Atlanta school board gets the message … right?

By signing Senate Bill 79, Gov. Nathan Deal has given himself authority to suspend school board members in any district that has lost or is in serious danger of losing its accreditation.

Say, for example, a certain embattled school board in a certain capital city with a certain investigation underway involving alleged cheating by teachers and administrators?

Yup, that very one.

Deal says he hopes never to have to use that authority, and there’s no reason to doubt his sincerity. Stripping duly elected public officials of the power given them by voters ought to be a last resort, and as a rule, governors don’t like to get involved in school board politics. For those and other reasons, the legislation is a purely symbolic statement of state concern about the way the Atlanta School Board has conducted itself.

But if necessary, it could become something more. The new law, if approved by the U.S. Justice Department, would also allow Deal to appoint temporary board members to carry out the duties of those who were suspended.

Certainly, the legislation was a better option than the other idea being kicked around at the Capitol, which was to hand control of Atlanta schools to Mayor Kasim Reed. Conditions in the district are not dire enough to justify such a drastic step, and Reed, for all his ability, has enough on his plate running the city and serving as the state’s ombudsman to the Obama administration in Washington.

In fact, the mayor might have thought twice about the wisdom of extending his mandate to education after witnessing the career arc of Adrian Fenty, the young, reform-minded mayor of Washington. Elected in 2006, Fenty demanded and soon got the power to run the troubled D.C. school system, but the backlash eventually cost him re-election and perhaps a once-promising political career.

To take the parallel a step farther, the reformist reputations of Fenty and the chancellor he appointed, Michelle Rhee, have recently been called into question by evidence of widespread cheating by teachers and administrators on standardized tests in the D.C. district. Like Beverly Hall, her counterpart in Atlanta, Rhee relied heavily on those tests both as a tool in operating the system and in demonstrating progress to a skeptical public.

“Her theory seemed to be that if she pushed incentives and sanctions hard enough, the scores would rise,” education expert Diane Ravich wrote. “Her theory was right, the scores did rise, but they didn’t represent genuine learning. She incentivized desperate behavior in principals and teachers trying to save their jobs and meet their targets and comply with their boss’ demands.”

Does that seems oddly familiar?

In the end, the outcome of Atlanta’s as-yet unresolved cheating scandal and the hiring of a new superintendent this summer will have a much larger impact on the education of its students than the passing dysfunctions of its school board. In fact, the board’s reluctance to supervise Hall and to force an honest investigation into cheating allegations represented a much more important failure than its backbiting and bickering.

With the school year coming to a close, it would be nice to be able to close the books on that failure and look forward. The threatened loss of accreditation and the bill signed by the governor ought to suffice to keep the board focused. The imminent departure of Hall and the selection of a replacement offer still more opportunity to look ahead.

Unfortunately, the uncompleted state investigation — a probe that was launched last August, eight months ago now — makes that impossible. That probe was begun by the governor’s office, and its report is overdue. Investigators have suggested that criminal charges are possible, and building such cases can take time. But at this point, with educations at stake, pursuing charges is less critical than identifying the problems quickly and fixing them.

– Jay Bookman

304 comments Add your comment

Call it like it is

April 22nd, 2011
7:52 am

Have a blessed Friday one and all, and have a Great Easter…..This blog now turned back over to Jay.

Normal

April 22nd, 2011
8:03 am

Peadawg

April 22nd, 2011
8:15 am

Not much to say on this blog…this is a good thing and hopefully it’ll send a message to the ASB.

Everyone have a Happy Easter!

stands for decibels

April 22nd, 2011
8:16 am

the uncompleted state investigation — a probe that was launched last August, eight months ago now

does this august body happen to have an online resource where one might track their progress, Jay?

MiltonMan

April 22nd, 2011
8:18 am

Just remember Jay, the party that you have such a man-crush towards has been in charge of Dekalb schools, Clayton schools & APS schools – basically all failures. I extend an invitation to you to visit North Fulton schools which are within the much hated Republican controlled areas.

Question Man

April 22nd, 2011
8:23 am

Does the law allow Board members to be replaced if the system “is in serious danger of losing its accreditation?” Didn’t most press reports say the law applied only after accreditation was lost?

Write Your Board Members

April 22nd, 2011
8:23 am

Actually Milton Man, though school board elections are non-partisan in DeKalb, for the last two years the majority of members are/were Republican. (Womack, McChesney, Speaks and Bowen. Redovian was and he was replaced by Jester who is) So, afraid you can’t blame the democrats for the holy mess that DeKalb County Schools are.

williebkind

April 22nd, 2011
8:23 am

If we would only dump more money into the school systems our children will learn more! We have hundreds of examples how government programs work so efficiently. Of course we have to blame the parents too! Did anyone see the proselytizing for a cleaner mother earth in the first grade class. It was a song and dance!

