When the Tea Party wave crashes into D.C. wall

Merry Christmas Jay, the movement has been forced underground until the right time. The organizers actually have jobs that they must tend to. Think of all the democrats that are depending on their labor

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Let’s wait until all those people the Tea Party helped elect are actually in office before we start busting them. Personally, I’m not happy with the bill, and I look forward to the Congress ending that nonsense. And if they don’t, I will be on the streets protesting.

TH- The tax cuts created a ton of jobs until the mortgage mess (which the GOP tried to reign in before being stopped by the Dems) killed the economy. The recession and recent job losses have nothing to do with the tax rates, or have you forgotten the sub prime mess already, in favor of just blaming Bush for everything, even things that he had nothing to do with?

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Jay,
come on, don’t you mean:

Dana Milbank of the washington post OPINES on the education of tea party darling Kristi Noem.

Way to blur the lines.

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“the corporate astroturf “handler” of much of the Tea Party,”

sour grapes here…get your sour grapes here.

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More GOP bashing, for every comment you make about the GOP, one could write just as much about the Dems. Same old story I don’t like your party, my party is better.

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usinUK,
no, I was just throwing out that comment baselessly…I know, it’s a novel tactic, but I thought I’d try.

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ty – “I was just throwing out that comment baselessly”

you’re the first person to ever do that here!

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Tea party comes on the field next year. Issacson and Chambliss should go. Country club Repubs at best.

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I’m not sure which is more noteworthy, the fact that the GOP is overflowing with lying pigs at the trough, or that the silly, naive TPers actually thought they could change them.

Talk about astro-turfed guppies…

Washington (CNN) – Tea Party leaders have “fire coming out of their ears” over the massive $1.1 trillion dollars Omnibus spending bill pending before Congress. Tucked into the legislation that would keep the government running for the next fiscal year are more than $8 billion dollars in earmarks, requested by lawmakers in both parties.

Several top republicans in Congress, including Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell of Kentucky and Sen. John Cornyn of Texas, have asked for millions of dollars worth of earmarks in the Omnibus bill. According to the spending watchdog Taxpayers for Common Sense, Cornyn has 51 earmarks in the legislation totaling $93 million dollars. The group says McConnell’s 42 earmarks add up to $86 million.

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At least the Tea Partyers did not campaign on a hope and change platform. Nosiree! They didn’t want to close the door on more of their same. I just cannot wait to hear what Tom Price has to say about it all.

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TPers actually thought they could change them.

Actually, some of us TPers are still holding onto our beliefs that there is hope for change.

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Shocker… the Tea Party are just core Republicans upset they lost the 2008 elections. Now they won the 2010 elections.

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Sounds like the Tea Party needs some Viagra in their stocking for Christmas. Lots.

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Tea Party…yeah right. The cynic in me thinks it was a ploy to get fools to hand them power. We’ll see if I’m wrong. I fully these astro-turf I mean grass-roots rallies against profligate spending to continue if John Boehner proposes any deficit spending…I won’t hold my breath though.

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Meant to include the word “expect” after fully

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The Tea party scares the left to death and with good reason. As for this monster Omnibus bill it appears that it’s gathering bi-partisan rejection and if so, that would be a good thing.

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Yeah Sid, you die hard republicans are SO into accountability……………..

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BW, I will take a crying Boehner over a far left pelosi any day of the week.

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You people are missing the point. The tea party was having problems with Obama and the Democrates spending money. Now that the republicans are spending it, they are just. “Let the good times roll”. Hadn’t heard a word from them since the election have you?

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No Fred, us Tea Party people are and you saw in the last primaries how we held republicans accountable by voting a few out. Get it straight fred.

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Good Morning All,
To Jay,Granny and Finn you all totally miss the point as usual. I am a Tea Partier and you miss the point. We are not going away until our country gets fixed. We are going to hold Repulicans Feet even closer to the fire if they continue down this roud of OVER SPENDING. We love our country regardless of the party we and are going to get help this country back to the way is should.Even if it means we voteing everyone out again. Time for Both Parties to unite as Americans. Life,Liberty and thePursuit of Happiness. Have a great day everyone.

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End the income tax and end the Federal Reserve and the problems go away. With no money to spend on their friends or to use to buy votes, the american people will begin to be free again and congress will be made to make the hard decisions that will ultimately lead to a government that remains within the limits supposedly imposed by the constitution.

Yeah, like any of that is going to happen voluntarily. Only the imminent collapse of the dollar will achieve anything close and we will all suffer when that happens.

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Although I don’t expect things to change. The tea party has little to do with earmarks proposed by Cornyn and McConnell. Neither was up for reelction in November, therefore neither was supported by the tea party. Again, I don’t expect things to change when these tea party backed candidates enter office in the coming year(I say tea party backed, because their is no formal “tea party”. A fact that many on this blog can’t seem to grasp). Not saying they(tea party backed candidates) won’t be hypocrits, but let’s just wait until they actually take office.

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So the ATTPers endorse and vote for known and proven pigs and then say they will vote them out of office if they act like pigs.

Good times in Delusionville…

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realtalk, don’t waste your time. They see only what they want to and hear only what blow hards at msnbc, cnn and the big three shove into their little minds. We have a plan and we will work it.

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Really Fred, and what lobbyists would that be?

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“With no money to spend on their friends or to use to buy votes, the american people will begin to be free again”

heeheehee … misplaced modifier fun for your Thursday …

thanks for the unintended humor patriot …

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Redneck, we need to get rid of the republican earmarks as well. Once again they have hit us with a 1900+ page bill that cost over a trillion dollars and they don’t want us to know what is in it. If it takes shutting down the government to get this cut, then so be it.

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You are right BW, it starts in January. Until then it is pelosi and reids show. You have been keeping up with the current 1900 page bill, haven’t you?

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Jay and AmVet, at least the Tea Partiers have tried, is the Obama change working yet? All he has done is lie since he has been in office and I know you won’t challenge that because I will show you many examples.

I am against earmarks all 6,700 of them, but guess what sport, a lot of them are from Democrats and I don’t see either one of you vilifing them, what hypocrits.

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“Remember the absolute joy that many of these disgusting right-wing dirtbags showed when Kennedy died…”

Name one, AmVet.

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Doggone – 9:48 – thanks – you just gave me an excuse to dust off this classic

http://fupaper.files.wordpress.com/2009/03/newt-gingrich-baby.jpg

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jm, great comment. The dems had total control starting under Bush and look where we have gone with the debt? Obama is not that stupid, he will move a little to the middle. Maybe not as much as Clinton because he is not a politically smart as he is but, a move none the less.

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USinUK – funny! I had forgotten about that one!

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Sorry normal, I do NOT get all my info from FNC. I gather it from all around the globe. Nice try at the fox news lies label.

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@@…..ditto.

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No realtalk, we will grow every year and we will hold all parties responsible for their actions. I will vote for a dem who is for the economic issues we support over a republican who is not. That’s pretty simple.

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Realtalk

I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt but if I had money on it I say the Tea Party goes the way of those who voted for Perot in 1992.

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I notice he didn’t deny that he didn’t read Jays essay…

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Granny Godzi – “gonna require a real big veterinarian.” Yeah, with 300 million teets, you’re right. The big heifer needs a diet or to be put down.

