Ga. legislators succumbing to rainmakers’ spiel

Back in the old days, a breed known as “rainmakers” would travel rural, unsophisticated areas of the country promising that — for an upfront fee of course — they could bring rain to drought-stricken farmland. If you read Sunday’s story by the AJC’s James Salzer, you might come to the conclusion that the breed has never gone away entirely. It has merely changed its sales pitch.

As Salzer reports, out-of-state companies have come to Georgia pitching what they call CAPCOs. It works like this:

1.) Thanks to a new law, insurance companies are given the right to contribute up to $125 million to private CAPCOs that otherwise would have been paid to the state. (The insurance companies are later repaid a share of that $125 million as an inducement to participate).

2.) CAPCO operators — the people pushing the plan in Georgia — use the $125 million to invest in local small businesses. They get paid management fees for handling the money. Even though it’s not their capital at risk, they get whatever profit the investment produces. In the end, they even get to keep the $125 million investment capital.

3.) By funneling state revenue into the hands of private investors, the state supposedly gets jobs and investment but no share of the profit. The jobs, however, are notoriously difficult to count. And as Salzer recounts, several states have tried the CAPCO approach, often producing more disappointment than employment:

“If they sold deals like this to naive little old ladies, they would go to prison,” said Republican state Sen. Glenn Grothman of Wisconsin, where a similar program has drawn criticism. “I don’t know what should happen to you if you sell deals like this to naive legislators.”

… Julia Sass Rubin, an associate public policy professor at Rutgers University and a leading critic of the CAPCO model, said states have much more cost-efficient ways to invest in small businesses to create jobs.

“The CAPCO is the classic $200 million toilet,” she said. “You don’t ask, ‘Does it flush?’ You ask, ‘Why did you pay $200 million for a toilet?’ ”

CAPCO promoters have an advocate in state Rep. Ben Harbin of Augusta, one of the more influential members of the House. The chief Georgia lobbyist for the plan, former state senator Pete Robinson, is a longtime friend of Gov. Nathan Deal and served on Deal’s transition team. Deal also backs the CAPCO approach.

The plan passed the state House on the next-to-last day of the 2011 session. When the Legislature reconvenes in January, it will be one Senate vote away from Deal’s signature.

Once that happens, the rains will start falling from the heavens, and the crops will rise green and lush from the moist Georgia earth. Or so we’re promised.

– Jay Bookman

342 comments Add your comment

SoGaVet

October 24th, 2011
8:22 am

Guy Incognito

October 24th, 2011
8:24 am

Morning Jay, and everyone. trust that WI Badger. This sounds like a scheme

Keep Up the Good Fight!

October 24th, 2011
8:24 am

The “miracles” of private capital systems saving our country and economy and the stupidity of those believing in the cure-all medicine being sold have apparently hitched their rube wagon to the Republicans……. No wonder there is a bump at the border. The turnip hits the road here!

stands for decibels

October 24th, 2011
8:28 am

From the linked piece:

“I don’t know what should happen to you if you sell deals like this to naive legislators.”

oooh, I do! I do!

Jimmy62

October 24th, 2011
8:32 am

Interestingly, if you tried to pull off most left wing economics in actual businesses, you’d go to jail, too. And frankly, plenty of ‘em should be in jail for flushing far more than $200 million down the toilet. Solyndra alone was more than twice this amount, given to a company that was already failing, with even people within the White House thinking it was a bad idea. But they still wasted half a billion on that toilet. Yet no complaint for Jay. Waste doesn’t matter unless you can make a Republican look bad, huh? I’ve never heard of CAPCO so I will do my own research rather than depend on Jay’s bias. I can guarantee if it looks like a waste I will bitch about it. But then I will bitch about all waste, not just waste from one side.

Jay

October 24th, 2011
8:36 am

Is there ANYTHING that state or local officials can do that can’t be made acceptable by the mere mention of the magic word “Obama”?

Seriously.

Common Sense

October 24th, 2011
8:40 am

The only surprise here is that Jay is against it.

Because it’s no surprise that a state government run by “democrats turned republicans” would support this sort of plan.

People had a choice last year. This plan would have gotten no where under Governor John Monds.

Georgia is getting what they deserved for only being willing to vote for someone that “can win”.

