With major hurricane looming, is federal aid in doubt?
Hurricane Irene, now a Category 3 storm, is headed up the Eastern Seaboard, threatening considerable damage and loss of life.
As the Weather Channel puts it, “this is a particularly threatening situation … computer models are currently trending toward a forecast solution of rare potency for portions of the Northeast. … Irene has the potential to be a serious and multi-hazard threat for the major metropolitan areas of the Mid-Atlantic and Northeast. This includes Norfolk, D.C., Baltimore, Philadelphia, New York City, Hartford, and Boston.”
At this stage, Irene is predicted to still be a Category 2 storm, with winds of 100 mph, by the time it hits the Washington, D.C. area sometime Sunday morning. A storm that big, hitting a handful of the nation’s densest urban areas almost simultaneously in a region not conditioned to hurricanes, has the potential to be a major disaster, requiring a full-out response by local, state and federal officials.
Or, maybe not.
House Majority Leader Eric Cantor, for example, has consistently argued that any appropriation for emergency relief must be offset by spending cuts elsewhere in the budget. With a major hurricane headed Virginia’s way, his office confirms has already announced that remains his position. And as we all already know, raising taxes to make the spending revenue-neutral won’t be an option either.
That approach is consistent with what Mitt Romney said back in June, in a GOP debate held shortly after tornadoes had destroyed much of Joplin, Missouri.
In a response to a question from John King, Romney said he would oppose federal disaster aid that would increase the deficit, proposing instead to leave that duty to the states. Given the chance by King to back off that position regarding relief operations in a major natural disaster, Romney refused, reiterating that we simply can’t afford it:
We cannot — we cannot afford to do those things without jeopardizing the future for our kids. It is simply immoral, in my view, for us to continue to rack up larger and larger debts and pass them on to our kids, knowing full well that we’ll all be dead and gone before it’s paid off. It makes no sense at all.”
There is, I suppose, a certain consistency in that position. As the argument goes, the words “hurricane”, “disaster” and even “storm” appear nowhere in the Constitution. In fact, under the conservative, states’ rights interpretation of the 10th Amendment so favored by Cantor, Rick Perry and others, it might even be unconstitutional for the federal government to respond to such a disaster.
While liberals might try to cite language in the Constitution that gives Congress the power to “provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States,” conservatives have made it pretty clear that the provision in question doesn’t apply in such matters.
As the Heritage Foundation helpfully explains in its guide to the Constitution prepared for members of Congress, “spending under the clause (must) be for the ‘general’ (that is, national) welfare and not for purely local or regional benefit.”
It goes on to quote James Madison to that same effect, arguing that congressional spending power is limited “to purposes of common defence, and of general, national, not local, or state, benefit.” It further notes that “the Fourth Congress did not believe it had the power to provide relief to the citizens of Savannah, Georgia, after a devastating fire destroyed the entire city.”
In this case, Hurricane Irene is projected to wreak havoc from North Carolina all the way north through Virginia and Maryland and on up into Massachusetts. While that comprises most, but not all, of the 13 original colonies, it doesn’t affect states such as California, Oregon, Iowa and even Georgia, not to mention Hawaii and Alaska.
In other words, sorry Eastern Seaboard. You’re on your own. Let us know how it all turns out for you.
– Jay Bookman
NOTE: This post has been edited slightly since the orginal posting.
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354 comments Add your comment
Jay
August 25th, 2011
5:27 pm
Cantor’s office says his position on offsetting disaster relief spending has not changed, but says that as majority leader he’s not in a position to control any vote but his own and cannot dictate what the House will do. Therefore, the earlier language in my post saying that Cantor would not “allow” such spending without offsets has been changed. The office will not address the issue of Hurricane Irene directly.
Joe Mama
August 25th, 2011
5:28 pm
Righty — You need some serious fact-checking.
“My support for the Iraq war ended with the fall of bagdad.”
Well, mine ended long before the first shot was fired.
“The problems in New Orleans weren’t caused by lack of funds let alone shortage of money caused by the Iraq war.”
I didn’t suggest anything of the sort. I pointed out that it’s hypocritical to fund a multi-year war via “Emergency Supplemental Spending Measures” as if you don’t KNOW ahead of time that you’re going to need to pay for it and then bleat about how emergency spending for things like natural disasters have to be funded. It has nothing to do with one taking money away from the other — it has to do with the EFFING LIE that one completely foreseen “emergency” needed to be funded off the books, while another unforeseen emergency is just going to have to be borne up under by the victims. It’s enough to make me wish there really was a hell so that Eric Cantor could go there.
“New Orleans and the state of Louisiana spent money that was given to them for improving the dykes on other things.”
Really? You seem to not know that all flood control and water management in the Mississippi Delta is the exclusive province of the Army Corps of Engineers. Your argument is teh FAIL.
“The damages in the Katrina aftermath were inflicted by local and federal waste.”
Not in the least.
“In addition we have spent billions since, go there and look around. To this day, it is a cr-p hole. Not cased by lack of money.”
I’m sure the Corps of Engineers would differ with you.
Doggone/GA
August 25th, 2011
5:29 pm
“Doggone 5:25 – bingo”
If you are interpreting what I said as being on “your side” you are MASSIVELY wrong.