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Tea party faux popular movement has a chance to rear its ugly head and fight this irresponsible bill but they are like an ostrich with its head in the ground, why? Because they aren’t a real movement but rather a manipulated group of disgruntled, confused, far right repubs – the worst of america. Besides, the media including fox are bored with them.

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carlos, if that is true what you said then you should love us. That is the same thing obama did and look how he turned against you.

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Christmas? I thought Christmas lost a war and is now gone for good….

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Time for Both Parties to unite as Americans. (My) Life,(My) Liberty and the Pursuit of (My) Happiness.

There, fixed your typos.

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…state of Louisiana, newly elected congressman Jeff Landry was the Tea Party’s poster boy for opposing the Washington culture of bowing to special interests. On election night, he told his followers that it’s going to be a new day in Washington, and “we need to get our country back on the right track.” Three weeks later, Landry was in the heart of Washington at the posh Capitol Hill Club on the hunt for Washington campaign dollars. He’s two months away from even being sworn into office, yet Landy is asking for money from K Street lobbyists and other Washington power brokers.

Getting to visit with Landry doesn’t come cheap. The high priced “meet and greet” with the new Louisiana 3rd District Congressman carried a price tag of $5,000 for the “PAC Gold Level; $2,400 for the individual Gold Level; $2,500 for the PAC Silver Level, and $1,000” just to get in the door. All of a sudden, just weeks after getting elected, many new congressman like Landry found that Washington went from a “cesspool” when they were campaigning, to a “hot tub” once elected.

Meet the new boss, same as the old boss….

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Live Free of DIE.

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Tea Partiers, here’s the plan. What you want to start doing RIGHT NOW is keeping track of all the pork and earmarks those up for election in 2012 are putting in over the next two years.

Keep a database so you and your buds don’t forget when the next election rolls around.

That’s the plan!

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The GOP continues to make its supporters just look plain silly.

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Logical Dude

Logic doesn’t win elections….the perception of a false reality does

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I am a Tea Partier and you miss the point. We are not going away until our country gets fixed.

You could save money on rental space for your meetings if you coordinated your activities with the FairTax crowd, for starters. And if you’re willing to work in a little anti-abortion message in with those tax cut hymns, the sky’s the limit.

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jm

you have that whole fixed thing backwards don’t ya?

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“This is Not Ross Perot. Different time in our country”

yeah. cuz this time they MEAN it

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What the rise (and fall?) of the Tea Party illustrates more than anything is the increasing need on the part of the right wing to employ a politics of pure theater to keep the masses narcotized and impose a continuation of its failed economic status quo, which has brought utter disaster in the 2008 financial collapse.

The question is, was the Tea Party ever anything independent of the right at all, did it ever have anything genuinely independent and new to offer, or was it spawned from within the right simply as a cynical ploy to provide an ingenious diversion from the fact that the American right wing emperor has no clothes, a diabolical effort to convert its moment of absolute defeat into its greatest triumph by masking once and for all the terminal stage of American capitalism.

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Del,

“I don’t recall conservatives on here or anywhere loudly cheering when Ted Kennedy passed away.”

Yeah, they were too busy calling him a murderer.

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Realtalk

Which freedoms? Both parties are responsible for that…the usual stuff from the left about guns and healthcare and from the right the Patriot Act and all the others mechanisms that are there for our “protection”. So which group is more offensive to you? You want to bash the left for impinging for your liberty and freedom that’s fine but don’t pretend that both parties aren’t the same game.

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The majority of republicans are weak brained and weak spined, so what’s new…

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Sid Farcas

December 16th, 2010
10:03 am

Start with your man in the WH.

AGAIN—FOR THE UMPTEENTH TIME

I supported Juan McSame in the last presidential election, sport.

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mystified

Georgia had their chance with Chambliss. But guess what? No one would challenge him and of course no one is going to vote Democratic in a state-wide election. I saw these same screeds about Chambliss being a RINO in 2008 and guess what…overwhelming re-election margin. Who is even a better alternative? Politicians join a party for a reason and they will adhere to the party line in general if they want the party’s support.

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Granny Godzi 10:03 – sure don’t.

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Its hard to belive what a fool belives….

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Bill Orvis White

Yes keep blaming the Dems but the reality is that the Republicans have almost unchecked power in this state and will have supermajority status after the gerrymandering I mean redistricting is complete. I don’t even think bashing Dems makes you feel better about the fact that Republicans end up being the same…it’s sad when you think about it. Me…I prefer cynicism.

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“holy crap. are you kidding???”

Probably not. That’s the beauty of having a VERY selective memory.

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Doggone – 10:13 – or, it makes you wonder what they believe is “respectful discourse”

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Until election finance is overhauled big time, there will be NO change in DC regardless to whether it’s the Tea Party, Coffee Party, Enema Party, or whatever Party. Pull away the one thing that feeds and enables the corruption, and you have a chance to remove the corruption. Until then, it’s all Kung-Fu Theater courtesy of the Bejing Opera Company…

/drive-by

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Yep, they sure “rolled” the president, by FORCING him to accept tax cuts for the wealthy.

I guess it kind of makes sense from a small government perspective. The government takes less of THEIR MONEY, and tax cuts don’t REALLY add to the deficit if you just move the revenue goal posts….

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the “Enema Party”? Now that’s a movement I could get behind!

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Bosch:

And your circle remains unbroken. Hygiene dictates that you wash your hands, you silly little twit.

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AmVet: As for your invitation to a red herring breakfast regarding the sins of others, especiallyt he Uppity Muslim, which I have addressed at length here, I’m not hungry…

Well said. Love it.

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the “Enema Party”? Now that’s a movement I could get behind!

You might want to get out in front of that crowd but if you’re really interested, check with Dave R. He’s the local chapter leader of the Constitutional Party.

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ex-pat and Doggone, even the hint of an assertion that the ecstatic venom from the hateful fringe wasn’t overflowing the day T. Kennedy died, is just plain idiotic.

Andy and many of the other trolls here, drive by as well as the regulars, had a freaking field day! Notwithstanding the puerile denials.

I have a good friend who repeatedly sent my far right wing emails. I endured them for a long while, but eventually I asked him, a couple of times, to stop sending them to me. They continued. And the day after TK died, he sent me one with the most viscous hatred I have read in some time, and I sent him a very forceful response. And he got the message and the emails stopped, with a quasi-apolgy. Though still long time friends, my respect for him dropped enormously that day…

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The Tea Party seems to be made up of a bunch of gullible rubes.

What a shock!

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The Tea Party is moving forward with it’s agenda to make America great.

We are fighting Obama socialism by getting Obamacare declared unconstitutional.

Tea Party: 2
Obama: 0

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Only the GOP will eat a crap sandwitch, knowing its a crap sandwitch but say its better than a dog crap sandwitch…

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“When the Tea Party wave crashes into D.C. wall”

Another case of ‘welcome to reality.’ The administration experienced it, this group of cons is experiencing it. I suppose the question isn’t if they will bend, but how much.

On a related note, was going thru the AM dial and tuned in to Hannity. Couple days later I tuned into the top-rated local DFW radio talk show. In both cases they had on conservative politicians. The questions and answers were all general ’spending bad, taxes bad, gotta cut.” Absolutely at no time did either host ask “okay, you campaigned on that, you got elected on that, Republicans swept the House and made a huge gain in the Senate. Now… specifically… by program and amount… just what are you going to cut to balance the budget?”

And the listeners suck it up….