Paul

October 24th, 2011
8:40 am

““I don’t know what should happen to you if you sell deals like this to naive legislators.”

Quiz of the day: what’s the difference between a ‘naive’ legislator and a stupid legislator?

Jay

“Is there ANYTHING that state or local officials can do that can’t be made acceptable by the mere mention of the word “Obama”?

Seriously.”

Seriously?

Nope.

Some people were never released from Pavlov’s lab -

carlosgvv

October 24th, 2011
8:41 am

It takes a special mindset to be a Georgia Republican politician. You have to sell yourself totally to Big Business and do what they tell you when they tell you. So, when companies come to Georgia representing Business, it’s no wonder that most Republican politicians will believe what they are told and act accordingly. It would be interesting to know how many Democatric politicians are falling for this scheme.

carlosgvv

October 24th, 2011
8:44 am

Jay – 8:36

Of course you know that to most Republican voters, Obama is that black African Muslim Socialist who is currently in the White House and is doing his best to completely ruin America. The brainwashed Republican voters believe anything their elected officials tell them.

Karl Rove's Paymaster General

October 24th, 2011
8:45 am

Solyndra alone

13 minutes? You guys are slipping. No bonus for you this week.

Granny Godzilla

October 24th, 2011
8:46 am

We’re number last!

We’re number last!

stands for decibels

October 24th, 2011
8:47 am

I’ve never heard of CAPCO so I will do my own research rather than depend on Jay’s bias.

door, ass, et cetera.

Thomas

October 24th, 2011
8:49 am

Jay- The issue with your writing style is that you consistently point out only the negatives on any issue you are against. I read the AJC article I think yesterday on CAPCO and also would tend to be against it but it is not the economic deal from hell. Further, I think I also read in the AJC that another Asian- Chine or Korean I think- entity is locating to Metro Atlanta and providing a platform for jobs.

The difference between you and say a Reuters or Bloomber editiorialist is that they will demonstrate both sides and come to a conclusion. There was a very intellectual and factual write up on Cains 9-9-9 demonstrating that yes it is regressive and “will not work” but it is at least a step towards economic and tax reform. The editorialist came up with a for instance 14-20-14 or something to that effect.

Anyway- just a thought.

Jay

October 24th, 2011
8:49 am

Independent research is encouraged, and I hope Jimmy reports his findings here.

Jay

October 24th, 2011
8:52 am

thomas, Cain’s 9-9-9 plan cannot be “regressive and will not work” AND a step toward economic and tax reform.

If it won’t work, if it is regressive, it is not a step forward. Those are contradictions in terms.

Abe Froman

October 24th, 2011
8:52 am

So one of your arguments against these investments is that it is almost impossible to tell which jobs have been ‘created or saved’. Interesting…….

larry

October 24th, 2011
8:54 am

But…………But ……this has got to be part of Obama’s jobs plan.

Just thought i would go ahead and throw that out there.

arnold

October 24th, 2011
8:54 am

We already know how financially sound of mind the Governor is. Just look at his business history. No wonder he is for this deal.

AmVet

October 24th, 2011
8:55 am

Apparently, Wisconsin got bilked, in this somewhat sophisticated shell game, to the tune of over $8,200,000.00. No wonder Dirty Deal and his dirty gang are drooling over it…

Reporters were only able to document 132 jobs that Wilshire investments had a hand in creating in Wi.

And critics of the program say it’s a scam that has cost other states $2 billion over two decades.

Other states, like Colorado, Texas and Florida, have had problems with their programs where state leaders have complained they’ve spent hundreds of millions but not seen any real proof that jobs were created. Some critics say it’s difficult to determine what jobs CAPCOs have created because they could have been created anyway or they are part-time or temporary jobs.

States like Maryland have created programs that invest in small businesses without going through CAPCOs so that the state can keep the profit and principal generated by the investments.

Harbin and CAPCO officials say they have learned from mistakes in other states and won’t repeat them in Georgia. For example, the bill would require at least 50 percent of the money to be invested within four years to prevent the CAPCO from sitting on the funding, and more than one-third of the money would have to be invested before the state grants tax credits.

Under the Georgia bill, CAPCOs wouldn’t have to guarantee if jobs are created, but they will have to report where the money is being invested and whether the companies are seeing job growth.