MightyRighty
August 25th, 2011
5:30 pm
Joe Mama
August 25th, 2011
5:21 pm
Do you actually think if we raised taxes the government would put some money away in a rainey day fund? My goodness no. They would just spend it on nonsense and then when it rains they would come back and want more money. Thank God there are a few good men like Eric Kantor who are looking out for the future of this nation. It is simple. The government has to be forced to reduce spending. Obama will prove me right when he announces his jobs program next month. It will be short on specifics save one. He will definitely want more money.
Joe Mama
August 25th, 2011
5:30 pm
md — “It looks a lot like the democrat tax proposal……….not enough to actually accomplish anything.”
Ah! So you admit there is a Republican tax-hike proposal!
Show me, please.
Logical Dude, feel free to jump in on this.
Logical Dude
August 25th, 2011
5:31 pm
Cantor’s office says “but says that as majority leader he’s not in a position to control any vote but his own”
So what DOES a majority leader supposed to lead? Oh, does he lead from behind too?
Sorry, that was too easy.
md
August 25th, 2011
5:31 pm
“So, are you suggesting that Cantor is going to approve the disaster funding with no delay, then later ask for offsetting cuts?”
From his response to Jay, I’d say that is a possibility……….it would be political suicide to withold the funding……….these guys/gals have that handbook…………..
Keep Up the Good Fight!
August 25th, 2011
5:31 pm
there isn’t a politician in the world that would be associated with actually withholding disaster relief [...]
Hmmm… I am confused. Hasn’t Cantor already said that he would support earthquake relief in his district but would look to offset the cost elsewhere in the budget…… I guess technically he has not said he would vote against it unless the cost was offset but sounds pretty close to a hard line:
The next step will be for Virginia Gov. Bob McDonnell (R) to decide whether to make an appeal for federal aid, Cantor said. The House Majority Leader would support such an effort but would look to offset the cost elsewhere in the federal budget.
“All of us know that the federal government is busy spending money it doesn’t have,” Cantor said in Culpeper, where the quake damaged some buildings along a busy shopping thoroughfare.
jm
August 25th, 2011
5:32 pm
Doggone 5:29 – dude, I was agreeing with you. This is not a constitutional issue. We’re talking about national assets and a whole region here.
I was adding my personal additions to what you were saying after agreeing with your first premise.
Lighten up Francis. (learned that one here myself)
Logical Dude
August 25th, 2011
5:33 pm
Joe Mama,
Didn’t you hear? The Republicans want to raise taxes by taking away the temporary tax reduction that Obama wanted. It cuts the payroll taxes slightly for those earning under 106K. Republicans want to end that tax reduction.
Joe the Plutocrat
August 25th, 2011
5:34 pm
hey everybody, look what I found when I did the GOOGLE for Blackwater, Katrina:
“Blackwater landed a $73 million contact to protect FEMA staff helping with the Katrina recovery operation”. again, was Cantor in Congress in 2005?
Joe Mama
August 25th, 2011
5:35 pm
Righty — “Do you actually think if we raised taxes the government would put some money away in a rainey day fund? My goodness no. They would just spend it on nonsense and then when it rains they would come back and want more money.”
If it’s such a good idea, then why don’t the Republicans put it forward as a legislative proposal?
“Thank God there are a few good men like Eric Kantor who are looking out for the future of this nation.”
IMO, Cantor’s a hypocritical turd. I just hope his constituents don’t have to suffer so that Cantor can feel all warm and noble and principled.
“It is simple. The government has to be forced to reduce spending.”
You must not read newspapers. The government already HAS reduced spending and is looking for ways to reduce it even more.
“Obama will prove me right when he announces his jobs program next month. It will be short on specifics save one. He will definitely want more money.”
I don’t think that will prove you right, though I don’t doubt that you will make all sorts of claims about it.
Doggone/GA
August 25th, 2011
5:35 pm
“I was adding my personal additions to what you were saying after agreeing with your first premise”
But I think it IS a Constitutional issue.
md
August 25th, 2011
5:36 pm
“Ah! So you admit there is a Republican tax-hike proposal!”
Of course……it is a blank page, or maybe some loophole changes, while the dem plan is a 2/3 blank page……….
Neither will provide enough to fix the problem…………..
jm
August 25th, 2011
5:37 pm
On a practical note, New Yorkers should evacuate.
If it does get a direct hit, it will be a damn mess. Tunnels all flooded. Subway car equipment ruined and beyond short term repair. Lost power in a hot city. Lack of gas and food. Basically a dysfunctional city for a couple of weeks, and probably up to a month.
Good thing the NYSE and Nasdaq have backups and most trading is done electronically in a disaggregated manner now.
@@
August 25th, 2011
5:38 pm
A rainy day fund would’ve been nice. ‘Ya gave to put forth the effort to save one of those though.
Brosephus
August 25th, 2011
5:38 pm
md
I think that straw will break the camel’s back when we get to the point where we refuse to lend a hand to help our fellow citizens stand back up after getting knocked down.
Playing budget cut bingo w/disaster aid is a bad idea in my book. Along the Eastern Seaboard, you have ports of Norfolk, Baltimore, Newark, and New York in the potential line of fire of this storm. You’re talking about a great deal of shipping for businesses that aid our economy. I don’t see how aiding the country is gonna break the country. Not aiding the rebuilding will handicap us much worse than any added debt. We can work off the debt with a functioning society. A damaged and disfunctional community can’t work worth sh*t to pay back any debt.