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I should also mention it’s a ridiculous argument to suggest that “we shouldn’t do DADT/DREAM-Act/anything-else now because ECONOMY!” GOP, you’ll have your chance to fix the economy. You are already getting the tax breaks for the wealthy, that supposedly fix the economy all by themselves. Relax.

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barking frog 10:23 Probably….

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lobbyism system of government, all the freedom money can buy. I just hope the GOP can keep these useless wars going. After all the control of oil is what backs the dollar. Some people want to go back to the gold standard but oil is what you spend your gold on. The earmark BS, the gay BS, the immigration BS just smoke to keep the sheep from waking up. We should be OK because the body guards of Big oil is paid in dollars and oil is trade for on the world market in dollars. The oil man Mr Cheney said debt don’t matter he may be a killer but he’s not a fool. The dollar is back by oil and the world is taking all the dollars the fed is pasting out. Peace on earth ,all I want for xmas is oil stock.

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Jay, the incoming Reps and Senators have not even taken office yet; the complete disregard for deficits, fiscal restraint, and good common sense being displayed in this lame duck session is exactly why the November elections were historical………….

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Why does TH always say the same ignorant thing every day?

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Dear Congress, please vote on this bill so I can go on vacation again, I only have two more years to enjoy all these perks.

Signed, The President

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Calculations from the Congressional Budget Office say last week’s tax deal will cost the Treasury $858 billion over the next decade in lost revenues and extra spending.

Republicans! Can’t live with ‘em. So, Heeere’s Johnny! Dang it, I mean, You can’t Handle the Truth.

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Anyone that supports the Dems way of thinking is just plain STUPID!

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There’s a fascinating discussion right now on the Diane Rehm show (unavailable on Atlanta airwaves, see website) on the so-called No Label movement.

My judgment of this whole “third way” or “No Label” type of movement: thumbs down

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I hate, or very very very much despise our politicians….. they collectively are ruining our country in the interest of staying in office.

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F. Sinkwich
December 16th, 2010
9:50 am

Name one, AmVet.

As always, you lose.

Bud Wiser
August 26th, 2009
9:19 am

This is a little more on topic here: Well, well, well. Teddie died, and most of the world is rejoicing, er, I mean, in mourning. A fruit basket arrived early this morning from Mary Jo Kopeckne’s family, welcoming Teddy to join their daughter in The Great Dirt Nap.

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Del,
This from the Navy Times and mentions only Amos as opposed. McCain does say he’s opposed to a cultural change while fighting two wars, but I say, “Then let’s bring them home. They don’t need to be there anyway.” That time is long passed.

http://www.navytimes.com/news/2010/12/ap-house-takes-up-repeal-of-ban-on-gays-in-military-121510/

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Jay – well, a fair number of the folks here seem to hate and despise the rich, although they may not have said so outright. Claiming most of them are crooks, don’t deserve their fortune, yadda yadda, which some of them undoubtedly are, but nowhere near the majority. There are certainly a good number of folks here that have a very Greek mentality and just outright have class envy.

I may have overstated my point earlier. But I still think it holds….

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jm

“They’re getting that Medicare tax hike, which they will never receive the benefit for or use. Just a reminder from your friendly tax analyst….”

Tax analyst? You sure? Medicare is not income-dependent. You get SS, you get Medicare. If you meant Medicaid, that is income dependent. But Medicare isn’t.

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What’s with all of the crying in The White House? Read more @imeanwhat http://imeanwhat.com/canyoubelieve/the-blubbering-republicans

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There are plenty of others, Sid. Let me know when you’ve had your fill of crow breakfast…

NRB
August 26th, 2009
9:26 am

One socialist scumb*g down, millions to go.

Ted Kennedy did more harm to this nation than a thousand 9/11s could possibly do.

Good riddance.

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AmVet, 1,000 dittos.

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Yes you can! (count on one hand the regular conservative commenters here on the Bookman blog). On the other hand, they’ve got one cross-fingered hand in their pocket and the other is flashing a peace sign. But they Kid Obama. Health Care? The conservatives are checking their list twice, but there’s only one item on that list: Kill the Bill. Why save lives when their god, Pure Capitalism, teaches them how to pray with kinder gentler ways of euphemising collateral damage which is as Kind and Gentle as the five point palm exploding dong technique. The country has finally completed all of the five steps from grief to acceptance since 911. The conservatives have shown their sticky, viral hands like surprise kitten porn.

Hey, we finally know what their doing with the hand in their pocket.

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ken R… See AmVet’s 10:48 post.

In other Tea Party news…

They are indeed upset over the pork-ladden bill. They’ve even said as much…

It sounds like “hyporkrisy” to Tea Party Express Chairman Amy Kremer. Her group backed GOP candidates in the 2010 election who promised to root out wasteful pork-barrel spending in Washington. She warns any republican who supports the measure risks a primary challenge in the next election cycle.

“We will go after them. We’re not going to accept it. We are absolutely not going to accept it. I mean there are all kinds of pork in there,” Kremer told CNN.

In related news, Tea Party Express Chairman Amy Kremer revealed to CNN that her group is nothing more than a subset of the GOP further invalidating the claim of the Tea Party not being GOP in a different dress.

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“And on Tuesday afternoon, she was the guest of honor at a “Meet & Greet” with Washington high-rollers at the powerhouse lobbying firm Barbour Griffiths Rogers. Once these boys start throwing money at Noem’s feet, she’ll soon be chin deep in lobbyist greenbacks.”

So, going to a function is now assumed to mean one will be rolling in greenbacks??

If one is going to find the individual guilty, at least wait until they have committed the crime………

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jm: “Claiming most of them are crooks, don’t deserve their fortune, yadda yadda, which some of them undoubtedly are, but nowhere near the majority.”

One’s attitude towards the rich per se is beside the point. The problem is the system that perpetuates an imbalance of advantage and power and concentrates it in the hands of those who own the means of production and who, when they can’t buy politicians outright, can use their money to buy the message (see Citizens United decision, e.g.).

“here are certainly a good number of folks here that have a very Greek mentality and just outright have class envy.”

What is “class envy” exactly? Where did this phrase come from?

Tell me how this term which is thrown around so freely is anything other than an Orwellian right wing attempt to mask class predation behind a seemingly innocuous term (I mean, who wouldn’t want to be free of something so petty and unattractive as envy?) ?

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TaxPayer 10:57 – I don’t have the stamina to go hunting around the archives. There’s a good balance of conservatives, moderates, and liberals bouncing around here. But there are some folks who seem inclined to think sticking it to the rich is the best way to go.

I remember having to argue with someone here that even if you increased the taxes on the rich to 100% (and they didn’t quit working miraculously), there still wouldn’t be enough revenue to close the fiscal deficit.

That kind of silly, inane, discussion is only necessary with someone inclined to believe the best solution is stick it to the rich. It displays an appalling lack of understanding of economics, incentives, and ignorance about the federal budget and deficit.

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Taxpayer – LWM 11:03 – there’s exhibit A, don’t even need the archives.

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IMeanWhat @10:52am
Great link!

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Taxpayer – LWM 11:03 – there’s exhibit A, don’t even need the archives.

jm,

You might wish to consider referencing posts that support your claims. Just sayin’

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Paul 11:03 – go do the math. If you think someone who makes $1million per year (not counting the much higher income folks), for 40 years, and pays an extra 1% in tax on said income, will use the $400,000 (not adjusted for inflation at all, and not even counting the other 2.9% / $1.1 million in Medicare taxes they’ll pay ) in health care costs before they kick the bucket, especially when said individual is likely to go use a private non-medicare doctor anyway for any really life threatening issue, well then I can’t help you.

