Immigration bill does less than backers, foes claim

“We’re looking for every tool we can to address this problem,” state Rep. Matt Ramsey, R-Peachtree City, said this week in an interview. “And we know that the number-one tool is cutting off access to jobs” that draw illegal immigrants to Georgia.

Ramsey was the chief sponsor of HB 87, the controversial new immigration law signed last week by Gov. Nathan Deal. The bill has been described by Ramsey and other advocates as an effort to crack down both on employers who hire illegal workers and on the workers themselves. Its critics, on the other hand, compare it to a highly controversial law in Arizona, which among other things allows law-enforcement officers to detain and check the immigration status of anyone subject to a “lawful stop.”

Both claims are overblown.

Although federal courts may come to a different conclusion, the new Georgia law strikes me as considerably less dangerous to civil liberties than the law in Arizona, parts of which have been suspended by federal courts. Under HB 87, police officers can check immigration status only when an officer “has probable cause to believe that a suspect has committed a criminal violation.” While that provision still has the potential to be abused, it reduces the fear that innocent people will be detained for suspicion of walking or driving while Hispanic.

However, Ramsey’s claim that the new law strikes hard at the core problem — the willingness of businesses to hire illegal labor — also strikes me as exaggerated.

The new law does require that businesses sign an affidavit that they have registered to use the federal E-verify system to check the status of newly hired employees. Without such an affidavit, businesses will not be able to register with government to do business.

However, the bill contains no provision for auditing businesses to ensure that they keep that pledge. According to Ramsey, legislators chose not to allow such enforcement audits out of fear of they would infringe on federal authority and thus be ruled unconstitutional. That’s dubious — the new Arizona law, for example, contains some pretty strong enforcement language, and those provisions have not been challenged.

But Georgia legislators showed no such restraint in targeting employees for criminal sanction. For example, the law prescribes a prison term of up to 15 years for using a phony ID to get a job. Refuting criticism that such a penalty is excessive showboating, Ramsey pointed out that current law already contains a penalty of up to 10 years for use of false identification. The law merely adds five years to the crime when such ID is used to obtain a job.

However, if an existing penalty of 10 years hasn’t discouraged illegal job-seekers, adding five years to the sentence isn’t going to change anyone’s calculation in the slightest. Like other aspects of the law, it is an effort to reap political credit for a tough approach without really changing a thing.

The bill also creates a commission to study a possible state-run “guest worker” program. The plan would conceivably be modeled after a plan adopted in Utah, which gives illegal immigrants state-issued documents to allow them to work in Utah agriculture.

The problems with such an approach are manifest. First, it’s unconstitutional, as Ramsey concedes. Second, the demand for such a provision from south Georgia employers demonstrates that despite public denials, they understand quite well how much they rely on illegal immigrant labor.

Most important, it reflects the deep cynicism and hypocrisy that permeates this debate. It suggests that it would be OK to overlook the illegal status of immigrants as long as they are confined to back-breaking labor in the fields, but not if they aspire to anything more. It would amount to an amnesty-light, with employers reaping all the benefits but the workers reaping almost none.

– Jay Bookman

323 comments Add your comment

USinUK

May 20th, 2011
7:12 am

HAPPY DAY BEFORE THE RAPTURE, YA’LL!!

Today’s the day to indulge in cake, bacon and the tipple of your choice!

USinUK

May 20th, 2011
7:14 am

“The new law does require that businesses sign an affidavit that they have registered to use the federal E-verify system to check the status of newly hired employees. Without such an affidavit, businesses will not be able to register with government to do business.

However, the bill contains no provision for auditing businesses to ensure that they keep that pledge.”

and THAT is where the sanctions should lie.

if the jobs go away, so will the majority of illegal immigrants.

Granny Godzilla

May 20th, 2011
7:15 am

Mick

May 20th, 2011
7:27 am

usinuk

Well, happy b-day over yonder. If you ever get to miami I’ll have to treat to my homemade key lime pie and a spot of tea but sorry – no squidleys!!

stands for decibels

May 20th, 2011
7:29 am

if an existing penalty of 10 years hasn’t discouraged illegal job-seekers, adding five years to the sentence isn’t going to change anyone’s calculation in the slightest.

yebbut it feeeeeels good.