Doggone/GA
August 25th, 2011
5:38 pm
“Neither will provide enough to fix the problem…………..”
You eat an elephant one bite at a time, not all in one mouthful
jm
August 25th, 2011
5:38 pm
Doggone – well then. You argue that point, I don’t think it is. I think the Feds can reasonably justify providing significant, but partial, help, with the states shouldering a good portion of the burden (30-50%).
md
August 25th, 2011
5:39 pm
“I am confused. Hasn’t Cantor already said that he would support earthquake relief in his district but would look to offset the cost elsewhere in the budget……”
There is a difference between withholding funds vs providing funds and then requiring cuts elsewhere.
Sounds like common sense to me………….if one spends what one doesn’t have, they will have no choice but to not spend somewhere else………..
Unless you folks are keen to the idea of perpetual borrowing…………
MightyRighty
August 25th, 2011
5:39 pm
Joe; If you are looking for some kind of an award for opposing the Iraq war, I don’t have any to give. The rest of your comments are just pretty much wrong. I never said the dykes weren’t repaired. I said New Orleans is a cr-p hole. It is. Boarded up business, trash, odor I could go on and on. This after billions of our tax dollars were wasted again during the aftermath of Katrina.
Joe Mama
August 25th, 2011
5:40 pm
Logical Dude — “Didn’t you hear? The Republicans want to raise taxes by taking away the temporary tax reduction that Obama wanted. It cuts the payroll taxes slightly for those earning under 106K. Republicans want to end that tax reduction.”
I heard.
Frankly, I think your characterization of this as a tax hike is pretty pathetic.
Obama: wants a payroll tax reduction
Republicans: oppose the planned payroll tax reduction
Republicans: ‘See? We’re raising taxes!’
Taxpayers: W. T. F.?
@@
August 25th, 2011
5:40 pm
‘Ya (H)ave to put forth…
IHB
josef
August 25th, 2011
5:40 pm
matti
@5:24
Thank you for putting it the way you did! I wanted to say that, but then, I’m just a thin skinned supersensitve drama queen, just looking for something to complain about…but, yeah, you’ve hit the nail on the head…
Joe Mama
August 25th, 2011
5:40 pm
Joe P. — “again, was Cantor in Congress in 2005?”
He was seated in January of 2001. So yes.
Joe the Plutocrat
August 25th, 2011
5:41 pm
jm, and most places like the NYSE and NASDAQ have offsite (outside of Manahattan) data centers and back-up data centers. that said, NYC will be fine, assuming there is no significant “storm surge” the real “exposed” folks are those in the burbs who live near rivers and streams; or the Jersey shore and southern coast of Long Island
Jay
August 25th, 2011
5:41 pm
“Let’s be honest here. Revenues are 15% of GDP. Spending has climbed astonishingly from 18% of GDP to 24% of GDP under Obama.”
Yes, let’s be honest. Spending as a percentage of GDP has risen in part because GDP has FALLEN so much, declining by 20 percent between the third quarter of ‘08 through the second quarter of ‘09.
Spending has also increased in part because of mandatory increases in such recession-driven programs as food stamps, unemployment, Medicaid, etc.
Doggone/GA
August 25th, 2011
5:42 pm
“You argue that point”
I don’t need to. Jay already did. At least, he mentioned it.
jm
August 25th, 2011
5:42 pm
Mighty Righty – New Orleans is a fundamentally lost city. That was a bad investment. With rising sea levels and a dysfunctional government, all those people would be better served if the city was abandoned with the exception of the area within a 3 mile radius of the French Quarter.
Rebuild higher, but a smaller set of levies….. next Hurricane and NO is probably toast again.
Joe the Plutocrat
August 25th, 2011
5:42 pm
so let me get this straight, he was OK with a $73 million payment to a bunch or mercenaries to protect FEMA employees who were (unconstitutionally) deployed to NOLA?
AmVet
August 25th, 2011
5:43 pm
“My support for the Iraq war ended with the fall of bagdad.(sic)”
Then you were in a minscule percentage of Republicans.
Doggone/GA
August 25th, 2011
5:43 pm
“jm, and most places like the NYSE and NASDAQ have offsite (outside of Manahattan) data centers and back-up data centers”
there are no offsite and back-up centers for shipping containers
jm
August 25th, 2011
5:46 pm
Um, Jay, GDP is as high as it was pre-recession.
2007q1 13,758.5 13,056.1
2007q2 13,976.8 13,173.6
2007q3 14,126.2 13,269.8
2007q4 14,253.2 13,326.0
2008q1 14,273.9 13,266.8
2008q2 14,415.5 13,310.5
2008q3 14,395.1 13,186.9
2008q4 14,081.7 12,883.5
2009q1 13,893.7 12,663.2
2009q2 13,854.1 12,641.3
2009q3 13,920.5 12,694.5
2009q4 14,087.4 12,813.5
2010q1 14,277.9 12,937.7
2010q2 14,467.8 13,058.5
2010q3 14,605.5 13,139.6
2010q4 14,755.0 13,216.1
2011q1 14,867.8 13,227.9
2011q2 15,003.8 13,270.1
http://www.bea.gov/national/index.htm#gdp
Even with the pre-recession peak on a real basis. Now, yes, more of it is composed of government spending. But its time to wind that down in a reasonable manner over the next 24 months.