Mr_B

April 22nd, 2011
8:23 am

Jay: As long as we rely on standardized testing to determine wheter or not our children have been “educated,” villanize teachers who can’t work miracles, and demand “accountability” without providing support and resources, such scandals will continue. Now, I must go corrupt the kiddies………..

Mr_B

April 22nd, 2011
8:24 am

Sorry: “whether”

Jay

April 22nd, 2011
8:24 am

First, MiltonMan, school board races are nonpartisan.

Furthermore I could take you to rural areas of the state dominated by Republicans where the test scores are just as bad as those in APS and in many cases worse.

The socio-economic status of the student body, not the political leaning of the school board, is the most accurate predictor of test scores. That is true in every state and every country and every era.

deegee

April 22nd, 2011
8:24 am

It is intellectually dishonest to assign political affiliation to the success or failure of a school district. The economic basis of the population and the active participation of parents determine the success or failure of a school.

The Rock

April 22nd, 2011
8:27 am

No, they did not get the message because they still have some Principals in place that are being protected.

stands for decibels

April 22nd, 2011
8:39 am

I extend an invitation to you to visit North Fulton schools

See Cession.
See Cession run.
Run, Cession, run!

AmVet

April 22nd, 2011
8:42 am

Good morning, Bookmaniacs.

Obviously, poor performing school systems are rampant throughout the nation. And as JB notes, it has virtually nothing to do with Dem. vs. Rep majorities.

The rural Midwest has been historically known for it’s academic excellence.

While the rural South has been know for the exact opposite.

Both are primarily “red” areas.

Likewise, the northeast corridor has typically done very well, while inner cities have done very poorly. Yet, both are primarily “blue”.

For the hyper-partisan, willfully clueless Milties out there…

http://tinyurl.com/3nw7k7e

Donald Walker

April 22nd, 2011
8:43 am

This bill concerns me as a candidate who came in second place to the city of Atlanta school board chair, Khaatim El in the last election. (hum- what a difference it would have made it parents would get out to vote). Nevertheless my concern is that this bill removes the validity of the electoral process which is protected by the constitution. The citizens of the state of Georgia should be very weary of constitution infringements simply because a process is broken. I think a better approach would be to implement term limits for school board officials and lesgislate a process where voters can remove school board officials from office- not the official who happens to hold the power of the governor or president. This is a very dangerous precedent!

Paul

April 22nd, 2011
8:44 am

Another example of how Republican politicians decry imposition of authority from on high, yet when they get in office they want that power to themselves (federal is to state as state is to local government entity).

“would also allow Deal to appoint temporary board members to carry out the duties of those who were suspended”

Does this mean that if Deal’s pick also fails, that Deal failed in his judgment and responsibilities and so will resign?

There might be a silver lining in there yet, Jay -

Obuma

April 22nd, 2011
8:45 am

The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure. It is a sign that the U.S. Government can’t pay its own bills. It is a sign that we now depend on ongoing financial assistance from foreign countries to finance our Government’s reckless fiscal policies…

Increasing America’s debt weakens us domestically and internationally. Leadership means that “the buck stops here.” Instead, Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and grandchildren. America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership. Americans deserve better.”

- Sen. Barack Obama (D-IL), March 20, 2006

carlosgvv

April 22nd, 2011
8:46 am

The cheating scandal report is actually long overdue. I’m guessing it’s conclusions will give a whole new meaning to the term “politically incorrect”. For that reason, I suspect certain powers that be are holding up the release of this report as long as possible. Maybe they hope that it they just ignore it, we will forget and it will just go away.

willie lynch

April 22nd, 2011
8:46 am

deegee

April 22nd, 2011
8:24 am

You are right, critical thinking is a necessary component to drawing acurate conclusions. In my observation, many blogger posts in this forum verify this is a lost art.

APS needs help, hopefully this bill will send a signal to all the school districts. Georgia is still ranked at the bottom nationally in education last time I checked and since it is and has been a red state, the blame, if one wishes to be so petty, could be placed more acurately in that.

poison pen

April 22nd, 2011
8:57 am

Obuma, I have stated on here many times, please don’t confuse Liberals with facts, if you want to lie it’s ok.

