “intellectual.” Well, Newt Gingrich is the intellectual of the Republican field the way Moe was the intellectual of the Stooges.

Thulsa Doom

December 3rd, 2011
9:48 am

Byte me,

Looks like you need some help with your basic understanding of economics. Companies profits are at all time highs because they are becoming cash cows. In other words they are sitting tight, cutting extra fat, not spending money on new hiring, new training, new plants or stores- expansion, new investment, new R&D, all of which cost significant amounts of money and resources. The reason they are not doing any of this is either because of a complete lack of faith in the economy under the community organizer, a strangling regulatory environment, or both. Bottom line is that if they expect the economy to continue to suck under this idiot then they will react accordingly regarding new hiring, investment and expansion, R&D, etc. Its really not that hard to understand. Even for the liberals.

Common Sense

December 3rd, 2011
9:48 am

@byteme,

With an economy that is the largest in our history, why would you not expect profits to be the largest?

Do you really expect the economy to be the largest and the profits to shrink?

Why do you think people are in business in the first place?

Let’s try a bit of logic shall we?

carlosgvv

December 3rd, 2011
9:49 am

Midori

Obama is not a good president. He seems to basiclly try to make everyone happy and winds up making no one happy. The people running for the Republican nomination are no better. So, in the more or less words of Paul Simon – “laugh about it, shout about it, anyway you choose, every way you look at it you lose”. Bad and worse are our only choices.

Midori

December 3rd, 2011
9:49 am

and that gents is that – in a nutshell:

Well, Newt Gingrich is the intellectual of the Republican field the way Moe was the intellectual of the Stooges.

:lol:

however, to be fair that was true of Moe. He actually kept the act together despite many, many obstacles and did their taxes to boot.

but still :lol:

Hi Kammy :)

Midori

December 3rd, 2011
9:50 am

I agree Carlos.

On all fronts.

ByteMe

December 3rd, 2011
9:50 am

You guys are funny. Here you complain that Obama’s killing the economy in one breath and then acknowledge that companies are doing great in the next one and don’t have any idea what “cognitive dissonance” means.

Thulsa Doom

December 3rd, 2011
9:50 am

Obama voters for 2012 remind me of dawg fans regarding the LSU game. They are delusional enough to think that they actually have a chance to win.

Common Sense

December 3rd, 2011
9:53 am

Oh they are not doing great Byteme. Is the economy doing great? Because you should use the same adjective for BOTH since they are both the largest in US history, right?

Did I mention that corporate tax payments are also at record highs? Or that the government is collecting as much in taxes as the companies are in profits?

Apply a little “consistent” logic, would you?

Kamchak

December 3rd, 2011
9:55 am

Hiya, Midori! :wink:

ByteMe

December 3rd, 2011
9:57 am

Common: yawn. You should look at the drivel Thulsa originally posted “Obama is waging an all-out assault on the American economy”. If that crap were true, the economy would be shrinking, not growing. And yet… it’s growing nicely, thank you very much. You want blame Obama for that, have at it.

Jay

December 3rd, 2011
9:57 am

Craig, in my experience, the smartest guy in the room is always the one who isn’t running around telling everyone that he’s the smartest guy in the room. Because that’s just not smart.

Thulsa Doom

December 3rd, 2011
9:57 am

Common sense,

I was watching Wall Street week with Louis Rukeyeser many years ago before Iraq and defense stocks were at alltime highs during peacetime. Seems counterintuitive and one would think that defense stocks would be high during war time because they have to replace munitions being used up. Nope. The analyst explained that defense stocks are most profitable and become cash cows during peace time. The reason why? Because they aren’t having to spend enormous sums of money in R&D which makes up the bulk of their costs. As you can see you can try and explain what is going on to liberals but the liberal mindset just doesn’t lend itself to logic and reality. It just doesn’t.

Ronnie Raygun

December 3rd, 2011
10:00 am

That should be on pay-per-view. Trump (a trust fund baby 1%) moderating a debate between Mittens (a technocratic career job destroyer who invented Obamacare) and Newter ( an adulterous blowhard who actually wrote and promoted sections of Obamacare back in the 90s) on how bad their ideas used in Obamacare really are. Classic.