Long live corporate welfare!

And sleazy, back scratching, self-serving, local politicians…

MountainMan

October 24th, 2011
8:55 am

If CAPCO’s are so great, why do they need government funding? You don’t see private money being thrown down ratholes.

stands for decibels

October 24th, 2011
8:56 am

If it won’t work, if it is regressive, it is not a step forward. Those are contradictions in terms.

But can’t you say it *nicely* so that the Cain fans’ widdle feefees aren’t hurted, Jay?

deegee

October 24th, 2011
8:56 am

Don’t we already have a small business administration? Don’t we taxpayers already pay a bureaucracy to lend money to small businesses? Why should Nathan Deal be able to circumvent the system in order to create a money funnel for his cronies?

Stevie Ray

October 24th, 2011
8:57 am

I submit that sans actual W-2’s as evidence, no government sponsored jobs plan (Obama’s Stimulus 1&2 or this crap) can credibly be acknowledged to create jobs.

If I understand this, the insurance companies who pay tax on all premiums paid by Georgia insureds can redirect this premium to these CAPCO (what does that stand for anyway?) facilities who “invest” in enhancing our agriculture business. No surprise here. Corruptresentatives on both sides of aisle can only be counted on for waste and BS. Perhaps some of you who want high earners to pay more in taxes can understand why the pushback is so strong.

For anyone to suggest the Republican’s have a corner on the “anything for re-election” style of governing, I will match any of you case to case. Take either side…

USMC

October 24th, 2011
8:58 am

“Back in the old days, a breed known as “rainmakers” would travel rural, unsophisticated areas of the country promising that — for an upfront fee of course — they could bring rain to drought-stricken farmland.”–Jay

It sounds like Jay is using from his own “stash”. You were pushing pretty hard for Legalization…

Rainmakers???? Come on Jay, you are starting to sound like the irresponsible kids and socialists down at Occupy Wall Street. :-)

stands for decibels

October 24th, 2011
8:58 am

You don’t see private money being thrown down ratholes.

It’s not often I get to say this, but clearly MountainMan has never worked in private industry.

SoGaVet

October 24th, 2011
8:59 am

“So one of your arguments against these investments is that it is almost impossible to tell which jobs have been ‘created or saved’.

Simple fix for this issue – it’s called means testing. When the legislature creates a piece of legislation like this one – or for that matter ANY legislation that offers something in exchange for tax dollars, dubious or otherwise – why not attach a fiscal note an let the proof be in the pudding.

Either it does what it’s purported to do or it doesn’t.

Waheema

October 24th, 2011
9:00 am

Jay is only concerned about “difficult to count” jobs when they are not caused by one of Obama’s failed stimulus plans.

MountainMan

October 24th, 2011
9:02 am

At least when the rats are fed with private money, it doesn’t effect me.

DannyX

October 24th, 2011
9:02 am

Speaking of rainmaker spells, I see Lake Lanier is near historic lows again, Deal better get to work and schedule another Pray For Rain.

Stevie Ray

October 24th, 2011
9:03 am

They say Democracy is simply a process where voters elect the next one to place the blame. I totally support our capitalist, democratic republic but the system is designed for failure at the legislative level. Kinda like the legal conflicts of interest the banks, investment houses, and insurers enjoyed with the repeal of psot depression legislation to keep a repeat from occuring.

If the influence money keeps flowing as it is, perhaps we should move toward national referendums on the issues (ie abortion, taxes, support of foreign campaigns et al) where these idiots can’t be trusted. I do have full confidence in them naming and renaming post offices al la Hillary Clintons most notable work in Congress..

Jay

October 24th, 2011
9:03 am

You don’t see private money being thrown down ratholes.

The best rebuttal to that claim is the $1 billion in private money invested and lost in Solyndra.

In addition, as the Salzer story suggests, Georgia legislators have been resistant to the idea of actually trying to document the economic impact of all their giveaway programs.

It’s almost as if they don’t want to know….

larry

October 24th, 2011
9:04 am

Im not suprised that Deal is in favor of this. Makes me wonder what percentage he will get out of the deal.

Meanwhile, the pawn and porn king of California is not happy with his purchase of the former ” Wilder Outdoors” . I went in there the other day and looked around. Looked like a normal pawn shop. But people hasnt exactly been beating down the door to get into the place. The guy behind the counter said he’s not real happy with the deal. I just shook my head. The man should have known better.