USinUK

May 20th, 2011
7:30 am

dB – … nobbut … it makes for a gooooood soundbyte “tough on immigration” and all that

:roll:

USinUK

May 20th, 2011
7:32 am

Mick – ohmysweetjeebus … key lime piiiiiiiiieeeeeeeeeeeeeeee ….

(wiping up the drool on my keyboard)

of course, I’m also buzzing from one of these:

http://redskitchendiaries.wordpress.com/2011/03/14/guinness-chocolate-cupcakes/

Dave R.

May 20th, 2011
7:33 am

Happy Anniversary of your 39th birthday, USinUK!

I’ll be carrying around a cake with me all day, in case we’re hit with Armageddon later on. This way I’ll have some with me when we meet in the afterlife. :D

Of course, that assumes we’ll both end up in the same place . . . ;)

stands for decibels

May 20th, 2011
7:33 am

Wait a second… I needed coffee, didn’t see this:

First, it’s unconstitutional, as Ramsey concedes

really, Jay? There’s on-the-record acknowledgement by the bill’s chief sponsor, that part of the bill now signed into law is unconstitutional? When did he come to this realization, before or after Deal signed it?

kayaker 71

May 20th, 2011
7:34 am

Granny,

These people are not refugees….. they are illegal felons, breaking our laws. If they don’t want to perform “back breaking labor in the fields’, possibly they should stay in Mexico.

stands for decibels

May 20th, 2011
7:34 am

nobbut … it makes for a gooooood soundbyte “tough on immigration” and all that

remember, conservatives are Logical. Liberals are all about feelings.

(I hear this a lot so it must be true.)

USinUK

May 20th, 2011
7:35 am

dB – “There’s on-the-record acknowledgement by the bill’s chief sponsor, that part of the bill now signed into law is unconstitutional?”

:lol:

that reminds me of when Mike Bowers was AG in GA (but so desperately wanted to be GOV) – he came out swinging against Zell Miller and Tom Murphy for a non-existent “slush fund” saying that “while there’s no law against it, it’s still illegal”

nothing like political expediency and pretzel logic!

Dave R.

May 20th, 2011
7:38 am

“The bill also creates a commission to study a possible state-run “guest worker” program. The plan would conceivably be modeled after a plan adopted in Utah, which gives illegal immigrants state-issued documents to allow them to work in Utah agriculture.

The problems with such an approach are manifest. First, it’s unconstitutional, as Ramsey concedes.”

I think you have a bit of a problem with Jay’s wordsmithing, stands.

The commission proposed by Ramsey is not unconstitutional. The approach that Utah took via a similar commission is considered unconstitutional by Ramsey. (and me)

poison pen

May 20th, 2011
7:39 am

Jay, exactly what should an ILLEHAL, aspire to, they are illegal, if they want to aspire to something they should get in line for legal status, just like thousnads of other people wanting to come to this country that don’t live on our border.

Man this Horse has 1,000 lives.

Granny Godzilla

May 20th, 2011
7:39 am

kayaker 71

May 20th, 2011
7:34 am
Granny,

These people are not refugees….. they are illegal felons, breaking our laws. If they don’t want to perform “back breaking labor in the fields’, possibly they should stay in Mexico.

I just don’t agree with you on this.

They’d rather do the hard work than starve.

USinUK

May 20th, 2011
7:40 am

Dave – (from downstairs) – i hear ya on the preventative tests – especially for that grotty stuff you have to drink before a colonoscopy – GAH! worse than the actual test, itself – at least for that you get a sedative! (although sedative + nuking your bowels would probably be a bad combo)

USinUK

May 20th, 2011
7:40 am

poisson – fwiw – I’m with ya 100%

scary, isn’t it.

Joe The Plumber too.