JamVet

December 3rd, 2011
10:00 am

This is why I love today’s Republican candidates. The bounty of unwitting comedic material is almost endless. yet they and their insanely gullible supporters, take themselves oh so seriously and never get the jokes.

Newt Gingrich is the intellectual of the Republican field the way Moe was the intellectual of the Stooges.

Now that is funny, cons.

Fannie and Freddie’s “hired larynx” feigning to be an outsider? How nice. The sloganeering sophist pretending to be an intellectual? Really? I’ve seen him on Faux News say things that would get a ninth grader chastised for being beyond ignorant.

And if his wife, Skeletor, is in any way imaginable, remotely comparable to the classy, sophisticated Jackie O, I’m the new Carey Grant.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pvbAseCN8F8

Common Sense

December 3rd, 2011
10:01 am

Byteme,

It is growing very nicely? Seriously.

If that is your belief, you should stop commenting on economic issues.

This economy is so far from it’s potential growth rate that it is depressing.

Guys like you conclude that if growth is above 0 it is good, and below 0 bad.

The truth is more like if growth is above 3.5% things are good, and below 3.5% bad.

!.5% growth? Horrible.

Thulsa Doom

December 3rd, 2011
10:04 am

“And yet… it’s growing nicely, thank you very much.”- Byte me.

The disconnect between reality and the liberal mindset on display. Lemme help you out there with a thingy called a FACT sir. The Federal Reserve said the economy grew at a paltry 1% annual clip during the first 6 months of the year. Is that what your mind considers “growing nicely”. Surely you jest?

What was that? Unemployment went down and private sector employment grew by 120,000 jobs? Yes. But about 50,000 of those jobs were seasonal and will end after the Holidays. You can expect unemployment to rise right back again in the first 6 months of next year. The numbers are also distorted because about 300,000 people simply gave up looking for work and no longer count in the U3 unemployment numbers. Perhaps you could educate yourself on U3 and U6 unemployment numbers sir.

Now I heard on the news somewhere that the economic growth may be revised upward to a whopping 2%. WOW! If your mind considers that to be “nice economic growth” than that explains a lot as to why you are a liberal.

Blue Teletubbie

December 3rd, 2011
10:04 am

I like the Gray Teletubbie. Coooooo.

Thulsa Doom

December 3rd, 2011
10:08 am

Moderate economic growth would be 3 or 3.5%. We aren’t even at an economic growth rate that would be considered moderate. And yet the liberal sheeple think that the economy is “growing nicely”. Dang these people are funny.

Jay

December 3rd, 2011
10:08 am

“The truth is more like if growth is above 3.5% things are good, and below 3.5% bad.”

Well, if you insist, Common Sense.

However, by that definition things were “good” for just six out of 32 quarters in the Bush administration, and “bad” for 26 of 32. On an annual basis, things were good for just one year — 2004 — and bad for the other seven.

JamVet

December 3rd, 2011
10:08 am

Morning, Doom.

Re your 9:50, someone better tell that to the bookies, who have Barry up big and bigger, depending on who the opponent is.

And though nowhere near perfect, those guys are not in the business of losing money.

I’ll vote against him again, but his almost certain victory next November seems to be a big dose of karma for those that voted in the (W)orst ever in. Twice. (And who would do so again, given the chance.)

The next GOP “debate”…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4ZgVRJ-H8U

Jm

December 3rd, 2011
10:09 am

Trump to Cain: you’re fired

Midori

December 3rd, 2011
10:13 am

there you go again Jay – confusing them with facts :lol:

Common Sense

December 3rd, 2011
10:13 am

Jay has to resort to jumping on the Bush era. Was I defending the Bush era as the US reaching it’s potential? No.

Without the bounce off the bottom of the recession, the Obama admin would have no quarters of growth above 3.5%.

So Bookman, you think this economy is running at it’s potential at 1.5-2% growth?

Are you taking the side that these are good numbers?

Kamchak

December 3rd, 2011
10:13 am

You should look at the drivel Thulsa originally posted…

Do I have to?