MountainMan

October 24th, 2011
9:06 am

Jay,

Does the public care about $ 1 billion in private lost on Solyndra? No, but we do care about the $500 million of public money lost.

Daedalus

October 24th, 2011
9:07 am

Sounds like a stupid idea; thus its a no-brainer under the Gold Dome.

This CRAPALO-CO thing will sail through the legislature and be signed into law faster than you can buy beer on Sunday.

Peter

October 24th, 2011
9:08 am

Well we know Deal lied about facing bankruptcy before the election, this will be a way to make his money back….. kind of on the same mold as Sonny Perdue.

Gosh when will a Republican step up and do the ” Right Thing ” for Georgia ?

I hope all the Republican commuters on 75 are having fun in the morning and evening !

sam

October 24th, 2011
9:10 am

i would like to offer my services managing this money…can the state direct deposit the $125M today?

Jay

October 24th, 2011
9:11 am

But that wasn’t your original point, now was it, Mountain Man.

Your original claim was that you don’t see private money sent down a rathole. And that is clearly wrong, because in the Solyndra case twice as much private money was lost.

I should also note that the Chinese government has invested some $30 billion in solar-power startups, and as a result are dominating that industry globally.

stands for decibels

October 24th, 2011
9:11 am

I’d like to know of this Galtian paradise might be, that MM speaks of, where private business’ malfeasance and/or incompetence has no effect on the lives of others.

stands for decibels

October 24th, 2011
9:12 am

can the state direct deposit the $125M today?

hey, I can do it for 1/10 the cost. for realz!

Daedalus

October 24th, 2011
9:13 am

If you think the loss of private money in investments doesn’t affect you; then you are drinking way too much tea. Remember the mortgage and stock-market meltdowns? That was a lot of private money lost (of course, you will likely blame Obama for all of that) with a huge effect on anyone who ever hoped to retire on stock or real estate investments.

Believing everything you are told, whether from a public official or private banker or hedge-fund manager, is a recipe for disaster.

Think McFly, think!

AmVet

October 24th, 2011
9:13 am

Glenn Grothman (R-West Bend): “It was a horrible bill,” he said at a legislative hearing in May. “I did vote for the bill, and I regret it.” He said the CAPCO program had “virtually no safeguards.”

Or Rep. Bob Ziegelbauer, an independent from Manitowoc: “It probably didn’t get the scrutiny it deserved. The whole CAPCO model to me is one of just giving the taxpayer dollars away to private ownership to be invested privately. And I don’t see any reason to do that.”

The firm in Wisconsin responsible for creating good jobs actually plowed half the money right back into their own parent company.

Imagine that. No safeguards, no scrutiny, no accountability.

This being on a much smaller scale, but going back about three years now, that all sounds kind of familiar, huh?

We live in the new America – the one with seemingly endless, legalized corporate thievery…

stands for decibels

October 24th, 2011
9:14 am

Anyhow, love to learn more about the Galtian Overlords’ Invisible Handjob (jm? is your iPad not turnin’ over this morning?) but this private industry producer’s gotta go produce. Later, kids.

Guy Incognito

October 24th, 2011
9:20 am

“I should also note that the Chinese government has invested some $30 billion in solar-power startups, and as a result are dominating that industry globally.”

Well, I’m sure that their public employee unions will get a healthy portion of those profits………oh wait

ITS ALL BUSHS FAULT

October 24th, 2011
9:20 am

If GA republicans were not so commited to there hate agenda and do a little research maybe people like Sonny, Nate and Johhny would not be ripping off the rest of us…..losers……OBAMA 2012……

Don't Tread

October 24th, 2011
9:22 am

CAPCO is a travesty! But hey, that half-billion dollars “invested” in Solyndra – nothing to see here, move along. :roll:

1811/0311

October 24th, 2011
9:23 am

Two interesting headlines:

“Islamist party poised to win Tunisian vote…”

“Libya’s liberation: interim ruler unveils more radical than expected plans for Islamic law”

