Hugely profitable companies pay more to CEOs than to Uncle Sam
Now isn’t this special?
According to the Institute of Policy Studies, a liberal think tank, 25 of the country’s 100 highest-paid CEOs were paid more personally than their corporations paid in federal income taxes last year. (The corporations in question made, on average, a profit of $1.9 billion each.)
If you believe many conservatives, that’s pretty amazing. After all, corporate taxes in America are allegedly sky high, so the fact that so many profitable companies somehow managed to pay their CEOs even more than they paid Uncle Sam — well, that’s really saying something.
“In 2009, we calculate, major corporate CEOs took home 263 times the pay of America’s average workers. Last year, this gap leaped to 325-to-1. Among the nation’s top firms, the S&P 500, CEO pay last year averaged $10,762,304, up 27.8 percent over 2009.”
Average CEO pay among the S&P 500 up 28 percent in a year. Tough times. And again, that’s not the high-performers, the CEOs who did something special. The average CEO got a 28 percent pay hike last year.
And how did those companies end up paying so little in taxes? The IJS helps explain:
“No tax-dodging strategy over recent years has filled U.S. corporate coffers more rapidly than the offshoring of corporate activity to tax havens in low- or no-tax jurisdictions. Eighteen of the 25 firms highlighted in this study operate subsidiaries in offshore tax haven jurisdictions. The firms, all combined, had 556 tax haven subsidiaries last year….
How do tax havens work? One common corporate accounting technique, “transfer pricing,” helps corporations shift profits offshore. Technology and drug companies regularly open shell companies — in tax havens — that hold their intellectual property rights. They then charge their U.S.-based operations inflated amounts for the use of these rights. These inflated costs get deducted off U.S. taxes. The overseas tax haven profits go un- or lightly taxed. Adding insult to injury, a coalition of corporate tax dodgers is now asking Congress to reward their tax avoidance with a deeply discounted 5 percent tax rate if they bring these funds back home where many of them started.”
These are American companies — corporations that are based here in the United States because they know that locating here maximizes their profits. They want all of the advantages of being American, meanwhile pretending that a lot of their operations are located on some little Caribbean island.
Personally, I think I’m going to open an offshore branch of Jay Bookman and have my paycheck sent there. I mean, why not? I’m a person, corporations are persons. If they can do it, I can do it too, right?
Well, there is one difference. As the IJS notes,”the 25 firms highlighted in this study spent a combined total of more than $150 million on lobbying and campaign contributions last year.” In contrast, I didn’t spend a dime.
In fact, 20 of the companies in question spent more money “lobbying lawmakers than they paid in corporate taxes. Eighteen gave more to the political campaigns of their favorite candidates than they paid to the IRS in taxes.”
You get what you pay for.
– Jay Bookman
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982 comments Add your comment
Brosephus
August 31st, 2011
9:52 am
larry: Except you shouldnt have to just accept it. District Attorney’s run for office, work like hell to get them out when a breach of justice like you discribed happens. Sheriffs run for office too.
Sounds good, but when you’re talking small town AL, it’s not gonna happen. Right after my grandfather was killed, the city ran all kinds of operations to ticket people running red lights since he was killed by a girl that ran a red light. One intersection was so bad, the police couldn’t catch everybody to write them a citation.
I still have a copy of the accident report. The girl wasn’t cited on the spot for running the light even though eyewitness accounts all stated she did. The spot she hit my grandfather was more than enough evidence to show she ran the light too. In order to even get her to face any charges, my family had to swear out a warrant for her arrest. The ADA, who is now the DA, did absolutely nothing beyond paying lip service to my family about getting her indicted. That’s one of the reasons I don’t go home more than once every 3-5 years.
Left wing management
August 31st, 2011
9:53 am
If capitalism was intended to do one thing and one thing only, which is to make the rich even richer, and to make the already super rich even more fabulously rich, then capitalism is doing its job just brilliantly right now.
So in one sense I don’t know what all the fuss is about.
This is clearly what the system is built to do. The fact that corporate bigwigs have figured out ways to pad their nest in even more spectacular and efficient ways is not a knock on a system that was built to do just that.
Keep Up the Good Fight!
August 31st, 2011
9:54 am
GLL: Still telling others how “classy” you are?
Brosephus
August 31st, 2011
9:55 am
paul: skimmed thru a couple pages. Aside from jimmy asserting corporations have to do this because our tax rate is too high, did anyone seriously refute anything Jay wrote?
Did you expect anything beyond the usual divert and deflect defense?
willie lynch
August 31st, 2011
9:55 am
“and when they give themselves an average pay increase of 28 percent in a time of great economic hardship for millions — that is not class warfare or wealth redistribution”.
“No, it is only class warfare when you are rude enough to notice such things”.
The truth, the whole truth…
Keep Up the Good Fight!
August 31st, 2011
9:56 am
Private sector companies? Try publicly held companies with obligations to make disclosures to shareholders.
Soothsayer
August 31st, 2011
9:57 am
To begin with, let’s state the obvious: We’re in a Depression. Yes, that’s a “judgement call”, but for 90 percent of working people in this country, the word accurately describes the slump we’re in.