May 20th, 2011
7:41 am

yawn………………

USinUK

May 20th, 2011
7:43 am

GG – better than having a CAT scan and finding a real cat! :-)

TaxPayer

May 20th, 2011
7:43 am

Jay,

Did you expect anything less from our good old boys. And what would be the point of having an agricultural industry or poultry industry here in Georgia if it is not profitable enough and a good high quality peonage system goes a long way to take care of that especially if it has law enforcement backing.

Granny Godzilla

May 20th, 2011
7:44 am

USinUK

Just had my first “scope”.

Not as bad as I thought AND the Doctor found the spare TV remote…..

Dave R.

May 20th, 2011
7:46 am

btw, the cool thing about all this time travel / time stamp posting thing on Jay’s blog?

If Armageddon does hit later today, we’ll still have posts showing up long after we’ve been taken. :D

Dave R.

May 20th, 2011
7:48 am

OK, Granny.

Waaaayyyyy too much information on a Friday morning before breakfast! :lol:

Peadawg

May 20th, 2011
7:48 am

Just like the supporters of Obamacare said….this bill is a start but certainly not perfect.

stands for decibels

May 20th, 2011
7:51 am

Speaking of illegal immigration, what are we going to do about the threat of illegal immigrant Muslims using the revenue from selling pee-sicles to Jewish kids to fund international jihad? huh?

when are you going to write about that BOOKMAN???

Dave R.

May 20th, 2011
7:52 am

stands, my 7:48 to Granny also applies to you. . .

stands for decibels

May 20th, 2011
7:54 am

Dave, yeah, it is a bit much this early in the morning.

ty webb

May 20th, 2011
7:56 am

“First, it’s unconstitutional, as Ramsey concedes.”

Jay,
What kind of shepard are you?…Seems your sheep were led astray with that one. I don’t know if that was intentional or not, but in the future, please keep it simple. For those that don’t think reading is fundamental, he’s writing about the plan in Utah.

DebbieDoRight

May 20th, 2011
7:57 am

HAPPY DAY BEFORE THE RAPTURE, YA’LL!!

Thanks girl!! Be there or be square!!!

Dave R.

May 20th, 2011
7:58 am

I’ll bet if this does turn out to be the last day on earth, the Mayans will be pi$$ed! ;)

Paulo977

May 20th, 2011
7:58 am

Granny
“God Bless and protect refugees everywhere” Indeed ……..We are such darn hypocrites . Say one thing and promptly do the opposite !!!

stands for decibels

May 20th, 2011
7:59 am

Just like the supporters of Obamacare said

well that didn’t take long.

Dave R.

May 20th, 2011
7:59 am

Later, folks.

Gotta go make me some money.

deegee

May 20th, 2011
8:01 am

Most of the people that support HB87 have no idea of the intricacies of immigration law. It is true that presenting a false ID to obtain work has always been punishable by law as it constitutes employment fraud. Employers will continue to maintain a “catch me if you can” attitude. The intent of HB87 is to scare the beejeezus out of illegal immigrants so that they will go elsewhere. It’s working. Any gringo that wants a job cutting grass and throwing pine straw can start today.

Doggone/GA

May 20th, 2011
8:01 am

“well that didn’t take long”

Come on…the whole quote is “Just like the supporters of Obamacare said….this bill is a start but certainly not perfect” and we DID and DO say that about the healthcare bill.

kayaker 71

May 20th, 2011
8:04 am

Granny,

There are starving people all over the world that would like to come to this country but we have a process for them to become citizens….. it’s called get in line and apply for citizenship legally. Also the jail sentences proposed for these felons, whether 10 or 15 years is nonsense. At an average cost of 40K/prisoner/yr, it would be cheaper to deport them. It’s the gift that keeps on giving and all for a box of peaches or a head of lettuce that costs a dollar less. These “poor, unfortunate” felons are breaking our laws and threatening our security, not to mention the cost to keep them in prison. These “refugees” make up nearly 1/3 of the prison population in this country, estimated in 2008 to be nearly 270K, 108K of them being in CA. Ever wonder why CA’s budget is in the tank? Criminal street gangs, in CA and elsewhere, are responsible for most of the violent crime in the US, mostly composed of illegal felons. The MS-13 gang is by far the worst. And these “poor refugees” are just trying to “escape poverty” in Central America. What a bunch of nonsense.