TaxPayer

October 24th, 2011
9:23 am

Clearly, the key to this program’s success is that it is supported by Republicans, free of any association with Democrats, in particular, Obama, not labeled as a stimulus and instead likely has a Luntz-approved name that has been shown to stimulate the frontal lobes of Republicans. And of course, the fact that it is purported to be a success in Texas is more than sufficient reason to buy into it without any other supporting evidence, positive or otherwise. Anyway, how does one go about signing up to be either a CAPCO or a recipient of said funds. If you can’t beat ‘em, join in on the screwing of others. It’s the Amurican way and Republicans have perfected it to the point of it being an artform. In fact, I expect to hear the likes of Limbaugh and Boortz and Hannity coming out in defense of this program at the appropriate time, should it become necessary as a result of any negative publicity brought on by shedding light on the matter.

Soothsayer

October 24th, 2011
9:24 am

Fast forward 80 years and we have protestors setting up camp in a public square, not far from where the same exact banks that caused the Great Depression have created the Greater Depression. The biggest Wall Street banks have gotten bigger. The Federal Reserve, in collusion with the Wall Street banks, has engineered a two year stock market rally, while the average American has seen their wages decline, food and energy prices soar, home prices fall, and banks paying them .1% on their savings. Anger and disillusionment continue to build in this country like a volcano preparing to blow. Some people are angry at Washington politicians. Some are angry at Wall Street. Others aren’t sure who to be angry at. The evil oligarchy of bankers, corporate titans, and bought off Washington politicians that control the agenda and mainstream media, continue to scorn, ridicule and denigrate the middle class of America. Their financial engineering is failing. They’ve gone too far. The debt accumulation is unsustainable. The mood of the country has darkened and talk of revolution and the shadow of impending violence is growing.
——————————————————————————

“Thus did a handful of rapacious citizens come to control all that was worth controlling in America. Thus was the savage and stupid and entirely inappropriate and unnecessary and humorless American class system created. Honest, industrious, peaceful citizens were classed as bloodsuckers, if they asked to be paid a living wage. And they saw that praise was reserved henceforth for those who devised means of getting paid enormously for committing crimes against which no laws had been passed. Thus the American dream turned belly up, turned green, bobbed to the scummy surface of cupidity unlimited, filled with gas, went bang in the noonday sun.”

― Kurt Vonnegut, God Bless You, Mr. Rosewater

Bosch

October 24th, 2011
9:25 am

Wow, the GA legislators are on a roll with the good idea laws — I read about this, right after reading about how people can get out of foreclosure by using their 401ks!

The stoopids just keep on coming, and the people of GA actually vote for these merry band of morons.

Soothsayer

October 24th, 2011
9:30 am

Butch Cassidy

October 24th, 2011
9:30 am

Bosch – ” right after reading about how people can get out of foreclosure by using their 401ks!”

Yeah, I saw that to. Why all the hoops, folks could just eliminate the middleman by picking out their favorite location on the street and move directly into their cardboard box. Afterall, if you’re going to use your retirment funds to pay your mortgage, your going to end up there anyway.

hobby

October 24th, 2011
9:31 am

you won’t hear Cain blamming anything on his predessesors—he’ll just fix the problems

1811/0311

October 24th, 2011
9:32 am

“By funneling state revenue into the hands of private investors, the state supposedly gets jobs and investment but no share of the profit. The jobs, however, are notoriously difficult to count.”

Hummmmm ………….. Jay ……….. that sounds just like Obama’s stimulus plans but you seem to like that.

jm

October 24th, 2011
9:32 am

“We simply should not countenance a residential mortgage market, the largest part of our capital market, dominated by so-called government-sponsored enterprises,” Mr. Volcker said in his speech. “The financial breakdown was in fact triggered by extremely lax, government-tolerated underwriting standards, an important ingredient in the housing bubble.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/23/business/volckers-advice-for-more-financial-reform.html?_r=1

Butch Cassidy

October 24th, 2011
9:33 am

hobby – “you won’t hear Cain blamming anything on his predessesors—he’ll just fix the problems”

I’m assuming you mean the list of chores around his house. Afterall, if you plan on alienating most of the women in this country by promising to make abortion illegal, you will NEVER be elected POTUS.