Second, the political process is broken. Again, this fact is so obvious that it’s hardly worth mentioning. The vast majority of people are thoroughly disgusted with the craven Wall Street duopoloy that masquerades as “representative government”. “Representative” of who? Corporate fatcats and bank vermin?
“American democracy” is a contradiction in terms; a complete farce. Neither party has any plan for lowering unemployment, correcting chronic trade imbalances, re-regulating the financial system, or growing the economy. Capital Hill is merely an annex of Wall Street, just as the White House is entirely in the clutches of the brandy-swilling swine who run the big brokerage houses and hedge funds. They own it all, every bit of it. America is just one of many properties in their sordid portfolio.
suwanee dawg
August 31st, 2011
9:57 am
Not sure why or how an article on taxes and CEO pay leads to racism comments in the blog. CEO pay is high and the investment community should address (not the government), but this article fails to address the real issue that our corporate tax structure is too high and to burdensome to comply. My company was looking to shift profits from the US (Fed Rate of 35% and state rates around 5%) to other countries including Singapore (18%) with much lower rates. If you want to promote economic growth like this country has never seen, cut and simplify both corporate and personal income taxes.
Common Sense
August 31st, 2011
9:57 am
Capitalism balances supply and demand in the markets, providing the incentive to meet that demand.
If these companies were not doing this, they would fail, and there would be no salaries.
Capitalism was not a creation in a class room. It is the natural, most efficient way to operate.
You may as well fight Mother Nature if you are willing to fight Capitalism.
Amazingly, the same political party tries to do both.
Good Little Liberal
August 31st, 2011
9:57 am
Left wing management
I couldn’t agree more. But the part that you left out is that capitalism allows anyone with the brains and the motivation to become rich. It’s sort of economical Darwinism
I’m not wealthy so I’m not at the top of the food chain, but I sure don’t hate the people that have made it.
Joe Mama
August 31st, 2011
9:58 am
Talking Head — “fact – lib rats always need to someone to hate on”
Ah, irony, your taste is so sweet.
1811/0311
August 31st, 2011
9:58 am
I wonder how many times Jay’s salary is vs. someone just on food stamps?
Of course the IRS takes voluntary contributions anytime Jay wants to make them.
Good Little Liberal
August 31st, 2011
9:58 am
Keep Up
UsinUK set the standards.
And you are STILL humping my leg.
Granny Godzilla
August 31st, 2011
9:59 am
GLL
Working Poor? I suspect you are an example of the genus
workingpoorius voteagainstbestinterestus
Common Sense
common sense says if it’s a publically traded company it is MY business.
Common Sense
August 31st, 2011
9:59 am
Shareholders: Their business. They can address it it numerous ways. # 1 sell the stock. But there must be participating in a mutually beneficial situation, or they would not be holding the stock would they? But the answer is the same. Sell the stock and make it none of your business.
Non-Shareholders: None of your business.
??
August 31st, 2011
9:59 am
Houston, TX can report an AP story about APD, but AJC can’t? Seems a bit shady. What gives AJC? http://www.chron.com/news/article/Audit-85-Atlanta-officers-lost-arrest-powers-2148062.php
stevie ray
August 31st, 2011
10:00 am
Interesting statistics I came across yesterday. In Florida and NC, average unemployment is consistent with national average yet for african americans, it is closer to 20%. We are finding that the rate is generally 100% higher for african americans than others, even hispanics. This is an embarassing and ridiculous situation that’s gonna keep many of those who voted in record numbers in 2008 away from the polls.
I’ve always felt the “warfare” in class warfare is overly dramatic. Too many variables involved to assign blame to any single source for the delta between the haves and have nots. Seems cyclical to me.
Good Little Liberal
August 31st, 2011
10:01 am
1811/0311
Be careful about saying anything about what liberals make. I’ve stirred up a hornet’s nest this morning. Apparently they think that it’s no body’s business what THEY make.
stands for decibels
August 31st, 2011
10:01 am
I didn’t say the country/world was full of them ………… God did.
If the shoes fits wear it ………… otherwise press on !
Here is what you wrote, quoted in its entirety:
This is why today’s speech by Gov. Rick Perry rings so true. We need the “real church” to stand up and be counted:
“An unholy church is useless to the world. It is of no value. It is an abomination. It is hell’s laughter and heaven’s abhorrence. The worst evils that have ever come on the world have been brought by an unholy church.”
Charles Spurgeon
Alas, our country is full of “unholy” churches and even entire “unholy” denominations.
Just sayin ……………………………
Stop being such a wuss, 1811, and name these “unholy” denominations. It wasn’t some other guy who proclaimed that our country is “full of entire unholy denominations.” it was you.
Name them.
(Anyone who thinks I’m being unfair to 1811, let me know. I think I’m entitled to know what he meant, without further dodges and deceptions.)
Uncle Jed
August 31st, 2011
10:01 am
According to the Institute of Policy Studies, a liberal think tank
+++++++++++++
And then I stopped reading.
