Do half of Republicans really think Obama is illegitimate president?

According to Public Policy Polling, 51 percent of Republican primary voters don’t believe that Barack Obama was born in the United States. Another 21 percent aren’t sure, and just 28 percent are willing to acknowledge that yes, Obama was born here.

I have no grounds on which to question the accuracy of the PPP numbers. But personally, I don’t believe they mean what they seem to mean. I am not willing to accept that more than half of Republican voters truly believe something that crazy.

So here’s my best alternative explanation:

When Republican voters are asked where Obama was born, many don’t approach it as a question of objective fact. They hear it as a test of tribal loyalty — do you side with Obama, or do you side with your fellow Republicans — and they answer it accordingly. Tribal loyalty trumps all, even if it means pledging loyalty to something that on its face is ridiculous.

I think that happens on a lot of issues these days. Global warming is another. In 21st century America, global warming is not a scientific issue to be debated in terms of CO2 concentrations in the atmosphere or the thickness of Arctic ice. It has become an issue of cultural allegiance. It is a tribal marker, a means of dividing us from them, and you can no more reason somebody into changing sides than you can reason a Yankee fan into rooting for the Red Sox. For that reason, it can never be resolved and compromise has become impossible.

Even conservative politicians who know better — Newt Gingrich, John McCain, Mike Huckabee, all of whom at one point have acknowledged the reality of manmade climate change — have recanted. They know what the data say, but they also know that their tribe has concluded that climate change is a fraud perpetrated by a global scientific conspiracy to bring down capitalism. So they have sided with their tribe.

Now, politics has always had an element of tribalism to it, and it always will. Any endeavor in which one group of people competes against another will at some level arouse instincts to side with “our people” and against “those people”. As human beings, we find those instincts deeply satisfying, and if you don’t believe me, take a seat in the stands at a Georgia-Georgia Tech football game.

But for some reason — perhaps because it is at root a movement of the besieged — American conservatism is particularly responsive to calls on tribal loyalty.

Just last weekend, House Speaker John Boehner was asked repeatedly whether he would challenge those in his party who believe that Obama was not born here. Boehner, the most powerful Republican leader in the country, declined to take the lead. “”It’s not my job to tell the American people what to think,” he said. “The American people have the right to think what they want to think.”

What he really meant was, the tribe has spoken.

Sen. Orrin Hatch, appearing at a CPAC forum late last week, offers a more poignant example. Hatch is up for re-election next year, and a new poll shows him with the support of just 44 percent of Utah voters in a Republican primary. Among those voters who call themselves very conservative, Hatch trails U.S. Rep. Jason Chaffetz by 51-35 percent.

Despite a lifetime of conservatism, Hatch is under attack from the right because in 2008, as Wall Street teetered on collapse, he voted in favor of the TARP bailouts. At last week’s forum, Hatch apologized profusely for the vote and called it a mistake.

“Not a lot of people are willing to say they’re sorry,” he said. “But I will.”

Yet in that same appearance, Hatch also felt the need to explain himself:

“Under the circumstances at that time, we were going down,” the senator said. “Let me tell you, we were going down. The secretary of the treasury said this is what had to be done…. If it had taken my vote, the 51st vote, to stop us from going into a depression, I would have done it anyway.”

In other words, doing the smart thing in order to avert a major depression was a mistake and Hatch now wants to be forgiven for it. He saw his close friend and colleague, former Sen. Robert Bennett, voted off Republican Island last year, and he doesn’t want it to happen to him. He wants back in his tribe’s good graces.

Now, maybe I’m wrong about all this. But if so, I’d like to see a better explanation. I just refuse to accept that so many Republicans truly are as daffy as Orly Taitz.

– Jay Bookman

664 comments Add your comment

arnold

February 15th, 2011
3:56 pm

GOP members are really that crazy.

jm

February 15th, 2011
3:59 pm

Time to Get Serious About the Deficit
http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2011/02/time-to-get-serious-about-the-deficit/71246/

illegitimate? only in the sense he’s not proposing real budget reform, the kind required of a leader.

Granny Godzilla

February 15th, 2011
4:00 pm

Tribal Loyalty?

Won’t that make a fun bumper sticker

Ragnar Danneskjold

February 15th, 2011
4:00 pm

Hard to argue with the “tribal loyalty” theory – certainly on display among leftists here every day.

