Iraq War winding down, but hard lessons linger

Ten years ago this month, in October 2001, secret discussions were already under way in Washington about using the 9/11 terror attacks as a pivot point to launch an invasion of Iraq. In fact, U.S. officials had already begun to leak allegations that Iraq was the leading suspect in the then-recent anthrax attacks, and that Mohammad Atta, the terrorist ringleader, had met in Prague with Iraqi intelligence agents.

Today, however, that chapter of U.S. history is apparently about to come to a close. One of the prime goals of the invasion had been the permanent installation of U.S. military bases in Iraq, to serve as a military counterweight to neighboring Iran. Despite billions of dollars poured into those facilities, that is not to be. While some 40,000 U.S. troops remain in Iraq, agreements signed by the U.S. and Iraqi officials back in the Bush administration require that all American forces must be withdrawn by the end of the year. Efforts to renegotiate that deal have failed, and while the official line is that the talks continue, there is little reason to believe things will change.

The Iraqi people, intent on reclaiming control of their own fate, want us gone. And most Americans are quite content to let them have it, even if our departure leaves a vacuum that Iran is eager to fill.

Looking back, 4,478 U.S. service personnel lost their lives in the Iraq invasion. And despite assurances that Iraq would pay for its own reconstruction and that total costs would come in below $60 billion, the price tag is now well over $1 trillion and counting. Other costs, including the impact on those service personnel who fought there, are not so easily accounted.

For some, of course, all of that is supposedly ancient history, to be forgotten and ignored. That would be a mistake. The cynical manipulation of public opinion to justify an unnecessary war, driven by fear-mongering about “mushroom clouds rising over American cities” and the like, should always be relevant to a democracy. The complicity of much of the U.S. news media in failing to challenge the official government narrative was also deeply disturbing.

In fact, only the naive would believe that the public’s current deep distrust of government and institutions has not been fed at least in part by recognition that our own leaders consciously deceived us into war. That’s a hard lesson to learn, but once learned it is even harder to forget. We’re going to paying for this, in one way or another, long after the last of our personnel have come home.

– Jay Bookman

452 comments Add your comment

Welcome to the occupation (Trotsky)

October 18th, 2011
8:55 am

Well at least Bill Kristol’s happy.

Normal

October 18th, 2011
8:57 am

While I, for one, I very glad times ten that we are leaving a place where we never should have been, I know that once we leave the real blood bath will begin and more than likely Iran will usurp Iraq into a combined Islamic nation with all that entails and controlling all that oil. Ol’ Saddam Hussein may not have been a model citizen, but he represented stability in the region and he could be controlled. What hath we wrought with the lives of 4,478 of our children?

USinUK

October 18th, 2011
8:58 am

Hard lessons were learned by many …

unfortunately, not by all …

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GvliUuXjbL4 (around the 5 minute mark)

Peadawg

October 18th, 2011
9:00 am

“hile some 40,000 U.S. troops remain in Iraq, agreements signed by the U.S. and Iraqi officials back in the Bush administration require that all American forces must be withdrawn by the end of the year.”

Thank goodness Obama didn’t extend the deadline and will actually let them come home finally. My only gripe is that this should have happened sooner.

godless heathen

October 18th, 2011
9:02 am

Without question, we need to disarm Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal, murderous dictator, leading an oppressive regime … He presents a particularly grievous threat because he is so consistently prone to miscalculation … And now he is miscalculating America’s response to his continued deceit and his consistent grasp for weapons of mass destruction … So the threat of Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real…”
– Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Jan. 23. 2003

Doggone/GA

October 18th, 2011
9:02 am

“My only gripe is that this should have happened sooner.”

and MY gripe is that it should never have been necessary to begin with

USinUK

October 18th, 2011
9:03 am

doggone – 9:02 – WORD!

Jm

October 18th, 2011
9:03 am

Jay. Paul can’t grasp WW2 history. He and others seem only able to remember 10 years worth of history at most.

The long arc of history is what matters. And the outcome in Iraq is still TBD.

Welcome to the occupation (Trotsky)

October 18th, 2011
9:04 am

The cynical manipulation of public opinion to justify an unnecessary war, driven by fear-mongering about “mushroom clouds rising over American cities” and the like, should always be relevant to a democracy

And just a word of criticism if I may. I would have liked to hear from you last week just a bit more skepticism regarding the Iran plot. Not that I agree with the extreme skeptics who say the entire things was merely a concoction, but I do think more skeptical eye is in order considering it’s clear that the Obama administration would probably love an excuse to launch an invasion to gain a quick victory, boost his numbers, and above all shift attention away from mounting social tensions at home (in that regard, the supreme leader’s response to the accusations was correct).