Can’t I just drive red-hot railroad spikes through my eyes instead?

Moderate Line

December 3rd, 2011
10:15 am

I remember when all the conservatives were falling over Perry. The Real Clear Politics average for Perry was 31.8% in mid September. Now he is at 7.2%. I believe the fact that the conservative Republicans who seem to be very fickle about who they believe can represent them will play to Obama’s advantage. It is possible hat we may get a candidate which has not been vetted by the media and will blow up once nominated since the media focuses in on the lead candidate . Romney can’t seem to gain any support from conservative Republicans but seems to have a handle on the moderate ones. At some point I feel like conservative candidates will start dropping out and Romney may be in trouble.

It has been amazing how all these conservatives come and go in this election. Also, Newt and Cain show it is better have your skeletons exposed before the election. When I look at the two I can’t see much difference between the two as far as skeletons.

The candidate that performs the best against Obama is Romney but the conservatives don’t prefer someone else. I can’t imagine Newt and Cain appealing to moderates who will ultimately decide the election. If the unemployment rate trends downward then moderates will swing to Obama.” Big IF”

Jay

December 3rd, 2011
10:16 am

Thulsa, we’ve had nine consecutive quarters of growth and 2011 already boasts the biggest annual increase in jobs since 2006. Now, the Eurozone mess puts all that at risk, but improvement IS happening.

Given what we faced when Obama took office — a decline of 8.9 percent in fourth-quarter of ‘08, and 6.7 percent in the first quarter of ‘09, the biggest two-quarter decline since they started measuring it in quarters in 1947 — that ain’t bad.

Jm

December 3rd, 2011
10:16 am

If trump will only kick Gingrich off the island….

Thulsa Doom

December 3rd, 2011
10:17 am

JamVet,

Damn that 3 stooges video was funny. I think Obama goes down because when we get to the debates whether we like him or not Newt is a bright guy and there is no question he would annihilate Obama in a debate. All he has to do is talk about the economy and the debt under Obama. Even flip flopper Romney would take him down and take the battleground states such as Michigan and a northeastern state or 2 possibly.

As for betting I think I’m going to go heavy on LSU over the dawgs. I say LSU by 3 touchdowns.

Retired Vet

December 3rd, 2011
10:17 am

Jay, ever notice how when the spot light hits Gingrinch or any of the other late night comedy material providers aka Republican candidates, there is no defense by their supporters only spewing their hatred of the POTUS. Listen conservatives, it’s not Mr. Obama’s fault that you guys have a cast of characters who are great comedy acts.

Midori

December 3rd, 2011
10:20 am

speaking of the Stooges, there’s a 3 Stooges Marathon on IFC right now :)

Curley kills me :lol:

Common Sense

December 3rd, 2011
10:20 am

So then what is your problem Bookman?

We have the largest economy in US history.

The problem is that once you admit this, then it it follows that just saying the growth is positive IS NOT sufficient.

A larger growth rate is needed to be positive in it’s impact. You could admit that fact is true.

But you won’t. Because it’s more important to tout 9 consecutive quarters than to honestly say they are sub par despite being positive.

TaxPayer

December 3rd, 2011
10:21 am

I think the Republicans are mostly excited to hear that Trump is moderating a debate because he’s sure to introduce a swimsuit competition into the show. Of course, while each candidate is laid near bare, Trump will fire off the question that will truly determine which candidate is most worthy of the GOP crown — “Where was Barack Hussein Obama born?” I suspect the Donald has already determined how he will visually confirm whether the male contestants are truly aroused by the topic and given that Michele is not truly a contender, that should not pose a problem.

Jay

December 3rd, 2011
10:21 am

Common, I am taking the position that those numbers are a HELLUVA lot better than they would be had we followed the current GOP economic prescriptions of no TARP, no stimulus, no rescue of the auto industry, etc.

If we had taken that course, unemployment might be 15 percent today instead of 8.6 percent. I have no doubt whatsoever about which was the proper course.

Mary Elizabeth

December 3rd, 2011
10:23 am

“Obama is not a good president. He seems to basiclly try to make everyone happy and winds up making no one happy.”