Stevie Ray

October 24th, 2011
9:33 am

Can anyone counter the study done by the GAO in 2008 that suggested that based on data obtained by staffers of both parties that indicated that DC numbskulls waste up to $1 trillion dollars annually just in Medicare/Medicaid waste and IRS inefficencies? Every body refers to the idea that the M/M’s spend much more on healthcare per person than insurers. Here are a couple verifiable facts: First, the US spends $400 per person on healthcare administration costs and insurance which is more than any other industrialized nations. Second, unlike private insurers who must meet solvency requirements by each state (cash and investments on hand) unlike reliance on future taxpayers liabilities) which easily accounts for the difference. Each state gets it’s bread buttered. Additionally, if we cut the waste out of this, we could afford to provide healthcare to those in need…

Butch Cassidy

October 24th, 2011
9:35 am

Stevie Ray – ” Additionally, if we cut the waste out of this, we could afford to provide healthcare to those in need…”

Therein lies the problem. One mans waste is another mans kickback.

JB

October 24th, 2011
9:38 am

Off subject, but shocks me that Obama and the State Dept. are surprised that the elections in this little country that had the first Arab spring voted to have the Muslim Brotherhood run the government. Duh, really. It’ll be a domino effect. They all will.It’s all they know, and it ain’t good for the USA.

Bosch

October 24th, 2011
9:38 am

“if we cut the waste out of this, we could afford to provide healthcare to those in need”

Everyone NEEDS healthcare.

carlosgvv

October 24th, 2011
9:39 am

1811/0311 – 9:23
Soothsayer – 9:24

Two frightening observations which strongly suggest we are heading towards an apocalypse. The only question seems to be are we inching towards it or on a runaway train speeding towards it.

Bosch

October 24th, 2011
9:39 am

JB,

Yes, democracy works that way.

kayaker 71

October 24th, 2011
9:40 am

Facts on Government Motors:

61% owned by the US Govt
17.5% owned by the UAW
9.8% owned by Canada
9.8% owned by bond holders from the old GM
Grand total of 98%.
Bailout money 8.1 Billion paid off ahead of schedule and with interest.
Even though Ed Whitacre states in all of the TV ads that GM is now solvent and making a profit, and has paid off the bail out money, they are still in debt to the Government for 49.1B dollars in TARP money which GM converted to common stock, ie the 61% owned by Bozo.
This company is far from solvent and is still in the tank financially. It’s woes are still there, but for all too few to see. GM employes nearly 210,000 people all over the world. How long can this house of cards last?

Adam

October 24th, 2011
9:40 am

MAKE IT RAIN!!!

Ok, I honestly don’t have anything substantive to add. But thought I’d throw in that little “make it rain” thing.

Carry on….

Jay

October 24th, 2011
9:41 am

In the first place, Stevie, I believe you misrepresent the study. You provide no link, but I imagine you’re referring to this one:

http://bit.ly/q4GPbI

It reports that the federal government spent a total of $808 billion on health care in 2007, which makes it rather difficult to believe that it wastes up to $1 trillion a year on those programs.

bman

October 24th, 2011
9:41 am

I’m trying to remember when and where I have heard of CAPCO. I will have to read more about it, but I thought it had been around for a long time?

The only thing that is surprising is that all of a sudden it’s not okay for politicians to flush money down the toilet…

bman

October 24th, 2011
9:43 am

Kayaker…I was unaware that the UAW had 17.5% of GM. Are you sure that’s correct? That’s a huge stake!

Jay

October 24th, 2011
9:47 am

Kayaker, the government’s ownership stake in GM is now down to 26 percent, not the 61 percent you list in your “facts.” I suspect the rest of your post is similarly accurate.

Paul

October 24th, 2011
9:48 am

Jay

“It reports that the federal government spent a total of $808 billion on health care in 2007, which makes it rather difficult to believe that it wastes up to $1 trillion a year on those programs.”

The $808 billion was spent on health care.

Another $1 trillion was spent on waste.

It’s a classic example of what happens when government tries to do stuff that private industry should do.

:-)

Jack

October 24th, 2011
9:50 am

Cain and capital. Two words that really, really distress Bookman.

Jm

October 24th, 2011
9:52 am

Jay, care to address Volker’s comments?

Or is an Obama revered former Federal Reserve governor a liar also?

You disappeared during our Fannie Freddie discussions last week. I’d normally accept that as a concession but I think you prefer denying the truth on the GSE’s and congress.