Peadawg

October 18th, 2011
9:04 am

Now if we can just get out of Afghanistan….

Keep Up the Good Fight!

October 18th, 2011
9:04 am

Sure, Blame Bush! ….. Thought we should get that out of the way.

Normal

October 18th, 2011
9:05 am

Goddless,
Get real. We didn’r have to invade to disarm him. No weapons of mass destruction were ever found, were they?

Doggone/GA

October 18th, 2011
9:05 am

“– Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Jan. 23. 2003″

and that is relevent how?

Normal

October 18th, 2011
9:06 am

Keep,
As far as Iraq goes, yes. The blame fall directly at the feet of his administration.

Normal

October 18th, 2011
9:07 am

Peadawg, On that we agree wholeheartedly. We should have left right after OBL was killed…and taken our money to Pakistan with us!

Bosch

October 18th, 2011
9:08 am

“doggone – 9:02 – WORD!”

Ditto.

ByteMe

October 18th, 2011
9:08 am

Jay, you forgot the part where they cynically held back the drumbeats of war until September 2002 *, and then used that to win control of Congress in the November elections.

. . .

*Why did the Administration wait until September to make its case against Iraq? White House chief of staff Andrew Card told The New York Times last week, “From a marketing point of view, you don’t introduce new products in August.”

Keep Up the Good Fight!

October 18th, 2011
9:09 am

Normal, I totally agree…. I am sure we’ll hear from others that there were no lies or that it made no difference because in their mind war was justified for some other reason that made the “lies” okay.

Bosch

October 18th, 2011
9:09 am

Looks like the neo-cons’ energy plan didn’t work out like they thought it would.

Bosch

October 18th, 2011
9:10 am

Keep,

And don’t forget — the DEMOCRATS voted for it too! :roll:

carlosgvv

October 18th, 2011
9:10 am

It will probably become clear in the coming years that these 4,478 soldies died for absolutely nothing. What seems clear now is that the only winner in this war is, SUPRISE, The Military-Industrial Complex. I suspect “our own leaders consciously deceived us into war” knowing this would be the likely outcome. Same for Afghanistan. And yet, are those in charge of these political debates asking the candidates to promise not to get us into any more of these useless wars? If not, why not?

Bosch

October 18th, 2011
9:11 am

godless,

And where does Senator Kerry talk about invading the country in that passage??

Bosch

October 18th, 2011
9:12 am

“SUPRISE, The Military-Industrial Complex”

The GOP’s answer to job creation. The wingnuts here always silent on spending THAT taxpayer money.

Jay

October 18th, 2011
9:13 am

Trotsky, I see no sign that’s how that news is being used, although I respect your caution. Furthermore, the fact that $100,000 was wired to the suspect from Iran is a pretty strong sign that something serious was intended.

Welcome to the occupation (Trotsky)

October 18th, 2011
9:13 am

In fact, only the naive would believe that the public’s current deep distrust of government and institutions has not been fed at least in part by recognition that our own leaders consciously deceived us into war.

But as the slime of the earth — the right — understands all too well, there’s no better way to address the public’s “deep distrust of government and institutions” than to put it to work getting itself blown up in foreign wars, chasing after foreign leaders and treasure.

The public loves itself a good war when you give them a good narrative wrapped in good and evil. The right understands that very well — and so does the Obama administration.

godless heathen

October 18th, 2011
9:13 am

Kerry’s comment is relevant because the real history of how we got into Iraq should not be rewritten by the neo-libs

“The cynical manipulation of public opinion to justify an unnecessary war, driven by fear-mongering about “mushroom clouds rising over American cities” and the like, should always be relevant to a democracy”

Doggone/GA

October 18th, 2011
9:13 am

“It will probably become clear in the coming years that these 4,478 soldies died for absolutely nothing”

COMING years? It’s already been clear to ME for years

AmVet - Read my lips. No new chickenhawks.

October 18th, 2011
9:13 am

George Bush and Dick Cheney should have been impeached for high crimes and misdemeanors.

And the Democratic Party is a disgrace for rolling over to these thugs and idiots.

And the GOP?

Beyond disgraceful.

For plenty of reasons, but primarily for EVER enabling those cowards in the first place and then for listening to those blithering liars in the White House.

The Republican Viet Nam.

Never, ever, ever let little men in positions of power do this again.

Common Sense

October 18th, 2011
9:13 am

Iraq war was extremely successful financially for the people who are in the war business. Not so good for anyone else.

Soothsayer

October 18th, 2011
9:14 am

Let’s add up what we got for our $4,000,000,000,000.00 and 4,000+ lives. Let’s see . . .

1.

Peadawg

October 18th, 2011
9:15 am

“As far as Iraq goes, yes. The blame fall directly at the feet of his administration.” – Yup, he did start it. I also blame Obama’s administration for keeping us there for 3 years after he was voted into office.

Mighty Righty

October 18th, 2011
9:15 am

We should have brought our troops home long ago. Obama has dragged this out three more years in spite of assurances to the contrary. I hope this time he will do what he said although I don’t know what the delay is. Same in Afghanistant. What the hell are we doing there?

Billings

October 18th, 2011
9:16 am

According to Panetta, negotiations are still ongoing.

I think the powers that be are letting Obama do his little thing (campaigning) while they go about their own business. Obama says one thing, the powers say another.

Sebelius said CLASS is dead. Obama says it’s not.

Everybody has their finger on a different page while Obama has his thumb up his arse. The adults are letting Obama play the role of president.

Doggone/GA

October 18th, 2011
9:16 am

“Kerry’s comment is relevant because the real history of how we got into Iraq should not be rewritten by the neo-libs”

Rewritten how? Kerry was just as wrong as anyone else. What’s to rewrite?

Normal

October 18th, 2011
9:16 am

Peadawg

October 18th, 2011
9:15 am

As do I.

USinUK

October 18th, 2011
9:16 am

Bosch -

Something reminded me of this video today –

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sl23O5N9FFI&feature=related

all we need is a brother in there, too and it would be you, Paul and Brocephus!

Peadawg

October 18th, 2011
9:16 am

Soothsayer

1. We got Hussein, who was a nasty dictator and treated his people like crap, out. But that’s about it.

Keep Up the Good Fight!

October 18th, 2011
9:17 am

Bosch, yes they did. For a number of them, I suspect it was based on lies and other information they had been fed and not based on the reality. I doubt very much that Bush and Cheney (especially Cheney) walked into Congress and said “we want to go to war with Iraq because W wants to be a “hero”, so we are going to lie to the world and we want you to know the truth that we are lying and still vote for this war.”

Aquagirl

October 18th, 2011
9:17 am

Sure, Blame Bush! ….. Thought we should get that out of the way.

When clearly he had nothing to do with this mess. Like, y’know, starting a war over weapons that weren’t there. Whoopsie-do! Screwed up the entire region, sorry folks!

I can see why you want people to move along, Keep.

Common Sense

October 18th, 2011
9:17 am

Obama would have been labeled “cut and run” if he ended it on the fly. Also the Generals, Businessmen, and war machine needed time to adjust and dismantle.

USinUK

October 18th, 2011
9:17 am

Jay – did you see the article I sent you this morning???

Doggone/GA

October 18th, 2011
9:19 am

“Yup, he did start it. I also blame Obama’s administration for keeping us there for 3 years after he was voted into office”

First rule of china shops: you break it, you bought it. We broke Iraq, it wasn’t going to get “fixed” just because a different President was in power.

Normal

October 18th, 2011
9:19 am

stands for decibels

October 18th, 2011
9:19 am

For some, of course, all of that is supposedly ancient history, to be forgotten and ignored.

Forgotten and ignored, you bet! Just as soon as I’ve had a chance to relieve myself on Little Tommy Friedman’s grave.

Aquagirl

October 18th, 2011
9:20 am

Sarcasm does not register before coffee. Ugh.

Common Sense

October 18th, 2011
9:20 am

Keep Up You’ve got it all wrong. It was done for lots and lots of money!!! Remember it was supposed to pay for itself in oil? Regardless who pays, someone does, and there is billions and billions in profits.

Soothsayer

October 18th, 2011
9:21 am

“We got Hussein, who was a nasty dictator and treated his people like crap, out. But that’s about it.”

Peadawg, there are countless evil dictators around the globe who never have to worry about a U.S. attack. Why Iraq?

stands for decibels

October 18th, 2011
9:21 am

I guess Mighty Whitey missed all those times Obama said, on the campaign trail in 2008, that we should be “as careful getting out of Iraq as we were careless getting in.”

Bosch

October 18th, 2011
9:22 am

USinUK,

Those guys remind me of what jm would be like in a bar…. “Oh really? You don’t get history because I disagree with you even though my point makes no sense!!”

:)

Keep Up the Good Fight!

October 18th, 2011
9:22 am

Well Aquagirl, there is always the Bosch concept… you blame the Dems that voted for it. :D

Or when the President is Dem, and the Congress is republican, you blame the President
When the President is Republican and Congress is Dem, you blame Congress
Then if all else fails you blame Liberals (that dang Liberal Court that crucified Jesus type thing)
And if there is a majority, you of course demand that all Dems vote for all bills ignoring the reality of laws, politics and etc….. you know, the Dems had 60 votes so why did they not vote in 2009 to do X knowing that it would come up in 2011.

:lol:

Joe Mama

October 18th, 2011
9:23 am

G. Heathen — “Kerry’s comment is relevant because the real history of how we got into Iraq should not be rewritten by the neo-libs”

There’s a difference in saying ‘I think Saddam Hussein has WMDs’ and saying ‘I think Saddam Hussein has WMDs and we should invade Iraq because of it.’

Peadawg

October 18th, 2011
9:23 am

“Peadawg, there are countless evil dictators around the globe who never have to worry about a U.S. attack. Why Iraq?”

Why Libya?

Why send 100 troops over to Africa to “advise”?

All 3 are good questions.

JohnnyReb

October 18th, 2011
9:24 am

Being a Republican and a strong supporter of W, I am extremely disappointed with the outcome in Iraq. We were/are the conqueror. They have money (oil). We should have maintained control until their resources paid us back. We should have secured a permanent military base of substantial size. The whole situation is FUBAR and disgraceful. The only thing noble has been our military heroes.

USinUK

October 18th, 2011
9:24 am

Sooth – “Peadawg, there are countless evil dictators around the globe who never have to worry about a U.S. attack. Why Iraq?”

I think it rhymes with mohel

Bosch

October 18th, 2011
9:24 am

Oh no Normal….I saw that downstairs, you didn’t see my scream post??

:)

Stevie Ray

October 18th, 2011
9:24 am

Jay,

You forgot to mention the 140,000 or so mostly innocent lives of Iraq’s et al who have perished. These tribes are 50 years from being ready for democracy. As long as we have our nose under the Middle-Easts tents, we remain at somewhat of a risk of getting whacked again. Unless Obama et al have information in his secret notebook, it makes no sense from any perspective to be there, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia, Israel, Germany, South Korea et al…

Seems the just because we have armed forces we always must have work for them. Tell me a single war since WWII that we faced imminent threat that was worth fighting…

Common Sense

October 18th, 2011
9:24 am

What a strategy!!!!

USinUK

October 18th, 2011
9:25 am

Bosch – 9:22 – the term “point” being used loosely.

Soothsayer

October 18th, 2011
9:25 am

Out for a business meeting. See ya later.

godless heathen

October 18th, 2011
9:25 am

Bosch: “And where does Senator Kerry talk about invading the country in that passage??”

Good point. That would be in this one.

“I will be voting to give the President of the United States the authority to use force — if necessary — to disarm Saddam Hussein because I believe that a deadly arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in his hands is a real and grave threat to our security.”
– Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Oct. 9, 2002

Keep Up the Good Fight!

October 18th, 2011
9:25 am

Dang, I missed the oil conspiracy snark. Bosch is not keeping me on my toes with the snark assists. Blame Bosch! :lol:

Jay

October 18th, 2011
9:26 am

No, USinUK, I don’t see it. Resend please.

Call it like it is

October 18th, 2011
9:26 am

Just another dumb war that we shouldnt have been in, in the first place. Let add it to the list.
Nam, We came in 2nd place
Korea, Still going on.
War of 1812, pissing match between big brother and little brother
Spanish America, over before it began.
and on and on.
Now its off to Iran…………..You want something to invest in, in this economy, go for weapon companies.

cliff zeider

October 18th, 2011
9:27 am

Hey, Don’t foget Old Bill Clinton and his lovely wife supported the war with Iraa, Wonder what the Dems. think of Hussin send oujr troops to Africa, was he afried the people mah come to America. cliff Port St. Joe Fl.