—————————————————–

Just a thought to insert and then I’m gone.

By commonly held perceptions, Obama’s style appears, to some, to be that of trying to make everyone happy. However, I think those commonly held perceptions are wrong. Lack of bombast does not equate to lack of strength or command. I do not perceive Obama as “trying to make everyone happy.” I perceive that he knows what battles to fight and which ones are futile, while he keeps his long-ranged goals primary in his vision, and thus his plan of action. In his latest maneuver, defense cuts will be forthcoming in 2013 to Republican surprise and consternation. I believe Obama saw how those dominoes would fall well in advance. This man has mental strength who combines visionary idealism with strong pragmatism. Just reread this Nobel Peace Prize Speech and you will see both qualities in well-honed balance. It is simply a bonus that he has a pleasant, cool-headed temperament.

Midori

December 3rd, 2011
10:24 am

Common Sense

December 3rd, 2011
10:25 am

Your inability to question how things are, only to say this is better than what would have happened shows just how little you grasp.

You critical thinking skills are abysmal.

Obama has THE LARGEST economy in US history. And the only reason the unemployment rate is falling is because so many have abandoned the search for work.

And you consider that success.

Mary Elizabeth

December 3rd, 2011
10:28 am

Post Script: A fact I learned yesterday. There have been 3 million private sector jobs created in the last 21 months.

Jay

December 3rd, 2011
10:34 am

Common, as a matter of simple logic, how could we have the biggest economy ever in history if that economy has not in fact been growing?

Furthermore, by the groundrules you attempt to set, we are not allowed to compare the economy today to that under the Bush administration. We are also not allowed to compare the economy today to what it might have been had we followed current Republican policies. So what the hell ARE we allowed to compare it to?

Thulsa Doom

December 3rd, 2011
10:35 am

Jay,

We all acknowledge Obama inherited a tough economy. However, as you pointed out in one of your graphs a couple of months ago job losses had completely bottomed and had already begun rebounding the month Obama came into office. In that regard the worst was over with before he came in and the bottom had already been breached. The only way to go was up.

Secondly 2 1/2 years into his presidency Reagan had us booming at a 7% economic growth rate. The paltry 1% growth rate at the same point in Obama’s administration makes me wonder if this isn’t the worst recovery from recession since the depression. And don’t say Reagan inherited a much better situation. If I remember correctly Volcker had to trigger a recession to bring down inflation which was rocketing along at something crazy like 16%. Interest rates likewise were out of control. And Reagan also had unemployment around 7.5% or so. So the first 2 years of his presidency were an austerity period just to bring inflation in check. After that bitter medicine the rest is history and the economic numbers regarding growth and employment speak for themselves.

Obama inherited the housing meltdown but he did not inherit runaway inflation or interest rates and nearly 3 years into his presidency his economic growth rates can be considered nothing short of abysmal, particularly when compared to Reagan. The facts are the facts and there’s no putting lipstick on this pig. Economic recovery and economic growth is substantially less under this president than what should reasonably be expected.

TaxPayer

December 3rd, 2011
10:35 am

Has anyone asked Boehner and his merry “men” when they plan on taking more from the poor to give to the wealthiest so they can trickle down some jobs. I seem to recall the Republican candidates conning their constituency by spouting that word — Jobs — amongst other lies, during the last election. Or was Ryan’s adventure on the yellow brick road the extent of their plan. If only 2.8% unemployment rate could be achieved… let’s try clicking our heels together just one more time. :lol:

Thulsa Doom

December 3rd, 2011
10:40 am

“This man has mental strength who combines visionary idealism with strong pragmatism”- Mary E.

“Visionary idealism”? As if visionary idealism is going to solve everyday, real life problems.

If someone can describe an example of Obama’s visionary idealism combining with strong pragmatism then please cite an example of this.

Common Sense

December 3rd, 2011
10:44 am

What is so difficult to grasp that growing is NOT ENOUGH.

If you had a salary increase every year since you started working yet it was only 1.5%, would that be enough?

Seriously, if an economy larger by 1.5-2% a year was sufficient, then we would already have the answer.

You are wanting to compare it to Bush to say “look how good we are doing”.