But I did wonder, based upon the headline; how much profit did Uncle Sam generate within these corporations? My guess, ZERO.
The Thin Guy
August 31st, 2011
10:01 am
Movie stars, athletes, and lawyers are overpaid. The Gorbot is making a mint with The Glow Bull Luke Warming Scam. The senior senator for Massachusetts parks his $ 7 million yacht in a neighboring state so he can escape the yacht tax. And Jug Ears is riding around the country in two $ 1.1 million dollars Canadian Death Star buses that get 6.7 miles per gallon (one for him and one for The Teleprompter). CEOs have to be highly paid so they can afford to bribe democrats. BTW, corporations don’t pay taxes; their shareholders do.
Common Sense
August 31st, 2011
10:02 am
Granny doesn’t understand how the term public has two different uses here?
Publically means all private citizens can participate if they choose to.
It does not obligate them to make the non-owners happy.
So if you are a non-owner, it’s none of your business.
Corporate tax rate 2nd highest in the world
August 31st, 2011
10:03 am
Maybe if the corporate tax rate wasn’t the 2nd highest in the world, about a tenth of 1 percent behind Japan’s, corporations wouldn’t feel the need to offshore money in order to remain competitive. Ya’ll simpletons ever think about that? Naw. Probably not.
Butch Cassidy
August 31st, 2011
10:03 am
Average income in the U.S. is around $50,000. For every million dollars a CEO makes, you could hire 20 employees at the average rate. So is it really asking a lot that perhaps a CEO take a 5 million dollar cut in return for bringing back 100 people to work, which will in turn contribute to the economic crowth of our consumer driven economy? Or does that just make too much sense?
Mary Elizabeth
August 31st, 2011
10:04 am
Bradley @ 9:50
Thank you for noticing this trend that is not in the interests of the average American, and for stating your thoughts about it here. The more people will speak up – as you and I have done this morning (as well as others) – the more the majority of average Americans will realize that what has been happening in our nation, especially in the past decade, has not been in their best interests – as well as how they have been manipulated to not see it.
Soothsayer
August 31st, 2011
10:05 am
U.S. Business Has High Tax Rates but Pays Less
Topping out at 35 percent, America’s official corporate income tax rate trails that of only Japan, at 39.5 percent, which has said it plans to lower its rate. It is nearly triple Ireland’s and 10 percentage points higher than in Denmark, Austria or China. To help companies here stay competitive, many executives say, Congress should lower it.
But by taking advantage of myriad breaks and loopholes that other countries generally do not offer, United States corporations pay only slightly more on average than their counterparts in other industrial countries. And some American corporations use aggressive strategies to pay less — often far less — than their competitors abroad and at home. A Government Accountability Office study released in 2008 found that 55 percent of United States companies paid no federal income taxes during at least one year in a seven-year period it studied.
The paradox of the United States tax code — high rates with a bounty of subsidies, shelters and special breaks — has made American multinationals “world leaders in tax avoidance,” according to Edward D. Kleinbard, a professor at the University of Southern California who was head of the Congressional joint committee on taxes.
Normal
August 31st, 2011
10:05 am
“I’m making lots of money right now.
Lots.”
Yeah…working for tips at the Eagle Club…
Common Sense
August 31st, 2011
10:05 am
“So is it really asking a lot that perhaps a CEO take a 5 million dollar cut in return for bringing back 100 people to work, which will in turn contribute to the economic growth of our consumer driven economy?”
Since you asked, yes it is too much.
Because it is none of your business. Who are you to demand that someone else earn less for the benefit of others?
Redneck Convert (R--and proud of it)
August 31st, 2011
10:06 am
Well, here we go again. Wealth Envy. Bookman won’t be satisfied till everybody’s making the same thing. That’s a librul for you. People make what they make because of Choices. People that don’t make much money made Bad Choices. People that make alot of money made Good Choices. That’s just the way it is in a Free Innerprize system. Course, it helps to know the right people. I wouldn’t of made it all the way up to beer truck driver without knowing Elmer Goodwin. He put in the good word for me down at the warehouse. Otherwise, I’d still be hanging sheetrock and walking on those stilts to put sheetrock mud on ceilings and then use the brush to make the pattern.
Anyway, I don’t mind if some people mak $10 million a year. $10 million don’t go as far as it use to. Before you know it you’re out of money and don’t have a penny to put into some derivative that comes along and could make you rich. And after you pay for all the upkeep on your mansion and vacation homes you barely have enough left to pay for your country club memberships.
I like this system, unlike the libruls. I figure I’m in for at least a 2% raise in December. Another 50 years or so and I’ll be right up there with the big boys. Maybe get that doublewide I always wanted and another flat screen TV. And the biggest ass pickup you ever seen.
Have a good Wednesday everybody.
Granny Godzilla
August 31st, 2011
10:07 am
Common Sense
again common sense says publically traded company – info is public.
sorry you don’t care for it, but tough stuff.
i never invest in a company without investigating it…do you?
and if you do, how can you if info required to be public ain’t?
do you guess? eeny meeny miney mo?