Doggone/GA

April 22nd, 2011
9:00 am

“Another example of how Republican politicians decry imposition of authority from on high, yet when they get in office they want that power to themselves (federal is to state as state is to local government entity).”

Paul – if you want an interesting insight into that mindset…check out Michigan and the bill they just past that give the Governor authority to REPLACE a city’s elected officials with an appointed fiscal manager. And on how it’s being used.

RC

April 22nd, 2011
9:00 am

Nonpartisan elections or otherwise, metro or rural, the VOTERS are electing these characters to their school boards. How is anyone going to fix that?

Bosch

April 22nd, 2011
9:01 am

“Does this mean that if Deal’s pick also fails, that Deal failed in his judgment and responsibilities and so will resign?”

Paul,

While Gov. Deal hasn’t really done anything in particular to warrant my distaste for him as Governor yet, I really hate having a Governor with the last name “Deal.” In politics, it just doesn’t sit well and as illustrated in such posts as yours above, it causes too many double takes — especially considering the topic.

Happy Good Friday blog peeps.

AmVet

April 22nd, 2011
9:06 am

Pen, as I recall you providing virtually none of those said facts in nay of your posts, you’re in the clear!

Carry on…

Paul

April 22nd, 2011
9:09 am

Obuma

“The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure.”

I believe this early on we are here to debate regarding the Atlanta School Board and Governor Deal.

Local community colleges may have courses in “follows directions and plays well with others.”

:-)

Morning, Doggone/GA

I see a Google search in my future. Thanks!

But nothing beats our Republican Gov Perry. Decried the stimulus, then took billions to balance the state budget.

Attacks the feds, then gets upset when they tell him education dollars have to be spent on…. education.

Talks about self reliance and how we don’t need Washington, then experiences wildfires and asks the feds to declare an emergency so he can get federal dollars.

Golly gee, what do you call a guy like that?

Hi Bosch

Worn out from all that dancing in the moonlight?

Keep Up the Good Fight!

April 22nd, 2011
9:11 am

poison pen
April 22nd, 2011
8:57 am
… please don’t confuse Liberals with facts, if you want to lie it’s ok.
___________________________

Conservatives and republicans lie on this blog? Shocker! Well at least the part where you now acknowledge it.

AmVet – loved the link!

Wish I had an easy answer to the school issue. Seems to me the more that the politicians try to apply short term fixes and “measurements” the more they screw it up and blame the teachers.

Mary Elizabeth

April 22nd, 2011
9:12 am

“She (Rhee) incentivized desperate behavior in principals and teachers trying to save their jobs and meet their targets and comply with their boss’ demands.”

——————————————————————-

This is why standardized test scores should not be tied to teachers’ salaries or dismissal. More harm comes of that than good. And more should be weighed in that process than test scores.

However, test scores should be used as one tool for ascertaining the precise instructional levels of students. It would be foolhardy to ask doctors to avoid MRIs or CAT scans when diagnosing and prescribing remedies. Likewise, teachers (and parents) must know where each child is functioning. Only by knowing that can they can effectively adjust instruction to individual need. Testing should not be dominant in the classroom, but it should be valued as an instrument of diagnostic insight.

The Anti-Gnostic

April 22nd, 2011
9:13 am

“The socio-economic status of the student body, not the political leaning of the school board, is the most accurate predictor of test scores. That is true in every state and every country and every era.”
______________________

I’ll go you one further: the IQ of the student is the most accurate predictor of test scores “in every state and every country and every era.” So we can end much of the debate, the elections, the public administration, the quest for the magic education elixir, the witch hunts when the achievement gap persists, right there.

Test students for g intelligence and practical aptitude, group them accordingly, and set the modest goal of raising IQ half a standard deviation instead of spending billions pretending everybody can be Einstein. One other thing: schooling for half or more of all youngsters should be over by age 16.

Bosch

April 22nd, 2011
9:15 am

Hi Paul! How can you tell? Blogging while lying in bed, who’d of thunk such a thing 15 years ago?

Keep Up the Good Fight!

April 22nd, 2011
9:16 am

Paul – to help you out on Michigan absurdity mentioned by Doggone and the Republican dictatorship (truly taxation without reporesentation).

The good news: a recall effort against the MI gov has been started and I bet this one does not need imported petition gatherers buying women drinks in exchange for signatures.

stands for decibels

April 22nd, 2011
9:17 am

This is why standardized test scores should not be tied to teachers’ salaries or dismissal.