If we do that, let’s look at the unemployment rates during the Bush years as an indicator as well.

Release yourself from the idea that if it is growing things are good. Then ask what growth rate we need to make real improvements in this economy.

Once you have done that, then you can move on to what are we doing to make things better.

Your logic says that 2% growth going forward is positive. I’d like to know how many more quarters you will be happy to accept such an anemic growth rate.

Zero should not be your benchmark for whether or not the economy is doing good. The number should be higher. I have my benchmark. Pick your own.

But when you pick 0, then it is obvious you have not really thought it through.

Jay

December 3rd, 2011
10:45 am

Thulsa, economists will tell you that what Reagan and Volcker (largely Volcker) faced was a lot more manageable than this. As you accurately described it, it was a recession brought about by a calculated and necessary decision by Volcker to fight runaway inflation with very high interest rates.

In that sense, it was a consciously created recession, and thus more or less always under control.

A global recession and near depression brought on by the biggest financial crisis in 80 years is an entirely different beast, and much more difficult to repair. I think even conservative economists will tell you that there is really very little comparison between the two types of problems.

Thulsa Doom

December 3rd, 2011
10:48 am

“Post Script: A fact I learned yesterday. There have been 3 million private sector jobs created in the last 21 months.”-Mary E.

And yet the unemployment rate remains at 8.6% and the U6 number substantially higher.

Economic analysts estimate that we need approximately 150,000 new jobs created each month minimally just to keep pace with new entrants into the work force. If that is true and we have economic numbers for the past 34 months then we needed just under 5 million new jobs to have been created(5.1 million to be exact) in order to keep up and just tread water so to speak. That still leaves us over 2 million jobs short. Just the facts ma’am.

carlosgvv

December 3rd, 2011
10:49 am

Doom

You and others report that “about 300,000 people simply gave up looking for work”. I’m having a difficult time understanding this. Who is financially supporting them? In all my years of working I was laid off a number of times. Giving up looking for a job was not an option. If I wanted a roof over my family’s head and food on the table, I had to find some kind of work. So, how is giving up lookin for work an option now?

Thulsa Doom

December 3rd, 2011
10:56 am

“A global recession and near depression brought on by the biggest financial crisis in 80 years is an entirely different beast, and much more difficult to repair.” – Jay

2 things. Number one that is an opinion and not a fact.

No. 2 is that Reagan faced his own financial institution collapse. The savings and loan debacle of the 80s resulted in the failing of 757 financial institutions and costed about 88 billion which 25 years ago was significantly more money than it is now. New housing starts also collapsed between 86 and 91. But this didn’t stop the Reagan economic juggernaut on the way to 20 million new jobs created from the bottom of the 80-81 recession.

You guys got more excuses for Obama’s dismal economic performance than Jimmy Carter has peanuts.

Welcome to the Occupation

December 3rd, 2011
11:01 am

Vinny: “You libs elected the gaff-o-minute machine Biden and the disaster-in-chief,Barry “Obumbles” Obama, into office and you have the gall to criticise the Republican candidates?”

Jaw. Slacked.

St Simons - we're on Dawg time

December 3rd, 2011
11:02 am

i love the smell of con desperation in the morning

Take your whoopin cons.
12 more years, counting Hillary/Warren

Snoop Dawg concert on the WH lawn next November. Be there.

Cmon saaaaaang it cons – SNOOOP DAWWWGY DAWWWG heheh

Medicare for All by 2016, death to for-profit health insurance cos.

TaxPayer

December 3rd, 2011
11:03 am

You guys got more excuses for Obama’s dismal economic performance than Jimmy Carter has peanuts.

As opposed to you guys and your self-proclaimed “facts” and “we’re just one more tax cut away from our economic salvation” rhetoric and if only we could de-regulate all that ails us, etc. :roll:

jconservative

December 3rd, 2011
11:03 am

“You libs elected the gaff-o-minute machine Biden and the disaster-in-chief,Barry “Obumbles” Obama, into office…”

Actually this is incorrect. Obama/Biden was elected by the Independent vote, the same vote that will elect the next president.

