Aftermath of Tucson shooting as dismaying as actual event
Judging from comments well into Sunday, people still feel a need to vent regarding the tragic shooting Saturday in Tucson. However, before we start down this treacherous road again, let me at least try to put things into context.
First, the attack was perpetrated by a young man who by all available evidence is mentally ill. Anyone who tries to attribute a political agenda of any sort to a soul like that is himself trying to advance a political agenda. It is wrong and disrepectful to the victims of this tragedy to try to distort it for political gain. Please, don’t go there.
However, if the incident itself was not political, there’s no question that the reaction to it became intensely political. What could have and should have been an opportunity to unite as Americans was instead quickly seized as an opportunity to divide ourselves further, to heighten rather than dampen the animosity and vitriol. The reaction told us a lot more about ourselves as a country than did the initial incident, and it was not reassuring.
We like to blame our leaders for a lot of our own shortcomings these days. Congress, for example, has never been held in lower esteem. But the truth is that our elected leaders are doing what we tell them to do. The pettiness and rhetoric in Washington reflect our own selfishness and shortsightedness here at home, and if we don’t like what they mirror back at us, well, blaming the mirror is never the answer.
That said, our elected leadership for the most part has acted appropriately and cautiously in response to Saturday’s attack, perhaps because the violence struck one of their own. Whatever the reason, the poison that infected our discussion over the weekend bubbled up from below, from among us, rather being inspired from above. The ugliness and rancor was our doing, not theirs. We — speaking in general terms — were handed a chance to leap at each others’ throats again, and too many of us eagerly jumped at it.
A lot has been made about the misuse of violent metaphors, such as crosshairs on websites and turns of phrases in speeches. For the most part, that’s nonsense. Metaphors and turns of phrases do not drive violence, and those who try to claim otherwise are again trying to smear their political opponents with innocent blood. They are contributing to the problem they claim to be identifying.
That said, “Second Amendment remedies” is not a metaphor; it is a direct legitimization of violence. American political thought is infected with the idea that violence is a legitimate political tool that can and should be employed at some unspecified point, when some unspecified political actor takes some unspecified political action that crosses some unspecified line. The decision of when such a line is crossed is typically left to the would-be patriot, but always with the suggestion that the line is getting closer, the day is drawing nearer, the threat is growing larger.
That mindset is fed by descriptions of our elected leadership as tyrants or as illegitimate usurpers out to destroy America. After all, once their tyrannical and destructive character is established, violence as a means of addressing the threat to liberty becomes justified. “Sic semper tyrannis,” as John Wilkes Booth so infamously proclaimed.
Again, there is no evidence that Jared Loughner was responding in any way to that ideology rather than to the voices echoing in his own head. But it is foolishness to pretend that others out there cannot be seduced by the false romanticism and heroism inherent in the idea of political violence.
Finally, we as a people need to acknowledge and adjust our thinking to the changing mediascape. We humans have always been afflicted with demagogues, as the ancient roots of that word demonstrate. But the easy accessibility of modern media has done more than give would-be demagogues a louder voice. There is now money to be made and a following to be gained by stripping us of our larger loyalties to the country and instead dividing us into cliques and cults defined by our animosity to each other.
Free and open debate is the lifeblood of democracy, and it is not always a genteel process. But we set the boundaries of appropriate rhetoric when we decide where to place our loyalty and attention. And we will pay the consequences of choosing wrongly.
– Jay Bookman
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627 comments Add your comment
ekerd
January 10th, 2011
11:26 am
md –
Middle of the conservation or not, your comments were still just as ignorant and lazy.
Paul
January 10th, 2011
11:26 am
Oops, not verb, lest the grammarians have a field day. I need a smoothie to get blood sugar back up -
Bosch
January 10th, 2011
11:26 am
UsinUK,
Looks like the pups have succumbed to the snow……they are both passed out on their backs, feet sticking up, tongues hanging out dreaming of bones and rabbits.
Mr_B
January 10th, 2011
11:26 am
BADA; according to Kurt Vonnegut, ther’s Ice9, but you really don’t wnt to see that one.
BADA BING
January 10th, 2011
11:26 am
I don’t want to brag, but I just wrote my name in the snow. In Latin.
LizBeth
January 10th, 2011
11:26 am
While we do need to temper our reaction to the shootings, we do have to acknowledge that words before the rampage did matter. If someone is having an extreme reaction to the political and/or social environment, and they hear others express the same ideology in a violent or “cleansing” sort of way, they may think that a violent act is not only acceptable but necessary. Rhetoric does matter; after all, it is all about identification and persuasion. Sadly, moderate voices are usually the most silent or ignored when sensationalism and extremism is so much more affirming.