Jay

October 24th, 2011
9:54 am

which volcker comments, jm?

kayaker 71

October 24th, 2011
9:55 am

bman,

Bozo and his cronies dressed it up when the money was given to GM. They designated that a 17.1% stake in the company would reside in UAW’s “health care division” which is just a ruse. They still own a 17.1% stake. The part that so disturbing and that no one mentions, is that Whitacre toots his horn and states that GM has paid off it’s “loans” when they are still 49.1B in the tank to the US Govt, which, in it’s own great wisdom is not so good at running car companies. GM still has not shown a profit since the TARP money and the bailout money was given to them. It ends up that the US Govt, by it’s 61% stake in the company is in a pretty precarious place in this agreement, especially with all of the employees that GM has. Let’s hope that they run this better than the post office or we are looking at some pretty steep bills in the future.

getalife

October 24th, 2011
9:57 am

kay,

Thanks to our President we still have a auto industry for you to cry about.

Stevie Ray

October 24th, 2011
9:58 am

Butch: Right on!
BOSCH; AGREED

Jay: Here is the link and healthcare and IRS inefficiences but in fairness those were only two of the 10 totalling $1 trillion. My bad for suggesting otherwise. If the total HC spending is $808 bln, then the 185 bln suggested waste represents 23% waste. IRS is much worse.

Ergo, lets say that the number is actually 125 bln…are you suggesting there is no waste in government spending to either of these two veins?

http://www.rd.com/money/the-government-is-wasting-your-tax-dollars/

AmVet

October 24th, 2011
9:59 am

Soothsayer that entire article you linked at 9:24 is one of the best that I have read in a very long time.

In a litany of damning evidence, this line really stands out…

The evil oligarchy of bankers, corporate titans, and bought off Washington politicians that control the agenda and mainstream media, continue to scorn, ridicule and denigrate the middle class of America.

Though sleazy, at least I can understand their self-serving positions.

But these poor working class schmoe neo-cons??? Who have gotten absolutely hammered for four decades??? And who insanely pretend that they haven’t???

Their self-destructiveness makes NO sense.

The only “reason” that I can see is that they have been so successfully programmed to hate everything and everybody non-Republican, that they now gleefully commit economic hari kari.

Just to show those loathed liberals, damn hippies and lazy punks that they are capable of such insanity…

Jm

October 24th, 2011
10:01 am

Jay, ones at the 9:32 post

1811/0311

October 24th, 2011
10:02 am

carlosgvv :

Concerning my 9:23 I believe it is the biggest threat facing the world today but the libs. just keep turning a blind eye.

Regarding this thread it seems as though Jay likes national stimulus plans but not state ones.

Maybe he will explain why.

Hard Earned Tax Dollars

October 24th, 2011
10:03 am

The chief Georgia lobbyist for the plan, former state senator Pete Robinson, is a longtime friend of Gov. Nathan Deal and served on Deal’s transition team. Deal also backs the CAPCO approach.

Everyone knows that this is just another business venture for our Dear Governor Deal! He seems to have no sense of direction when it comes to making bad business decisions whether they are personal or governmental. Even though this system has failed in several states he wants to attempt to make the Republican Party appear as if they have come up with a solution to our states’ extremely high unemployment rate. Governor please do not waste my hard earned tax dollars on this bogus no accountablility plan!

Stevie Ray

October 24th, 2011
10:04 am

Jay,

Your link predicably, did not include any audit data (if even completed) on waste….this is the bogus data set that congress makes decisions based upon. Perhaps an independent audit would provide data that may change some of the proposals to include efforts to find waste….perhaps on a Qui Tam basis???

1811/0311

October 24th, 2011
10:04 am

“Just to show those loathed liberals, damn hippies and lazy punks that they are capable of such insanity…”

Yep ………….. people you would be crazy to EVER hire.

kayaker 71

October 24th, 2011
10:05 am

Bookman,

Here we go again. Look up FactCheck.org under GM and find out the truth. The 61% is a true figure, according to your precious FactCheck. The real kicker is that GM has been paying off some of their TARP obligation with unspent TARP funds. In other words they are paying off their TARP obligation with TARP funds that they should never have gotten in the first place. This Bozononics is just the thing we need to put this company into solvency. Where did you get the 26% figure?