Every election the Democrats and Republicans turn out about the same number of voters. Then the 6 to 8 percent of the voters, the Independents, actually elect the president.

The moral to the story is to nominate someone who can/will carry the Independent vote. Or at worse, someone who can split the Independent vote down the middle.

Hint: the Independent vote went to Obama in 2008, Bush in 2004 and Clinton in 1996.

Thulsa Doom

December 3rd, 2011
11:05 am

carlosgvv,

Some of those people may just have moved in with family, friends, or working underneath the table, etc. In any event they no longer count in the U3 unemployment numbers and now count in the U6 unemployment numbers which accounts for part time or underemployed workers, long term unemployed who gave up looking. Speaking of which here is an excellent article on the latest economic numbers.

http://www.ibj.com/unemployment-rate-falls-to-lowest-level-since-march-2009/PARAMS/article/31133

Welcome to the Occupation

December 3rd, 2011
11:07 am

Jay: “Thulsa, economists will tell you that what Reagan and Volcker (largely Volcker) faced was a lot more manageable than this. As you accurately described it, it was a recession brought about by a calculated and necessary decision by Volcker to fight runaway inflation with very high interest rates.”

Volcker technically marks the dawn of the neoliberal era, the beginning point of the counter-offensive waged by capital against the gains of the working and popular classes won in the 20th C New Deal era, the Great Rollback. The Fed has to have its mission rewritten with all but Keynes burned in effigy. This happened obviously under a Democratic administration and this agenda has been all but solidly bipartisan ever since.

“A global recession and near depression brought on by the biggest financial crisis in 80 years is an entirely different beast, and much more difficult to repair.”

According to economists not under the sway of the neoclassical model — a small minority — like Steve Keen, we’re already in a Depression, now.

Midori

December 3rd, 2011
11:07 am

Simons – don’t forget the bbq and plenty of 40 ouncers!!

getalife

December 3rd, 2011
11:10 am

Are you dawgs ready to face the best college team in football?

Down go the dwags like the rest of em..

Which part of LSU is # 1 do you dawgs not understand?

Geaux Tigers!

Thulsa Doom

December 3rd, 2011
11:13 am

jconservative,

On the other hand if we did re-elect Obama we could have another 4 years of Joe Biden gaffes. Something to think about and I think Obama should make that part of his re-election platform- re-elect me and you will have Joe Biden gaffes aplenty to humor us in a time of misery. I mean why not? He’s got nothing else to run on.

Thulsa Doom

December 3rd, 2011
11:15 am

getalife,

The best college football team really isn’t determined until after the bcs title game. Until then we just have polls. I have one word that will torment you and make you cry. “REMATCH!”

Mick

December 3rd, 2011
11:16 am

doom

The only republican solution to everything is tax cuts, if that were true, we should have experienced massive boom times during the previous administration. Instead, they opted to turn a blind eye toward regulating just about anything. This real estate collapse is not finished and everyone who overextended just have to wait it out and keep paying down their debt. Obama is your daily whipping boy for all ills, it’s just a conned opinion not backed up by facts…

JamVet

December 3rd, 2011
11:26 am

Doom, saying BHO inherited a tough economy is like saying the Titanic had a little problem with a piece of ice!

This Fab Four cover is just so fine…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wn5lX2khB2g

Thulsa Doom

December 3rd, 2011
11:31 am

JamVet,

Always with the cutting humor. I have to admit I like that iceberg vs ice analogy. Nice video. Me loves me some fine Susanna Hoffs.

Mick

December 3rd, 2011
11:31 am

One thing is for sure, I can’t wait until this presidential election cycle plays itself out. Maybe we can get the right majorities and actually solve some problems before it all starts over again…

Thulsa Doom

December 3rd, 2011
11:35 am

Mick,

Tax cuts is not the end all be all of a healthy economy. I think we suffer more from govt interference in the economy and burdensome regulation than from high marginal tax rates. As for capital gains tax rates I’m on record as being for raising the cap gains tax rate from 15 to 18-19%. Its only when you go over 20% that you begin to affect investor behavior and begin to lessen tax revenue maximization.