Kamchak

February 15th, 2011
4:02 pm

Us and Them: Understanding Your Tribal Mind by David Berreby is a good read for those that want more about this topic

Adam

February 15th, 2011
4:04 pm

The bottom line is, despite the evidence, some people will NEVER believe the man was born in this country. And a lot of it, whether they want to admit it or not, is because he “just looks foreign.” Nevermind that his mother was midwestern, and that he was born in Hawaii.

So YES, some of them believe this because they ARE, in fact, racist. You don’t have a belief that Obama is a Muslim, or a belief that he is a foreigner, just because you disagree with his policies. That is grade A bullsh*t so don’t give me that.

jm

February 15th, 2011
4:05 pm

Jay, incidentally, I saw the whole Boehner interview. Please give him credit where due. He said, repeatedly, that it was apparent to him that he was born in Hawaii and was an American citizen. He did, however, abdicate any responsibility for telling voters what to believe. But he repeatedly stated it was his belief Obama was a US Citizen born in Hawaii and obviously qualified to be President.

Whether one wants to call into question his leadership abilities based on this is argument one can have. But Boehner is not perpetuating the idea that Obama is illegitimate.

0311/0317 - 1811/1801

February 15th, 2011
4:07 pm

Jay, listen:

I explained this once today already.

There are 11 states (at last count) that are working on legislation to make any “future” presidential candidate establish his/her citizenship before their names can go on a ballot.

Obviously, the states involved have different “requirements” for what “documentation” determines citizenship.

I would wager that at least one state (perhaps one with Republican legislatures and a Republican Governor) will pass such a law before the next election.

If and I say “if” , said law is upheld by the courts, this will be quite entertaining.

Paulo977

February 15th, 2011
4:08 pm

“51 percent of Republican primary voters don’t believe that Barack Obama was born in the United States” Tribal loyalty apart , they really DON’T KNOW that the state of Hawaii is a part of the US!!!

AmVet

February 15th, 2011
4:09 pm

I think you hit the nail right on the head, Jay.

All of these people cannot be that idiotic.

The modern day farce of a Republican Party takes a perverse pride in being opposed to virtually every major subset of every major western democracy in the entire world.

In many ways, their ideology is closest to that of the Middle Eastern nations and their Abrahamic cousins in Islam.

Pick a topic – man-made climate change, gays in the military, Bush’s Crusades, Obama’s citizenship, etc. etc. etc….

That they have become the laughingstock of the planet is of no concern to them, as they view themselves as the poor set upon victims of morality and valor.

And sometimes I think life would be so much easier if I could also be that brain-dead…

BTW, I noticed that some miscreant Joe Bidened my phrase “Reign of Error” this morning.

Without so much as a thank you or kiss my foot.

The nerve.

Adam

February 15th, 2011
4:10 pm

jm: Boehner acted in typical political speech. However, at some point it does become the responsibility of leadership to put an end to nonsense. But since Boehner doesn’t want to later be painted as someone from the government telling you what to do or what to think, he’s going to stick to his story on this one. That’s more important to him than fighting crazies who may just give him more votes later. And those same crazies will see that interview and think that Boehner AGREES with them, despite the fact he clearly stated otherwise.

Meme Mine

February 15th, 2011
4:10 pm

Continued defense and support of Climate Change’s unstoppable warming is hurting the planet as it divides environmental efforts and stalls progressive social reforms. The UN had allowed carbon trading to trump 3rd world fresh water relief, starvation rescue and 3rd world education for just over 25 years of climate control instead of needed population control. Obama blew off climate change in his Feb. speech and none of his thousands of consensus scientists raised a fuss over it. They were paid. Real scientists would be marching in the streets. This IS after all the biggest emergency ever, unstoppable warming, not bad weather. Why are the scientists not leading this insanity, instead of the politicians promising to lower the seas with taxes? If climate change was true these scientists would be on every news cast and every front page and on every talk radio show. This was our Iraq War of climate WMD’s. System Change, not climate change.

Richard

February 15th, 2011
4:11 pm

How is that surprising? 40% of Americans think Christianity came before Judaism which means they looked at books call the “Old Testament” and the “New Testament” and can’t figure out which came first.

Keep up the good fight!