Joe Mama
August 25th, 2011
5:47 pm
Righty — “Joe; If you are looking for some kind of an award for opposing the Iraq war, I don’t have any to give.”
I don’t need one from you or anyone else. But it would be nice if you recognized how that war got paid for.
“The rest of your comments are just pretty much wrong.”
There’s nothing wrong in anything I said, sir. The war WAS funded off-budget, via Emergency Supplemental Spending Measures EVERY YEAR while Bush was in office. It’s not my fault if you’re not aware of that.
“I never said the dykes weren’t repaired.”
I didn’t claim you did. I pointed out that you were wrong when you claimed they were a state and local responsibility. You clearly aren’t very well informed on the issue.
“I said New Orleans is a cr-p hole. It is.”
Seems to me that we had a President saying that we’d rebuild that city. How’s that working out for them?
“Boarded up business, trash, odor I could go on and on. This after billions of our tax dollars were wasted again during the aftermath of Katrina.”
And yet you support Cantor’s position, which would only yield MORE cities in that condition. You’re absolutely amazing, and I don’t mean that in a good way.
josef
August 25th, 2011
5:48 pm
jm
@ 5:42
Hey, reality check…it was an area within the three mile radius of the Vieux Carre that got smacked…
Like so many of the rest of those who hold Uncle Sam’s Red Headed Step Children in such low regard but just love “the culture,” you won’t be happy until its confined to a museum of an extinct people.
jm
August 25th, 2011
5:48 pm
Doggone 5:43 – no, but there are other ports. But your point is well taken. The nation needs those ports (and airports, among other things).
Jay
August 25th, 2011
5:49 pm
You mean it’s recovered to what it was four years ago?
Yes.
Meanwhile, what did defense spending do in those intervening four years? Social Security, Medicare? Those and other things kept rising; GDP did not. Therefore, the ratio of spending to GDP rose without Obama having a single thing to do with it.
Logical Dude
August 25th, 2011
5:50 pm
Joe Mama: Frankly, I think your characterization of this as a tax hike is pretty pathetic.
Oh, it wasn’t my characteristic, it’s what the headlines were saying.
But I’d just like to see the “Bush/Obama tax cuts” end as well. It’s amazing that Republicans fought SO hard because they called it “raising taxes” after the cuts were supposed to expire. I thought it made them look pathetic, too. Can’t even take an easy step for the good of the country.
MightyRighty
August 25th, 2011
5:51 pm
Joe Mama
August 25th, 2011
5:35 pm
IMO, Cantor’s a hypocritical turd. I just hope his constituents don’t have to suffer so that Cantor can feel all warm and noble and principled.
An example please.
Righty — “Do you actually think if we raised taxes the government would put some money away in a rainey day fund? My goodness no. They would just spend it on nonsense and then when it rains they would come back and want more money.”
If it’s such a good idea, then why don’t the Republicans put it forward as a legislative proposal?
Do you know they haven’t?
You must not read newspapers. The government already HAS reduced spending and is looking for ways to reduce it even more.
Joe I can’t ignore the utter stupidity of the above statement. Specifics please.
“Obama will prove me right when he announces his jobs program next month. It will be short on specifics save one. He will definitely want more money.”
I don’t think that will prove you right, though I don’t doubt that you will make all sorts of claims about it.
Unlike your above stateement I will be happy to provide quotes.
jm
August 25th, 2011
5:51 pm
josef 5:48 – I’ve been to New Orleans many a time. I think its a fantastic city. But I also think rising sea levels will make it indefensible (or obscenely costly to do so) unless one contemplates trying to defend a smaller area.
Joe Mama
August 25th, 2011
5:51 pm
jm — “Mighty Righty – New Orleans is a fundamentally lost city. That was a bad investment. With rising sea levels and a dysfunctional government, all those people would be better served if the city was abandoned with the exception of the area within a 3 mile radius of the French Quarter.”
“Rebuild higher, but a smaller set of levies….. next Hurricane and NO is probably toast again.”
One wonders why the LA state and Federal authorities rebuffed the Dutch offer to help plan out a flood mitigation plan. With their knowledge and expertise, the Dutch could easily help figure out the best and most cost-efficient way to address the Delta’s flooding issues.
MightyRighty
August 25th, 2011
5:52 pm
Gotta go. Grub time.
Joe Mama
August 25th, 2011
5:52 pm
Logical Dude — “But I’d just like to see the “Bush/Obama tax cuts” end as well.”
There were many liberal posters here who, like myself, eagerly said we’d take the conservative posters up on that offer.
Bosch
August 25th, 2011
5:53 pm
So Brosephus
Tell us how you REALLY feel !
jm
August 25th, 2011
5:53 pm
Jay 5:49 – yep, they’ve grown by 30% in total (18% to 24% of GDP)
So now would be a responsible time to reform them by doing what Bowles Simpson suggested.
Cut military spending, reform entitlements, reform the tax code, bring some (SOME) additional revenue in and be done with it. The terd blossoms in DC (including the one in the WH) can’t seem to pull the trigger.
jm
August 25th, 2011
5:56 pm
Canadian liberals have more brains and guts than our domestic variety. When Canada got downgraded, they cut entitlements and held the line on spending for over a decade. AND THE LIBERALS DID THAT.
josef
August 25th, 2011
5:56 pm
jm
Not at all trying to be snarky, please understand. But you’ve “been to New Orleans several times.” So have a lot of other people wanting to call it a “lost cause.” Well, it’s home to me. It’s my heart and soul. You can’t just pick it up and relocate it..if you did, all that y’all tourists find so enchanting would be gone with the wind…
And, hey, the Dutch have done it…so can we…
Dusty
August 25th, 2011
5:57 pm
Well, I think Bookman ought to be put away for instigating a mob. He knows good and well the government is already rendering aid with preparations, ships going to sea, weather stations watching, and not one thing in government has been stopped. Besides that, Red Cross has already put in motion all of its aids (which is not government). But THE GOVERNMENT IS READY AND ABLE TO HANDLE IRENE AND NOBODY HAS STOPPED IT!!!
Cantor said quite properly, we should be prepared to cut other expenses when we make plans for covering emergencies. That is called PLANNING AHEAD.
All of you political bozos go jump in your car and head for Washington ’cause you think “the government is not going to help”. Maybe you will get on the Jerry Springer show and tell the world how the government aint doing a thing. Take Bookman with you. He knows how to make a show out of a legitimate concern for handling America’s expenses.
Joe Mama
August 25th, 2011
5:57 pm
Righty — “An example please.”
An example of Cantor’s constituents suffering so he can feel noble? How about an earthquake and a hurricane in the same week, and Cantor sticking to his ‘no disaster relief without offsets’ position?
“Do you know they haven’t?”
If you know that they have, then show me the proposal. Link, please?
“Joe I can’t ignore the utter stupidity of the above statement. Specifics please.”
Righty, it’s been all over the news AND both President Obama and Speaker Boehner have made public statements to that effect that. Are you for real? Do you really not follow the news?
“Unlike your above stateement I will be happy to provide quotes.”
Whether you can provide quotes or not won’t prove the antecedent claim.
md
August 25th, 2011
5:58 pm
“So now would be a responsible time to reform them by doing what Bowles Simpson suggested.”
Naw………..makes sense to someone to trash that and do it all over again…..probably with the same reault.
Paul
August 25th, 2011
5:58 pm
“Eric has consistently said that additional funds for federal disaster relief ought to be offset with spending cuts.”
As md noted, there’s a big difference between ‘will’ and ‘ought.’ Seems Rep Cantor (can I call him ‘Eric’ like his press secretary does?) is scrambling for some wiggle room.
Parsers of the world, unite!
See, parsing gives a clue how they try to wriggle out of their ideology when it suits them.
Jay – another confirmation of your earlier post regarding what the Republican Congregation for the Doctrine of the Party will let him do.
I hope RW-(the original) shows up. Right after the horrible tornadoes hit, I posted to the effect might as well get out of the way how some would argue against federal aid and I got hit by a ‘play the jerk card’ storm. Congrats, Jay – you did an entire thread on Cantor’s Jerk Card!
Eric’s ’s holding a losing hand. It’s going to be fun to watch how he calls for redealing -
Message from Matti
August 25th, 2011
5:58 pm
josef,
I’m glad my Granny was dead and gone, so she didn’t have to witness what happened to that city. It would have killed her.
Paul
August 25th, 2011
5:59 pm
“Jay – another confirmation of your earlier post regarding what the Republican Congregation for the Doctrine of the Party will let ROMNEY do.”
jm
August 25th, 2011
6:01 pm
josef 5:56 – I didn’t say put it on a truck and relocate it (insane)
I just think a prudent, intelligent, and apolitical analysis shows that some portions of the city should be abandoned. New higher levies would be built (at much less cost) around a much smaller area, preserving the Downtown and surrounding residential areas.
I don’t pretend to know NO incredibly well, but I do not that big chunks of the city have been semi-abandoned. Like Detroit, it needs to consolidate, but for an even more pressing reason than just infrastructure and management issues (like Detroit has). NO has that small levy problem.
Anyway, I hear you, NO is a fantastic city with lots of history and neither I nor anyone else in their right mind wants to see it disappear.
Gotta go. Been fun.
jm
August 25th, 2011
6:03 pm
josef – weird typo. Levee, not levy.
Still got the SAV Levy’s on my mind I guess.
Bosch
August 25th, 2011
6:04 pm
Admit it Jay my earlier posting as Cantor being King Weasel was the reason for this posting. And apparently you’ve been successful in proving my metaphor correct!
Paul
August 25th, 2011
6:05 pm
Yup, here’s Eric of the past:
“Congress will find the money and it WILL be offset”
speaking of the tornado disaster.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/05/30/eric-cantor-on-face-the-n_n_868700.html
Joe Mama
August 25th, 2011
6:05 pm
jm — “I just think a prudent, intelligent, and apolitical analysis shows that some portions of the city should be abandoned. New higher levies would be built (at much less cost) around a much smaller area, preserving the Downtown and surrounding residential areas.”