I’m inclined to agree—as a parent, I’m already pretty horrified at how much time is pissed away spent on CRCT prep and the actual testing itself. That you would be providing incentives for relatively low-paid professionals to goose their numbers for personal gain seems extra-wrong.

However, I do have to ask—if we are to incentivize improved scholastic outcomes, what kind of metric do you use? Thoughts?

stands for decibels

April 22nd, 2011
9:18 am

oy. the strikeys, they struck.

one mo’ time, sans lame joke:

Mary, I’m inclined to agree—as a parent, I’m already pretty horrified at how much time is spent on CRCT prep and the actual testing itself. That you would be providing incentives for relatively low-paid professionals to goose their numbers for personal gain seems extra-wrong.

However, I do have to ask—if we are to incentivize improved scholastic outcomes, what kind of metric do you use? Thoughts?

Bosch

April 22nd, 2011
9:18 am

IQ is so like 1950s intelligence measures have come a, ong way baby since then.

Paul

April 22nd, 2011
9:20 am

Anti-Agnostic

“the IQ of the student is the most accurate predictor of test scores “in every state and every country and every era.”

Citation?

We’ve a family friend – was a department chair at one of the Calif state universities – who did one of his doctoral dissertations on IQ tests. Offhandedly referred to them as ‘a lie from beginning to end. They are more a reflection of the manner in which the child is being taught (than a predictor of future performance).

So if you have some professional journal-type articles, I’m interested.

The

April 22nd, 2011
9:21 am

to end up poor can be the result of misfortune, but to stay poor is a choice.

Paul

April 22nd, 2011
9:21 am

Keep up

Thanks much. Was going to take me a while to search for it. Just following this conversation while trying to get some work out is challenge enough -

stands for decibels

April 22nd, 2011
9:24 am

veering off topic, but…

Good Fight @ 9.16, having spent some time in and near near St. Jo’s/Benton Harbor, that story really hit home for me. That some thieving SOBs would use financial hardship combined with a vile, labor-hating Governor’s mad lust for power to steal a beachfront park from poor people ought to outrage just about anyone with a sense of justice, and kudos to Rachel for bringing this small scale, easily overlooked story to light.

joe

April 22nd, 2011
9:25 am

Hey Jay, didn’t get to comment on your last blog, but here’s another example of you bashing the GOP for “defending tax cheats” when the Dems do the exact same thing….case in point. General Electric. GE basically bought the election for Obama by dispatching NBC to his beck and call every waking hour of every day during the election…and in turn, the Obama administration allows GE to rake in millions upon millions of profits without paying one darn nickle in taxes…so while I agree to an extend that the GOP should be scolded for defending tax cheats, you need to do the same for the other side of the aisle when stuff like GE happens.

On a side note, if we had the fair tax, we wouldn’t be talking about these issues as everyone would pay their fair share and 47% of the people who don’t pay anything now…would. Why people like you cannot support the fair tax, I’ll never know.

Bosch

April 22nd, 2011
9:26 am

stands,

Back in the day while I was in graduate school, I worked with some folks who were piloting some new test measures that were able to (in my opinion) better reflect the students intelligence by the way they learned things. From there, they developed lessons for students accordingly. Pretty neat stuff. I just knew this was going to be the wave of future testing, but then NCLB came along and pretty much stopped that crazy talk all together.

If you have never ever heard of him, one person I’d recommend reading up on is a Harvard guy named Howard Gardner. Interesting way of looking at intelligence.

Paul

April 22nd, 2011
9:27 am

The

Your spouse and kids all present with the same symptoms of a rare genetic disorder. You health insurance taps out and you’re on the hook for hundreds of thousands of dollars of medical costs. You burn thru your retirement savings and mortgage the equity in your house. Then you lose your job. Your area has a high unemployment rate and you’ve no cash to move, as your credit cards are maxed out. (If you declare bankruptcy you’re liable for those bills).

Pick any scenario you want, but this morning you woke up with no job, no savings, no nothing. Not your fault, no choice you made. It just is.

So, The, care to walk us thru the steps you’ll take to survive, then become prosperous?

Southern Comfort (aka The Man)

April 22nd, 2011
9:28 am

I extend an invitation to you to visit North Fulton schools

See Cession.
See Cession run.
Run, Cession, run!

So much laughter… So little time…
:lol:

Doggone

I was going to bring up the Michigan law. I love how the GOP aka conservatives are for small government unless it’s allowing them to intrude into the business of others. That’s not big government though, when one person can go back and erase the votes that citizens have cast for people to represent them in government.