Doggone/GA
January 10th, 2011
11:27 am
“Granddaddy used to tell me, “Jody, “e” may be the most common vowel in the English language, but that doesn’t mean every word has to have one!” ”
funny!
Paul
January 10th, 2011
11:28 am
Badus Bingus
“I don’t want to brag, but I just wrote my name in the snow. In Latin.”
Ummm…. what color?
Mr Right
January 10th, 2011
11:28 am
WOW– Jay for the first time in who knows how long wrote something I agree with 100% ! Way to go Jay !
Left wing management
January 10th, 2011
11:28 am
A question for you to ponder:
Note that the root of the word schizophrenic is split. Meanwhile I’m listening to a program where journalists, who by all accounts are psychologically normal, are agreeing more or less with the assertion that our violent political rhetoric is coming overwhelmingly from one particular corner of our political discourse and then in the same breath turn around and say that what they find most troubling is that none of us is willing to admit that we ourselves are to blame and instead insist on blaming the other side for the violence.
I ask you, is this itself not an example of a split that is perhaps just as pronounced as the delusions of the Tucson shooter? Could the real “schizophrenia” be in our political discourse itself?
josef nix
January 10th, 2011
11:29 am
BOSCH
“Since we are going on about grammar, what is the difference between “theatre” and “theater”?
British vs American spelling…now Granny, the turn of the last century schoolmarm always said that the theatER is where you went to see theaTRE…
The little furry ones and the snow…Unmentionable took Mustafa the al Qaaida Terrorist Cat out to see the snow, the feline turned, flipped his arrogant tail, came back in with this look of “I’ve seen it before and I wasn’t impressed.”
Doggone/GA
January 10th, 2011
11:29 am
I always thought “theatre” was French and the English speaking world just misprounounces it?
USMC dawg
January 10th, 2011
11:29 am
I hate to admit it, but with regard to “gun control”, as someone who has been professionally trained with firearms, I found myself stunned at the lack of licensure/training required to own/operate a firearm when I exited the Marine corps and went back to the private sector.
I believe that ANYONE who wishes to possess/own or operate a firearm should not only be thoroughly analyzed for a background check, but MOST IMPORTANTLY required to pass a rigorous training course for safety first and marksmanship and responsibility secondly, sort of like a much more detailed drivers licensure process.
Not to harp but we should also incorporate a drivers license system similar the Germans where the potential licensee must pass a rigorous driving test, written and practical application.
The Thin Guy
January 10th, 2011
11:29 am
After the Fort Hood, Virginia Tech, and University of Alabama at Huntsville shootings, we were told by the liberal press that we should not jump to conclusions about a motive and that even Solomon would have been totally clueless as to what provoked these murders. But when a Democrat congresswoman was the target that all changed. Many attempts have been made by left wingers to blame the demonic dreaded right wing for this horrific and pointless slaughter. Some of the gunman’s rambling posts on the internet might lead one to believe that he was a left winger. Certainly his high school classmates described him as a pot smoking liberal. But I won’t do what the left is trying to do to the right. He was a nut with a gun who desperately wanted someone to pay attention to him. And he got that attention–his posts on the internet have been read by millions. Do the Second Amendment advocates really believe that a mentally unstable person should be allowed to purchase a Glock with a large capacity magazine so that he can efficiently kill and wound large numbers of people in a short period of time? Why not go back to the principles that our republic was founded on that anyone serving in a state militia may own as many mussel loading flintlocks as they wish? Would you extend the Second Amendment right to bear arms to nuclear weapons for kindergartens? The attempt to tar Sarah Palin and the rest of the American right with this tragic attack on a member of congress will eventually fail when it is shown to be totally absurd. The main effect of this will be that members of congress will no longer be willing to meet with their constituents for fear of their life. And who can blame them?
TaF Kaf
January 10th, 2011
11:30 am
Bosch: It depends on whether you speak English or American. Myself? I speak American……….
getalife
January 10th, 2011
11:30 am
Hi Paul.
I had a router go down and your stadium is the best in the country.
Brother called and said Big D got some snow too.
TaF Kaf
January 10th, 2011
11:32 am
USMC dawg
January 10th, 2011
11:29 am
Not to harp but we should also incorporate a drivers license system similar the Germans where the potential licensee must pass a rigorous driving test, written and practical application.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Not to mention the $1500 it costs to GET a license. but then in Germany, they have mass transit that works and bike paths that are wide enough for a whole battalion to run on. Not exactly comparing apples and oranges……..