RB from Gwinnett
August 31st, 2011
10:07 am
I’m not afraid to say it. We DO need to tax poor more (some at all!!) and every increase in taxes should affect them by the same percentage. As long as half the country has no skin in the game, there is no “WE” and we cease to be in this together. When “WE” have a stake in what our government does and how they perform (or don’t), then “WE” will have the incentive to do something about it. As long as 47% have no incentive at all, “WE” are going to continue to do nothing.
Sarah
August 31st, 2011
10:07 am
Who would Marv Albert bite?
stevie ray
August 31st, 2011
10:08 am
Butch, it’s not that simple. First, including benefits et al, your $50,000 salary actually costs the company $75,000. Second, if demand for this company’s products is flat, what exactly are these 100 people gonna do everyday? Additionally, at salary of $50,000 contributes virtually zero dollars in federal income tax…..
Butch Cassidy
August 31st, 2011
10:08 am
Common Sense – “Because it is none of your business. Who are you to demand that someone else earn less for the benefit of others?’
Sorry, I guess your one of the supporters of the 9% unemployment rate. My statement merely indicated that it is possible to reduce unemployment in this country wothout hitting the profit margins of the organization, if 1 individual was willing to compromise for the good of everyone.
jt
August 31st, 2011
10:08 am
Lytil Jhon and Robyne Hude
Wayth-men ware commendyd gude
In Yngil-wode and Barnysdale
Thai oysyd all this tyme thare trawale.
.
There is a reason why Robin Hood’s message has lasted 600 years……………600 years!
Robin Hood did not steal from the rich and give to the poor.(Demo-Prog talking points).
Nor did he steal from the poor to give to the rich.(R&D Federal Party Reality).
.
Through clever shenanigans and outright hi-jacks, he allowed the poor to keep/shield their wealth from a corrupt government authority.
.
Don’t go down in history as a Sheriff of Nottingham.
USinUK
August 31st, 2011
10:09 am
“and when they give themselves an average pay increase of 28 percent in a time of great economic hardship for millions — that is not class warfare or wealth redistribution.”
what’s the 2011 equivalent for “let them eat cake” because that is surely what the CEOs are saying.
USinUK
August 31st, 2011
10:10 am
There’s class warfare, all right, but it’s my class, the rich class, that’s making war, and we’re winning.
-Warren Buffet
Brosephus
August 31st, 2011
10:10 am
Interesting statistics I came across yesterday. In Florida and NC, average unemployment is consistent with national average yet for african americans, it is closer to 20%. We are finding that the rate is generally 100% higher for african americans than others, even hispanics. This is an embarassing and ridiculous situation that’s gonna keep many of those who voted in record numbers in 2008 away from the polls.
Not very interesting from my perspective. AA unemployment rates have been twice the national average for as long as I can remember. There was the old saying that I would need to be “twice as smart, twice as good, and work twice as hard” just to be on an even level with others. Guess that saying was rooted in some fact after all.
larry
August 31st, 2011
10:10 am
Brosephus
August 31st, 2011
9:52 am
I guess its just the idealist in me that you can fight back but i know the feeling being raised in small town GA. The ADA should have gone after her and made her pay.
I am sorry for the loss of your grandfather.
Good Little Liberal
August 31st, 2011
10:10 am
Granny Godzilla
Nah, I do alright. I’ll be able to pay off the loan for the land to build the new digs up here in the sticks around October and the house was paid for before it was finished. I drive an older car and a very old pick up. Mostly, I stay away from debt as much as possible and keep my expenses very low.
Since moving away from Atlanta, that’s been a lot easier. Its how the government should work. A few years ago I decided that I didn’t need a huge income if I could get rid of a lot of my costs. I stopped buying new cars every year. Spent every dime I had paying off the credit cards, started a little internet business that pays a few bills every month ( and nothing more)
You could make a lot more money than working three jobs, just by starting an internet company. You just need to find a way to do it. It’s not easy, but once you do it, it’s a lot easier than working all those jobs.
stevie ray
August 31st, 2011
10:10 am
Butch, again I challenge your argument that randomly hiring for the sake of reducing unemployment doesn’t float unless a corresponding increase in demand for said product exists…
Joe Mama
August 31st, 2011
10:10 am
Kayaker71 — “Once the money is deposited in a 401K, it is you who determines what the account will produce. The evil corporation has nothing to do with it.”
It sounds like you’re saying that 401k holders are to blame for the 2008 meltdown. Maybe you should back up and rephrase that, Champ.
USinUK
August 31st, 2011
10:10 am
“Who would Marv Albert bite?”
good gravy … there’s a blast from the past
Bosch
August 31st, 2011
10:10 am
“As long as half the country has no skin in the game”
This argument makes no sense. How does one equate paying income tax to not having a connection to the country in which they are citizens?
Corporate tax rate 2nd highest in the world
August 31st, 2011
10:11 am
common sense says if it’s a publically traded company it is MY business- Granny Godzilla
Being publicly traded means nada. It is still owned by private individuals, people’s 401ks, mutual and pension funds, etc. As long as this company operates within the bounds of the law it is none of your business what they do unless you own part of that company. And even then you have very little say unless you own a significant portion of said company. You’re probably one of those people who think its nobody’s business what a woman does in relation to abortion which is the extinguishment of a human life but yet you think its everybody’s business what a particular corporation is doing. It isn’t. As long as they are operating legally it aint none of your dang business at all. None.