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So where are we now?
——–

That’s kind of a stupid question. We’re in a place where Democrats still have huge majorities in both houses. You insult your readers with such posts.

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TaxPayer 10:57 – I don’t have the stamina to go hunting around the archives.

You could have sent me a KISS. Something like “I got nothin’” would have sufficed.

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TaxPayer – apparently you have a selective reading problem…. are you sure both hemisphere’s are working? I’d suggest contacting a doctor.

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TaxPayer 11:07 – to quote a nutball – “there’s your sign”

And once you’ve sent me that one KISS, you should just reference it with something like, “See my 11:11am post.” K.

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TaxPayer – apparently you have a selective reading problem…. are you sure both hemisphere’s are working? I’d suggest contacting a doctor

OR, you could provide quotes from that post-post that you chose to reference, in a most untimely way I might add, and demonstrate with that prowess of yours precisely how I have a selective reading problem. I anxiously await.

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Realtalk, I hope you are for real, because the politicians need to be reminded just who it is they work for. They so often seem to forget.

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It seems kind of odd that while many of “the rich” themselves have been saying that they don’t need the controversial tax cuts, those in the middle class who would like to count themselves among “the rich” keep on defending those tax cuts and deriding any taxation of wealth as “sticking it to the rich.” Is it because too many people incorrectly like to count themselves among the rich. Here’s a clue — if you know how much money you earn every year, you’re not wealthy.

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Paul – averages buddy. Like I said, I don’t think I can help you. The average person doesn’t use $300,000, or $1.4 million in medical costs before they die. Your anecdote not withstanding.

And if you don’t understand that HC inflation can’t continue at its current pace or in 40 years the only industry we will have in the US is health care, then again, I can’t help you.

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Notice how ‘jm’ ignored my calling him out on the use of this phrase “class envy”?

Must be painful to acknowledge that one’s head is stuffed with pseudo-ideas — the anti-ideas that are roughly the equivalent of anti-matter in physics — that have been put there by people who have an interest in seeing to it that people don’t think.

Narcotization of the masses marches on …

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It the rich wanna-bees that are seem to be fooling theirselves…

In the end when the bill comes due, if its me or someone thats loaded, let them get most of the bill. They can handle it. If they don’t like it, thats fine.

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LWM 11:22 – I can only try to help so many off-base people at a time. You need some help too?

Apparently you think Caroline Baum, and the whole Right and Moderates are crazy for recognizing that D’s (the WH among them) are engaged in class warfare. Well buddo, you’re in the minority. Enjoy, keep yelling…..

“Unlikely. Class warfare has never been a big seller in the U.S. for the simple reason that most Americans aspire to being rich or achieving some degree of financial security. ”

http://noir.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601039&sid=a.AcZkGx6mr8

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Tea Party = Tool of GOP
Now about these taxes, when are we going to stop torturing the top 2%-the millionaires & billionaires of this country? Why, why, why must they continue to be punished for being successful? The tax rate for these suffering folks is too high and should be lowered immediately! Since they create most of the jobs in this country, I say we lower their tax rate to 0%!! Then they can create lots & lots of new jobs and solve the unemployment problem. Please have mercy on them, haven’t they suffered enough?

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I don’t believe AmVet is a Republican…

In my best Ed McMahon voice, “You are correct sir!”

I came of age while Tricky Dick and Spiro were doing their excellent criminal imitations.

Then I endured the miasma and likewise criminal debacle called Reagan/Meese/North.

Then for the icing on the cake I witnessed the eight worst years for the republic in my lifetime under the serially impeachable W(orst ever).

I guess I just don’t lack the moral courage to be one…

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“Don’t you know who should pay ? It’s Suzzy, she has the money and poor little Johny doesn’t!”

Yeah………shame on me for not realizing Johnny is just a “poor thing”…………..

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My neighbor had a heart attack and got hit with hundreds of thousands in medical bills. They had to file bankruptcy. By the way, they’re pretty average.

Another friend of mine had cancer and the bill after all treatments was hundreds of thousands of dollars. Fortunately, Wal-Mart’s insurance policy actually covered most of it.

Another acquaintance had an outpatient non-life-threatening surgery that lasted maybe an hour or so followed by two days in the hospital for observation and that one cost over twenty thousand. I could go on and on and on but what’s the point given that some people choose to ignore the facts in favor of their own self-proclaimed “truths”.

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“Good grief! Aren’t there enough off-topic comments in this thread without digging into the archives? Get a life. Or exchange e-mails so everyone else doesn’t have to read this crap.”

Or don’t read it……..

Those pesky choices again.

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I guess if you don’t like paying income taxes, you could choose to work for low pay, but then you would have to choose to eat or not…

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Say it with me until you get it:

Choices alone do not make people rich.

There, don’t you feel better? The first step is to admit you have a problem.

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jm 11:20 “averages buddy”
??????????

I’m always amazed when people trot out their professional qualifications, make an absolute remark such as 10:34 “They’re getting that Medicare tax hike, which they will never receive the benefit for or use” then qualify their remark (11:09 “If you think someone who makes $1million per year… especially when said individual is likely to go use a private non-medicare doctor anyway for any really life threatening issue) with no data to back it up, then at 11:20 resort to “averages, buddy.”

Fact is, you asserted rich will NEVER get back or use the program. Then you said they could, but wouldn’t. At 11:20 you began speaking of averages. Which is it? The rich will NEVER use Medicare, or they will NEVER get back what they contributed, or the AVERAGE cost per rich person will not equal contributions?

Your last paragraph at 11:20 isn’t on topic – just an attempt to illustrate “I’m smart and you can’t be helped.”

Is this what you tell your clients?

“You’ll never get questioned on that deduction.”
“Ummm… you’ll never have to pay more in taxes than the deduction is worth.”
“What I really meant is the average amount you’ll probably have to pay…”

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@md
So you’re trotting out the tired old argument that people choose to be poor? Or choose to be rich? Or choose to be unemployed? Do they also choose to get laid off in a down economy? Do they choose to get cancer and have to spend their life savings on costly medical care?
Where do the choices end?
If only people would choose not to be blinded by the politicians and spin doctors who want them to believe that taxing people who can afford it is class warfare.

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“Choices alone do not make people rich.

There, don’t you feel better? The first step is to admit you have a problem.”

Hmmm………..but they sure as heck will prevent them from having the opportunity to be…………

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“So you’re trotting out the tired old argument that people choose to be poor? Or choose to be rich? Or choose to be unemployed? Do they also choose to get laid off in a down economy? Do they choose to get cancer and have to spend their life savings on costly medical care?”

Read it again……..we choose everything we do…………….

Never known anybody to choose to get cancer (actually, some smokers do), or get laid off.

But, we do choose how we react to every situation thrown at us………………..everything one does on a daily basis is a choice, and choices are compounding…………..look at oneself prior to looking elsewhere…………………..

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“Anyone want to take my bet?”

If you do have money laying around to wager? Do us all a favor, and raises taxes on yourself.

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anyone else have a problem posting on the blog? or just me?

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Paul 11:36 – I tried to post a response, twice. Something going on tech – wise.