What we need instead is a law that could hold elected officials criminally negligible for complete screw-ups that endanger other parts of government operations. Start giving pols hard time behind cinder blocks, and we should see better behavior from them all.

stands for decibels

April 22nd, 2011
9:29 am

to stay poor is a choice

thanks, Neal. Don’t you have a radio audience to swindle right about now, though?

Good little liberal

April 22nd, 2011
9:30 am

“What we need instead is a law that could hold elected officials criminally negligible for complete screw-ups that endanger other parts of government operations. Start giving pols hard time behind cinder blocks, and we should see better behavior from them all.

Obama would look good in orange.

stands for decibels

April 22nd, 2011
9:32 am

Start giving pols hard time behind cinder blocks, and we should see better behavior from them all.

how about they stand in front of cinder blocks, for a few short seconds, instead?

I mean we have the punishment available to us, why not use it where it’ll actually do some good instead of on small time hoods? a boy can dream…

The Anti-Gnostic

April 22nd, 2011
9:32 am

Paul – it does not surprise me that a professional educator comes up with a thesis that supports the education bureaucracy’s mission of pounding square pegs into round holes. Some kids are dumb, some kids are smart. The best teacher in the best school with the best resources will bring them up about half a standard deviation–that’s it. That’s why Westminsters, Marist, Pace Academy, et al. don’t spend millions hiring Ph.D.’s away from university: because the student already tested smart and they know the teacher is not going to add much. IQ testing is sound, which is why the military still has its ASVAB.

The failure to acknowledge this reality insures that the debate will be perennial. No amount of reform is going to turn dumb kids into smart kids. The achievement gap is a fact of life that the educrats, like the old Soviet party bosses, insist somebody (saboteurs, teachers, parents, etc.) must be to blame for.

1811/1801 - 0311/0317

April 22nd, 2011
9:33 am

Teachr’s pet !

Mary Elizabeth

April 22nd, 2011
9:34 am

Stands for decibels @ 9:18

Answer: Teacher training of how to use diagnostic results effectively. The best teachers want to see their students advance. That is the only incentive they need. They are professionals. Students want to learn (until they feel like failures). The best incentive is simply success. Growth must be measured and understood with complexity and insight. Some can advance more than others. All can advance. Having scores on computers, systemwide, would be state of the art in fostering precise instruction. Following student advancement over years – instead of simply over months – would enable more success. Remember the art of teaching is the dynamic between the student and the teacher – not the test scores. It is the nurturing that matters. Test results are only a tool for nurturing with wisdom.

I don’t care to dominate this discussion anymore, today. Hope the above helps.

Remember Good Friday and what it means. Good day.

1811/1801 - 0311/0317

April 22nd, 2011
9:34 am

Excuse me: “teacher’s”

Southern Comfort (aka The Man)

April 22nd, 2011
9:34 am

Obama would look good in orange.

And public caning for instigating and/or spreading partisaned bs…

dB

LOL!!!!!

Paul

April 22nd, 2011
9:34 am

Anti-Agnostic

Two paragraphs?

All I asked was if you had any professional research citations to support your opinion.

The

My underlying point was, if being poor is a choice, then so is being prosperous. So what choices does a poor person make to become prosperous?

stands for decibels

April 22nd, 2011
9:35 am

Bosch @ 9.26, I’m vaguely aware of his theories of multiple intelligences… I’ll bookmark a ref or two for future use, thanks.

Left wing management

April 22nd, 2011
9:36 am

Speaking of partisanship, it’s funny to observe the confusion here among the usual suspects. They don’t know quite what to do with an issue where, at the moment, bipartisanship seems to reign.

By the way, how’s this for bipartisanship?

It’s seems even Chris Christie is happy to call Obama an ally in the education area. (So does that mean Christie is a Kenyan Marxist, too?)

Chris Christie Says Obama Is ‘Great Ally’ On Education Reform

New Jersey Republican Governor Chris Christie on Wednesday declared himself an ally of President Obama and his administration on education issues

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/04/20/christie-obama-education-reform_n_851789.html

Rightwing Troll

April 22nd, 2011
9:38 am

I don’t even know what to say about this:

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=ec0_1303444048

Why do these melees, that seem to keep popping up on youtube or where ever, always seem to involve black girls?

What this video is, is a sad commentary on the state of our society, white and black. At least 4 guys and one manager stood by while two black girls beat a white girl until she had a seizure, I couldn’t tell but I think the videographer was white. At the end as the girl laid there and convulsed, the videographer or one of his friends warned the attackers the cops were coming and calmly helped one of them find her phone.