As for marginal tax rates here is an interesting read not only on macro economic policy but on marginal tax rates worldwide.

http://www.econlib.org/library/Enc/MarginalTaxRates.html

JamVet

December 3rd, 2011
11:38 am

Any takers on whether Herman uses the following words?

Lynch. Plantation. Brainwashed. And my personal fave, conservative black man

finn mccool

December 3rd, 2011
11:38 am

Why don’t the repubs just run kermit or miss piggy? About as much chance of beating obama as any current runners.

Mick

December 3rd, 2011
11:43 am

doom

Bottom line: Are you going to be making more money this year than last year? I am, I feel lucky about that but also I have positioned myself correctly for the times we live in. I have had to help keep several family members afloat, so I am still be stretched but I am thankful for what I have and am able to do to help out…

very xmas

December 3rd, 2011
11:43 am

We are going to need Obama2lead us through the coming Euro Catastrophe. The GOPeeTards can play with themselves all they want, after all, it’s free.

JamVet

December 3rd, 2011
11:43 am

It’s turning into a great Saturday morning…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AP4KIrvfiJo

Thulsa Doom on the Obama bandwagon

December 3rd, 2011
11:44 am

That’s it. My decision is made. I’m voting for Obama. My logic? Simple. He screwed less badly than I expected him to screw up in his secretary of the treasury pick. We all remember when Jon Corzine was on the short list for Treasury sec. But instead Obama stuck with tax cheat tim geitner. It coulda been much worse. If Corzine lost 1.2 billion with MF Global than how much would he have lost as treasury sec? 1.2 trillion? Yeah. I know. Obama screwed up with the tax cheat Geitner. But it coulda been much worse with the crook Corzine. For that reason I think I have to go with Obama on the premise that he doesn’t screw up quite as bad as I thought he does.

Thulsa Doom

December 3rd, 2011
11:46 am

finn mccool,

Where ya been? We’re running Elmer Fudd on the premise that he’s smarter than Obama. And he is.

Jay

December 3rd, 2011
11:50 am

OK, folks, please cease the personal sniping.

Mick

December 3rd, 2011
11:50 am

jamvet

Have to catch up later, workiing this morning – no you tube…

Thulsa Doom

December 3rd, 2011
11:51 am

Mick,

What can I say? Ya got me there. I made more money this year than last and will be making more next year as will you. But keep in mind that while you acknowledge you will be making more you also noted that you are helping support several family members who are hurting. Same here. My brother works for the state and took a 5% reduction in benefits. I’ve already helped out in some nonmonetary ways like helping him with work on his house or on the farm on weekends so that he doesn’t have to hire contractors or workers. Lotta people I know banding together to help each other. But I also know of other people being evicted, having cars repoed, etc. Unfortunately I see a lot more hurt than progress amongst friends, family, etc.

Recon 0311 2533

December 3rd, 2011
11:51 am

If Cain stays in I’d like to hear him say that he would take an independently administered lie detector test and challenge his accusers to do the same. The left does fear this man as a candidate and believe like many that while he probably wouldn’t win the nomination if his popularity was such as it once was he could still potentially take from Obama a small percentage of the black vote even on the campaign trail for the successful Republican nominee. Obama couldn’t afford to lose even a small percentage of the black vote after losing so much support with Independents and even some Democrats.

Kamchak

December 3rd, 2011
11:52 am

Are you dawgs ready to face the best college team in football?

Yeah, pretty much.

JamVet

December 3rd, 2011
11:54 am

I think Herman is stalling his trip down political death row to see if he can get a last minute stay from the Supreme Court.

What a fantastic article about the current state of black music in America. Great synopsis of it’s evolution and where it stands today, compared to yesteryear, when empowering songs played by truly talented artists, like this were the norm…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ojNiEl9zEO8

http://www.cnn.com/2011/12/02/showbiz/music/love-songs/index.html?hpt=hp_c1

Mick

December 3rd, 2011
11:55 am

recon

The left does not fear herman cain. It’s actually quite puzzling that there are actually people who follow cain seriously, he has no credentals for the presidency. Godfather’s pizza sukked and is an abominaton, that’s his calling card? Think about that…