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Let’s see, I will give you ten hardly workly Republicans in exchange for your purchase of an additional $100 in US treasuries and I’ve got plenty more where those came from. Deal?

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adam,
no excuses, I just want you to pay your “fair share”. And our deficit needs your money too.

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The bigger question is what will become of the Revolutionary War costume manufacturers? Will the Orange Pekoe Brigade stick with their penchant for dressing up, or will they go the more liberal route and wear suits?

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ty webb: Now that that is settled, care to comment on whether or not you’d take my bet, and what leads you to believe you are on the winning side of the bet if you DO take the bet?

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jm: “Apparently you think Caroline Baum, and the whole Right and Moderates are crazy for recognizing that D’s (the WH among them) are engaged in class warfare. Well buddo, you’re in the minority. Enjoy, keep yelling…..”

I invited you to engage in a serious discussion of what this notion of class warfare actually is, but you seem to prefer repeating assertions that what this or that political player is doing amounts to class warfare. But that begs the question of what class warfare really is. To my mind, a system that rewards crony capitalism and reckless financial speculation is engaging in class warfare.

Btw your assertion at 11:17 that corporate tax rates are an urgent remedy to our tax woes is misguided. As I said yesterday on Wingfield’s blog, this obsession with the nominal corporate tax rate ignores the effective tax rate, which is the amount that corporations actually pay after all their myriad loopholes and schemes.

The right is fond of throwing around the assertion that a whole class of American individuals pay no income taxes. But how silent they fall when it comes to pointing out how many corporations do not pay corporate income taxes. Ironic – don’t you think? – considering that since the Citizens United decision the principle has been enshrined that corporations can now be treated just like an individual for legal purposes. Funny how that works.

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WAY off topic, but what version of Wordpress is this, and do the difficulties here mean I should consider Drupal instead of Wordpress for a blog of my own?

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Bloody Yank
August 28th, 2009
9:47 am

One less drunken, philandering, murdering, liberal dirtbag. I’ll drink to that!!

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LeftWingHata
August 26th, 2009
10:17 pm

Ole’ Kennedy was quite the drunkard. Yes, let us not forget the biggest losers in the wake of his death. That is the D.C./Boston area liquor stores. I easily predict a 20-25% drop in whiskey/scotch sales in the area. Also, I hear Johnny Walker is coming out with a limited edition bottle with a picture of an intoxicated Senator lying on the Senate floor with his pants half down…

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NOBAMA12
August 26th, 2009
4:07 pm

TED WAS A SLIMMY STAIN OF THE FABRIC OF AMERICAN POLITICS. FINALLY HE GOT WHAT HE DESERVED SO MANY YEARS AGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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jm 11:50

We’ve discussed that before – all the stats about % of health care costs associated with last few months… AND those who say “if I’m in that situation I’ll say ‘pull the plug.’ But when the time comes it’s “okay doc, anything else we can try?”

Earlier posts – I’ve a thing about absolutes and generalizations to include a majority, especially when comments come from people who say they’re in professions where accuracy in detail is paramount. I’ve known a number of people in that category you reference and they generally will use Medicare IF their current doc is in the program. I’ve also looked at the numbers, been a while, not the tweaking from the new law, and my impression was, regardless of what was paid in over the years, it doesn’t take long for a significant number of elderly to blow past those numbers.

Also had a similar discussion with a very rich, very successful, very hard-working, smarter than nearly everybody else, financial genius (his words) Clint Eastwood fictional character wannabe who took the same position with Social Security – that the ‘rich’ would never get back what they paid in. Trouble was, he made the going-in case that SS is an investment club, not an insurance program. And I don’t think he ever got the concept of ‘discounting’ or ‘present/future values.’

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pat
August 26th, 2009
1:44 pm

The man’s a murderer, he should have died in prison not in any honor what so ever. I’d rather Michael Vick be a senator than Toastied ted.
The country is better off with out him.
The people who are mourning the most? Vodka makers.

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With the election of the new Republicans in Nov, I understood the leadership of the Repubs promised that all the EARMARKS were to be eliminated!! What happened?? Also this LAME_DUCK session is BS!!! These politicians are not accountable to any one at this time, they should have NO voting rights!! ELIMINATE this LAME-DUCK session!! Signed – A CONSERVATIVE

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Earmarks and lobbyists! Oh my!

Good to see national Republicans finally coming around. You will love the Georgia Republican model. Wait ’till you get in on some Georgia Republican style ethics!!!

In Georgia a short-skirted utility lobbyist is important. We have Sonny land deals, Sonny Loans, Sonny Highways, Sonny tax breaks. We just voted in a bankrupt-ex-Democrat-career politician-corrupt US congressman as our next Governor. We will honor his no-bid government contracts with honor. We watched our State School Superintendent get a face lift with stolen deaf school funds. We watched Oxendine make a mockery of his office. We notice the mysterious exile forced on Cagle. We have crooked Georgia Power legislation. We have no problem with the FDIC picking up the tab for all of our failed banks. We love, love love lobby pork.

We don’t need a Tea Party in Georgia. Now that Republicans have some more power the national Tea Party can stop pretending. The buck don’t stop here, move along.

The party is on.

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jm 12:06 & 12:07

And just before that I had hopes you didn’t fit in the ideologue category…..

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Paul 12:08 – I’m against ethanol subsidies too.

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Yeah Paul, damn, why can’t you just “get it.”

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Paul,

“Welcome to reality.”

A state that some can never fully realize and a state some choose escape with a nice Makers Manhattan or two…or three.

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left wing
Narcotization of the masses marches on …

Yes, but maybe there will be a watershed event in the not too distant future that will change everything…

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Mick,

“Narcotization of the masses marches on …”

Perhaps they are just ingratiating themselves to their new corporate overlords in the hopes they will show benevolence.

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“for the record.”

Don’t worry…they won’t let their own words get in the way of a good delusions.

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The Soviets were right when they said the US will fall from within…they learned from 1917 when the rich got demoted.

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Paul 12:35 Now add in ag subsidies, massive DoD cuts…

I’m for ending those too. Now, if only Chuck Grassley the porker from Iowa would get on board.

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jewcowboy 12:36 – indeed….. facts seem to just make them more bullheaded. Especially the anti-global warming crowd. I can understand and appreciate some of their skepticism. But they lack balance in their views….

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Here’s the “Republican” recovery – for all the wackos that keep hollering about where the improvements are now that Republicans are in power, even though they aren’t yet, and they will only control one chamber of Congress and not the WH.

Anyway, good for everyone, R’s and D’s alike, new jobless claims are down.

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE6BF2B220101216

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“So where are we now?”

Ummm…we’re still here with the same Democrat controlled house, senate, and white house, Jay. You are aware none of the people we elected have taken office yet aren’t you Jay?

To make it perfectly clear to you and the tools who follow you, the same people who caused the landslide losses for the Dems are still doing the same things that caused the landslide losses. They’re arrogant elitists, Jay. They don’t want the hear what the American people just shouted at them. Their time is up in 2 weeks or so and good riddance.

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Soames

Is it possible to find very many people who are familiar with the ins and outs of Washington, who have contacts and influence with the various agencies, who have executive-level capability, who are NOT or have never been, lobbyists?

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jm: “so you think the Democratic party is too conservative, corrupt, and beholden to corporate interests. I bet you think Obama is one of those sell outs too. Got it, right.”