BADA BING
January 10th, 2011
11:32 am
Paul…..I even dotted the I, and crossed the ts and used punctuation. Talk about control!
Paulo977
January 10th, 2011
11:32 am
Great column Jay …but as you say..
“Free and open debate is the lifeblood of democracy, and it is not always a genteel process”
I guess, because in one way or another we feel guilty so we respond, or react, to free ourselves of the guilt!!
USMC dawg
January 10th, 2011
11:32 am
How many people still make snow ice cream?
(I know it is probably toxic, but boy it taste good)
lovelyliz
January 10th, 2011
11:32 am
For the constitutional “literalist’ who think “well regulated militia” according to the 2nd amendment means any idiot can have as many of any type of gun and can carry it anywhere all with no responsibility/accountablility, that amendment doesn’t mention bullets
@@
January 10th, 2011
11:33 am
It would appear Getalife has gained access to Southern California’s women. Have you also regained access to the AJC blogs, Getalife?
I threw some bread crumbs out for the doves. They all flew away. Now I have to sweep up the bread.
I don’t know nuthin’ bout feeding birds. The one time I put out a bird feeder, the Cajun’s cats killed ‘em all. Who knew bird seed would serve as bait?
I like cats…my husband hates ‘em. Says they’re lazy freeloaders with an arrogant attitude. With a smile on his face, he accused me of killing ‘em with my caring. Since the only thing he can do in the kitchen is boil water, I put a bullion cube on his plate for three days straight.
It’s the thought that counts.
schnirt
Juggy
January 10th, 2011
11:33 am
It is no big secret the Left has been chomping at the bit to blame the Tea Party/Palin on any violent outbreak or attack in this nation on a Democrat politician. The news of this tragedy wasn’t even an hour old and already Left wing pundits were pointing fingers at TP/Palin.
It is refreshing to see Jay call it like it really is – a mentally ill and deranged person who long ago should have been removed from society and put in an institution. It was disappointing, albeit not surprising, that many were the first out of the gate trying to blame the Right before even knowing the facts about this sick individual – which are still coming in.
I think everyone can agree that this is a sad time for America and anyone using this as a political referendum – from either side – is stomping on the memories of the deceased victims.
Dave R.
January 10th, 2011
11:33 am
josef, our Louisiana Catahoula took three steps out and whizzed on our snow-covered driveway.
No long trek to the yard for her . . .
AmVet
January 10th, 2011
11:33 am
md, Utopia was first and foremost a musical concept and expression. All four members wrote, sang lead, had nearly complete free artistic license and even exchanged musical instruments. A pretty revolutionary and yes, Utopian ideal.
His over-arching, lifelong message of discovery, enlightenment, self-empowerment, contribution, compassion and affirmation have remained constant.
So your assertion that attempts at a utopian life are a pipe dream, is perhaps true, but…
In great attempts it is glorious even to fail. ~Cassius Longinus
Doggone/GA
January 10th, 2011
11:34 am
“I believe that ANYONE who wishes to possess/own or operate a firearm should not only be thoroughly analyzed for a background check, but MOST IMPORTANTLY required to pass a rigorous training course for safety first and marksmanship and responsibility secondly, sort of like a much more detailed drivers licensure process”
I wouldn’t dissagree with that, but I have an additional take on it. Given the “2nd amendment” rhetoric…I think EVERY gun owner should be require to be a member of a state militia and attend regular training sessions. Even if they’re handicapped, they can do office work or something, and they can still attend gun use and safety training.
electrician
January 10th, 2011
11:34 am
Josef….you know I dont have that many problems with my fellow cox co-worker J.B,b but, he{and you and I] knew where it was going to go when he posted it,makes todays “cant we all get along”piece seem a little fake.
TaF Kaf
January 10th, 2011
11:34 am
@: @@
Real men know how to cook.
USinUK
January 10th, 2011
11:35 am
Bosch – 11:26 – awwwww! excellent!
we’re having far more pedestrian weather … rain mixed with overcast cloudiness followed by more rain …
USMC dawg
January 10th, 2011
11:35 am
“Not to mention the $1500 it costs to GET a license. but then in Germany, they have mass transit that works and bike paths that are wide enough for a whole battalion to run on. Not exactly comparing apples and oranges……..”