Various Dutch plans I have seen indicate that, depending on extent and scope, a comprehensive flood control system could be built for a capital investment of $10-$50 billion. That doesn’t cover ongoing maintenance.
For those of you who think ‘we don’t need no damfool europeeans to tell us what’s what, Google “Delta Works.” I think you’ll see that the Dutch are the go-to guys for this sort of thing. Oh, and they’re pretty smart with money, too. Dutch bankers are among the world’s best, and it was the Dutch who first lent money to a little start-up nation called the United States of America, long, long ago.
AmVet
August 25th, 2011
6:05 pm
I did not follow any of the previous Nawlins trash talk.
I’ve been a lot of places and that one is both special and unique to me. Visiting my grandparents on Toledano Street, as a child, was one fabulous memory.
You don’t dig it? That’s your biz.
But I suspect those folks don’t really give a damn what you think.
stands for decibels
August 25th, 2011
6:05 pm
There really are no words
(beyond those that would get me banned for at least a few days.)
Joe Mama
August 25th, 2011
6:06 pm
Bosch — don’t know if you saw this downstairs, but here it is again, for fun:
http://rolcats.com/page/2
Logical Dude
August 25th, 2011
6:06 pm
time for me to ride a bike really far again. Take care peeps!
(and if calling y’all “peeps” offends you, I’ll apologize now for the slang).
But I feel that each city, county, state in the path of the hurricane will request disaster relief as needed, and the federal government will grant it all.
Because that’s what we do. We pick up the downtrodden, we take care of each other after disasters, and we help each other.
(hey, quit laughing! We do!)
Just wish people wouldn’t politicize it. . .
So, until next time!
Bosch
August 25th, 2011
6:10 pm
Joe mama
Did you get to watch that Sylvester video?
Left wing management
August 25th, 2011
6:10 pm
Shouldn’t the course taken by the storm be determined by the wickedness of the inhabitants of a given place? I mean, I’m just going by the all-knowing pronouncements of some of our nation’s respected clergymen you know …
So let’s see, wild gay sex orgies in New York City …
Check …
pogo
August 25th, 2011
6:10 pm
The Low Road. You know the one, it is now well used by desperate liberals such as Jay whom are more and more willing to travel down it these days. As was said in the movie “Grease”, “How low can you go”? Judging from this piece, apparently pretty damned low.
Desperation is a terrible thing to witness and Jay you are obviously very, very desperate. Face up to it; nothing will turn the tide in favour next year of Obama and the excessive government spending he loves so much. Between now and then we will be lucky if there isn’t anarchy in the streets, much less this poser being re-elected. When the checks stop coming the government spending addicts in this country will revolt. Imagine it, fat old baby boomers out there demanding their checks and young people running around with no jobs and no future demanding that the government take care of them. Ron Paul is exactly right. The money has run out.
Bosch
August 25th, 2011
6:12 pm
And to those so critical of Jay “politicizing” this, after what we saw here after the oil spill, I hope you choke on those Hypocrisy Sandwiches!
Adam
August 25th, 2011
6:12 pm
Eric Cantor said “we will find the monies.” I am just SURE he means that for his district, he’ll apply the same rules he applied for Joplin, and insist on spending cuts to pay for it.
Who wants to lay bets that when it comes right down to it, they just spend money to help, and DON’T do spending cuts?
Joe Mama
August 25th, 2011
6:14 pm
Bosch — “Did you get to watch that Sylvester video?”
All streaming video blocked here. I’ll check it out later tonight.
Dusty
August 25th, 2011
6:18 pm
Well, I see that Bookman’s usual foil for political advantage worked again. He’s got the lib crowd nodding and chatting about the awful Cohen and the terrible ingrates who do not wish to spend money we don’t have and won’t help.. That while they watch all the government preparations on television.
I don’t see how Bookman sleeps at night. He could make your grandmother look like Killer Queen and most of you would say “That’s right. Thanks for telling us.” But then the sheep have to be herded in the right direction. In Bookman’s case, that is over the cliff.
Bosch
August 25th, 2011
6:18 pm
So in these grand plans of Mr. Cantor’s does the spending cuts come from the affected areas or just in general, say if he spends a million in his district on disaster relief they cut a million out of NPR’S budget?
Paul
August 25th, 2011
6:18 pm
Have I missed something?
In all the posts, have any of the usual suspects argued that disaster relief spending is not a function of the federal government?
Or that upcoming disaster relief spending MUST be offset by spending cuts?
I read upset over ‘politicizing’ the issue….. but has anyone addressed, clearly and directly, the above two salient points?