TaxPayer

October 24th, 2011
10:05 am

Buck Hayek

October 24th, 2011
10:06 am

Republicans have no right to complain about Fannie and Freddie.

The GSE Reform Act of 2005 would have completely deprived FNM/FRE of new investment capital when it passed (HR 1461). The Bushpigs killed it. Bush said he wanted to keep subprime mortgages rolling.

Now Treasury is stuck with backing the implied guarantee of GSE bonds for years.

Jay

October 24th, 2011
10:08 am

Kayaker today: “GM still has not shown a profit since the TARP money and the bailout money…

New York Times, in February:

DETROIT — General Motors, which nearly collapsed from the weight of its debts two years ago before reorganizing in a government-sponsored bankruptcy, said on Thursday that it earned $4.7 billion in 2010, the most in more than a decade.

GM’s profit-making ways have continued into 2011. It made $2.5 billion in the second quarter of 2011 alone, and Chevy just announced that it sold more cars in the third quarter than at any point in its history.

Kayaker, you have repeatedly proved to pay no attention whatsoever to facts, posting stuff time and time again that has no basis in reality. As a result, I’m not even going to bother to correct or ever read what you post any longer.

You have forfeited all credibility.

getalife

October 24th, 2011
10:09 am

“You have forfeited all credibility.”

Agreed.

Jm

October 24th, 2011
10:09 am

Buck 10:06

Nice revisionist history there. You got it backwards

TruthBe

October 24th, 2011
10:10 am

Liberals perverts and their corrupt lack of morals, anti-patriotism, anti-GOD are the real problems of this Country. Just look at this loser of a president Obama that will do ANYTHING to be re-elected. Liberals progressive’s corruption of politics and their partners in crime the media are destroying this Country today. Jay you and your cronies at the ajc have media blood on your hands.

1811/0311

October 24th, 2011
10:11 am

“Obama: ‘I’d like to work my way around Congress’ … ”

“OBAMA TO SIDESTEP CONGRESS”

bman

October 24th, 2011
10:12 am

kayaker..I do know that the Gov’t needs to sell their stake in GM @50+ per share to break even. It seems I remember reading where we were going to actually make money on this deal….

TaxPayer

October 24th, 2011
10:12 am

I sure hope that the folks running these CAPCO’s are not stupid enough to loan millions to folks like Tom Graves. :lol:

Jay

October 24th, 2011
10:12 am

No, kayaker, that 61 percent is NOT a “true figure.”

It used to be, once upon a time. But the government has since sold off most of its stake. Not that you would care about actual facts in the first place.

Jm

October 24th, 2011
10:13 am

What’s with Hillary’s new hairdo?

Can’t figure it out. Very 60’sish….

getalife

October 24th, 2011
10:14 am

scout,

The gop obstructed everything but socialism for the banks.

Jay wrote about it but the rest of corporate media ignore it and give your failed party a free pass .

AmVet

October 24th, 2011
10:15 am

Corporal, wake up and look around,

They ain’t hiring your neighbors and your sanctified church going buddies, either.

Actual unemployment is really somewhere near 23%.

And only the biggest bullsh*tters around, like you, contend that that has had no effect on Republican families, neighborhoods and communities.

Just to a man and woman, ALL of those lazy, don’t want to work, criminal protesters, right?

Your ideology of ignorance and your twisted religion of hate combined, have become poisons in the United States of America…

Jm

October 24th, 2011
10:16 am

GM
Just some good government socialism…..

getalife

October 24th, 2011
10:17 am

I would add all cons lost credibility here a long time ago.

We do find them laughable now and fun to engage.

Jm

October 24th, 2011
10:19 am

And Amvet blames the GOP for 26% unemployment when for 2 years Dems controlled EVERYTHING

and…. So I stopped reading

Generation$crewed

October 24th, 2011
10:19 am

Jm

October 24th, 2011
10:16 am

picking winners and losers is good…

especially when it is ones chosen party who is doing the picking….

wonder what Ford’s profits would be if they had taken as much money as GM did?

TaxPayer

October 24th, 2011
10:19 am

If you Republicans are worried about your investments in GM, you should consider buying some credit default swaps from AIG to cover your bets. They’re backed by the full faith of 1.5 billion government-owned shares of AIG. :lol: