In Japan, a grisly consequence of radiation

Boy, hadn’t thought about this aspect of the tragedy in Japan … from the Japan Times:

Radiation is preventing the retrieval of hundreds of bodies from inside the 20-km evacuation zone around the Fukushima No. 1 nuclear power plant, police sources said Thursday.

Based on initial reports after the March 11 catastrophe, the number of bodies is estimated at between a few hundred and 1,000, one of the sources said, adding that high radiation is now hampering full-scale searches.

That view was supported by the Sunday find of high radiation levels on a body found in Okuma, Fukushima Prefecture, 5 km from the plant.

The rescuers are now in a bind. Even if they retrieve the bodies, anyone who comes into contact with them risks being irradiated, too, whether they’re in the evacuation zone or not.

And if the bodies are cremated, the smoke could spread radioactive materials as well, the sources said. Even burial poses a problem. When the bodies decompose, they might contaminate the soil with radioactive materials.

Other news looks equally grim:

(The International Atomic Energy Agency) said Wednesday in Geneva it detected about 2 million becquerels of radioactive substances per sq. meter, or double the threshold at which the IAEA itself would order an evacuation, in soil samples from the village of Iitate about 40 km northwest of the nuclear power plant.

With the data, the IAEA effectively urged Japan to expand the current no-go zone of 20 km around the plant. Residents in areas 20 km to 30 km of the plant have been advised to stay indoors.

Chief Cabinet Secretary Yukio Edano only said the government may consider expanding the mandatory evacuation zone if the higher levels of radiation continue…..

The Nuclear and Industrial Safety Agency said Thursday the level of radioactive iodine-131 in seawater near the plant was 4,385 times the maximum tolerable amount, the highest reading since the crisis began March 11.

Other highly radioactive materials were also detected, including cesium-134 at 783.7 times the maximum amount permitted, and cesium-137 at 527.4 times the legal limit.

The half-life of cesium-137, or the time its radioactivity dissipates by half, is 30 years compared with eight days for iodine-131 and two years for cesium-134.”

And as Fox reports:

Workers at the disaster-stricken Fukushima nuclear plant in Japan say they expect to die from radiation sickness as a result of their efforts to bring the reactors under control, the mother of one of the men tells Fox News….

Speaking tearfully through an interpreter by phone, the mother of a 32-year-old worker said: “My son and his colleagues have discussed it at length and they have committed themselves to die if necessary to save the nation.

“He told me they have accepted they will all probably die from radiation sickness in the short term or cancer in the long-term.”

The woman spoke to Fox News on the condition of anonymity because, she said, plant workers had been asked by management not to communicate with the media or share details with family members in order to minimize public panic.

She could not confirm if her son or other workers were already suffering from radiation sickness. But she added: “They have concluded between themselves that it is inevitable some of them may die within weeks or months. They know it is impossible for them not to have been exposed to lethal doses of radiation.”

– Jay Bookman

321 comments Add your comment

jm

March 31st, 2011
4:14 pm

First item. Unfortunately I had. Grisly and sad indeed.

WOW

March 31st, 2011
4:23 pm

Yep, it’s real bad over there. Then again, oil prices have soared higher under Obama than they had under Bush.

So where are all of the great alternative energy sources, Jay?

Peadawg

March 31st, 2011
4:26 pm

WOW, stfu with the Bush/Obama for once. THIS blog subject has nothing to do with either.

Our thoughts and prayers go out to Japan!

Haywood Jablome

March 31st, 2011
4:26 pm

All this and Godzilla and Mothra too.

Where is Ultraman when you need him?

WOW

March 31st, 2011
4:27 pm

“WOW, stfu with the Bush/Obama for once. THIS blog subject has nothing to do with either.”

Peadawg, make me.

Peadawg

March 31st, 2011
4:27 pm

I can’t, but maybe Jay can.

josef nix

March 31st, 2011
4:28 pm

Those workers are real heroes…

WOW

March 31st, 2011
4:29 pm

“I can’t, but maybe Jay can.’

For what, Peadawg? I haven’t name called or anything.

carlosgvv

March 31st, 2011
4:29 pm

It may be that here in the US any future nuclear plants will be built far away from the ocean and nowhere near any earthquake faults. It’s no secret that oil will eventually run out and wind, solar and water power don’t look as though they will be able to replace all of that lost energy. So, in the years to come, either we learn to live with a good bit less power, or we build a large number of nuclear plants. I hope that future improvements in technology will prove me wrong.

josef nix

March 31st, 2011
4:30 pm

If WOW weren’t here, who would we be reacting to? :-)

Southern Comfort (aka The Man)

March 31st, 2011
4:31 pm

Peadawg :)

Japan and it’s citizens have an almost herculean task ahead of them on their road to recovery. A country with vast land resources could probably absorb this incident. However, Japan doesn’t have the space. I’ll continue to pray for them.

WOW

March 31st, 2011
4:32 pm

“If WOW weren’t here, who would we be reacting to?”

For one, I never addressed one single person on THIS particular topic. Peadawg comes in, tells me to STFU and then wants Jay to shut me up because I stated that oil prices have shot up under Obama.

Sounds like Peadawg is an angry individual.

Doggone/GA

March 31st, 2011
4:32 pm

“For what”

for being a PITA

Punching Bag

March 31st, 2011
4:33 pm

Obama caused the earthquake.

You’re welcome WOW.

John Birch

March 31st, 2011
4:33 pm

god works in mysterious ways, you’d think we could have a nuclear accident somewhere in the ME!

Peadawg

March 31st, 2011
4:34 pm

“because I stated that oil prices have shot up under Obama. – There’s a time and blog to argue about Bush/Obama and gas prices but this subject isn’t the one.

USMC dawg

March 31st, 2011
4:36 pm

It’s all George Bush’s fault!

josef nix

March 31st, 2011
4:37 pm

Punching Bag

“Obama caused the earthquake.”

Unh hunh…Me and Dusty did!

John Birch

Mid East “accidenrt?” Bibi’s got it covered!

md

March 31st, 2011
4:38 pm

Sounds to me as if all future plants should be built over a deep pit full of water…….problems like this arise and flush the whole plant down the hole………….and cover it up.

AmVet

March 31st, 2011
4:38 pm

I’m concerned that the Japanese government isn’t being very forthright about all of this.

20 to 30 klicks? That’s it?

I understand them not wanting to add to any panic, but jeez, I have to wonder people are going to get horribly sick and die needlessly.

At any rate, my heart aches for the men, women and children who are suffering there. Hang tough, Japan. We’re sending money and assets and our thoughts are with you.

josef and peadawg, you’re both right.

As Jay notes, if you don’t want to make this blog about him, don’t make it about him.

Without constant attention, he’ll wither and die.

And then a semblance of sanity will return to this forum…

josef nix

March 31st, 2011
4:39 pm

SoCo
“I’ll continue to pray for them…”

Likewise.

WOW

March 31st, 2011
4:40 pm

“As Jay notes, if you don’t want to make this blog about him, don’t make it about him.

Without constant attention, he’ll wither and die.

And then a semblance of sanity will return to this forum”

LOLOL!!!!!! You guys are hilarious. I didn’t even comment on one single person on this blog and yet four of you have responded!!!!!!!!

josef nix

March 31st, 2011
4:41 pm

AmVet

“Without constant attention, he’ll wither and die”

A delicate flower…

Paul

March 31st, 2011
4:41 pm

Tragic, tragic situation.

Those plant workers embody the noblest attributes of humanity.

josef nix

March 31st, 2011
4:42 pm

WOW

For the record, I like having you around…

Paul

March 31st, 2011
4:45 pm

josef nix

Please, my friend….

http://tinyurl.com/4czcdhg

AmVet

March 31st, 2011
4:45 pm

josef, you truly are the King of EOIs!

BTW, PBS had a heartbreaking special about that killer earthquake last night.

As always, their intense coverage of any topic is top notch…

md

March 31st, 2011
4:45 pm

Although a reverent topic, I have to admit not really good blog material………without going off topic, I don’t see how this one really gets anywhere. Like it or not, the debating, fussing, etc is what carries this place.

Granny Godzilla

March 31st, 2011
4:46 pm

God bless all the first responders…..

Seems to me whether at the World Trade Center, the Federal Building in OK, Japan’s nuclear plant – they behave with the utmost in dignity, character and bravery.

God Bless them everyone.

WOW

March 31st, 2011
4:46 pm

“For the record, I like having you around…”

Thanks! The folks that usually get angry at me are the ones who say things like “troll, racist humper, white trash etc…

Either way, I just laugh and continue on. I’ll state my opinion and then expect a few left wingers to name call and THEN cry to Jay to ban me.

Yeah, it sucks what’s happened in Japan but there is nothing anyone can really do at this point. The facility was old, outdated and needed to be updated. The company also has a history of hiding/ falsifying documents to the government.

If Bush was president right now, the left would be howling and screaming for his impeachment like they were when the Sudanese were being massacred. What’s really ironic is you never ever hear the left talk about that anymore. Wonder why?

jm

March 31st, 2011
4:46 pm

jonix 4:42 – herehere

Granny Godzilla

March 31st, 2011
4:47 pm

AmVet

We watched that last night sometimes tearfully….PBS did another excellent job.

Jay

March 31st, 2011
4:49 pm

WOW, I hate to dash your persecution complex, but nobody has contacted me asking that you be banned.

josef nix

March 31st, 2011
4:49 pm

PAUL

I love everybody and don’t want anyone going hungry under a bridge…except Helen Thomas…

md

That is very true…

AmVet

I caught that program…very good…when you want serious and indepth, go PBS is my motto…

AmVet

March 31st, 2011
4:50 pm

Well said, Granny…

We tend to take them, and law enforcement, for granted.

Until…

It’s hard to believe that the diesel engines that run the entire plant cooling system could be so easily compromised. And the back up batteries only provided 8 hours of power.

I’m not playing backseat driver here, and I know the design is older, but WTF?

moonbat betty

March 31st, 2011
4:50 pm

What a tragedy.

I am wondering how staying inside is going to protect the people from radiation?? Does a home not have any kind of ventilation?

However, we can move away from nuclear power and avoid this by investing in the the Moonbat2000 personal power generator.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=asZ2RHPHT4c

Get your family in shape and power all electrical devices in your home while saving mother earth.

I am working with obama to start Moonbat2000 farms where illegal immigrants can be granted citizenship after 2 years of service for pedaling power to the US.

jm

March 31st, 2011
4:50 pm

Libya is not Rwanda

http://shadow.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2011/03/30/libya_is_not_rwanda

The president made it clear in his speech that the U.S.-led war against Libya is primarily motivated to prevent a humanitarian catastrophe. “We were faced with the prospect of violence on a horrific scale,” he said. “To brush aside America’s responsibility as a leader and – more profoundly – our responsibilities to our fellow human beings under such circumstances would have been a betrayal of who we are. Some nations may be able to turn a blind eye to atrocities in other countries. The United States of America is different.”

This gives credence to the reports that Hilary Clinton, the secretary of state, Susan Rice, the U.S. permanent representative to the U.N., and Samantha Power, N.S.C. senior director for multilateral affairs, led the charge to war specifically to avoid “another Rwanda.” The latter two especially have been outspoken in their belief that the United States was wrong not to intervene to stop the 1994 genocide in Rwanda in which the ethnic Hutu Interahamwe militia slaughtered some 800,000 fellow Rwandans in a few weeks while the world watched. One diplomat told Power she shouldn’t let Libya become “Obama’s Rwanda,” according to the New York Times. Rwanda looms darkly in the liberal conscience as a powerful prod of guilt, whispering “Next time, do something. Do anything. Anything is better than nothing.”

Liberals have a point about Rwanda. It was grotesque that troop-contributing countries actually withdrew their forces from the U.N. Mission in Rwanda (UNAMIR), rather than beef it up with more resources and authority, as the genocide unfolded. (However, Power betrays her ignorance of military realities when she argued in her book, A Problem From Hell, that the U.N. could have stopped the genocide with the assets it had on the ground at the time).

But Libya is not Rwanda. Rwanda was genocide. Libya is a civil war.

WOW

March 31st, 2011
4:50 pm

“I hate to dash your persecution complex, but nobody has contacted me asking that you be banned.”

No, but Peadawgs 4:27 proves my point. Also, I don’t have a persecution complex. I just like to point out that the left wingers get away with name calling.

jm

March 31st, 2011
4:51 pm

“persecution complex”

Like a Federal Pen?

Doggone/GA

March 31st, 2011
4:52 pm

“It’s hard to believe that the diesel engines that run the entire plant cooling system could be so easily compromised”

“Easy” is relative…no one could anticipate that the coastline would go DOWN, which it did. And the generators were setup for (I think) a 20 foot tsunami…this was 30 feet.

Anti-WOW

March 31st, 2011
4:52 pm

Jay, Please ban WOW.

WOW, hope that helps. :)

AmVet

March 31st, 2011
4:53 pm

moonbat!

Thanks for some much needed levity!

And I like your plan! Even if does sound Pharaoh-like in nature!