Good point, but they are much better drivers, safer and more responsible than the average driver in the US because they are made to pass rigorous driving tests including written and practical application… but your point is valid.
Matti
January 10th, 2011
11:37 am
AtAt,
Black-oil sunflower seeds are best. (Millet does not get eaten as quickly and tends to attract rodents.) On a day like this, I toss the seed on the snow outside the window, and watch the feathered lovelies for hours.
TaF Kaf
January 10th, 2011
11:37 am
PLUS they know to stay the hell out of the left lane except when they are passing. I miss the autobahn………..
getalife
January 10th, 2011
11:37 am
“It would appear Getalife has gained access to Southern California’s women. Have you also regained access to the AJC blogs, Getalife?
I threw some bread crumbs out for the doves. They all flew away. Now I have to sweep up the bread.
I don’t know nuthin’ bout feeding birds. The one time I put out a bird feeder, the Cajun’s cats killed ‘em all. Who knew bird seed would serve as bait?
I like cats…my husband hates ‘em. Says they’re lazy freeloaders with an arrogant attitude. With a smile on his face, he accused me of killing ‘em with my caring. Since the only thing he can do in the kitchen is boil water, I put a bullion cube on his plate for three days straight.
It’s the thought that counts.”
That is hilarious @@.
Yes, I had to buy a new router.
California women are wild.
Just like I like them.
Very liberal behind closed doors.
TaF Kaf
January 10th, 2011
11:38 am
Matti: Don’t forget that the birds like raw rice like the type thrown at weddings………..
TaF Kaf
January 10th, 2011
11:39 am
getalife: Did you get a D-link?
TaxPayer
January 10th, 2011
11:39 am
How many people still make snow ice cream?
Well, given that the liquid was blown up this way from the Gulf of BP…
cborgia
January 10th, 2011
11:40 am
Just like Good Old Lamar Alexander says, nobody’s to blame because like most violence this is the work of unfortunate mentally ill people. People who make it easy for all those unfortunate mentally ill persons to obtain firearms are complicit in the results. If far right politicians, media jerks, and internet propagandists who created the current situation have no responsibility for Loughner, did people who repeated lies about the Jews all over central europe, paving the way for Nazis by spreading their propaganda have no responsibility for the result? Loughner’s rants about gold backed currency came right out of the tea party and the Paul’s nonsense about the ‘natural basis’ of money. Scott and L’il Larry: how many times have you forwarded email propaganda or passed on right wing garbage that you knew was a lie, or was far-fetched drivel for which you had no evidence?
PS: I had no problem waiting a week for a background check last time I purchased a rifle. Add the NRA to the list of people with a lot to answer for concerning the arming of the insane in Arizona. I suggest that anybody who is member ought to quit and tell them why.
USMC dawg
January 10th, 2011
11:41 am
“Well, given that the liquid was blown up this way from the Gulf of BP…”
Yeah, natural psychedelics… Come on, Where is that Inner Hippy in you?
josef nix
January 10th, 2011
11:42 am
USMC
Made snowcream last night…yeah, probably toxic, but good and full of childhood memories…
electrician
With all due respect, I don’t think he had any idea just how out of hand it would get…
OREP
If you’re still here…question…I was reading a post earlier and the poster had said “a few is..” My “error” light flashed and then I thought, “wait a minute a by it’s nature is third person singular…” and then, “but few by its meaning is plural…” Which is it?
getalife
January 10th, 2011
11:43 am
TaF Kaf ,
The D-Link passed away.
Netgear is the new baby .
The D-Link lived to be around ten years old.
Mick
January 10th, 2011
11:43 am
usmc dawg @ 11:29
I second that….
Also to all the amateur mental health sleuths, the DSM-IV states that “schizphrenic delusions are erroneous beliefs that usually involve a misinterpretation of perceptions or experiences”. A possible explanation as to why he considered her ” non answer” to his question so important to him.
TaF Kaf
January 10th, 2011
11:44 am
Josef:
Many are called, few are chosen.
citizen
January 10th, 2011
11:44 am
How do you go about fixing a broken mind?
USMC dawg
January 10th, 2011
11:44 am
Classmates describe the shooter as “Left-wing pothead”:
http://blogs.phoenixnewtimes.com/valleyfever/2011/01/jared_loughner_alleged_shooter.php
Paul
January 10th, 2011
11:44 am
getalife
Your brother is correct. As all will see tonight on the BCS Championship game.