Mick

October 18th, 2011
9:27 am

reb

I agree with you somewhat, at the very least we should have gotten oil for compensation. It was a fools errand and cost us in blood and treasure. Including all the dead innocent iraqi’s or collateral damage as they are coldly known..

Joe Mama

October 18th, 2011
9:27 am

G. Heathen — Thanks very much for admitting via the Kerry quote that *the Decider* put us in Iraq.

That being said, I have nothing but scorn for any Republican or Democrat who voted for the AUMF. Either vote for war or vote against it.

Bosch

October 18th, 2011
9:27 am

godless,

Again, where does Senator Kerry talk about invading the country in that passage? “Using force” does not equal the “shock and awe” tactics Bush used.

USinUK 9:24,

fer rizzle.

Granny Godzilla

October 18th, 2011
9:28 am

Homelessness among Iraq vets continue to rise….

Some are paying more.

USinUK

October 18th, 2011
9:28 am

Jay – check your FB mail

stands for decibels

October 18th, 2011
9:28 am

Don’t foget Old Bill Clinton and his lovely wife supported the war with Ira[q]

Don’t forget his lovely wife was denied the Democratic presidential nomination as a direct result of that support.

kayaker 71

October 18th, 2011
9:29 am

“Laid at the foot of the Bush administration “….. now that’s a stretch. I seem to remember that the vote to go into this war approved by a number of Democratic members of both the House and the Senate….. the Senate vote 77/33 with 29 Democrats voting for….. the House vote 297/133 with 82 Democrats voting for. This is in addition to numerous Democrats in the Washington scene including former President Clinton, Senator Hillary, Sandy Burger, Madeline Albright, Senator Kennedy and numerous others that going to war was essential to remove Saddams threat of WMDs. All of them were on board at first but quickly jumped ship when it was evident that it was not a good decision. They ended up self righteously jumping ship like a bunch of rats when the political expediency was at an end then pointed fingers at the “one responsible”, Bush 43. So don’t give me this “they should be prosecuted for war crimes” bull sh*t when the majority of Washington DC on both sides of the aisle were encouraging the war early on.

USinUK

October 18th, 2011
9:30 am

“They have money (oil). We should have maintained control until their resources paid us back. ”

that’s like breaking into someone’s house and ripping your jeans on the way in, then demanding that they give you a family heirloom to pay for your jeans.

they didn’t invite us

we invaded – we have no “rights” to anything of theirs

Joe Mama

October 18th, 2011
9:30 am

K71 — ” I seem to remember that the vote to go into this war approved by a number of Democratic members of both the House and the Senate…..”

When exactly did Congress vote to go to war with Iraq, please?

Mighty Righty

October 18th, 2011
9:30 am

stands for decibels

October 18th, 2011
9:21 am

You are correct, I missed that. I still don’t recall anything similar from his mouth. I do remember him saying as soon as he took office he would get us out. Still waiting……………….

Mick

October 18th, 2011
9:31 am

yaker

Your facts are all wet, at no time did kennedy vote for or support the iraqi war con…

Doggone/GA

October 18th, 2011
9:31 am

“We should have maintained control until their resources paid us back”

In other words, a country that never attacked us and was no threat to us, should have to pay us back because WE invaded THEM.

Bosch

October 18th, 2011
9:32 am

TaxPayer

October 18th, 2011
9:32 am

Too bad the Republicans will not at least own up to their responsibility to pay for their trillion dollar mess.

Jay

October 18th, 2011
9:32 am

Kayaker, I will agree that a number of Democrats who should have known better allowed themselves to be intimidated or steamrolled into voting in favor of the war, Hillary Clinton, John Kerry and Max Cleland among them. I think that’s the primary reason Hillary Clinton is not president today.

That said, while 82 House Democrats voted for the war, 126 voted against it.

godless heathen

October 18th, 2011
9:32 am

carlos: “It will probably become clear in the coming years that these 4,478 soldies died for absolutely nothing.

And the ones that are dieing in Afghanistan today, same?

_____________________

I think we should keep an airbase or two in Iraq, whether they like it or not.

Joe Mama

October 18th, 2011
9:33 am

Sgt. Gilad Shalit released. :)

JohnnyReb

October 18th, 2011
9:33 am

Someone hijacked my handle @ 9:28.