Centerist

March 31st, 2011
4:54 pm

No surprise to see someone whine and piss their pants over another saying STFU. Grow up. This blog is about the loss of humanity not the loss of your pride on how your Obama/Bush comment was responded to. Grow up.

jm

March 31st, 2011
4:55 pm

All I have to say is: these nuclear engineers better be smarter and better than the previous nuclear engineers, cause they’re building a new plant in Augusta. And if it ever lights up like this one, there will be some mighty PO’d Georgians. Understatement.

George W

March 31st, 2011
4:55 pm

Very bad situation for them! Many prayers to the Japanese here and abroad.

@@

March 31st, 2011
4:55 pm

And yet there was the story about a small Japanese village, who, in 24? 48? hours was able to remove all the debris from their streets and get back to their daily lives as best they could.

Amazing determination.

SoCo:

I’m going to leave you a post downstairs. As I said, I was lagging behind and missing posts.

Southern Comfort (aka The Man)

March 31st, 2011
4:55 pm

Peadawg left wing?????

Damn, I think I ruptured my kidneys from laughing so hard……..

md

March 31st, 2011
4:57 pm

“Get your family in shape and power all electrical devices in your home while saving mother earth.”

That’s why I like the idea of electric airplanes……with the passengers doing the running. Keep those flying in great shape…….and plenty of incentive not to stop.

George W

March 31st, 2011
4:58 pm

Anyone notice Bill SB-5 in Ohio passed! Bye Bye Unions!

jm

March 31st, 2011
4:58 pm

Historical analogies are sloppy thinking. U.S. policymakers went to war in Korea and Vietnam because they wanted to avoid another Munich. Liberals believe that Iraq is another Vietnam. Paleoconservatives worry that Libya is another Iraq, while liberals fear it is another Rwanda. These are rhetorical shortcuts that partisans use to excuse themselves from having to think very carefully or learn the details of each new case. One hopes the strategists in the White House will resist that temptation, but judging from Obama’s speech, they aren’t.

from foreign policy

AmVet

March 31st, 2011
4:58 pm

If WOW and Anti-WOW meet (in theory of course!), is there a giant explosion?

Doggone, I saw that. And it is mind boggling to think that the Japanese coast actually sank relative to the ocean, but I believe the protective tsunami walls were only 8 feet high.

I’m not faulting them, truly I’m not. And I understand that this was the largest earthquake to have hit that region in a long time, but this has shades of the levees in New Orleans. (Built for Cat 3, but nothing bigger…)

Scientists must have predicted bigger event

Paul

March 31st, 2011
4:59 pm

Anti 4:52

Careful, or this could be you -

http://tinyurl.com/4985b2l

josef nix

March 31st, 2011
4:59 pm

jm

Genocides are frequently much a part of a civil war…

Quite frankly, and not trying to poke anybody, but I am always fascinated by just who (and what) it is that’s a burr under the Bruin’s saddle…he’s usually pretty placid…but sometimes… :-)

Paul

March 31st, 2011
5:00 pm

AmVet

ahhhhhh, more great minds, and all that -

jm

March 31st, 2011
5:01 pm

The Shores of Tripoli: Our Latest Wilsonian War
Walter Russell Mead

It’s still much too soon to tell how America’s Libya liberation venture will work out. The international coalition is shaky; the UN mandate is dubious; air power has frequently disappointed those who trusted that it alone can win wars; political support in the US is shaky; the Great Loon of Libya, a statesman in the hallowed tradition of Idi Amin, is as cunning as he is daffy; Libya’s fragile unity may crumble as the tribes and clans turn on one another; the rebels are poorly armed and poorly organized; some of them may in fact be experienced international terrorists.

For the record, I hope it all works out. I want the government to fall, the Great Loon to flap away into inglorious exile somewhere dismal and dull, and I want the rebels, with help from NATO and the Arab League, to set up a workable government that gives Libya’s people a chance to reinvent their country and spreads the oil wealth around. (I would also like a pony.) I think we are out on a limb here and I wish the president had found the time to get some congressional backing up front, but we are where we are and the best we can do now is to muddle on through.

http://blogs.the-american-interest.com/wrm/2011/03/30/the-shores-of-tripoli-our-latest-wilsonian-war/

Pogo

March 31st, 2011
5:01 pm

The Fukushima reactor complex consisted of six very old General Electric Mark I Boiling water reactors built (and to a large degree, maintained) by General Electric. These reactors, for whatever reason (probably money), never implemented the safety design changes that the Mark I boiling water reactors in the US incorporated when they were constructed and which were regulatorily required as technology and knowledge advanced. The reason that the Fukashima reactor buildings exploded was because the Japanese reactors did not have Reactor Building ventillation (which the US plants have) which would have exhausted the hydrogen and prevented the explosions that you see that occurred in Japan. If these explosions would not have occurred the plant would have been much easier to control and the spread of contamination would have been much less and the Japanese reactor buildings themselves were not constructed as robustly as the US reactors are.