DebbieDoRight

May 20th, 2011
8:04 am

Jay, exactly what should an ILLEHAL, aspire to, they are illegal, if they want to aspire to something they should get in line for legal status, just like thousnads of other people wanting to come to this country that don’t live on our border.

If they apply for the legal status, with the thousands of others, how long does that take? Also, does the bill address the fact that if picked up by police, for running a red light, could the illegals prove that they had applied OR were on their way to apply but had gotten momentarily sidetracked because they were cutting your grass?

ty webb

May 20th, 2011
8:05 am

“The bill also creates a commission to study a possible state-run “guest worker” program.’

and shouldn’t my leftist friends be ecstatic…I do know how you guys always enjoy the formation of a commission. Now we just need an illegal immigration czar.

poison pen

May 20th, 2011
8:06 am

USinUK

May 20th, 2011
7:40 am
poisson – fwiw – I’m with ya 100%

scary, isn’t it.

Are you the real USinUK???

stands for decibels

May 20th, 2011
8:08 am

DGA @ 8.01, you know, you’re right.

Peadawg, the snark was uncalled for. My bad.

poison pen

May 20th, 2011
8:09 am

DebbieDoRight

May 20th, 2011
8:04 am
Jay, exactly what should an ILLEHAL, aspire to, they are illegal, if they want to aspire to something they should get in line for legal status, just like thousnads of other people wanting to come to this country that don’t live on our border.

If they apply for the legal status, with the thousands of others, how long does that take? Also, does the bill address the fact that if picked up by police, for running a red light, could the illegals prove that they had applied OR were on their way to apply but had gotten momentarily sidetracked because they were cutting your grass?

Debbie, I would like to think that you are smarter then this moronic answer. I cut my own grass, and ignorant people like you still don’t understand what illegal means, you must have missed this in the 4th grade, if you made it that far.

DebbieDoRight

May 20th, 2011
8:11 am

Now we just need an illegal immigration czar.

We can target Bristol. Her mom had vast international experience (she could see Russia from her house); she has a silly name, (not as silly as DeMarcus or DeOne but still silly); AND she, Bristol, was on Dancing With The Stars. You can’t beat those credentials you betcha!

stands for decibels

May 20th, 2011
8:12 am

These “refugees” make up nearly 1/3 of the prison population in this country, estimated in 2008 to be nearly 270K

lessee… per Wiki, “According to the U.S. Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS) 7,225,800 people at yearend 2009 were on probation, in jail or prison, or on parole — about 3.1% of adults in the U.S. resident population.[7][4] 2,292,133 were incarcerated in U.S. prisons and jails at yearend 2009.”

That 270K figure–wherever it came from–isn’t “1/3″ of 2,292,133.

And last I checked, if anything, undocumented immigrants are actually less likely to commit crime than legal residents. So I don’t buy your “security” argument at all.

poison pen

May 20th, 2011
8:13 am

deegee

May 20th, 2011
8:01 am
Most of the people that support HB87 have no idea of the intricacies of immigration law. It is true that presenting a false ID to obtain work has always been punishable by law as it constitutes employment fraud. Employers will continue to maintain a “catch me if you can” attitude. The intent of HB87 is to scare the beejeezus out of illegal immigrants so that they will go elsewhere. It’s working. Any gringo that wants a job cutting grass and throwing pine straw can start today.

DeeGee, funny, but I don’t see any adds in the AJC or any paper for grass cutters or BS throwers.

DebbieDoRight

May 20th, 2011
8:14 am

pp: Debbie, I would like to think that you are smarter then this moronic answer. I cut my own grass, and ignorant people like you still don’t understand what illegal means, you must have missed this in the 4th grade, if you made it that far.

Ooooh peepee, you are really in a snit this morning huh? Try some fiber with your breakfast, it’ll help that “bloated but not going” feeling. BTW lighten up a bit………..in less than 48 hours we’ll all be gone!!

Gale

May 20th, 2011
8:14 am

I am really hoping the RAPTURE folks all get taken to their reward tomorrow. It will allow the sanity level in the world to jump up a few notches.

On topic, our immigration laws need to be streamlined and enforced. We need to make a visa for people to work here legally, but keep iron clad track of them so they must leave when the visa expires. Those who want to stay and become citizens need an easier track.

Finn McCool

May 20th, 2011
8:15 am

39? A wee young to be posting on blogs. Do your parents know you’re on the computer?

St Simons - we're on Island time

May 20th, 2011
8:15 am

“…but not if they aspire to anything more. It would amount to an amnesty-light, with employers reaping all the benefits but the workers reaping almost none.”

what has my proud, formerly progressive (for the South) Georgia become? The only thing the Ga Republics need is some banjo music playin in the background.

poison pen

May 20th, 2011
8:16 am

Deb, In a snit, cute answer when your caught with the panties down.

Normal

May 20th, 2011
8:16 am

What if they held a Rapture and nobody made the cut?

:shock:

Finn McCool

May 20th, 2011
8:16 am

the bill contains no provision for auditing businesses to ensure that they keep that pledge.

There in lies the problem – you conservatives keep voting in people who “say” they are going to solve problems but they WON’T solve the problems.

DebbieDoRight

May 20th, 2011
8:18 am

Deb, In a snit, cute answer when your caught with the panties down.

They’re down again??!! That’s what I get for wearing granny panties with a sundress!! Excuse me while I go and pull these off, better to wear nothing then be caught with my granny panties down…………. :roll:

ty webb

May 20th, 2011
8:20 am

“And last I checked, if anything, undocumented immigrants are actually less likely to commit crime than legal residents”

shouldn’t that say less likely to “…commit additional crime…”?

Emmanuel Hall

May 20th, 2011
8:21 am

These state sponsored “anti-immigration” bills have nothing to do with anything other than a right wing attempt to keep as many people from becoming citizens who they know are unlikely to vote for them. I have no doubt that if our borders were being breached by people from Finland, this political hypocrisy would not exsist. This ugliness we now see in America by these right wing, Republican and tea party nuts will soon end; because evil and lies may appear eternal, but history reveals that their fate is always the same, death.

stands for decibels

May 20th, 2011
8:22 am

shouldn’t that say less likely to “…commit additional crime…”?

Well, if it makes you feeeel good.

see also:

http://www.ocregister.com/news/crime-59244-study-immigrants.html

Finn McCool

May 20th, 2011
8:22 am

I vote for the rapture. Let’s clear out he nutters.

misty fyed

May 20th, 2011
8:23 am

Obama makes a moronic foreign policy speach yesterday hanging our allies out to dry in favor of a terrorist run organization, and you choose to talk about an immigration bill with no teeth?

Granny Godzilla

May 20th, 2011
8:23 am

kayaker 71

i am not in the least surprised by your attitude, and i accept that you will always see the dark side of this issue.

you is what you is….

misty fyed

May 20th, 2011
8:24 am

Hahah…Finn, I’ll gladly be counted a nutter if that happens… Unfortunately, if it does and it’s all true…Life for you suddenly will get a little tense in the next few years.

Keep Up the Good Fight!

May 20th, 2011
8:24 am

Ramsey pointed out that current law already contains a penalty of up to 10 years for use of false identification. The law merely adds five years to the crime when such ID is used to obtain a job.
However, if an existing penalty of 10 years hasn’t discouraged illegal job-seekers, adding five years to the sentence isn’t going to change anyone’s calculation in the slightest.

Just another example of a “liberal feel good” (confirming Stands “learning) law that is “tough” on soundbites but just more lipstick on the pig. And if they dont start behaving, we’ll raise the term to 30 years from 15. That will show them we mean bizness. [snark]

DebbieDoRight

May 20th, 2011
8:26 am

Normal: What if they held a Rapture and nobody made the cut?

:lol: Don’t worry, why some of our fine upstanding conservatives like Ted Haggerty, ummm Abramahoff, ummmm Mark Foley, ummmm Newt Gingrich….. oh forget it! Maybe you’re right…..

poison pen

May 20th, 2011
8:26 am

Emmanuel Hall

May 20th, 2011
8:21 am
These state sponsored “anti-immigration” bills have nothing to do with anything other than a right wing attempt to keep as many people from becoming citizens who they know are unlikely to vote for them. I have no doubt that if our borders were being breached by people from Finland, this political hypocrisy would not exsist. This ugliness we now see in America by these right wing, Republican and tea party nuts will soon end; because evil and lies may appear eternal, but history reveals that their fate is always the same, death.

Emmanuel,
The bill is designed to try and keep ILLEHAL people from coming into our country, in case you haven’t noticed we are going broke. I guess people on Welfare just don’t care as long as they are getting their dole.

Finn McCool

May 20th, 2011
8:27 am

Life for you suddenly will get a little tense in the next few years.

If you’re right, it’ll just get a bit hot. I can live with that.

Granny Godzilla

May 20th, 2011
8:27 am

misty

ain’t it funny – the President presented challenges to both the Israelis and the Pakistanis in his speech – and based on ones own ideology it’s attacked by both sides.

that should be your first clue it was well done.

stands for decibels

May 20th, 2011
8:27 am

And if they dont start behaving, we’ll raise the term to 30 years from 15.

There’s always double-secret probation as well.

gotta produce. Later, all.

Keep Up the Good Fight!

May 20th, 2011
8:28 am

And in case the world does end tomorrow, I’ll be at the heavenly bar laughing at the “conservatives” who will be feeling the heat.

Oh wait…I’m going to be born again to a higher existence. Perhaps instead of progressive independent, I can become a elitist intellectual.

JKL2

May 20th, 2011
8:28 am

granny- God Bless and protect refugees everywhere…..

As long as obama is dropping bombs everywhere, we should have a never ending supply. Just don’t pray for them as that would be a clear violation of “seperation of church and state” not to mention the fact it would just incite the muslims to perform more acts of violence against us.

buck@gon

May 20th, 2011
8:28 am

It suggests that it would be OK to overlook the illegal status of immigrants as long as they are confined to “back-breaking labor in the fields,” but not if they aspire to anything more. It would amount to an amnesty-light, with employers reaping all the benefits but the workers reaping almost none.

Jay,

Imagine how awful, corrupt and incompetent the electorate and government in Mexico is that the government can not encourage its citizens to even supply jobs for, as you say, “back-breaking labor in the fields” that Mexicans should be flooding our country illegally to find it.

I would suggest that the Mexican government with all its problems, many admittedly and exclusively Mexican–some uniquely Latino also, still resembles more the Obama administration and liberal administrations in general than conservative ones. After all, Mexico’s version of energy policy is much like Obama’s view of healthcare–the government has taken to running things.

What a disaster!

Finn McCool

May 20th, 2011
8:28 am

Until you start auditing and fining businesses big bucks, the illegals are here to stay.

Doggone/GA

May 20th, 2011
8:28 am

“shouldn’t that say less likely to “…commit additional crime…”?”

Illegal immigration is illegal, it is not criminal

kayaker 71

May 20th, 2011
8:28 am

STD,

These are Justice Dept Figures on Incarcerated Aliens, March 6, 2007. Source…. Newsmax.com. If the actual prison population is close to 2M, there must be a lot more illegals in prison than this source states. About 1 in 142 people who reside in the US are in prison. Illegals make up 17% of the population in this country but are only 3% of the actual population. That would make the actual illegal prison population at closer to 340K. Source, Justice Dept Statistics, 2008. No matter whether they are 270 or 340K, they represent a drain on resources and pose a danger to the US population. That’s where the security part comes in. The loss of life, criminal drug traffic, violent homicide that these people commit….. we would all be more secure if it were not present. Is that so hard to comprehend?

Paul

May 20th, 2011
8:29 am

“The new law does require that businesses sign an affidavit that they have registered to use the federal E-verify system to check the status of newly hired employees.”

Apparently, it doesn’t say anything about actually using it.

Parsing, anyone?

Morning, USinUK

“HAPPY DAY BEFORE THE RAPTURE, YA’LL!!”

I just reread that…. Thought it said “rupture.” Can I cancel my appointment with my doctor?

BTW – Jay’s forwarded my email to you for our Londonfest. So be sure to check your spam folder before deleting anything. After all, it is coming from ajc dot com –

kayaker 71

“they are illegal felons, breaking our laws.”

They’re not felons, at least not by any statutory definition. It’s a civil offense, not criminal.

poison pen

May 20th, 2011
8:29 am

Granny, really! putting terrorists closer to your borders is well done. Please tell me this is April 1st.

Granny Godzilla

May 20th, 2011
8:29 am

Ah the rapture…..I’ll miss Scout….

St Simons - we're on Island time

May 20th, 2011
8:31 am

the cons screech “follow the monnney” until it leads to their pocket

Granny Godzilla

May 20th, 2011
8:32 am

poison pen

huh? did President Obama rent u-hauls for terrorists?

missed that part of the speech

Finn McCool

May 20th, 2011
8:32 am

the government can not encourage its citizens to even supply jobs

LOL, another business skool grad? Someone else who thinks guvmint suppleis jobs or helps create jobs.

Jobs aren’t “supplied”, demand for products and services is what creates jobs.

buck@gon

May 20th, 2011
8:32 am

Keep up @ just now,

True intellectual elites and the ajc are mutually exclusive, even discouraged in fear of embarassing Ms. Tucker’s lofty status. The kind that we have around here is a tap-dancing bunch full of bluster and show–mostly NOTHING TO SEE HERE, FOLKS! I wouldn’t want to be reborn as Jay Bookman or the man about whom he has a personal and desirous fetish, Paul Krugman.

Better to be someone who knows the truth, like Socrates, even if they force the hemlock on you.

Paul

May 20th, 2011
8:34 am

Mornin’, Granny

“Ah the rapture…..I’ll miss Scout….”

I’m concerned for him. After all, he’s a Marine and they don’t go higher than a helicopter flies. Unless it’s on a USAF transport. Either way, they’re enclosed.

What if he doesn’t like heights? What if he gets airsick?

And just where do all those people go when they’re up in the air? Do they just hang there looking down at us? Do they go above 10,000 feet? If so, what about supplemental oxygen? If it’s a spiritual thing, do their bodies drop back down? What if they hurt someone? Are they accountable, or does God give credit for accidents? And what about women wearing dresses? That could be a problem, couldn’t it?

Theology should wait until after breakfast.

ty webb

May 20th, 2011
8:34 am

Doggone,
entering the country illegally is a crime.

Granny Godzilla

May 20th, 2011
8:34 am

Paul

Excellent Points.

And what about NORAD?

We don’t want to move to DefCon 4 just because of floaters…..

Finn McCool

May 20th, 2011
8:35 am

felons? for standing on the corner in Marietta? For wanting to work? For wanting to feed your family?

What, pray tell, do you call a child molester or a serial killer?

Mighty Righty

May 20th, 2011
8:36 am

I agree with Jay this one time. I do think the state of Georgia should invest in bill board and TV advertising to extol the benefits offered illegal invaders by the state of Maryland. As I understand it, Maryland is offering in state tuition to the invaders. The theme could be something along the lines of “stay in Georgia, go to jail, move to Maryland and get a free education.” Maryland would be ideal for them. A liberal governor, convenient to Washington D.C. where they could camp out on the Elipse and the National Mall. No way Obama would do anything to spoil their stay. Heck, they could stop at Pro Bass Shops to get their camping gear. Pro Bass is right on the way. Get a driver license in North Carolina. Looks like a win, win to me.

kayaker 71

May 20th, 2011
8:36 am

Bookman,

Have you set a date yet for your debate with Boortz? I want to buy a ticket for that one.

Paul

May 20th, 2011
8:40 am

kayaker 71

Jay posted updates as he emailed and called and couldn’t get an answer.

Apparently, Boortz is a coward.

But if Boortz does grow a spine and find his integrity, I too would want to watch. People who are used to flipping off a caller’s switch can have a difficult time in a face to face when asked for a direct response.