Adam
August 25th, 2011
6:21 pm
Page 1:
No mention of Obama or Bush
Page 2:
Anti-Obama posts = 5
Individual anti-Obama posters = 3
Anti-Bush posts = 2
Individual anti-Bush posters = 1
Fake posts meant to skew the results = 0
Page 3:
Anti-Obama posts = 1
Individual anti-Obama posters = 1
Anti-Bush posts = 1
Individual anti-Bush posters = 1
Fake posts meant to skew the results = 0
Totals:
Anti-Obama posts = 6
Individual anti-Obama posters = 3
Anti-Bush posts = 3
Individual anti-Bush posters = 1
Fake posts meant to skew the results = 0
Still tallying Page 4
josef
August 25th, 2011
6:22 pm
logical dude
“Because that’s what we do. We pick up the downtrodden, we take care of each other after disasters, and we help each other”
Tell that to the folks down around New Orleans…yeah, once the whole world stands aghast and Mexico sends the first help, and the locals are begging to let the Cuban doctors come help, not to mention ready to take what Venezuela is offering…
Other places in the good ole USA, maybe, but not so ready, willing and able for some of us…
And by that I mean the official response…the common folks across this great land of ours opened their hearts and doors and for that, we, and here I am one of “them,” are eternally grateful. But there are many, many still out there trying to find their way back home…
Paulo977
August 25th, 2011
6:22 pm
Midori
August 25th, 2011
4:21 pm
All good thoughts go out to them!
Left wing management
August 25th, 2011
6:24 pm
pogo: “When the checks stop coming the government spending addicts in this country will revolt. Imagine it, fat old baby boomers out there demanding their checks and young people running around with no jobs and no future demanding that the government take care of them. Ron Paul is exactly right. The money has run out.”
That was a great punch line, that last bit about the money running out. I laughed. Really.
josef
August 25th, 2011
6:25 pm
DUSTY
” He’s got the lib crowd nodding and chatting about the awful Cohen and the terrible ingrates who do not wish to spend money we don’t have and won’t help..”
Who’s Cohen? Oh well, Cohen, Shapiro, they all look alike…
Joe Mama
August 25th, 2011
6:27 pm
Paul — “Or that upcoming disaster relief spending MUST be offset by spending cuts?”
Yes. There’s some acceptance of that point on page 3. There’s also some after-the-fact justification for not spending on disaster recovery, e.g. ‘look at what a waste of money New Orleans was.’
Paul
August 25th, 2011
6:27 pm
So much for the Republican “faithful’ in defending Party Purity.
Unless it’s to attack their own candidates.
Normal
August 25th, 2011
6:27 pm
Jay is starting to change subjects like I change my BVD’s…this was probably more germain below, but it’s still an interesting rean and thought.
Breaking from Newsmax.com
Libyan Rebel Leader Reaches Out to Israel
A rebel spokesman who is a member of the new Libya’s emerging leadership is making a somewhat unexpected call for support from none other than the Jewish state of Israel.
“We are asking Israel to use its influence in the international community to end the tyrannical regime of [Moammar] Gadhafi and his family,” Haaretz quoted Ahmad Shabani as saying.
“Libya needs any help it can get from the international community, including from Israel,” said Shabani, the founder of Libya’s Democratic Party and the son of a former cabinet minister who served under Libya’s King Idris.
Shabani’s family fled Libya after the king was deposed in 1969, settling in London, where Ahmad was educated.
Contrary to Gadhafi’s claims that al-Qaida was working with the rebels, Shabani said al-Qaida activists, including Libyans as well as foreigners, have been working with Gadhafi. Israeli intelligence notes that weapons have been smuggled from Libya to the Gaza Strip since the Libyan uprising began.
The opposition hopes to end the smuggling, Shabani said
Paul
August 25th, 2011
6:28 pm
Joe Mama
So is it kind of like watching a worm wriggle on a hook?
GT
August 25th, 2011
6:31 pm
Maybe God is pushing their buttons. A little earthquake, some wind… I wonder if God looked at all that wasted money spent for Homeland Defense during the Bush administration. I wonder what else they have compromised that we don’t see because there is no storm heading that way. Seems to me the Republicans fear what never happens and have no fear for real things that do happen. I guess facts get in the way of real, in the fear of the dark the imagination can run wild with a little help from being illiterate mixed in.
Dusty
August 25th, 2011
6:32 pm
josef,
Are you blind? How many millions were spent trying to help New Orleans and how much of it was wasted by the locals and how much are we still spending on NO and how many NO residents came to Atlanta and others to the capitol of Louisiana and accepted by the locals?
Your crybaby whine is out of line with what really happened. Has there ever been a catastrophe that those affected thought they did not get enough help? I don’t think so. And the rediculous mention of Mexico? If anybody needs help, it is Mexico.
Please return to your reasonable state of mind. It makes more sense.
ragnar danneskjold
August 25th, 2011
6:33 pm
Good afternoon. My great idea: let’s rebuild the devastated northeast and strengthen the US economy at the same time: take all of the reconstruction money out of the EPA budget. In fact, let’s match that with monies from the SEC’s Sarbanes-Oxley enforcement funds, and some of the enforcement funding of the FDA. And maybe eliminate taxpayer guarantees for FNMA and FHLMC and FHA mortgages above $200,000. And diminish the departments of Agriculture and Labor and HUD and Education and Energy by comparable amounts. The economy would spring to life, once our government looked like that of Hong Kong.
Joe Mama
August 25th, 2011
6:34 pm
Paul — “So is it kind of like watching a worm wriggle on a hook?”
No, they seem quite indignant at the idea of deficit spending of any sort. Except where a war in Iraq is involved. And they don’t like spending money on things that weren’t planned and budgeted for. Except where a war in Iraq is involved.
One poster (I won’t name him but I don’t think you’ll have any trouble finding his posts) actually claimed that dike maintenance was a job for state and local authorities; he seems not to know that that’s totally the job of the Army Corps of Engineers.
Misinformed, married to his position and thick as a brick. Nope, it’s pretty much par for the course with that one fellow.
Dusty
August 25th, 2011
6:35 pm
Josef,
Cohen? Cantor? I bet you can even figure out whom I was writing about. You did notice that I got the name Bookman in the correct status, didn’t you? Just say “baaa”.
F. Sinkwich
August 25th, 2011
6:36 pm
“But there are many, many still out there trying to find their way back home…”
Are you talking about people trying to get back to New Orleans, josef?
If so, what’s stopping them?
Joe Mama
August 25th, 2011
6:37 pm
Ragnar — “and some of the enforcement funding of the FDA.”
Okay, that’ll be a Double E Coli Burger, some Listeria Fries and a brackish, unidentifiable liquid with light ice. Will that complete your order?
poison pen
August 25th, 2011
6:39 pm
Logical Dude
time for me to ride a bike really far again. Take care peeps!
(and if calling y’all “peeps” offends you, I’ll apologize now for the slang).
But I feel that each city, county, state in the path of the hurricane will request disaster relief as needed, and the federal government will grant it all.
Because that’s what we do. We pick up the downtrodden, we take care of each other after disasters, and we help each other.
(hey, quit laughing! We do!)
Just wish people wouldn’t politicize it. . .
So, until next time!
Logical dude, Thank you, your post is the only sane one on this entire blog, including Jay’s that’s why I cut & pasted it.
We not only always help out our neighbors but just about every other country. I doubt there is any other country in the World that is as giving as we are.
Both sides on here need to grow up.
Dusty
August 25th, 2011
6:40 pm
Paul
You didn’t get the salient points here? The point here is to smear a Republican. That’s all. Nobody seems worried about the storm. Just worried that some Republican (Cantor) said something about saving money and that is dirty talk. Should never mention such things. Just spend.
F. Sinkwich
August 25th, 2011
6:40 pm
“Okay, that’ll be a Double E Coli Burger, some Listeria Fries and a brackish, unidentifiable liquid with light ice.”
I believe providing such cuisine is against the law, Joe. What’s your point?
ragnar danneskjold
August 25th, 2011
6:43 pm
Dear Joe @ 6:37, you must buy a lot of elephant stampede insurance. You seemingly are willing for me to pay for it too.
josef
August 25th, 2011
6:46 pm
DUSTY
Get real, Sister Lou, I’m not beding yours and Doggone’s little whining snarky crybaby here…what you’re positing as your dearly beloved memos are one long way from the reality I dealt with on a daily basis during that time…sorry, but you’re being a partisan jackassess here.
And just how little you know, the first aid to arrive in the Katrina zone was the ships of the Mexican Navy…
And you snarky ass, I made a special point of saying how grateful we are for all of the open hearts and open doors of our fellow citizens across this great land of ours…go back and read it…
Sorry, Dumbolina. but I know too well what “not enough help” means.Katrina was a catastrophe the likes of which this nation has seldom seen and no small part of that catastrophe was the total failure of the governmental bodies from the City Hall of NOLA to 1600 Pennsylvania…failure…plenty of guilt to go around…so get off your party line high horse for a minute…
THE TRUTH
August 25th, 2011
6:46 pm
The sky is falling—-the sky is falling—- the sky is falling.
Sounds just like Jay.
What was that chickens name, nah, it wasn’t Jay, or was it?
Joe Mama
August 25th, 2011
6:47 pm
F Sinkiewicz — “I believe providing such cuisine is against the law, Joe. What’s your point?”
Cut enforcement funding for outfits like the FDA (and the USDA, which would have a role in this, too), as another poster suggested, and who’s going to do anything about it?
Having laws is all well and good, but what good are those laws if they’re not enforced?
Dusty
August 25th, 2011
6:47 pm
Ragnar,
I feel your desperation. So many here cannot see that spending money you do not have does not work. I can’t figure it out. Just spend spend spend like tomorrow will never come. Amazing!!
josef
August 25th, 2011
6:49 pm
I quoted what you said on Cohen…that was all…if I need clarification/correction, do so… call it my own knee-jerking…
Doggone/GA
August 25th, 2011
6:49 pm
“not beding yours and Doggone’s little whining snarky crybaby here”
How the hell did I get into this? I haven’t even addressed anything to you
Joe Mama
August 25th, 2011
6:49 pm
Ragnar — “you must buy a lot of elephant stampede insurance.”
Why? Are you an elephant stampede insurance sales agent? Do I look like a prospect to you?
“You seemingly are willing for me to pay for it too.”
I am willing for you to buy whatever amount of elephant stampede insurance you feel is appropriate for your life and property, yes.
Joe Mama
August 25th, 2011
6:51 pm
Okay, She Who Must Be Obeyed is calling. Be well, be safe and be sure your loved ones in the path of the storm are okay.
I’m out.
Just Another Anonymous One
August 25th, 2011
6:51 pm
Okay, that’ll be a Double E Coli Burger, some Listeria Fries and a brackish, unidentifiable liquid with light ice. Will that complete your order?
Would you like to double size that order. It’s a free upgrade if you purchase the tort reform triple whammy peanut butter shake.