But the real problem was the hydrogen which caused the explosions in the first place. It would have never been present if there would have been adequate power to the emergency control and cooling systems. A typical boiling water reactor in the US must have 5 emergency diesels instantly available at all time to provide emergency power to control and cooling systems in the event of loss of offsite power. Out of these five generators, at least two must available to power the control and cooling systems in the plant. Most of reactors in the US are not built upon fault lines but some are and some are susceptible to sustained periods loss of “offsite” power due to tornadoes and hurricanes. These are the ones that need to be scrutinized and make no mistake, the Nuclear Regulatory Commission at this very moment is most likely looking at making additional power sources, outside of the emergency diesel generators, mandatory for all nuclear reactors. And I am all for it. Nuclear power is a great thing but we must be willing to ignore budget constraints to make them as absolutely safe as they can be. Make no mistake, it provides one heck of a lot of electricity for us which is virtually pollution free, is economical for us consumers and they also make a lot of money for their owners. There is absolutely no reason for us not to be be able to obtain a balance between efficient and economical nuclear energy and abosolute nuclear safety (or as absolute as mankind can make it).

Another thing, Barbara Boxer and some other politicians are now calling for the nuclear power plants to empty their fuel pools. Because of Obama and Reids decision to shut down the Yucca Mountain Project, the utilities only have one option and that is surface storage at the plants themselves in “dry casks”. If the Federal Government would have lived up to its lawful obligations and made a depository available (i.e. not shut down Yucca, which was completely safe), then the plants could have shipped their fuel and it would have all been consolidated and safely buried hundreds of feet under solid rock. But politics got in the way of common sense. Isn’t that they way. Also, Jimmy Carter canceled recycling of spent nuclear fuel which was really, really stupid. Recycling would be a great benefit to all of us and all of our concerns no matter whose side you are on in the nuclear debate.

Anti-WOW

March 31st, 2011
5:03 pm

AmVet – you need to brush up on your physics. No explosion, maybe a few gamma rays, that’s about it. We just disappear into the night.

Maybe to an alternative universe perhaps.

Doggone/GA

March 31st, 2011
5:04 pm

“but I believe the protective tsunami walls were only 8 feet high.”

Actually, according to the Nova show – 18 feet, but then they sank with the coastline…and the tsunami was STILL 30 feet high. So they still would have been inundated and lost their generators even if the coastline hadn’t sunk.

poison pen

March 31st, 2011
5:04 pm

Carlosgvv, I don’t think that any technology can fool Mother Nature.

josef nix

March 31st, 2011
5:06 pm

AmVet

“josef, you truly are the King of EOIs!”

Oh, no. Compared to our Main Man, Paul, I’m just a distant “also ran…” :-)

Paul

March 31st, 2011
5:08 pm

Anti

“We just disappear into the night. Maybe to an alternative universe perhaps.”

Funny, that’s the reality I thought you were blogging from…..

Anti-WOW

March 31st, 2011
5:09 pm

They are probably not going to be this cooperative next time. By the time American, French and British lawyers and diplomats finished stretching the resolution, it was hard to see what activities were banned. NATO could not only impose a no fly zone and intervene to protect civilians under actual attack; it apparently believes it has a legal right to recognize rebels as the legitimate government, market their oil, sell them arms, and attack any Libyan forces anywhere in the country with any weapons they choose without regard to the danger those forces pose to civilians in the short term — and to continue the operation pretty much at will. Even ground forces might be permissible — as long as they don’t call themselves an occupying army. Having sold the resolution to the Russians and Chinese as a compromise measure that circumscribed their freedom of action, the allies have interpreted it to give them carte blanche for virtually any actions one can imagine.

1811/1801 - 0311/0317

March 31st, 2011
5:13 pm

Jay:

I am so glad you posted this thread because this radiation debacle is probably an unmanageable problem

Now ………….. based on what’s happening in Japan, just imagine Islamic terrorists at some point in the future are able to set of a potent “dirty radiation” bomb in one or more of our major cities.

This is nothing to get political about.

We had best be doing EVERYTHING to prevent that (which at this time we are not).

Just sayin’

Normal

March 31st, 2011
5:13 pm

Has Pat Robertson come out and said what’s happening to Japan is because they aren’t Christian?

Sorry, bad joke….

Josef,
Had this for you yesterday. I bet you know about this guy…

http://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/samuel-bell-maxey-born

Deep Throat

March 31st, 2011
5:14 pm

Hello Wow, hows it going , all the hatred that spews from the left, if we could harness that energy perhaps we could eliminate a couple of our Nuke plants.

jm

March 31st, 2011
5:14 pm

not good news.

Order is breaking down somewhat. When Egyptians celebrated International Women’s Day on March 8, gangs of men harassed them. When Mohamed ElBaradei, the Nobel Peace Prize-winner who is running for president, tried to vote in a recent referendum, a mob attacked him.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/31/opinion/31kristof.html?_r=1

Normal

March 31st, 2011
5:15 pm

Who was said the world will end, not with a bang, but a whimper?

Is Japan the beginning of that whimper?

Moderate Line

March 31st, 2011
5:18 pm

Jay

March 31st, 2011
4:49 pm
WOW, I hate to dash your persecution complex, but nobody has contacted me asking that you be banned.
+++++++++
Peadawg

March 31st, 2011
4:27 pm
I can’t, but maybe Jay can.

md

March 31st, 2011
5:18 pm

“A typical boiling water reactor in the US must have 5 emergency diesels instantly available at all time to provide emergency power to control and cooling systems in the event of loss of offsite power. Out of these five generators, at least two must available to power the control and cooling systems in the plant.”

5 or 55, I doubt any of them would work under water………..

jm

March 31st, 2011
5:18 pm

Dave R.

March 31st, 2011
5:19 pm

““josef, you truly are the King of EOIs!”

I do believe that I deserve at least an honorable mention in that category . . .

WOW

March 31st, 2011
5:21 pm

“If WOW and Anti-WOW meet (in theory of course!), is there a giant explosion?”

Anti-WOW and I are actually pretty cool with each other.

“Hello Wow, hows it going , all the hatred that spews from the left, if we could harness that energy perhaps we could eliminate a couple of our Nuke plants.”

I’m doing just fine, Deep. How are you?

Moderate Line, I pointed that out to Jay and never heard back.

Dave R.

March 31st, 2011
5:23 pm

I said this right after this disaster began, but we use the term “hero” a bit too loosely these days.

The workers in that plant and surrounding areas truly fit the definition of “heroes”.

josef nix

March 31st, 2011
5:24 pm

Normal

I am. And that don’t take any prisoners alive applied to whites as well as blacks…it was pay back for the Black Hawk War and Pea Ridge…

an interesting read on the subject in reference to Albert Pike…
http://rebelhistory.blogspot.com/2009/12/confederate-indian-treaties-promising.html

Southern Comfort (aka The Man)

March 31st, 2011
5:25 pm

I doubt any of them would work under water………..

Maybe there is some use for our old diesel subs after all……..

Moderate

I don’t think Peadawg was asking Jay to ban WOW. He was just stating that Jay could do it, if he so chooses to.

AmVet

March 31st, 2011
5:26 pm

Pogo, thanks for the info. Good stuff.

And Anti-, didn’t you ever watch Star Trek? It was tongue in cheek.

Speaking of which…

Throat, quit giving him a tongue bath. It’s unmanly AND unbecoming…

md, after the explosions, I read some about the containment buildings.

Apparently they are designed to withstand the impact of a fully loaded airliner, without allowing any leaks.

Why am I dubious?

josef nix

March 31st, 2011
5:26 pm

DAVE

Oh, I’ll agree…but you, too, are just an “also ran” when it comes to our founder and chairman, Paul…

AmVet

March 31st, 2011
5:29 pm

…but you, too, are just an “also ran” when it comes to our founder and chairman, Paul…

True, when either of you wannabes can get the blog shut down for an extended period of time, you will be in his league…

Doggone/GA

March 31st, 2011
5:29 pm

“5 or 55, I doubt any of them would work under water”

Didn’t Jay say something the other day about the new reactors at SRS having a passive cooling water flow, fed by gravity and not pumps?

Deep Throat

March 31st, 2011
5:30 pm

md, 5 or 55, I doubt any of them would work under water………..

I am no engineer nor am I very bright, but, I do know submarines used to be powered by diesel engines and since submarines operate under water, one would think the technology is out there to create a generator to operate under water. Just my guess.

Southern Comfort (aka The Man)

March 31st, 2011
5:30 pm

AmV

I don’t think anybody’s gonna best Paul in that category….

Deep Throat

March 31st, 2011
5:33 pm

Amvet, the fake, born in 55, enlisted in 76 when he was 17. I knew you were a fake.

Pogo

March 31st, 2011
5:33 pm

No Normal, the Mid-East is the beginning of that “whimper”. From there it only goes down.

1811/1801 - 0311/0317

March 31st, 2011
5:34 pm

josef:

I used to know a guy named “peajuice”.

Jay

March 31st, 2011
5:35 pm

I think it’s fair to say that Ga. Power plants at Vogtle and Hatch are not vulnerable in the same way as the plants in Japan, even though the Hatch plant is the same basic design and age as the Japanese plants.

But I was struck by this nugget in a recent NY Times story:

“WASHINGTON — American nuclear safety regulators, using a complex mathematical technique, determined that the simultaneous failure of both emergency shutdown systems that are designed to prevent a core meltdown was so unlikely that it would happen once every 17,000 years.

But 20 years ago, it happened twice in four days at a pair of nuclear reactors in southern New Jersey. … as the New Jersey accidents in 1983, which did not result in any core damage or release of radiation, show, no one can predict what might upend all the computer models, emergency planning and backup systems designed to eliminate those narrow theoretical probabilities or mitigate their effects. “

Redneck Convert (R--and proud of it)

March 31st, 2011
5:35 pm

Well, you got to feel bad for some of the people over there. They can’t say goodbye to Mama in a good Christian manner at a big funeral but they can see her glow from miles away. Maybe they’ll be able to pick her remains up in a few dozen years.

I just hope this don’t mean GA Power stops working on the nuculer power plants I’m buying a share of when I pay my power bill. Anyhow, this Japan problem ain’t nobody’s fault. I mean, you can’t cause a earthquake and a 60 ft. wall of water. No matter what the Rev. Robertson might say. And the GA Power plants are a couple hundred miles from the ocean, so no danger there.

So it’s bad over there, but you got to crack some eggs to make a omelette we need to keep building the nuculer plants here. Besides,we already got more people than we know what to do with.

Have a good night everybody.

morris wise

March 31st, 2011
5:38 pm

Leakage of Caesium-137 of 547 times the normal level at the Dai-ichi nuclear plant is bad news, it has a half life of 30 years. Experiments with dogs show that a single dose is lethal within three weeks and even a small dose can cause cancer in humans. The worst fear is that it will get into the food supply and affect fertility rates leading to the depopulation of the planet. The IAEA has stated that Caesium-137 is the isotope of choice in dirty bombs, the Dai-ichi leak has accidentally made the dirty bomb a reality.

josef nix

March 31st, 2011
5:40 pm

Nuclear power…do the benefits outweigh the risks? IMHO, no….

Paul

March 31st, 2011
5:43 pm

Dang, AmVet and SoCom, would you two get some Christian charity? If God forgets the sin when a sinner repents, then maybe you two could…

wait… that means I’d have to feel remorse and turn away from those actions…

Nevermind.

good evening, josef nix

Regarding those “Five Civilized Tribes” down south: spent some growing-up years in upstate New York. There we had the Iroquois Five Nations – Mohawk, Oneida, Onondaga, Cayuga and Seneca. They might take a wee exception to hearing another group of five referred to as ‘civilized’ -

md

March 31st, 2011
5:44 pm

“md, after the explosions, I read some about the containment buildings.

Apparently they are designed to withstand the impact of a fully loaded airliner, without allowing any leaks.”

Yeh…I read some too that said as a last resort the core would melt down and drop on the floor to cool……but the integrity of the building didn’t seem to be in question.

As I said before, why not dig a pit under the floor……..if the building is breached, the floor opens, the core drops down and then the floor re-closes and acts as a second containment building.

But I’m just an armchair engineer, so maybe someone that knows can tell me……….

Pogo

March 31st, 2011
5:46 pm

I understand what you are saying md but we cannot have energy without paying a price either in risks or our pocket books. All energy sources entail risks whether it be natural gas explosions or the terribly toxic byproducts created by the production of solar panels and batteries. We don’t live in some perfect sci-fi universe where there is a limitless cheap source of power which is pollution free to keep our AC’s and our computers going. I think that is the trouble with people today; everyone thinks that they should be able to have whatever they want whenever they want it but there should be absolutely no risk or cost involved to either themselves or to society. And at that point one can only surmise that we trully have become a “ship of un-educated, un-realistic” fools. Of course, what with our supposed “leaders” and the promises they make to pacify their constituentcies, it is entirely understandble. They know that they have enough gullible fools to follow them that they can basically say whatever they want whether it is stupid or not and they will still follow them.