Mighty Righty
August 31st, 2011
10:11 am
Granny Godzilla
August 31st, 2011
9:59 am
common sense says if it’s a publically traded company it is MY business
My common sense tells me that anyone who doesn’t own stock in a company should not concern themselves with what that company does so long as what thecompany is doing is not illegal and is not harming the public. Further, if one does want to stick their nose in something that is not of their business, that person should put their money where their mouth is and purchase shares in said company. Such purchase gives all who own shares a vote in what the company does. Otherwise MYOB.
Common Sense
August 31st, 2011
10:12 am
Granny displays a false logic.
The information is public. So make your choice as to whether or not ti invest.
That is not the same as demanding that those salaries for companies be lowered.
It becomes none of your business when you are not an owner of the corporation and you try to tell them what to pay their employees.
Do you get the difference? Probably not. Because it’s a tough concept to grasp.
But I will help you. To apply YOUR logic, your neighbors should be able to address how may kids you have because THEY are paying for public schools.
And what would your response to them be? That’s what I thought.
It’s none of THEIR business.
Brosephus
August 31st, 2011
10:12 am
Because it is none of your business. Who are you to demand that someone else earn less for the benefit of others?
Unless we move back to company provided defined pensions and away from market invested 401k’s, IT IS the business of every damn body who’s invested in the market. When my retirement is dependent upon those companies, it’s every bit my business of what decisions they make. The GOP wants to kill SS. The GOP wants to kill fed pensions. All I may end up with by the time I retire is my market plan.
getalife
August 31st, 2011
10:13 am
They are not cons anymore.
They are wealthers fighting for the wealth care party.
The wealthy can get all the money in this country and the wealthers will still blindly fight for them.
Leaving their kids with no chance of making a livable wage.
You can’t fix this kind of ignorance.
You just have to laugh.
Bosch
August 31st, 2011
10:13 am
Cultural hegemony people….look it up. It’s a Marxist philosophy so embraced by our wingnut friends like GLL.
Soothsayer
August 31st, 2011
10:13 am
I love these kind of blogs. You see the Righties walking the talking points right over straight from Focked News. Never mind that they’re half-truthes and/or outright lies.
Monkey hear, monkey say. That’s the way it is when you get your information from rote knowledge rather than trying to ascertain the real truth.
So, therefore, Jay’s blog is reduced to an endless refutation of Right-wing talking. No matter how many time they’re proven false, they just keep walking the talking points.
Out for the day.
stands for decibels
August 31st, 2011
10:13 am
Since you asked, yes it is too much.
Because it is none of your business.
Hmm. an idea.
Why don’t we take this to the people to decide as a major 2012 campaign issue? Maybe working Americans will take to heart this Ayn Randian concept that other people’s incomes and livelihoods are simply their business and we shouldn’t even think about how much they’re taxed.
Or, not. Whaddaya think? Think that’s a winner for the GOP?
stevie ray
August 31st, 2011
10:13 am
Brocephus, love your moniker by the way….on one the better ones on this forum. Agree with your comments with the exception that african american unemployment was half of current levels in 2008 and when you get upwards of 20%, its so much more apparent…I know I’d be screaming louder. Too bad the fed’s ability to materially affect unemployment either way is more limited than most think…
Butch Cassidy
August 31st, 2011
10:14 am
stevie ray – “Butch, again I challenge your argument that randomly hiring for the sake of reducing unemployment doesn’t float unless a corresponding increase in demand for said product exists…”
I’m not saying to hire at random, however it’s been documented that companies are squeezing more out of their workers rather than hiring more to offset the load. No problem doing that, but increasing CEO pay at the expense of the existing works is BS. Take less at the to, redistribute it to the working staff i.e. hiring, and let those dollars work their way through the economy. 20,40,50 more employees will contribute a lot more to the growth of the econamy that 1 CEO possibly can.
stands for decibels
August 31st, 2011
10:14 am
Also, about this “the rate is sooooooooo high” nonsense…this
(which is from this.
Martin the Calvinist
August 31st, 2011
10:15 am
I believe a lower tax rate on income and corporations are in order here. But those should come at the expense of all the deductions individuals and corporations get. But common sense tax policies will never come because some donors, (both political parties) have helped create the tax policies.
on a side note, isn’t it funny the President for three straight years after his August vacation has proposed a “jobs” bill that is exactly the same and has done not one bit of good.
USinUK
August 31st, 2011
10:15 am
Bosch – “This argument makes no sense. How does one equate paying income tax to not having a connection to the country in which they are citizens?”
it makes them subhuman, doncha know
Thulsa Doom
August 31st, 2011
10:15 am
To the contrary Bosch. It makes all the sense in the world. The reason is because when half the country does not pay taxes what is to stop them from using the ballot box to vote themselves goodies paid for by the other half of the country? Its nothing more than theft with the ballot box enabling one group to take from another group at will. And as De Tocqueville said and as we see with the debt being accumulated it will surely be the ruination of this once great nation.
Bosch
August 31st, 2011
10:16 am
Hey Paul,
It looks like stands is going to be joining our club of asking wingnuts direct questions and watching them squirm away in a vain attempt to dodge and deflect from answering their obvious bs hyperbole, and when called upon it, instead of just admitting they were using such hyperbole.
Granny Godzilla
August 31st, 2011
10:16 am
GLL
Thanks for the advice, but I’m actually very happy and actually blessed
in my employment situation.
After crashing the glass ceiling at a fortune 100 company two decades ago….I find this life much more satisfying.
USinUK
August 31st, 2011
10:16 am
“It’s a Marxist philosophy so embraced by our wingnut friends like GLL.”
I don’t think “embraced” is quite the word I would use.
out of the blue
August 31st, 2011
10:17 am
MR…”Now we find out his company doesn’t even pay taxes it owes and most likely his conspirators in the administration will cover for him. What a joke!
Righty “WE” Now WE find out Buffett’s company doesn’t even pay taxes it owes!
Why, I do believe you posted that same BS the other day. And cited as proof, an article
by The New York POST. A company owned by that sainted Rupert Murdoch!
Brosephus
August 31st, 2011
10:17 am
larry
My headstrong idealism got powerbombed in that instance. I moved from idealism to realism after that. I’ve learned to live with the choices I have and not fuss over the things I have no control over. Our society has become so self-fixiated that not too many people stop what they’re doing to help others in need. I learned then that it’s sometimes better to help someone out with problems, even when you have problems of your own. Just a wee bit of help goes a long way towards making people feel better in different situations.
Keep Up the Good Fight!
August 31st, 2011
10:17 am
GLL: I’ve stirred up a hornet’s nest this morning. Apparently they think that it’s no body’s business what THEY make.
Well actually no. But Jay did make an offer to post on an equitable basis. So apparently part of your chicken humper distortion routine is to say one thing and do another. Rinse and repeat?
So have you sent your tax returns to Jay yet. When should he expect them? Or is this a lot of cluck, cluck.
USinUK
August 31st, 2011
10:17 am
“The reason is because when half the country does not pay taxes what is to stop them from using the ballot box to vote themselves goodies paid for by the other half of the country?”
that’s right!
let’s return to the days when only the landed gentry could vote!!
huzzah!
Joe Mama
August 31st, 2011
10:18 am
jm – “Tax return penis measuring
Faaaantastic fun
This should be entertaining”
I wonder if we will be measuring gross income, net or just from the base to the tip?
Mighty Righty
August 31st, 2011
10:19 am
Unlike our elected representives, CEO compensation is determined by the board of directors and the shareholders. There are people posting here stating the CEO’s determine their own pay which is uninformed non sense.
Good Little Liberal
August 31st, 2011
10:19 am
Keep Up
What is that on my leg?
Thulsa Doom
August 31st, 2011
10:19 am
isn’t it funny the President for three straight years after his August vacation has proposed a “jobs” bill that is exactly the same and has done not one bit of good.- Martin the calvinist
Martin,
Nope. Its not at all unexpected to me. Its the same ole same ole SSDD nonsense from Obama. But there are a lot of stupid people out there who will soak it up as if he is actually proposing something entirely new. I call them liberals sheeple and they go baa baa.
Uncle Jed
August 31st, 2011
10:20 am
Bradley @ 9:50
Thank you for noticing this trend that is not in the interests of the average American, and for stating your thoughts about it here.
++++++++++++++++++++++
Teacher awards Bradley a gold star. Next time try a Hallmark because:
“When You Care Enough, Send the Very Best”
Adam
August 31st, 2011
10:20 am
GLL: I’m making lots of money right now.
Lots.
So you admit to being paid to post BS.
Martin the Calvinist
August 31st, 2011
10:20 am
So Jay, what are you suggesting we do about this little “problem” you’ve introduced? Maybe liberals are dreaming Obama pull a Hugo Chavez and nationalize all the corporations. All the books Obama have written suggests that Marxist economic policies are ones he desires to implement.
Brosephus
August 31st, 2011
10:21 am
stevie ray: Agree with your comments with the exception that african american unemployment was half of current levels in 2008 and when you get upwards of 20%, its so much more apparent…
Look at historical rates. When AA unemployment was half the current rates in 2008, compare it with the national average. There’s been an almost consistent 2:1 ratio for a long time. I’m not all that old, but it’s been that way as long as I can remember. AA employment follows the LIFO method, Last In, First Out. Just a fact of life here in the US. Prior to integration, AA unemployment didn’t follow the 2:1 ratio.
Peadawg
August 31st, 2011
10:22 am
I don’t really get the point of this blog besides a whole lot of wealth envy. The million $ question is how much do we tax the “rich”? I’m all for taxing the rich more along w/ significant spending cuts, but how much more?
Joe Mama
August 31st, 2011
10:22 am
Stands — “Stop being such a wuss, 1811, and name these “unholy” denominations.”
What’s the over-under on him naming the Scientologists in that group? (pops corn)
Thulsa Doom
August 31st, 2011
10:22 am
USinUK,
Did I advocate some nonsense about feudal society or a society where only the landed gentry could vote? Nope. Just echoing the sentiment that everyone should have skin in the game. But your hyperbole and empty rhetoric is amusing nonetheless- and sadly it was very expected and sooo predictable.
getalife
August 31st, 2011
10:23 am
No new wealth care.
Say it with me wealthers.
No new wealth care.
Yeah right.
You wealthers will not stop until your children work for a dollar an hour.
Then you will kick them on the streets like you want to do with the Seniors.
Hilarious.
stevie ray
August 31st, 2011
10:24 am
Brocephis, we are saying the same thing but I don’t understand your comment about “before integration”..??
Adam
August 31st, 2011
10:26 am
RB: I’m not afraid to say it. We DO need to tax poor more (some at all!!) and every increase in taxes should affect them by the same percentage. As long as half the country has no skin in the game, there is no “WE” and we cease to be in this together. When “WE” have a stake in what our government does and how they perform (or don’t), then “WE” will have the incentive to do something about it. As long as 47% have no incentive at all, “WE” are going to continue to do nothing.
For those interested, this is what REAL class warfare looks like.
Good Little Liberal
August 31st, 2011
10:27 am
Granny
I can see that. The rat race is for rats. I like this laid back lifestyle up here a lot more. I go back to Atlanta about once a month and I am amazed at how rude everybody seems.
You should think about the internet thing, though. It’s found money. If you go into it not expecting to make millions, it can be done relatively easily and actually with almost no money. You live in Atlanta where things can be gotten pretty easily. The only real problem with living up here in the sticks is that I do most of my shopping on the internet. My site gets about 99% of the orders from small towns.
But for God’s sake stay away from these guys who teach classes on how to make money on the internet. That’s how they are making money: they are teaching classes. Just figure out something that you like or like to do and find a few products to sell around that business. Sign up for Pay Pal and you are done. I make a few grand a year, enough to pay a few bills, but that really helps considering that I do nothing to make the money.
Bosch
August 31st, 2011
10:27 am
Doom,
I dunno, something tells me, and yes, this is just all speculation to me, but something tells me those folks don’t keep up with politics like we do and something tells me they aren’t out voting in droves.
“Its nothing more than theft with the ballot box enabling one group to take from another group at will. And as De Tocqueville said and as we see with the debt being accumulated it will surely be the ruination of this once great nation”
OH THE HUMANITY!!! (And melodrama
)
stevie ray
August 31st, 2011
10:28 am
Butch, shareholders will look askance at hiring for the reasons you mentioned. Adding employees to allow others a lightened load simply for the benefit of society will never float with corporate boards who face very expensive derivative suits in the event of hits on EPS that affect performance compared to peers or market in general. Quite a system…
Uncle Jed
August 31st, 2011
10:28 am
I sure am glad that the democrat party has toned down the rhetoric. You would never hear this from a member of the Congressional White Caucus…
Andre Carson: Tea party wants blacks ‘hanging on a tree’
A top lawmaker in the Congressional Black Caucus says tea partiers on Capitol Hill would like to see African-Americans hanging from trees and accuses the movement of wishing for a return to the Jim Crow era.
Rep. Andre Carson, a Democrat from Indiana who serves as the CBC’s chief vote counter, said at a CBC event in Miami that some in Congress would “love to see us as second-class citizens” and “some of them in Congress right now of this tea party movement would love to see you and me … hanging on a tree.”
Carson also said the tea party is stopping change in Congress, likening it to “the effort that we’re seeing of Jim Crow.”
And some fretted Bachmann joking about the cause of earthquakes and hurricanes. Hmmm
Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0811/62396.html#ixzz1WcHwJUBy
Left wing management
August 31st, 2011
10:29 am
Common Sense: “Shareholders: Their business. They can address it it numerous ways. # 1 sell the stock. … Non-Shareholders: None of your business.”
Common, your assumption is that there is a natural division between stockholders and non-stockholders, and by extension that there is nothing political about that setup. But surely you know that there is nothing more political – more ideologically freighted – than the profit system and corporate governance system that is weighted so extremely towards the “stockholder” as it is in Wild Wild West Anglo-American capitalism (as opposed to Continental European capitalism, where at least there have traditionally been some restraints on this). You do realize that, don’t you?
By the way, Common, I’m amused in a way at your nom de blog. Are you aware of the critique of “common sense” of the great Marxist Gramsci?
Adam
August 31st, 2011
10:29 am
Common Sense: That is not the same as demanding that those salaries for companies be lowered.
Please, anywhere in this thread, find a post that says this is what we need to do.
USinUK
August 31st, 2011
10:29 am
“Just echoing the sentiment that everyone should have skin in the game.”
no – what you’re saying is that the people who don’t have “skin in the game” are abusing the ballot box to get more “goodies” …
so, yeah – let’s return to the days when only people who have “skin in the game” can vote! only people who pay income taxes are eligible! only people who pay property taxes are eligible!
at least have the courage of your convictions to say what you really mean, Thulsa. When you don’t, it just makes you look spineless.
go get ‘em Thulsa!!!
Brosephus
August 31st, 2011
10:30 am
Brocephis, we are saying the same thing but I don’t understand your comment about “before integration”..??
Prior to integration, the AA unemployment rate did not follow the 2:1 ratio that it pretty much does now because everything in society was duplicated. You had businesses for Whites and businesses for Blacks. Blacks were employed in the Black businesses because they could only work in limited areas in White businesses, if they were allowed to work at all.
Post-integration, AA employment has typically been LIFO, Last In, First Out. It doesn’t always follow that method, but AA unemployment in the past few decades has averaged around twice the national average. There’s different reasons for that, but the average has been that way for a while.
Good Little Liberal
August 31st, 2011
10:31 am
Adam
“So you admit to being paid to post BS.”
I own my own business. The only person paying me is me. It’s the American way.
So who is paying you right now?
Bosch
August 31st, 2011
10:31 am
And Doom,
“when half the country does not pay taxes what is to stop them from using the ballot box to vote themselves goodies paid for by the other half of the country?”
Are you really going to sit there with a straight face and tell me that this voting block has THAT much power?
Oh just damn that’s so ridiculous.
Uncle Jed
August 31st, 2011
10:31 am
It’s the last day of the month. 10:23 must have run out of meds
stands for decibels
August 31st, 2011
10:32 am
What’s the over-under on him naming the Scientologists in that group? (pops corn)
Sorry for the off-topic / soap operatic post, but…
If the past is any guide, 1811/Scout will just wait me out, figuring I’ll stop asking.
Like I did about a year or so ago when Scout posted that there are regulars here in the comments page who “secretly loathe the military.” I thought that was very interesting, not just in how Scout is capable of reading minds over the internet, but of course which secret-loathers he might mean.
So I asked. Three separate times.
He completely avoided me, never answered, and I gave up, figuring maybe I was just being petty. After all, it was just a stray thought, and he’s just talking about other mostly-anonymous comments page people, right?
But when he steps out and claims that entire denominations are unholy, and that the US is full of them?
I think that deserves some elaboration. and twice now he’s tried to pull a fast one, and I don’t think I should just let that go. I think he needs to tell us which denominations (and since he used that term, I’m assuming he means Christian denominations, not, you know, tens and twenties?) he meant.
Adam
August 31st, 2011
10:32 am
Peadawg: How much more? I would settle just for closing the special interest loopholes that only benefit the rich. At that point, they’d be paying closer to their actual rate, as opposed to around 15-20%, lower than most in the middle class.
Butch Cassidy
August 31st, 2011
10:33 am
stevie ray – “Butch, shareholders will look askance at hiring for the reasons you mentioned. Adding employees to allow others a lightened load simply for the benefit of society will never float with corporate boards who face very expensive derivative suits in the event of hits on EPS that affect performance compared to peers or market in general”
Alright then, what would be your suggestion for getting the unemployment rate down to reasonable levels?
Bosch
August 31st, 2011
10:33 am
And Doom, I will add, if you are a citizen in this country, you have “skin in the game.”
Adam
August 31st, 2011
10:33 am
GLL: I’ve answered that question numerous times. hint: It’s not a simple one-income answer.
Brosephus
August 31st, 2011
10:34 am
dB
Stay on him!!!!!!!!
Anybody that posts bullsh*t here, whether left or right, should be called on it.
larry
August 31st, 2011
10:34 am
I saw over the weekend another mutl-billionare wants the wealthy to pay more in taxes .
Mark Cuban on PIers Morgan
http://piersmorgan.blogs.cnn.com/2011/08/30/clips-from-last-night-mark-cuban-on-the-economy-and-transparency-cory-booker-on-bachmann/?iref=allsearch
Thulsa Doom
August 31st, 2011
10:35 am
Bosch,
I think we can all learn a little from history. When de Toceqville saw the remarkable experiment in U.S. democracy he gave us about 200 years before the collapse would begin. His reasoning was simple and so far profoundly true. Social creep and the idea that evententually a majority of people would realize they can just vote themselves goodies from the public trough paid for by others. With nearly half of us not paying federal income taxes, with one in 6 Americans on food stamps and with a good % of Americans drawing some type of benefit from the govt is there any doubt as to what is happening? Its happening right before our very eyes. Call it melodrama but we’re going broke and that is as plain as day to see.
Aquagirl
August 31st, 2011
10:35 am
The only real problem with living up here in the sticks is that I do most of my shopping on the internet. My site gets about 99% of the orders from small towns.
If it’s a physical product, this is only possible because of a heavily subsidized transportation system. But of course, your money is the sole product of your brilliance and individual effort, and any taxes you pay are only due to class warfare and wealth envy.
stevie ray
August 31st, 2011
10:37 am
Brocephus, seems over time that all minorities get to eat the sh*t sandwich with the african americans time in the penalty box being incomparable long. When 16% of the population comprises a geometrically higher percentage of national unemployment, something needs to get done. Question is what?