DebbieDoRight

May 20th, 2011
8:40 am

KUTF: Oh wait…I’m going to be born again to a higher existence. Perhaps instead of progressive independent, I can become a elitist intellectual

peepee is going to come back as a virgin……….oh wait!!!

JKL2

May 20th, 2011
8:41 am

I like how this has gone from “Deal will be too embarrassed to sign it in public” to “I can’t believe he signed it” to now “it’s no big deal”. At least the state is doing something as opposed to the Demwit plan of “do nothing, because we have no problems”.

Finn McCool

May 20th, 2011
8:41 am

You can drive like a maniac on I85 but don’t stand on the corner in Marietta – you’ll be a felon!

That’s conservative brain trusts at work. That’s why we have conservatives in Georgia government who put a law in place and then don’t audit companies to make sure it’s being enforced.

Scott

May 20th, 2011
8:43 am

You know who else does less than his supporters claim…Obama. Thanks moron for putting this clown in office. Thanks for treating the 2008 election like a giant popularity contest.

AmVet

May 20th, 2011
8:43 am

Good morning, all.

Everybody is acting much too civilly this morning. Where is (fill in your favotie troll here)?

Paul, theology before breakfast, huh?

OK.

So what’s up with this angry god? Always looking to extract vengeance and lay waste to people? The Big Guy needs to chill. After all he’s the one who made this mess, why isn’t he mad at himself???

Oh well, I guess it’s like in the military – one guy messes up and everybody pays…

Now I lay me down to sleep
I’m praying Lord my soul to keep
If I die before I wake
Somebody make a big mistake

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BsAbJMgP8mQ

Peadawg

May 20th, 2011
8:44 am

“Where is (fill in your favotie troll here)?” – Finn and Granny are both here.

Finn McCool

May 20th, 2011
8:44 am

People who are used to flipping off a caller’s switch

That happens like 99% of the time, doesn’t it? LOL. Boortz is a blowhard. My father in law was President of a trucking company that retained the law firm Boortz worked for last. He cost the company over $100,000 when he failed to file papers on time to a court in Tenessee. He had to find something else to earn a living at.

Scott

May 20th, 2011
8:45 am

AmVet…”Where is (fill in your favotie troll here)?” You answered my question when you posted.

Paul

May 20th, 2011
8:46 am

AmVet

Personally, I think it’s another example of people screwing up then diverting blame by pointing Upstairs and saying “He’s gonna get you for that!”

jm

May 20th, 2011
8:46 am

The bill is either (A) whitewash or (B) a step in the “right” direction in terms of enforcing some laws, improvements to be made down the road.

I don’t know which, and I don’t know that I care immensely.

Finn McCool

May 20th, 2011
8:48 am

Good article on American manufacturing…and why Paul Ryan is the wrong man for his job.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/20/opinion/20krugman.html?_r=1&hp

Mighty Righty

May 20th, 2011
8:49 am

Does anyone know the exact time the world comes to an end. I want to be dressed and groomed when it happens. Also, I feel really bad for Atheists. They have nothing going for them. Thats the bad news. The good news is it’s not too late to change.

Good little liberal

May 20th, 2011
8:50 am

Obama says that America wants to put the Tel Aviv Airport within targeting distance of Iranian supplied shoulder fired missiles, supplied to the Palestinians. And this is after a couple of months of his pushing for the takeover of Northern African countries by the Muslim Brotherhood.

Obama is becoming more and more dangerous. This isn’t about wiretaps and waterboarding. This is about giving complete lunatics the ability to destroy our allies in Israel and in Europe.

So let’s talk about the Immigration bill.

We will be lucky to survive the next two years.

Scott

May 20th, 2011
8:51 am

finn…i don’t even need to look at your link to know that it is a bunch of bull. The second i see “nytimes” and “Krugman” in the address we all know is it nothing more than trash.

jm

May 20th, 2011
8:51 am

Finn McCool- Krugman (despite decorative medals of one sort or another) is a complete and utter partisan hack. The guy has no credibility as a serious economist. Intelligent? Yes. Utterly biased which compromises anything he says? Yes.