AmVet

March 31st, 2011
5:48 pm

From the stellar 1980 LP Phoenix

I hear the thunder three miles away
The island’s leaking into the bay
The poison is spreading, the demon is free
People are running from what they can?t even see

Face the fire you can?t turn away
Risk grows greater with each passing day
Waiting?s over, the moment has come
To kill the fire and turn to the sun

They?ll take your money and then take your health
To line their pockets with unequaled wealth
These men are under the power of gold
Won?t be safe until we shut them down cold

Face the fire you can?t turn away
Risk grows greater with each passing day
Waiting?s over, the moment has come
To kill the fire and turn to the sun

People came to the Capitol Town
One hundred thousand of them laid their hearts down
They screamed in anger and broadcast their fears
Just to have them fall on deaf ears

Face the fire you can?t turn away
Risk grows greater with each passing day
Waiting?s over, the moment has come
To kill the fire and turn to the sun
Kill the fire and turn to the sun

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xAp2v3r-QZc

Paul

March 31st, 2011
5:48 pm

Jay

“was so unlikely that it would happen once every 17,000 years. But 20 years ago, it happened twice in four days at a pair of nuclear reactors in southern New Jersey”

Hits once, beginning of the 17,000, then it starts over and hits again. Doesn’t mean it can’t happen at the beginning of the cycle.

and lessee, that’s roughly equivalent to once every 6.2 million days.

But every week people are winning powerball lotteries with lots higher odds than that.

Oh well, sleep tight tonight!

md

March 31st, 2011
5:48 pm

“I am no engineer nor am I very bright, but, I do know submarines used to be powered by diesel engines and since submarines operate under water, one would think the technology is out there to create a generator to operate under water.”

But all of the sub is within a contained space…………be harder to do with a giant reactor, but I can see where it could be made to be waterproof………….we do have power running under ground. I’m guessing there would have to be some kind of snorkel system to vent.

1811/1801 - 0311/0317

March 31st, 2011
5:53 pm

“Cartels threaten to kill Texas Rangers, ICE agents”

March 31, 2011 2:18 PM
Laura B. Martinez
The Brownsville Herald

“A law enforcement bulletin has been issued warning that the drug cartels were overheard plotting to kill ICE agents and Texas Rangers guarding the Texas border, officials reported this morning.

The cartel members planned to use AK-47 assault rifles to shoot the agents and rangers from across the border, the bulletin said. It did not name which drug cartel was involved.”

Note: Almost 100 years ago, Gen. Pershing and U.S. Cavalry were sent into Mexico on a punitive raid to stop the killing of U.S. Citizens along the border.

What we need is a president who would let the “Cartelnuts” group themselves across our border, land a company of Marines behind them and take no prisoners.

Normal

March 31st, 2011
5:54 pm

Hark! What glow comes from the west?

Sorry, couldn’t help it….

md

March 31st, 2011
5:55 pm

Pogo….agree.

Jo…”Nuclear power…do the benefits outweigh the risks? IMHO, no….”

Along the lines of Pogo’s comment, I don’t think it is that simple of an answer……as he states, every source has it’s drawbacks……….another math equation to see which is actually worse.

Take nuclear off the table, and the price of oil skyrockets………and the cost of everything goes with it……..how many around the globe starve because they can’t afford the higher priced food??

josef nix

March 31st, 2011
5:55 pm

PAUL
The term “Five Civilized Tribes” came into vogue during the Removals as a contemporary “Newspeak” Ir is interesting to note that in the records of the Late Misunderstanding, the Union Records refer to “tribes” while the Confederate Records use the term “nations.” Accords reached between the Richmond government and the Indian Nations were conducted according to the precepts of international diplomacy…truly, though, Union policies during and after the Wah-uh is one nasty read…but, Kundera’s Professor Hubl paradigm reigns full in the popular and Major Historians version of the rewrite…

getalife

March 31st, 2011
5:56 pm

It is horrific.

Radiation spewing every where.

Toxic mess over there.

AmVet

March 31st, 2011
5:59 pm

Notwithstanding the horrific and obvious risks, I have always leaned heavily towards using nuclear power.

With that said, we the people paying for these Georgia plants up front, is a crock of corporate welfare ____…

But we ain’t ever gonna get to do the Kirk and Spock thing, if we can’t even get this right.