February 15th, 2011
4:12 pm

The Tribe has spoken….and they be idiots.

Jay

February 15th, 2011
4:12 pm

it’s already entertaining to see you believe such nonsense, Scout.

Dave R.

February 15th, 2011
4:12 pm

1. Not a republican.

2. He is not illigitimate.

3. He is, however, the least qualified person to ever hold that office.

@@

February 15th, 2011
4:13 pm

I kinda liked Boehner’s response:

”It’s not my job to tell the American people what to think,” he said. “The American people have the right to think what they want to think.”

Were I Boehner, I would’ve added It’s President Obama’s job to convince him he’s an American citizen.

Having said that, I believe Obama was born in the United States.

He’s illegitimate in that he doesn’t know what he’s doing. Other than that…

Pompano

February 15th, 2011
4:13 pm

Agreed Ragnar – funny Jay doesn’t mention the kool-aid speak that he & his liberal brethren spew. The problem is Jay & his ilk are perfectly content to be sheeple and be told what to think by their party (seem to lack the ability of critical analysis).

Guess that’s why he’s having such a difficult time not understanding why Boehner doesn’t feel the need to address this issue. Boehner knows his constituents can do their own research and reach their own conclusions while Jay’s base needs to be spoon-fed in American idol sound-bites.

TaxPayer

February 15th, 2011
4:14 pm

Ragnar should help fund Orly’s next courtroom escapade. I think they’d make a great tag-team.

TaxPayer

February 15th, 2011
4:15 pm

funny Jay doesn’t mention the kool-aid speak that he & his liberal brethren spew.

Perhaps some specifics would help you build a credible case. Feel free.

Kamchak

February 15th, 2011
4:16 pm

I laughed so hard, that ilk came out of my nose.

Dave R.

February 15th, 2011
4:16 pm

“Just last weekend, House Speaker John Boehner was asked repeatedly whether he would challenge those in his party who believe that Obama was not born here. Boehner, the most powerful Republican leader in the country, declined to take the lead. “”It’s not my job to tell the American people what to think,” he said. “The American people have the right to think what they want to think.”

What he really meant was, “I can’t believe this Gregory idiot is asking me this question when there are important subjects to talk about.”

Fixed your typo, Jay. No thanks needed.

@@

February 15th, 2011
4:16 pm

I’m curious…in the video I linked to downstairs “Progressive protesters rally against Clarence Thomas” what does jay’s team think the guy meant when the guy said “Send him back to the field!”

1) Back to the legal field?

OR

2) Back to the cotton field?

No doubt in my mind what the guy meant.

Kamchak

February 15th, 2011
4:17 pm

Ilk — it does a body good.

Libertarian

February 15th, 2011
4:18 pm

Who is responsible for checking a candidate’s eligibility anyway? Is this something that no one has been doing for a while? Just curious.

0311/0317 - 1811/1801

February 15th, 2011
4:18 pm

Headline: “CBS correspondent Lara Logan sexually assaulted in Egypt”

“CBS has just announced that on Feb. 11, the day Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak stepped down, CBS correspondent Lara Logan was covering the jubilation in Tahrir Square for a 60 Minutes story when she, her team and their security were surrounded by a “dangerous element,” reports USA TODAY’s Gary Levin. They were part of a “mob of more than 200 people, who were whipped into a frenzy.”

In the crush, Logan was separated from her crew. She was surrounded and suffered a brutal and sustained sexual assault and beating before being saved by a group of women and an estimated 20 Egyptian soldiers. She reconnected with the CBS team, returned to her hotel and returned to the United States on the first flight the next morning. She is currently in the hospital recovering.”

Hummmmm …………. I wonder what “dangerous element” means ? Methodists ?

http://content.usatoday.com/communities/entertainment/post/2011/02/cbs-correspondent-lara-logan-sexually-assaulted-in-egypt/1

Jay

February 15th, 2011
4:18 pm

No doubt in my mind, either, @@. I agree with your interpretation.

However, are you trying to equate one rabid nut in a crowd to more than 50 percent of GOP primary voters?

AmVet

February 15th, 2011
4:19 pm

But one of the most ludicrous aspects of this nonsense is how the faithful actually think all of the relevant intelligence gathering agencies in the United States of America failed to note this rather “obvious” violation of US law.

Do these super-sleuths still read Nancy Drew and watch Scooby Doo?