And that huge tv over the field? The Jerry Jumbotron? It’s 1080p. Incredible.
http://tinyurl.com/4d9t5v5
the original URL was 646 characters. Woulda’ had another record -
md
January 10th, 2011
11:45 am
“Middle of the conservation or not, your comments were still just as ignorant and lazy.”
Context………may behoove you to learn the meaning.
Pancho
January 10th, 2011
11:46 am
I’m a Cisco man myself.
Peter Haskett
January 10th, 2011
11:46 am
Jay. thanks for the article, and I hope for the life of me that we, as a people, will pay more attention to the severe, SEVERE problem of mental illness as it plagues us as a nation. Indeed, I would submit that mental illness is the most costly and tragic disease in our society.
One line that has become far too blurry is the difference between “political” debate and “partisan” debate. The Left v. Right match-up is not a political debate, it is a partisan debate. There is only name calling, no solutions. The shooting was a political shooting, but the motivation was partisan. The individual was a megalomaniac with severe delusions. Medical science has nothing for people like this and they are and have been stigmatized for centuries.
md
January 10th, 2011
11:47 am
usmc dawg,
Your post makes sense, but those willing to follow your guidelines aren’t the problem.
I doubt the thugs/gang members in possession of illegal weapons are going to run down to the nearest testing authority and get with the program…………
Scout
January 10th, 2011
11:47 am
Here’s your motive. Look no more …………………..
TUCSON, Ariz. — “At an event roughly three years ago, Rep. Gabrielle Giffords took a question from Jared Loughner, the man accused of trying to assassinate her and killing six other people. According to two of his high school friends the question was essentially this: “What is government if words have no meaning?”
Loughner was ANGRY about her response — she read the question and didn’t have much to say.”
getalife
January 10th, 2011
11:51 am
Paul,
Everything is big in the big D.
Auburn cheated with a pro quarterback and LSU should be playing tonight.
They dominated A&M Aggies.
USMC dawg
January 10th, 2011
11:51 am
FYI, Jay,
You got a really good “plug” on “The Georgia Gang” (Tv show) yesterday by Jeff Dickerson in regard to your article about the importance of education last week.
@@
January 10th, 2011
11:52 am
Matti:
I can’t feed the birds ’cause there are prowlers among them.
As much as it goes against my beliefs, the mentally ill should be implanted with time released meds. They refuse to take ‘em ’cause they dull the senses. Understandable, but not in their or our best interest.
Whoooaaaaa…that sounded so WRONG!
USinUK
January 10th, 2011
11:54 am
Scout – 11:47 – did you miss the part of the lede that said THREE YEARS AGO?
yes, the guy was a nut, but come on … three YEARS
Dusty
January 10th, 2011
11:55 am
Well, so many true confessions here. Not bad. I hope they are not like New Year resolutions. Here today and gone tomorrow.
Yes, Bookman wrote a nice piece today.
Yes, JOSEF, Bookman knows his job is to stir the pot for boiling and he usually does. Some call that rabble rousing. Does that negate ethics? Does making it “opinion” twist the usual requirements called true journalism?
Yes, RW, one cannot read Bookman’s usual reports without noticing his “slant’ which seems to bring more bloggers. That he is now noticing the excesses of himself & others is a little slow in coming..
Nevertheless, Bookman is NOT responsible for people who cannot seem to control their hate. He is not their moral compass. They must have their own..
OK, I will try to do better myself. (GRANNY Godzilla did a nice confession job this morning. Congrats.
We all learn somethng from this terrible tragedy. We rise from a heavy feeling of sadness for the unjust “wounds” that befall us and our nation. Then we move forward in slow steps as we have done before.
TaxPayer
January 10th, 2011
11:56 am
Is the mail running today. Hey! Don’t look at me. They’re the ones with the motto.
@@
January 10th, 2011
11:57 am
USinUK:
Three years? It was but one of many dismissals that Loughner took issue with. Obsessive thoughts are prevalent in mental illness.
USMC dawg
January 10th, 2011
11:58 am
“I doubt the thugs/gang members in possession of illegal weapons are going to run down to the nearest testing authority and get with the program…………”
I agree with you. An interesting point was made yesterday about Washington DC’s strict gun laws and the number of murders due to hand guns. I forgot the exact number, but DC had more gun killings last week by criminals with Illegally obtained firearms than most or any other city in the US.
Also, the evidence is very clear with regard to the ridiculous gun laws in the UK.