Barry

October 18th, 2011
9:33 am

TELEPROMPTER !!

PLEASE COME BACK !!

WHERE YOU AT ?

stands for decibels

October 18th, 2011
9:33 am

“Laid at the foot of the Bush administration “….. now that’s a stretch.

A stretch? Glass houses and stones, Stretchy McRubberman. Glass houses and stones.

kayaker 71

October 18th, 2011
9:34 am

Joe Mama,

It was a Joint Resolution passed by the Congress and the Senate as Public Law 107-243, enacted October 16, 2002.

Richard

October 18th, 2011
9:34 am

Agreed. We never should have been there.

Granny Godzilla

October 18th, 2011
9:34 am

kayaker

“All of them were on board at first but quickly jumped ship when it was evident that it was not a good decision.”

re read what you wrote

“WHEN IT WAS EVIDENT THAT IT WAS NOT A GOOD DECISION”

Was it better to ignore the fact it was NOT A GOOD DECISION and stay the course?

USinUK

October 18th, 2011
9:34 am

Johnny – 9:28 – it scares me when we agree.

Bosch

October 18th, 2011
9:35 am

And kayaker plays the irrelevant and would know it is irrelevant if he read the posts here “but the Democrats voted for it tooooooo!!! WAHHHHH”
card!!!

:roll:

Welcome to the occupation (Trotsky)

October 18th, 2011
9:35 am

JohnnyReb: “y have money (oil). We should have maintained control until their resources paid us back. We should have secured a permanent military base of substantial size. The whole situation is FUBAR and disgraceful. The only thing noble has been our military heroes.

Well, except for a few “bad apples” here and there.

What do we do next?

October 18th, 2011
9:35 am

Just think if we used a significant portion (25-35%) of the funds and resources utilized in Iraq and allocated it to Afghanistan and alternative fuel research. If only…

Joe Mama

October 18th, 2011
9:36 am

K71 — “It was a Joint Resolution passed by the Congress and the Senate as Public Law 107-243, enacted October 16, 2002.”

I think if you look closely, you will see that PL107-243 was *not* a declaration of war.

stands for decibels

October 18th, 2011
9:36 am

You are correct, I missed that.

Anyone who followed the campaign heard it.

http://www.google.com/search?q=As+careful+getting+out+as+we+were+careless+getting+in&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

unless, perhaps, they were getting their “news” spoon fed to them by crap source, I guess.

JohnnyReb

October 18th, 2011
9:36 am

UsinUK and Doggone – when a country is invaded and conquered their rights don’t enter into the equation.

Paddy O

October 18th, 2011
9:37 am

This is an accurate article. This entire war can be laid at the feet of the neo-cons who manipulated the Bush administration.

USinUK

October 18th, 2011
9:37 am

kayaker – nowhere in the joint resolution did they declare war

in point of fact, the resolution encouraged diplomatic efforts in concert with the UN and only allowed use of force as necessary to protect the US and UN allies.

that’s not declaring war, bub … not by a long shot

JohnnyReb

October 18th, 2011
9:38 am

USinUK – relax, we still disagree. That 9:28 was not me.

jconservative

October 18th, 2011
9:39 am

So the US was attacked by terrorist and 3000 Americans were killed and we declared Muslims the enemy.

So we invade Iraq and get 4478 Americans killed trying to set up a new government for Muslims in Iraq.

And we invade Afghanistan to capture the Al Qaeda leader. And when we failed to capture Bin Laden we decided to create a new democratic nation for Muslims and got another 1682 Americans killed there.

If Muslims are the enemy why do we insist on trying to help them?

And yes “blame” can be shared by all. Both ideas came out of a Republican administration with great support from Democrats in the Congress.

The problem is that Americans feel that if one questions a military Policy one is also Not Supporting the troops. Nothing could be further from the truth. But it is a lie we will continue to tell ourselves.

History proves that neither peoples nor governments learn anything from history.

Bosch

October 18th, 2011
9:39 am

Reb @ 9:36

I don’t think that’s how Iraq (or the rest of the world for that matter) sees it — that might be true if the reason they were invaded was valid, since in their case, it wasn’t — we broke it, we get to fix it.

TaxPayer

October 18th, 2011
9:40 am

when a country is invaded and conquered their rights don’t enter into the equation.

And Republicans such as Scott Walker have extended that GOP philosophy down to the state level.