Not what I said. It’s beholden to a philosophy that is represented by the individuals mentioned.

Mick: “Yes, but maybe there will be a watershed event in the not too distant future that will change everything..”

Absolutely. The irony is that in 2008 we almost had that “watershed event” – a full-blown depression. I wonder if all those conservative-leaning people who agreed with the claim that “too big to fail” is a terrible thing really understand what that might have meant?

Standing in long lines for food vouchers would focus the attention of a lot of people.

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RB from Gwinnett,

“You are aware none of the people we elected have taken office yet aren’t you Jay? ”

You are aware Saxby Chambliss is still in office aren’t you?

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Paul,

” Last time I “got it” the penicillin treatments were a pain….”

Dammit, that was my last sip of Coke!

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Don’t like it? Just flip the filibuster switch.

You get to the very end then decide to stop using it cold turkey? Nonsense.

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Paul:

That’s my point. All of this anti-lobbyist furor is a red herring. Cat food. I was just pointing out that it isn’t one single political party guilty of this sin….the Democrats love to do it as well. They all belong UNDER the bus.

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Jefferson

When the house goes corporate? Surely you jest. The house has been bought and paid for by big business for some time now.

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carlosgvv,

jinx…

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“er” as in more.

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afternoon all.. sorry lot of work for the day.. sigh..

@ jay.. like the blog today.. so true.. so true..

@ jewcowboy.. long time no see.. hope youre doing well.

@@ jay.. btw did you hate my holiday season recipe blog idea?

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Still haven’t seen the regular conservative bloggers who were grave dancing when Ted Kennedy died. I’m talking about myself, Scout, @@, Dusty, Harry Callahan, md, Wylde Byll, Bruno and maybe I’m missing a few others. No fly by postings by non-regular handles as they could very well be frauds.

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jewcowboy

http://tinyurl.com/2ajo95m

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No surprise here. Why would someone spend MILLIONS to run for an office that pays very little really compared to what someone could get in corporate land? Answer: CAMPAIGN money which they ultimately get to keep….and other perks. Otherwise why bother? Don’t give me the “want to help their country” baloney. It is the MONEY.

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“Who, in your opinion, are “the same people” and what caused the landslide losses? Please be specific.”

Nancy, Harry, Obama… you know, the ones who have been in charge for the past 2 years and have nothing but a constitutionally challenged healthcare bill to hang their hats on while Rome has burned. Have you not been paying attention Adam?

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“No fly by postings by non-regular handles as they could very well be frauds.”

And they could very well be those people you listed, but are too chicken to post such garbage under their “real” names

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Howdy Union,

Been crazy busy this week, but all is well. Hopefully for you too.

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Paul,

Calvin and Hobbs and Bloom County were the only reasons I ever looked at the funny papers.

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RB from Gwinnett,

“But like everything else in the mind of a liberal, the person who listens to the lobbyist couldn’t posssible be responsible for his/her own actions.”

~ “When the good people of South Dakota voted last month to send Republican Kristi Noem to Congress, they probably believed that she would give no quarter to the lobbyists and special interest groups who enjoyed, as she put it, “throwing money at the feet of a member of Congress.”

So liberals elected a Republican to Congress…interesting.

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I Object. There. I think that sums up what I came here to do. I feel as though I have accomplished so much for the people. They’re sure to keep re-electing me, given my stellar track record.

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SmittyATL, agreed. Agreed. And thank you. And, in my book, you are…

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DannyX,

“Or we elect them Governor.”

Ouch…

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Del @ 1.03, that’s weak. Peadawg and Wyld Byll were there, as was our “Leg Lamp” (who went by “Turd Furgeson” then), and “I Report”, and Bud Wiser. All right wingers, all succumbing to the urge to posting hateful crap about a dead Senator.

And they don’t get any further right than “I Report”. If you try to go right of him, you circumnavigate the globe and end up back on the far Left.

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Del,

“I don’t recall conservatives on here or anywhere loudly cheering when Ted Kennedy passed away. We didn’t agree with his politics but I don’t recall the few conservative bloggers on here cheering.”

“sfd, Peadawg and Wyld Byll are reg’s but the others I don’t think were with the exception of “I’ Report.”

Sorry to jump in here…but where in your original post did you qualify your statement with “regulars”?

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The President is doing one heck of a job. He has proven once again that he can get it done. Who would thought that he could get a second stimulus package passed this soon after the opposition party won the House of Representatives? Simply by calling it the renewal of the Bush Tax Cuts, he was able to get every red-neck praising it’s passage. Good job BO!

btw: you tea party folks were, as someone mentioned earlier, played. Now that you have provided everything your coaches wanted, its the bench for you. Sorry!

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SoCo,

Maybe there were a few supposed right wing bloggers who posted comments of glee when Ted Kennedy died, however, the majority of conservatives on this blog didn’t celebrate his death by making immature remarks cheering his passing. That accusation made by someone earlier was way out of line.

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The regulars argument is the No True Scotsman fallacy. The added term of regulars was not originally stated. Just sayin.

Also, lol at WAW’s somment. THat pretty much sums it up.

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damn typos all over my last post. Oops!

Anyway Del, you may not have celebrated his death, and you may know others who also did not celebrate his death. However, you cannot logically deny the evidence presented from this very blog that many people did.

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“you cannot logically deny the evidence presented from this very blog that many people did”

many, many, many people did. And I can vouch for the fact that it got so ugly a time or two (or three) that I finally just quit that subject because they were so disgusting.

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Del,

“what statement would that be?”

The one I reposted at 1.39.

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“I don’t recall Pat’s comment or if he/she is a regular.”

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WRY_t6GEOB4

Damned androgynous names…

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One last post on the more disgusting right wingers and Ted Kennedy. I have listed at least half a dozen posts to prove the point, and trust me, there are lots and lots more.

As for the “regulars” doing so, I have already provided a couple but I don’t think that is either relevant nor quantifiable.

Many of the “regular” right wingers here have changed names more often than Michael Jordan has changed underwear in those Hanes ads. And several have even been caught prevaricating about doing so.

Only the most deluded don’t believe that there are also gutless and dishonest bloggers here who use multiple concurrent names and also masquerade as one-off, drive by trolls.

But I don’t think many of the more aware here are that easily hoodwinked.

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AmVet,

“But I don’t think many of the more aware here are that easily hoodwinked.”

Especially when you can recognize someone’s writing style.

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because I tend to think of it as fairly balanced, about as many left-leaners as right-leaners, with a healthy dollop of centrists and unclassifiable curmudgeons.

WOO HOO!

I sure hope josef and I are in that unclassifiable curmudgeon category!

There ain’t a man alive today
Who doesn’t want to have the world in his hand
And everything to go his way
And abuse what he don’t understand
Some people never can be satisfied
Less they push somebody else around
But I can’t give no aid or take no side
I just watch them drag each other down because

Some folks is even whiter than me
Some folks is even blacker than me
I got myself caught in the middle somewhere
And that’s just where I want to be

I’m talking bout the outside
Talking bout the inside too

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rd0mBiuOw0E

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sfd, I don’t read every post, however, in my general view the ratio of left bloggers to those on the right seems to favor the left. I don’t believe there’s any such thing as a true centrist.

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I have missed all the fun! I was shopping for some new clothes at The Gap.

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RB: How about starting with telling us all what great accomplishments Obama has to hang his legacy on 2 years into his term since you seem to think there is something.

Signed the Weapons Systems Acquisition Reform Act to stop fraud and wasteful spending in the defense procurement and contracting system

Ended Bush administration’s CIA program of ‘enhanced interrogation methods’ by requiring that the Army field manual be used as the guide for terrorism interrogations

Established Credit Card Bill of Rights, preventing credit card companies from imposing arbitrary rate increases on customers

Added 4.6 billion USD to the Veterans Administration budget to recruit and retain more mental health professionals

Shall I go on? I could make a MUCH longer list.

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Adam, what then is your point. I’ve seen foolish incoherent comments from both sides of the political spectrum on Jay’s blog. I typically ignore them unless on very few occasion someone was personally attacking me.

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drawing one’s last breath does not change the manner in which one lived.

And neither does one sin invalidate one’s life work…

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jewcowboy, it seems you’re trying to make some kind of a point, however, it’s unclear what it might be.

You’ve moved the goal post.

First you stated, “I don’t recall conservatives on here or anywhere…

Then, when evidence began showing up to “refudiate” your assertion, you qualified it with, “I haven’t seen any evidence that the majority of regular conservative bloggers on here…”

Now you are lamely trying to walk it back.

Bearing false witness is one of the big ten no-nos

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No fly by postings by non-regular handles as they could very well be frauds.

Noooooo!!!

It’s not like we haven’t harpooned the Mobys before. Some of the funniest moments in blog history, they were.

And I’m not one to claim that someone’s post is over the line. I’m one of those who advocates free speech for one and all. AmVet, on the other hand, would declare What’s free for him is not for them.

The lion has roared!

In like a lion…out like a lamb!

Ted’s dead and that’s that!

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“I’m one of those who advocates free speech for one and all turning public forums into cesspools.”

Normal, what?!

Taking a balanced look at someone’s record and life?!

Weighing and balancing out the pros and cons thereof?!

In this example the ONLY thing the haters refer to is Chappaquiddick and drinking.

NOTHING ELSE.

And why their selective myopia and memories is generally “refudiated” by more reasoned and reasonable people…

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Del

There were not many who would qualify as regulars that actively participated in the Kennedy dance. There were many trolls that delighted in posting crap that day. Most of the regulars here, both left and right, are pretty cordial to each other for the most part. The inflammatory stuff usually comes from non-regulars on both sides. There’s exceptions from time to time, but that’s usually what I see happening here. I think it’s bad taste to make fun of anyone else’s health/demise period, but maybe that’s because I was raised with decent morals and manners.

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Southern Comfort,

“I think it’s bad taste to make fun of anyone else’s health/demise period, but maybe that’s because I was raised with decent morals and manners.’

Unless their demise was caused by auto-erotic asphyxiation…then it is open season.

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Kamchak@2:23, I hope you can pound nails a lot better than you try to split hairs. I won’t, however, engage with you in juvenile name calling as you’re not worth the time.

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I hope you can pound nails a lot better than you try to split hairs.

Just as I suspected.

You lack the honesty of your professed Christianity and the balls of a jarhead to admit to your original post.

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Normal

December 16th, 2010
2:21 pm

What about repeated sin? Or are all indiscretions and sins simply washed away if a man does enough good?

Alos when the sin is murder or allowing one to die that one sin then becomes larger as we never will know of the good or great things and service that the person would have accomplished had they not been killed.

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@@,

“On the TK thread left-wingers were besmirching her by saying she killed an innocent young man while driving drunk.”

Wasn’t drunk…but she did run a stop sign. Tragedy in every sense of the word.

http://www.snopes.com/politics/bush/laura.asp

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Del,

“You could have just asked me”

I did…@ 1.39…
______________________________________
jewcowboy

December 16th, 2010
1:39 pm

Del,

“I don’t recall conservatives on here or anywhere loudly cheering when Ted Kennedy passed away. We didn’t agree with his politics but I don’t recall the few conservative bloggers on here cheering.”

“sfd, Peadawg and Wyld Byll are reg’s but the others I don’t think were with the exception of “I’ Report.”

Sorry to jump in here…but where in your original post did you qualify your statement with “regulars”?

Anyway…I am off to a very long and most likely very boring meeting.

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Unless their demise was caused by auto-erotic asphyxiation…then it is open season.

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AmVet: I’m not really sure how that’s devil’s advocate, but thanks

Del: I won’t get into my own distinction but I see liberals as one group and the far left as another.

That is good. At least it leaves some room to maybe say “well, they’re not ALL bad,” which is a good first step in reaching agreements across any aisle. Aside from that it is my hope to avoid being lumped in with the attack aspect. Yes there are people who are kooky, and get uppity about a lot of things. I can get uppity about a few issues myself but try to avoid the kooky edge.

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Adam, There’s a big difference between disagreement and personal attacks. No I didn’t consider yours to be a personal attack.

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Bookman do you just cut and paste previous blogs form DEM-wit parasites and REP-ugants into your hate generating topic of the day. Their comments never change no matter the subject matter. I HATE Republicans …I HATE Liberals more….what a waste of time…With award winning columnish/communist like yourself it’s no wonder no one buys your lIberal rag!

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Adam,

I don’t recall ever saying one can choose to be rich, although one must make enough good choices to do so. You seem to enjoy choosing to make excuses……..also a choice. Many of my comments today were in response to being poor, and yes, some do actually make the choices to be poor (choose to be poor?). I’ll refer you back to the conversation the other day in which 1/3 of folks drop out of school………….are they choosing to be poor? Doubt they look at it like that, but in reality that is exactly what they are doing. Nothing in life is guaranteed except death……..everything else is playing the odds.

And yes, one does have to make enough good choices to give oneself the opportunity to become “rich”.

Are you a doctor Adam?? If not, why not??

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Normal

A while ago someone called you Nermal (as in a cute little kitty) and now we find out you were a Tiger in the late 60’s (at least tiger striped some of the time). Good for you.

Did you worry if the Naval Corpsmen supporting you were gay, like some of the Marines here seem to?

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Obamas fault, You can also add,

Closing Gitmo.
It will be on CSpan.
I don’t really know who Acorn is.
I will bring the troops home.
Transparency.
and so on and so on and so on.

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And the comment earlier about the credit card bill……please……look into the actual outcome and tell us all again how great it was. Sure, the cc companies have to let us know ahead of time…..so they all did. The added cost of the regulations were passed directly to the consumer……….gee thanks……..

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md: you’ve mischaracterized my points. I am not suggesting someone chooses to be poor or rich, but that the choices they make don’t lead them down one path or another in anywhere close to a guaranteed or statistically significant way. If we take your number of 1/3 of students dropping out, and assume somehow this is the only relevant figure or even a very relevant figure, then it logically follows that somewhere within a statistically significant margin of error, 1/3 of people would be poor and the rest would be at least in a very good situation with a good percentage of the remaining 2/3 being rich. Since that’s not actually the case, you’re missing a LOT of the variables.

The amount of people that make choices leading them to be poor and choices leading them to be rich is very very small. Much of the poor has a high school education, a fair amount have college degrees. A good amount of the rich are entrepreneurs, but so are a good amount of the poor through failing businesses.

As for being a doctor, doctors aren’t the only people who make money. I decided to go into IT, another “guaranteed” money making field, but guess what? I’m not rich. I made all the right choices to get there, have a degree and a lot of experience, but I am still not rich.