Obama doesn’t need to be in orange, but these two Hoochymammas and every person in that video needs to be…

AmVet

April 22nd, 2011
9:39 am

I’m sure it has changed somewhat, but as for the ASVAB, when I took it in 1972, I scored in the 99th percentile.

It took about an eight grade level of mastery to score well on it.

i.e., a joke…

Rightwing Troll

April 22nd, 2011
9:40 am

LWM,
He’ll be called a RINO and excommunicated… and possibly be tarred and feathered…

@@

April 22nd, 2011
9:44 am

As a resident of Clayton County, I can only say this law was too long in coming. Perdue intervened here in Clayton but only after the damage had been done. It will take years to recover.

Our system went to school uniforms, something that parents fought for years. While a little thing, it’s been entertaining to watch our high school students adapt over time. At first, upon leaving the school grounds, the boys shirts would come off revealing a wife beater. The polo would then be tied to their heads, the pants would drop below their butts. With time, they don’t bother anymore. They leave as they arrive.

When I drive by a group of young men I’m tempted to say “Lookin’ spiffy, guys!” but they’d probably rebel so I refrain.

Peadawg

April 22nd, 2011
9:44 am

Rightwing Troll

I can’t believe what I just watched. Sad doesn’t even begin to describe it….

The Anti-Gnostic

April 22nd, 2011
9:44 am

Paul – I would suggest Jensen’s The g Factor, Seligman’s A Question Of Intelligence, and Murray and Hernstein’s The Bell Curve. All are available from Amazon.

Bosch

April 22nd, 2011
9:45 am

stands,

Like I wrote, my knowledge of him and his theories are pretty old, and I’m sure more have been done or disproved, but anyway, in my opinion, part of the problem with education is that we value or devalue a students ability to learn. Even students with “learning disabilities” can learn, it’s just finding the best alternative way of getting that information to stick in their head.

And as Anti-Gnostic reminds us — we have been programmed to think of kids as “smart” or “dumb” based simply on a couple tests that measure a students ability very little. I’m sure that @@ would agree that even kids who have been labeled as “special” or whatever are simply kids who learn different and can be taught and succeed.

In other words, intelligence and who is smart and dumb is all relative, just as who is successful is all relative. Part of the problem is that as a society, we have to re-evaluate how we think of intelligence, as as such, how we value it.

Ex APS Employee

April 22nd, 2011
9:46 am

What is truly amazing is how Beverly Hall has just slipped out of the guilty limelight and all of the focus is now on the board of education for not supervising all of her criminal activity. How is it that she is still around trying to clean up as much of her dirty work before she officially leaves behind piles and piles of mess.

She did this same exact thing in New Jersey and I hope she gets criminal charges when it is all said and done so no other school district has to sink to the lowest common denominator due to her criminal mode of operation with all of her cohorts. She is truly a successful well paid white collar criminal and she needs to be stopped dead in her tracks.

Anyone who has done what she has done to the Atlanta Public Schools and has the ability to show up at televised board meetings and operate with her business as usual presentation and with no remorse is scary.

catlady

April 22nd, 2011
9:47 am

I hope those men looking into the cheating scandal aren’t billing by the hour! They could have birthed a baby during this amount of time! And how about the GBI?

getalife

April 22nd, 2011
9:47 am

The gop assault on education and teachers is because the gop get the low or no education vote by a very large margin.

@@

April 22nd, 2011
9:47 am

Oops! Forgot to comment on this part:

The socio-economic status of the student body, not the political leaning of the school board, is the most accurate predictor of test scores.

And I’ve never bought into that. I’ve known poor people who took full advantage of the educational opportunity afforded them. Intelligent entrepreneurs, they.

The Anti-Gnostic

April 22nd, 2011
9:48 am

AmVet – the ASVAB is designed to establish an IQ cutoff of around 90. Below that, no amount of teaching is going to get people adept at maps and compasses or maintenance protocols.

@@

April 22nd, 2011
9:49 am

Bosch @ 9:45:

Absolutely!

Rightwing Troll

April 22nd, 2011
9:49 am

Pea,
For all we know the girl that got beat down could’ve started it. But it went so far beyond over the top, and for all those able bodied males to stand around and laugh, well that’s pathetic and it kinda makes me want to go beat them down…

When I was a teen, we’d gather around in a circle and watch the fight, but it never involved more than one v. one, may the best combatant prevail, and at a certain point folks would step in to stop it if the beating seemed too severe…

Good little liberal

April 22nd, 2011
9:51 am

Southern Comfort (aka The Man)

“And public caning for instigating and/or spreading partisaned bs…”

Being jailed for speaking out against the president. Sounds like you libs have the perfect solution for everyone.

Paul

April 22nd, 2011
9:51 am

Anti Agnostic

The first one I looked at said it wasn’t about IQ. He was making a case for //general// ability. In fact, the first reviewer said the author took issue with IQ tests.

Not playing with words, but they do have meaning.

If your position is “give kids an IQ test and that tells what they can become and no amount of education will change it much ” that’s one thing. If it’s ‘people have abilities that cover a range and do better in some areas than others” that’s another.

So I’m not really sure what your point is.

Me, I think people have lots of abilities, different from each other, strengths in some areas, weaknesses in others, and many can be enhanced by innovative teaching methods.

Out for a while -

USMC

April 22nd, 2011
9:53 am

The Atlanta Public Schools have a long way to go, but at least people are starting to wake up, shed light on the system as a whole, and start addressing the problems.

Did anyone else see the heinous HATE crime caught on film? Unbelievable:
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=ec0_1303444048

Peadawg

April 22nd, 2011
9:54 am

“For all we know the girl that got beat down could’ve started it. But it went so far beyond over the top, and for all those able bodied males to stand around and laugh, well that’s pathetic and it kinda makes me want to go beat them down…”

Exactly what I thinking. The white girl may have started it by talking trash or something but she didn’t deserve to be beating into a seizure while everybody stood and watched. Times like this and also with animal cruelty I wish eye-for-an-eye was the law.

Good little liberal

April 22nd, 2011
9:54 am

getalife:

“The gop assault on education and teachers is because the gop get the low or no education vote by a very large margin.”

So the GOP gets the Atlanta Ghetto vote? When did that happen?

getalife

April 22nd, 2011
9:56 am

lil con,

“So the GOP gets the Atlanta Ghetto vote? When did that happen?”

Racist much.

The Anti-Gnostic

April 22nd, 2011
9:56 am

“In other words, intelligence and who is smart and dumb is all relative, just as who is successful is all relative.”
______________________

I suppose it’s relative. I don’t know how to score a bag of crack without getting caught by the cops. So relative to the West Side, I’m pretty dumb. OTOH, I’m smart enough to know that scoring a bag of crack is ultimately a poor use of my time and money. So maybe I’m pretty smart.

But this is a specious argument and you know it. You wouldn’t pick a surgeon or a civil engineer who hadn’t passed objective tests in science and math, for example.

And in the end, your argument for relative intelligence actually fits hand in glove with my thesis: students should be grouped by their relative abilities. IQ tests are a cheap, quick way to do that but if you don’t like them fine. Do away with them and have the parents and teachers figure it out. Just don’t spend billions of dollars year in and year out on the fool’s quest of trying to make everybody a college-bound prodigy.

Left wing management

April 22nd, 2011
9:56 am

I wonder if there’s a single example nation-wide of a school system under direct mayoral control and is truly successful. If I’m not mistaken, the list of examples of mayor-run school systems with dismal results is long:

Cleveland
New York
Chicago
D.C.
Boston
Albuquerque

Am I missing any?

Rightwing Troll

April 22nd, 2011
9:56 am

Left wing management

April 22nd, 2011
9:58 am

So the GOP gets the Atlanta Ghetto vote? When did that happen?

Is WOW back from the dead?

Good little liberal

April 22nd, 2011
9:59 am

getalife

Is it racist to point out that the democrats have warehoused a large part of the Black population and given them the worst education in the state?

Sounds like anyone voting for Democrats would be the racist.

UGA1999

April 22nd, 2011
9:59 am

Getalife….The gop assault on education and teachers is because the gop get the low or no education vote by a very large margin.

REALLY?? Care to prove that….

Keep Up the Good Fight!

April 22nd, 2011
9:59 am

eye-for-an-eye — Isn’t that old school bible? What happened to turn the other cheek? More pick and choose the verse to follow? ;)

Good little liberal

April 22nd, 2011
10:02 am

Left wing management

The only way to fix what the Democrats have done to the low income Black demographic is to stop ignoring it.

stands for decibels

April 22nd, 2011
10:02 am

the heinous HATE crime

ok, jeez, that’s two now…what winger site’s hyping this? Is it Hattie Matty Drudge?

getalife

April 22nd, 2011
10:02 am

lil con,

Did you drop out of high school?

ug,

Google it.

Bosch

April 22nd, 2011
10:03 am

“Me, I think people have lots of abilities, different from each other, strengths in some areas, weaknesses in others, and many can be enhanced by innovative teaching methods.”

Paul, exactly.

@@,

I will expand on that thought a little — I know several kids who are either autistic, or “learning disabled” which is a term I really don’t believe in — but in my opinion, I feel that they are sometimes actually smarter than many other kids. They have to work harder to learn based on the tools available. They have to work harder, and in most cases succeed in doing so with tools that doesn’t fit with their styles of learning. In other words, they actually figure out how to put the square peg in a round hole, which to me, indicates higher intelligence on their part.

In the case of autism, I think that that is an evolutionary phenomenon we are seeing where the kids actually use MORE of their brains to process their surroundings and the environment and our ways of communication just haven’t caught up to them — a case of evolution happening faster than it’s surroundings.

carlosgvv

April 22nd, 2011
10:03 am

The Anti-Gnostic

Your IQ observation is absolutely correct. It is also absolutely politically incorrect and will earn you the ire of every bleeding-heart liberal who posts here.

stands for decibels

April 22nd, 2011
10:04 am

I see the Oppressed White Posse is in da hizzie.

Good little liberal

April 22nd, 2011
10:05 am

getalife

Top of my class and now a Master’s degree. How about you?

Bosch

April 22nd, 2011
10:05 am

@@,

Also, I get aggravated when anyone considers autistic kids or “learning disabled” kids as having something WRONG with them.

The Anti-Gnostic

April 22nd, 2011
10:06 am

“And I’ve never bought into that. I’ve known poor people who took full advantage of the educational opportunity afforded them. Intelligent entrepreneurs, they.”
____________________

@@: If the problem is socio-economic, then government can point to it as justification for its billions of dollars in transfer payments and social engineering. OTHO, if it just comes down to the individual, then all those administrators with Ph.D.’s in Finger Painting, all the unionized public sector workers, the elected school boards, etc., are a huge malinvestment which will eventually be liquidated once the private sector decides they can no longer afford it. We will see more homeschooling and more private tutors and more internet courses.

getalife

April 22nd, 2011
10:07 am

Low education voters are easily led to believe gop lies.

Hence, the attack on education.

RW-(the original)

April 22nd, 2011
10:07 am

The ASVAB started being used by the Air Force in 1973 with the other branches to follow over the next few years.

Oh well, so much for standardized testing trivia,

A Good Friday to you all.

/drive by

UGA1999

April 22nd, 2011
10:07 am

Getalife…..I did..http://www.stat.columbia.edu/~gelman/research/published/chance_on_2008.pdf

Word of advise before you make a quote on a blog….better make sure you can back it up. Welcome to the party of dumb!

BTW….MBA from UGA…..you?

Left wing management

April 22nd, 2011
10:08 am

GLL: “The only way to fix what the Democrats have done to the low income Black demographic is to stop ignoring it.”

Do I hear lurking behind this question the ridiculous conservative fable that the Democratic party is somehow responsible for racial segregation in this country?

Southern Comfort (aka The Man)

April 22nd, 2011
10:08 am

Being jailed for speaking out against the president. Sounds like you libs have the perfect solution for everyone.

Says the poster with the moniker “Good little liberal”. You’re more of a lib by using that name that I’ll probably ever be, but keep smoking your pipe anyway. Public caning has nothing to do with being jailed. You have all the right in the world to speak out against the president. However, just spewing partisaned bs should net you a caning. Do you have proof that Obama would end up in an orange jumpsuit, or is it just your conservative wet dream? Will that proof stand up in a court of law? If not, you could POSSIBLY be accused of spreading partisaned bs.

I’m not conservative or liberal, I’m just calling it as I see it.

getalife

April 22nd, 2011
10:08 am

lil con,

You have a master in bs.

getalife

April 22nd, 2011
10:09 am

ug.

Word of advice.

Learn how to post a link.

UGA1999

April 22nd, 2011
10:09 am

Getalife….ONCE AGAIN YOU CANNOT DISPUTE THE FACTS OF THE EDUCATION NONSENSE THAT YOU POSTED…..GREAT JOB DEMON!

Good little liberal

April 22nd, 2011
10:09 am

getalife

You keep trying but you keep striking out.

UGA1999

April 22nd, 2011
10:10 am

hahaha these libs just make it TOO easy.

MiltonMan

April 22nd, 2011
10:11 am

Good to see AmWay on board with his typical juvenile name calling mode.