Or regarding the CIA, etc perhaps

They were paid.

LOL!

And in the world of science-free, fact-free conspiracies, no proof whatsoever is required. Just the neo-con meme itself.

jm

February 15th, 2011
4:20 pm

BLOCK GRANTS FOR MEDICAID!

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703843004576138682854557922.html?mod=WSJ_Opinion_LEADTop

That’s my new rallying cry. When I’m not declaring “THE CORPORATE TAX IS TOO DAMN HIGH!”

Midori

February 15th, 2011
4:20 pm

illegitimate? only in the sense he’s not proposing real budget reform, the kind required of a leader.

you mean like starting two wars and not paying for them, jm?

that the kind of “bonafides” you talking about?

Joe

February 15th, 2011
4:21 pm

In 21st century America, global warming is not a scientific issue to be debated in terms of CO2 concentrations in the atmosphere or the thickness of Arctic ice. It has become an issue of cultural allegiance.

Very true. For proof, read Kyle Wingfield’s blog. Despite what the experts say (i.e., climate scientists), he’ll deny global warming till the day he dies (of heat stroke).

AmVet

February 15th, 2011
4:21 pm

Oh brother Kam, you do bring some much needed levity to this globally cooled loony farm…

jm

February 15th, 2011
4:22 pm

Midori 4:20 – nope.

josef nix

February 15th, 2011
4:22 pm

“Tribal loyalty”, itself a somewhat insulting term viewed from certain anthropological perspectives and paradigms, is not confined to one side of the political spectrum or ideological viewpoint. It comes just as frequently and just as inanely from left as it does right.

Question the taboos and find yourself excommunicated in a flash. It has been my experience hereabouts on a regular basis whenever I dare to question a deeply held and deeply cherished fiat.

I agree that the question of the President’s citizenship legitimacy is on the wack-o side and makes for a good talking point for castigating “their” lunatics. But it is the less spectacular intra tribu orthodoxy on both sides that is more dangerous.

jm

February 15th, 2011
4:24 pm

Mitch Daniels Is No Panderer
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2011/02/15/mitch_daniels_is_no_panderer_108901.html

Rich Lowry agrees with Jay Bookman (mostly). This must be the end of the world as we know it.

ty webb

February 15th, 2011
4:24 pm

darn it…I tuned in today for a book or movie review, and all I got was this stinkin blog topic. “Illegitimate”?…No. Unqualified?(and no, that’s not coded “racist” language)…Yes.

@@

February 15th, 2011
4:24 pm

jay, you didn’t watch the whole video? More than one nut.

Hang him! Kill him! Feed him to (indecipherable). Gators? Lions? The fishies?

More than 50% of GOP primary voters have said Obama needs to go back to the field? I haven’t seen that.

AmVet

February 15th, 2011
4:25 pm

Spin it how they will, Boehner is the perfect neo-con. Gutless.

At least in the old days, the GOP pr!cks didn’t suffer the idiots in their own ranks gladly.

Now they adore them, even when they play stupid about such matters…

Paul

February 15th, 2011
4:25 pm

Is this kinda like, what is it, half of Democrats aren’t sure if the president is Christian?

Used to be 20-25 percent of people would believe anything. Looks like it’s time to adjust the percentage.

That’s disturbing about Sen Hatch. Wait’ll those voters find out he worked with and got along with the late Sen Kennedy, I mean, the AntiChrist.

I was late to the party downstairs, but listed a couple of questions I’d like to hear thoughtful answers to. Provided a link to all the justice’s disclosure forms, too. It’s a real Paul Harvey “Rest of the Story” thing.

Matti

February 15th, 2011
4:26 pm

YES, y’all.. Please show us that you’re not all as daffy as Orly Taitz! I SO want to believe that Americans have a future with each other, and that we can move forward as a strong nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. (A sweet, romantic notion I know… Is that such a silly thing to hope for?)

Paul

February 15th, 2011
4:27 pm

jm

February 15th, 2011
4:27 pm

Daniels is the anti-Obama. Instead of generalities designed to cater to all audiences and deliberately obfuscating what he’s saying, Daniels is a hard nosed truth teller.

I am dying to see a 2012 election with a choice between a sensible, pragmatic, fiscally conservative leader, and a somewhat rudderless, big spending, previously inexperienced, politician (Obama).

Battle royale. And if Obama wins, we will get what we deserve…

0311/0317 - 1811/1801

February 15th, 2011
4:28 pm

Jay @ 4:12

“it’s already entertaining to see you believe such nonsense, Scout.”

Are you saying the below information is false? If so, I will gladly withdraw my post.

“Bills have been introduced in at least nine states to provide that certain presidential candidates may not be listed on ballots unless a birth certificate is submitted to elections officials. Some of these bills only relate to presidential candidates running in a presidential primary. Others relate to presidential candidates on the November ballot.

Bills that only relate to candidates running in a presidential primary are: Indiana SB 114; and Oklahoma SB 91 and SB 384.

Bills that cover all candidates who seek to run in the general election are: Connecticut SB 391; Nebraska LB 654; Oklahoma SB 540; and Texas HB 295 and HB 529.

Bills that cover some candidates in the general election, but not all of them, are: Arizona HB 2544; Georgia HB 37; Missouri HB 283; Montana HB 205.”

Midori

February 15th, 2011
4:28 pm

jm

February 15th, 2011
4:29 pm

Everyone knows and everyone says popular entitlement programs imperil the country’s fiscal health. Then, the conversation usually ends.

Freshman congressman Bobby Schilling, (R., Ill.) appeared on Meet the Press during the weekend to say that “everything is on the table,” before mumbling and looking at his shoes when asked for details. Pres. Barack Obama took the bold step a year ago of appointing a fiscal commission to study the issue. He hid behind the commission while it was at work, saying he couldn’t pre-empt it; now that it has issued a specific report, he simply ignores it.

Out of this miasma of evasion, Mitch Daniels strides purposefully, walking all over the third rail in his deliberate, plainspoken Hoosier style. At CPAC, he said it’s time to bid “an affectionate thank-you to the major social-welfare programs of the last century.” If the Democratic National Committee doesn’t have this sound-bite already filed away for a negative ad should he run for president, someone should be fired.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2011/02/15/mitch_daniels_is_no_panderer_108901.html

jm

February 15th, 2011
4:29 pm

Daniels advocates “new Social Security and Medicare compacts.” Over time, he wants to change the programs so that they focus on the neediest, grow with inflation but not faster, and feature more flexibility and choice. In pursuit of his overall vision of fiscal rectitude, Daniels is willing to put defense on the chopping block and relegate cultural issues to the far back burner. Conservative sacred cows, too, must go to the slaughterhouse.

jm

February 15th, 2011
4:31 pm

“Spin it how they will, Boehner is the perfect neo-con. Gutless.”

Spin it how they will, Obama is the perfect politician. Gutless.

0311/0317 - 1811/1801

February 15th, 2011
4:31 pm

Arizona Bill’s language:

“Within ten days after submittal of the names of the candidates, the national political party committee shall submit an affidavit of the presidential candidate in which the presidential candidate states the candidate’s citizenship and age and shall append to the affidavit documents that prove that the candidate is a natural born citizen, prove the candidate’s age and prove that the candidate meets the residency requirements for President of the United States as prescribed in article II, section 1, Constitution of the United States.”

Pogo

February 15th, 2011
4:32 pm

Nah. We don’t think he is an illegitimate president because of his birth place. We think he is an illegitimate president because he was created by monied progressives such as Soros and a very loving American media who were enamoured with the thought of a having a black man as president, no matter his qualifications. Soros had one agenda (greed and self-empowerment) and the media had another (the tired old white guilt thing). Obama had no credentials other than being an extreme leftist community Chicago organizer. He also had about 6 months of real time being a US Senator under his belt. Soros saw him for what he was; an opportunity not to be squandered. It is kind of funny though, today I read that a commentator at ABC is now saying that Obama is turning the Whitehouse into a State run Media center and that the conventional media are being excluded thus the Whitehouse is eliminating the usual scrutiny that it has (and needs). Someone in Obama’s camp knows that he and his administration can’t stand up to scrutiny and they are simply by-passing the avenues that provide it. And this is coming from ABC News. Maybe they at last are catching on.

AmVet

February 15th, 2011
4:32 pm

Used to be 20-25 percent of people would believe anything. Looks like it’s time to adjust the percentage.

Gawd help us Paul.

The dumas factor just doubled?

Yikes…

Jay

February 15th, 2011
4:32 pm

States don’t get to decide the legitimacy of candidates for national office, Scout.

Del

February 15th, 2011
4:32 pm

What’s stupid about this thread is you can ask that question of anyone on the street and the honest answer would be that they couldn’t truly know one way or the other. Now depending how the question was asked the interpretation could be inaccurate. For an example if I was asked if I believed Obama was born in the United States, my reply would be that I couldn’t believe it or disbelieve it. It would be left up to the call representative to record my answer in one of the categories. Many would simply record my answer as not believing and move on with the next call. They’re measured on volume not accuracy. Jay are you running out of material? You can do better than this. How about the budget battle.

Midori

February 15th, 2011
4:32 pm

Am Vet,

you doubt all the evidence surrounding your posts? :)

Dave R.

February 15th, 2011
4:33 pm

“Spin it how they will, Boehner is the perfect neo-con.”

Sorry, AmVet, but was asked and he answered. David Gregory is a tool, just looking for a gotcha moment.

Jay

February 15th, 2011
4:33 pm

Del, 21 percent said they didn’t know. The pollsters wrote down their answer and reported it.

AmVet

February 15th, 2011
4:35 pm

jm, just curious do you ever eat anything other than red herrings?

Similar in category, but with darker implications than ignoratio elenchi, a “red herring” is an answer, given in reply to a questioner, that goes beyond an innocent logical irrelevance. A red herring is a deliberate attempt to divert a process of enquiry by changing the subject.

Own it and stop it.

@@

February 15th, 2011
4:35 pm

Paul:

Justice Thomas’ Financial Disclosures are unacceptable. His signature was “blacked out” to protect the “guilty”.

schnirt

Hootinanny Yum Yum

February 15th, 2011
4:35 pm

Jay,

Are you and Cynthia Tucker sharing the same talking points paper? Just curious.

Bud Wiser

February 15th, 2011
4:35 pm

Bookman: …”Tribal loyalty trumps all, even if it means pledging loyalty to something that on its face is ridiculous.>>

Interesting choice of words, Jay.

Perhaps if you take this litmus test and apply it to Democrats and the passage of the soon to be struck down Obamacare, you might want to eat those words.

Interesting also that the typical left wing hypocrisy views that particular choice of words as okay, but if it had been said by a conservative about an Obama program (or this ridiculous budget he has “proposed”), the racial overtones would have been blasted forth from the very same word processor.

Hypocrite.

Paul

February 15th, 2011
4:36 pm

AmVet

What’s amazing in this instance, and several others, is that the percentage of loony things people believe has increased over the last couple of years.

Do ya’ think if Romney manages to get elected, people will think he was really born in England?

Dave R.

February 15th, 2011
4:36 pm

“States don’t get to decide the legitimacy of candidates for national office, Scout.”

Actually, as states set the ballot requirements for ALL races being voted on, they do, Jay.

0311/0317 - 1811/1801

February 15th, 2011
4:37 pm

Jay:

This is from the Georgia General Assembly’s official website on legislation:

“HB 37 Elections; President and Vice President candidates meet Constitutional qualifications”

DO YOU HAVE A COMMENT ?

http://www.legis.ga.gov/Legislation/en-US/Search.aspx

AmVet

February 15th, 2011
4:37 pm

And if had any hair at all “south of the equator”, he would have manned up, looked at the guy and laughingly replied, “These people are friggin’ nutcases! But I don’t care because I need their votes!”

His popularity would have probably soared..

jm

February 15th, 2011
4:38 pm

Dave R – I love meet the press. And Russert was just awesome. But I feel like Gregory is steering more into the gotcha questions rather than asking the hard nosed questions. Meet the Press is supposed to be the “toughest”, as it should stay. I like seeing the hard questions asked.

I don’t know, mixed feelings about it all. I understand why a Republican Congressman only wants to say we need to fix social security, but not provide specifics. Its more than the president will do, and why commit political suicide if the President is going to do anything?

I just feeling like Gregory should ask the hard questions, not let people dodge with answers, but he needs to do a better job on his choice of questions…. I guess.

0311/0317 - 1811/1801

February 15th, 2011
4:39 pm

Dave R.:

It’s going to be interesting to see how much crow Jay can eat on this one ……………… :o

Jay

February 15th, 2011
4:40 pm

No, they don’t Dave. States don’t get to decide whether a candidate meets the requirements of the federal Constitution. That is purely a federal matter.

Even Orly Taitz knows that much, which is why she files her hopeless cases in federal rather than state court.

@@

February 15th, 2011
4:40 pm

Obama’s budget cuts raised some left-wing hackles. They don’t understand why he’s targeting the poor and rewarding the wealthy.

Too funny!

I’m out.

Kamchak

February 15th, 2011
4:43 pm

Even Orly Taitz knows that much…

Oh, snap!

jm

February 15th, 2011
4:43 pm

jesus

Despite all the headlines about Obama embracing austerity, the White House is projecting that federal spending will increase from $3.7 trillion in fiscal 2012 to $5.7 trillion in 2021. In nominal terms, that is a fifty-four-per-cent rise; in inflation-adjusted dollars, it is a more modest seventeen-per-cent increase.

Read more http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/johncassidy/2011/02/obama-bets-on-the-bond-market.html#ixzz1E4AuHeMB

Deficits. As far as the eye can see.

Midori

February 15th, 2011
4:43 pm

and the right wing didn’t care how much money Bush pissed away until Obama became president.

Jay

February 15th, 2011
4:45 pm

And Scout, you’ll note that the sole sponsor of that bill is one Bobby Franklin, who is renowned even among Georgia legislators as a, well, eccentric. He is also the sole sponsor of HB 3, for example, which would require Georgia to pay its bills only in gold or silver.

You and he might make great pals.

0311/0317 - 1811/1801

February 15th, 2011
4:45 pm

Jay:

All I said was it takes only one state to change their ballot process law and have it upheld by the courts and …………………. the fun begins.

Georgia is apparently trying to do that along with other states.

jm

February 15th, 2011
4:46 pm

Midori – yes they did.

Keep up the good fight!

February 15th, 2011
4:46 pm

jm

February 15th, 2011
4:46 pm

“pay its bills only in gold or silver”

Positively silly. Unless I was a government contractor, in which case I’d love the idea….

Midori

February 15th, 2011
4:47 pm

jm – bull crap

Kamchak

February 15th, 2011
4:48 pm

jm

February 15th, 2011
4:48 pm

“pay its bills only in gold or silver”

Wonder how many tax refunds would actually make it to the recipient….. not to mention, would the USPS charge for the extra weight? Although with the value of the dollar such as it is, a few flecks of 24 carat would probably cover most refunds.

Paul

February 15th, 2011
4:49 pm

“Eccentric.”

:-)

So voters give him a majority and elect him and we wonder how half of a certain block believes something else that’s outrageous?

AmVet – time for Panama. By way of Belgium.

Midori

February 15th, 2011
4:49 pm

exactly, Kammy

jm

February 15th, 2011
4:50 pm

Midori / Kamchak – “deficits don’t matter” Cheney is not the Republican Party, or the fiscal conservative wing of the Republican party. Furthermore, part of me suspects Cheney was engaged in Machiavellian Benificent Malevolence with respect to the budget. But that’s another issue for another day.

AmVet

February 15th, 2011
4:50 pm

It’s going to be interesting to see how much crow Jay can eat on this one.

Coming from someone who simply cannot be embarrassed or shamed for having been proven to take, ahem, liberties with the truth, innumerable times on this very forum.

Alriiiighty then…

Wes

February 15th, 2011
4:51 pm

The NY Times reported a little over 10% of voting age people voted in a republican primary. Does 5% of the US voting age population thinking Obama isn’t native sound about right?

http://fivethirtyeight.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/09/14/primary-voter-turnout-stays-low-but-more-so-for-democrats/

Jay

February 15th, 2011
4:51 pm

Paul, Bobby’s actually a nice guy and he happens to be absolutely sincere in these causes. But he is a caucus of one, as they say.

Dusty

February 15th, 2011
4:51 pm

JOSEF,

“Tribal loyalty”??? Anyone who reads the morning koffee klatch on Bookman’s blog knows exactly the meaning of tribal loyalty. You can hear the voodoo drums beating and the bare feet dancing while their leaders blame the “enemy”. The big leader Booboo Kaveman hands out the names to be insulted. It is a jolly crowd full of tribal treachery and mental trajectory.to the lower regions. They hug and embrace each other in the joy of petty parties. Yep,, tribal loyalty at its best. All that’s missing are the nose bones. ( AmVet and KamChak already have theirs.).