Don’t quote me on stats, but I was shocked at the SURGE in crime shown statistically when the guns were outlawed to the citizenry. Look it up. It is one of the great case studies against strict, nonsensical gun laws that take gun ownership away from responsible citizens.
TaxPayer
January 10th, 2011
11:59 am
yes, the guy was a nut, but come on … three YEARS
Wait a minute. Our elected ones here in Georgia still want to secede from the Union and Virginia is talking about resurrecting the Confederate currency.
md
January 10th, 2011
11:59 am
“did you miss the part of the lede that said THREE YEARS AGO?”
I’d hazard a guess that three years of stewing may have some bearing on the situation……or maybe not.
USinUK
January 10th, 2011
11:59 am
oh, man … in more sad news, Maj. Winters died right after the new year
http://photoblog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/01/10/5804380-farewell-to-wwii-hero-maj-dick-winters-central-character-in-band-of-brothers
(if the rest of you knew this, then I apologize for being behind the curve)
Bob
January 10th, 2011
12:00 pm
Obama will band guns now. Makes sense, since banning cars will keep drunks off the road so they can’t kill people.
Matti
January 10th, 2011
12:00 pm
getalife,
Getoverit. There’s no evidence that “Auburn cheated.” A twenty-yr-old football playin’ college kid (with a creepy preacher dad that he did not choose) wound up playing for Auburn this year. His efforts on the field are both his own and part of a team that wanted to win, and they’re spectacular. No matter who wins the game tonight, it was an awesome college football season for those who watched this kid play.
Matti
January 10th, 2011
12:01 pm
USinUK,
I <3 Dick Winters! Am so grateful to him for sharing his stories.
getalife
January 10th, 2011
12:01 pm
Dusty is back on the wagon.
That kid probably needed to be in a mental facility.
I think we should ask our pols to set a good example for the kids they are stealing from.
RW-(the original)
January 10th, 2011
12:01 pm
With all due respect, I don’t think he had any idea just how out of hand it would get…
josef,
Even if Jay B was naive enough to not know that when he first started blogging he surely must know by now. Think about how many times he’s cautioned about the tone of the debate right in his initial posting. And in case our village idiot is still hanging on my every word I once again didn’t make that left vs. right.
USinUK
January 10th, 2011
12:01 pm
md – like I said – he was a nutter, so I’ll grant that it maybe it was a cause, but three years is a long time between cause and action
@@
January 10th, 2011
12:02 pm
Dusty:
You hit several nails with your 11:55. Granny Godzilla? Never doubt that she’ll be here incognito to deliver what she apologized for.
She’s devious that way.
josef nix
January 10th, 2011
12:02 pm
DUSTY
Opinion is one thing, and is a form of journalism…I have no problem with it on the editorial pages or with the “rabble rousing” attendant thereto. My problem is when it infuses the news page WRITING,,,even the choice of what goes on the news pages is itself selective and oriented to the slant, bias or position of the editorial board…IMHO
USinUK
January 10th, 2011
12:03 pm
Bob – and I’m sure you have evidence that backs up your assertion that Obama plans to ban cars … and guns … we’ll await your link
USMC dawg
January 10th, 2011
12:04 pm
“md – like I said – he was a nutter, so I’ll grant that it maybe it was a cause, but three years is a long time between cause and action”
To you it may be, but to the “mentally” disturbed may be not.
md
January 10th, 2011
12:05 pm
“Auburn cheated with a pro quarterback”
Please pass all proof along to the NCAA……….they ruled there wasn’t any. They may appreciate what you have to provide…………..
Dusty
January 10th, 2011
12:06 pm
JOSEF, is not Bookman a member of the editorial board? I think so. Therefore……
Paul
January 10th, 2011
12:06 pm
getalife
“They dominated A&M Aggies.”
That’s a polite understatement.
LSU should have been playing tonight? One can make a case.
TCU woulda taken’em, though -
Doggone/GA
January 10th, 2011
12:06 pm
“They’re the ones with the motto.”
Nope, it’s not their motto. It’s carved on the main post office building in NYC, but it’s not the motto of the postal service
md
January 10th, 2011
12:07 pm
usuk,
I think the term is “grudge”………..did he have one……time may or may not tell.
@@
January 10th, 2011
12:07 pm
josef:
jay is all about the numbers/comments. Selective in whose are acceptable and whose aren’t.
Dusty
January 10th, 2011
12:08 pm
@@, you are right on top of these things. Let me know the names when some of the favorites here go “incognito”.
USMC dawg
January 10th, 2011
12:09 pm
“LSU should have been playing tonight? One can make a case.
TCU woulda taken’em, though -”
No way Paul, both Alabama and LSU would “smoke” TCU, but hats off to TCU for their victory in the Rose Bowl over a fairly good Big Ten football team.
md
January 10th, 2011
12:09 pm
“LSU should have been playing tonight? One can make a case.”
And I agree with Paul…..TCU could make a better case………….
Doggone/GA
January 10th, 2011
12:09 pm
Looks like snow has it’s uses!
http://www.ajc.com/news/snow-helps-police-catch-800291.html
Road Scholar
January 10th, 2011
12:10 pm
md: “Again, we are dealing with percentages”
I’m sorry, but you can observe someone being crazy and at least suggest/make someone, esp a dependant, go to the doctor. From what we know about this guy, it wouldn’t have taken 5 minutes to commit him!
USinUK: Good Afternoon! Why did you send us the snow we are having? I guess when it was shovled, it had to be placed somewhere? But it’s a great wine chiller!
Shiri
January 10th, 2011
12:11 pm
Blame it on Bush…
Left wing management
January 10th, 2011
12:11 pm
Scout: “What is government if words have no meaning?””
I wonder what the congresswoman’s response to this question was. Doubtless she had no idea that her answer was literally a “your money or your life moment”, with her life literally on the line. As a psychologically ‘normal’ person, she could hardly have realized that the person who asked it meant it with deadly earnestness.
A paradox to ponder:
In the world of the psychotic words have no meaning, the result of which is that words mean everything.
RW-(the original)
January 10th, 2011
12:12 pm
Paul,
I’m sure I’m missing something here, but what are we supposed to learn about the Dallas stadium from a game being played in Arizona?
Joe the paleo-plutocrat
January 10th, 2011
12:12 pm
you folks are missing the point. there are no “thugs”. there are no liberals. there are no tea parties, moochers, producers, or parasites. there are no “mentally ill loners acting alone”. homo sapiens have been using violence to attain political ends since (if you believe Sarah Palin) god and Moses killed all them Egyptians in the Red Sea. bin Laden was an “asset” until he became a liability. Tim McVeigh was a “soldier” until he became a terrorist. John Kerry was a decorated Naval officer until “swiftboat” became a verb. and we all know Lee Harvey Oswald’s back story. “We like to blame our leaders for a lot of our own shortcomings these days”. JB, I can’t believe you actually wrote this. are you telling me it is easier to “blame” a “mentally unstable loner”? wringing our hands over the “motive” behind this crime is like Capt. Renaut being ’shocked to learn there is gambling at Rick’s.’
getalife
January 10th, 2011
12:13 pm
True.
The Horned Frogs are undefeated.
md
January 10th, 2011
12:14 pm
“From what we know about this guy, it wouldn’t have taken 5 minutes to commit him!”
You are aware that for the most part, many states no longer have mental hospitals…right?
We “commit” them and then put them out on the street or release them to family members…….I deal with it on a daily basis…….and unfortunately, the “law” can do nothing until after something occurs………………..they will not, and can not arrest folks that may do something bad.
mm
January 10th, 2011
12:15 pm
“Our gun laws are too restrictive”.
Yeah, right.
USMC dawg
January 10th, 2011
12:16 pm
“True.
The Horned Frogs are undefeated.”
So are the Peewee Redskins at Chastain Park.
AmVet
January 10th, 2011
12:16 pm
College football has been inundated with borderline convicts for a long time now. Players, agents, coaches, alumni and ADs. That this kid has a rap sheet and that his dad is a slimeball, is sadly and barely newsworthy anymore. Especially in the SEC. (Sorry don’t shoot the messenger. You can look it all up.)
Some day, kids will grok that these entertainers are generally NOT role models.
The good news is that the two best teams in the country, this year, go toe to toe tonight…
josef nix
January 10th, 2011
12:17 pm
I’m not out to “defend” the Bruin per se. He’s quite capable of doing that himself as he feels the need. I am saying, though, that like the rest of us, in doing his job, he can get as roll-on-Columbia as any and then, when not playing close attention…all hell can break loose. For reasons of my own, I do believe he is taking a closer look now at what his children are doing and how much he himself has played into that, As far as he being a member of the editorial board, he is that. I would also like to be a fly-on-the-wall there, too, Given the general tone of the AJC, I would say that he is not always in the majority. They could use more introspection and he, I think, could offer that. He does, after all, have a moral compass.
getalife
January 10th, 2011
12:18 pm
“So are the Peewee Redskins at Chastain Park.”
SEC still dominates college football.
patriot
January 10th, 2011
12:18 pm
Violence is never the solution to problems. That is why government solutions always fail – they are based on the premise of violence.
Let’s review. If I advocate a policy that allows the free market and individuals to make decisions through voluntary exchange of money, etc. for goods or services then I am advocating a truly peaceful process.
If on the other hand I do not wish to allow people to voluntarily choose, allow businesses to operate free of government regulations and controls, then I am advocating the use of the government force mechanism, its guns, its prisons, and ultimately the spector of death as a potential punishment for not complying with the laws I wished passed.
Those who “advocate” for the poor, the needy, the “you fill in the blanks” try to pass themselves off as benevolent types with only love and goodness in their hearts yet the first thing they want is for the violent state to pass laws, throw people in prison, steal their money, and kill them if they resist. Just look at how gun-toting FDA agents have raided doctors offices, health food stores, etc. over the advocacy of vitamins and other natural solutions to diseases.
When talking to your ignorant friends on both the left and the right, remind them that one either advocates liberty, freedom, and a peaceful, voluntary mechanism to solve problems, or YOU are bringing guns to the debate.
Violence is the mechanism of the state. That is all it is good at. We who advocate liberty and freedom must never sink to their level. We must educate and encourage our fellow citizens to peacefully withdraw their consent, for that is all that ultimately supports the state and its violent ways.
snoqualmiefalls
January 10th, 2011
12:19 pm
I agree with some on this board this shooter was all over the map in terms of his reading list/ideology, can’t discern his political leanings. What the facts are… is that he murdered a number of people, attempted to murder a member of the Democratic Party, a member of Congress and a member of the Jewish faith. That in and of itself says quite a bit about motive. More later.
USMC dawg
January 10th, 2011
12:19 pm
“SEC still dominates college football.”
Amen, we are so lucky to have the great product that is SEC Football.
Paul
January 10th, 2011
12:21 pm
USMC dawg
I appreciate the point of view, but if you watched the TCU game, up against that HUGE offensive line, TCU adapted, improvised, overcame. Speed and agility. Like one of your USMC units going up against the Army.
Same woulda happened against those other two.
’sides, which, TCU, a school of 9.000…. biggest difference?
TCU football players can read….
USMC dawg
January 10th, 2011
12:22 pm
…”a member of Congress and a member of the Jewish faith…”
I missed the importance of the “Jewish faith” part…
Is the shooter now Anti Semitic?
Paul
January 10th, 2011
12:23 pm
RW-(the original)
You are correct, of course. That would be the Super Bowl.
But I got in the neat interior shot of the stadium -
SOUTHERN YANKEE
January 10th, 2011
12:24 pm
My sense of alarm causes me to wave the “red flag” warning. I’m worried about what we haven’t learned over the past 150 years since the Civil War (War Between the States)ended. Each of our political parties, in some way and fashion, has touted the belief that “I’m right and you’re evil.”
America has new issues. The world is watching us. Our enemies are planning their strategies against us. Perhaps as it was 150 years ago, our way of life and the preservation of our democratic ideal are in danger.
The most interesting part of this story so far emphasizes the political climate of our citizenry. Congresswoman Giffords herself during a recent interview with MSNBC stated, “We’re on Sarah Palin’s targeted list, but the thing is, that the way she has depicted has the crosshairs of a gun sight over our district (map). When people do that, they have to realize that there are consequences to that action.”
Palin has since removed this “crosshair” reference from her website.
Am I implicating the Tea Party movement? Certainly not!!!
But some of their political philosophies and slogans, especially those endorsed by the Radical-Right, will be coming under close scrutiny by the talking heads as this story unfolds. I’ll be watching a lot of FOX NEWS this week and now that I’m retired, I have time to listen to the likes of Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck.
Over the next several days, the talking heads will be speculating about why this happened. There will be tears, endless commentary, lots of blame, and most certainly, a touch of hate here and there. The various pundits from the Far-Left and the Radical-Right will be posturing their positions; each placing blame on the other side.
And the question of protocol will arise again. Have the lessons of the Civil War taught us to peacefully and respectfully agree on how to disagree without bloodshed? Is history doomed to repeat itself?
Perhaps a little out of context but Rodney King, infamous for enduring a police beating back on March 3, 1991 said it best.
“Can we all just get along?”
We’d better learn how to get along with each other and damn quick if America is to survive.
http://thoughtsofasouthernyankee.com/