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md – it’s not all about good choices. Wouldn’t it be a good choice to major in Comp. SCience in the 70’s, I did.

Wouldn’t it be considered a good choice to keep your skills in IT current, I did.

Wouldn’t it be considered a good choice to go to work for IBM, I did.

Those were the bad choices you were referring to when you spoke about bad career choices, as the government has enabled the corporations to offshored countless IT jobs in the late 1990’s through the present time.

As and added bad choice the government has allowed H1b visa holders to continue to come to the US to take jobs from highly qualified CS graduates, BAD CHOICES I think NOT. Except maybe in the PRESIDENTS WE ELECTED.

And would you call someone who graduated in 2000 with a CS degree someone who made a bad choice? Sounds like a long DAMN career to me.

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And who will wipe away Boehner’s and McConnell’s tears?

Ohhhhh, soooooo pitiful.

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“Wouldn’t it be a good choice to major in Comp. SCience in the 70’s, I did.”

Why not a doctor or lawyer….etc etc. Probably would have been even better choices. The point is, you made a choice……it doesn’t always work out, but you made the choice…………

That is the main point…….we make the choices…..all of them…..whether to pursue education, have a family, provide things for ourselves and family, etc etc………..nobody is making any choices for us, only ourselves…………………since that is the case, we are responsible for our position in life no matter how many excuses one wants to dream up to the contrary………for every excuse, I can show you a corresponding choice.

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“As for being a doctor, doctors aren’t the only people who make money. I decided to go into IT, another “guaranteed” money making field, but guess what? I’m not rich. I made all the right choices to get there, have a degree and a lot of experience, but I am still not rich.”

same for you Adam…….you made that choice when you decided to go IT. Pretty simple actually…….it was you that put yourself on that particular road and you that will determine where you go next……………….but, the odds of you being poor are greatly diminished with an education………….other variables?? Absolutely…..tons of them.

Odds is the key once again. Playing the odds with choices………………

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Nice to see minorities pissed off at the Tea Party,what,s the matter money running out?

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Bookman,
It’s amazing watching the dems and what they are trying to pull in the lame duck session of congress and it speaks volumes about your views that you have not mentioned any of this, yet you have pleanty of time to discuss and predict what the tea party people will or will not do. Useless banter. It tells me that you are one of the 13% that supports what congress is doing. You should teach Liberalism 101 in your spare time…..if you need a TA, let me know, I am well versed in far left liberalism.

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Men accept responsibility for their actions. Liberals blame others and want gub’t to help them when they
‘have been wronged’. I’ve had a terrible two years in the construction industry but I take total responsibility for my position in life right now. Grow a pair Adam…….

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md

December 16th, 2010
7:16 pm
Adam….I’m also upside down on my mortgage…….one would think through no fault of my own….right??
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md

Say tomorrow an H1b contractor came in and was given your job making 1/3 what you are making and since you are in IT you look for a job elsewhere.

You can’t find one for what you were making so you can’t pay your mortgage and possibly lose your home.

The only job that can get is 1000 miles away and the contract doesn’t pay expenses and is at 1/3 what you were making.

Would you be upset at the gov’t for allowing all the CHEAP h1b visa holders into the country so that they can take your livelihood? Even though you know that they can’t do your job as well as you can and can’t communicate as well as you can.

AND someone tells you WELL you made the wrong CHOICE somewhere. Yep that choice would be to not see the trend 20 years before it occured.

Well as someone stated GROW A PAIR.

This isn’t about choices this is about UNFAIR LABOR PRACTICES.

For g0ds sake they even allow Dentists in the US under the existing H1b rules.

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Why should anyone be surprised by these idiotic Teabeggers. You broke gubner just served notice that Jawja state govmint is too big. I say the cuttin needs to start at the very top, WITH IS JOB. Let’s face it, he’s broke and on the lam from the repo man. Why would anyone take this monkey seriously? You people are the bigget bunch of loons I’ve ever seen and you wonder your unemployment rate is 10.1 per cent!

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Choices are not the end all be all as you are trying to portray md. At least, your choices are not the only choices that are factors in what happens in your life. So you see, even though I made choices to pursue IT, I didn’t choose to make all that effort and not get a job in the field somewhere down the line. I didn’t choose to have to work in a different field just to make ends meet. A mortgage situation isn’t comparable, but even if it was, the risk wouldn’t have been something you could have foreseen as taking a hit like it did. Your choices were good, mine were good, but we’re both screwed. Other people’s choices led to that, not ours.

To get to your point about self employment, first of all that’s awfully convenient. Have you tried it? I have. I am currently part owner of a business that really isn’t bringing home the bacon like it was supposed to. Luckily for me I had to do all the work for funding it myself since banks aren’t lending, so I’m not screwed on payments. But I am also working full time at another job. So I am working full time in two places, with all my intelligence, education, experience, and yes CHOICES, and I’m still below the poverty line. My choices are not the only choices that affect my life.

I can only assume your continued belief that personal choices mean everything is based either in a religious/ideological context and/or you think anyone opposed to your position is so because they want someone to blame. I don’t agree with placing blame anywhere BUT myself, but I also recognize that I don’t control my entire fate through my own choices. Since I don’t believe in placing blame somewhere for everything that I can think of, I also don’t blame myself when I know I’ve done everything right. I don’t have to place the blame somewhere else when I recognize that either.

Anyway the point is that personal choices don’t make a life. They can help, they can hurt, or they can have no net effect on a given subject. That is my point. My consistent point. You can use all the anecdotes and references you want and this will still be true.

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md@10:38 pm

don’t like having to play by anothers rules, then make your own.

Okay I make my own rules ALL H1b visa holders for the IT industry have to go back home. WHAT? THE GOVERNMENT SAYS THEY DON’T HAVE TO? LOL, hows that for a rule.

IF, you were self employed you wouldn’t have to worry about another taking your job…..right??

There are very very few self employed IT personell in this country, Most CORPORATIONS have RULES AGAINST hiring INDEPENDANT CONTRACTORS.

You chose to play that particular game.

I chose the IT field because it was interesting and still is, but how many industries have been ATTACKED by their own government?

Do you recall there ever being any guarantees that the job would be yours for ever and ever??

It’s not a job it’s a flippin CAREER, and no a single job is for ever and ever. I have worked in many IT shops in the Atlanta area since the late 70’s. The IT industry is not making buggy whips for goodness sakes as you seem to be implying.

Choices………..
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The CHOICES have been made by others to attack the IT industry, why? because the corporations have never seen IT as a value add position.

The next time your bank statement comes, thank an AMERICAN IT WORKER.

The next time you pay your electric bill thank an AMERICAN IT WORKER that it’s posted to your account correctly.

Your phone, cellphone, your internet connection, and many other aspects of your everyday life have been brought to you by the AMERICAN IT WORKER.

From here on out if its forked up blame the corporations for offshoring or bringing in H1b visa holders to do the IT work. Try calling the help desk and TRY to understand the call center worker who doesn’t speak English as their first or maybe even second language.

To use these companies is YOUR CHOICE and good luck with it.

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md: Like I said, if I can look at my choices and realize I didn’t make any bad ones, then the fault must not lie with me. But that doesn’t mean I have to go and find someone to blame. I’ll just keep trying. Despite what you may think I have thought a LOT about this.

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