Hillbilly Deluxe

February 15th, 2011
4:52 pm

Did they ever figure out if Chester A Arthur was born in Canada or New York?

On Obama:

From what I’ve read and heard, seems to me, he was born in Hawaii. He could probably put all this to rest, if he wanted to. As long as this goes on, he’s smart enough to know it keeps folks distracted from other things, so I figure he’ll let it go on forever..

AmVet

February 15th, 2011
4:52 pm

Paul, talked with my buddy last night and we’re considering taking a trip down there this summer.

he’s been a few times already and somewhat knows the lay of the land.

Recon and senoritas…

JohnnyReb

February 15th, 2011
4:52 pm

The House will hold hearings tomorrow on Obama’s stimulus program. The White House has declined to send anyone. Next step, subpoenas.

Put me in the undecided group on Obama being born in legitimate citizen. Any other would put the controversy to rest by producing his birth certificate, but not the arrogant one.

Please hold the responses that he “has” presented his birth certificate. If he had, we would not be blogging on it today.

Jay

February 15th, 2011
4:53 pm

You’d think a constitutional scholar like Dave R. would know better.

Paul

February 15th, 2011
4:53 pm

Didn’t VP Cheney say deficits don’t matter in a political sense, when it comes to winning elections?

See, if Pres Obama wins reelection, he’ll have proved VP Cheney correct!

LOLOLOL!

jm

February 15th, 2011
4:53 pm

“Tribal Loyalty”

Like the Mantra that Republicans don’t care about the poor….

Keep up the good fight!

February 15th, 2011
4:53 pm

How long before Dusty posts a witch doctor photo?

jm

February 15th, 2011
4:54 pm

Paul 4:53 – bingo.

Del

February 15th, 2011
4:54 pm

Jay, I can believe that a percentage of people would answer, “I don’t Know” that’s a honest answer. My example was if I was asked that question and answered in the example I gave, I could have been recorded as answering that I didn’t believe he was born in the U.S. when I was actually saying that I couldn’t be personally certain. If I was pressed further, which call center people typically don’t do because their work is volume driven my longer answer would have been that while I personally couldn’t say for certain, I would have to assume that he was properly vetted before running for the presidency. That could put me in the “Don’t Know” category or the “yes I believe he was” born here. Polling on questions such as that one often produce inaccurate results.

Midori

February 15th, 2011
4:54 pm

he may not have been the “republican party” but enough of them howled and salivated and parroted that sentiment whenever it suited them.

0311/0317 - 1811/1801

February 15th, 2011
4:55 pm

Keep up the good fight!
February 15th, 2011
4:46 pm

“Race” ……………. no it’s because of his ideology that many Americans want to stop him in any way legally possible !

DJ Sniper

February 15th, 2011
4:55 pm

Let’s go ahead and say it: all this talk about Obama’s birthplace is being done because he’s black. I know a lot of people on here get aggravated when the race card is played, but let’s stop sugarcoating this thing. This is still America, and even in 2011, we still have people who hate the fact that a black man is President. For them, it has nothing to do with his policies, his platform, none of that. The mere fact he isn’t white is enough for them.

I have no issue with people who have honest, legitimate gripes about Obama’s performance as president. Hell, I have a few issues with him myself. People like Orly Taitz and that doctor are in a completely different category though.

Kamchak

February 15th, 2011
4:55 pm

Cheney is not the Republican Party, or the fiscal conservative wing of the Republican party

But the point was that The American Spectator had no problems with it either.

Nor The Weakly[sic] Standard http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/005/245esggv.asp

Midori

February 15th, 2011
4:55 pm

and I must add — until Obama became president.

Dave R.

February 15th, 2011
4:56 pm

“No, they don’t Dave. States don’t get to decide whether a candidate meets the requirements of the federal Constitution. That is purely a federal matter.”

Sorry, Jay, but you’re wrong again. If the states could not set ballot requirements for Federal elections, then there would be no ballot requirements for Libertarians, Greens, Constitution, or Wicca parties – but there are. As such, states can also set ballot requirements for any party at any time, as long as their Constitution allows them to do so.